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December 17th, 2012
03:02 PM ET

My Take: Praying for questions about Newtown that go beyond ‘Why, God?’

Editor’s note: Margaret Feinberg is a popular speaker and author of numerous books, including “Wonderstruck: Awaken to the Nearness of God,” which releases on Christmas Day. Follow her on Twitter @mafeinberg.

By Margaret Feinberg, Special to CNN

Why, God, why? Why do you allow the horror of the shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School?

Why do you allow the loss, pain, terror, heartache and death? Why do you allow evil to triumph and innocence to be stripped away? Is this kind of evil stoppable? And do we have some role to play?

In the wake of so many unanswered questions, what kinds of questions do we really need to be asking? Are you cajoling us to ask how we can prevent this from happening again? Is the answer found in gun regulations, better security or deeper changes in our own hearts and lives?

Does preventing these kinds of crimes actually begin with us? If we had more compassion on those on the margins - those who wrestle with the demons of mental illness and social exile, who may be pondering violent acts at this very moment - can we prevent this horror from happening again?

My Take: Obama's Newtown remarks show pastor-in-chief

Are you prompting us to search our own lives and hearts to identify who we need to recognize that we’ve overlooked? In our families? Neighborhoods? Schools? Workplaces? Communities? Retirement homes?

Who are the kids and adults being shoved to the sidelines of life on whom we need to extend compassion? Where have our arms been too short, our hearts too closed to embrace?

Is this a potent reminder that our call is to be more sensitive to those who feel unloved, marginalized, shunned from our society? Are you awakening us to the fact that we all play a role in these matters?

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Have we helped create troubled souls like Arizona gunman Jared Loughner, Colorado gunman James Holmes and now Connecticut gunman Adam Lanza through our failure to extend kindness to those who need it most?

What are the words we need to learn to say not just with our mouths but our actions? Are you challenging us to express, “I love you!”;  “You matter!”; “You’re good at that!”; “We’re glad you’re here!";  “Want to join us?” or something more?

Will you grace us with the courage to extend a love we do not have on our own?

Why does it seem that before we can change, we need to encounter you? Will you give us eyes to see those who feel invisible, ears to hear their cries for help and hearts broken for victims who prey on victims?

CNN’s Belief Blog: The faith angles behind the biggest stories

How can we reflect you and your love during this difficult time? Will you pour out your grace, strength and love on those who have lost so much? Will you wrap your arms around them? Will you be with them in a tangible way?

Will you give them unexplainable peace? Will you do something miraculous? Will you unleash your redemption and restoration in this situation? Will you take prayers we’ve offered this week and make them habits of our hearts?

Will you do what only you can do, and take our breaths away again? Will you astound us with the wonder of who you are in the midst of that which makes no sense? Will you draw us all closer to you and to each other through this time?

In the wake of your love, will you teach us what better questions we need to ask and how we need to respond? Will you help us, oh Lord? Will you let it be so? Amen.

The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of Margaret Feinberg.

- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: Christianity • Opinion • Prayer • Violence

soundoff (1,166 Responses)
  1. mike from ct

    Hitchens put it best. God either lacks the power to stop senseless carnage (like in Newton, CT) or does have the power but does not care to. Either way, this is someone not worth praying to.
    The author, throughout the article, prayed for wisdom and aid from her creator. If such a creator would not lift a finger to impart wisdom on a disturbed young man and convince him that it is in no way acceptable to blow little kids head's off or aid the victims of such a violent act, then its very obvious that her requests would be less of a priority.
    And don't say "God works in mysterious ways." That's a tired and overused way of saying "I don't know."

    December 17, 2012 at 9:34 pm |
    • devils advocate

      I'm with you. I agree with you. But what they would say, is if what they prey to encompasses all that is good, then to reject leaves you will all that is rotten, and that is why it is worth praying to Him.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:03 pm |
    • +

      Actually Mike, Jesus' truth (the Bible) explains what happens when people stay away from practicing what he preaches. The world is the Devil's kingdom. Haven't you read that?

      December 18, 2012 at 12:48 am |
    • Geezus

      So you're saying god is lame and powerless vs. the devil? Why even bother praying to him?

      It's like choosing to follow Perot vs. Obama this year.

      December 18, 2012 at 9:03 am |
  2. Kman

    Come to Me all you who are weary and burdened and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn about Me for I am gentle and humble in heart and You will find rest for your soul. These words come from the One who has overcome death and the world and these children are secure in His arms. I wonder what the children's parents would think if they happened to stumble upon the majority of comments posted here. Such an angry foolish fallen world we live in today. All this following the slaughter of 20 children. Pathetic!

    December 17, 2012 at 9:33 pm |
    • +

      God Bless you Kman for your post. Christians hear you loud and clear. Nonbelievers however, have no eyes to see, nor ears to hear, not to mention no heart.

