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 The nation is being savaged by the Great Recession, but many pastors are afraid to talk about its causes, some say. Preachers confront 'last taboo': Condemning greed amid Great RecessionBy John Blake, CNN (CNN) – Bishop Harry Jackson is a former college middle linebacker who can still hit hard. He once described same-sex marriage as a satanic plot to destroy the family, called on Republicans to get “political Viagra” and said African-Americans needed to abandon what he called the Gospel of Victimization. Jackson is not shy about stirring up controversy, but he stops short when it comes to preaching about greed. The Maryland bishop said he encourages his congregation to get through the Great Recession by saving and sharing. But he doesn’t want to alienate well-off members by talking about what’s behind the nation’s economic woes. "I've got to watch it," said Jackson, pastor at Hope Christian Church in Beltsville, Maryland. "I could get into some big teaching on greed, but the reality is that a lot of that teaching may wind up creating anti-economic-growth and anti-capitalism concepts (in people’s minds). ... I always talk about personal responsibility so we don't get into the blame game." The Great Recession is more than an economic crisis. It has become a spiritual dilemma for some of the nation’s pastors and their parishioners, religious leaders say. Three years after an implosion of the nation’s financial system helped push the country into its worst economic nosedive since the Great Depression, pastors are still trying to figure out how to address people’s fears from the pulpit. But first they have to deal with their own fears, some pastors and scholars say. Though millions of Americans are angry over the economy, little moral outrage seems to be coming from the nation’s pulpit, they say. Too many pastors opt for offering pulpit platitudes because they are afraid parishioners will stop giving money if they hear teachings against greed, said the Rev. Robin R. Meyers, senior minister of Mayflower Congregational United Church of Christ in Oklahoma City. “Money is the last taboo in church. It’s much easier to talk about sex than money,” said Meyers, who wrote about greed and the other seven deadly sins in his book, “The Virtue in the Vice.” The anxiety from the pews has become so palpable for some pastors, though, that they now feel like they have no choice. Andy Stanley, a prominent evangelical leader, said some in his congregation cheered when he launched a preaching series called “Recovery Road” to talk about politically touchy issues such as personal greed, the federal deficit and the sins of subprime loans.  The Rev. Andy Stanley says he took a risk preaching about greed to his suburban Atlanta congregation, but it has paid off. The senior pastor of North Point Community Church in Alpharetta, Georgia, north of Atlanta, told his church members they should look in the mirror before they start blaming politicians for the nation’s economic woes. Any economic recovery “begins with me, not they,” Stanley said. It continues when pastors ask how such a wealthy country can stumble into such a financial mess, Stanley said. “Any time the entire country is talking about something, pastors should pause and talk about it,” Stanley said. “We know what Republicans and Democrats think, but what does the Bible and Jesus say?’’ Other ministers say an economic recovery also must involve pointing fingers. They say Jesus calls his followers to struggle against those people and policies that helped lead to the Great Recession. Charity – feeding the poor, steering people to job fairs – must be accompanied by justice, said Meyers. “It’s good to pull people out of the river when they’re drowning,” the Oklahoma pastor said, “but it’s also good to go upriver to see who’s throwing them in the river.” Should pastors speak truth to economic power? During the Gilded Age of the late 19th century, Walter Rauschenbusch, a Baptist minister, inspired others to fight against the economic inequality of the time with the “Social Gospel.” During the Great Depression, Father John A. Ryan built such a national following condemning the excess of capitalism that he was invited to deliver prayers at a presidential inauguration. The Rev. Martin Luther King Jr. spent the last three years of his life focusing on poverty. When he was assassinated in 1968, he was on the cusp of leading a nonviolent, interracial army of poor people into the nation’s capital to demand a fairer distribution of wealth. These ministers who took on the big economic issues of the day were inspired by the example of Jesus, who angered the powerful by condemning the economic exploitation of the poor, religious scholars say. His teachings are seen throughout the New Testament in parables such as “The Rich Man and Lazarus.” “Jesus took sides – he said he didn’t come to bring peace but a sword,” said Vincent Miller, a Catholic theologian and author of “Consuming Religion: Christian Faith and Practice in Consumer Culture.” Miller said pastors who are afraid of angering congregants by talking about touchy economic issues ignore the Gospel. “You can’t preach the Gospel without alienating people. That’s part of it. You’re not helping people if you’re not alienating them,” said Miller, the Gudorf Chair in Catholic Theology and Culture at the University of Dayton in Ohio. The recession divides preachers, not just politicians That leaves pastors with the challenge of interpreting Jesus’ message for today’s economic woes. On that front, the pulpit is as divided as the nation’s politics. Consider the cause of the 2008 economic meltdown. Was it