By Alan Duke, CNN
Los Angeles (CNN) - The weekend's sermon at Saddleback Church was "Surviving Tough Times," a theme Pastor Rick Warren planned before his youngest son killed himself with a gun Friday.
Matthew Warren, 27, committed suicide "in a momentary wave of despair" at the end of a lifetime struggle "with mental illness, dark holes of depression and even suicidal thoughts," the pastor wrote to the staff of his Southern California megachurch.
"Matthew was an incredibly kind, gentle and compassionate young man whose sweet spirit was encouragement and comfort to many," a statement from the church said. "Unfortunately, he also suffered from mental illness resulting in deep depression and suicidal thoughts. Despite the best health care available, this was an illness that was never fully controlled, and the emotional pain resulted in his decision to take his life."
Friend Mike Constantz told CNN he had a "playful spirit."
"There are the days where he was just this bubbly, outgoing, effervescent, reaching out to people," Constantz said. "And there were the days where he just didn't want to be around people. Just the pain, the excruciating pain, was just too much."
"Hold on to the promises"!
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Free speech helps educate the masses................POLITICIANS too !
Where do morals come from?
By Kelly Murray, CNN
Gravity is not up for debate !
BY the way ...................Splat goes a fairy in the sky !...............bye bye tinker bell !
Einstein's Gravity Theory Passes Toughest Test Yet
Apr. 25, 2013 — A strange stellar pair nearly 7,000 light-years from Earth has provided physicists with a unique cosmic laboratory for studying the nature of gravity. The extremely strong gravity of a massive neutron star in orbit with a companion white dwarf star puts competing theories of gravity to a test more stringent than any available before
Hey James Madison................religion has none it looks like.............with the comments on this blog.
The Big question is ETHICS ! does religion have any ?
The Ethics of Resurrecting Extinct Species
Apr. 8, 2013 — At some point, scientists may be able to bring back extinct animals, and perhaps early humans, raising questions of ethics and environmental disruption.
April 30, 2013 at 4:16 pm | Report abuse |
May 1, 2013 at 12:42 pm | Report abuse |
Dinosaur Egg Study Supports Evolutionary Link Between Birds and Dinosaurs: How Troodon Likely Hatched Its Young
And NO ANGELS the pope KICKED them OFF the TEAM last year !
From Soup to Cells—the Origin of Life
the wrong path is Adam and Eve !
Human Y Chromosome Much Older Than Previously Thought
Mar. 4, 2013 — The discovery and analysis of an extremely rare African American Y chromosome pushes back the time of the most recent common ancestor for the Y chromosome lineage tree to 338,000 years ago. This time predates the age of the oldest known anatomically modern human fossils.
No god(s) needed or required to graduate from public schools in the US
Remember : Adam had to POKE himself hard with his OWN BONE to create Eve.
No god(s) needed................... Old. DNA works..................also catches crooks !
Ancient DNA Reveals Europe's Dynamic Genetic History
Apr. 23, 2013 — Ancient DNA recovered from a series of skeletons in central Germany up to 7,500 years old has been used to reconstruct the first detailed genetic history of modern Europe.
Ca-nabis and Cannabinoids (PDQ®) – National Cancer Insti-tute
Mar 21, 2013 – [1,2] These plant-derived compounds may be referred to as phytocannabinoids. ... have a protective effect against the development of certain types of tumors. ... In lung cancer cell lines, CBD upregulated ICAM-1, leading to ...
Good stuff !
The fact...............the earth is to old for this nonsemse ! Time to EVOLVE !
Ancient Earth Crust Stored in Deep Mantle
Apr. 24, 2013 — Scientists have long believed that lava erupted from certain oceanic volcanoes contains materials from the early Earth's crust. But decisive evidence for this phenomenon has proven elusive. New research from a team including Carnegie's Erik Hauri demonstrates that oceanic volcanic rocks contain samples of recycled crust dating back to the Archean era 2.5 billion years ago. Their work is published in Nature.
For what...................... ? Make sure to read what the pope said !
Learning is fun with facts.......................... and facts work when teaching children.
Atheist Prof. Peter Higgs: Stop calling Higgs boson the ‘God particle’
Professor Peter Higgs said recently that there is no God and so people should stop referring to the theoretical partial that
bears his name as the “God particle.”
