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Survey: Few religious groups want Roe v. Wade overturned despite belief abortion morally wrong
Roe v. Wade has remained controversial in the four decades since the landmark Supreme Court decision.
January 16th, 2013
10:00 AM ET

Survey: Few religious groups want Roe v. Wade overturned despite belief abortion morally wrong

By Dan Merica, CNN

Washington (CNN) Forty years after the Supreme Court protected abortion rights in Roe v. Wade, a new survey finds that white evangelicals remain the only major religious group that supports overturning the landmark ruling, even though most such groups find abortion morally wrong.

Slightly more than half (54%) of white evangelicals, according to the Pew Research Center study, favor completely overturning the 1973 Supreme Court decision that affirmed a woman’s right to have an abortion. No other religious group, including white mainline Protestants, black Protestants and white Catholics, agreed with completely overturning the ruling.

In fact, substantial majorities of white Protestants (76%), black Protestants (65%) and white Catholics (63%) say the ruling should not be over turned, the survey found.

But support for keeping Roe v. Wade intact does not mean these religious majorities believe abortion is morally acceptable.

A majority of every religious group sampled white evangelicals (73%), black Protestants (58%) and Catholics (58%) and a plurality of white mainline Protestants (36%) responded that abortion was morally wrong. Those respondents who find it morally wrong are also overwhelmingly likely to support overturning the law, compared with keeping it intact 85% to 5%.

"What is interesting about this aspect of abortion attitudes is that while many people find abortion to be problematic, they may either personally feel it is wrong or favor greater restrictions. Overturning Roe v. Wade is not nearly as supported an idea," said Michael Dimock, director at the Pew Research Center. "The vast majority of evangelicals say they see abortion as morally wrong, but barely a majority say that they want to see Roe v. Wade overturned."

Dimock points out that while more than 70% of white evangelicals find abortion morally wrong, only slightly more than 50% say the ruling should be overturned. "There is somewhere in the neighborhood of 20% of evangelicals who are personally opposed to abortion but don’t want to see this precedent changed," Dimock said.

The religiously unaffiliated were the only group in which more people say they find abortion morally acceptable rather than wrong. Twenty-four percent of the group said it was acceptable, compared with 20% who said it was wrong. Nearly half (43%) said it was not a moral issue.

White evangelicals (64%) are also the most ardent that abortion should be illegal in “all or most cases.” Mormons (63%) and Hispanic Catholics (53%) are the only other two religious groups where more respondents favor illegality in all or most cases.

“By contrast, nearly nine in 10 Jews say abortion should be legal in all or most cases, as do about seven in 10 Americans with no religious affiliation and 63% of white mainline Protestants,” the survey reported. “Among both black Protestants and white Catholics, 54% say abortion should be legal in all or most cases.”

The establishment of a woman’s constitutional right to terminate a pregnancy has been controversial in the four decades since the Supreme Court decision. The court’s ruling was not close, however. Seven of the nine justices voted in favor of making abortion a fundamental right under the Constitution.

Anti-abortion rights activists have demanded the ruling be repealed, a move that would likely allow states to decide whether to allow abortions or not. With the judiciary becoming more conservative during George W. Bush's presidency, some observers said the court under Chief Justice John Roberts would be anti-abortion activists best opportunity to relitigate Roe v. Wade.

"Roe v. Wade certainly did engage the pro-life movement by being so symbolic of an issue, but I don’t think the level of opposition to abortion has really shifted that much over time," Dimock said. "For a very contentious ruling, the public's view on it has remained fairly stable."

Frequency of religious services attendance is also an indicator of whether a poll respondent wants Roe v. Wade overturned. According to the survey, people who attend weekly or more support overturning the decision by 55% to 44%.

That number is substantially different among respondents who attend church less often. According to the survey, 76% among those don't support overturning the ruling, compared with 17% who do.

The Pew Research Center results are part of a study released with the 40-year anniversary of Roe v. Wade in mind. The telephone survey of 1,502 adults was conducted from January 9 through Sunday, with a margin of error of plus or minus 2.9%.

- Dan Merica

Filed under: Abortion • Belief

soundoff (887 Responses)
  1. Science

    Free speech helps to educate the masses..............POLITICIANS TOO !

    Hey James Madison................religion has none it looks like.............with the comments on this blog.

    The Big question is ETHICS ! does religion have any ?

    The Ethics of Resurrecting Extinct Species

    Apr. 8, 2013 — At some point, scientists may be able to bring back extinct animals, and perhaps early humans, raising questions of ethics and environmental disruption.

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130408165955.htm

    The fact...............the earth is to old ...........time to EVOLVE !..................Creationists...........ID believers and christians !

    Ancient Earth Crust Stored in Deep Mantle

    Apr. 24, 2013 — Scientists have long believed that lava erupted from certain oceanic volcanoes contains materials from the early Earth's crust. But decisive evidence for this phenomenon has proven elusive. New research from a team including Carnegie's Erik Hauri demonstrates that oceanic volcanic rocks contain samples of recycled crust dating back to the Archean era 2.5 billion years ago. Their work is published in Nature.

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130424132705.htm

    Maybe they should not have created the wedge !!!

    The wedge strategy is a political and social action plan authored by the Discovery Insti-tute, the hub of the intelligent design movement. The strategy was put forth in a Discovery Insti-tute manifesto known as the Wedge Docu-ment,[1] which describes a broad social, political, and academic agenda whose ultimate goal is to defeat materialism, naturalism, evolution, and "reverse the stifling materialist world view and replace it with a science consonant with Christian and theistic
    convictions.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wedge_strategy

    Dover Trial Transcripts............................................. FACTS.

