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American nuns face Vatican over rogue charges
Sisters Pat Farrell and Janet Mock met with Vatican officials over claims their group had gone rogue.
June 12th, 2012
12:05 PM ET

American nuns face Vatican over rogue charges

By Eric Marrapodi, CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor

(CNN) – After weeks of anticipation, the leaders of American's largest umbrella group of nuns met Tuesday with the Vatican to address charges the nuns had gone rogue.

At the Vatican, Sisters Pat Farrell and Janet Mock, president and executive director respectively of the Leadership Conference of Women Religious, sat down with Cardinal William Levada, head of Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith the church's doctrinal watchdog group, and Archbishop Peter Sartain of Seattle, who is charged with bringing the nuns back in line with the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops and the Vatican.

The sisters and church officials met to discuss a doctrinal assessment finding the influential group of American nuns had strayed too far from the church's teachings.

In a statement afterward, the nuns said, "The meeting had been requested by the LCWR to address what the conference considered deficiencies in the process and the results of the doctrinal assessment of the organization released by the CDF in April."

“It was an open meeting and we were able to directly express our concerns to Cardinal Levada and Archbishop Sartain,” Farrell said in a statement from the nuns' group.

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In a statement, the Vatican said, "The meeting provided the opportunity for the Congregation and the LCWR officers to discuss the issues and concerns raised by the doctrinal assessment in an atmosphere of openness and cordiality."

The Vatican reiterated that under canon law, which dictates how the church operates, the Leadership Conference of Women Religious "remains under the supreme direction of the Holy See in order to promote common efforts among the individual member institutes and cooperation with the Holy See and the local Conference of Bishops."

Cardinal William Levada, head of the Catholic Church's doctrinal watchdog group, had called the face-to-face meeting critical

"The purpose of the doctrinal assessment is to assist the LCWR in this important mission by promoting a vision of ecclesial communion founded on faith in Jesus Christ and the teachings of the Church as faithfully taught through the ages under the guidance of the Magisterium," the statement continued.

The Leadership Conference of Women Religious is a group of 1,500 nuns who lead more than 300 religious orders. Together, its members represent 80% of the 57,000 nuns across the United States.

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The group's board met two weeks ago in Washington for the first time to discuss the assessment, saying it “was based on unsubstantiated accusations and (was) the result of a flawed process that lacked transparency.”

“Moreover, the sanctions imposed were disproportionate to the concerns raised and could compromise (the nuns’) ability to fulfill their mission,” the group said in a statement.

The lengthy doctrinal assessment, released in April, listed a number of concerns church officials had with the sisters.

It said that at an annual gathering of the group, guest speakers who preached "radical feminism" went unchallenged. The report also alleged sins of omission, saying the nuns were focused too heavily on social justice and not enough on opposing abortion, euthanasia and same-sex marriage.

Levada, an American who was formerly archbishop of San Francisco, earlier had called the face-to-face meeting in Rome critical.  "Such a personal encounter allows for the opportunity to review the document together in a spirit of mutual respect and collaboration, hopefully thereby avoiding possible misunderstandings of the document’s intent and scope," he said in a statement at the time of the assessment.

"As the issues evidenced in the doctrinal assessment involve essential questions of faith, the Holy Father has given the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith a special mandate to collaborate with the (Leadership Conference of Women Religious) in a renewal of their work through a concentrated reflection on the doctrinal foundations of that work," Levada said.

The nuns' group said their leaders will return to the United States and discuss its options with members at their annual meeting in August.

The Leadership Conference of Women Religious was formed at the behest of the Vatican and is still under the auspices of the Holy See. One approach the nuns are said to be considering is the "nuclear option," with the sisters resigning en masse and forming a nonprofit group outside the Vatican's reach.

- CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor

Filed under: Belief • Bishops • Catholic Church • Pope Benedict XVI • Vatican

soundoff (702 Responses)
  1. silver

    They seem real quick to punish the nuns, but not the pedo priests.