Pope praises science, but insists God created world updated Thur October 28, 2010
Stephen Hawking is wrong, Pope Benedict XVI said Thursday – God did create the universe. The pope didn't actually mention the world-famous scientist, who argues in a book published last month that the laws of physics show there is no need for a supreme... \
Heaven is 'a fairy story,' scientist Stephen Hawking says updated Tue May 17, 2011
By Dan Gilgoff, CNN.com Religion Editor The concept of heaven or any kind of afterlife is a "fairy story," famed British scientist Stephen Hawking said in a newspaper interview this week. "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when...
April 7th, 2012
08:32 PM ET
The Jesus debate: Man vs. myth
Make sure to read comments
April 18, 2013 at 3:10 pm | Report abuse |
NASA: Three planets found are some of best candidates so far for habitable worlds outside our solar system.
NASA: Mars could have supported life
Star Dust we are
Rick Warren often expresses he has no compassion as in when he says he does not believe in gay marriage???
I think you frankly are too biased to add anything sensible. You are just campaigning for something which pop culture says is congenital but doctors say is a choice!
Therefore if you are sincere in your compassion then give it and leave your stupid propaganda behind or go campaign for gay marriage in Saudi Arabia where your efforts will be much appreciated!
I am sure your compassion and sacrifice will be most evident!
Fcats would help No Goda
Does the RCC have any ?
A wedge !
My sincere condolences to the Warren family. I'm an atheist but that doesn't prevent me from seeing a family in pain. A man suffered serious mental illness which included suffering beyond his ability to cope and took his own life. The guilt and responsibility his family must be feeling is surely immense. No one with even a shred of humanity deserves to lose a child, if even the tiniest shred is all they have. Just because Rick Warren often expresses that he has no compassion, it doesn't mean no one should have compassion toward anyone associated with him.
Even when loss is random and inescapable, loved ones blame themselves whether they truly are responsible or not. I hope that Rick Warren and his family are able to forgive themselves and live semi-normal lives. I've seen families destroyed by the loss of a child, grown or not. It is nothing to take joy in, only something to feel sadness for.
Mental illness is real. Stigma-free, reality-based treatment should be available. I'm saddened by the unnecessary loss of Warren's son and by the knowledge that, while he lived, he was tortured by his own thoughts.
May our God comfort you and the family.
The only person to blame for Matthew's death is Rick himself!
If only he had prayed for his son, the boy would have been cured! It says so in the Bible, and we all know that is the word of God and is all true.
What a crock!
What's with all this vitriol?
A dad has lost his son,
can't you some compassion?
some people can cope with despair,
While others can't.
Leave the pastor alone,
Let him grieve in peace.
I doubt very much Rick Warren is reading this blog right now. So what ever we write (good or bad) has zero affect on him.
The vitriol, evil, discriminatory history of Rick Warren warrants no sympathy from me. This man has made a career of misinformation and vilification of atheists and others.
In short, Fuck Rick Warren.
@Hawaii.................you've got to come out your shell. Please tell us how you really feel. :)
I haven't said half of what I think of that asshat.
Romans 15:13 May the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope.
@hope..............zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz Bu'll sh'it zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzBu'll Sh'it zzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Pastor Rick had read online comments and the outpouring of encouragement and support and was encouraged. However, he was also pained at some of the other hateful comments posted, according to huffington posts and other news reports.
@Mr. Atheist...............................................He now knows how it feels when he spews hatred at others. Hopefully he'll realize he's like others and others are like him.
Pastor Rick gives away 90% of his earnings to charitable causes. He is in the forefront helping aids victims and numerous other humanitarian causes. What have you done for mankind?
I've done walks to prevent birth defects, found people jobs, give money for the homeless. It's not about charity work. It's about how you treat people. Because you help some but hate others doesn't make you better than anyone else.
Haters are gonna hate ,
Christians are gonna show love ,
In spite of personal tragedies,
a Christian will turn to God ,
in whom they will find comfort.
God's love surpasses and trumps an atheist hatred.
To pastor Rick-we love you, above all else, God loves you!
Pastor Rick has expressed his hate. That's why it's coming back at him. Honestly I have children, so my condolences go out to him and his family. I wouldn't wish that on anyone. Let's be fair, Rick has his issues which would lead others to enjoy his misery right now. Whatever he needs to do to deal with this tragedy i hope helps through the grieving. His son's death isn't going to right the wrongs out there. Maybe during his time of grief he'll gain a different perspective and change his outlook.
I find it interesting that all the people defending Rick have not actually addressed any of his own vitriol, vilification, and discrimination that he has built his career on. Cherry picking, one of the religious favorite past times.