    Below are the complete transcripts from the Dover Trial. Thanks to our friends at the National Center for Science Education for helping us fill in the missing transcripts.

    http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/intelligentdesigncase/dovertrialtranscripts.htm

    Education works for children

    Where do morals come from?.............the answer is not the bible read and find out !

    By Kelly Murray, CNN

    http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/04/12/where-do-morals-come-from/#comments

    Gravity is not up for debate ! ............E = mc2..........(U–Pb).................two math formulas..........that do not lie or sin !!!...

    By the numbers .......easy to do !

    Doc................Love FACTS !...............Evolution is a dirty word to them !

    Monkey Math: Baboons Show Brain's Ability to Understand Numbers

    May 3, 2013 — Opposing thumbs, expressive faces, complex social systems: it's hard to miss the similarities between apes and humans. Now a new study with a troop of zoo baboons and lots of peanuts shows that a less obvious trait – the ability to understand numbers – also is shared by humans and their primate cousins.

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/03/130306133917.htm

    The ORIGIN story is bullsh-it...............so is the bible............... nasty !

    From Soup to Cells—the Origin of Life

    http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/IIE2aOriginoflife.shtml

    Scientists have unearthed the first direct signs of cheesemaking, at a site in Poland that dates back 7,500 years.

    Human Evolution

    http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/IIE2cHumanevo.shtml

    Dover Trial Transcripts............................................. FACTS.

    Below are the complete transcripts from the Dover Trial. Thanks to our friends at the National Center for Science Education for helping us fill in the missing transcripts.

    http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/intelligentdesigncase/dovertrialtranscripts.htm

    They lost in 2005............still trying !

    May 6, 2013 at 10:14 am | Report abuse |

    Peace.......

    May 6, 2013 at 12:31 pm |
    • Science

      Gravity is not up for debate ! ............E = mc2..........(U–Pb).................two math formulas..........that do not lie or sin !!!..........

      Free speech helps educate the masses................POLITICIANS too !

      Where do morals come from?

      By Kelly Murray, CNN

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/04/12/where-do-morals-come-from/#comments

      Gravity is not up for debate ! ............E = mc2..........(U–Pb).................two math formulas..........that do not lie or sin !!!..........

      BY the way ...................Splat goes a fairy in the sky !...............bye bye tinker bell !

      Einstein's Gravity Theory Passes Toughest Test Yet

      Apr. 25, 2013 — A strange stellar pair nearly 7,000 light-years from Earth has provided physicists with a unique cosmic laboratory for studying the nature of gravity. The extremely strong gravity of a massive neutron star in orbit with a companion white dwarf star puts competing theories of gravity to a test more stringent than any available before

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130425142250.htm

      Hey James Madison................religion has none it looks like.............with the comments on this blog.

      The Big question is ETHICS ! does religion have any ?

      The Ethics of Resurrecting Extinct Species

      Apr. 8, 2013 — At some point, scientists may be able to bring back extinct animals, and perhaps early humans, raising questions of ethics and environmental disruption.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130408165955.htm

      April 30, 2013 at 4:16 pm | Report abuse |

      May 1, 2013 at 12:42 pm | Report abuse |

      Dinosaur Egg Study Supports Evolutionary Link Between Birds and Dinosaurs: How Troodon Likely Hatched Its Young

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130418104324.htm

      And NO ANGELS the pope KICKED them OFF the TEAM last year !

      From Soup to Cells—the Origin of Life

      http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/IIE2aOriginoflife.shtml

      the wrong path is Adam and Eve !

      Human Y Chromosome Much Older Than Previously Thought

      Mar. 4, 2013 — The discovery and analysis of an extremely rare African American Y chromosome pushes back the time of the most recent common ancestor for the Y chromosome lineage tree to 338,000 years ago. This time predates the age of the oldest known anatomically modern human fossils.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/03/130305145821.htm

      No god(s) needed or required to graduate from public schools in the US

      Remember : Adam had to POKE himself hard with his OWN BONE to create Eve.

      No god(s) needed................... Old. DNA works..................also catches crooks !

      Ancient DNA Reveals Europe's Dynamic Genetic History

      Apr. 23, 2013 — Ancient DNA recovered from a series of skeletons in central Germany up to 7,500 years old has been used to reconstruct the first detailed genetic history of modern Europe.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130423134037.htm

      Ca-nabis and Cannabinoids (PDQ®) – National Cancer Insti-tute

      http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/cam/cannabis/.../page4

      Mar 21, 2013 – [1,2] These plant-derived compounds may be referred to as phytocannabinoids. ... have a protective effect against the development of certain types of tumors. ... In lung cancer cell lines, CBD upregulated ICAM-1, leading to ...

      Good stuff !

      The fact...............the earth is to old for this nonsemse ! Time to EVOLVE !

      Ancient Earth Crust Stored in Deep Mantle

      Apr. 24, 2013 — Scientists have long believed that lava erupted from certain oceanic volcanoes contains materials from the early Earth's crust. But decisive evidence for this phenomenon has proven elusive. New research from a team including Carnegie's Erik Hauri demonstrates that oceanic volcanic rocks contain samples of recycled crust dating back to the Archean era 2.5 billion years ago. Their work is published in Nature.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130424132705.htm

      For what...................... ? Make sure to read what the pope said !

      Where do morals come from?

      By Kelly Murray, CNN

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/

      Learning is fun with facts.......................... and facts work when teaching children.