      December 18, 2012 at 12:50 am |
    • Observer

      +,

      It is NONBELIEVERS who would not have sat around and watched the children die like God supposedly did.

      Ooops.

      December 18, 2012 at 12:55 am |
    • Geezus

      Kman, go to CT and tell that to the grieving families and the town.

      Basically, you are telling them to suck it up?

      December 18, 2012 at 9:06 am |
  3. lionlylamb

    Life is much more then a game of checkers for it is much more like a game of chess. Know you well all the pawns and place them where needed and then bring out the knights and rooks and castles and bishops and even the queen to best be the game's victor or go down in defeat! We are all life's chess pieces. We are all the sower's seeds. In death we are consumed while yet living are we not made aware? For to get back to the sower our seeded bodies must be like popcorn is made once we are dead via the fires of cremation. In the pillars of cremation's fire are our seeds of platted creationism popped and grown into becoming an expansion of our souls delights!

    December 17, 2012 at 9:20 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      *sigh*

      December 17, 2012 at 9:21 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @TTTPS,

      one day, much in the same way that an infinite number of monkeys with typewriters will produce Shakespeare, LL will produce a coherent post.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:36 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      One can only hope.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:43 pm |
  4. Bootyfunk

    why doesn't god make children bullet proof? he doesn't have to take away the freewill of maniacs to shoot at children - but they wouldn't be able to hurt them. seems easy and straightforward enough for an all-powerful god that loves us.

    god = fail

    December 17, 2012 at 9:18 pm |
    • +

      Bootyfunk, instead of insulting God on this issue, why not figure out the reality that the world is Satan's domain. That too is written in scriptures that you spout that you've read cover to cover and know like the back of your hand.

      December 18, 2012 at 12:53 am |
  5. Huh...

    Blaming God for what people do...
    I mean, that kinda takes away the point of free will.

    What I want to know is what people get out of commenting on CNN (I'm looking at the both of you, Christians and atheists).
    I'm here because I just want to know what people think and all, but when people go all out to try to disprove something on a CNN blog, that's the part that strikes me as silly.

    December 17, 2012 at 9:13 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      as an atheist, i hope that religious people that are on the fence, that know god doesn't make sense as anything but a fairy tale, are persuaded to leave the cult. christianity is a cult, like all religions. we are trying to wake our brothers and sisters up to think for themselves. you don't need god to be a good person - i'd like to help people realize that.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:16 pm |
    • Try it you'll like it.

      It is ever so fun!

      December 17, 2012 at 9:16 pm |
    • +

      Bootyfund, you must have your TV off and not watching CNN to see the Grace of God all the people in Newtown are expressing. Oh, that's right, you nonbelievers truly have no eyes to see nor ears to hear God's truth being shown to you live, in color ... all over the TV since Friday.

      December 18, 2012 at 12:57 am |
    • sam stone

      how does concept of free will jibe with an omniscient god?

      is this the free will of "believe or fry"?

      December 18, 2012 at 2:03 am |
  6. Apple Bush

    Those right wing radical Hopi fundies say there will be three days of the missing sun and that will start the new age, but that is their Anastasi nonense. Mayans know there will be a cauldren of fire over the ocean. Keep Hopi fundamentalism off the reservation!

    December 17, 2012 at 9:13 pm |
    • Akira

      Ah, Apple, my Grasshopper, you are the wise sage.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:30 pm |
    • Apple Bush

      Plus those Hopi Fundies are spewing their filth about Earth going into a fifth world. IT IS THE FOURTH WORLD. Absurd mithra goon.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:35 pm |
    • Apple Bush

      Sorry if I seem upset. Those Hopi Indians are really pissing me off with there fundie meso-american bullshit.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:41 pm |
  7. General Question

    Does anyone know why a post with no bad language or hatefull speech never gets posted? Copy and paste the same text in over and over and it never goes up. Are there key words in text that cause a reject?

    December 17, 2012 at 9:12 pm |
    • Apple Bush

      You got this HH?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:14 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      giant word filter on CNN. super frustrating at times.

      for instance. to type the word "inst.itute" uses the word "t.it". really have to check the language.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:20 pm |
    • Helpful Hints