primarily the result of Wall Street greed? Jay W. Richards doesn’t think so. Richards is a senior fellow at the conservative think-tank the Discovery Institute and author of “Money, Greed and God: Why Capitalism is the Solution and Not the Problem.” Greed was a factor in the 2008 financial crisis but not it’s primary cause, Richards said. There were other major factors, including the tendency of Americans to live above their means and policies that encouraged banks to dilute mortgage lending standards. In addition, he said, large financial institutions were encouraged to engage in risky behavior because they knew the federal government would bail them out. The causes of the 2008 crisis were so complicated that some of the smartest people in the world failed to anticipate it, Richards said. The first thing pastors should do during tough economic times is “pray for, comfort and encourage” parishioners, he said. “If a pastor suggests that the financial crisis happened because of a few greedy corporate titans and some Wall Street traders, that’s a sure sign that he doesn’t understand the crisis,” he said. Neither should Christians condemn the growing gap between rich and poor, Richards said. “Denouncing a presumed gap between rich and poor is, more often than not, a symptom of economic confusion, not prophetic wisdom,” he said. “It can also mask envy, and is usually invoked just before someone calls for the state to coercively confiscate the wealth of some and give to others.”  Bishop Harry Jackson says Americans can experience a miraculous economic recovery if they return to God. According to the U.S. Census Bureau, income disparity in the United States has increased 40% in the past 30 years. In 2010 the nation’s poverty rate rose to a 17-year high, with more than 46 million people – 15.1% of the population - living in poverty and 49.9 million living without health insurance. Despite these grim statistics, Richards said he believes people born in America today can still succeed if they work hard and get a good education. “The American Dream is still alive,” he said. “The fact that millions of people from around the world still want to come here is a sign of that. … If someone works hard in school and develops good financial habits, they’re more likely to do reasonably well financially than most people were for most of human history.” The Rev. Jim Wallis, a prominent evangelical who has worked with Democrats, has a different perspective. He said it’s clear that greed was a major factor in the economic collapse and that a wide gap between the haves and have-nots is social dynamite. “History shows that an increasing gap between the rich and the poor is a prime indicator of imminent collapse,” Wallis wrote in his recent book, “Rediscovering Values: On Wall Street, Main Street and Your Street.” Wallis said he hoped his book, written right after the 2008 meltdown, would spark a movement among the nation’s churches to re-examine the country’s economic values. But he said many of the nation’s pastors operate like politicians, afraid to alienate their wealthy donors. “We said the public is ready for this. The church is ready for this,” a weary Wallis said of his hopes for such a movement. “Boy was I wrong.” Where have all the prophets gone? Joel Osteen is the senior pastor of one of the nation’s largest churches, the 40,000-member Lakewood Church in Houston, Texas. His 90-minute services are broadcast nationwide each Sunday, and he’s just come out with a book, “Every Day a Friday,” which encourages people to have a “prosperous, victorious year” and be “dream releasers” by helping others realize their goals. Osteen said some of his church members have been hit hard by the recession, but he prefers to preach about the cures, not the causes, for the nation’s economic ills. Part of his message: Live within your means, don’t give away your power, live without crutches and travel light. “We go through difficult times, and it’s easy to get trapped in the past thinking about what didn’t work out,” he said. “At some point, we gotta move forward. I’m not supposed to just endure my life. I’m supposed to enjoy it.” Back in Maryland, Jackson said he tells his congregation that the nation’s economic problems are partly God’s way of encouraging the nation to return to a “biblical faith.” He said there will be a “supernatural economic recovery” if Americans practice generosity. “If you have a bowl of rice, why not share a quarter of that bowl with someone who is needy?” he said. Those kinds of sermons annoy Meyers, the Oklahoma pastor. He said too many pastors have reduced Jesus to a “financial adviser, not a prophet.” He said pastors should also call for justice. He said it’s a crime that no bankers or financial leaders behind the 2008 collapse have gone to jail. “We’ll send an African-American teenager off to the slammer who robs a 7-Eleven, but we won’t do anything to a banker who helped cause the collapse of the entire banking system,” he said. But most preachers won’t say that, he said, because much of the church is too captive to greed to address the moral challenges of the nation’s economic problems. He doesn’t expect politicians or other leaders to step into that void because too many are beholden to the rich and powerful. “There just aren’t that many prophets left,” he said. “A prophet is someone who is willing to tell us the unpleasant truth about ourselves. If we can’t bring unpopular messages, who will?” |
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so because you don't want to hurt the feelings of the well off and teach them that their behavior is disgusting by their own faith you instead pick on gay people and blacks?