      Atheist Prof. Peter Higgs: Stop calling Higgs boson the ‘God particle’

      Professor Peter Higgs said recently that there is no God and so people should stop referring to the theoretical partial that
      bears his name as the “God particle.”

      http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/04/08/atheist-prof-peter-higgs-stop-calling-higgs-bosen-the-god-particle/

      Pope praises science, but insists God created world updated Thur October 28, 2010
      Stephen Hawking is wrong, Pope Benedict XVI said Thursday – God did create the universe. The pope didn't actually mention the world-famous scientist, who argues in a book published last month that the laws of physics show there is no need for a supreme... \

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2010/10/28/pope-praises-science-but-insists-god-created-world/

      Science

      Heaven is 'a fairy story,' scientist Stephen Hawking says updated Tue May 17, 2011
      By Dan Gilgoff, CNN.com Religion Editor The concept of heaven or any kind of afterlife is a "fairy story," famed British scientist Stephen Hawking said in a newspaper interview this week. "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when...

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/17/heaven-is-a-fairy-story-scientist-stephen-hawking-says/

      April 7th, 2012

      08:32 PM ET

      The Jesus debate: Man vs. myth

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/04/07/the-jesus-debate-man-vs-myth/comment-page-137/#comment-2281915

      Make sure to read comments

      April 18, 2013 at 3:10 pm | Report abuse |

      Breaking News

      NASA: Three planets found are some of best candidates so far for habitable worlds outside our solar system.

      http://www.cnn.com/2013/04/18/us/planet-discovery/index.html

      NASA: Mars could have supported life

      Star Dust we are

      [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWdU_px9ApE&w=640&h=390]

      Holy Hallucinations 35

      [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XTCRdC8Dlo&w=640&h=390]

      The ORIGIN story is bullsh-it...............so is the bible............... nasty !

      From Soup to Cells—the Origin of Life

      http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/IIE2aOriginoflife.shtml

      Scientists have unearthed the first direct signs of cheesemaking, at a site in Poland that dates back 7,500 years.

      Human Evolution

      http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evosite/evo101/IIE2cHumanevo.shtml

      BBC. Planet of the Apemen. Battle for Earth 1. Ho-mo Erectus

      [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUliLKSJ4bQ&w=640&h=390]

      BACKFILL on E =mc2.....

      Einstein letter, set for auction, shows scientist challenging idea of God, being 'chosen'

      By Jessica Ravitz, CNN

      Decades before atheist scientist and author Richard Dawkins called God a "delusion," one world-renowned physicist – Albert Einstein – was weighing in on faith matters with his own strong words.

      “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends,” Einstein wrote in German in a 1954 letter that will be auctioned on eBay later this month. "No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this.”

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/category/culture-science/

      May 4, 2013 at 6:47 am | Report abuse |

      Cheech & Chong's History of 420

      http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/3b1508d1f0/cheech-chong-s-history-of-420?rel=player&playlist=341944

      All cults...........creationists, ID believers and devil cults.................

      The fact...............the earth is to old ...........time to EVOLVE !.

      Ancient Earth Crust Stored in Deep Mantle

      Apr. 24, 2013 — Scientists have long believed that lava erupted from certain oceanic volcanoes contains materials from the early Earth's crust. But decisive evidence for this phenomenon has proven elusive. New research from a team including Carnegie's Erik Hauri demonstrates that oceanic volcanic rocks contain samples of recycled crust dating back to the Archean era 2.5 billion years ago. Their work is published in Nature.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130424132705.htm

      Dover Trial Transcripts............................................. FACTS.

      Below are the complete transcripts from the Dover Trial. Thanks to our friends at the National Center for Science Education for helping us fill in the missing transcripts.

      http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/intelligentdesigncase/dovertrialtranscripts.htm

      Education works for children

      Earth From Space

      Detailed satellite images reveal the web of connections that sustain life on Earth. Aired February 13, 2013 on PBS

      Program Description

      "Earth From Space" is a groundbreaking two-hour special that reveals a spectacular new space-based vision of our planet. Produced in extensive consultation with NASA scientists, NOVA takes data from earth-observing satellites and transforms it into dazzling visual sequences, each one exposing the intricate and surprising web of forces that sustains life on earth. Viewers witness how dust blown from the Sahara fertilizes the Amazon; how a vast submarine "waterfall" off Antarctica helps drive ocean currents around the world; and how the sun's heating up of the southern Atlantic gives birth to a colossally powerful hurricane. From the microscopic world of water molecules vaporizing over the ocean to the magnetic field that is bigger than Earth itself, the show reveals the astonishing beauty and complexity of our dynamic planet.

      http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/space/earth-from-space.html

      February 16, 2013 at 7:18 am | Report abuse |

      Peace

      May 6, 2013 at 12:32 pm |
  2. pherrisphain

    China is anti-choice as well. Except, in China the government says women have to abort. It is estimated that 14 million abortions are performed in China every year. To put is into perspective, there have been 500 million abortions in China since Roe v. Wade while it is estimated that there have been 50 million abortions in the United States during the same period. If you are against abortion, you do more to support it with your consumerism than you can ever do to stop it at the ballot box.

    January 28, 2013 at 6:15 am |
  3. Tom, Tom, the Other One

    Oh well, I suggested this compromise: Keep abortion safe, legal, and free from social stigmas, but make contraception freely available to all.

    No Takers.

    January 26, 2013 at 11:03 pm |
  4. alexi acevedo

    three companies. will end Abortion

    January 26, 2013 at 8:31 pm |
    • HotAirAce

      So you think a few companies will achieve something no god has?

