By Dan Merica, CNN
Washington (CNN) – When he campaigns in southern Florida on Monday, Mitt Romney will have an unwelcome traveling partner: a mobile billboard attacking his religion.
The billboard on wheels, sponsored by American Atheists, attacks the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints for its treatment of African-Americans and gays, though the church says the attacks are inaccurate.
The billboard, which American Atheists says will follow the Romney campaign for seven days, features two messages on Mormonism: “No Blacks Allowed (until 1978)” and “No Gays Allowed (Current).”
The first line is a reference to the church’s practice of denying lay priesthood to black male members until 1978.
Though the church did not allow black male members to be ordained before that year – when the church head says he received a revelation to reverse the policy – it did allow blacks and members of all racial and ethnic groups to be church members. According to The Second Book of Nephi, a part of Mormon doctrine, “Black and white, bond and free, male and female; … all are alike unto God.”
The billboard’s second line refers to what American Atheists President David Silverman says is the religion's “intolerance” and “bigotry” when it comes to the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender community.
But the church denies such categorizations. It accepts gay members, though church doctrine condemning homosexuality has not changed and the church strongly opposes same-sex marriage. Some gay rights activists say the church is subtly growing friendlier toward the LGBT community, including voicing support for some gay rights.
"People are surely free to disagree with us on the facts," Dale Jones, a church spokesman, wrote in an e-mail to CNN. "This group seems not to know that there have been black members of the Church since our earliest history, and there are many faithful gay members of the Church today."
Jones continued: "We would be happy to introduce the (American Atheists president) to any of our millions of members of different ethnicity who would be happy to educate him on our racial diversity."
Silverman denies the billboard, which is costing the group $8,000, is an attack on Romney specifically. A spokeswoman for the Romney campaign said she would not comment on the sign.
“Nobody seems to be talking about the implications of having a very religious Mormon president,” Silverman said. “There are a lot of things about Mormons that people don’t know, including the fact that racism is an important part of their dogma.”
The LDS Church has largely tried to stay out of the politics surrounding the presidential campaign, even though it has received increased attention due to Romney’s candidacy. This billboard, writes Jones, is "obviously" about the "personal politics" of American Atheists.
"We have consistently kept out of the political campaign," Jones wrote. "People can see this (billboard) for what it is."
American Atheists has a long history in using billboards to call out religion and get its message out. During the political conventions in August and September, the group put up billboards attacking Mormonism and Christianity, taking aim at the faith of both presidential candidates.
This mobile billboard, however, is a departure from the standard American Atheist tactic of multiple billboards on multiple religions. According to Silverman, this is because Romney’s faith hasn’t been addressed enough in the 2012 election.
“We all understand the implications of having a Christian president. We do not understand the implications of having a Mormon president,” Silverman said. “We are not taking a position on the election, we are taking a stance on ignorance.”
Before you hate, please listen...
Something to think about...
1Corinthians 3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, [ye are] God's building.
Luke 17:21 Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
Well ain't we special?
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PUBLIC NOTICE AS REQUIRED BY LAW: Any Use of This Post, in Any Manner Whatsoever, Will Increase the Amount of Disorder in the Universe. Although No Liability Is Implied Herein, the Believer Is Warned That This Process Will Ultimately Lead to the Heat Death of the Universe.
Einstein 16:24 Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.
Gould 1:15-16 Human consciousness arose but a minute before midnight on the geological clock. Yet we mayflies try to bend an ancient world to our purposes, ignorant perhaps of the messages buried in its long history. Let us hope that we are still in the early morning of our April day.
Bohr 2:11 Anyone who is not shocked by quantum theory has not understood it.
Szilard 88:16 I'm all in favor of the democratic principle that one idiot is as good as one genius, but I draw the line when someone takes the next step and concludes that two idiots are better than one genius.
Sagan 22:1 For me, it is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reàssuring.
Feynman 110:55 …it doesn't matter how beautiful your theory is, it doesn't matter how smart you are - if it doesn't agree with experiment, it's wrong.
Hawking 41:61 A machine that was powerful enough to accelerate particles to the grand unification energy would have to be as big as the Solar System-and would be unlikely to be funded in the present economic climate.
Hippocrates 14:5 Science is the father of knowledge, but opinion breeds ignorance.
