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Why are Jewish dead flown to Israel for burials?
The coffins containing the bodies of the victims of the French shooting arrive at Israel’s Ben Gurion Airport.
March 21st, 2012
10:45 AM ET

Why are Jewish dead flown to Israel for burials?

By Jessica Ravitz, CNN

(CNN) – The four victims of Monday’s shooting at a Jewish school in Toulouse, France, were buried Wednesday morning – not in their home community but, after an overnight flight from Paris, in Jerusalem.

Though two of the young victims were born in Israel, the Consistory of Paris, which represents Jewish communities, told CNN that all the victims were being buried there for reasons of faith, not nationality. Being laid to rest in Israel, the birthplace of Judaism, ensures that their remains will not be tampered with, the group said. It also added that 40% of practicing French Jews are buried in Israel.

French religious Jews aren’t alone in wanting this, and the reasons run deep.

“It goes all the way back to the Bible, when Jacob passed away,” explains Rabbi Shaul Ginsberg, who oversees Shomrei Hachomos, an Orthodox funeral chapel in Brooklyn – which he says is one of three Orthodox funeral homes in New York state.

Before Jacob passed away, Ginsberg says, “One of the things he said to Joseph is, ‘Don’t leave me in Egypt.’”

CNN's Belief Blog – all the faith angles to the day's top stories

He wanted to join those who had died before him, including his grandfather, Abraham, who received the first Jewish burial, Ginsberg says.

In the Hebrew Bible, Genesis 47:28-30 reads:

And Jacob lived in the land of Egypt seventeen years; so the days of Jacob, the years of his life, were a hundred forty and seven years.

And the time drew near that Israel [Jacob] must die; and he called his son Joseph, and said unto him: "If now I have found favour in thy sight, put, I pray thee, thy hand under my thigh, and deal kindly and truly with me; bury me not, I pray thee, in Egypt.

But when I sleep with my fathers, thou shalt carry me out of Egypt, and bury me in their burying-place." And he said: "I will do as thou hast said."

Jacob would be buried in the Cave of the Patriarchs, known by Muslims as the Sanctuary of Abraham, in what’s now the West Bank city of Hebron.

Another incentive to be buried in Israel extends beyond the Bible - and beyond concerns, for some, about grave desecration. It’s rooted in the belief that when the Messiah comes, those buried in Jerusalem will be resurrected first.

Jews do believe that a figure will emerge to restore peace, save the righteous and judge those who've done wrong. But the Jewish concept of a Messiah is very different from Christianity's view. Christians believe the Messiah already came, in the divine form of Jesus Christ. Jews do not believe this. In fact, they don't believe that the Messiah will be divine - since God, from their perspective, cannot become human.

When the Messiah comes, Judaism teaches, he will shepherd in what's referred to as the "World to Come." There will be peace, no more evil and the reinstatement of the Temple in Jerusalem. And, apropos of this story, all Jews will return to Israel.

The significance of being buried in Israel is one Ginsberg both respects and anticipates for himself. He purchased his plot in Jerusalem years ago and says 60% of those he serves are being flown to Israel for burial.

That choice doesn’t come cheap.

When Ginsberg bought his plot in 2000, it cost him $4,500. But lack of land, demand and simple economics have changed things. The plot next to his, he says, recently sold for $25,000.

Granted, one can choose to be buried outside of Jerusalem at better rates. But once the cost for the flight over is factored in, the price is still steep.

For the majority of Jews outside Israel (and even within Israel) who are not ultra-religious, burial considerations are likely not driven by what Jacob said to Joseph or by thoughts of a potential Messiah. These motivations, in fact, are probably foreign to many of them.

Even so, for very observant Jews, and even for some others who are not Orthodox, the expense of an Israel burial – if they can afford it – may be worth it, says David Zinner, the executive director of K’vod v’Nichum, an organization that provides education and resources about traditional Jewish funerals and burials.

One page on the organization's website is dedicated to burial in Israel, offering tips, links to articles and cemetery options.

Yet Zinner, who works with Jews of all denominations, also points to passages in the Talmud where Rabban Gamliel, a first century authority, argued against expensive burials. Zinner says Gamliel feared high prices deterred people from upholding traditions. To this day, Jews are traditionally not buried in fancy caskets.

By extension, Zinner says, there are many who argue that splurging for a burial in Israel makes little sense.

“Money is to help the living, to give to charity,” Zinner says, summarizing that school of thought.