      January 26, 2013 at 10:45 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      What a delusional dweeb. Abortion has occurred since women got pregnant. You can't make it "go away." Unless you figure out some way to remove a zygote or fetus from the uterus of a woman who doesn't want it and transplant it somewhere, you're out of luck, dear.

      Women simply won't carry a pregnancy if they don't wish to give birth.

      January 26, 2013 at 10:49 pm |
    • Moby Schtick

      Abortion will not "end" until we fix the problems that cause abortion to be seen as necessary by so many people who are in their rights to get one. Abortion is a symptom of complex issues that must be addressed by a decent society. As a staunch "pro-choice" individual, I'd like to see the number of abortions go way down because it's not a necessary option. Education on the body and the immense consequences of certain actions and behavior and how to limit harm and undue medical stress are excellent goals for a caring society AND the more educated on those issues the less abortions would be needed.

      It should concern us that we need abortion, even with all the "evil" it's been labeled with for so long. My position is to make the intent earliest possible obstruction. The earlier the better. Keep the two cells from ever coming into contact: best. Stop the egg from implanting, okay. If it's two months away from delivery, and we need to use the tool, then clearly their are other problems at work that need to be seriously addressed. And there is no limit to what those problems might be; some good and some bad.

      January 26, 2013 at 10:58 pm |
  5. HotAirAce

    So the Catholic Health Initiative now says that life does not begin at conception, that a baby must be born to be a person. A women 28 weeks pregnant with twins died at a CHI hospital and the husband/father attempted, unsuccessfully, to sue – see http://www.westword.com/2013-01-24/news/catholic-church-is-a-fetus-a-person/. And to add insult to injury, the hospital is suing the plaintiff for costs – over 100K$! How compassionate.

    January 25, 2013 at 11:45 pm |
  6. linda

    It is sad to think that roughly 50 million legal induced abortions have been performed in the United States since 1973. In other words at least 50 Million innocent infants killed because they were not old enough or capable of defending themselves. They could have changed the face of America today. If each of these children was given the chance to grow up and if each of them contributed with only one dollar to the american economy ,America would have been at least 50 Million dollars richer and probably a much better place to live in.It is a Huge loss . Americans did not invest in their future.

    January 23, 2013 at 5:36 pm |
    • John Danielson

      I can pointlessly conjecture too! One of those 50 million would have been abandoned as a baby, became the next Hitler, and would have taken over the world and killed billions.

      January 28, 2013 at 12:53 am |
  7. Live4Him

    @Jen

    I don't know if you'll see this post, but I thought I'd respond to your comments anyway. I apologize for the delay.

    ----

    @Jen : I would disagree that everyone having s-x who does not want a baby is doing it for self esteem.

    You may be distorting my position slightly. My posit was concerning s-x outside of marriage. As for you claim that some women do it for pure enjoyment, lets delve into this. How many of them want to make money at what they enjoy? Few to none of them want to go into that so-called profession. Why? Because it is degrading. This implies that women are not doing it for enjoyment.

    ----

    @Jen : I certainly was emotionally ready to have s-x long before that time.

    Everyone is ready for the enjoyment before the responsibility, but were you ready for the responsibility? No. Therefore, you were not emotionally ready.

    ----

    @Jen : I just DON'T WANT any more children. ... It would likely lead to the demise of our marriage

    I can understand that point. So, you took steps to avoid the consequences. However, would you be willing to stop a beating heart to avoid it? I don't know if this latter point concerned abstaining or pregnancy, so I will presume the latter since it addresses both points. If your marriage cannot handle one additional child, then your marriage is not a good marriage. The concept of "for better or worse" doesn't apply. So, it would appear your husband has the view "for better or I'll dump you". He doesn't treasure you the way he should. However, if he DOES treasure you properly, then he can accept another mouth to feed that resulted from his own desires. It's all a matter of maturity. Is he committed to you for better or worse? If not the latter, then it may be only a matter of time before he leaves you.

    ----

    @Jen : Forcing her to have a child would likely just continue the cycle.

    Not necessarily. When confronted with a child, most people either grow up or run away.

    Let me take a rabbit trail here. Since the woman has the opportunity to avoid responsibility after the act, should the man have that same opportunity (i.e. declare the child not his and avoid child support)? If you answer yes, then you support equallity. But, most people would answer no. This reveals that people recognize the bad judgement in the act of abortion. Just think about this for a bit. Let it perculate.

    ----

    @Jen : you think they are okay before the heart is beating. If they are okay at 5 weeks, what's to stop abortions at 30 weeks? Or a newborn baby?

    You misunderstood my position. I DON'T think it is acceptable at 5 weeks. I just have more difficulty presenting empirical evidence (i.e. medical / courts) to support my position. I try to be very objective in my positions, which means that I must present emiprical evidence, rather than my feelings. BTW – when I was younger, I didn't see a problem with abortion. However, as I grew up, my views changed. I really abhor the idea that women should be used and cast aside after they age.

    My real concern is the impact to the woman. Years later, will she feel like a murderer? Will she wonder what the child would have been like (blond or redhead, extrovert or introvert, good at writing or math)? Will she feel used? etc.

    January 23, 2013 at 9:47 am |
    • Live4Him

      Correction: This implies that women are not doing it for enjoyment.

      Should read : This implies that women are not JUST doing it for enjoyment.

      January 23, 2013 at 9:50 am |
    • Saraswati

      "My real concern is the impact to the woman. Years later, will she feel like a murderer? Will she wonder what the child would have been like (blond or redhead, extrovert or introvert, good at writing or math)? Will she feel used? etc."

