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July 25th, 2010
05:51 PM ET

Status report: Ted Haggard's new church

[cnn-video url= http://www.cnn.com/video/?/video/living/2010/07/19/co.haggard.new.church.kusa%5D

Fallen evangelical leader Ted Haggard says the church he founded last month is quickly gaining new worshippers. KUSA reports.

- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: Christianity • Leaders • Scandal

soundoff (407 Responses)
  1. patraick

    I believe in the Easter bunny, the tooth ferry and Santa- but that's about it, most of the other stories seem like pure rubbish to me. and rising from the dead is impossible, so you can throw that one out...

    come on, get a grip- there is no such thing you wackos!!!!

    July 28, 2010 at 9:23 am |
  2. NewCreature7

    Ted Haggard is asking people to forgive him. That's healthy for him and for us. We should be willing to forgive. Being gay is not natural. It's unhealthy. It's selfishness, a desire to want life on your own terms, but we should forgive. We forgive other unhealthy lifestyles, like selfishness, greed, drug addiction, and alcoholism. We all need forgiveness. That's true love.

    July 28, 2010 at 8:21 am |
    • Gatortarian

      Forgiveness and 10% of you income in this case.

      July 28, 2010 at 8:52 am |
    • Gary

      NewCreature7 ....being gay which I am not is totally normal . its not a choice, Only close minded religious folks can not understand reality

      July 28, 2010 at 11:11 am |
  3. mrrealtime

    Being gay is natural, and admitting it and moving on with life is healthy. The bible is WRONG, and the bible is repulsive, and stupid. Ted is just setting himself up for another fall, really. And its sad to watch.

    July 28, 2010 at 6:35 am |
    • bobross2

      mrrealtime: Being gay is not natural at all... let me provide a definition of natural for you.

      natural: occurring in conformity with the ordinary course of nature.

      So you are saying that it is the ordinary course of nature for 2 members of the same sex to engage in intercourse??? Do you realize the implications of that statement??? If being gay were natural, there would be no humans left because everyone would naturally be gay and the human race would die off. If it were natural, 2 men or 2 women could produce a child. I'm not saying that you have to hate gays, you should treat everyone with respect and love, but you have got some serious thinking to do if you think homosexuality is natural. The bible is not wrong either, it is the inspired word of GOD... it points out that performing homosexual acts is a sin just as performing immoral heterosexual act would be sin. Do not conform to the world my friend because the world is heading in the wrong direction. Conform to God and his word.

      July 28, 2010 at 8:17 am |
    • Joseph MA

      "Animals lack the ability to display human motivation and sentiment. Simply put, animals do not engage in deeply emotional relationships that are based on communication, nostalgia and sentimental factors."

      "The term homos3xuality should be limited to the human species, for in animals the investigator can ascertain only motor behavior. As soon as he interprets the animal's motivation he is applying human psychodynamics-a risky, if not foolhardy scientific approach."

      July 28, 2010 at 11:23 am |
  4. brad1001

    People just love a redeemed sinner. S'ok by me if they want to be fleeced. But you'd think that he'd be recognized as the fake that he is.

    July 28, 2010 at 12:59 am |
  5. Yorkie

    Yorkie here again.
    I just cannot understand why gays spend all their life pushing sh** up hill !

    July 28, 2010 at 12:07 am |
  6. Joseph

    No LouAz I'm actually not the Joseph MA from above...but apparently I sound like him lol. And yea we probably won't change, but I'm enjoying the dialog...as Aristotle once said, the mark of an educated mind is the ability to entertain a thought without accepting it. 😉

    July 27, 2010 at 11:43 pm |
  7. Joseph

    LouAz: I'm not talking about 'me' or 'my God' but rather people of faith, which includes over 90% of the world population. How they use that faith is often another story. Then again arguments regarding morality, even when used against faith, actually often inadvertantly support it by lending credence to universal principles of ethics. Though many may not accept my 'brand' of faith, it is undeniable that the vast majority of humanity does and always has believed in some form of higher purpose and truth. You are the exception, and thus perhaps it is you who are misestimating your own importance.

    Jeff: The 'sense' is a deeper sense of purpose and reality that supercedes or at least lives outside of the bounds of the scientific method, but which cannot be denied if viewed from the standpoint of historical affirmation.

    July 27, 2010 at 11:37 pm |
    • LouAz

      No, you are talking about the judeo-christian god. All the words you use are the same old stuff. Don't you know the halos in all the christian paintings are not real ? "that the vast majority of humanity does and always has believed in some form of higher purpose and truth" ? WTF ? No they don't. One third is trying to kill the other third, in the name of god(s), and the remaining are starving to death. Is this the higher purpose that you refer ? If so, that is more '"jesus loves me" happy talk.
      Vast majority ? What are you some kind of politican or FOX noise reporter. Just how many are the "vast majority" ? Typical christian arrogance !