@Hawaii.......Hasn't it always been that way?
Yes. Usually they do it to the bible almost exclusively, except for cherry picking quotes from founding fathers to perpetuate the complete lie of a "nation founded on Christianity".
Rick has no-one to blame but himself!
Tom, since you are only living to die and move on to some other existance, why don't you go ahead and do it already.
Since you can't manage the reply function, I am guessing you're addressing me. I'm not living only to die. That would be something believers appear to do-to live only in hopes of the resurrection and of life in heaven. I don't need that crutch. I enjoy my life now, here. It's enough for me to have family, friends, a career, a home, and many other things that make life worth living.
If heaven't so great, why are you still here?
LOL @ TOM
Friends? Family? Career?
You spend 18 hours a day here being the most negative person imaginable. You sure don't seem happy. I know it. Everyone else knows it. Dogs know it. You really aren't happy.
Well, sweet cheeks, I just arrived at home after work. So for the past 6 hours, I haven't been here.
Guess that proves you're a bit of a stalker.
I don't know what makes you think Christians don't pursue those things too.
Never said I thought that. I simply don't need to believe that there's anything more than this life. My life has meaning without the belief in a hereafter. I find joy in the things I do each day and that's enough.
It's strange that they can even imagine eternal life. We really aren't suited for it. After a few giga-millennia there would certainly be nothing left of our memories of life in this world.
Tom the other;
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Atheists on here can't seem to give any of us a straight answer. They are quick to nitpick every little thing but when were right about things they ignore the truth. I have met a lot of ignorant Atheists on here and its appalling to see. You want us to tell you our Christian views yet you can't seem to tell us anything about being an Atheist? Go figure!!!
And by the way, you christians are not right about ANYTHING. Your false beliefs have you blinded to the real world.
You are right, Kilto. And atheist ignorance resides in this: First, they think they get to define what kind of evidence "proves" the existence of a Supreme Mind. THey don't. Second, they don't know that proof for a Supreme Being is probably unavailable to them. Last, they assume they could understand such evidence if they saw it.
The evidence that atheists want is entirely irrelevant to the question. This betrays an ignorance of the concept of God. It's why Richard Dawkins reduces God to "hokus pokus fairies in the pond." He can't talk about it on a higher level.
Then why bother to engage, Prime? Just ignore atheists. In fact, if their posts bother you SO much, then why not go to a site where only other believers can post?
You hypocrites are only here because you love to argue with those who disagree with you. If the only people here were believers like you, you'd be bored to tears. That's why you come here instead of just going to church and praying. You LIKE conflict. You crave it.
Re: "can't talk about it on a higher level" is believer mumbo-jumbo for "refuses to elevate myth (unsupported bullsh!t) to fact."
I can and will give you straight answer. GOD DOESN'T EXIST PERIOD. He doesn't solve any problems ANYWHERE in the world. There is ZERO proof of his existence. I'm sure the rev. Warren prayed for his son. How did that work out? I know what you're going to say, God has called him. Why would god want a drug addict?
Talk about condescending. You really must hate that you can't provide empirical, independently verifiable evidence for your god.
We can't even find the emperical evidence to prove human consciousness exist. None of the data we've collected explains why the blob between your ears is producing a subjective experience. What would meet the criteria for empirical proof of a God?
Then why do you claim you can? Why do you make claims that you "know" god exists? That you "know" he created the universe? If you have no evidence, then stop pretending you do and be honest. You believe and have faith. That's all. No proof, no evidence.
The "how" is not as important as "does it exist"? And What requires consciousness to exist.
These things we do know. For instance, we know that destroying parts of the brain greatly and negatively affect the consciousness, and identity of a person. We also know that other animals with brains that are structured similarly display similar forms of consciousness and self-awareness.
Consciousness is an emergent property of a functioning, sufficiently complex and structured brain.
You jumped from "can't prove it exists" (which we can), to "can't explain how it exists", so which is your stance?
What kind of proof would you ask for exactly? What kind of evidence would satisfy you beyond a reasonable doubt?
I assume you're talking to Tom, and I'm guessing it would be something like "Independently verifiable, empirical evidence" would go toward actually making it a possibility.
Of course, first you'd need to start with presenting something to support that A god exists, then if you were to succeed in that, you could move on to proving that it's the god you worship.
