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Who is on God's side of the marriage debate?
March 25th, 2013
11:00 PM ET

Who is on God's side of the marriage debate?

By Dan Merica, CNN

Washington (CNN) – As the Supreme Court considers two major same-sex marriage cases that could change marriage in the United States, religious leaders on both sides of the debate believe they are on God's side of the contentious issue.

In the months leading up to this week's Supreme Court hearings, religious leaders from across the country have held prayer vigils and rallies for their respective causes.

At each event, even those with diametrically opposed views, leaders cite biblical principles as the foundation for their beliefs.

"I believe I am on God's side," Dr. Richard Land, president of The Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission and and opponent of same-sex marriage, told CNN. "I have no question in what God says marriage is."

"I do think we are on God's side because my idea of God is someone that is loving," said the Rev. Gary Hall, dean of the Washington National Cathedral and a proponent of same-sex marriage. "My understanding is that kind of God that loves everyone and wants everyone to live a joyful life."

This week, the Supreme Court will hear two cases. One will examine the constitutionality of Proposition 8, a law that prohibited same-sex marriage in California, and the other will test the Defense of Marriage Act, the 1996 legislation that forbids the recognition of same-sex marriages nationwide and bars married gay and lesbian couples from receiving federal benefits.

Marriage and the Supreme Court: Five things to watch

Land and Hall each have actively worked on his side of this debate.

Hall, after taking the reins at the National Cathedral in 2012, decided to marry same-sex couples in the historic church. Land, who has counseled Republican presidents and members of Congress, has written and spoken at length about why same-sex marriage goes against biblical principles.

And although they both believe in the Bible, their opinions on how the text views same-sex marriage are shaped by their views on how literally to read the holy book.

"I come from a tradition that looks at the big story," said Hall, an Episcopalian. "The image of Jesus in the Bible is of someone who really makes everyone welcome, and it is from that perspective that I operate."

Hall acknowledges, however, that the Bible isn't the only guide for this belief.

"Our argument is not entirely scriptural-based," Hall said, after acknowledging passages of the holy book that define marriage as being between a man and a woman. "There is no place in the Bible that I can point to that says Jesus performed a same-sex marriage or anything like that."

In addition to scripture, Hall said, "tradition and reason" anchor his belief that same-sex couples should be allowed to wed. There are about 2 million Episcopalians in the United States.

CNN Belief: My Take: Will gay rights infringe on religious liberty?

Land, on the other hand, cites the chapters and verses that guide his views on same-sex marriage.

"The people who take a more conservative view of the Bible and believe that they are under the authority of scripture almost universally oppose same-sex marriage," Land said about people who agree with him.

For Land, this view is not only consistent but  also roots his belief in "traditional values" and his disgust with "moral relativism."

Land, a Southern Baptist, continued: "The people who are religious and support same-sex marriage tend to take a Dalmatian view of scripture. They believe the Bible is divine in spots, and they think they can spot the spots."

If the Supreme Court decides in favor of same-sex marriage, Land said, the decision would be on par with the court's 1973 decision on Roe v. Wade, which affirmed a woman's right to an abortion.

"I think it will evoke a similar reaction," Land said.

Southern Baptists count 16 million members in the United States.

CNN Poll: 'Rob Portman effect' fuels support for same-sex marriage

This split over the biblical reasoning behind each side of the marriage debate extends beyond just Land and Hall, however. Churches around the country have been divided on the issue, with some choosing to allow same-sex marriage and others to forbid it.

The Rev. Jacqui Lewis, the senior minister at Middle Collegiate Church in New York who has worked with the Gay and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation on same-sex marriage, comes down in favor of same-sex marriage.

She uses the Bible - and civil rights - in her reasoning.

"I don't think that people who are supporting gay marriage need to distance themselves from the Bible in needing to find support," Lewis said. When asked about how the Bible anchors her beliefs, she cited Mark 12:31: "Love your neighbor as yourself."

On the other side of the argument is Robert Gagnon, a biblical scholar at Pittsburgh Theological Seminary who has worked with the Family Research Council on the issue.

"Only a woman is a true sexual compliment to a man and vice versa," said Gagnon, citing Genesis 1:27 and Genesis 2:24, along with the Gospels of Mark and Matthew, as the reasoning behind his view on same-sex marriage.

"That is why a man leaves his father and mother and is united to his wife, and they become one flesh," reads Genesis 2:24.

As for how he feels about people such as Hall who use the Bible to defend their position in support of same-sex marriage: "You are rejecting Jesus himself. ... Just go ahead and make up your own religion."

- Dan Merica

Filed under: Belief • Christianity • Gay marriage • Politics

soundoff (2,640 Responses)
  1. Joe

    God doesn't exist. Move on.

    March 26, 2013 at 7:50 pm |
    • Anon

      Except in the overactive imagination of the believers who apparently can't or won't differentiate between desert myths and reality.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:57 pm |
  2. Unintelligent Designer

    God is on the side of marriage equality for all, or else she would not have made gay & lesbian couples with the desire & ability to raise children.

    March 26, 2013 at 7:38 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      Are you being sarcastic?

      March 26, 2013 at 7:42 pm |
    • Unintelligent Designer

      I'm just shoehorning my God into reality.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:55 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      Your god is just as good as any other god.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:00 pm |
    • Lola Bunch

      As there is a plethora of children languishing in orphanages and foster care, He should be happy. Doesn't appear the straight couples are able to take up the slack.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:11 pm |
  3. The bigger question is

    What impact do these decisions have on future generations? God has given mankind the freedom of choice, it is upto man to make wise choices and decisions.

    March 26, 2013 at 7:25 pm |
    • Jane

      Oh no, another moron trying to make a free will argument for his sky fairy. So is your BOMITS omniscient or not?

      March 26, 2013 at 7:34 pm |
    • Mr. Reality

      What do mean god has given mankind the freedom to choose? How do you know what your god has done? You need to first demonstrate your god then we can get to its wishes and desires. Far as future generations go, Ima take a wild guess and say society will be much better once everybody is treated equally under the law.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:52 pm |
    • Laws

      Some fools think there are no consequence to the choices they make in life.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:54 pm |
    • Gave Them Up

      Tell me Mr. Know it all Mr. R, where did you come up with the idea of law and what is its purpose?

      March 26, 2013 at 7:57 pm |
    • Lola Bunch

      And what decisions are you talking about? Gay marriage? To the faithful, none. To the ones asking for equal civil rights, the freedom to be who they are without discrimination, unless the self-righteous persist in persecuting gay people. Why? What do YOU think is going to happen?

      March 26, 2013 at 8:00 pm |
    • Prime rib

      Who is talking about the rights of bi sexuals? The rights if polygamists? who decides what marriage should and should not be? you???