Galileo 12:16 It is surely harmful to souls to make it a heresy to believe what is proved
Carlyle 2:2 It is a mathematical fact that the casting of this pebble from my hand alters the centre of gravity of the universe.
Fermi 1:1 The weak nuclear force does not change over time.
Oliver Heaviside 62:3 Shall I refuse my dinner because I do not fully understand the process of digestion?
C. P. Snow 5:3 Innocence about Science is the worst crime today.
Paul Valéry 3:6 One had to be a Newton to notice that the moon is falling, when everyone sees that it doesn't fall.
A.C. Doyle 14:8 It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts.
Clark 19:17 Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
Roddenberry 68:12 We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes.
deGràsse Tyson 1:1 God is an ever receeding pocket of scientific ignorance.
“They even attribute to Him sons and daughters, without any knowledge. Be He glorified. He is the Most High, far above their claims.” Quran [6:100]
“The example of Jesus, as far as GOD is concerned, is the same as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him, "Be," and he was.” Quran [3:59]
“No soul can carry the sins of another soul. If a soul that is loaded with sins implores another to bear part of its load, no other soul can carry any part of it, even if they were related. ... [35:18]
It does not befit God that He begets a son, be He glorified. To have anything done, He simply says to it, "Be," and it is. [19:35]
[Quran 6:116] If you obey the majority of people on earth, they will divert you from the path of God. They follow only conjecture; they only guess.
[Quran 6:3] He is the One God in the heavens and the earth. He knows your secrets and your declarations, and He knows everything you earn.
[Quran 6:60] He is the One who puts you to death during the night, and knows even the smallest of your actions during the day. He resurrects you every morning, until your life span is fulfilled, then to Him is your ultimate return. He will then inform you of everything you had done.
[Quran 43:12] He is the One who created all kinds, in pairs (male and female), and He created for you ships and livestock to ride.
[Quran 36:36] Glory be to the One who created all kinds of plants from the earth, as well as themselves, and other creations that they do not even know.
[Quran 22:74] They do not value God as He should be valued. God is the Most Powerful, the Almighty.
Thanks for taking time to read my post. Please take a moment to clear your misconception by going to whyIslam org website.
Take very young girls and bang the snot out of them [Quran 49:12]
Big Smiles.... there is no hatred for people like you....your confused again....it's called pity....
I have to run along now....I do have a life....but one thing you said is true....something I don't think you can say....I really do like myself....anyway....ugly, little, lonely, pitiful.....thats how I imagine you to be ta ta
Buddy, it's "you're" not "your." Your obvious lack of education has removed you from any level of credibility and simply placed you back in your trailer court. Your constant name calling also indicates a small mind and a large insecurity... Good luck with that.
Romney's faith has been ignored far to long in this debate. Why on earth the media has ignored the fact that a man that belongs to a VERY dangerous cult could run our country, is beyond me. If you think I am bias, then look up: White Horse Prophesy, Temple rituals, (including secret names, swearing to keep all secret through the threat of suicide, oil on all 7 chakra areas, women walking one step behind their husband at all times, etc) The law of Consecration (communism), Joseph Smiths history as a crook. Joseph Smith believing that he would be King over America after he transformed it into a THEOCRACY (destroying what our forefathers created), High domestic violence, RX abuse higher in UTAH than other states....I could go on, but people please educate yourselves. Mormon.org is a propaganda machine. Now watch as the mormons attack me not realizing that I'm a 7th generation mormon with a father and Aunt working as temple workers. I know what I'm talking about.
How adorable.....does your mommy know your on the computer? At least you gave me a big grin.....you must be so lonely
Of course I know Mommy is letting me use the computer. Why do I have to talk to myself on here? It's much easier to type out comments to myself than the usual recordings that my shrink keeps track of. Since I'm a danger to other people I only get to use the computer here at the asylum a few times and when I do, WOW I love to hate, hate, hate, hate, hate, hate, hate, hate, hate,hate,hate people that aren't like me or that don't think like me, or don't act like me, or aren't me! ME!
Poor Atheist's...such small scared, lonely, ugly little people Even Einstein detested them....
And with my hateful words, I show my own self-loathing, insecurity and ignorance. Since I obviously know nothing about Einstein (because if I did, I'd know that he had his own doubts about God) I have to admit that a lot of my hatred toward people that are better than me, comes from my horror over my small penis.