    June 12, 2012 at 7:07 pm |
    • blondie

      yeah, ain't that the truth!

      June 12, 2012 at 7:10 pm |
    • Frank

      But raping children isn't against church doctrine so it's not an issue or priority so....rape away! On the other hand....these rogue harlot women...well, that's a different matter all together and it won't stand!

      June 12, 2012 at 9:18 pm |
  2. sportreform

    Going to the Vatican and going commando too.

    June 12, 2012 at 7:03 pm |
  3. kindness

    MY personal testimony.
    A thought to consider without an ego response

    Accept Jesus christ as your lord and saviour. You never know how soon is too late. Transcend the worldly illusion of enslavement.
    The world denounces truth....

    Accepting Jesus Christ (for me) resulted in something like seeng a new colour. You will see it .....but will not be able to clearly explain it to anyone else..... Its meant to be that way to transend any selfism within you.

    Also... much the world arranges "surrounding dark matter into something to be debated" in such a way that protects/inflates the ego.

    The key is be present and transcend our own desire to physically see evidence. We don't know anyways by defending our own perception of dark matter.

    Currently.... most of us are constructing our own path that suits our sin lifestyle. Were all sinners. Knowing that we are is often an issue. But both christians and non are sinners.

    We don't like to Let go and let god. We want control to some degree. This is what Jesus asks us to do. "Follow me".
    It's the hardest thing to do... but is done by letting the truth of scripture lead you (redemptive revelation)... as I said .

    Try reading corinthians and see if it makes sense to you. Try it without a pre conceived notion of it being a fairy tale.
    See the truth...
    do we do what it says in todays society... is it relevant... so many have not recently read and only hinge their philosophy on what they have heard from som other person...which may have been full of arogance pride or vanity..

    Look closely at the economy ponzi, look at how society idolizes Lust , greed , envy, sloth, pride of life, desire for knowledge, desire for power, desire for revencge,gluttony with food etc .

    Trancsend the temporal world.

    Just think if you can find any truth you can take with you ....in any of these things. When you die your riches go to someone who will spend away your life..... You will be forgotten.... history will repeat iteslf.... the greatest minds knowledge fade or are eventually plagerzed..... your good deeds will be forgotten and only give you a fleeting temporary reward . your learned teachings are forgotten or mutated..... your gold is transfered back to the rullers that rule you through deception. Your grave will grow over . This is truth .

    Trancsend your egoism and free yourself from this dominion of satan. Understand you are a sinner and part of the collective problem of this worldly matrix... Repent.... Repent means knowing (to change) The Holy spirit (within) will convict you beyond what you think you can do by yourself. Grace is given to those who renounce the world. That are" in" the world but not "of " the world.

    Evidence follows faith. Faith does not follow evidence..... Faith above reason in Jesus Christ.

    Faith comes by Reading or Hearing the word of god from the bible . Ask Jesus in faith for dicernment and start reading the new testament... You will be shocked when you lay down your preconceived notions and ....see and hear truth ... see how christ sets an example ... feel the truth....

    Read Ecclesiastes. Read corinthians.

    You cant trancend your own egoism by adapting a world philosophy to suit your needs. Seek the truth in Christ.

    Sell all your cleverness and purchase true bewilderment. You don't get what you want ....you get what you are in christ.

    I promise this has been the truth for me. In Jesus christ .

    Think of what you really have to lose. ...your ego?

    Break the Matrix of illusion that holds your senses captive.

    once you do . you too will have the wisdom of God that comes only through the Holy Spirit. Saved By grace through Faith. Just like seeing a new colour.... can't explain it to a transient caught in the matrix of worldly deception.
    You will also see how the world suppresses this information and distorts it

    You're all smart people . I tell the truth. Its hard to think out of the box when earthly thinking is the box.
    I'ts a personal free experience you can do it free anytime . Don't wait till you are about to die.. START PUTTING YOUR TREASURES WHERE THEY REALLY MATTER >
    Its awsome and It's just between you and Jesus

    my testimony

    Romans 10:9

    "If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved."