      No, it's not. If it were you would equally asks will she have a lower quality of life as a reault of having a child. If you look at the research, happiness actually decreases for most people when they have a child. It goes up for about 6 months and then stays down below the non-child trend until the kid leaves home. That's the reality borne out by years of research. Studies have also looked at the psychological well-being of women who had abortions and there is no negative impact. So if you want to be sure that women don't feel bad down the road, just stop spreading silly propaganda that a few poor women might be sucked into by their religious nutter families.

      January 23, 2013 at 9:52 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Research has shown that have nothing to worry your empty head about, Liver. A recent, very large study showed that women who choose to terminate a pregnancy are no more likely to suffer depression or any other mental illness than women who choose to continue a pregnancy.

      Kinda shoots your theory in the foot, huh?

      January 26, 2013 at 10:51 pm |
  8. Matlock

    So the Democrats kill babies (per their platform). So what's wrong with that?
    RC Sproul has a great post:
    http://www.ligonier.org/blog/pro-choice-what-does-it-mean/

    January 21, 2013 at 11:39 pm |
  9. Correctlycenter

    Godless people favor: Abortion, addictive alcohol, prescription drugs, illegal drugs(which they want legalized), violence, kids having kids, kids aborting kids, prohibiting Christianity (ACLU), taking bibles out of schools (like the 1960's) enpowering defiant and rebellious kids to take control over their parents (more Juvenile dentention centers) h o m o s e x u a l i t y (it's ok now, despite what God says about it)...

    January 21, 2013 at 4:18 pm |
    • SundogA

      No. We just favour not allowing you or anyone else to tell us what is or isn't acceptable in our own lives. Keep your morality; I have my own.

      January 21, 2013 at 5:21 pm |
  10. cken

    I wish no one would ever get an abortion. However if abortion is an issue of morality then it is a decision that rests between the pregnant person and her God, whatever she perceives God to be. It is not for me to judge her or legislate my view of morality on other people. This is particularly true because we don't know when life begins and more importantly we don't know when a fetus gets a soul. We euthanize our pets and other animals and don't consider it immoral because even though they are alive we don't believe they have a soul. shouldn't we use the same standard for a fetus? Killing a fetus would be immoral only after it has a soul.

    January 21, 2013 at 3:50 am |
    • Reality

      And the irony of ironies: (from a PowerPoint slide)

      IF THE PILL AND MALE CONDOMS WERE USED PROPERLY, ABORTION WOULD NOT BE AN ISSUE AND OBAMA WOULD NOT BE PRESIDENT.

      January 21, 2013 at 8:09 am |
  11. An Australian

    As an outsider looking in, it's sad that the country which claims to be the greatest democracy on Earth has so little separation of church and state.

    January 20, 2013 at 12:07 pm |
    • What?

      Your assuming every pro lifer is also religious, or is also conservative and it just isn't so.

      January 20, 2013 at 8:03 pm |
    • Jen

      Baloney. The overwhelming majority of anti-abortionists are Christian extremists, and they love their guns too.

      January 21, 2013 at 1:37 am |
    • cken

      What does democracy and separation of church and state have to do with each other?

      January 21, 2013 at 3:29 am |
  12. A conservative push for marriage equality

    More gay interludes = less conception= less abortion.

    Think about it.

    January 20, 2013 at 10:22 am |
    • Reality

      The most effective forms of contraception, ranked by "Perfect use":

      (-Abstinence, 0% failure rate)

      - (Masturbation, mono or mutual, 0% failure rate)

      Followed by:

      One-month injectable and Implant (both at 0.05 percent)
      Vasectomy and IUD (Mirena) (both at 0.1 percent)
      The Pill, Three-month injectable, and the Patch (all at 0.3 percent)
      Tubal sterilization (at 0.5 percent)
      IUD (Copper-T) (0.6 percent)
      Periodic abstinence (Post-ovulation) (1.0 percent)
      Periodic abstinence (Symptothermal) and Male condom (both at 2.0 percent)
      Periodic abstinence (Ovulation method) (3.0 percent)

      January 20, 2013 at 2:35 pm |
  13. Observer

    Here's a simple solution. If you feel like forcing someone into an unwanted romantic trist...don't do it.
    If you are volunteering to be in a romantic trist..don't be afraid to get your knees dirty.

    Pretty soon, no conceptions.

    January 19, 2013 at 9:08 pm |
  14. Reality

    Only for the new members of this blog:

    Why the Christian Right no longer matters in presidential elections:

    Once again, all the conservative votes in the country did not help the "pro-life" presidential candidate, Mitt Romney, in 2012 as the "Immoral Majority" rules the country and will be doing so for awhile. The "Immoral Majority" you ask?
    The fastest growing USA voting bloc: In 2008, the 70+ million "Roe vs. Wade mothers and fathers" of aborted womb-babies" whose ranks grow by two million per year i.e. 78+ million "IM" voters in 2012.

    2008 Presidential popular vote results:

    69,456,897 for pro-abortion/choice BO, 59,934,814 for "pro-life" JM.

    2012 Presidential popular vote results

    65,899,660 for pro-abortion/choice BO 60,929,152 for pro-life MR

    And the irony once again:

    And all because many women fail to take the Pill once a day or men fail to use a condom even though in most cases these men have them in their pockets. (maybe they should be called the "Stupid Majority"?)

    The failures of the widely used birth "control" methods i.e. the Pill and male condom have led to the large rate of abortions ( one million/yr) and S-TDs (19 million/yr) in the USA. Men and women must either recognize their responsibilities by using the Pill or condoms properly and/or use other safer birth control methods in order to reduce the epidemics of abortion and S-TDs.