I have never talked to a Jesuit priest in my life and I am astonished by the audacity to tell such lies about me. From the viewpoint of a Jesuit priest I am, of course, and have always been an atheist.
-Albert Einstein, letter to Guy H. Raner Jr, July 2, 1945, responding to a rumor that a Jesuit priest had caused Einstein to convert from atheism;
Thank you Joel! Its always the ignorant ones that like to use the names of famous people to justify their beliefs, though they do so with great ignorance. I was looking for the same quote from Einstein because anyone that has gone to high school knows that he wasn't a die-hard christian (well he was a Jew and not a great believer in God even then).
Buddy: No apostrophe in "atheists"
Christianity, Islam and Judaism teach horrible morality.
Since I am the authority on, among MANY other things, religion and atheism, I think that everyone should listen to me because I am right and anyone that disagrees with me is wrong. I hate atheists because they make me question my own beliefs and that frightens me. As a christian, I am very good at judging and hating, so now that atheists have become center stage in politics, I really love to hate them. It makes me feel good to be right all the time. I know a lot of people call it megalomania, but I call it godliness. I am a lot like God actually.
Masquerading as other people is childish.
It's 'Texas' in the name that sells it for me.
But then I realize that if people weren't so ignorant and mean, then other people wouldn't have to show their true side by pretending to be them. I myself am a mixed up person, so sometimes I need my other voices to speak for me. I just didn't realize there were so many people like me that heard voices! Sometimes I think those voices are Jesus or Satan and sometimes I think Mitt Romney is talking to me late at night...or at least when i imagine cuddling with him.
Then there are times when I think that maybe I should just mind my own business or get a job or let other people do what they want to do without calling them names. Sometimes it's hard for me to learn lessons because I just can't keep my mouth shut...just like a lot of the other childish people on here.
@the childish ME II,
As I said, masquerading as other people is childish.
My psychiatrist told me that having the DEEP need to get the last word in is a sign of a personality disorder called Borderline Personality disorder. It shows that my level of maturity is far beneath that of a typical grades school level. Yet still I must do it. I must do it. I must do it! At least I know that officially I'm as childish as those I accuse of being the same! LOL!!!!
@the childish ME II,
Admitting you have a problem is half the battle, good luck.
I do have a problem! See, I keep talking to myself thinking that I can get the last word in with myself! I'm amazing! I mean, totally amazing! My doctor thinks I'm pretty messed up and possibly incurable. Where is my shot of haldol? I need it to battle my childish personality. Wait, do I have more than one personality or just a personality disorder? I don't know! But I know I'll say something again because I HAVE TO GET THE LAST WORD IN! You know I don't have any friends because of that. Sigh.
@the childish ME II,
Is it possible that I can reduce your impact on others by keeping you focused on this comment?
I'm always focused on myself and my impact on me is wonderful! I love me! I love me! But I am kinda like God so maybe that's why!
@the childish ME II,
Excellent. Just keep commenting...
Ok Atheists. You have been posting on CNN for I don't know how long that being Atheist is not a religion. Well it sure looks like one now. If you don't believe in any God or religion, then what is this all about. I think most people are over hearing how the world should be changed so 3% of the population that practices abnormal behavior. Yes, when 97% practice one way and 3% practice another, the 97% is the norm.
Atheist = lack of belief in god. Simple as that. No, not a "religion"
Keep your personal religious beliefs out of our government.
How is Atheism a religion?
There's no doctrine.
There's no rituals.
There's no dogma.
There's no stated beliefs.
Right is right even if no one is doing it and wrong is wrong even if everybody is doing it.
If all it takes to sway you is percentages then I hope you don't kick and scream and whine about the unjustness should 97 out of 100 people decide you no longer have anything to offer the human race.
I don't believe, rail against or concern myself with a deity. What I do concern myself are those that come up with all kinds of high weirdness in the name of that belief. When you have a believer spouting off some absurd nonsense about a child conceived in ra-pe as a deity's will, you have to seriously start to question what that belief is doing to people.
Now you can rant and rave that that person isn't a 'true' believer, but let's be real here... you can't get two believers to agree on what they believe in. Why should I and the rest of the world have to suffer for your ignorance?
Rob-Texas: 3% practice abnormal behavior? Where did you pull that stat out of, other than from your rectum?
I'm a retard.
And prayer changes things, right?
Aren't you dead?