    June 12, 2012 at 7:02 pm |
    • blondie

      Looks like you missed yur dose of haldol....come with me to the padded room and will give you an injection...Dr.'s Orders now...

      June 12, 2012 at 7:09 pm |
    • just sayin

      Kindness, sorry glossed over your rant and bs.

      June 12, 2012 at 7:11 pm |
    • NSL

      Your post is complete malarkey, and has nothing to do with the article and the issues of the Nuns with the Catholic Church.

      Christians can very much believe in Jesus, and at the same time, believe the Church hierarchy is full of it, and it appears to me that the report and dressing down of the nuns is an absurdity written by a bunch of men who have very much lost their way.

      The American nuns in question have my support and admiration for what they do and how they go about it.

      June 12, 2012 at 7:15 pm |
    • Aezel

      I think you had to write this down. You couldn't possibly spew this much bull***t and not run out of breath.

      June 12, 2012 at 7:16 pm |
    • CuriousAboutStuff

      Hallelujah!!! well said. When the veil is lifted and the blind can see; they will say Hallelujah as well. Thank you Jesus ...

      June 12, 2012 at 7:32 pm |
  4. YouGoNuns!

    I hope they do leave the church and form their own group out of reach of the Vatican. They are accused of doing too much uplifting of the human spirit and not enough oppressing. WWJD?

    June 12, 2012 at 7:00 pm |
  5. srichey321

    Ever notice how religion works out best if you are a man?

    June 12, 2012 at 6:49 pm |
    • Drew

      Most inst itutions seem to work out better if you are a man

      June 12, 2012 at 6:54 pm |
    • Dana

      It's aaaaaaa Cruel World ?

      June 12, 2012 at 6:59 pm |
    • humanone

      Put a woman on St. Peter's chair... it might be a better church. Just a thought. Not in my life.

      "The Vatican reiterated that under canon law, which dictates how the church operates... promoting a vision of ecclesial communion founded on faith in Jesus Christ and the teachings of the Church as faithfully taught through the ages under the guidance of the Magisterium,"

      The All Holy Male Magestirium founded on the faith in JC... yes, the Borgias come to mind, the Dominicans and their Inquisition, a Holy See that turns it's eyes the other way when the clergy prey on the innocent.. the list goes on.

      I know many nuns that have more balls than most male clergy running the establishment. Go Sisters!

      June 12, 2012 at 7:17 pm |
  6. Church of the Devil from Rome

    Damned Catholic Church! So full of Evil people, men wearing women dresses and abusing children. Abuse these women servants, do you? Your Church is about to be ripped out of the ground...one more Pope and that is it. You'll be forced to change or be destroyed. It will happen. Your sins will be exposed.

    June 12, 2012 at 6:45 pm |
  7. Steven Colo

    You're kidding me. The Vatican released a report critical of American nuns and didn't do a fact-check with the nuns first? Now the idiots may have to backtrack.

    June 12, 2012 at 6:42 pm |
  8. nolimits3333

    The three great evils in the world are Islam, the Catholic Church, and the Republican Party.

    Not necessarily in that order.

    June 12, 2012 at 6:38 pm |
    • Nah

      Aww, another partisan liberal. How cute :)

      June 12, 2012 at 6:44 pm |
    • Church of the Devil from Rome

      In order of evil deeds...Catholic Church, islam and the republican party.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:49 pm |
  9. Dana

    Let the trash go. Better yet remove them en mass from the catholic church and transfer them to the Episcopalian church as they are the septic tank of the fallen.

    June 12, 2012 at 6:24 pm |
    • Drew

      These women dedicated their lives to public service. So who's the real trash, Dana?

      June 12, 2012 at 6:27 pm |
    • Dana

      Drew::: I'll say I'm poor and white and a little trashy but they" Had The Calling " and if they can't follow the teaching then leave, get out , pizz off. I think you may be a gay Episcopal, now you can open your arms to those people.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:34 pm |
    • Drew

      Has in occurred to you that maybe the people who const itute the Catholic Church should have some say in what it means to be Catholic?

