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Did Facebook save an unborn child?
Hundreds of adoption offers flooded in after a Catholic church posted this message on Monday.
July 11th, 2013
11:47 AM ET

Did Facebook save an unborn child?

By Daniel Burke, CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor

(CNN) – On Monday morning, a Catholic parish in Virginia posted an urgent message from its priest on Facebook.

A couple was pregnant with a child diagnosed with Down syndrome, said the Rev. Thomas Vander Woude of Holy Trinity Catholic Church in Gainesville, Virginia.

If they didn't find a couple willing to adopt the unborn child by the end of day, they would abort it, according to the priest.

Within hours, hundreds of couples had contacted the church with adoption offers, according to Holy Trinity staffers.

The parish had to bring in extra staff to field the phone calls flooding in from around the world, including the Netherlands, Puerto Rico and Canada, said Martha Drennan, the parish's director of Adult Faith Formation & Liturgy.

In addition, Vander Woude received upwards of 600 e-mails, Drennan said. "It has to be well over 1,000 couples who were interested in adopting the baby," she said.

"It's really beautiful," said Vander Woude. "Here you have this unborn babe with handicaps and all these people almost immediately offer to take care of it. It's just really a testament to the goodness of people."

READ MORE: Dad's confession: I almost left my disabled daughter

On Tuesday, a local adoption agency presented three prospective families to the pregnant couple. Drennan said the church is not disclosing the name of the adoption agency, which screened prospective adopters, to protect the biological parents' privacy.

"It was so exciting to see all those people stepping up to give that baby a voice - a life," said Geraldine Erikson, a member of Holy Trinity who posted Vander Woude's urgent message on the church's Facebook page.

Erikson, who manages the church's social media accounts, also said she sent an e-mail blast to 140 families on a Yahoo discussion board for homeschooling families

Dozens of Catholic Facebook groups, as well as international media, have jumped on the story.

"I was doing a search this morning and saw some articles in languages I don't understand," Erikson said.

The Catholic Church teaches that all life is sacred and strongly advocates against abortion – but the story is even more personal for Vander Woude. The 47-year-old priest has a brother, Joseph, who has Down syndrome.

The priest's father, Thomas Vander Woude, died in 2008 after diving in a septic tank to save Joseph, who had fallen in while walking in the backyard.

"With our experience with my little brother Josie, this is something that is close to my heart for sure," said the priest.

More than 70 priests attended Thomas Vander Woude's funeral at Holy Trinity Church, including his eldest son, Thomas Jr., who officiated at the Mass and delivered the homily.

It's not unusual for families to find children with Down syndrome to adopt on social media,  said Diane Grover, founder and president of the International Down Syndrome Coalition. In fact, several of the coalition's board members have adopted children after seeing a Facebook post, she said.

"It's a beautiful way for people to get the information out there," Grover said. After checking to make sure the story was true, the coalition helped spread the word on social media about Vander Woude's message and received hundreds of calls in return, she said.

"Its a good eye-opener for our society to see that so many families value a child with Down syndrome like any other child and want to raise them as their own," said Jon Coleman, president of the National Down Syndrome Society.

"People with Down syndrome are making great strides in living more independently, attending college and working. With the proper support, they can do so much if given the opportunity."

READ MORE: Breakfast, lunch and hugs at Tim's Place

- CNN Belief Blog Editor

Filed under: Abortion • Catholic Church • Church • Faith • Faith & Health • Virginia

soundoff (807 Responses)
  1. Angelo

    The biological parents should watch this video. The story of how this little angel won over her dad's love was featured some time ago on CNN.

    [youtube=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rpmLc8s4OWM&w=640&h=390]

    July 11, 2013 at 5:21 pm |
    • lionlylamb2013

      "I am so sorry Lord Christ Jesus for my continually being misguided and ever running away from your loving kindness! I am nothing without your father's mercies and beg you to be kind to others who neglect and defame others without mercy! The shame is mine Lord, the shame is mine."

      July 11, 2013 at 6:14 pm |
  2. DfiantWolfe

    This is an excellent example of a woman exercising her right to choose what she does with her body, She's chosen to allow another couple to raise this child. She COULD have chosen to abort the baby but she didn't, and that was her choice.