      Bad letter combinations / words to avoid if you want to get past the CNN automatic filter:
      -
      ar-se.....as in ar-senic.
      co-ck.....as in co-ckatiel, co-ckatrice, co-ckleshell, co-ckles, etc.
      co-on.....as in racc-oon, coc-oon, etc.
      cu-m......as in doc-ument, accu-mulate, circu-mnavigate, circu-mstances, cu-mbersome, cuc-umber, etc.
      cu-nt.....as in Scu-nthorpe, a city in the UK famous for having problems with filters...!
      ef-fing...as in ef-fing filter
      ft-w......as in soft-ware, delft-ware, swift-water, drift-wood, etc.
      ho-mo.....as in ho-mo sapiens or ho-mose-xual, ho-mogenous, etc.
      ho-oters…as in sho-oters
      ho-rny....as in tho-rny, etc.
      hu-mp… as in th-ump, th-umper, th-umping
      jacka-ss...yet "ass" is allowed by itself.....
      ja-p......as in j-apanese, ja-pan, j-ape, etc.
      koo-ch....as in koo-chie koo..!
      nip-ple
      o-rgy….as in po-rgy, zo-rgy, etc.
      pi-s......as in pi-stol, lapi-s, pi-ssed, therapi-st, etc.
      p-orn… as in p-ornography
      pr-ick....as in pri-ckling, pri-ckles, etc.
      que-er
      ra-pe.....as in scra-pe, tra-peze, gr-ape, thera-peutic, sara-pe, etc.
      se-x......as in Ess-ex, s-exual, etc.
      sl-ut
      sm-ut…..as in transm-utation
      sn-atch
      sp-ank
      sp-ic.....as in desp-icable, hosp-ice, consp-icuous, susp-icious, sp-icule, sp-ice, etc.
      sp-oon
      sp-ook… as in sp-ooky, sp-ooked
      strip-per
      ti-t......as in const-itution, att-itude, ent-ities, alt-itude, beat-itude, etc.
      tw-at.....as in wristw-atch, nightw-atchman, etc.
      va-g......as in extrava-gant, va-gina, va-grant, va-gue, sava-ge, etc.
      who-re....as in who're you kidding / don't forget to put in that apostrophe!
      wt-f....also!!!!!!!
      There's another phrase that someone found, "wo-nderful us" (have no idea what sets that one off).

      December 17, 2012 at 9:22 pm |
  8. Apple Bush

    CGAW, if that is your real name, this is not a religious forum. It is a Belief Blog. All beliefs, not just yours.

    December 17, 2012 at 9:06 pm |
  9. Adrian

    There is no god. Your sick idea of the imaginary guy in the sky who takes care of us has been blown to bits, again. What loving god would say it's okay to murder 20 little kids. Face it. god is dead. god never was. it's up to us to battle the sick around us. Don't wait for god to do anything. He's not there. Go ahead and flam me you christian morons.

    December 17, 2012 at 9:03 pm |
    • von

      Sir, if I may call you that, Jesus Christ died for you and me; however, He gave all of us free will to make our own decisions, good or evil. Perhaps this young man was troubled and did not know to read the Bible to receive hope, or perhaps he was too sick to have heard or believed the stated promises of God. Also, God has gradually been removed from our society so we left Him, not the other way around. The death of these sweet children is hard for us to believe, but then think of this, this country, alone, kills probably thousands of children per day thru abortion and we don't hear one word about this type of murder. And this country will suffer for these deaths at some point in time just as there are bad consequences for an individual doing evil.

      December 18, 2012 at 1:19 am |
    • sam stone

      von: repeating a story does not prove the story

      December 18, 2012 at 2:06 am |
    • sam stone

      Also, Von, under no law of the land is abortion considered murder.

      And, your empty proxy warnings are laughable. Do they make you feel all godly?

      December 18, 2012 at 2:08 am |
  10. lionlylamb

    What do you peons know about any life form's upbringing thru their conceptualization within the womb of one's mother? Is not your God playing with your conscious conscience as you are being built up in your mother's womb? Is not God there with you in your mother's womb and does not God ease your troubles before being born?

    We are all God's husbandries and thru our being conceptualized by God being there in smallness sakes are the reasons we first do cry after birth for we have been forsaken by our own wanting to be conceived but in our feeble infancies we became aware of the physical plains of a world unknown when we were with God in the very smallness of the inner cosmos of our father's inner cellular cosmological configurations!

    December 17, 2012 at 9:02 pm |
    • Observer

      So God is to blame for all miscarriages or didn't he care about some of them?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:05 pm |
    • Akira

      Ll, when you can conceive, let's talk.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:18 pm |
    • lionlylamb

      1Cr 3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, [ye are] God's building.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:22 pm |
    • lionlylamb

      Akira,

      When you can understand cellular cosmologic conceptualization then we'll be able to converse the facts!

      December 17, 2012 at 9:24 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Akira, stop laughing over there! You're making me guffaw!

      December 17, 2012 at 9:25 pm |
    • lionlylamb

      Observer,

      WE LABOUR TOGETHER WITH GOD, you poor excuse for being a sentient life form!

      December 17, 2012 at 9:27 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      When's the last time your labor produced a baby, LL?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:28 pm |
    • Observer

      lionlylamb,

      Grow up, child.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:31 pm |
    • lionlylamb

      Observer,

      Yes oh sentient life form, I will grow up and soon die to be reborn back into the kingdom of God's domains upon the inner cosmos of all living inner cosmological cellular dynasties this world's peons know not and may never come to rationalize due their stinkin thinkin ways!