      June 12, 2012 at 6:37 pm |
    • Dana

      Drew absolutely not. In what world or when did you think Religion was a democracy? Religions are a group of beliefs and guidelines to a clean life. If one doesn't agree with the teachings or can't live within the guidelines or rules then you must leave the order.
      These women should no longer be identified as sisters or nuns if they no longer believe in the teachings, plain and simple.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:47 pm |
    • Drew

      Some 90 percent of Catholic women use birth control... should they all leave the church? Because if they do, the church loses about half of its membership. See, Catholicism kind of needs to be democratic, otherwise it wont have any more adherents

      June 12, 2012 at 6:50 pm |
    • Eric

      I'm with Drew.

      June 12, 2012 at 7:09 pm |
    • blondie

      Trash should be in the bin Dana, please....walk yourself outside and stand in it.

      June 12, 2012 at 7:13 pm |
  10. snaporaz

    If there isn't a punk band somewhere named "The Rogue Nuns" by the end of the week, I'll be greatly disappointed.

    June 12, 2012 at 6:23 pm |
  11. Old Man

    If you are a Catholic, then be a Catholic. If you don't like the rules of the Catholic Church find one that you like. If you can't find one you like, start your own.

    June 12, 2012 at 6:14 pm |
    • Drew

      The Catholic Church doesn't belong to the Pope, it belongs to all Catholics

      June 12, 2012 at 6:15 pm |
    • Old Man

      I don't think it was just the Pope who determined the "rules" of the Catholic Church. Every organized church has a method to determine it's rules. Everybody can't be in charge

      June 12, 2012 at 6:18 pm |
    • Drew

      Right, but unfortunately the "methods" are se xist and authoritarian. If that is something these nuns want to change, why shouldn't they try at least? It might not work, but you can't fault them for trying

      June 12, 2012 at 6:21 pm |
    • Philip Hades

      Uh, Drew, maybe you need to read the fine print. Pope's word is the word of God on Earth. "Catholics" who disagree with that are called "Protestants".

      June 12, 2012 at 6:31 pm |
    • Drew

      Not necessarily. Anyone can call themselves anything they want. If the Vatican really doesn't like it they can excommunicate the nuns.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:33 pm |
    • Philip Hades

      I'm not saying the nuns shouldn't try, but I am pointing out that Martin Luther didn't get invited to the Vatican for lunch after posting his thesis. And your comment that the pope could just excommunicate them reinforces my point that the Catholic faith belongs to the Pope, not the followers.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:39 pm |
    • Drew

      Right, but here's the rub; if the pope excommunicates large groups of people, soon he wont have a church to rule anymore. For this reason he'll be loath to excommunicate the nuns, and they may even get something they want. This is how politics works. And actually Martin Luther did get invited to lunch by the Vatican because they wanted him to recant. In hindsight, they might have wished they had compromised with him; it would have saved the church a lot of grief

      June 12, 2012 at 6:42 pm |
    • Jesse Gonzalez

      Amen!!! JESUS gives us freedom to Leave if we no longer believe (John 6:64-66). IF SOMEONE NO LONGER BELIEVES; ADIOS!!!

      June 12, 2012 at 6:44 pm |
  12. Reality

    ONLY FOR THE NEW MEMBERS OF THIS BLOG:

    The following vitiates the "so what" differences between said nuns and the Vatican:

    Saving Christians like said nuns and Vatican officials from the Infamous Resurrection Con/

    From that famous passage: In 1 Corinthians 15 St. Paul reasoned, "If Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith."

    Even now Catholic/Christian professors of theology are questioning the bodily resurrection of the simple, preacher man aka Jesus.

    To wit;

    From a major Catholic university's theology professor’s grad school white-board notes:

    "Heaven is a Spirit state or spiritual reality of union with God in love, without earthly – earth bound distractions.
    Jesus and Mary's bodies are therefore not in Heaven.