    This doesn't mean that everyone else has to choose the same route that she did, she's a good example to everyone, but let's not use this as justification to remove the choice from other women.

    July 11, 2013 at 5:20 pm |
    • Vic

      The parents were going to abort and gave ultimatum by the end of the day! If it were not for the church acting promptly, the baby would have been aborted already!

      July 11, 2013 at 5:31 pm |
    • Damocles

      @vic

      I find the whole 'ultimatum' thing a bit sketchy

      July 11, 2013 at 5:37 pm |
    • Ebay

      I wouldn't call it an ultimatum, that sounds bad. It's more like the bid is closing.

      July 11, 2013 at 5:45 pm |
  3. Roger

    While I have sympathy for all concerned, I can't help wonder why bring in a life in this world and make it 'suffer' – life is not easy for the able persons either, why make that disabled baby go thru the suffering for next 50-60 years.

    July 11, 2013 at 5:10 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      A person dealing with downs is not necessarily "suffering". My niece has downs and functions pretty well. This is about the parents. They are making a choice (pro choice). Some say the parents are wrong and don't want to deal with a downs child. I say the parents may not be able to properly care for the child and believe someone else can do a better job.

      July 11, 2013 at 5:22 pm |
    • Ginger

      Why would you assume a person with Down Syndrome is suffering? I have a feeling you don't know anyone with Down Syndrome.

      July 11, 2013 at 5:25 pm |
    • Roger

      Thanks Ken for making that clear. Unfortunately I've seen only one kind of down syndrome kids who are wheel chair bound and completely dependent on their parents and I feel for those parents because it puts a lot of burden on them.
      It looks like I'm not fully informed – I'm reading up – thanks again.

      July 11, 2013 at 5:30 pm |
    • allyandoscar

      Obviously you do not know anyone with Down Syndrome if you think they live a life of suffering. They are some of the happiest , most caring people I know.

      July 11, 2013 at 5:36 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      @Roger......................I guess there are different levels of downs. I'm sure it appears they are suffering compared to us. Since they know no other way of life, it isn't suffering to them.

      July 11, 2013 at 5:47 pm |
  4. Cpt. Obvious

    Get Clued, you should feel about it however you think you should feel about it. Believe whatever you want to as well. After all, it's only your opinion that matters.

    July 11, 2013 at 4:13 pm |
  5. Get Clued

    Censorship is just wrong in any form in my opinion. Let the voices be heard. Even if the words make your blood boil, every person has a right to speak his/her mind.

    Served in the 82nd Airborne years ago and it wasn't to be censored and spied on...

    July 11, 2013 at 4:13 pm |
  6. godless morons

    Not surprised.

    CNN, bunch of godless and spineless morons. Just like the rest of the idiots posting vile comments.

    July 11, 2013 at 4:09 pm |
  7. John Cram

    So why don't they just post an ad on Facebook for the other MILLION kids waiting for a home that are already born? Is there just a better "market" for kids with down?

    This story has all the makings of a fairytale.

    July 11, 2013 at 4:06 pm |
    • Just a thought...

      I don't understand why adoption has to be such a long winded and expensive process. Anyone can have a child naturally without first passing a background check or getting permission from anyone else, so why should adoption be any different?

      July 11, 2013 at 4:10 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      @just..................Because the adoption agency doesn't want to deal with the aggravation if the foster parents hurt/kill the child This way the agency can cover it's azz in the event something happens by saying they covered all bases.

      July 11, 2013 at 4:15 pm |
    • Get Clued

      ...a suggestion was brought up yesterday regarding sterilizing everyone at birth and only allowing people that are self sufficient to reverse the process and procreate. I think that would be a great solution. Not one of us can own a giraffe as we lack the ability to properly care for it. Just sayin'...

      July 11, 2013 at 4:16 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      @clued..................OK you first in line.

      July 11, 2013 at 4:21 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      I discussed people perhaps needing a license to have children but I said nothing about "sterilization." Are you lying, Get Clued?

      July 11, 2013 at 4:41 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      No, wait, you are lying. Nobody said "sterilized at birth."