sounds legit I guess
Greed is a fundementaly rich andpor thing,that includes all inbetween as well. We must not only look upon this down turn as a theological proplem but also as a morlistic problemas well. Greed is something we all a guilty of. From hoarding our money and posessions to being grreedy in spirit. This economic situaion we all have a hand in. From the financial despots who trived on those who wanted and were given motrgaged they cold not afford to the ones who over extended themseves. I thiink we as Pastors hane an obligation to talk on a relistic and level about greed . If we don't who will? We have to be willing to be just as uncomfortable as we make those who are listening to our message. If we are not willing to do the responsible thing , maybe, we need to look harder at ourselves and see if we are in the service of God and our flock or being a theo-politcian.
As a pastor, perhaps you could pass on a further lesson concerning hypocrisy. No doubt, some of the greedy people fail to see their own hypocrisy when they use the Bible to pick on others, especially gay people. The same applies for all the hypocrites who are guilty of the Ten Commandment sin of adultery for divorcing and remarrying. "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone".
If your religion makes your life better, then don't use it to make someone's life worse.
The clergy are preaching about greed.
Oh the irony.
Churches should start doing more of the work that government-funded relief organizations do. With coordination, a gradual transition can be made that will result in the churches giving more to the community, country, and world, and the government could use the money that would have gone to relief organizations instead of raising taxes or cutting from schools. We try as hard as we can to give as much aid as we can, and I'm sure other churches do too, but if every one put forth even more effort, religion would once again become a key part of society and the government would have a little bit more money to work with.
By the way, I don't have anything against relief organizations, it's just that they're job could be done just as well by churches without costing the government as much money.
@Me
You said: "Churches should start doing more of the work that government-funded relief organizations do. With coordination, a gradual transition can be made that will result in the churches giving more to the community, country, and world, and the government could use the money that would have gone to relief organizations instead of raising taxes or cutting from schools. We try as hard as we can to give as much aid as we can, and I'm sure other churches do too, but if everyone put forth even more effort, religion would once again become a key part of society and the government would have a little bit more money to work with.
By the way, I don't have anything against relief organizations, it's just that they're job could be done just as well by churches without costing the government as much money."
Yep, as I have warned people several times in the past, this is a Christian Right desire. I will reprint their wish list for you all to see. You can decide if you want them running the country:
Christian Right Agenda = Christian Theocracy
Christian Right = Predominately Evangelicals
The Texas history books are rewriting history to give the conservative slant. The objective of this effort, is to create a Christian Nation, a theocracy with Jesus as Head of State.
The recent article about the letter to the Jews, from George Washington, must sting like a son-of-a-gun. We are a secular nation. Thank god!
A huge campaign is underway, to convince the American people, the founding fathers never intended a separation of church and state. Thomas Jefferson's role as a founding father is played down. In some cases Jefferson is smudged.
Expect an attack on the 1st and 14th Amendments. The founding fathers will weep.
Most of the Tea Party are for a Christian Theocracy. The Tea Party is in bed with the Christian Right. A vote for any Tea Party candidate, is a vote for Christian Right domination.
The Republicans are the puppets of the Christian Right and Rich White Men. If you aren't rich or if you aren't white, then this is not your party. Remember Rand Paul's wish to have limited government that should not force private businesses to abide by civil rights law? Isn't that a tad racist or is it just me? Can you say: "You want me to sit where on the bus?"
You will see an amendment defining marriage as between a man and woman. Gay rights will dwindle and die.