As for those who are buried outside of Israel, Ginsberg says, the resurrection, when it comes, will not be lost on them. The process will just be more arduous and definitely less comfortable.

Tunnels will be created underground leading to Israel, he says, “and their bones will roll into Israel.”

Those already buried there “will save themselves that pain.”

- CNN Writer/Producer

Filed under: Faith Now • Israel • Jerusalem • Judaism

soundoff (396 Responses)
  1. Ykcyc

    Why do we not see, that we are talking about here are the innocent human beings, the children. It does not matter what they believe or were they came from – they had as much right to live, as your own children. People, who hide behind the internet and spew hate, have no humanity, decency, or compassion. They are already dead inside, because they live in fear and hate. Whether religious person or an atheist, a closed mind is still a prison and it makes no difference if the walls are a different color or height. The prisoner within is still the one responsible for being there, whether completely unaware or simply refusing to take the responsibility for their own state of being. If you are one of those individuals or simply don't have anything useful or positive to add – don't bother. You'll be wasting your time.
    Peace.

    March 21, 2012 at 1:45 pm |
    • laquisha

      I agree 100%. The 800 palestinian children who died in Israel's "Cast Lead" were–in the jewish medias eyes– somehow not as important as the 2 jewish children who died. Can you explain why?

      March 21, 2012 at 1:47 pm |
    • William DeMuth

      laquisha

      Because their imaginary God says so!

      Nah Nah Nah NA NA!

      Their God can beat up your God so he must be right.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:52 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      My gosh you are all a bunch of idiots today. 800 children? Evidence please.
      But let's be clear on something...Israel DID NOT make it their mission to kill civilians in Cast Lead. If you have a problem with the Gazans that died..talk to the Hamas Govt for putting their people in harms way. Let's be honest...if Israel wanted civilian deaths, there would have been hundreds of thousands of them and no one could have stopped them.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:56 pm |
    • Ykcyc

      It doesn't matter if a child is black or white, palestinian, christian, or jewish. No child deserves this. Most people who have a heart woud agree. To take a life of another just because we do not agree? What have we become?!

      March 21, 2012 at 2:03 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      You are right, no child does deserve this.

      March 21, 2012 at 2:04 pm |
    • Ykcyc

      It is about the freedom from thought. Beliefs (thought) of any kind will continue to be the source of suffering for human kind, as long as people think they have to defend (sometimes to the death) their thoughts (beliefs), whenever they feel threatened by a different view, idea, opinion, etc. When will people realize that no thought can contain the absolute truth? At the very best, thoughts can point to it, but the only ones that can benefit from that road sign, will be the ones with an open mind, which most religions do not allow. Maybe in the beginning, thoughts have appeared to have been an evolutionary advantage; it should be clear and obvious that at this time, unquestioned thoughts are interfering with Life on this planet and are an evolutionary liability.

      March 21, 2012 at 2:37 pm |
    • Urafkntool

      Because the Jews see the Gentile (that's the rest of us) as throw away trash. We're not, but that's how they see us. It doesn't matter if said Gentile is Christian, Pagan, Buddhist... they don't care. They have no loyalty other to themselves and they aren't worth our time of day.

      March 21, 2012 at 2:48 pm |
    • Ykcyc

      @Urafkntool
      That's the fear and a closed mind talking. Why do you care how others see you? Does their opinion matter to you that much? Do you live your life, according to how others see you? If that's the case, you are not free, my friend. You are a slave to your or other's thoughts and believes. Time to ask yourself, who you really are.

      March 21, 2012 at 2:58 pm |
    • Urafkntool

      I have 3 words for you: "The Samson Option."

      March 21, 2012 at 3:09 pm |
    • Duh

      "Time to ask yourself, who you really are."

      They are a afkntool.

      March 21, 2012 at 3:15 pm |
    • Ykcyc

      @Duh
      "They" are not who they "think" they are. "They" may not be able to see it yet. It is a "normal" human condition.
      The ego needs enemies to strengthen it's "I" illusion. If it is not "them", "it" would find anybody else.

      @Urafkntool
      I choose not to. I don't care what others believe.
      I am responsible for my own state of being.
      I am going on with my life.

      I’m not my thoughts – No thought is true.
      Thoughts aren’t your source – No thought is you.
      Don’t trust your thoughts – No thought is real.
      Mind that believes that thoughts are real is troubled, ill.

      You want this kind of reality, I have no doubt that you will get it.
      The dragon you are trying to slay, does not exist, except in your head.
      Good luck.