      July 11, 2013 at 4:43 pm |
  8. Get Clued

    I've never seen all the comments by one person wiped out...I guess I should be proud of myself...

    July 11, 2013 at 4:06 pm |
  9. John Cram

    Rock on whoever you are and keep posting, they can't shut ALL the voices down!

    July 11, 2013 at 4:05 pm |
  10. Get Clued

    What other explanation could there be?

    July 11, 2013 at 4:00 pm |
  11. Cpt. Obvious

    Are you sure that's the only explanation?

    July 11, 2013 at 3:59 pm |
  12. bostontola

    Well done Fr. Vander Woude.

    And to the people calling atheists "god haters", I don't hate your god, just like I don't hate Lex Luthor.

    July 11, 2013 at 3:54 pm |
  13. Portland tony

    Yes, if we are to. stop abortions this is a great step in the right direction. I'm so sickened by "right to lifers" who say "save the unborn" without giving a damn about what happens next. Poverty, foster homes, malnutrition,and so on. Let's care for the newborn child too..

    July 11, 2013 at 3:50 pm |
    • LOLogic

      Right... using the logic of "thinking about what's next," then I suppose just about all of the fetuses in Africa should be aborted. Who would want to grow up in a war-torn country where disease and famine is rampant? Maybe we could take a survey and ask those with Down Syndrome if they would have rather been aborted...

      July 11, 2013 at 3:54 pm |
    • Kris

      Oftentimes a person opposes abortion for the simple reason that no human has the right to take the life of another. There's no grand philosophy behind it, no religious motivation, just plain, simple morality and a universal acceptance of the decree 'do not kill'.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:59 pm |
    • JustRight

      @LOLogic...

      I like that your handle is "laugh out loud logic" because thats what i did when i read your logic

      July 11, 2013 at 3:59 pm |
    • Portland tony

      @Lologic: Brilliant.....Then there would be no wars, famine or disease. There, of course, would be no one left to suffer or complain....Huh? Your world would now be perfect!

      July 11, 2013 at 4:32 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      Why would you want to stop abortions? In some cases an abortion is needed to save the life of the mother, If the fetus will not survive, in the event of a crime or the mother's circu'mstances change beyond her control.

      July 11, 2013 at 4:32 pm |
  14. Xiomarita

    I am pro-choice, however, I commend this priest for actually finding a solution to this unwanted pregnancy. It is disheartening to see so-called pro-lifers rail at women facing unwanted pregnancies, but not offering solutions to their dilemmas. I cannot in good conscience judge women who opt for an abortion and not offer a penny to help them if they keep the child. That's the easy way out. Finally someone decides not to judge the parents and instead offered a viable solution. We need more priests like him!

    In response to lionlylamb2013: I feel very sorry for you that you don't see the good in other people. As the parent of a child with disabilities, I know the hoops the governments makes you jump every month to obtain a monthly amount that doesnt begin to cover the costs related to a child's disability. I feel even sorrier that you would be so cynical about providing assistance to a helpless child. I can only hope that you grow a heart someday, for your very own sake.

    July 11, 2013 at 3:45 pm |
    • My Dog is a jealous Dog

      I would think though, if you wanted to adopt a disabled child, that you should have the financial ability to raise that child without government assistance.

      July 11, 2013 at 4:07 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      You should have the financial ability to raise any child whether the child is healthy or not. Why are you against govt. help? If the parents are unemployed do you want the child to starve? The govt. role is to help the people. Keep in mind, one day you may be unable to help yourself. Should you just go and jump into an garbage can.

      July 11, 2013 at 4:39 pm |
    • My Dog is a jealous Dog

      @Ken

      If you were addressing me, I am not against government assistance for the disabled. I am against allowing couples that would need government assistance to adopt disabled children. I you want to adopt a disabled child – you need to be able to provide for that child without government assistance. I have seen the foster care system, and there are far too many "parents" in the system that are there simply for the money, and have little concern for the children.

      July 11, 2013 at 4:52 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      So only the well to do should adopt disabled children? If a parent is only interested in the money, they shouldn't get the child in the first place. If a parent truly wants to help the child and have a genuine plan to raise that child. Govt. help shouldn't matter.