    January 19, 2013 at 8:08 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Idiot, there is no "epidemic" of abortion. Abortion rates have dropped steadily. Do you really think your spam has made ANYONE more "aware?" What a silly man you are.

      January 19, 2013 at 9:38 am |
    • Skip Stealey

      I am a born again Christian, I do believe abortion is morally wrong, HOWEVER I am male, which means I will never have one nor need an abortion. and I have NO right to tell someone else what to do with their body. A woman makes this choice since its her body we are discussing, not mine nor any males. I would prefer she didn't as I am sure there are hundreds that wish I wouldn't smoke cigars too. None of their business, its between them/me and God. I do pray they find the Way but its personal and I can only tell them about Jesus, not force them to have faith. Faith is a gift you get when you ask for it.

      January 19, 2013 at 10:51 am |
    • Reality

      From the Guttmacher Inst-itute- August 2011

      "In 2008, 1.21 million abortions were performed, down from 1.31 million in 2000. However, between 2005 and 2008, the long-term decline in abortions stalled. From 1973 through 2008, nearly 50 million legal abortions occurred.[2]"

      i.e. making the number of Immoral Majority members more like 100 million in 2012.

      More from Guttmacher:

      "• Fifty-four percent of women who have abortions had used a contraceptive method (usually the condom or the pill) during the month they became pregnant. Among those women, 76% of pill users and 49% of condom users report having used their method inconsistently, while 13% of pill users and 14% of condom users report correct use.["

      And if half of these aborting "mothers and fathers" have had two abortions, the Immoral Majority would still be a huge voting bloc i.e. ~50 million, enough votes to give any presidential candidate the differential votes needed considering many voters vote straight Democratic or Republican tickets no matter what the issues are.

      January 19, 2013 at 12:44 pm |
    • Jen

      So are you assuming that all of the people that have abortions vote democrat? Even though Roe Vs. wade has remained legal under all the Republican presidents as well?

      Also, you assume that people vote based on the abortion issue and nothing else? And you assume that everyone that has an abortion votes? Including the people that have died since Roe Vs. Wade was passed and the teenagers that aren't allowed to vote? ( many of whom are the kids of the 'Christian' right). Hmmmm.."interesting logic you have. Of course you also assume birth control is 100 percent effective because you consistently say that abortion would be eradicated if birth control was used properly, something that smart people know is not true.

      Don't get me wrong, I think it would be great if the Christian right stopped having influence (or should I call them the stupid right?)

      January 19, 2013 at 2:10 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      And? What has happened SINCE 2008, Unreality? There is no "epidemic" of abortion. Your hysteria and hyperventilating are nonsensical. Abortion is declining as better contraceptives are more widely available and affordable. There will always be a need for legal abortion for women whose birth control fails or for whom pregnancy puts life or health at risk. And there will always be some women who have abortions for myriad other reasons, NONE of which are any of your business whatsoever.

      January 19, 2013 at 2:13 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      There is correlation between the state of the economy and the number of abortions. Abortions rise when the economy is bad. That rise doesn't make an "epidemic" no matter how much you'd like to pretend it is.

      What do you suppose would have occurred here had every one of those fetuses been born alive, Reality? They'd have been born to women who couldn't support them and didn't want them. Do you REALLY think we'd all be better off then?

      January 19, 2013 at 4:23 pm |
    • Reality

      The reality of se-x, abortion, contraception and STD/HIV control: – from an agnostic guy who enjoys intelligent se-x-

      Note: Some words hyphenated to defeat an obvious word filter. ...

      The Brutal Effects of Stupidity:

      : The failures of the widely used birth "control" methods i.e. the Pill (8.7% actual failure rate) and male con-dom (17.4% actual failure rate) have led to the large rate of abortions and S-TDs in the USA. Men and women must either recognize their responsibilities by using the Pill or co-ndoms properly and/or use safer methods in order to reduce the epidemics of abortion and S-TDs.- Failure rate statistics provided by the Gut-tmacher Inst-itute. Unfortunately they do not give the statistics for doubling up i.e. using a combination of the Pill and a condom.

      Added information before making your next move:

      from the CDC-2006

      "Se-xually transmitted diseases (STDs) remain a major public health challenge in the United States. While substantial progress has been made in preventing, diagnosing, and treating certain S-TDs in recent years, CDC estimates that approximately 19 million new infections occur each year, almost half of them among young people ages 15 to 24.1 In addition to the physical and psy-ch-ological consequences of S-TDs, these diseases also exact a tremendous economic toll. Direct medical costs as-sociated with STDs in the United States are estimated at up to $14.7 billion annually in 2006 dollars."

      And from:

      Consumer Reports, January, 2012

      "Yes, or-al se-x is se-x, and it can boost cancer risk-

      Here's a crucial message for teens (and all se-xually active "post-teeners": Or-al se-x carries many of the same risks as va-ginal se-x, including human papilloma virus, or HPV. And HPV may now be overtaking tobacco as the leading cause of or-al cancers in America in people under age 50.

      "Adolescents don’t think or-al se-x is something to worry about," said Bonnie Halpern-Felsher professor of pediatrics at the University of California, San Francisco. "They view it as a way to have intimacy without having 's-ex.'" (It should be called the Bill Clinton Syndrome !!)

      Obviously, political leaders in both parties, Planned Parenthood, parents, the "stupid part of the USA" and the educational system have failed miserably on many fronts.