      March 26, 2013 at 8:14 pm |
  4. Gave Them Up

    Atheists have a common trait with the perversion community. Give them anonymous posting ability and they think the entire world is a restroom for graffiti.

    March 26, 2013 at 7:23 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      Well since you are so christian.......Who are you? What is your real name? Where do you live? Don't worry god will protect you.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:26 pm |
    • Gave Them Up

      What's with all the questions? Atheists have all the answers.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:31 pm |
    • Lola Bunch

      Says the guy named "Gave Them Up", who is posting....anonymously.
      Who also has a burning need to make ridiculous sweeping generalizations. What an ass.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:31 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      @gave them up.................Ironic you wont give up your name mr. anonymous. Atheists don't claim to have all the answers. Atheists don't believe YOU (Christians) have all the answers like you claim you do.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:35 pm |
    • Gave Them Up

      Oh yeah?! Women should ride side saddle and quit hanging around with her friend Flicker. It's too exhausting for marital life. Did you know that?

      March 26, 2013 at 7:43 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      @Gave........When backed into a corner. Come up with gibberish.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:51 pm |
    • sam stone

      More inbred Christian blather. Jeebus is waiting to fill your silky mouth with his gooey savior goodness. Get back on your knees, b1tch

      March 26, 2013 at 7:52 pm |
    • Gave Them Up

      The whole world is their restroom, even space!

      March 26, 2013 at 7:54 pm |
    • Lola Bunch

      "Oh yeah?! Women should ride side saddle and quit hanging around with her friend Flicker. It’s too exhausting for marital life. Did you know that?"
      It sounds as if you are well-versed in perversion, since you seem to study it so diligently. I suggest getting back in your DeLorian, McFly.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:06 pm |
    • sam stone

      That's the point I was making, Robert. Free will is inconsistent with an omniscient god. Your distinction between "absolute free will" and "limited free will" is absurd since 1. You cannot establish that "god" exists and 2. You cannot establish that this "god" interferes with human behavior. It is a bit like arguing how man angels can dance on the head of a pin

      March 27, 2013 at 6:17 am |
    • sam stone

      That was supposed to be for Robert, below

      March 27, 2013 at 6:20 am |
  5. SeilnoigileR

    So we're apparently given 'free will' then immediately told to give it up and do exactly as some deity instructs or you burn forever. That's slavery, so if that's what you want, go for it. Not I.

    If god created the universe and is 100% good, then where did evil come from since he created EVERYTHING? Logically, that means he created evil as well as good.

    Why would an all-loving, all-powerfull creator make a side bet with the 'devil' on whether or not a follower would forsake god when he's submitted to all kinds of torment? What was the prize they bet on?

    Noah and rainbows – did the laws of physics change?

    Adam & Eve – how could a species survive with only 2 progenitors?

    Revelations – now that's just the rantings of someone on a really, really bad acid trip.

    Paul was a misogynistic jerk who never met Jesus in person – just figured out that he could take the movement and use it for his own ends. Ever notice how NOT like Jesus his writing are?

    Faith is just as good as icing what your dog leaves behind and calling it a cake.

    March 26, 2013 at 7:15 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      SeilnoigileR,

      “So we're apparently given 'free will' then immediately told to give it up and do exactly as some deity instructs or you burn forever. That's slavery, so if that's what you want, go for it. Not I.”

      You are given limited free will. You may do as you please, unless God decides to stop you, he may, he may not. You are presented with a gift. You are free to accept it, or not. If you accept it, then you can really be free, if you reject it you will never really be free, you will be a slave to your sin.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:27 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      SeilnoigileR,

      “If god created the universe and is 100% good, then where did evil come from since he created EVERYTHING? Logically, that means he created evil as well as good.”

      God created self conscious beings with free will, capable of doing most anything, good or bad. God also created angels, apparently with free will also. One of them and his buddies decided that they would take over. It isn’t working out to well for them.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:32 pm |
    • Jill

      Robert Brown, phhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooot. Sneeze more diligently. Often, the pertinent cat presents fabled necessities in the parking chamfer. Realize your net precedent. Triangulate! Save the best for the alligators. Ever the bastille notches the orchestra but Wendy is not green and horses will capitulate. Filter out the log from the turnstile and cry prevalently.

      So there brown stare. Feed your inner walnut and resolve. Subject your lemon to the ingenious door in the presence of snow and animals. Aisle 7 is for the monetary cheese whiz. Faced with the kitchen, you may wish to prolong the sailboat in the cliff. Otherwise, rabbits may descend on your left nostril. Think about how you can stripe the sea.

      Regale the storm to those who (6) would thump the parrot with the armband. Corner the market on vestiges of the apparent closure but seek not the evidential circumstance. Therein you can find indignant mountains of pigs and apples. Descend eloquently as you debate the ceiling of your warning fulcrum. Vacate the corncob profusely and and don’t dote on the pancreas.

      Next up, control your wood. Have at the cat with your watch on the fore. Aft! Smarties (12)! Rome wasn’t kevetched in an autumn nightie. (42) See yourself for the turntable on the escalator. Really peruse the garage spider definitely again again with brown. Now we have an apparent congestion, so be it here. Just a moment is not a pod of beef for the ink well nor can it be (4) said that Karen was there in the millpond.

      Garbage out just like the candle in the kitty so. Go, go, go until the vacuum meets the upward vacation. Sell the yellow. Then trim the bus before the ten cheese please Louise. Segregate from the koan and stew the ship vigorously.

      And remember, never pass up an opportunity to watch an elephant paint Mozart.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:32 pm |
    • Anon

      Free will is a paradoxical impossibility according to the omni-attributes of Abrahamic desert deity but that doesn't impede apologists from making crap up and ad infinitum.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:34 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      SeilnoigileR,

      "Why would an all-loving, all-powerfull creator make a side bet with the 'devil' on whether or not a follower would forsake god when he's submitted to all kinds of torment? What was the prize they bet on?"

      No bets, just war. Ever read the bible?

      March 26, 2013 at 7:35 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      SeilnoigileR,

      “Noah and rainbows – did the laws of physics change?”

      From what we think we know today, has there been many changes in our planet in it’s history?

      March 26, 2013 at 7:38 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      Free will doesn't change a thing. If god created you to be good, then you should freely choose good behavior over bad every time. That point is moot anyway, since free will does not exist under a christian paradigm as Anon points out.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:39 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      @Rob..................You have read the bible? Has it solves all your issues? It couldn't have because you've been writing tooth fairy nonsense. With all the praying that goes on, It's a wonder we have any problems in the world.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:40 pm |
    • Bob

      fred, get off your disgusting high horse stance. Just about everyone in the western world has had to read your nasty Christian book of tall tales. Let's take a look at what it really demands that you do, as a Christian blood cult member:

      Numbers 31:17-18
      17 Now kiII all the boys. And kiII every woman who has slept with a man,
      18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

      Deuteronomy 13:6 – “If your brother, your mother’s son or your son or daughter, or the wife you cherish, or your friend who is as your own soul entice you secretly, saying, let us go and serve other gods … you shall surely kill him; your hand shall be first against him to put him to death”

      Revelations 2:23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

      Leviticus 25
      44 “‘Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves.
      45 You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property.
      46 You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.