      July 11, 2013 at 5:12 pm |
    • lionlylamb2013

      dear Xiomarita,

      Your sullenly written verboseness are deafening to my ambiguities natural contorts which become contentious misgivings upon other folks demeanors. Just based upon your causalities to render me your sorrow fields when you know little to practically nothing about my Life experiences, you have no rights to feel sorrows for me based upon a little fragment of my perceptions and my unknown to you ongoing struggles with my Life.

      Life is but an acquittal of unreasoned measuring within my faceted shenanigans of societal woes hurled against unwary ones who were never the faulted but I became other's brunt jokes among the socially deplorable so called friends in sheepskins that if sheared would reveal their wolfish natures. Still, I remain a reclusive extrovert staying far and further away from society's woeful perplexities that many folks find themselves arbitrarily caught up in and many of ill-willed social dispensations becoming as jousting figurations ever taking it on the chin for the other's sakes. You know nothing about me that os worthy of making mention of.

      Keep your sorrows Xiomarita. for I am not yours to feel sorrows for,,,

      July 11, 2013 at 5:25 pm |
    • .

      Just remember LL is the belief blog psuedo intellect, just laugh at their comments and move on.

      Which God?

      LL threw up his brain cell, again.
      July 11, 2013 at 12:49 pm | Report abuse |
      Candiano

      And yet I got Dot's meaning immediately. There is something to be said for speaking plainly; understanding a point one is trying to make. When a person's eyes glaze over reading a post, it isn't the fault of the reader. It's the fault of the communicator who is more interested in trying to sound intellectual rather than conveying a succinct point.

      In other words, I didn't get past the first two sentences. And before you mangle my name trying to be clever: don't. It looks immature.
      July 11, 2013 at 12:51 pm | Report abuse |

      .

      A pseudo intellect is someone who acts pretentiously and wishes to impress, rather than modestly trying to communicate effectively uses rhetoric over content.
      July 11, 2013 at 1:08 pm | Report abuse |
      Candiano

      Three words: buy a diary.

      Dot: exactly. And I most definitely am not impressed.
      July 11, 2013 at 1:15 pm | Report abuse |

      Yo!

      Hey guys stop picking on LL and just recognize this poor soul suffers from low self esteem issues and this is how they compensate for it.
      July 11, 2013 at 1:26 pm | Report abuse |

      Candiano

      And calling people "simpletons" because they don't want to slough through a bunch of randomly strung-together words to figure out a simple message is disingenuous, and the sure sign of a vain, prideful pseudo intellect who cannot communicate effectively.
      Although it is telling that you would put the onus on the person receiving the message, and being dismissive of their ability to comprehend your incomprehensible way of writing, rather than to look at yourself and the way you communicate.
      If you talk this way, you are likely friendless.
      July 11, 2013 at 1:37 pm | Report abuse |

      July 11, 2013 at 5:27 pm |
  15. lionlylamb2013

    Many couples endure their wantonness for financially consecrated abortions by which no physical malady regarding their abortion "practices" are to be found. Why then when one knows their fetus's physical ailment(s) bring it to full term? I find such parents as in this blog to be at odds with their mindset worries but to put up for adoption is a sorry way of indecisiveness regarding their foolish reasoning abilities. Potential adoptees of this child see only the money to be made from governmental disability securities.

    July 11, 2013 at 3:31 pm |
    • Logan

      @lionlylamb2013

      "Potential adoptees of this child see only the money to be made from governmental disability securities." You really shouldn't be so judgemental in your decision making. It is possible that whoever wants to adopt this child truly wants to share their love and raise it in a nurtured environment.