      December 17, 2012 at 9:36 pm |
    • lionlylamb

      Tom Tom,

      You know damn well your questions answer! When's the last time you can remember when you were in your mother's womb being conceptualized and built by Godly Beings of such a grand but very small scale and they placed your soul of conscious conscience inside your conceived body?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:43 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You moronic nut-job, you can't even ask a meaningful question. From what I gather, you're attempting to ask me if I recall anytime before birth, and the answer, you numbskull, is "of course not, and neither do you." You don't even remember what happened an hour ago.

      Fetuses do not have the capacity to reason, remember, or understand. Women, on the other hand, do. And they, not you, are best qualified to decide what is best for themselves.

      I cannot imagine ANY circ umstance in which any sane person, man or woman, would ask your advice on anything more substantive than the weather, and with you, even THAT is a stretch.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:47 pm |
    • Apple Bush

      It is verily forcasticated to be windful and waneful as heavenly tears making way downwardly and upwardly to the cosmic cycle of percipitationism.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:55 pm |
    • lionlylamb

      Tom Tom,

      What I believe basically in is that our souls were ever and are forever. WE before our conception were with God in the smallness places of what we now call the atomic cosmos. WE were created out of cosmic fidelities within the womb of our mother. Our souls that ever were are deposited within our conceptualized and/or husbandry made bodies built by God's families and servants.

      I do humbly believe our very small beings were ever around living upon this atomic cosmos and we were called to duty to take up our conceptualized body thru God's husbandry. We are spiritual beings within the fidelities of unknowable to us cosmic cleaving of such a small size, our only way to return back is to die.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:18 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      I don't care if you believe your left big toe can tell time, LL. You don't get to force others to carry a pregnancy they don't want. Blow it out your cosmological ass.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:21 pm |
    • Apple Bush

      Well whatever, but it is stll going to rain ism.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:27 pm |
    • lionlylamb

      Tom Tom, I could care less about your emotional subterfuge ranting and raves of desperations dumbness! Go now and find yourself a fatherly bone to gnarl upon! Mine is not on the menu!

      December 17, 2012 at 10:27 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You're the idiot who responded, LL. I am not interested in your moldy-ass bone, honey. I doubt anyone ever was. The only one ranting and raving here is you. Get bent, lunatic.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:29 pm |
  11. CGAW

    Bootyfunk in a religious forum – knows nothing about God and the universe but tries to convince you it knows everything = fail

    December 17, 2012 at 8:54 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      LOL! i have an admirer!

      December 17, 2012 at 9:00 pm |
    • sam stone

      CGAW: And you feel you know more about god than bootyfunk? Based on what?

      December 18, 2012 at 2:10 am |
  12. Clean_Your_hands_Boy

    I'm sure more crazies LOVe this.

    "yes,keep praying!! Pray Pray,while the laws stay the same and I can continue buying guns and going crazy with them"

    December 17, 2012 at 8:53 pm |
  13. KRHODES

    I am wondering what our atheist brethern are upset about the shootings? If God does not exist and when we die we are just gone...what is there to be upset about? What makes the act wrong and why?

    December 17, 2012 at 8:53 pm |
    • Observer

      KRhodes,

      Atheists are waiting to hear from you how your God could sit and watch 20 kids get butchered.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:56 pm |
    • rob r.

      um.. because we know the value of life better than you. We don't think this life is some kind of trial until we get to a better place. We care about people for moral reasons not because some ultimate power tells us so.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:56 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      just trolling? seriously can't think of an answer? i'll give you one.

      murder is wrong. killing people is wrong. killing children, the most innocent among us, is the worst kind of inhumanity. we don't need god to know killing children is wrong.

      but to answer your questions more directly - this is the only life we get, so taking that is the worst thing you can do. we don't believe you get to float around on fairy wings all day and night after you die. there is nothing worse you can take from someone.

      satisfied?

      December 17, 2012 at 8:57 pm |
    • Akira

      Krhodes:
      Why on earth would you think that people would not be upset at some insane person murdering a bunch of people, 20 of which are children?
      Are you that arrogant to think that the only people capable of sympathy and empathy are the ones who believe in your (Christian) God?
      How very patronizing of you.
      I suggest a good dose of "grow up."

      December 17, 2012 at 9:06 pm |
    • molly

      I'm just wondering what this means:

      "I am wondering what our atheist brethern are upset about the shootings? "

      December 17, 2012 at 9:13 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      My word, Khrud, but you're disgusting. Do you really think that simply because atheists think that when they die that's it that they don't value the life they and others enjoy here and now? What special kind of stupid are you?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:23 pm |
    • KRHODES

      Bootyfunk

      "just trolling? seriously can't think of an answer? i'll give you one.

      murder is wrong. killing people is wrong. killing children, the most innocent among us, is the worst kind of inhumanity. we don't need god to know killing children is wrong.

      but to answer your questions more directly – this is the only life we get, so taking that is the worst thing you can do. we don't believe you get to float around on fairy wings all day and night after you die. there is nothing worse you can take from someone."