    Most believe that it to mean that the personal spiritual self that survives death is in continuity with the self we were while living on earth as an embodied person.

    Again, the physical Resurrection (meaning a resuscitated corpse returning to life), Ascension (of Jesus' crucified corpse), and Assumption (Mary's corpse) into heaven did not take place.

    The Ascension symbolizes the end of Jesus' earthly ministry and the beginning of the Church.

    Only Luke records it. (Luke mentions it in his gospel and Acts, i.e. a single attestation and therefore historically untenable). The Ascension ties Jesus' mission to Pentecost and missionary activity of Jesus' followers.

    The Assumption has multiple layers of symbolism, some are related to Mary's special role as "Christ bearer" (theotokos). It does not seem fitting that Mary, the body of Jesus' Virgin-Mother (another biblically based symbol found in Luke 1) would be derived by worms upon her death. Mary's assumption also shows God's positive regard, not only for Christ's male body, but also for female bodies." "

    "In three controversial Wednesday Audiences, Pope John Paul II pointed out that the essential characteristic of heaven, hell or purgatory is that they are states of being of a spirit (angel/demon) or human soul, rather than places, as commonly perceived and represented in human language. This language of place is, according to the Pope, inadequate to describe the realities involved, since it is tied to the temporal order in which this world and we exist. In this he is applying the philosophical categories used by the Church in her theology and saying what St. Thomas Aquinas said long before him."
    http://eternal-word.com/library/PAPALDOC/JP2HEAVN.HTM

    The Vatican quickly embellished this story with a lot CYAP.

    With respect to rising from the dead, we also have this account:

    An added note: As per R.B. Stewart in his introduction to the recent book, The Resurrection of Jesus, Crossan and Wright in Dialogue,

    p.4

    "Reimarus (1774-1778) posits that Jesus became sidetracked by embracing a political position, sought to force God's hand and that he died alone deserted by his disciples. What began as a call for repentance ended up as a misguided attempt to usher in the earthly political kingdom of God. After Jesus' failure and death, his disciples stole his body and declared his resurrection in order to maintain their financial security and ensure themselves some standing."

    p.168. by Ted Peters:

    Even so, asking historical questions is our responsibility. Did Jesus really rise from the tomb? Is it necessary to have been raised from the tomb and to appear to his disciples in order to explain the rise of early church and the transcription of the bible? Crossan answers no, Wright answers, yes. "

    So where are the bones"? As per Professor Crossan's analyses in his many books, the body of Jesus would have ended up in the mass graves of the crucified, eaten by wild dogs, covered with lime in a shallow grave, or under a pile of stones.

    June 12, 2012 at 6:09 pm |
    • answer is cold

      the Greek word "Metanoia" is incorrect or intentionally wrong, it is not "repentance" ....it is "CHANGE"

      June 12, 2012 at 6:23 pm |
  13. really

    The RCC certainly did not "preserv[e] the wisdom of Rome and Greece through the dark ages." Rather, it took humanists in the renaissance to bring this wisdom back to light. By the way that is a pretty clear statement on your part.

    June 12, 2012 at 6:07 pm |
    • Drew

      I may have misspoken, but the thrust of my argument was correct; major interest in antiquity arose with humanism. That's why "classicism" is only discussed from the Renaissance onwards. Church scholars during the dark ages were much more interested on commentaries from Church figures than primary texts from antiquity

      June 12, 2012 at 6:13 pm |
    • Dennis

      "Really".. you know S**** about history... Why dont you substantiate your claim of 'humanists' bringing about the enlightenment. FACT IS most historians have disputed and DISPROVED the very concept of the 'dark ages'. The FACT is that it was in the monastaries where books were horded, copied, maintained and saved from destruction during the fighting following the end of the Roman Empire. It was the Byzantine Empire and the Greek Orthodox CATHOLIC church that did the same in the east, it was the movement of that knowledge from Byzantium to the west that assisted the supposed 'enlightenment' which was really just natural progression of events. Your bulls*** version of history has no foundation other than your own wishful thinking.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:43 pm |
    • Drew

      My only point is that the church had little interest in these texts, while the humanists did.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:46 pm |
  14. Greenspam

    What's amazing is that USA remains the only industralized country where Church still plays a big part in our politics.