      I can see by your post that you tend to have a negitive outlook on life and in most people. Try and find the good in people and there intentions and you will have a happier and more fullfilling life yourself.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:40 pm |
    • Akira

      Are you espousing abortion in this situation?
      And I know parents with a child who has DS, and parents who have a developmentally challenged daughter. They are loving parents who do not rely on the government for anything at all.
      I think you are thinking of the professional foster-child people, some who have make their income caring for children in the foster-care system. These people do get extra money for caring for mentally-challenged children, but they do not get to pick who they foster.
      It's not all cut-and-dried, LL.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:45 pm |
    • lionlylamb2013

      Sired Logan,

      If and that's a big IF, I were to spend most of my time seeing all the goodness issues in mankind's livelihoods, I would be no better off than those emotionally lopsided religious conversationalists who know not what they do but give most of their hard earned capital to churches instead of using their monies for their own necessary Life given needs.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:50 pm |
    • lionlylamb2013

      BTW Logan,

      I am negatively positive and positively negative when the issues ensue me to so be. My bi-partisanship issues are sometimes a failure in the eyeing ways of the incensed and bitter complacencies of tawdry ambivalences of many unruly gestations of the riot squads that propagate malicious contentment. I love all of God's first born sonS and hate God himself for his untidiness and revolting pleasantries God has done in our histories passing movements.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:59 pm |
    • lionlylamb2013

      Dearest lady Akira,

      These 'potential parents" of a would be child with a diagnosed physical malady should either abort or take it upon themselves to raise their child instead of bartering it away to the most promising adoptee(s). Here in the USA, there is a growing market around the needs for potential adoptive practices for making money. Heck, even if these parents were to keep their yet to be born child, they could themselves receive governmental disability benefits to help them in raising said child.

      As it is, they are doing a cop out by not taking full responsibilities by using someone else's wants to raise their yet unborn child in order for them to avoid their unreasoned rationalism by scouring the world for someone willing their troubling issues away. As it now is, these parents can only reason out to either abort or give their child up to someone else willing to do the things they themselves cannot fathom to do!

      July 11, 2013 at 4:14 pm |
    • Akira

      Lionly, are you sorry you were born?

      July 11, 2013 at 4:15 pm |
    • lionlylamb2013

      Akira,

      On occasion I wish it was so,,, on other times not so much. But what does my self-deprecation have to do with this blog's post?

      July 11, 2013 at 4:48 pm |
    • Akira

      It doesn't have a thing to do with this blog, Lionly, but that has not stopped either of os from posting off topic, has it?
      I was just curious, that's all.

      July 11, 2013 at 5:02 pm |
    • .

      Just remember LL is the belief blog psuedo intellect, just laugh at their comments and move on.

      Which God?

      LL threw up his brain cell, again.
      July 11, 2013 at 12:49 pm | Report abuse |
      Candiano

      And yet I got Dot's meaning immediately. There is something to be said for speaking plainly; understanding a point one is trying to make. When a person's eyes glaze over reading a post, it isn't the fault of the reader. It's the fault of the communicator who is more interested in trying to sound intellectual rather than conveying a succinct point.

      In other words, I didn't get past the first two sentences. And before you mangle my name trying to be clever: don't. It looks immature.
      July 11, 2013 at 12:51 pm | Report abuse |

      .

      A pseudo intellect is someone who acts pretentiously and wishes to impress, rather than modestly trying to communicate effectively uses rhetoric over content.
      July 11, 2013 at 1:08 pm | Report abuse |
      Candiano

      Three words: buy a diary.

      Dot: exactly. And I most definitely am not impressed.
      July 11, 2013 at 1:15 pm | Report abuse |

      Yo!

      Hey guys stop picking on LL and just recognize this poor soul suffers from low self esteem issues and this is how they compensate for it.
      July 11, 2013 at 1:26 pm | Report abuse |

      Candiano

      And calling people "simpletons" because they don't want to slough through a bunch of randomly strung-together words to figure out a simple message is disingenuous, and the sure sign of a vain, prideful pseudo intellect who cannot communicate effectively.
      Although it is telling that you would put the onus on the person receiving the message, and being dismissive of their ability to comprehend your incomprehensible way of writing, rather than to look at yourself and the way you communicate.
      If you talk this way, you are likely friendless.
      July 11, 2013 at 1:37 pm | Report abuse |.

      July 11, 2013 at 5:29 pm |
    • lionlylamb2013

      Kindly Akira,

      Your personalizing my Life in your wanting to know such things about my conscience accolades tells me you either care or are just randomly curious about my mental perceptions. And yes many of us here have lingering tendencies to post off-topic.