      Note that the bible is also very clear that you should sacrifice and burn an animal today because the smell makes sicko Christian sky fairy happy. No, you don't get to use the parts for food. You burn them, a complete waste of the poor animal.

      Yes, the bible really says that, everyone. Yes, it's in Leviticus, look it up. Yes, Jesus purportedly said that the OT commands still apply. No exceptions. But even if you think the OT was god's mistaken first go around, you have to ask why a perfect, loving enti-ty would ever put such horrid instructions in there. If you think rationally at all, that is.

      And then, if you disagree with my interpretation, ask yourself how it is that your "god" couldn't come up with a better way to communicate than a book that is so readily subject to so many interpretations and to being taken "out of context", and has so many mistakes in it. Pretty pathetic god that you've made for yourself.

      So get out your sacrificial knife or your nasty sky creature will torture you eternally. Or just take a closer look at your foolish supersti-tions, understand that they are just silly, and toss them into the dustbin with all the rest of the gods that man has created.

      Ask the questions. Break the chains. Join the movement.
      Be free of Christianity and other superstitions.
      http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/

      March 26, 2013 at 7:40 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      SeilnoigileR,
      “Adam & Eve – how could a species survive with only 2 progenitors?”

      This is an assumption from the limited information we were given. Where did Cains wife come from?

      March 26, 2013 at 7:42 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Anon,

      You can make that argument if you start with a hypothetical absolute free will. There are many examples in the bible that point to limited free will, instead of absolute.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:46 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      “Noah and rainbows – did the laws of physics change?”

      From what we think we know today, has there been many changes in our planet in it’s history?
      ----------------------------------------

      So physical change = Changing laws of physics. Religies never cease to amuse.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:47 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      TANK!!!!,

      Gods creation was good. He created good intelligent beings who were capable of most anything.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:49 pm |
    • SeilnoigileR

      Yes, I have read the bible. I was a member of an Assembly of God church for over a decade as a teen/young adult. Royal Rangers (the christian Boy Scouts), church 3-5 times a week, etc. I came to the conclusion that the reason people join is for the feeling of community, unity and 'we're better than everyone else' fee-good mentality. To explain away the rainbow thing as 'things just change' is beyond inane btw. If the bible were written today as a work of fiction, most christians would have protests and book burnings from all the violence and inces t that's in it. It's basically a way for a group of people (and we humans love our groups/tribes) to feel superior to everyone else and provides a 'reference' guide that provides enough loopholes for its own inconsistencies to make a lawyer drool.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:49 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Ken Margo,

      The problems in the world will continue, until Jesus comes again.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:51 pm |
    • Anon

      As I said apologists making crap up ad infinitum to defend their imaginary omni-atribute desert deity.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:53 pm |
    • sam stone

      Ooooh, a "slave to sin"....pretty darn scary.

      Robert, did you ever consider standing on your own feet and not being a snivelling sycophant?

      March 26, 2013 at 7:55 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      "He created good intelligent beings who were capable of most anything."

      If they were good, they wouldn't have sinned. If they were that intelligent, they would not have trusted a talking reptile over an omniscient god whose existence they could prove (unlike nowadays) because he friggin' TALKED to them face to face. Somebody must have implanted a propensity towards sin and illogic into them, and it must have been the guy who made them. And yet, this same guy threatens to torture you for eternity if you can't deviate from a nature he obviously implanted into you himself. Yay for christianity!

      March 26, 2013 at 7:57 pm |
    • sam stone

      Robert: Free will does not exist if there is an omniscient god. Try again

      March 26, 2013 at 7:58 pm |
    • SeilnoigileR

      Oh, Robert Brown, just FYI, your 'answers' to the questions I posed were not answers. They were simply the standard christian talking points. Nothing factual at all. Nothing concrete. All conjecture and 'faith'. I simply do not believe that a group of people from the Middle East could possibly contain everything that a divine being capable of creating this incredible universe in one, rather poorly written, book. It was simply a way of imposing what were, at the time, good guidelines for a peacable society. Instead of trying to explain why some things were bad to do, why not say there's a 'god' who told them to tell you (hearsay!) what you should and should not do.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:00 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      SeilnoigileR,
      There are serious problems with organized religion see Mathew 23 for what Jesus thought of it in his day.

      I won’t post the whole thing here (it bothers jill), but if Noahs flood bothers you so much try reading it as a parable.

      If you think that the human family has changed much since old testament days watch the national news for a few minutes.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:01 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Anon,
      God doesn’t need any defense from little ole me.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:06 pm |
    • Anon

      Then why be apologetic in the first place while defending a desert myth?

      March 26, 2013 at 8:09 pm |
    • SeilnoigileR

      Robert Brown

      Family hasn't changed since OT times? Correct me if I'm wrong, but back then most men had multiple wives (Solomon?) and brothers were supposed to procreate with the widows of their deceased siblings. Just a touch different from today, I'd say. The God of the OT condoned incest (Noah), genocide (any number of groups), polygamy and any number of other acts that we'd consider heinous today by any standard. So yes, things are a LOT different now.

      Oh, and explain how Methusela lived to be 969 years old, but all records indicate that humans lived much shorter lifespans than today and we don't even get close to that? You don't even need to be a religious scholar to find numerous inconsistencies in the book christians claim is the 'true word of god'. I also really wouldn't want to spend eternity with about 99% of those claiming they're going to heaven. Now that would be eternal torment.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:10 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      sam stone,

      Darn it sam, quit calling me a sycophant, I had to go look it up again!!!!!!!!!
      From Merriam-Webster
      a person who flatters another in order to get ahead

      March 26, 2013 at 8:13 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      @Rob...........And when is Jesus going to show up?

      March 26, 2013 at 8:15 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      TANK!!!!,

      We can’t help it, even those who God reveals himself to, still sin. The flesh versus the spirit.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:15 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      sam stone,
      Limited free will

      March 26, 2013 at 8:17 pm |
    • Anon

      Well how can you tell between limited and absolute free will?

      March 26, 2013 at 8:22 pm |
    • sam stone

      robert: calling it "limited free will" doesn't make your argument any more valid. if god knows what we are going to do from the beginning, and god cannot be wrong, then we have no choice

      March 26, 2013 at 8:22 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      SeilnoigileR,

      I can’t prove God to you, only God can do that, and I believe he will do it. Could anyone really believe unless God revealed himself to them?