That would be absurd having someone following me around "proselytizing" me. I'd probably rather have a Mormon following me around for 7 days trying to talk to me than that stupid billboard bus. My, my, it seems "Atheism" is just the same as all other religions, wanting to force its beliefs on someone else.
How is reminding people of the official policies of the Mormon church forcing beliefs one someone else?
Of course I'd want mormon missionaries following me everywhere....they are all HOT hunks. Baby, give me a hot mormon missionary man anyway! Save me Jesus!!!!
@gf: please show us one articule placed before congress or the senate that has anything to do with being atheist; i can however show you hundreds of attempts by the religious to get amendments passed or rulings over-turned due to their beliefs.
i can show you how the christians are using their "faith" to deny americans EQUAL PROTECTION UNDER THE LAW by denying them the right to marry. religious people are using their beliefs to make what a woman chooses to do with her body illegal.
so please show me where atheists are doing anything to force our LACK OF RELIGIOUS BELIEF on anyone; if you mean by giving equal rights and freedom of choice to groups of americans that you and your lot are trying to stomp on, then we are guilty as charged.
Of course you're right, they're not "forcing" us to believe that ... no more than the Mormon missionaries knocking on my door are forcing me to believe what they're preaching to me. So in a literal sense, you're right. Perhaps I should have phrased it better, but I think in the casually-worded spoken manner that it is, my point is understood. I don't want people following me around (whoever they are, whatever religion they are) telling me what to or what not to believe. That is a trait that has often be characteristic of religious establishments, but it seems that sense it's attributable to atheists, that really it's just human nature.
My issue is with the fact that you are claiming that this billboard is telling people what to believe. It is not. It is simply providing information about the Mormon church. Weather or not you believe the message is up to you, no threat or reward is attached to the belief. Now if you were trying to claim that American Atheist were being rude I would agree with you, but as long as you are making unfounded claims about certain beliefs being forced, or even supported, I will refute you.
It's a billboard, like the ones selling Ford pickups and inviting people to come visit the local amusement park. If you're not interested then just ignore it like I've come to ignore the many, many messages outside of churches implying that I'm not a good person just because I don't believe in Christ. Personally, I miss having Mormons come to my door in the morning. It use to be fun asking them to explain away the Mountain Meadows massacre and the "Lost" 116 pages of the Book of Mormon. I think someone must have warned them about me. :-)
Simple messages can have larger messages behind them. While this billboard will innocently be just giving information about the LDS church, really the bigger message is ... "Mormonism is wrong, it's prejudicial, you should not follow that or believe in that". It might even have further implications – "You should not vote for Mitt Romney." Otherwise, why is it following ol Mitt? Those who supported the billboard are proclaiming their beliefs, or disbeliefs. People put forth their own beliefs by saying what they believe, by saying what they don't believe, or by pointing out the errors in another's beliefs ... all to the same end.
I-40 runs from the coast of North Carolina to California. If you happen to drive it, look for the Christian billboard in Arkansas encouraging parents to beat the crap out of their kids.
Normally I would agree with you, and I have liked many of the Atheist billboard campaigns in the past, but this one is a mobile billboard following the Republican Mormon candidate.
David Silverman is being petty, in my opinion, and I wish he'd take a higher road.
"Good people do good things, regardless of what the bishop says." [Romney was a "bishop" in the LDS.]
"Ancient books don't hold a patent on good. (even if they aren't really ancient)" [Book of Mormon was supposedly translated from ancient "reformed Egyptian" gold plates.]
Really the whole billboard thing doesn't bother me personally – I will never see it. I think I'm bothered imagining the annoyance of having anyone follow me around for a week with a sign purposed to basically shoot down something I believe, or to criticize me. For some reason I find that annoying. Next, I'm bothered in part because it seems that the "atheist faith" has become a religion (so to speak) of its own ... doing the very thing atheists accuse religious people of doing, that is proselytizing (be that through speaking for or against something).
And I'm like you, I actually kind of liked having Mormon people stop by my door. I found them to be some of the nicest people. It started when I lived in apartments that they rotated in and out of and I got to know some. I just like to talk with people about what they believe (be they Mormons, Christians, Muslims, Hindus, atheists...), whatever that is, and get to know them and their "culture" ... so I find the "critical" position to be very rude and without the desire to really learn about others.
"Simple messages can have larger messages behind them."