      The most effective forms of contraception, ranked by "Perfect use":
      - (Abstinence, 0% failure rate)
      - (Masturbation, mono or mutual, 0% failure rate)
      Followed by:
      One-month injectable and Implant (both at 0.05 percent)
      Vasectomy and IUD (Mirena) (both at 0.1 percent)
      The Pill, Three-month injectable, and the Patch (all at 0.3 percent)
      Tubal sterilization (at 0.5 percent)
      IUD (Copper-T) (0.6 percent)
      Periodic abstinence (Post-ovulation) (1.0 percent)
      Periodic abstinence (Symptothermal) and Male condom (both at 2.0 percent)
      Periodic abstinence (Ovulation method) (3.0 percent)

      Every other method ranks below these, including Withdrawal (4.0), Female condom (5.0), Diaphragm (6.0), Periodic abstinence (calendar) (9.0), the Sponge (9.0-20.0, depending on whether the woman using it has had a child in the past), Cervical cap (9.0-26.0, with the same caveat as the Sponge), and Spermicides (18.0).

      January 19, 2013 at 5:32 pm |
    • Reality

      The major voting blocs in the USA:

      There are roughly 55 million registered Republicans. There are roughly 72 million registered Democrats. And there are roughly 42 million registered independents.

      And there are 40-100 million members of the Immoral Majority. The lower number taking into account those getting multiple abortions or death since Roe vs. Wade or being teenagers.

      And now we know why Obama/Axelrod ran two weeks of non-stop pro-choice/abortion ads before the election.

      January 19, 2013 at 5:45 pm |
    • Reality

      Regarding epidemics:

      As per Guttmacher:

      There are 62 million U.S. women are in their childbearing years (15–44) and 43 million of those are se-xually active. The CDC gives no real percentages required for epidemics. In the UK, an epidemic is defined as over 1000 cases in 100,000 visits to a general practioner i.e. 1%. http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and.../outbreaks_vs_epidemics.html

      1 million abortions/yr divided by 43 million = 1.2%

      19 million cases of S-TDs/yr divided by 86 million (factoring in the male component) = 22%

      In

      January 19, 2013 at 6:06 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      TLDR. There is no epidemic of abortions, you moron.

      January 19, 2013 at 6:08 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      I don't believe abortion is immoral. I don't believe women who have abortions are immoral.

      Prove otherwise, Unreal ding-dong.

      January 19, 2013 at 6:09 pm |
    • Jen

      Are you actually referring to yourself as the agnostic??? I hope not. Agnostics don't refer to the Christian right as 'moral'.

      You've got fun die written all over you.

      January 19, 2013 at 6:11 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Oh, and from my glance at your interminable post, Unreal, Obama ran pro-choice ads because Romney and Ryan ran on an anti-choice platform. Ryan thinks that even ra pe and incest are not reasons for legal abortion.

      And guess what, doofus? THEY LOST. Women do not want the government dictating what medical decisions they should make anymore than YOU want the government telling YOU that you MUST donate an organ to someone else even if you don't wish to do so. The principle is the same, idiot. Women have a right to choose because they are equal citizens. They do not give up their rights to privacy or bodily integrity just because they happen to get pregnant.

      You and your nonsensical railing about the "Immoral Majority" are simply irrelevant. Nobody cares what you think about someone else's decisions regarding pregnancy, Unreal Unintelligent.

      There is nothing "immoral" about supporting choice. If you can't grasp that, tough sh!t for you.

      January 19, 2013 at 6:15 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Doesn't he, though? And you have to know Reality is male. I love how he thinks that abortions are caused by "stupidity." As if reading statistics will allow him to know the details of people's private lives and private hells. Reality has not a CLUE what some people endure in their lives. No one can know what someone else's life is like or what is best for her. She is the only one qualified to decide, no matter what Unreal Unintelligent says.

      January 19, 2013 at 6:18 pm |
    • Jen

      Forget the fact that if people did vote for Romney because they wanted abortion overturned they are stupid. Romney had no intention on overturning R v. W. He was pro choice when he was governor of MA.

      January 19, 2013 at 6:20 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Reality lives in a dream world. He idiotically thinks he's performing a public service by posting his little brochures online.

      What a friggin' dolt.

      January 19, 2013 at 10:15 pm |
    • Reality

      Obviously, some here failed to note the numbers presented on the epidemics of abortion and STDs. Scroll up the page and review one more time.

      And one more time:

      Men and women must either recognize their responsibilities by using the Pill or co-ndoms properly and/or use safer methods in order to reduce the epidemics of abortion and S-TDs.- Failure rate statistics provided by the Gut-tmacher Inst-itute.

      And for some added calculations:

      As per the Guttmacher Insti-tute, the Pill fails to protect women 8.7% during the first year of use (from the same reference previously shown, Actuall the number was rounded to 9% in Guttmacher's 2012 review).

      i.e. 0.087 (failure rate)
      x 62 million (# child bearing women)
      x 0.62 ( % of these women using contraception )
      x 0.306 ( % of these using the pill) =

      1,020,000 unplanned pregnancies
      during the first year of pill use.

      For male condoms (failure rate of 17.4 and 18% use level)

      1,200,000 unplanned pregnancies during the first year of male condom use.

      The Gut-tmacher Inst-itute (same reference) notes also that the perfect use of the pill should result in a 0.3% failure rate
      (35,000 unplanned pregnancies) and for the male condom, a 2% failure rate (138,000 unplanned pregnancies).

      January 20, 2013 at 12:10 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Post all the numbers you want, Unreal. There is no epidemic of abortion. You're full of crap.

      January 20, 2013 at 11:47 am |
    • Reality

      Obviously, some here are not good at math or at accepting reliable references like those promulgated by the Guttmacher Insti-tute.

      January 20, 2013 at 12:47 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Obvious troll is boring.