      March 26, 2013 at 8:23 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Anon,

      I don’t see it as being apologetic, more like sharing my ideas on God, kind of like you sharing yours.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:25 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      "We can’t help it,"

      Because god made us this way. Why couldn't he have made us so we could help it? After all, we were made to be 100% good!

      March 26, 2013 at 8:28 pm |
    • Anon

      So the only thing that matters is complete absolute faith while using mental gymnastics to ignore anything and everything that goes against the Abrahamaic desert deity. In other words I'll probably need a cerebral aneurism in order to believe in Yahweh/Jesus/Jehovah/Allah/etc.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:28 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      SeilnoigileR,

      I don’t think because things are in the bible that it means God condoned them, just the opposite. Those things happened then and they happen now.
      I can’t explain how someone lived almost a thousand years, no one can. There aren’t any inconsistencies in the bible, lack of understanding yes, inconsistencies no. Have you ever read any really good bible commentary? There are some good ones by folks who can read Hebrew and Greek, it really helps.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:44 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Anon,

      Limited=God can and does intervene.

      Absolute=God can, but will not intervene.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:47 pm |
    • Anon

      Classic apologetics: The bible is true because it says so.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:48 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      sam stone,

      God knowing what you will do, does not prevent him from letting you do it.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:49 pm |
    • Anon

      A modern day version of Epicurus
      "Either God can do nothing to stop catastrophes, or he doesn't care or he doesn't exist. God is either impotent, evil or imaginary. Tale your pick, and choose wisely."
      -Sam Harris

      March 26, 2013 at 8:51 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      TANK!!!!,

      Do you really want to be a robot?

      March 26, 2013 at 8:51 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Anon,
      Mental gymnastics, I try to avoid those because just in case you couldn’t tell, I’m not very mentally athletic.

      I wouldn’t believe either, if God hadn’t revealed himself to me and continued to affirm and reaffirm my faith. If God is what you are looking for, he will find you.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:56 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Ken Margo,

      Jesus will show up right on time. He hasn’t shared his schedule with me so I don’t know when.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:58 pm |
    • Anon

      Was christian for 20+ years. Reading the bible and researching comparative religion completely obliterated any chance of me in becoming a follower of the Abrahamic deity ever again. INB4 the classic not a true christian like many say to me a lot.

      March 26, 2013 at 9:02 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      @ Robert Brown No. You know what else I don't want to be? A sinner. Unfortunately, according to your own reasoning, god has implanted the 'Sin' feature in my design, therefore I have no choice. I don't want to be a robot, but god has planned that I should sin without consulting me. Therefore, according to christianity, I am a robot. Yay for christianity again! The crazy doctrines just keep getting better!

      March 26, 2013 at 9:02 pm |
    • sam stone

      "God knowing what you will do, does not prevent him from letting you do it."

      Huh?

      God knowing what I will do, and his inability to be wrong mean I cannot do other than what he knows I will do. Therefore no free will. If I have a choice of A or B, and an omniscient god knows I will choose B, what are the chances I will choose A and prove this omniscient god wrong? (Hint for you statistically impaired: It is ZERO)

      March 26, 2013 at 9:03 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      @ Robert Brown No. You know what else I don't want to be? A sinner. Unfortunately, according to your own reasoning, god has implanted the 'Sin' feature in my design ( and the design is 100% good). Therefore I have no choice. I don't want to be a robot, but god has planned that I should sin without consulting me. Therefore, according to christianity, I am a robot. Yay for christianity again! The crazy doctrines just keep getting better!

      March 26, 2013 at 9:03 pm |
    • sam stone

      "God knowing what you will do, does not prevent him from letting you do it."

      How can he prevent me from doing what he knows I will do?

      Logic is not your strong suit, is it?

      March 26, 2013 at 9:06 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      I second Sam's comment. If god knows that a person is going to sin even before he creates that person, then the created individual cannot deviate from god's plan, or else god would not be omniscient. God further enables the sinful behavior by CREATING the person in the first place. Why would any intelligent designer create something if he KNEW for sure that it would break down eventually?

      March 26, 2013 at 9:09 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Anon,

      Catastrophe
      I believe he exists and cares. People call God evil because he allows catastrophes. There are several examples in the bible, we may not like it or understand it now, but we know he is in control. Would an eternal being put as much weight on our short existence in the flesh as we do? Is around a hundred years comparable to eternity?

      March 26, 2013 at 9:09 pm |
    • Anon

      Looks like ever loving and all benevolent goes out the window as well.

      March 26, 2013 at 9:15 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Anon,

      There are lots of folks posting on here who were Christians. In the parable of the sower Jesus explained having faith and losing it. The enemies are the same for those who believe and those who do not, the world, the flesh, and the devil. God has the power to conquer all three, whether you believed and no longer believe, or you never have. No one can really believe and continue to do so, without a reason.

      March 26, 2013 at 9:27 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      TANK!!!!,

      You have the sin feature, because you are in the flesh. God offers you the cure for this feature whether you believe he gave it to you, or not. What would be worse would be a defect without a fix. You may say what would be better would be no defect at all, then you wouldn’t have any free will and your back to the robot again.

      March 26, 2013 at 9:35 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      Robert- "No one can really believe and continue to do so, without a reason." Then may the one who began this good work in us carry it on to completion until the day of umm..... any day now... what was the reason, again?

      March 26, 2013 at 9:36 pm |
    • Anon

      According to my christianese deciphering tome that translates into, "You were never a true christian".
      Your primitive desert religions has retarded generation after generation and it kills you that people are slowly realizing that it's all a complete and utter farce.

      March 26, 2013 at 9:36 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      sam stone,
      Therefore, no hypothetical absolute free will.

      March 26, 2013 at 9:39 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      So the flesh is the sin feature, and it was designed by god. Nobody held a gun to his head and told him to put me in sinful flesh, did they? So you must admit god is at fault here.

      Now tell me: would you purposefully build a house out of crappy materials, just so it could decay and collapse so that you could build it again, or would you build it out of sturdy materials so that it would NOT decay at all? If you would choose the latter option, why couldn't god? Why did he make me a sinful creature just so he could pop out and save the day by offering salvation? Couldn't he have done a better job the first time around?

      March 26, 2013 at 9:48 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      sam stone,
      Logic is not my strong suit.

      I say limited free will because from mine on experience I believe he influenced my choice. I don’t believe I could have chosen otherwise. What I don’t and can’t know is what another person would have done under the same circu.mstances.

      March 26, 2013 at 9:51 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Tom, Tom, the Other One,

      What gives us confidence in this good work he has begun in us is the good work, being born again.

      March 26, 2013 at 10:01 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Anon,

      There is no way, even if you told me, that I could know for sure what you experienced. I can’t and don’t want to judge you. You may remember we aren’t supposed to do that. You said you were a Christian and I believe you thought you were and for all I know you may still be a Christian. It is really between you and God.