Our belief in consciousness largely comes from self report. Almost any research into our conscious experience requires a description of "what it's like". We understand that cutting a chunk out of your brain alters your subjective experience. We just have no scientific or logical reason for a subjective "you" to exist at all. If consciousness is a phenomena related to the interactions in material structures like a brain, there's no logical reason that's keeps similar phenomena from existing at larger scales. But we can't prove the existence of a conscioussness, we can only infer its existence from observation.
So when I'm asking for specifics I mean that, what would be sufficient? Any physical phenomena can ways be given a natural explanation, the concept of the metaphysical precludes physical evidence, and anything that violates the laws of physics will be doubted a few generations later, even if you put it in a book. So what would you accept?
What are you even talking about anymore? What would I accept as proof of what? Consciousness or a god? Which one?
I'm not asking for proof from anyone unless that person claims he has it. I don't think you do; I don't think anyone does. I simply think it's dishonest of Christians to claim they "know" a god exists when they don't.
You're welcome to believe whatever you want. I don't care if you can prove it, until you claim you can. Is that what you're claiming?
As proof of God.
Unfortunately I need to go. I'll be back tomorrow thought and respond. You seem actually genuinely interested so I will be responding.
No prob, look forward to it.
I think people who claim they know about god genuinely believe they have a justified true belief. So are they dishonest or just, potentially, wrong?
Ok, so first off, I think in terms of proof, the only thing that would justify as proof to me would be direct contact with a "god being", but even then a lot of questioning and experimentation would be needed to rule out other possibilities.
From the believers, I ask for evidence that:
1) A god exists.
2) It's your concept of god that exists.
By evidence, I mean empirical, independently verifiable evidence that would support your position.
There's also logical argumentation that could support the possibility. It wouldn't be evidence, but it would help the concept to actually be a valid option rather than an assertion.
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
@ Mass D
"By the way, there are many people who keep dream journals, but only psychopaths try to decipher them as divine inspiration."
i am going through this again...
all of the dreams I had, that I discern were visioins, were because I was having dreams that were LEADING what my reality and awake life was about to actually present to me. Did I know when i wrote them down, or expect, for these dreams to be doing such a thing? there were a few where I knew that I could expect something. and they did hit .
two nights in a row, and a little space between the third dream,
#1I dreamt about the tile patio , a huge and beautiful rock tile with wide grout and a beautiful pattern and color, ater i had entered a stone arch entrance. There was an arm reaching into a whole, a whole chizzeled out of the ground. and the arm pulled out a leather bag full of gems. wrote these down in the middle or the night half asleep. The next day....I kept reading my bible.......
New American Standard Bible (NASB)
8 Then the word of the Lord came to Jeremiah in Tahpanhes, saying, 9 “Take some large stones in your [a]hands and hide them in the mortar in the brick terrace which is at the entrance of Pharaoh’s [c]palace in Tahpanhes, in the sight of [d]some of the J.ews; 10 and say to them, ‘Thus says the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel, “Behold, I am going to send and get Nebuchadnezzar the king of Babylon, My servant, and I am going to set his throne right over these stones that I have hidden; and he will spread his canopy over them.
#2 the next night I dreamed that i was being attacked by a motorcycle gang and that the leader of the gang had a huge animal horn, att.atched to his seat. he could not even sit on his bike. he was trying to run me over. they were a rebel gang.
the next day, i had finished reading Jeremiah and gotten into Lament.ations
◄ Lament.ations 2:3 ►
New International Version (©2011)
In fierce anger he has cut off every horn of Israel. He has withdrawn his right hand at the approach of the enemy. He has burned in Jacob like a flaming fire that consumes everything around it.
◄ Lament.ations 2:17 ►
New International Version (©2011)
The LORD has done what he planned; he has fulfilled his word, which he decreed long ago. He has overthrown you without pity, he has let the enemy gloat over you, he has exalted the horn of your foes.
I DID NOT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE BOOK OF JEREMIAH AND THE STONES, AND I HAD NO RECOLLECTION OF LAMENTA.TIONS. i COULD NOT HAVE TOLD YOU WHAT ONE MAIN POINT WAS OTHER THAN I KNEW JEREMIAH WAS A PROPHET.
#3 a few days later I had a dream that there was a huge pile of feathers underneath a bed. that day, I was reading in the book of daniel, ◄ Daniel 4:33 ►
New International Version (©2011)
Immediately what had been said about Nebuchadnezzar was fulfilled. He was driven away from people and ate grass like the ox. His body was drenched with the dew of heaven until his hair grew like the feathers of an eagle and his nails like the claws of a bird.
the kid who i had the dream about, got into trouble that day, which i had suspected the feather was a sign that he would be humiliated. he had his work pass suspended which was a major blow.