Roe Vs. Wade will be reversed. Women will once again be forced to seek back alley remedies. Men may be forced to buy condoms on the black market. You will procreate! Or you will be abstinent! It is not up to you!
Stem cell research will stagnate. The hopes of damaged and sick people will be dashed.
All scientific research will be scrutinized by the Christian Right. "Whether or not a theory is in agreement with the Evangelical's interpretation of god's will", will be the new metric. Get use to hearing "God Did It". No one will dare question otherwise. Science classes will be much easier. Much less to remember or think about. 90% of the answers will be "D" – God did it. 30% correct will be passing. 50% will be Valedictorian.
Makes it pretty easy to get their "sheep skin". LOL Baaaaa!
Education doesn't matter! Jesus is coming soon.
You say you've developed a vaccine that will prevent women from getting cervical cancer? No, Mr. Scientist. You will pour it down the drain! And you will make drugs that prevent STDs no more! So sayeth the Lord...According to the Religious Nuts.
"Giving the HPV vaccine to young women could be potentially harmful, because they may see it as a license to engage in premarital $ex. Abstinence is the best way to prevent HPV" – Bridget Maher of the Family Research Council
I would much rather my daughter was lying there dying of cancer, rather than having taken a shot that might have given her out of control urges.
There was a recent article on the Religious blog about how Evangelical young'uns are not waiting. Little Betty is not praying so often, because she is so devout. She is praying for her Aunt Flow. Amen!
P_ornography will be illegal. The Religious Right will decide what is p_ornographic , as well as what is art. You will watch television programs approved by the Evangelicals. Lots of reruns of "Growing Pains", starring that Evangelical darling Kirk Cameron. Thank you Jesus!
Will museums exhibiting transitional fossils and other evidence of evolution, be deemed po_rnographic and closed? Their exhibits burned?
Creationism will be taught in public school, most likely alongside evolution rather than instead of, but no guarantees. Creationism/ Intelligent Design will consist of 10 chapters. Evolution will be mentioned on the book jacket cover.
Vouchers will enable parents to send their child to religious schools. Funds to public schools will dwindle. Quality education will be out of reach for the masses. The finite amount of money, will be spread too thin. Destroying the public school system is the purpose of the voucher system.
If each faith attends their own school, interacts only with children who believe as they do, Might this not interfere with the melting pot, we often brag about? Won't this increase prejudices? The Catholics once told their children that Jews have horns. *sigh*
Segregation, is not beneficial. We need to learn to get along, and work together. Toddlers are really good at playing well with others.
Little Johnny will believe in talking snakes and Zombie Messiahs. He will spend his free time watching the heavens, waiting for Jesus to return. The rest of the world is spending their time learning real science and math. Good luck Johnny. Can you say: "Would you like fries with that?"
State-sanctioned Prayer will be in our schools. The Christian Right think they know better than the Founding Fathers and want to tamper with the Bill of Rights. They want to amend the U.S. Const_itution, so that the Government would legally sponsor and take over the activity of prayer. Only the one true god, the Christian god, will be given homage. The god(s), of all other faiths, will be subservient to the Christian god. Muslim parents will need to make this clear to their children. Will the Catholics and the Mormons be Christian enough? What about the Jehovah Witnesses? The Evangelicals / Jesus will determine this.
The non-Christians will be allowed to put their heads down on their desks, during the morning worship. They can contemplate their damnation, for not accepting Jesus.
$ex education will consist of abstinence only. Studies have shown it is a worthless concept. But, it will please the religious fanatics. Why did little Betty have her purity ring reshaped into a tongue stud?
The war against unions, commenced during the Reagan administration, will continue. Labor will be humbled. They will accept the wages they are offered and should be grateful to get it. The Mexicans won't come here for jobs, anymore. The rate of pay won't justify the effort.
Say goodbye to enti_tlements. Social Security and Medicare are Ponzi Schemes!
Our elderly will die earlier than they thought. But, they have the promise of an afterlife to comfort them. Unless of course, they haven't accepted Jesus. Then, they will burn in a place created by an all loving and all just god, for all eternity. Best to concentrate on that pie in the sky. Works better than opium for a lot of people.
Go toward the light, Grandma... Grandpa is waiting for you.