      Here are few questions you can answer for yourself. You don’t need to reply with your answers, they are just for you. Do you remember feeling guilty or convicted of your sin? Did you believe Jesus died, was buried, and rose again to obtain forgiveness for your sin? Do you remember being drawn to him? Did you accept him as your savior? Did you trust him to do what he said he would? Were you born again? Can you recall the moment of this supernatural event? I don’t mean can you recall the date and time, I mean can you remember the very moment you were forgiven and born again? The moment that you accepted his forgiveness, trusted him for it, knew you were forgiven, and your burden was lifted?

      If you answered in the affirmative to all of that then I believe that not only were you a Christian, but that you still are and there is no taking it back. Oh, you can sin and deny him, but you are his for eternity. He will whip you for your sin and correct you until you repent, but you can’t get away no matter what you do.

      March 26, 2013 at 10:19 pm |
    • Anon

      I'm utterly convinced that the b@stard didn't even exist in the first place and was based on even older savior myths.
      That passive aggressive apologetic crap about once a christian always a christian sure does wonders doesn't it?
      Hell I'll even proudly say I reject holy spirit (unpardonable sin according to your primitive myth) without second thought and it wouldn't even cause me to lose sleep overnight.

      March 26, 2013 at 10:51 pm |
    • Anon

      Also here's the proper place for your big book of primitive desert myths AKA bible.
      [youtube=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6OgAXbyzP5g&w=640&h=360]

      March 26, 2013 at 10:54 pm |
    • sam stone

      That's the point I was making, Robert. Free will is inconsistent with an omniscient god. Your distinction between "absolute free will" and "limited free will" is absurd since 1. You cannot establish that "god" exists and 2. You cannot establish that this "god" interferes with human behavior. It is a bit like arguing how man angels can dance on the head of a pin

      March 27, 2013 at 6:21 am |
  6. Sam Yaza

    which God?

    March 26, 2013 at 7:12 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      Take your pick. None of them are doing anybody any good right now!

      March 26, 2013 at 7:13 pm |
    • Anon

      Obviously the Abrahamic deity (Yahweh/Jesus/Jehovah/Allah/etc) of the three desert blood cults.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:14 pm |
    • Sam Yaza

      oh that guys on the side of wanting to destroy the world; who care what that lunatic thinks.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:17 pm |
  7. Anon

    Neither because God as in the Abrahamic deity (Yahweh/Jesus/Jehovah/Allah/etc) is a primitive desert myth that's supposed to be irrelevant in the 21st century.

    March 26, 2013 at 7:04 pm |
  8. Voice in the desert

    Jesus loved sinners. In fact, the more wretched and detestable in the eyes of society, the more eagerly he sought them out. However, his message to them was always the same. He told them to repent and believe in him in order to be saved. Since Jesus was the only man to ever live without committing a single sin, what he said applies to each and everyone of us without exception (John 3:16).

    He loves you, and he died for you to take your punishment for your sins, and my sins, and the sins of all who would beleive in him. Tell him you're sorry. Tell him you love him. Ask him to be your Lord, and you will have eternal life in him.

    March 26, 2013 at 7:04 pm |
    • Anon

      ^ This is why many non-believers see Christians as nutcases.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:06 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      OK god I'm sorry for my sins. Now please let me hit the lottery!

      March 26, 2013 at 7:08 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      Stop blaspheming. As every intelligent person knows, the Flying Spaghetti Monster is the One True God of All Creation.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:09 pm |
    • Sam Yaza

      Jesus was a drunker, thus he sinned.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:15 pm |
    • Mr. Reality

      Voice in the desert is clearly brainwashed to the point of no return. You want us to believe a man the may have live 2,000 years ago loves us, we should love him in return, and that he died for us. You want us to tell him we are sorry, sorry for what? Whoever started a religion on his behalf should give us an apology. Besides who wants live forever, not me. That will get boring and tiresome especially if I had to do it around silly folks like you. Grow up, you are gonna die one day...get over it.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:14 pm |
  9. currentinsider

    Reblogged this on therealkelvincambridge.

    March 26, 2013 at 6:22 pm |
  10. Ken Margo

    What is god's side? We have floods, hurricanes, earthquakes, tsunami, twisters and all the other disasters that happen. Why is god even concerned about gay marriage? God is killing a ton of straight people with all these natural disasters.

    March 26, 2013 at 6:09 pm |
    • Gave Them Up

      It's the insurance companies that won't give up the "acts of god". The rest of you claimers of Being god better pay up.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:12 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      If it's not the "act of god" What is it? Oh my. could it be THE DEVIL? dum dum da dum

      March 26, 2013 at 7:22 pm |
    • Lola Bunch

      Insurance companies causes hurricanes and tsunamis, twisters and earthquakes? Well. Good to know.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:45 pm |
  11. Andrew Casey

    Well, you know what they say about opinions...

    March 26, 2013 at 5:29 pm |
  12. EnjaySea

    Isn't it a coincidence that one's god always ends up hating the same people that the believer hates, as well as holding all of the identical political and ideological views! What are the chances of that happening!

    If there is a god, in a universe this large, it probably hasn't even discovered us yet, or never will. Let alone the absurd notion that the supposed creator of the universe is so tied up in what happens to the bacterial slime that happens to live on this insignificant planet.

    March 26, 2013 at 5:25 pm |
    • mzh

      My suggestion to you to find the answer from the koran and you will be amazed what you will find and you never know what new things that you will learn... please do not treat the koran by looking at some muslims action as not all the muslims follows what they should as a muslim... just fyi...

      March 26, 2013 at 5:28 pm |
    • Saraswati

      Yep, Falun DaFa (Falun Gong) perfected this. Not only are gay people bad (similar to murderers) but the falun gong folks get off giving to charity because the poor folk are suffering for past misdeeds.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:29 pm |
    • you are not God Enjay, and your statement is dull

      9 So the LORD said to him, "Bring me a heifer, a goat and a ram, each three years old, along with a dove and a young pigeon." 10 Abram brought all these to him, cut them in two and arranged the halves opposite each other; the birds, however, he did not cut in half. 11 Then birds of prey came down on the carcasses, but Abram drove them away. 12 As the sun was setting, Abram fell into a deep sleep, and a thick and dreadful darkness came over him. 13 Then the LORD said to him, "Know for certain that your descendants will be strangers in a country not their own, and they will be enslaved and mistreated four hundred years. 14 But I will punish the nation they serve as slaves, and afterward they will come out with great possessions. 15 You, however, will go to your fathers in peace and be buried at a good old age. 16 In the fourth generation your descendants will come back here, for the sin of the Amorites has not yet reached its full measure." 17 When the sun had set and darkness had fallen, a smoking firepot with a blazing torch appeared and passed between the pieces.