      March 21, 2012 at 3:56 pm |
    • billy_Spudd

      Just because you claim there is only 'one god' doesn't mean you aren't still worshiping a false idol.

      March 21, 2012 at 4:07 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      Urafkntool- "Because the Jews see the Gentile (that's the rest of us) as throw away trash. "

      No they don't.

      March 21, 2012 at 4:12 pm |
    • sick dog

      bla bal bla were they already planning their burial as children to go to Israel. Nah they're being used, bought and paid for

      March 21, 2012 at 4:15 pm |
    • octopus

      @Urafkntool "Because the Jews see the Gentile (that's the rest of us) as throw away trash."

      No, only you. But then EVERYONE sees you as throwaway trash – and justly so.

      March 21, 2012 at 5:07 pm |
    • Thinker23

      laquisha... For starters, there were no "800 Palestinian children" killed in Gaza during Cast Lead. Further, people are being killed during ANY war and no one, even Israel, has the magic weapons killing bad guys only. Still further, as long as the Palestinians are willing the war to continue it will continue and more Palestinians will be killed. When the number of dead Palestinians will satisfy those still alive they will ask for peace.

      March 21, 2012 at 6:06 pm |
  2. William Wilberforce

    I am not Jew and I would love to be buried in the eternal city of Jerusalem. There my Lord Jesus Christ will establish his eternal kingdom and will rule the nations of the world as Lord of Lords and King of Kings. The Apostle John declares in Revelation , a new heaven,a new earth and a new Jerusalem.Amen.

    March 21, 2012 at 1:44 pm |
    • joshua liss

      you are unfortunately speaking repugnent words.
      what the muslim in france did a few days ago is no different than what was done by the christians to the jews for centuries.
      maybe the time for you to forget about the prophecies and realise that the cross of your false messiah was turned into swords to massacre jew after jew.
      the prophecy of john will be proven to be wrong when the real messiah comes and he won't be any son of God. We do not try and preach to the other religions or nations this fact because we belive that it will become clear with the passing of time.
      stop trying to converts us... the nazis tried phisical annialation the evangelicals and missonaries of today are attempting spirtual destruction. You will never succeed... we are the chose people of God and are not going to recognise the false messiah ever

      March 21, 2012 at 5:38 pm |
    • Thinker23

      Joshua... It IS different. You see, Christianity DOES NOT order the Christians to kill every Jew in sight (PROVE me wrong if you wish). Islam DOES.

      March 21, 2012 at 6:19 pm |
  3. Jonathan

    Comment to the author about this sentence: "...known by Muslims as the Sanctuary of Abraham"
    This place was the "sanctuary of abraham" 2,000 years before Islam existed. You are talking about Jewish Burial and this sentence seems to an opportunity to insert your personal misnomer that the muslims have some kind kind of historical claim to Israel.

    March 21, 2012 at 1:40 pm |
    • laquisha

      Strange. Living in an area for 2,000 years consecutively doesn't give a people an historical claim to a land? I didn't know that. So, when can we Europeans rename Constantinople and move back? Will Israel support us in this venture?

      March 21, 2012 at 1:45 pm |
    • Jonathan

      laquisha:
      I wasn't speaking on the topic of who has claim to any land. I was making a comment about who are the ones that named the place Cave of Patriarchs – Sanctuary of Abraham. The author makes it sound like a Muslim place – where it is historically Jewish. If you are seeking truth go read history books and stop listening to others. Seek truth! If you can handle such a thing.

      March 21, 2012 at 2:31 pm |
    • billy_Spudd

      Abraham was not Jewish! According to the Torah, Jacob was the first Jew.

      March 21, 2012 at 4:09 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      billy_Spudd- "According to the Torah, Jacob was the first Jew."

      Got a citation for that? Just curious.

      March 21, 2012 at 4:13 pm |
    • Peter

      200 % right,well said @jonathan

      March 21, 2012 at 4:40 pm |
  4. Matan

    I replayed here for a comment, and I would like all of you to pay attention for it. It is important to know!!!