      July 27, 2010 at 11:55 pm |
  8. Jeff

    "Believing in God is common sense" It is common but where do you get the sense part? Believing in an all powerful sky-being is not my definition of sense.

    July 27, 2010 at 11:22 pm |
  9. verify

    The basic nature of human beings involves survival. Over the ages they have imagined magical beings and superstitions for protection to help ensure that survival - and survival past death... even better!

    July 27, 2010 at 11:22 pm |
  10. Joseph

    Unicorns or any specific historical/traditional story has little to do with the overall consensus of anthropology, which is the spiritual need of man. And my post speaks of all people of faith, not just the Judeo-Christian.

    July 27, 2010 at 11:08 pm |
    • LouAz

      Webster – anthropology- noun, the study of humans, esp. of the variety, physical and cultural characteristics, distribution, customs, social relationships, etc. of humanity.
      Webster – religion – noun, belief in a divine or superhuman power or powers to be obeyed and worshiped as the creator(s) and ruler(s) of the universe b) expression of such a belief in conduct and ritual .
      Let's not substitute anthropology for religion.

      July 27, 2010 at 11:16 pm |
  11. Joseph

    A believer is someone who has placed faith in God, period. A logical believer is a person who has placed faith in God, but also understands and employs science/reason in their paradigm, both in what it can consistently explain and in what it cannot.

    July 27, 2010 at 11:04 pm |
    • LouAz

      Webster – paradigm – noun, an overall concept accepted by most people in an intellectual community, as those in one of the natural sciences, because of its effectiveness in explaining a complex process, idea, or set of data.
      See the "most people" ? You did not answer about the two thirds of humanity that thinks you and your god are dung. There are also a considerable number of humans in the remaining one third that also think of you and your god the same as the two thirds. I think you have a highly inflated sense of your own importance in the universe.

      July 27, 2010 at 11:23 pm |
  12. Joseph

    In other words, believers define God as the personal being who is the embodiment and prime cause of good, truth, purpose, and reality. Science is great and necessary, but it’s obviously not capable of delivering us the whole story; more is needed. The whole of human history (the Bible included) affirms that humans thirst for purpose, truth, and interaction with the God, and that the God has interacted with man personally. These are not just accounts of history or fairy tales we are somehow taught to believe against our nature, they are historical affirmations of what people feel now and will always feel as long as we are human.

    July 27, 2010 at 10:53 pm |
    • NL

      I appreciate that is what you believe, but what evidence can you offer to convince a non-believer? What you are offering is testimony as to the character of your belief, not evidence as to it's validity. You are making claims, but can you prove them?

      July 28, 2010 at 12:16 am |
  13. Joseph

    At their deepest level, people (both individuals and the cultures of history) believe in God because across the board they seem to possess an inherent spiritual need for something deeper and higher than themselves. It's truly against our nature as humans to think our existence, or existence in general, is random and without purpose. Even staunch naturalists try to conjure up purpose in a universe that to them is completely random. Often this spiritual ideas have been mixed with greed and hunger for power, or rather used in the cause of greed and hunger for power. This does not invalidate spirituality, it only proves that some people will go to any extent to achieve their personal amibitions, whatever they may be.

    There is no direct proof per say that God exists, or does not. But the vast majority of people have taken a step back from the 'trees' and viewed the 'forest,' if you will, and concluded that there is ultimately purpose, meaning, and beauty in existence. Some would argue that this very blog, full of passion on both sides for what is true and real, demonstrates the need for ultimate truth and good (versus lies and evil).

    Reason indeed speaks to our need as rational beings to understand the natural world and operate in it. But for most reason alone is not enough for fulfillment. Thus we have faith, which speaks to the world of the unseen, of revealed knowledge, of the master plan behind every stroke of the brush that God has painted.

    To the logical believer, God has not performed a lot of grand interventions in the course of history. He created a universe fine tuned to support and bring about life, that really did not need intervention. When rational beings evolved, he then came with an intervention: the individual revelation, relationship, and interaction with people that he has always done since people have existed. These aren't large fanciful manifestations, but they are interactions undeniable to people of faith, which can neither be suppored nor refuted by scientific methods, for they are wholly out of the realm of the types of hypotheses science, which has its limitations, can test. Science, which is reason, does not disallow these types of occurrences, but it does not have the means to prove them either. That is why the whole of human experience shows that people are much larger and deeper than a neurological intellect: we are deep creatures, formed in the likeness of God.

    July 27, 2010 at 10:13 pm |
    • LouAz

      You left out the part about the Unicorn.
      But please expalin the difference between a "logical believer" and just a regular "believer".

      July 27, 2010 at 10:56 pm |
    • verify

      The basic nature of human beings involves SURVIVAL. Over the ages they have imagined magical beings and superstitions for protection to help ensure that survival – and survival past death... even better!