      March 26, 2013 at 6:20 pm |
    • you are not God Enjay, and your statement is dull

      If there is a god, in a universe this large, it probably hasn't even discovered us yet, or never will.

      GOD..........hasnt' discovered yet? Whatever man.

      March 26, 2013 at 6:21 pm |
    • Vic

      Romans 1:20
      "20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse."

      Colossians 1:16
      "16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him."

      Hebrews 11:3
      "3 By faith we understand that the worlds were prepared by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things which are visible."

      Acts 17:24-28
      "24 The God who made the world and all things in it, since He is Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in temples made with hands; 25 nor is He served by human hands, as though He needed anything, since He Himself gives to all people life and breath and all things; 26 and He made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their habitation, 27 that they would seek God, if perhaps they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us; 28 for in Him we live and move and exist, as even some of your own poets have said, ‘For we also are His children.’"

      [Scripture is from the New American Standard Bible (NASB)]
      http://www.biblegateway.com

      March 26, 2013 at 6:26 pm |
    • sam

      @you are not God Enjay, and your statement is dull

      Terrific. More bible quotes that mean nothing. Thanks. Run along.

      March 26, 2013 at 6:37 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      @mzh................the Qur'an is just a different brand of toilet paper. With all the problems in the middle east, the Qur'an isn't helping Muslims either.

      March 26, 2013 at 6:58 pm |
    • Robert Brown

      Sam,

      If memory serves, this was the ancient way of making a promise or a covenant. It would be similar today to signing a contract.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:02 pm |
    • Jill

      fred, open up to the green spectacles. Realize your net precedent. Triangulate! Save the best for the alligators. Ever the bastille notches the orchestra but Wendy is not green and horses will capitulate. Filter out the log from the turnstile and cry prevalently.

      So there brown stare. Feed your inner walnut and resolve. Subject your lemon to the ingenious door in the presence of snow and animals. Aisle 7 is for the monetary cheese whiz. Faced with the kitchen, you may wish to prolong the sailboat in the cliff. Otherwise, rabbits may descend on your left nostril. Think about how you can stripe the sea.

      Regale the storm to those who (6) would thump the parrot with the armband. Corner the market on vestiges of the apparent closure but seek not the evidential circumstance. Therein you can find indignant mountains of pigs and apples. Descend eloquently as you debate the ceiling of your warning fulcrum. Vacate the corncob profusely and and don’t dote on the pancreas.

      Next up, control your wood. Have at the cat with your watch on the fore. Aft! Smarties (12)! Rome wasn’t kevetched in an autumn nightie. (42) See yourself for the turntable on the escalator. Really peruse the garage spider definitely again again with brown. Now we have an apparent congestion, so be it here. Just a moment is not a pod of beef for the ink well nor can it be (4) said that Karen was there in the millpond.

      Garbage out just like the candle in the kitty so. Go, go, go until the vacuum meets the upward vacation. Sell the yellow. Then trim the bus before the ten cheese please Louise. Segregate from the koan and stew the ship vigorously.

      And remember, never pass up an opportunity to watch an elephant paint Mozart.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:37 pm |
    • Lola Bunch

      @you are not God Enjay, and your statement is dull:
      Your name says much about your mindset. Your post tells you are incapable of independent thought.

      Enjay's post was every bit as valid, and much more interesting... Sam has it right. Run along now.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:22 pm |
  13. GodFreeNow

    God is on the side of the religious people, since they are the ones that believe god exists—Just like zeus is on the side of those who believe in zeus. But since god is likely a figment of their imaginations, I wouldn't expect much help from him on this issue. I mean, if he's not going to help suffering children with cancer, and starving people, and those being slaughtered by war, what makes you think he's going to assist on this matter?

    March 26, 2013 at 5:14 pm |
    • Saraswati

      That would assume god is a reasonable being with the same relative values we have. If he's really just sort of a stupid ass who has a lot of power there's really no predicting what he'd do.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:21 pm |
    • JR

      If God exists, maybe he/she/it doesn't believe in Divine Intervention but instead believes in free will above all else. In any case, your amateurish attempts in taunting him/she/it into a response will obviously go unanswered.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:23 pm |
    • Saraswati

      Except that Christian "free will" makes no sense at all if you actually think about it. It's just a convenient term to plaster up a giant gaping hole in the Christian religion.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:30 pm |
    • The Non Believer

      @JR
      But, but, but.... he created the earth, spoke to Moses from a burning bush, parted the red sea, destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah, flooded the earth, created Jesus from a virgin birth, sacrificed himself to atone for humanity"s sins, and showed his (Jesus') face in a tortilla!

      March 26, 2013 at 5:32 pm |
    • Athy

      Actually, his face was in a piece of toast. I ate it.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:47 pm |
    • Vic

      God wants man to believe in Him (Faith!!!) He reveals Himself through His Creation (Prima Facie!!!) If God were to show himself, then, we can not be tested by Faith/Belief!

      March 26, 2013 at 6:12 pm |
    • GodFreeNow

      @ Vic, don't you find it curious that he waited until the age of reason to start demanding faith and stop performing miracles? I love how all myth stories have this phenomenal works of unbelievable magic... but then... humans got science and voila... Now you must have faith. 🙂

      March 26, 2013 at 6:26 pm |
    • Vic

      @G F N

      http://lightyears.blogs.cnn.com/2013/03/18/on-mars-more-water-evidence-in-drilling-area/#comment-136832

      March 26, 2013 at 6:34 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      "doesn't believe in Divine Intervention"

      Great. So we can take jebus and the christian god off the table now.

      March 26, 2013 at 6:35 pm |
    • fred

      "if he's not going to help suffering children with cancer, and starving people, and those being slaughtered by war"

      =>All the above conditions are the result of man and the continued sin of man. Sin has already been atoned for in Christ and God will create a new heaven and a new earth and wipe away every tear (i.e. the innocent are already provided for). In short we all had a chance to play the game and reveal our soul destined for eternity.

      Your error is to assume there is nothing to existence other than what a dead ape will face and this you believe without evidence. The truth is very different and has been revealed. The truth is that God said let ther light and the light seperated the darkness. Jesus was the light and the darkness (evil) is being separated in this journey called life. Your only hope is that the life of an ape is all there is and our only hope is in Christ..

      I don't come on this board to give you a tuff time I am trying to warn you. Don't fall for the talking serpent who said "did God really say that" "you will not surley die"

      March 26, 2013 at 6:42 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      "children with cancer"

      Wait. SIN causes child cancer? Pathology be damned!

      March 26, 2013 at 6:48 pm |
    • In Santa we trust

      fred
      Your error is to assume there is more to existence other than what a dead ape will face and this you believe without evidence. There is no evidence for most of the bible, especially the creation myth part.