    Israel is the only little piece of sanity in the middle east! Isarel is the only place of western culture and real democracy in the middle east, by the way, Israel is the only place the ARAB enjoy RIGHTS and EQUALITY. Israel is definetly not the problem in the middle east!!!
    (The problem is with the Islamic religion that says to her sons to go and die a holy death (= teror))
    wish you all understand the real problem :)

    March 21, 2012 at 1:40 pm |
    • laquisha

      Israel is a "democracy?" Strange, bc it describes itself as a "Jewish state" implying no inherent difference between church and state. Why can't any nation on earth be a "catholic state" without Abe Foxman spewing his venom? You also know it is illegal in Israel for a Jew to marry a non-Jew, correct? The hypocrisy of you people is hilarious.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:50 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      @laquisha- I'm guessing you've never been to Israel to actually know what you are blabbering about.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:52 pm |
    • Matan

      William DeMuth – No we are not the half of problem.. we do not slaughter them. They try to kill us!! we just defend our babies by killing terorists.
      laquisha – Israel is Absolutely democray!! we are the major here so it is a jewish state. if the Arabs become the major, it will be an Arab state. I'm sorry to shatter the your myth but in Israel we have a real free election (not as in Egypt, Syria, Lebanon, Gaza and Iran, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Yemen, there everthing is fake), in Israel the women has rights, (not as in...) every religin can freely exists (not as in...). BTY we can marry every one we want. Israel is the only little piece of sanity in the middle east!

      March 21, 2012 at 2:13 pm |
    • GodPot

      If you believe Israel is infact God's chosen people and believe they have the right to take Palistinian lands because of a prophecy written in one of your books, then you are at least half of the problem. I understand that Islam also has it's own prophecies for who God chose and who should occupy Jerusalem, so they are the other half of the problem. You BOTH have killed members of the opposing side, however Israel is now the acting prison guard for a nation of incarcerated women, children, and yes Men who reject your claim to their land and fight back as any insurgency would. What you call terrorist they call freedom fighter, and they have a point. The Americans who revolted against Brittish rule could have been considered terrorists of their time, and yet we see them as Patriots throwing off the shackles of an unjust ruler today and celebrate them as hero's. Until you both agree to put aside your religion for the good of the innocent who are being killed as collateral damage nothing will change and more blood will be on boths sides hands and your God's are not strong enough to wash that blood away.

      March 21, 2012 at 2:50 pm |
    • Davidrom

      Laquisha, your claim in trying to take Constantinople again , and comparing it witjh the "Jewish Problem" as the occidental nations , had call the jewish nation , is just absurd , if european people had the same problems that jewish people had face through centuries , it would be shame not to support it , but history is the opposite of what your saying, instead european nations always had a strong antisemitic feeling, and dont forget also how the muslims goverments had treat the jews , some times good , some times bad etc etc . World has been trying to fix the jewsih problem since inmemorial times , and their solutions always had been unwise and violent actions against the jews, now that there is a place where the jewsih nation is trying not to depend anymore of other countries , the whole world is making problems ,and why? is just because the same old feeling against trying to comprehend jewish culture , when the palestinians where kicked out of Israel and they were trying to settle in other arab countries , they were rejected by their own muslim fellows !!!! the palestinian claim in the land of israel , as it known nowadays is unreal , palestinians hadnt live in Israel for 2,000 years , because lets make memories , when Palestine was a british colony is was an empty land with only some arab merchants around the Gza area and a tiny jewsih and muslim comunity in jerusalem , furthermore the jewsih existence in the land of israel can be pointed since the conquest of Yeoshua to the last of cruzades and more the muslims existence in israel was turkish , so what claim of 2000 years does this guys have in israel i just dont get it , and yes Israel is a democracy and the arabs that have israeli nationality live in a very nice environment , for example , israel is the only place in middle east that has arab women working as taxi drivers , when can u see this in Syria , Iran, Irak , they also dont have any economic limits , is the only place on middle east where muslims can drive BMW and make lots of shekels , and the most beautiful part of this , is that israeli-arabs know this perfect. about marrying a non jewish person its only a problem with the rabanut , the religious political office , but within the secular world , Israel wasnt got any problem of marying jewsih and not jewsih guys i know lots of them in Israel, i would like to invite u guys to really care about the problem and study world history , to really make reasonable reserches about the problem.

      Thanks.

      March 21, 2012 at 2:53 pm |
    • Matan

      William DeMuth
      the babies killing when the terorists use them as human shield (because the want you to say we are killing children). IDF usually stops operations when the know children involve in, show me another army that will do so!, in our operation in Gaza we recovered *their* children in our hospital show me another contry that will do so (i.e. we took from Gaza babies with their family and put them in one of our hospital, a film has been made of it. after we ISRAEL recovered the baby which the film deals with, the director asked the mother : "what do you want him to be when he will grow up"? she answered SHAHID. Nice, isn't it? we are very ethical!!
      about Iran, you can continue to be apathetic and think it is only Israel's problem but soon when Iran will have a Nuclear weapons maybe we will be the firs to suffer but somehow "by mistake" the weapon will be in terorist's hands (those who destroyed the ground zero), and then a A radioactive cloud will cover New York. so make by yoursalf the mathematic a conventional war now or unconvantional war when tou will wake up!?