Maybe, but, in this case, you can't support that as.sertion. The only thing that you can factually say about these billboards is that they present information about official policies of the Mormon church. No personal beliefs are being put forward, only verifiable information followed by a conclusion.
ONLY FOR THE NEWCOMERS:
Bottom line: Romney is Mormon because he was born Mormon. Should we hold this against him? After all, BO also believes in "pretty/ugly wingie thingies, bodily resurrections and atonement mumbo jumbo.
One should be voting based on rational thinking. Believing in angels, satans, bodily resurrections, atonement, and heavens of all kinds is irrational.
Apparently, BO and MR have been severely brainwashed in their theologically and historically flawed Christianity and they are too weak to escape its felonious grip.
@real: i don't hold any religious affiliation over anyones head, i just don't trust someone that can't explain a simple tax plan or how they intend to increase revenue without favoring one group over another, not to mention i thought we learned our lesson about giving weapons to enemies; namely the whole taliban BS. we provided weapons to them to fight the russians for us now they use those same weapons against us. romney wants to give arms to the fighters in syria, i totally disagree with arming people we don't trust,nor can trust not to use them agianst americans given the first chance.
To promote yourself by denouncing others tells me the denouncer doesn't have much to offer.
Being critical is easier than producing or providing anything. I can sit there an criticize some brush strokes or paint colors on a Monet, but no way can I produce something better. It's easier to destroy than create, easier to knock down than build up. It's the easy road those sort of people take ... the road of politicians it seems.
So.... you're denouncing this billboard?
@Cheryl, you are right, nothing positive ever came from some one denouncing another. I mean the founding fathers denounced the British monarchy and all we got was freedom and independence.
Yeah, Cheryl, are you talking about atheists or conservative Christians? I've never heard a conservative Christian spokesperson ever say anything positive about other faiths, and everything they ever say about atheists is negative. They have some right to complain!
And Jesus denounced the Pharisees and all we ever got out of that was Christianity. Hmm, maybe Cheryl does have a point?
LOL kinda like what Christians do on a regular basis....denounce all other religions and claim they have the truth.
religion; a way to control the weak minded
Except that it's more like the Lemon Aid books, reporting the problems with ALL religions, and they all do have problems.
Prayer changes things .
Please don't feed the troll.
He's just a non-believer sock puppet anyway. He slipped up a while back, and posted something critical of religion under this name.
"Ronald Regonzo" who degenerates to:
"Salvatore" degenerates to:
"Douglas" degenerates to:
Taskmaster" degenerates to:
"truth be told" degenerates to:
"The Truth" degenerates to:
"Thinker23" degenerates to:
"Atheism is not healthy ..." degenerates to:
"another repentant sinner" degenerates to:
"Dodney Rangerfield" degenerates to:
"tina" degenerates to:
"captain america" degenerates to:
"Atheist Hunter" degenerates to:
"Anybody know how to read? " degenerates to:
"just sayin" degenerates to:
"ImLook'nUp" degenerates to:
"Kindness" degenerates to:
"Lorraine" degenerates to:
"Chad" degenerates to
"Bob" degenerates to
"nope" degenerates to:
"2357" degenerates to:
"WOW" degenerates to:
"fred" degenerates to:
"!" degenerates to:
This troll is not a christian!
Prayer does not; you are such a LIAR. You have NO proof it changes anything! A great example of prayer proven not to work is the Christians in jail because prayer didn't work and their children died. For example: Susan Grady, who relied on prayer to heal her son. Nine-year-old Aaron Grady died and Susan Grady was arrested.
An article in the Journal of Pediatrics examined the deaths of 172 children from families who relied upon faith healing from 1975 to 1995. They concluded that four out of five ill children, who died under the care of faith healers or being left to prayer only, would most likely have survived if they had received medical care.
The statistical studies from the nineteenth century and the three CCU studies on prayer are quite consistent with the fact that humanity is wasting a huge amount of time on a procedure that simply doesn’t work. Nonetheless, faith in prayer is so pervasive and deeply rooted, you can be sure believers will continue to devise future studies in a desperate effort to confirm their beliefs.
Those who believe in strange supernatural myths are followers, not leaders.
Those who believe that mankind is less important than strange supernatural mythical characters are not to be trusted with the affairs of mankind.
Peace through atheism! Keep it real!