      I tried to commit suicide 3 times but was thwarted by unforeseen forces at each time. Police, 2 times and a locked gate the other time. My anti-psychotic medication has relieved me of suicidal thoughts and even though I am living a shallow social Life, I have little needs for community socialism in the real sense.

      I do fine via my writing here for it is a release of sorts to my wanton willingness to be a participant in a social setting that needs no physical union. If I am being an obtuse tell me or if I am on the wrong track then sway me away.

      July 11, 2013 at 5:46 pm |
  16. DinkyPink

    a priest can post a baby on facebook, but mothers get arrested for doing the same thing on facebook or craigslist. disability or not, I didn't think one could advertise a baby on a social media outlet. ???

    July 11, 2013 at 3:05 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      Fair point.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:16 pm |
    • How about

      Ebay?

      July 11, 2013 at 3:20 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      To be technical, It's not a baby yet. I'm pro choice. So what ever works for the parents is good enough for me.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:24 pm |
    • Barbara

      I must have missed the part where it explained why the parents weren't keeping the child themselves.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:37 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      Well, you could try reading it again to make sure? Then when you posted, you could have said something definite, and then gone on to explain something further.

      I wonder if any missing information about the parents has something to do with their privacy? Nah.....that'd be silly.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:44 pm |
  17. Lucifer's Evil Twin

    9 times out of 10 aren't these stupid Facebook pleas hoaxes?

    July 11, 2013 at 3:02 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      Hmmmmmm....Now that you mention it.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:24 pm |
  18. Abraham would have killed his own son for god.

    "do not abort this beautiful gift from god", gift, wow that is too funny. It makes their super being overlord sound like a big fat jerk. Which it would be if it was real and not BS told to weak minded people who then brainwash their very own children, pathetic.
    Anyway...
    BOW!!!!
    YIELD!!!!!
    KNEEL!!!
    AND GIVE ME YOUR MONEY, ERR UMMM, I MEAN DONATIONS!!!!

    July 11, 2013 at 2:54 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      It's a gift from the fathers pe'nis. If it is a gift from god. Why would god let it get downs syndrome?

      July 11, 2013 at 3:27 pm |
    • Akira

      Lionly...double entendré?

      July 11, 2013 at 3:31 pm |
    • lionlylamb2013

      Hi Ho there Akira,

      Sometimes a good double indemnity leaves others in unwanted triviality,,,

      July 11, 2013 at 3:42 pm |
    • My Dog is a jealous Dog

      @lionly

      Back to your old ways again? I may indeed be a simpleton – so could you please explain exactly what this means?

      "Sometimes a good double indemnity leaves others in unwanted triviality,,,"

      July 11, 2013 at 3:53 pm |
  19. Lycidas

    William Demuth- "CNN seems to want to censor people who point out that many priests bugger little boys."

    Perhaps it's because;
    1. It has nothing to do with the blog topic.
    2. They have no idea what you mean by "many".

    I mean really, is many to you 10%, 1% or maybe .00001%? Do you have any factual numbers to even give a percentage to define your "many" or are you just pulling stuff out you @ss again?

    July 11, 2013 at 2:50 pm |
  20. Monica

    It is really sad that people are willing to snuff out a life because it doesn't meet their expectation. If we went around doing that we would just kill cancer patients as soon as they are diagnosed. We would euthanize infants right out of the womb who have particular diseases or deformities because "they might suffer". I would rather suffer and be alive then allow someone to take my life because my DNA doesn't meet their expectation. If that is the way I feel then I could imagine an infant in the womb would want that opportunity also. Life is not about the suffering, its about the chance to experience life under any condition. Doctors are not right all the time. Life doesn't always meet our expectations. Sometimes when the odds are against a person they turn out to exceed those odds. How many cases have we heard of children or people who were told they would live to a certain age and then they end up living far beyond those days or years? Even if the child in your womb wouldn't live but for a day it is a day worth having been able to try to exceed your life expectancy It pains me that people have such a casual view of life.

    July 11, 2013 at 2:44 pm |
    • Roger that

      I can't think of better proof that there is no omnipotent and omniscient god than when a child born into suffering.

      July 11, 2013 at 2:51 pm |
    • Alias

      It pains me that you have such a casual view of other people suffering.