      March 21, 2012 at 2:55 pm |
    • William DeMuth

      Matan

      There are more Jews in New York than in Tel Aviv.

      Good riddance to it (Sorry Mom!)

      March 21, 2012 at 3:45 pm |
    • Focus

      Matan-The problem with Muslims is that that they are very intolerant of non-muslims.
      The persecution of non-mulsims across the globe is just gut-wrenching. The world needs to stop this intolerance,violence and hatred by the muslims around the globe. Their violence has to stop.

      March 21, 2012 at 4:01 pm |
    • Chaya

      Matan is correct! If you have never been here, you don't know. Come here for a visit...and then go to an Arab city and compare.

      March 21, 2012 at 4:58 pm |
  5. Claire

    Actually the reason that so many French Jews are buried in Israel is bc in accordance to French law bodies in cemeteries in Paris & other small cities are dug up and cremated after 30 or 35 years due to a lack of space in the cemeteries. Cremation is forbidden in Jewish law therefore most people just bury immediately in Israel to avoid having to go through another burial many years later.

    March 21, 2012 at 1:33 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      @laquisha- You are nuts.
      "JEWS DO NOT CONSIDER THEMSELVES MEMBERS OF THE NATIONS IN WHICH THEY LIVE."

      Where on Earth did you get this notion from? You do realize that you fell into a fallacy of absolutes right?

      March 21, 2012 at 1:48 pm |
  6. Truefax

    "As for those who are buried outside of Israel, Ginsberg says, the resurrection, when it comes, will not be lost on them. The process will just be more arduous and definitely less comfortable.

    Tunnels will be created underground leading to Israel, he says, “and their bones will roll into Israel.”

    Those already buried there “will save themselves that pain.”
    "

    Uh huh, cuz your sky god only exists over that parcle of land right.

    March 21, 2012 at 1:32 pm |
  7. Matan

    lin9, what are you talking about??
    Israel is the only little piece of sanity in the middle east! Isarel is the only place of western culture and real democracy in the middle east, by the way, Israel is the only place the ARAB enjoy RIGHTS and EQUALITY. Israel is definetly not the problem!!!
    (The problem is with the Islamic religion that says to her sons to go and die a holy death (= teror))
    wish you understand the real problem :)

    March 21, 2012 at 1:23 pm |
  8. Common Sense

    Karl marx,Joeseph Engels jewish,Vladmir Lenin,Leon trotsky Jewish,Joeseph Stalin jewish every Bolshivik leader from Lenin to Stalin jewish the blood of 60,000,000 is on your hands you're hardly the innocent victim

    March 21, 2012 at 1:12 pm |
    • Ignorance is Everywhere

      Your ignorance is mind numbing. Though it's probably less ignorance than bigotry. And Common Sense is definitely on oxymoron for you.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:23 pm |
    • laquisha

      Lenein was 1/4 jewish and spoke Yiddish with hs jewish wife. Stalin was a georgian, not a jew. Lmao, I love how now of you bother to comment on the fact that Laar Kaganovich (artiest of the Holdomar), Trotsky (bronstein), Ilya Ehrenburg...I could go on for pages... were jews is a Russia where jews made up .005% of the population.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:38 pm |
    • William DeMuth

      laquisha

      You seem to confuse culture versus religion.

      Either you believe the Jewish faith or you don't, you can't be three quarters any religion

      (Please note, Christians can be considered half Jewish in some ways!)

      March 21, 2012 at 1:59 pm |
    • MennoKnight

      Lenin and Stalin were Atheists hence the fact that they were Communists of the early 20th Century. Stalin was from a nominal Christian home that rejected Christianity, Lenin, as mentioned before was 1/4 Jewish who rejected all faiths but the faith of Atheism.

      I am a born again Christian and my savior is a Jew. The Jewish people are a blessing to the world.

      March 21, 2012 at 3:14 pm |
    • Common Sense

      Jews are a race guided by a common religion sorry.And yes Jews invented and were responsible for the rise of Communism.And are for being a Christian and brown noseing the Jews as the "chosen ones" you obvious never read the New Testement and what Jesus actually stood for "you are like your father and speak only lies"

      March 23, 2012 at 11:15 am |
  9. Joe

    Jonathan Sandler, Gabriel Sandler, Arieh Sandler, and Myriam Monsonego HY"D

    March 21, 2012 at 1:11 pm |
  10. Amit-Atlanta-USA

    JUST WATCH OUT!