Atheists have tortured and murdered more people in the last 100 years than were killed in all previous centuries. Atheism is brutality, murder and wars, held together with lies.
"Truth be Told", while your statement is completely false, keep in mind that your "loving god" will burn at least 5 billion out of the 7 billion people in this world for all eternity. This does not include the people who "he" has already been torturing since the beginning of humanity. Your god whose @$$ you are kissing puts all other murderers to shame.
Hi nope troll. Do you have any coherent arguments today, or just the same one word sheep responses?
@nope: so simple, so easily stated, so completely void of any type of thought. did your mother drop you on purpose or "by accident" repeated times? seriously your grasp of the human language is just so marvelously phrased that i must know your secret; to seem so intelligent while saying so little.
i mean it's the perfect reply to everything......................
you want to bath............nope
you want a job................nope
you want to accept responcibilty for your life..............nope
you want to grow and mature as a human being...........nope.
see so simple it's flawless. that is my new favorite word..........nope.
The statement by truth be told is completely accurate but does not convey the total horror that atheism has unleashed in this past century. Judgement is reserved by God, not man, you have no knowledge of what you are talking about.
Nope is more of an answer than all you lying so called atheists deserve.
Don't try to detract from the evilness of your god by lying. The murders you are referring to were not done in the name of Atheism. HItler was Catholic, supported by the pope, and the other ones you are referring to thought of themselves as gods. No matter how much spin you try to put on this, it does nothing for your argument.
And yes according to your fairy tale book, your god will eternally torture 5 billion out of the 7 billion people currently alive on this planet. This is even worse that murder. How anyone can worship such a god is beyond comprehension. But believers were not trained to think, just to follow and say "Baaaaaaaaaaaaah" like the sheep you are.
@nope: let's all give NOPE a round of applause. see you can train a monkey to dance. XD
i trained nope to say nope again. come on on nope let's see you dance again. i love dancing NOPE monkeys they are so cute, but stink because all they know is nope.
never said NOPE monkeys were intelligent just fun to watch..............for a few minutes, then they start throwing poo at people. ROFLMFAO.
that's a good nope monkey. (pats on head.)
truth be told
That would be dictators who did that, with only some of them being communists whose "atheism" amounted to suppression of organized religion because it was a rival for power amongst people.
COURT:if you will please show the court where my clients "LACK OF RELIGIOUS BELIEF" amounts to being thrown in with some of the most violent people in history?
COURT:how does one of "NO RELIGIOUS BELIEF" ki11 in the name of something they don't have?
i myself LACK A BELIEF IN SANTA CLAUSE, does that mean i can ki11 in the name of santa clause?
COURT: if you can't provide the court with proof of what you say then this case will be thrown out of court.......................we are waiting MR. TBT.
"Judgement is reserved by God, not man, you have no knowledge of what you are talking about."
And god was created by men....whats your point?
Mitt Romney's favorite novel is "Battlefield Earth" by L Ron Hubbard, creator of Scientology.
Look it up.
Now now, you have to give "Battlefield Earth" is due: how many books can claim to has been the inspiration for a movie that is almost universally hailed as one of the worst film ever made? What other film had John Travolta win " Worst Screen Couple (John Travolta and "anyone on the screen with him"), and continued to get Raspberries years after, including "Worst Film of the Decade"?
Battlefield Earth is not that bad, the book. The movie was horrible. The book was simplistic and more science-fantasy than science-fiction but it was a decent story.
Mind you Hubbard was nuts, but that doesn't mean he couldn't write one semi-decent novel.
I've read it too, but like somebody else said a few pages back, it was way too long. Hubbard use to be paid by the word, and it sure shows.
I didn't see the the other comments, but yes, he did go on a bit, didn't he. Note that I said "semi-decent." I don't think it won any awards and got only mixed reviews, but, unfortunately, I've read much worse.
Evidently, you are all looking up "Battlefield Earth", not Scientology.
Get yourself some info guys.
They conducted "Operation Snow White", the largest infiltration of American government in history.
The disconnect families and fleece people of their money, child labor, mind control, easily the most sinister organisation one can imagine.
It's as if Romney's favorite film was made by dictator Kim Yong Il.