      But why is murder wrong? I mean we are here for no reason and will eventually go nowhere....why think that killing is wrong? I mean animals do it all the time...why should we be any different? That is what we are right...just animals? Why put any value on human life?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:35 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      If the only reason you think murder is wrong, Khruddy, is because the Ten Commandments say so, then YOU'RE the one lacking in morality. The rest of us don't need some mean giant threatening us with damnation to know that it's wrong to hurt others. The rest of us have more sense than you do, obviously.

      What an ass hole you are.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:40 pm |
    • KRHODES

      Akira

      "Krhodes:
      Why on earth would you think that people would not be upset at some insane person murdering a bunch of people, 20 of which are children?
      Are you that arrogant to think that the only people capable of sympathy and empathy are the ones who believe in your (Christian) God?
      How very patronizing of you.
      I suggest a good dose of "grow up."

      I never stated one had to be a Christian to have empathy or sympathy. I want to know why it is wrong? Who decided it is wrong and why?Like i said...if we are here by accident and are going to go out of existence...then why is it wrong?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:40 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @KRHODES,

      because as a society we define right and wrong. If you want it to be animalistic, it's tribal. The tribe takes care of it's own. You hurt someone in the tribe, you hurt me. The existence of morality without burning bushes and graven tablets is not that hard to figure out.

      To take a life is the ultimate travesty. It is all that you have. Surely you recognize the immensity of this for people who don't believe in an afterlife?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:40 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Khruddy is so ignorant that he doesn't know that murder is anathema everywhere, not just in Christian or religious nations.

      Moron.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:42 pm |
    • KRHODES

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      "If the only reason you think murder is wrong, Khruddy, is because the Ten Commandments say so, then YOU'RE the one lacking in morality. The rest of us don't need some mean giant threatening us with damnation to know that it's wrong to hurt others. The rest of us have more sense than you do, obviously.

      What an ass hole you are"

      Did i say anything about the ten commandments tommy? Why is it wrong to hurt others if atheism is correct? By saying you have more sense than i do are you saying it is a personal preference? If it is a personal preference then why do we all view the act with horror?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:45 pm |
    • KRHODES

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      "Khruddy is so ignorant that he doesn't know that murder is anathema everywhere, not just in Christian or religious nations.

      Moron."

      It is an anathema...yes, but why?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:47 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      because all humans are my brothers and sisters, as proven by scientific DNA evidence. i love all my brothers and sisters, even the religiously deluded ones. basically - i care for others, including you. i treat others as i want to be treated. also, it's logical to be ethical. but it sounds like your basic question is why be ethical? or how can atheists be ethical without god? why be good for goodness sake?

      do a basic google search. you will find a number of papers written by scholars and philosophers that have produced entire works on the subject.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:48 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      BECAUSE, YOU IDIOT: Over eons, we evolved. We formed communities and tribes. Murdering someone in one's tribe wouldn't be beneficial to the survival of the group.

      How stupid are you?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:49 pm |
    • KRHODES

      I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      "@KRHODES,

      because as a society we define right and wrong."

      So right and wrong are simply subjective to the particular society. Well in some cultures they love their neighbor and in some they eat their neighbor...which do you prefer and why?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:51 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Do you have nothing between your ears, Khrud?

      You are attempting to pretend that all of us have morality because of some god. That isn't the case. There are plenty of secular and even atheistic societies in which murder is taboo.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:53 pm |
    • KRHODES

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      "BECAUSE, YOU IDIOT: Over eons, we evolved. We formed communities and tribes. Murdering someone in one's tribe wouldn't be beneficial to the survival of the group.

      How stupid are you?"

      Well evolution is concerned with survival and truth would always take a backseat to that. So the truth that murder is wrong may not actually be true but rather personal preference and certainly not objective to all humanity right?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:54 pm |
    • KRHODES

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      "Do you have nothing between your ears, Khrud?

      You are attempting to pretend that all of us have morality because of some god. That isn't the case. There are plenty of secular and even atheistic societies in which murder is taboo."

      So given evolution...if there were two people and one had something they both needed then survival would trump the idea of murder right? It would be survival then wouldn't it.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:05 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      How many times did your mommy have to show you how to tie your shoes, KRUD? You've been told before that humans discovered early on that they had a better chance of surviving if they worked together rather than alone and that everyone benefited when the group's good was paramount. What part of that is so hard for you to grasp?

      December 17, 2012 at 10:06 pm |
    • KRHODES

      I thought we were talking about murder tom? As i said...your idea of murder or right and wrong goes out the window when survival is the priority. That tells me that if atheism is true then no morality exist and it is simply a selfish act to fain concern about others, because you link your survival with others. That is an interesting position you have and one that really can't be logically defended.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:23 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @KHRODES,

      "So right and wrong are simply subjective to the particular society. Well in some cultures they love their neighbor and in some they eat their neighbor...which do you prefer and why?"