    I will NOT at all be surprised if our own Islamic supporters like Mr. Fareed Zakaria or Dean ObeidALLAH will write up yet another story bashing the valiant Jews and castigating Americans for questioning the loyalities of Muslims in the light of this.

    JUST WATCH OUT!

    March 21, 2012 at 1:08 pm |
  11. YoursIsNoDisgrace

    What Chosen means:

    Because of our acceptance of Torah, Jews have a special status in the eyes of G-d, but we lose that special status when we abandon Torah. Furthermore, the blessings that we received from G-d by accepting the Torah come with a high price: Jews have a greater responsibility than non-Jews. While non-Jews are only obligated to obey the seven commandments given to Noah, Jews are responsible for fulfilling the 613 mitzvot in the Torah, thus G-d will punish Jews for doing things that would not be a sin for non-Jews.

    March 21, 2012 at 1:05 pm |
    • William DeMuth

      What chosen really means, when applied to ones self is that the speaker has a higher status in a heirarchy.

      If that heirarchy exists only in your head, it means the person claiming it is a bigot.

      Your God does not exist (no God does), therfore you are a bigot.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:31 pm |
  12. EranTheJew

    i never understood why people always hate on the jews, what did my ancesestor did that we deserve to be hated on without notice without a reason to why u gotta hate me for i am a jew. the white people of the world need to be carefull and make babies because by 2050 germany will become a muslim republic purely by numbers as for the rest of europe( the christian europeans lost the war because they decided to hunt the jew to extinction, instead of hating join the battle against islam and thier murderer prophet

    March 21, 2012 at 1:03 pm |
    • fred

      Eran
      I do not understand why you rejected Jesus as the Christ. What are your reasons specifically?

      March 21, 2012 at 1:41 pm |
    • SPA Knight

      Eran – Count me as a non-Jew who does not hate you or your ancestors. In fact, true Christianity is built upon Judaism. The hatred you refer to may be linked to the Old Testament in the story of Abraham. For those of Arab descent, they see Ishmail as the true first born of Abraham and the heir to the Abrahamic lineage which includes the Promised Land. Clearly he was the first born but he wasn't the child of Sarah but of an Egyptian slave girl. This is one of the reason why conflict in the Middle East will never cease because in essence it is a family fued that has gone on for centuries. The Jews believe the land of Israel belongs to them through Isaac's family lineage but Arabs believe the birthright of Ishmail was taken away from him without cause.

      Until Arabs (primarily Muslim) see Jews as their brothers, this conflict will never end. Christians have no cause to hate either Muslims or Jews because we all share a common heritage. In fact, many Christians are persecuted because of their continued support for Israel.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:43 pm |
    • William DeMuth

      SPA Knight

      The majority of Christians loathe Jews. Always have always will.

      You have heard of Pogroms right?

      That’s why you guys eat Ham on Easter.

      I have asked 10 Jews within the past five minutes, and they all agree completely! Born Again’s use them like a canary in a coal mine, hoping they die to indicate the second coming.

      March 21, 2012 at 2:04 pm |
    • SPA Knight

      William – Are you speaking on behalf of Christians suddenly?

      March 21, 2012 at 2:29 pm |
    • Woody

      "I do not understand why you rejected Jesus as the Christ. What are your reasons specifically?" – Fred

      Could it be because there's absolutely no proof? Many people, other than Jews, reject Jesus as the "Christ". The main reason believers accept him as the "Christ", is because he (Jesus) made the claim. Jesus must have been one hell of a BS artist. He'd have been a great used car salesman, if they had cars in those days.

      March 21, 2012 at 2:38 pm |
    • SPA Knight

      william – I am not familiar with progroms but the eating of ham is not rooted in Christianity but in a paganistic fertility cult. Like many other paganistic rituals, this tradition was adopted by Christianity and given new meaning during the conversion of pagans into the faith. Nothing to do with Judaism I'm afraid but nice try in derailing the real discussion.

      March 21, 2012 at 2:39 pm |
    • William DeMuth

      SPA Knight

      Wrong again dude.

      Hams were distributed by Torquemada himself.