      January 20, 2013 at 6:11 pm |
    • ztom

      So are you saying all Americans vote based on their pro-life/pro-choice stance exclusively? I know that a few do, but aren't there other issues facing America today that could sway the election towards one candidate or another?

      January 23, 2013 at 9:08 am |
  15. Live4Him

    @Jen : If you not a hypocrite Live4him you would answer the question I have repeated to you several times of whether you consider an abortion before 5-6 weeks (before the heart starts beating) okay?

    Jen, I have a life outside of these forums. I always get more posts than I can answer, but I'm always willing to discuss honest and logical issues. However, I don't always see the post. That said, I'll address your issue now, but on the abortion forum.

    Abortion is not just about the taking of the child's life. It is a bigger issue. It is about the devaluation of people too. I consider abortion to be murder – but I will admit that I waiver on this subset issue (i.e. murder) if it is prior to the heartbeat. However, the underlying issue is still unresolved. The larger issue is the devaluation of people – women are only s.ex objects for the man's "fun" and men are only banks for women. I see ALL people to be special. The only reason an abortion would be desired prior to 7 weeks is if the woman had been promiscuous and slept with the wrong man. Women try to justify abortion by treating it as a logical solution that stems from an emotional mistake. But women sleep with men because they want to be considered special. If they were treated special, they wouldn't want to give up the child.

    Here's something that I posted previously, but you may have missed:

    Why do I consider abortion to be morally wrong?

    1) It stills a beating heart. Almost every abortion occurs after the heart starts beating.
    2) Abortion is a symptom of a larger issue – promiscuity.
    ___ a) While s.ex is fun, the underlying motivation is self-esteem : Does this person think I'm special?
    ___ b) Movies, TV and society as a whole, pushes the message that women are not special unless they are "pretty".
    ___ c) Similar messages are directed to men: They are not special unless they are "strong" or "rich".
    ___ d) Contrary to popular belief, promiscuity only undermines a person's self-esteem – "They only want to use me."
    3) Once taking a life for convenience becomes acceptable in society, then everyone's life is in question.
    ___ a) Logan's Run (depicting a society where only those younger than 21 lived, while those older died) becomes a possibility. All that is needed is "proper justification".

    January 19, 2013 at 7:38 am |
    • Live4Him

      Well, I'm signing off now

      January 19, 2013 at 7:49 am |
    • Jen

      Well I appreciate your answer (that's why I asked the question – because I have seen your post including number one several times).

      As for number two, while I agree with you to a certain extent, I would disagree that everyone having s-x who does not want a baby is doing it for self esteem. I did not get married until my thirties (much like many people are doing), and I certainly was emotionally ready to have s-x long before that time. I had s-x because I enjoy it – nothing to do with societal pressure. I just didn't WANT a child. Now that I am married and have three children, again, I just DON'T WANT any more children. I have had a tubal libation, but it could still fail. What is your solution? Not to have s-x with my husband? That is an impractical solution as we both know (and you should well know that many married women have abortions). It would likely lead to the demise of our marriage – not really fair to our children and potentially would be a trigger for a child's later self esteem issues. And as for a teen getting pregnant. Forcing her to have a child would likely just continue the cycle.

      As for number three (the slippery slope argument), Saraswati covered it (if you allow 18 year olds the vote, next you will allow 4 year olds). The fact is that you draw the line before the law does. You believe it is when the heart starts beating and the law is more in line with when the brain starts functioning (which falls more in line with the definition of murder – which includes the description of cessation of brain activity). The overwhelming number of abortions are in the first trimester (long before there is cognitive function – and doctors won't perform late abortions without a medical reason).

      As for the slippery slope – you think they are okay before the heart is beating. If they are okay at 5 weeks, what's to stop abortions at 30 weeks? Or a newborn baby?

      January 19, 2013 at 8:40 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Are you daft? You think that the only thing preventing euthanasia is making abortion more difficult to get or illegal? And you use a movie as your source of information? Come on.

      January 19, 2013 at 9:40 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Abortion has been legal far longer than it was illegal. Do you see euthanasia being legalized in state after state? No, of course you don't. But that won't stop you and those who think as you do from using the slippery slope fallacy to bolster your argument.

      January 19, 2013 at 9:48 am |
  16. Douglas

    It is time to move toward a general quarantine of the AIDS infected, who with careless abandon and zeal
    seek out the innocent to infect.

    Demand a general quarantine from your public health officials.

    Accept nothing less!

    Stop the discrimination against celibate LGBTQ, now!

    January 19, 2013 at 6:51 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Bozo.

      January 19, 2013 at 9:49 am |
    • Sleuth

      Can I demand a public quarantine of you, Douglas?
      You bigoted ass hole, stop trying to deny your latent h0m0s exuality and live your life already, such as it is, you craven moron.

      January 19, 2013 at 9:19 pm |
  17. Argument from Ignorance

    as long u guys keep "praying" for change, i have no problem lol.. but please refrain from doing anything practical.. thats where i will disagree with u all.

    January 18, 2013 at 11:38 pm |
  18. lol??

    "Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ. "

    January 18, 2013 at 7:28 pm |
  19. lol??

    "2Ti 2:8 Remember that Jesus Christ of the seed of David was raised from the dead according to my gospel: "

    January 18, 2013 at 7:25 pm |
    • End Religion

      lol, pimping bible passages for 2000+ years has gotten your pathetic religion where it is today... worthless, weak and dying off. Good plan!

      January 18, 2013 at 7:33 pm |
  20. lol??

    "Rom 1:3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; "

    January 18, 2013 at 7:23 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.