      March 26, 2013 at 6:56 pm |
    • fred

      TANK!!!
      “Pathology be damned”
      =>Path ology is the study of a path. I suggest you study the path of Jesus because He said I am the way the truth and the light.
      I suspect the cancer rates between believers and non believers are close to the same. There was no death prior to the fall when man rejected the Garden provided in the security and complete dependence on God. Since that point our days are numbered for various reasons. A child’s cancer will not be remembered in the course of eternity with God except that which was to the Glory of God. By this I mean the good and right that was revealed in and by the soul through that journey.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:01 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      "Path ology is the study of a path."

      No, dimwit, pathology is the study of DISEASE. Are you so lazy that you couldn't be bothered to google a word you clearly didn't understand? Remind me to post this gem of a quote on every thread you comment on henceforth.

      Just for the lulz: If pathology is the study of paths, then what does sympathy mean?

      March 26, 2013 at 7:07 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      I've bookmarked and taken a pic of the page, so you can't lie your way out of this gaffe like a typical religious loon.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:15 pm |
    • fred

      In Santa we Trust
      You have no more scientific evidence than I do as to life after death or purpose for life itself. It is a sense that 98% of the worlds population has which says there is something more. It is possible that the 2% are correct but that would not be based on evidence and would be very unreasonable given that 2% deviation in biological and neurological functionality is expected in the general population.

      Making matters worse I do not need to prove to myself or justify anything because I am safe regardless if there is or is not life after death. You have chosen a proposition that increases the probability of a hard landing.
      If you had one shred of evidence that there is no afterlife it would be a different story.

      What do I have? I have the Word of God that said ask Jesus into your life and you will see God. I did and I see the reality of God. I have the Bible where all promises have been fulfilled to date over a 3,400 year time period. I see the plan and purpose for creation and have yet to hear of a better plan. I hear the voice of God and feel the hand of God direct my path. I have learned to love God which is something I did not think possible.

      You on the other hand must believe that we die like the slime, fish, mammals, apes we evolved from and live like the animals we are inside our social groups like the apes.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:24 pm |
    • Doris

      L O L !

      March 26, 2013 at 7:30 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      "You on the other hand must believe that we die like the slime, fish, mammals, apes we evolved from and live like the animals we are inside our social groups like the apes."

      Doesn't know what pathology is, but feels confident enough to dictate distorted implications of accepting science. Ya gotta love religies!!

      March 26, 2013 at 7:32 pm |
    • fred

      TANK!!!
      If a bunch of sympleton atheists were to stomp through the tall grass their path could be seen. They would have a pahtyness about them. For short it would be called sympathy. If they were going back to their house or if they were gay it could be a homeopath. If they were crazy Christian haters it would be known as a psychopath.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:35 pm |
    • Jill

      fred, realize your net precedent. Open up to the green spectacles in the refrigerator. Triangulate! Save the best for the alligators. Ever the bastille notches the orchestra but Wendy is not green and horses will capitulate. Filter out the log from the turnstile and cry prevalently.

      So there brown stare. Feed your inner walnut and resolve. Subject your lemon to the ingenious door in the presence of snow and animals. Aisle 7 is for the monetary cheese whiz. Faced with the kitchen, you may wish to prolong the sailboat in the cliff. Otherwise, rabbits may descend on your left nostril. Think about how you can stripe the sea.

      Regale the storm to those who (6) would thump the parrot with the armband. Corner the market on vestiges of the apparent closure but seek not the evidential circumstance. Therein you can find indignant mountains of pigs and apples. Descend eloquently as you debate the ceiling of your warning fulcrum. Vacate the corncob profusely and and don’t dote on the pancreas.

      Next up, control your wood. Have at the cat with your watch on the fore. Aft! Smarties (12)! Rome wasn’t kevetched in an autumn nightie. (42) See yourself for the turntable on the escalator. Really peruse the garage spider definitely again again with brown. Now we have an apparent congestion, so be it here. Just a moment is not a pod of beef for the ink well nor can it be (4) said that Karen was there in the millpond.

      Garbage out just like the candle in the kitty so. Go, go, go until the vacuum meets the upward vacation. Sell the yellow. Then trim the bus before the ten cheese please Louise. Segregate from the koan and stew the ship vigorously.

      And remember, never pass up an opportunity to watch an elephant paint Mozart.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:38 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      Instead of acknowledging and correcting your ignorance, you wallow in it like a typical religie. Don't worry; I'm snapping a pic of your latest comment as yet another reminder of your willful embrace of stupidity.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:42 pm |
    • fred

      TANK!!!
      Good try, but take a close look and note the space between path and ology in my post.
      Ology: Noun -A subject of study; a branch of knowledge.

      Path: Noun-A way or track laid down for walking or made by continual treading or Such a way or track designed for a particular purpose

      March 26, 2013 at 7:52 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      I brought up the subject of pathology. Why would you mention "path ology?" Thanks for demonstrating you inability to logically follow the conversation. That demonstration and your pathetic cop-out only sheds more light on the depth of your stupidity.

      And in which dictionary can you find "pathology" and the pathetic etymology you've presented for sympathy and homeopathy?

      March 26, 2013 at 8:02 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      I mean "path ology."

      March 26, 2013 at 8:04 pm |
    • fred

      etymology of TANK!!!
      Born in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, and moved with his family as a child to the Washington, D.C. suburb of Clinton, Maryland. He was a multi-sport athlete at Crossland High School and was offered the opportunity to play college football. However Tank decided to focus on music and his talent eventually led him to an opportunity to sing background vocals for Ginuwine during one of Ginuwine's tours. AKA Durrell Babbs

      March 26, 2013 at 8:17 pm |
  14. JR

    ...God refused to grant an interview for this article to CNN

    March 26, 2013 at 5:12 pm |
    • In Santa we trust

      In keeping with his low-profile policy of the last few millenia

      March 26, 2013 at 5:17 pm |
    • The Non Believer

      Shoot. I was hoping for evidence.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:20 pm |
    • sam

      To be fair, he has been really busy helping people stuck on Carnival cruises get home safely.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:28 pm |
    • Chuckles

      @sam

      Weird, I thought he was too busy helping teams win at sports and laughing at hungry african children.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:31 pm |
    • sam

      @Chuckles oh yes, that's on next week's schedule. He's all booked.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:47 pm |
    • Vic

      God wants man to believe in Him (Faith!!!) He reveals Himself through His Creation (Prima Facie!!!) If God were to show Himself, then, we can not be tested by Faith/Belief!

      March 26, 2013 at 6:23 pm |
    • sam

      Wow, Vic, how convenient!

      March 26, 2013 at 6:36 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      @ Vic Are you god's spokesperson? How much does he pay per hour?

      March 26, 2013 at 6:37 pm |
    • Vic

      @TANK

      Answer: Eternal Life!!!