So what if that is Romney's favorite book. I read it in highschool and I thought it was great! I didn't know anything about Scientology or ERH being its leader (I'm Catholic). Other than the bad guys being named Psychlos (ERH's shot at psychologists) and the whole space bank thing, both of which went over my head at the time, I don't think there's any obvious scientologist message in the book. The fact is, the book was a big, fun, action-filled sci-fi book. We were talking about it the other day here at work, another aerospace engineer here read it and enjoyed it.
The Battlefield Earth movie on the other hand was just terrible. Even the screenwriter has admitted that. Still it's something to see Travolta and Forest Whitaker slumming in it.
Oh, and btw, speaking of ERH's sci-fi books, I really enjoyed his Mission Earth decology too. There was some great satire there, although I wonder to this day whether he actually did right the last few books, considering he passed away before they were all finished.
Yes, darling, we are looking up the book, because that is what Romney said he enjoyed, not Scientology. And, as pulp fiction, I agree with him.
what if Romney's favorite painting was painted by Adolf Hitler?
What if his favorite film was by Kim Yong Il?
What if his favorite poem was by Charles Manson?
First, they aren't. He did not not claim to "enjoy" Mein Kampf or a painting by Hitler, etc.
Second, as nutty as L. Ron was he doesn't quite compare to Hitler, et. al.
Actually, I have less concern about the author than I do about Romney listing such a mediocre sci-fi book as a "favorite". It doesn't show much intellectual capacity to count this as a favorite book. I think it is an enjoyable read, taken in its intended class a pulp fiction, but hardly worthy of most people's favorites, let alone a President's.
"as nutty as L. Ron was he doesn't quite compare to Hitler,"
Well, I think if you look into what the "Church of Scientology" is up to, how they are dealing with critics, infiltrate governments as well as other statements, the route from Hubbard to Hitler is actually not as long as it may seem.
There are people locked up in mind-control prisons in Los Angeles right now.
People disconnected from their famillies.
There is no end to the weirdness.
It's not just "nutty" it's unfortunately outrageously sinister and has subverted politicians all over Southern California.
Sorry, I'm not trying to minimize the ultimately damaging behavior of the Church of Scientology, and perhaps 'nutty but not Hitler' was inaccurate of me. I think Scientology can be very dangerous to people who buy into such things, literally as well as figuratively, and people should be wary of them, as they should be wary of all religions, but especially those with cult-like tendencies like Scientology. However, I'm also saying that liking or enjoying a novel such as Battlefield Earth is not tantamount to endorsing Scientology, as opposed to liking or enjoying Mein Kampf, which speaks directly and almost exclusively about Hitler's philosophy.
Basically, I think, your comparison of liking the book to liking some hypothetical painting by Hitler is a weak or false analogy.
p.s. Have you read the book?
Well, I may need to add that Hitler actually wanted to become an artist before he started to become involved in politics, and there indeed are paintings of his that I think have a similar "non"-relationship to his ideology as Hubbard's science-fiction stories have to his ideology, and I think Kim Yong Il's films are similarly connected to his totalitarian regime.
I do admit to not knowing if Manson indeed wrote poems that are as independent of his other activities.
I am not judging the quality of the book itself – which I have not read entirely, I only browsed the first 100 or so pages once, and I saw some of the movie, which is arguably has a different set of problems.
But I think if someone who wants to become president of the United States, a little more awareness of these things would definitely remain to be wished for.
After all, Scientology, created by Hubbard, perpetrated the biggest infiltration of government in the history of the U.S. and that was before "Battelfield Earth" was even published.
I would rather see the new president behind revoking Scientology's continued tax exempt status than naively announcing that a book its leader wrote is his favorite.
Funny how in other areas (e.g. family life and husbandry) there are enormonous sensitivities to the most minute detail, but this gets so little attention.
This is what happens when someone uses faith, and dogma. You end up blindly following anything you read in that book, even if it picks on innocent minorities.
Shame on them.
So, even though there are Black Mormons you still make this charge?
Mark, there are now. Also, anyone who have read the book of mormon and think it is real at all, is a fool. Just like any theistic book.
How about gays, Mark? What about the Mormon Church's war on the rights of people who are not Mormon and not harming Mormons or Mormonism in any way?
Mark from Middle River
There are Black Mormons out of convenience, because the LDS church wanted to expand in black South America. In other words, it was a business decision, not a moral one. Not many people doubt that the whites-only policy would have continued much longer had the elders not wanted to expand.
The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.