      Those who refused them had a VERY short life expectancy

      March 21, 2012 at 2:43 pm |
    • William DeMuth

      SPA Knight

      I do not speak for Christians only of them, because their own spokesmen lie.

      The truth is out, only fools deny it.

      March 21, 2012 at 2:45 pm |
    • EranTheJew

      fred, first off chirstianty is a pagen religion so i have no reason to believe in jesus (born lived and died as a jew). christianty has no say in this because both jews and islamists alike know that christianty is a load of BS that the emperor of the holy eastern roman empire, constantinople invented to calm the civil riots.
      secondly to spaknight ismail was a son of a slave girl he was born because sarah couldnt give birth at that time so he was a product of abraham being a MAN. thirdly where does it say that a jewish person invented interest because i know for a damn fact that in europe jews were mainly farmers of bootmakers

      March 21, 2012 at 2:45 pm |
    • SPA Knight

      Woody – What kind of proof are you looking for? First off, you recognize that Jesus is a historical figure then unlike many on this blog who seem to think that he never even existed. If you say that the Jews themselves rejected his claim as the Messiah then he must have made that claim correct? In fact not only did he claim to be the Christ but he even claimed he was God himself with the authority to forgive sins. And so he did. Why would he do that? He was either crazy, had a death wish or was telling the truth perhaps.

      March 21, 2012 at 3:06 pm |
    • fred

      EranTheJew
      So you think the well educated roman citizen Saul of Tarsus was a big liar? Few scholars doubt his letters to the church. Even your own Tulmud refers to Jesus the truouble making preacher, a jew do you deny your own records?
      What sect of Jew are you ?

      March 21, 2012 at 4:30 pm |
    • Woody

      "In fact not only did he claim to be the Christ but he even claimed he was God himself with the authority to forgive sins." – SPA Knight

      Mental Insti-tutions, worldwide, are full of people with similar delusions. Jesus, if he did exist, was either crazy or one of the greatest con artists of all time.

      March 21, 2012 at 8:48 pm |
    • Woody

      "In fact not only did he claim to be the Christ but he even claimed he was God himself with the authority to forgive sins." SPA Knight

      Mental Insti-tutions, worldwide, are full of people with similar delusions. Jesus, if he did exist, was either crazy or one of the greatest con artists of all time.

      March 21, 2012 at 8:49 pm |
    • fred

      WOW got a double Woody on that one !
      You get a fail on the great con man idea however. What con man would give everything to someone who does not deserve it. What con man would take a beating and get nailed to cross in order to save your soul. What con man would be perfect in all ways and free of sin.

      March 21, 2012 at 8:57 pm |
    • huh?

      "You get a fail on the great con man idea however. What con man would give everything to someone who does not deserve it. What con man would take a beating and get nailed to cross in order to save your soul. What con man would be perfect in all ways and free of sin."

      The other pagan religions that story was stolen from did similar sacrifices...and rose from the dead too. . Gandhi starved himself almost to death to get people to change their minds, the Jews burned in the furnaces to get the world to stop Hitler.

      March 21, 2012 at 9:01 pm |
    • fred

      Huh?
      Similarity of stories is just that similarity. Without taking a class designed to water down the faithful or doing a Wiki search it is hard to come up with the others you speak of that rose from the dead. The name of Jesus to this day will cause a stir and millions continue to give their lives to Jesus every year. There is power in truth that even Stalin, Mao or Poll Pot could not drown out even at the cost of millions of dead worshipers.

      March 21, 2012 at 9:14 pm |
    • Huh?

      "the name of Jesus to this day will cause a stir and millions continue to give their lives to Jesus every year. There is power in truth that even Stalin, Mao or Poll Pot could not drown out even at the cost of millions of dead worshipers"

      You keep posting the same crap but religion has killed more people. The name of Gandhi still causes a stir, the name of Martin Luther King still causes a stir, the name of Shakespeare, the name of Plato.... Now do your homework and show how many are leaving Christianity when they learn the truth that your god doesn't exist....scroll back...there was just a recent article of those leaving the church.. LMAO!

      March 21, 2012 at 9:18 pm |
    • fred

      Huh?
      The Bible says the end will come when no other soul can be saved. The Bible says in the end times we will be deceived by false religions and false teachers. In the end times people will abandon God and turn to the beast. You may be correct and we have reached the tipping point where people are giving up on God more than new people are coming to God. This has been predicted.

      March 21, 2012 at 9:25 pm |
    • HuH?