We love you Grandma. But, the Republicans have taken away Medicare and cut your Social Security. Go to sleep, now.
The government will turn over its programs for the p_oor, to the Christian Right. They will decide who will receive help and who will not. No longer will the criteria for receiving help, simply be income.
The Christian Right has embraced Paul as the moral lawgiver. Paul's First Ep_istle of Paul to the Thessalonians, is often quoted by the Republicans. You never hear them quote Jesus' advice to the rich. You don't bite the hand that feeds you. Jesus will understand.
The Republicans applaud the executions, of human beings. The more the merrier. They will be a burden to the state, no more! If it turns out some were actually innocent, god will set it right... Providing they have accepted Christ.
Perhaps trials aren't necessary. Send the accused directly to god's justice! We are a Christian nation!! Are we not the hand of god? The accused are of another faith, you say? Give them a chance to pray the Sinners Prayer, and send them to judgement.
The Republicans screamed, "YES", when asked if an uninsured man should be allowed to die.
If you read the Good Samaritan parable told by Jesus, you might come away with the idea that Jesus wouldn't agree.
But, I bet Jesus will change His mind once the Evangelicals rule in His name.
Could be, Jesus will feel compelled to rewrite the entire bible, leaving out those obviously unclear parts. The Evangelicals will help Jesus clear them up. Guaranteed!
Jesus will be the Head of State! He will be represented by an empty chair at the head of the leadership table. Only the Evangelicals will be able to hear His voice. They will tell the rest of us His will. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!
The Evangelicals will rule in the name of a non-existent god.
It makes me want to puke. This is a power grab. Vote for the Dems in 2012. There are a lot of things I would like to see changed in the Democratic Party, but at least they are not insane.
Cheers!
Rather than the last taboo, let's hope it becomes the last hypocrisy.
These snake-oil salesman need to shut the hell up!
BD
The last taboo is greed. Really? Greed?
Well, I guess coming from a preacher it might just fit.
I have been at war with greed for years. It has touched my life in so many ways...from the paint contractor who ran off with $3,000 while my husband was dying of cancer (and the contractor knew this) to my new boyfriend who said he had to charge me "extra" for some work he did for me that he initially offered to do for free to the IRS who told me I didn't charge enough to my tenants for rent so they taxed me on the difference in what they could have made if I'd charged more. Sometimes I think greed is very American. It's in everything and it can be found in our churches as well.–I say this and I'm a Christian. It all makes me very sad.
I'm sorry that people have taken such advantage of you. I think that greed is very human, not just very American, and sadly, we must be cynical about whom we trust.
Wait...your husband was dying of cancer but you had a new boyfriend???
Pray all you want, it's not going to get better. Another recession is going to happen. It's already been officially called by the ECRI. It's not speculation, it's fact at this point. For those of you who don't believe me, just google them. ECRI says that things are going to get much worse. So if you think just because things aren't too bad cause you were lucky enough to stay employed...just wait. Nothing short of Jesus returning to earth or an angel whatever is going to change that now. It's already too late. Enjoy your faith pastors because, very soon, it's about to be shattered.
Recessions smash Religion? I didn't read that in the ECRI article. When I see the well off scrambling for higher ground I will then believe its really bad. When it just the rest of us suffering, well, thats not very newsworthy apparently. A very wise person said when people have to make a choice between heating and eating, your really going to see the manure hit the fan and its going to get on everybody. Food is to double in cost by the end of this year and fuel oil is already more than a burden that most of us take until the end of summer to pay off to only start again. Christmas this year will be unlike any other for us all, the faithful and the Godless.
Genuine faith thrives in hard times. Hard times can often be the fuel for greater devotion to God!
Jesus made a number of very clear statements about money and wealth in the Bible. For example:
Matthew 6:19
Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal; but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal. For where your treasure is, there your heart will be also.
Luke 14:33
Any of you who does not give up everything he has cannot be my disciple.
Matthew 6:24
No one can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or else he will be loyal to the one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and Money.
Matthew 19:21-24
Jesus answered, "If you want to be perfect, go, sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me." When the young man heard this, he went away sad, because he had great wealth. Then Jesus said to his disciples, "I tell you the truth, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
Matthew 19:28-29
Jesus said to them, "I tell you the truth, at the renewal of all things, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. And everyone who has left houses or brothers or sisters or father or mother or children or fields for my sake will receive a hundred times as much and will inherit eternal life.