      Yep. I prefer the one where we don't eat our neighbours, because it is the one I am in.

      By the way doesn't your religion involve ritual human sacrifice by proxy and require ritual canabalism?

      December 17, 2012 at 10:23 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Khruddy, when you get an education and grow a brain, do send out an announcement. There's no "stand" here; these aren't new ideas and they're hardly revolutionary. I'm not surprised, though, that you are unfamiliar with them.

      You're rather dull.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:26 pm |
    • KRHODES

      "Yep. I prefer the one where we don't eat our neighbours, because it is the one I am in."

      Oh..okay, but that doesn't mean the other scenario i gave is wrong...just not the one you prefer because you don't live in it. Well then i am correct...morality , right, and wrong don't actually exist as truth.

      By the way doesn't your religion involve ritual human sacrifice by proxy and require ritual canabalism?

      I don't practice catholicism. I am merely a fundamentalist as you would put it.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:29 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You can go on with your act, Khrud, but that will avail you nothing. Atheists are just as moral as you fundies are, and often more so, as we don't need to have the threat of hell held over our heads keep us from murdering others. I guess you aren't quite so civilized.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:32 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      Still signed up for the ritual human sacrifice by proxy though: 'He died for our sins' and all.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:41 pm |
    • KRHODES

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      "Khruddy, when you get an education and grow a brain, do send out an announcement. There's no "stand" here; these aren't new ideas and they're hardly revolutionary. I'm not surprised, though, that you are unfamiliar with them.

      You're rather dull."

      No..those ideas are fairly new and illogical when taken tto their conclusion. That type of thinking in our society is why incidents such as what occurred in Newton have become so prevelant. Our society is on a downward spiral and that thinking has brought us to it. We are teaching people we are the same as animals, and there is no God. Sooner or later don't you think they come to the conclusion it does not matter what they do, because they will be dead and will suffer no consequences? Besides that...who said it is wrong?

      .

      December 17, 2012 at 10:43 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @KRHODES,

      "morality , right, and wrong don't actually exist as truth"

      "truth", certainly not. You can look for that in the Philosophy department, but you will find it to be elusive.

      There are facts:
      We breathe oxygen. There are 7 billion humans living today. We will all die. George Washington was the first President of the United States, etc.

      There are proofs:
      The sum of two even numbers is even. Any number subtracted from itself equals zero. Any number divided by itself equals one.

      There are natural laws:
      Bodies in motion remain in motion. Bodies at rest remain at rest. F=ma. For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. The absolute pressure and volume of a given mass of confined gas at constant temperature are inversely proportional. PV = nRT. Matter cannot be created or destroyed. E=mc²

      There are theories, backed up by evidence.
      Our universe began with the big bang, 13.8 billion years ago. The earth is 4.5 billion years old. Humans evolved from primates. The end of the dinosaurs was coincident with a meteorite collision 65 million years ago.

      There are opinions:
      Raising tax revenue from the richest 1% will help reduce the deficit. The French Navy won the American War of Independence.

      There are morals:
      Killing, lying and stealing are wrong.

      There are beliefs:
      There is one God – the Father the Son and the Holy Spirit. There is one God – Allah, and Mohammed is his prophet. If one sows goodness, one will reap goodness; if one sows evil, one will reap evil.

      Each of these may be considered as ‘true’ by a great number of people, but the search for “truth” belongs in the philosophy department.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:45 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You really don't know much about history, do you, Khruddy? It's amusing watching you end-of-the-world-as-we-know-it types run around this blog like Chicken Little.

      But do continue to write. It just makes atheism look more and more rational.

      December 17, 2012 at 10:53 pm |
    • ZKX

      @Tom

      Is it necessary to insult the guy whenever he responds? I know that you have a logical line of reasoning, but calling KHRODES an "idiot", and telling him that there is "nothing between his ears" and that he should "grow a brain" when all he is doing asking questions seems a little abrasive for what could be a very interesting logical debate. Sure, it makes Atheism seem more and more rational, but it also comes off as a little bit disrespectful.

      December 18, 2012 at 1:21 am |
  14. Em

    With all respects & with no desire to cause any doctrinal or religious debate, here are some words of scripture that comforts me with 'questions of the soul' such as "Why does God allow evil & suffering to occur?" or "Why good people die?"- and similar questions:

    "...And the blood of the innocent shall stand as a witness against them (the wicked), yea, and cry mightily against them at the last day"

    "For the Lord suffereth the righteous to be slain that his justice & judgment may come upon the wicked; therefore ye need not suppose that the righteous are lost because they are slain; but behold, they do enter into the rest of the Lord their God."