      "The Bible says the end will come when no other soul can be saved. The Bible says in the end times we will be deceived by false religions and false teachers. In the end times people will abandon God and turn to the beast. You may be correct and we have reached the tipping point where people are giving up on God more than new people are coming to God. This has been predicted."

      It's just a fictional book. I can quote Nostradamus and make it fit anything in history doesn't mean it's true, only an ignorant person thinks the world is going to end this year. LMAO!

      March 21, 2012 at 9:28 pm |
    • SPA Knight

      EranTheJew – You state that Sarah was unable to conceive at that time so Ishmail was a result of Abraham being a man. The fact is both Sarah and Abraham were disobedient of God, were not willing to wait or simply didn't believe him when he said he would bless them with a son. This story sounds similar to Adam and Eve doesn't it? Despite the fact that God continually reached out to the Hebrews to renew his covenant, they simply disobeyed him time after time. He never gave up on them and still haven't.

      Regarding your comment on Christianity being a pagan religion, well the only response I have to that is that I wish you well with your family fued with the descendants of Ishmail. But remember this, the final covenant that God made with his people was to extend salvation to the Gentiles in Jesus Christ. See you in Jerusalem!

      March 22, 2012 at 10:54 am |
  13. Urafkntool

    Okay duh, your name fits. You need to consider this idea:

    When we were an entirely white nation, we were also THE economic powerhouse, as well as THE country that beat back England TWICE. Nobody else managed it once. Now that we're all "multicutural" and our country's been sold out to non-whites, it's also a major s-h-i-t-hole.

    March 21, 2012 at 1:01 pm |
  14. ladydi

    If thats where they want to be buried.....so what?????

    March 21, 2012 at 12:58 pm |
  15. jimtanker

    Bible study for today: Was Lot a righeous man?

    March 21, 2012 at 12:57 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      The incest was after they got him so drunk that he didn't know they had been with him. He did offer his daughters to the crowd to keep them from getting the angels. However, God sent the angels to take Lot and his family out of Sodom before it was destroyed. Righteous or not God preserved him.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:15 pm |
    • TruthPrevails

      Interesting interpretation Robert...where is your proof of that? Sounds more like you were drunk when you read that part!

      March 21, 2012 at 1:18 pm |
    • Just the Facts

      How about ol' Noah? He was a drunkard who even put a magic evil curse on his grandson who he mistakenly accused of seeing him naked!

      Yeah, yeah, yeah, learn from their weaknesses...

      There is just as much good advice in Aesop's fables... and it's clear that you do not need to believe that foxes, frogs and wolves talk.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:20 pm |
    • fred

      Yes he was. Since Lot is only shown in the Bible that is all we know of him. That same Bible God sees him as righteous. All have sinned and fall short of the glory of God. God saved Lot because of who God is not Lots condition at time of saving. The drunkeness and immorality of the daughters is a side effect from bringing your family up in a bad town. Lot chose that place without consulting God and paid a dear price.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:47 pm |
    • J.W

      His daughters were mad that he was going to give them away to a mob.

      March 21, 2012 at 1:49 pm |
    • just sayin

      2 Peter Chapter 2 verse 7

      March 21, 2012 at 9:10 pm |
    • Benlot

      If I have a daughter who is crazy enough to make me drunk to lay in bed with me, I would surely let streetdogs to give her a behind.

      March 21, 2012 at 9:46 pm |
  16. duh

    "The US was originally started and meant to be a white nation."

    Even if it was it was a HUGE mistake and one that has been fixed. Only a moron would think something like that was important. What a closed minded bigot you are.

    March 21, 2012 at 12:53 pm |
  17. wpqr

    And don't forget all those Noble Prize winners in science and medicine they keep churning out year after year. Nothing but problems..

    March 21, 2012 at 12:53 pm |
  18. Urafkntool

    sorry about the double post. Either my internet or CNN are running slow.

    March 21, 2012 at 12:50 pm |
  19. Aurelija

    LOL of course Evil Juice is responsible for your crisis, nobody would event think of another reason such as your lousy skills...

    March 21, 2012 at 12:50 pm |
  20. Pancho Villa

    thank good I'm Mexican and don't have to worry about that conflict. You Should move to Mexico. Mexicans are very accepting of other peoples religions. You can live in peace their just ask Mitt Romeneys relatives who live in a mormon settlement in Colonia Dulban and the Quakers who live in Chihuhua or the Jewish who live in Guadalajara. They are doing quite well.

    March 21, 2012 at 12:45 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke and Eric Marrapodi with daily contributions from CNN's worldwide newsgathering team.