Luke 9:23-25
Then he said to them all: "If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me. For whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for me will save it. What good is it for a man to gain the whole world, and yet lose or forfeit his very self?
Matt 13: 22
The one who received the seed that fell among the thorns is the man who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke it, making it unfruitful.
Hebrews 13:5
Keep your lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have, because God has said, "Never will I leave you; never will I forsake you."
Phil 2:3
Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit, but in humility consider others better than yourselves.
Acts 2:44-45
All the believers were together and had everything in common. Selling their possessions and goods, they gave to anyone as he had need.
The message is clear. If you want to follow Jesus, you need to "sell your possessions and give to the poor." It is a very simple message, and easy to do. Have you done it? The fact that you are reading this page would indicate that you have not. Chances are you own a computer, pay for an Internet connection every month, live in a home or apartment, have a car, etc. In other words, you live a life at a level of wealth unimaginable in Jesus' time. Meanwhile, billions of people on the planet live in startling, abject poverty.
Why don't you sell everything and follow Jesus, as he requests in the Bible? The reason is simple: Jesus and God are imaginary, and you know it. If Jesus were real, you would do what he says.
i i certainly acknowledge the insanity of my belief system....and i agree that in this rich, violent, darwinian culture God appears dead. But consider also that "Christian" in India is often perceived as synonymous with "medical worker" or "healer" because so many Christians there are caring for the poor and wounded. Also i travel the states constantly and as a cynically tinged idealist i have been hopefully shocked many times by the humble love and sacrifice of people of faith. I would also argue that many agnostics are unwittingly influenced by Christ in their fundamental understandings of right and wrong and Justice. Still, Jesus' disciples echoed your own statements when they asked Him (just after the rich man/camel/eye quote in Matthew) "well then how can anyone be saved". Jesus replied something like, "with men it is impossible, but not with God" -and so in the end....Christ gave up His own Life for all of our sakes and for all of our selfish cruel ways. I think He did that because He Loved us but also because He wanted us to Love Him, and eachother, and serve eachother oout of Love and not guilt. We all suck at it....including you.....but the fact that Love exists in the world gives me hope....and so i try to live poor and serve the poor, as Jesus did. And i do this because i hope in the existence and power of sacrificial Love.....and ultimately i hope in the Author of Love --even though it is kinda silly
So how about the fundamentals of right and wrong in nations where Christ isn't an influence? I have no problem with you worshiping as you choose, but don't give your religion credit where it is not due.
My sense of right and wrong came from a very secular upbringing. I was taught very early on that my actions have consequences, and that I should behave as I wish those around me to behave. I am not always successful with that, but my knowledge of right and wrong came from being held accountable, not from religion.
"I would also argue that many agnostics are unwittingly influenced by Christ in their fundamental understandings of right and wrong and Justice."
Atheists and agnostics do right and have justice without depending on bribes (heaven) and threats (hell).
Observer
Did Jesus do right or wrong because of heaven or L ? I think not. He did it because of who is was just as Christians are to be like Christ we do it because of who we are. Some in the beginning may do as you say but once we understand Grace and the finished work on the cross our motivation is Christ not heaven or L
Observer
Did Jesus do right or wrong because of heaven or eL ? I think not. He did it because of who he is just as Christians are to be like Christ we do it because of who we are. Some in the beginning may do as you say but once we understand Grace and the finished work on the cross our motivation is Christ not heaven or eL
fred,
"Did Jesus do right or wrong because of heaven or L". Of course he was afraid of hell and expected to be rewarded with heaven. Isn't that the whole point of Christianity?
Observer
Jesus was not afraid of evil of any sort. His words were clear fear not evil. Jesus was one with God the Father. He was in the beginning with God. He was there when the first great angel the most beautiful of all allowed desire / lust to turn against God. This evil was cast out from the Kingdom of God. Jesus cast out demons it is they that fear the Lord.