      July 11, 2013 at 2:51 pm |
    • Just the Facts Ma'am...

      What is sad are people that think they should get to makedifficult decisions for other people just because they "feel" they are right. What is sad is that often those people who "feel" they have the right to decide these life altering decisions for others won't step up to the plate and say "Hey, I know there are 100's of thousands of children on the adoption rolls, but I don't really have the time or money to adopt, but I do have time to tell you why you are an evil person for considering abortion."

      July 11, 2013 at 2:52 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      Incorrect. It simply means that there is not a "good" god. Since there no proof of any god, and an evil one seems somewhat incomprehensible, it [i]implies[/i] that nonbelief is indeed reasonable.

      July 11, 2013 at 2:54 pm |
    • Lycidas

      Roger that- "when a child born into suffering."

      By what standard do you tell if they are suffering? Your own?

      July 11, 2013 at 2:55 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      I know, right, Ly, I mean it always soooooo difficult to know when another person or animal is suffering. Most the time I don't even try.

      July 11, 2013 at 2:58 pm |
    • Mike from CT

      And, of course, that raises a very big question. If a good God made the world why has it gone wrong? And for many years I simply refused to listen to the Christian answers to this question, because I kept on feeling "whatever you say, and however clever your arguments are, isn't it much simpler and easier to say that the world was not made by any intelligent power? Aren't all your arguments simply a complicated attempt to avoid the obvious?" But then that threw me back into another difficulty.
      My argument against God was that the universe seemed so cruel and unjust. But how had I got this idea of just and unjust? A man does not call a line crooked unless he has some idea of a straight line. What was I comparing this universe with when I called it unjust? If the whole show was bad and senseless from A to Z, so to speak, why did I, who was supposed to be part of the show, find myself in such violent reaction against it? A man feels wet when he falls into water, because man is not a water animal: a fish would not feel wet.
      Of course I could have given up my idea of justice by saying it was nothing but a private idea of my own. But if I did that, then my argument against God collapsed too- for the argument depended on saying that the world was really unjust, not simply that it did not happen to please my private fancies. Thus in the very act of trying to prove that God did not exist-in other words,that the whole of reality was senseless-I found I was forced to assume that one part of reality-namely my idea of justice-was full of sense.
      Consequently atheism turns out to be too simple. If the whole universe has no meaning, we should never have found out that it has no meaning: just as, if there were no light in the universe and therefore no creatures with eyes, we should never know it was dark. Dark would be without meaning.

      –CS Lewis "Mere Christianity"

      July 11, 2013 at 3:01 pm |
    • lionlylamb2013

      Hello Monica,

      While I applaud your emotionalist ambitions, we live in a world that needs all its resources and financial obligations which are fast becoming an unsound commodity. A fetus that does not make the grade due its potential or lack thereof are decision to be made by all folks involved considerations. Many people who might adopt children of such malformed ailments tend to do so for monetary rewards. I personally know of a few folks who do this as a means for supporting themselves for: without such monetary gains, they would never adopt an ill child. Sad as it is I would rather die if I were of such for other's ill-gotten monetary gains.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:02 pm |
    • Lycidas

      Pvt. Obvious- "Most the time I don't even try."

      I doubt you try to figure out much of anything.
      Please do not confuse suffering due to physical trauma with genetic defects. They are not always comparable.

      Having downs syndrome, aperts syndrome...etc should not be deemed "suffering". Sure you may look at it that way but for all we know you might look at being ginger as a birth defect. Your feelings only count as far as you and I guess your own offspring.

      I have little faith in humanity when it starts talking about topics like this. If we get to the point where we deem people are suffering for having a genetic defect and are willing to do the simplist fix we can muster up (DEATH) instead of other options....I worry.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:04 pm |
    • Roger that

      Lycidas,

      Excuse my poor grammar. I'm on my phone. I was replying to Monica who said she would rather be alive and suffering. I'm not specifying what is considered suffering. Capt Obvious is correct. It doesn't prove that there is no omnipotent omniscient god. God could be evil or simply not give a crap. After reading the Bible, I think you have to go with evil.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:04 pm |
    • Roger that

      I think you have to go with evil.