    Jesus said: "Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God"

    (Alma 14:11, 60:13-The Book of Mormon-Another Testament of Jesus Christ, Mark 10:14-The Holy Bible)

    December 17, 2012 at 8:44 pm |
    • Geezus

      The scripture also loves to stone people, particularly women and children. Let's quote those as well.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:48 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      jesus in matthew 10:

      34 “Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35 For I have come to turn
      35 a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law—
      36 a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.
      37 Anyone who loves their father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves their son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me."

      yes, quite the messenger of peace and love...

      December 17, 2012 at 8:52 pm |
  15. Ampam

    Maybe if GOD was allowed in schools once again, these things wouldn't happen........

    December 17, 2012 at 8:43 pm |
    • Geezus

      So your god is so weak and without conscience, that he'll let 20 children get murdered because we don't pray to him at school? I thought he was good and merciful?

      December 17, 2012 at 8:45 pm |
    • molly

      Wow. Your as stupid as Huckabee. You have to try pretty hard to be that stupid. Maybe you're just a poe.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:45 pm |
    • CGAW

      Ever heard of freewill? Atheists get away with all kinds of things and pious people get shafted all the time becasue some human has to get over on the other one.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:49 pm |
    • Akira

      Get real...is he that petty?

      December 17, 2012 at 8:50 pm |
    • rob r.

      Holy crap are you stupid. Who said God is not allowed in schools/? Do kids pray at school? All the itme. Do teachers and administrators pray? All the time. Are there plenty of Christians at public schools? Of course. To suggest that somehow this is God's retribution is heinous.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:54 pm |
    • Observer

      Ampam,

      Guess you're not one of those people who claim this is a Christian nation. Guess not being allowed in schools may have caused God to kill some of the Christians there.

      Bright.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:54 pm |
    • sam stone

      There is nothing that stops individuals from praying. It is ORGANIZED prayer that is banned. God has not been kicked out of anything. Persecution complex in good working order, I see

      December 18, 2012 at 2:12 am |
    • sam stone

      CGAW: Athiests get away with all sorts of things, but the pious get shafted? Can you give us some examples, or is it all in your head?

      December 18, 2012 at 2:14 am |
    • sam stone

      I figured that the CGAW troll would not support his blather. Another post and run cowardly christian

      December 18, 2012 at 10:18 am |
  16. Carl

    I am awestruck by the narrow-minded stupidity of people who are blaming this tragedy on "God being removed from schools." The flip side of God is not evil, it's Reason. And for the Canadian who said we never had God in our schools, you are wrong. All through the '60s I suffered through the Lord's Prayer every morning in my classroom. This nonsense was finally dropped in the early '70s, just about the time girls were allowed to wear pants to school.

    December 17, 2012 at 8:40 pm |
  17. Born again

    If there is a warm house full of comfort and joy, and you are denied entry because you won't aknowledge that the owner sets the rules; can you really say it's the owners fault when you remain out in the cold, wailing and knashing your teeth?

    December 17, 2012 at 8:38 pm |
    • Rudy1947

      Are you one of those narcissists?

      December 17, 2012 at 8:43 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      yes. it's cruel to say follow my arbitrary rules or go die. it shows the owner cares for his rules more than he does for his fellow human being.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:43 pm |
    • Sam

      Wait, you really aren't talking about a house, are you? This is supposed to be some clever metaphor.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:44 pm |
    • Nate

      Born again is one of those legalistic Christians that give the rest a bad name. When you look at what you just wrote objectively, do you really think it was productive?

      December 17, 2012 at 8:50 pm |
    • born again mayb e

      Just saying. Every says why is God doing this or that. If He made the universe and everything in it, why should he give a rats a$$ about anyone who isn't with the program. He is not doing anything at all to anyone. That's just it. All the pain isn't because of what he has done, it's due to the lack of him. I don't think if you accept all is fun and games, but the idea that the creator of the universe and everything in it is going to grovel to serve is just not the way it works. If you don't acknowledge the master of the house then don't be surprised when you're not invited in.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:54 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      "If He made the universe and everything in it, why should he give a rats a$$ about anyone who isn't with the program"

      for the same reason a father cares for his child.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:02 pm |
    • Nate

      Because of God's love for us EVERYONE got the invite(John 3:16). It's up to us to accept it.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:03 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      love me or be tortured forever...

      December 17, 2012 at 9:10 pm |
    • born again not neccessarily

      I'm not saying the invite didn't go out to all. But if you turn away, you turn away.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:10 pm |
    • born again again

      Mr Bootyfunk: Dad's will always love sons and daughters, but haven't you heard your dad say "If you live under my roof, you'll live by my rules". Simple concept. I don't think he "made" what happened to those kids. Evil is in the world. See the lion devour bambi. See the old mans glasses crumble on the step of the library after nuclear holocaust. Evil is the other half and that's that.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:19 pm |
    • Nate

      Bootyfunk – I think a better wording would be, "Here, grab this life saver, it's right next to you. It's right there! What the heck, why aren't you grabbing it!"