    June 12, 2012 at 6:01 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      yep. they laugh. americans talking about god in the political arena. it's like a serious politician bring up "magic" during a speech.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:03 pm |
    • Philip Hades

      That's absolutely untrue. The US is actually one of a few industrialized nations without an state religion. And if you don't think religion doesn't play a part in politics of Germany, France, the UK, etc etc, then you just aren't looking.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:34 pm |
  15. sftommy

    The Magisterium lets the Pope and Bishops define moralities and also presume the infallibility of the Catholic Church. Thus the perversion and the coverup of the perversions over the centuries was divinely inspired according to Catholic canon?

    45,000 American women think Christ had a nobler purpose.

    June 12, 2012 at 5:59 pm |
  16. DJ

    The ignorance of factual historical facts and the true history and knowledge of the Catholic faith are overwhelming on this site.

    You people are so ignorant. Review your historical facts and the bible before making such ignorant remarks about the Catholic Church. Lies and distorting the truth to support your views is just plain ignorance. Go spread your ficticious views elsewhere.

    June 12, 2012 at 5:58 pm |
    • sftommy

      Catholicism has earned it's animosity.
      Spiritual guidance in ignorance Catholic details are as apt to achieve the goal of Christ's teachings as knowing what the pope thinks on any issue.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:03 pm |
    • Drew

      The RCC has been at best a mora lly-ambivalent enti ty in Western History

      June 12, 2012 at 6:06 pm |
  17. kindness

    A personal testimony.
    A thought to consider without an ego response

    Accept Jesus christ as your lord and saviour. You never know how soon is too late. Transcend the worldly illusion of enslavement.
    The world denounces truth....

    Accepting Jesus Christ (for me) resulted in something like seeng a new colour. You will see it .....but will not be able to clearly explain it to anyone else..... Its meant to be that way to transend any selfism within you.

    Also... much the world arranges "surrounding dark matter into something to be debated" in such a way that protects/inflates the ego.

    The key is be present and transcend our own desire to physically see evidence. We don't know anyways by defending our own perception of dark matter.

    Currently.... most of us are constructing our own path that suits our sin lifestyle. Were all sinners. Knowing that we are is often an issue. But both christians and non are sinners.

    We don't like to Let go and let god. We want control to some degree. This is what Jesus asks us to do. "Follow me".
    It's the hardest thing to do... but is done by letting the truth of scripture lead you (redemptive revelation)... as I said .

    Try reading corinthians and see if it makes sense to you. Try it without a pre conceived notion of it being a fairy tale.
    See the truth...
    do we do what it says in todays society... is it relevant... so many have not recently read and only hinge their philosophy on what they have heard from som other person...which may have been full of arogance pride or vanity..

    Look closely at the economy ponzi, look at how society idolizes Lust , greed , envy, sloth, pride of life, desire for knowledge, desire for power, desire for revencge,gluttony with food etc .

    Trancsend the temporal world.

    Just think if you can find any truth you can take with you ....in any of these things. When you die your riches go to someone who will spend away your life..... You will be forgotten.... history will repeat iteslf.... the greatest minds knowledge fade or are eventually plagerzed..... your good deeds will be forgotten and only give you a fleeting temporary reward . your learned teachings are forgotten or mutated..... your gold is transfered back to the rullers that rule you through deception. Your grave will grow over . This is truth .

    Trancsend your egoism and free yourself from this dominion of satan. Understand you are a sinner and part of the collective problem of this worldly matrix... Repent.... Repent means knowing (to change) The Holy spirit (within) will convict you beyond what you think you can do by yourself. Grace is given to those who renounce the world. That are" in" the world but not "of " the world.