As to heaven Jesus was always one with God. This unity is throughout. When he was to bear the sins of the world on the cross His agony was one of knowing separation from God was coming. God cannot be in unity with sin as He is a Holy God. Jesus took the pain and suffering associated with all sin past and present upon Himself. At that moment "My God my God why have you forsaken me?" Jesus had to suffer separation from God on a real basis. Jesus never was without God but for that time. The Kingdom of Heaven is to be one with God. For us it is a reward so to speak as we are in Christ who is one with the Father.
Tax the churches big time, and our economic problems would be solved.
Luke 12:48 "...Much will be required from everyone to whom much has been given. But even more will be demanded from the one to whom much has been entrusted."
This pretty much says it all.
Greed and vice. Modern day churches. Who woulda thought?
I'm with Andy Stanley, what does Jesus have to say about this? He does have a lot to say...and truth is truth and it should be preached no matter what!!!
My problem with the fanatical aspect of religion is that many of them are coming to my door on Saturday mornings trying to save me from my heathen ways because they've seen my bumper stickers. When I ask if they believe in having a fair and equal discussion they always say they are. I say ok you first. So I listen to their fairy tales but when I get my turn to talk they won't listen to a different side of the same coin. They're too busy interrupting to tell me I'm wrong. Then I ask what happened to the fair and equal discussion they believed in? I didn't stop you and I agreed to listen. If you lied to me about that, what else are you lying about?
If that doesn't get them off my porch I invite em in for a bath. That always seems to work.
I saw this on one of the church sign pictures..."It's ok, Jesus hates religion too.." It is true!!!
That is quite true. Jesus did not establish any denomination (Catholic, Methodist, Anglican, Lutheran). Jesus rebuked the Pharisees and the Sadducee and even the scribes. He did not appoint any bishops or popes. He did not ordain anyone. Neither did the Apostles in Acts. He said "preach the gospels and baptize those who believe" He told the Apostles to beware of false doctrine (Mark 8). He told us not to judge, not to condemn, Much of what he said (instructions) is completely ignored by denominational churches.
I remember hearing about the Nobel Prize winning ecconomist Milton Friedman getting a call from a local church during the last recession and the person on the end of the line said to him: "There's tough times ahead, what should we do with our money?" Milton Friedman answered: "Have you considered giving it to the poor?" The person on the other line asked: "...is this the REAL Milton Friedman??" To which Milton responeded: "...is this the REAL Church?"
They wrote "Joel Osteen is the senior pastor of one of the nation’s largest churches, the 40,000-member Lakewood Church in Dallas" ,,,, Who does the research for these articles? Lakewood Church is in Houston, not Dallas. Stupid mistake.
Relax, nobody died and the state was correct. Everything is bigger in Texas, even micro-managing.
Some basic economics:-------->
How much money would the following save the US taxpayers ?:
Saving 1.5 billion lost Muslims:
There never were and never will be any angels i.e. no Gabriel, no Islam and therefore no more koranic-driven acts of horror and terror likr 9/11
One trillion dollars over the next several years as the conflicts in Iraq and Afghanistan will end.
Eighteen billion dollars/yr to Pakistan will stop.
Four billion dollars/yr to Egypt will end.
Saving 2 billion lost Christians including the Mormons:
There were never any bodily resurrections and there will never be any bodily resurrections i.e. No Easter, no Christianity!!!i
The Mormon empire will now become taxable as will all Christian "religions" and non-profits since there is there is no longer any claim to being a tax-exempt religion.
Saving 15.5 million Orthodox followers of Judaism:
Abraham and Moses never existed.
Four billion dollars/yr to Israel saved.
All Jewish sects and non-profits will no longer be tax exempt.
Now all we need to do is convince these 3.5+ billion global and local citizens that they have been conned all these centuries. Time for a Twitter and FaceBook campaign!!!!
Please send all of your current donations to these "unreligions" to:
Gifts to the United States
U.S. Department of the Treasury
Credit Accounting Branch
3700 East-West Highway, Room 622D
Hyattsville, MD 20782
plz hit report abuse on all reality spam postings
The truth hurts eh Mr .......? How is Reality's post abusive? Do tell.
I can't be the first to quote Matthew 19:24 with regard to this article, and I doubt I'll be the last, but: "Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God."
Sounds like Harry Jackson would do good to read the Gospels!
All an executive or elected clown/politician has to do is ask himself or herself, how much damage did my decisions have on destroying the economy. Most won't care.