      Or deranged.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:07 pm |
    • Alias

      @Mike from CT

      This coppied arguement misses one very important point:
      Christians believe their god will judge everyone and we will eahc get what we deserve. Where is all the injutice you are bothered by if we are unable to avoid final judgement by an all knowing god?

      July 11, 2013 at 3:08 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      Ly, your diction demonstrates you to be an azzhole, and your choice of what topic to engage on from a given writing sample means you're proud of it. What's it like to be proud that you're an azzhole?

      July 11, 2013 at 3:11 pm |
    • Barbara

      Don't like abortion? Don't have one. Leave me alone to make my own decisions. Thank you.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:19 pm |
    • Lycidas

      Well..congratulations Captain..I didn't know CNN made you a moderator.
      I figure that if idiots on here and go off the rails and talk about the existence or non-existence of dieties even though the blog entry here is about other things....I figure I could at least comment on a topic that has to do with the blog.

      Silly me...I should be like you and talk about stuff that has nothing to do with the blog.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:25 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      Ly, no additional evidence was needed, but of course it's expected you would provide it. Do you mind answering the question?

      July 11, 2013 at 3:29 pm |
    • Amy Smith

      What ever happened to minding your own business? How DARE this idiot interfere with a personal and PRIVATE decision.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:31 pm |
    • Ken Margo

      @monica..............Pull your head out your azz. I noticed you didn't complain about the fact we EXECUTE people in this country. Repubs are against reasonable gun control laws despite the fact that gun violence claims over 10,000 lives a year. Repubs are also against healthcare reform. So if you're pro life do me a favor. Raise YOUR taxes to pay for these children. Put your money where your mouth is.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:34 pm |
    • Lycidas

      There was no question that required addressing.

      I implore you to seek help CO. You seem to have a very unhealthy fixation on those that disagree with you. Your passive aggression echoes it very clearly.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:49 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      lol Hit a little too close to home, yesterday, did I? :)

      July 11, 2013 at 3:51 pm |
    • Lycidas

      ??

      Are you denying your comments are passive aggressive?
      Or are you denying that you have a fixation with those that disagree with you?

      It would be hard for you to deny either. The majority of replies that you feel the need to go after are rarely addressed to you at first.

      July 11, 2013 at 3:54 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      Ly, you've left several of my questions unanswered, so I feel no need to answer yours. I thought we were getting somewhere positive yesterday when I was addressing your continual need here to play the jerk. For once, your replies seemed genuine, and not just a cause to be an azzhole.

      So, in essence, yesterday, you fooled me. Good job. I apologize for trying to help you. I will try not to help you in the future. Good luck. I wish you the best, but perhaps you should consider if people are right when they confront you about your att.itutde.

      July 11, 2013 at 4:05 pm |
    • Lycidas

      I tire of this game. If your only defense are long winded ad hominems then there is really nothing to discuss with you.
      No one needs your help. No one asked for your help.
      To let it all sink in, think about what your response would be to a Christian that offers their advice to "help" you when you haven't asked for it.

      Now if you would like to return to the topic of the blog..we can.

      July 11, 2013 at 4:13 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      Whatever you say, Ly, whatever you say.

      July 11, 2013 at 4:15 pm |
    • Mike from CT

      "Where is all the injutice[sic] you are bothered by if we are unable to avoid final judgement by an all knowing god?"
      Can you please rephrase this, it does not seem to make sense

      Where is all the injustice? Right Here.
      Are we able to avoid final judgement ? No.
      Because someone, whether all knowing or not, knows of injustice does that take away the charge of it being unjust? If this is your question the answer is Certainly not.

      If there is no final justice then you must understand that the only conclusion that leads to is Evil will win in the end.

      July 11, 2013 at 4:19 pm |
    • In Santa we trust

      Mike, Fear of reprisal is not why I lead a life that I consider to be not evil; I believe in society and common good not some god for which there is no evidence.

      July 11, 2013 at 4:32 pm |
      • Mike from CT

        "I believe in society and common good"... which there is no evidence.

        What is common good?
        Who gets to define common good? Americans? White Americans?

        July 15, 2013 at 10:51 am |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.