      John 3:16

      "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life."

      [Scripture is from the New American Standard Bible (NASB)]
      http://www.biblegateway.com

      March 26, 2013 at 6:45 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      So you ARE god's spokesperson. Be a dear and ask the old lad what jam I should put on my bread tomorrow morning.

      March 26, 2013 at 6:50 pm |
    • Vic

      @TANK

      God speaks for Himself; I only witness to Him!!!

      I am a believer in God the Father, Son and Holy Spirit; in Jesus Christ as Lord and my personal Savior!!!

      March 26, 2013 at 7:00 pm |
    • TANK!!!!

      But you ADMITTED to being his spokesperson, and even quoted your salary. Why are you backtracking now?

      March 26, 2013 at 7:13 pm |
  15. Live4Him Equals Arcy

    Troll complete.

    March 26, 2013 at 5:09 pm |
    • Thought

      so.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:13 pm |
    • sam

      Yeah, the poe schtick was getting obvious the longer it went on.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:14 pm |
    • ..

      Yep, thought so.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:27 pm |
  16. Eric

    Ok so here is my view. Exactly why are the Christians worried about the moral decay of this country? Wouldn't this hasten judgment day? Isn't that what Christians live for? So give it up, let the gay folks marry, let this country go to hell (in your opinion)...and allow judgment day to come. If and when it happens, then you can stand up and lay blame, while you bask in the glory of your lord. But if it doesn't come, then I guess the rest of us were right.

    March 26, 2013 at 5:07 pm |
    • Saraswati

      That seems to be the approach some of them are taking now. After all, they're clearly going to lose given the youth demographics so there's not really another position to take without feeling the reality of defeat.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:15 pm |
    • Moby Schtick

      There's one thing you can always count on god for: Nothing.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:22 pm |
    • End Religion

      Christians are worried about "moral decay" because they do not believe what they profess to believe. They do not want the rapture to come because they're scared god doesn't exist even though they swear up and down he does exist. If they truly believed in their religion they would adhere exactly to the bible and not even take medicine because they would want to get to heaven as fast as possible without actually committing suicide. Every single one of them who moderates from the exact commandments of the bible does not believe in it, contrary to what they will scream and swear to. They may be nice people, but they simply lack any critical thinking in the area of religion and at least in that respect are all hypocrites.

      March 26, 2013 at 7:13 pm |
  17. Sanity

    I think it's rather obvious to anyone who has ever seen a rainbow that God sides with gays. I mean, why else would he magically make rainbows appear?

    "12 And God said, “This is the sign of the covenant I am making between me and you and every living creature with you, a covenant for all generations to come: 13 I have set my rainbow in the clouds, and it will be the sign of the covenant between me and the earth. 14 Whenever I bring clouds over the earth and the rainbow appears in the clouds, 15 I will remember my covenant between me and you and all living creatures of every kind. Never again will the waters become a flood to destroy all life. 16 Whenever the rainbow appears in the clouds, I will see it and remember the everlasting covenant between God and all living creatures of every kind on the earth.” Gen 9: 12-16

    Funny how apparently light reflection in water droplets where different wavelengths of color bend at slightly separate angles didn't exist until AFTER the flood...

    March 26, 2013 at 5:06 pm |
    • SeilnoigileR

      Yes! Exactly! Amazing how the laws of physics changed that very instant. Apparently there was either no rain or no rainbows before the flood. That'll throw off a lot of astronomical equations. How are the deluded going to explain that one?

      March 26, 2013 at 7:03 pm |
  18. Fundies Gone Wild! They are Panicking!!

    [youtube=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I0-04VDrCbM&w=640&h=360]

    . .

    March 26, 2013 at 4:58 pm |
  19. mzh

    Do gay or lesb ppl turn to gay or lesb after they gets tired of being with straight ppl or what? i do not understand when someone says that i was born to be gay... this is totally incorrect saying... hitlar was not born as hitlar but later he made himself with the ppl around him as hitlar... so i guess its all depends on what types of compenions they hang out with prior to turn to what they are... i pray for them... i do not hate them but i hate the action they do... they are all as human as i am...

    March 26, 2013 at 4:55 pm |
    • Yeah Right

      This has to be the worst attempt at Poe-ing I have ever seen.

      March 26, 2013 at 4:58 pm |
    • EJR17

      Yeah, Right, I have t agree. Either this person is a Poe Supreme, or 12.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:05 pm |
    • Sanity

      Might just have english as a second or maybe third language. That and being 12.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:09 pm |
    • mzh

      To Sanity: you are right english is my third or may be forth language... 🙂 i am still learning...

      March 26, 2013 at 5:15 pm |
    • Saraswati

      mzh, I taught ESL for a bit when I was younger and that's not what non-native writing looks like. That's either crappy, uneducated, pre-teen texting script or a really good imitation of it.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:19 pm |
    • mzh

      I will take these as a complements...

      March 26, 2013 at 5:31 pm |
    • Athy

      Who is hitlar?

      March 26, 2013 at 5:52 pm |
    • Truth Prevails :-)

      uneducated...the best part of this is : "I hate what they do." Are they doing something bad? Should we call the police and have them arrested and put in jail. Are they worse than Jodi Arias?

      March 26, 2013 at 6:46 pm |
    • Mr. Reality

      mzh....who cares that you don't understand when they say that they were born gay. Then you say it's incorrect after you say you don't understand. You make no sense...probably why you are a believer. Also, you hate what they do, so what. How does it bother your daily goings on...it doesnt. Nobody needs you to pray(talk to yourself) any more than you do. It is a futile exercise with no tangible utility.

      March 26, 2013 at 8:40 pm |
  20. mainepotter

    I wasn't aware that the court gets to pick which god, if any, it wants to promote. There are more than several to choose from.

    March 26, 2013 at 4:51 pm |
    • Smelly Dan, High Squirrel-Priest of Bippyism

      There is only one true god: Bippy, the Great and Powerful Squirrel-Ubergod of Everything Except Burn Toast and Plastic Sporks. Such a shame Justin Bieber killed him.

      March 26, 2013 at 4:57 pm |
    • mainepotter

      The minor goddess of Things That Stick in Drawers, Anoia is praised by rattling a drawer and crying "How can it close on the damned thing but not open with it? Who bought this? Do we ever use it?" As she says, sooner or later every curse is a prayer. She also eats corkscrews and is responsible for Things Down The Backs of Sofas, and is considering moving into stuck zips. Terry Pratchett says it is so.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:04 pm |
    • Akira

      Love me some Terry Pratchett. Haven't read him in a while. Thanks for the reminder!

      March 26, 2013 at 5:07 pm |
    • Saraswati

      Pratchett let's us all laugh at ourselves without feeling too bad about being silly humans.

      March 26, 2013 at 5:33 pm |
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About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.