#4 dreamed I was poisoned by mercury in alcohol. the next dream, didnt have a single dream for two weeks, this next dream I had just let two snakes out of a cage. one was a viper, the other was a rattler. but I had not thought even thought the word viper for a long time. when i woke up, i said to the kid next to me................."something is going to happen today, this one is a sign" i knew the snakes were a sign..
two hours later i went down to bible study, the leader, on the second passage, said turn to proverbs 23:32
29 Who has woe? Who has sorrow?
Who has strife? Who has complaints?
Who has needless bruises? Who has blo.odshot eyes?
30 Those who linger over wine,
who go to sample bowls of mixed wine.
31 Do not gaze at wine when it is red,
when it sparkles in the cup,
when it goes down smoothly!
32 In the end it bites like a snake
and poisons like a viper.
#5 Dreamed i was in a wh.ore house and I flooded it because i turned on a water spitot upstairs and just let it go and left it on. I had been praying about lust. I didnt catch this dream, until a few week later i did a study on water. I had no clue about this dream. i seemed like a random joke. but i got kicked out for letting the water run and flood.
15 Drink water from your own cistern, running water from your own well. 16 Should your springs overflow in the streets, your streams of water in the public squares? 17 Let them be yours alone, never to be shared with strangers. 18 May your fountain be blessed, and may you rejoice in the wife of your youth. 19 A loving doe, a graceful deer– may her breasts satisfy you always, may you ever be intoxicated with her love. 20 Why, my son, be intoxicated with another man's wife? Why embrace the bosom of a wayward woman? 21 For your ways are in full view of the LORD, and he examines all your paths. 22 The evil deeds of the wicked ensnare them; the cords of their sins hold them fast.
# 6 dreamed i was touring a house and went out back and there was an ABOVE ground pool with an flush deck and a privacy fence right around the deck.
two days later the kid sleeping next to me pulled out a piece of paper , sheldon clay was his name, and he showed me his blue print he drew, of a new house, with an above ground swimming pool , with a flush deck around the pool, and a privacy fence on the deck.
#7 this kid on night threw a roll a tp and racked me. I was furious and said to myself, I wonder if he has the light in his eye. and then i rebuked my judgment of his spiritual condition. THE NEXT MORNING he woke up and came up to me and said, "i had a dream last night that i was going around to see who had a special light in their eye to see if they were possessed or not"
this kid was not a bible verse type of guy.
#8 had a dream that the kid who was ripping on me lost his money
a month later i over heard him talking about how he lost his money, and i said watch this, and pulled out the dream i had that he had lost it.
#9 the cat dream. I had a cat at my house, that night i dreamed that a demonic voice sang to me which inverted my body and then presented the same cat, covered in blood.
I woke up and the cat was dead in the highway, 550 feet from my house.
#10 I had a dream i was inside the st. louis arch and I was in there with my cousin, and she was pointing at a glass case , with a bust of someone. she said "look, its thomas Jefferson" and the place was very nice. very expensive and ritzy.
I had no idea what the st. louis arch was about. but what i had been doing, was getting heavily into the rumors about masons, and this dream just came to me. and when I googled this and I started trembling . this is called "a word of knowledge" which is a type of spiritual gift.
There have been numerous other ones that I believe were spiritual words of knowledge that i wont get in to .
None of this stuff, is me trying to fit things together. everything i dreamed, and then experienced in real life as i have stated. Some of these, are totally obvious. others, I have complete faith that they were also spiritual revelations, because I know %100 that some were, so I can have faith that others probably were too. and 8 of the first ten there, all happened in jail.
This is organized, and relevant information that is a dream, relating to reality that i was about to live.
That is spiritual revelation.
March 18, 2013 at 12:46 am | Reply
March 24, 2013 at 12:01 am | Report abuse |
Man, what a crock of shit. It sounds like you need some serious shock therapy to get back to normal.
Not to be rude, but who really gives a flaming fuck about this tool?
Hey, dumbbell, anyone who reads my posts knows I don't bother to type the word that way.
Poor you. Is your ass hurt?
How Christian of the copy-cat troll, right Tom?
It's some little whiny brat whose mommy didn't serve his favorite mac and cheese for dinner and he just can't get over it.
The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.