      December 17, 2012 at 9:19 pm |
    • Nate

      Born again....So if we don't live by the rules then bad things happen to us? Can you live by the rules? I know I can't. So the good news is that if I can't live up to the rules I'm just waiting around for a piano to fall on my head or some mentally deranged kid to gun my kids down?

      December 17, 2012 at 9:26 pm |
    • born again and again

      Nate,
      Not quite like that. My thought is that accepting God has nothing to do with good/bad things happening. I'm just saying that as that one person said, there is the life saver. Accept it and go to heaven, decline it and go into the neder regions. As for the kids, that, as horrible as it sounds is just the way life goes. Think of the holocaust, the romans feeding people to lions. Evil is as much a part of life as is good. It is real. Like Clint said in the unforgiven, something like "we all have it comming".

      December 17, 2012 at 9:55 pm |
    • born again and again

      Nate,
      My thought is that accepting God has nothing to do with good/bad things happening. I'm just saying that as that one person said, there is the life saver. Accept it and go to heaven, decline it and go into the neder regions. As for the kids, that, as horrible as it sounds is just the way life goes. Think of the holocaust, the romans feeding people to lions. Evil is as much a part of life as is good. It is real. Like Clint said in the unforgiven, "we all have it comming".

      December 17, 2012 at 9:59 pm |
    • sam stone

      If the owner of the warm and comfy house won't let those freezing in, he or she is not all loving

      If the owner of the warm and comfy house won't let those freezing in, he or she is petty and vindictive

      December 18, 2012 at 2:17 am |
    • sam stone

      born again again: you see a lion devouring bambi as an example of evil? the lion is just doing what the lion was made to do

      December 18, 2012 at 2:21 am |
  18. Squonkk

    Hey everyone! Weird Science is on HBO tonight.

    (Most of these geeks spent their childhood pretending to be those guys)

    December 17, 2012 at 8:37 pm |
    • molly

      What geeks are you talking about? Are you talking about someone on TV that we can't see? And just talking to yourself?

      December 17, 2012 at 8:48 pm |
  19. CGAW

    Atheists in religious forums – narcissists

    December 17, 2012 at 8:35 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      religious zombies that don't understand this is where belief and non-belief is discussed - hilarious.

      i only want to hear my side of the story! boohoohoo!

      December 17, 2012 at 8:44 pm |
    • eclectic8

      They are out to disprove what they don't believe in and for what purpose? They fancy themselves as some kind of hero.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:44 pm |
    • CGAW

      @bootystunk – we know your side – you believe you can speak for other's personal experiences – delirious

      December 17, 2012 at 8:46 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      to wake up the christian cult members and get them to think for themselves. cults are not good for you. they teach you to turn off your brain. we are trying to save our brothers and sisters from a life of mentally slavery. the pillars of christianity are guilt, fear and ignorance. leave the cult. think for yourself.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:48 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      hahaha. someone who talks to an invisible sky fairy talking about delirium - priceless.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:49 pm |
    • eclectic8

      @bootyfunk, I see you are out to save us and you are a half wit at that.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:50 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      yes, the religious are allergic to facts and logic

      December 17, 2012 at 8:53 pm |
    • sam stone

      People who purport to speak for god – narcissists

      December 18, 2012 at 2:24 am |
  20. achepter

    I agree...God is guilty of doing nothing, thus being an accessory to murder.

    December 17, 2012 at 8:33 pm |
    • eclectic8

      and you are an assesory to an idiotic statement.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:42 pm |
    • PON

      What a sick, perverted, pathetic person you must be

      December 17, 2012 at 8:46 pm |
    • Bootyfunk

      god is all powerful - he could have stopped it. he could make all children throughout the world bullet proof with the snap of his fingers. why doesn't he protect innocents?

      Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
      Then he is not omnipotent.
      Is he able, but not willing?
      Then he is malevolent.
      Is he both able and willing?
      Then whence cometh evil?
      Is he neither able nor willing?
      Then why call him God?
      - David Hume, echoing the logical formulation that we have dubbed the "Epicurean Riddle"

      god = fail

      December 17, 2012 at 8:46 pm |
    • CGAW

      Atheist in a religious forum – wasted time, wasted energy. Result = nothingness.

      December 17, 2012 at 8:52 pm |
    • rob r.

      Eclectic is guilty of not backing up anything he says.
      Once you clear out all the muck in your brain and examine some simple facts, it is obvious that God is non-existent or powerless or uncaring.
      Most accurate verse in the Bible: You must enter the kingdom of heaven with eyes of a child." And the brains too.

      December 17, 2012 at 9:04 pm |
    • Rudy1947

      @Bootyfunk
      Loved your quote from David Hume....short and sweet!

      December 17, 2012 at 9:08 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.