    Evidence follows faith. Faith does not follow evidence..... Faith above reason in Jesus Christ.

    Faith comes by Reading or Hearing the word of god from the bible . Ask Jesus in faith for dicernment and start reading the new testament... You will be shocked when you lay down your preconceived notions and ....see and hear truth ... see how christ sets an example ... feel the truth....

    Read Ecclesiastes. Read corinthians.

    You cant trancend your own egoism by adapting a world philosophy to suit your needs. Seek the truth in Christ.

    Sell all your cleverness and purchase true bewilderment. You don't get what you want ....you get what you are in christ.

    I promise this has been the truth for me. In Jesus christ .

    Think of what you really have to lose. ...your ego?

    Break the Matrix of illusion that holds your senses captive.

    once you do . you too will have the wisdom of God that comes only through the Holy Spirit. Saved By grace through Faith. Just like seeing a new colour.... can't explain it to a transient caught in the matrix of worldly deception.
    You will also see how the world suppresses this information and distorts it

    You're all smart people . I tell the truth. Its hard to think out of the box when earthly thinking is the box.
    I'ts a personal free experience you can do it free anytime . Don't wait till you are about to die.. START PUTTING YOUR TREASURES WHERE THEY REALLY MATTER >
    Its awsome and It's just between you and Jesus

    my testimony

    Romans 10:9

    "If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved."

    June 12, 2012 at 5:57 pm |
    • sftommy

      Already saved, no churchmen, no church involved.
      Give your heart to God and live your life like it was the most important thing God ever did.
      Don't give ear to others pretense that they can separate you from Him. Faith!

      June 12, 2012 at 6:08 pm |
  18. Bman

    Where's the Butler? There's something rotten in Vatican City.

    June 12, 2012 at 5:55 pm |
  19. Lee Oates

    The Christian Churches and the Muslims are stuck in the 12th Century. Both are holding back the social and mental growth of the Naked Ape.

    June 12, 2012 at 5:51 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      religion knows education is a threat. the more people think, the less buy religion.

      June 12, 2012 at 5:57 pm |
  20. really

    Drew, thank you so much for proving my point. Bet you believe the Church taught the world was flat too! Of course any educated person (educated in Catholic universities of course) since before the fall of Rome knew from the Greeks that the world was round.

    June 12, 2012 at 5:46 pm |
    • Drew

      I fail to see how I proved your point. Many classical texts were rediscovered only during the renaissance and due to humanistic interest in the ancients. And no, I would not dispute your point regarding catholic universities, but such universities were hardly common during that period.

      June 12, 2012 at 5:52 pm |
    • really

      So by founding universities to teach the knowledge and supporting scribes to copy the knowledge, the Church did not preserve the knowledge.... Ummm that total disregard for facts, and the ability to discount real factually positive actions are the actions of a bigoted mind.

      June 12, 2012 at 5:58 pm |
    • Drew

      I never meant to deny that the Church had any role in preserving such texts, I'm just saying its silly to give them credit for the resurgence of interest in antiquity. Certainly the church has served certain functions well, I don't think anyone would disagree. It has also been a frequent impediment

      June 12, 2012 at 6:00 pm |
    • really

      So in your belief (and I use the word intentionally) the church preserved the texts, but never read them or taught them?? OK. Go read some medieval Catholic writings. It is all chock full of neo Platonism. One of the things the Protestants rebel against to this day.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:06 pm |
    • Drew

      Right, Plato and Aristotle were the main exceptions, but apart from them the RCC didn't have much use for the teachings of antiquity. This isn't my opinion, it is historical fact; it was in the Renaissance that interest in antiquity took off, and not among the clergy or the faithful but among humanist scholars and thinkers. That's why "Classicism" is really only a term used from the Renaissance onwards.

      June 12, 2012 at 6:10 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke and Eric Marrapodi with daily contributions from CNN's worldwide newsgathering team.