      July 27, 2010 at 11:38 pm |
    • NL

      "a universe fine tuned to support and bring about life,"
      Most of the universe cannot support life. Most of our solar system cannot support life. Finely tuned, indeed?

      July 27, 2010 at 11:49 pm |
  14. Surthurfurd

    I am a Christian and I find the actions of Haggard to be repulsive. I am all for forgiveness. His shames are between him and those whom he has harmed as well as God. The problem we have is this cult of personality.

    I hold not animosity against him. I just do not see where he has escaped his selfishness. Jesus asks us all to support each other. We are to love each other. Yet, far too many people believe Christianity is about exclusion and degrading people who sin no more than any of us. We need to turn back to Jesus not fall back on Fundamentalism.

    July 27, 2010 at 10:09 pm |
  15. Shelly

    This is in response to all the non-believers. If you choose to not believe in Jesus that is your choice. Stop disrespectiing those who do believe in Jesus. Believers are not gulliable or delusional. We are faithful. We are human just like everyone else. Respect others beliefs

    July 27, 2010 at 9:29 pm |
    • NL

      No disrespect, just afford us the same courtesy and respect our... ah, disbelief. Now, are you here to discuss your reasons for believing, or is that taboo?

      July 27, 2010 at 10:09 pm |
    • Ned Racine

      I do disrespect the religious. They are, after all, delusional. I "disrespect" them in the same sense I disrespect those who believe in the Easter Bunny, believe in astrology, or who hear voices. Those who hear voices do so out of illness, however. Those who choose to "believe" in God do so out of choice, although many are also mentally ill.

      We need to stop "respecting" religion. It is a lie. It hurts people. It is taught to young children and it then hurts them. It isn't cute to teach children lies. It is child abuse. We would never feel it is acceptable to teach children that the Germans won WWII, or that the boogy monster really exists, but we find it acceptable to lie to children about this. So yes, I "disrespect" the religious, and anyone that cares about society and our children should do so as well.

      July 28, 2010 at 9:34 am |
    • Luke

      Shelly – Sure Shelly, I'm down. But could you please do me a favor and have the leaders of your faithful flock stay out of the science classroom, get them to start distributing condoms to HIV ravaged African nations, stop killing each other all over the world and perhaps even stop undermining the education of our children? Stopping Genital mutilation would be good too. Let's start there. When you get done with those, we'll talk agian. Cool?

      July 28, 2010 at 9:45 am |
    • Luke

      Shelly – Sure Shelly, I'm down. But could you please do me a favor and have the leaders of your faithful flock stay out of the science classroom, get them to start distributing protection to HIV ravaged African nations, stop killing each other all over the world and perhaps even stop undermining the education of our children? Stopping genital mutilation would be good too. Let's start there. When you get done with those, we'll talk again. Cool?

      July 28, 2010 at 9:59 am |
    • D

      Shelly, please worship who you want, where you want, and with whoever you want to worhip with. And I truly hope you enjoy it and it brings you whatever you are looking for.

      That said, the message you can take back to your people is this...Don't you dare tell ANYONE how to run their life and what they can or can't do. And don't waste your time praying for someone else b/c you do not agree with them, use your prayers on your family and yourself.

      If everyone follows the simple advice you are throwing around, this world would be a better place.

      July 28, 2010 at 11:33 am |
  16. shinden58

    Luke did a great job or articulating science. I feel sorry for others who fail to believe in things that are based on fact. And no the bible is not fact it is merely a bunch of stories, not necessarily based on fact.

    July 27, 2010 at 9:20 pm |
    • Luke

      Shinden. What is Shinden? I like that word. Looks Japanese in nature.

      July 28, 2010 at 9:41 am |
  17. Joe

    Haggard is a bone smuggling tweeker. The fact that anyone would show up at his church just proves how delusional the "faithfull" are.

    July 27, 2010 at 9:09 pm |
  18. Brion

    Ahhhhhhh...it will not take my full post. Disreguard all of the above. It makes no sense out of order.

    July 27, 2010 at 8:04 pm |
  19. Brion

    Man, this system is terrible. Disregard all of the above...it makes no sense out of order.

    July 27, 2010 at 7:58 pm |
  20. Brion

    For instance, most scholars reject the idea that Genesis 1-2 is historical narrative. Instead, the genre of Genesis 1-2 is analogous to poetic literature. Hence, the poetic structure matching the content of days 1 with 4, 2 with 5, 3 and 6. If you read Genesis 1 you will instantly see this structure. The writer never intended to offer a scientific or chronological explanation of the origin of the earth. And we should not read it as if he did. The Hebrew word used for day is the Hebrew word ‘yom.’ We know that this word was used in many ways. In the case of Genesis 1, it is used to assist the intended stylized structure. Genesis 1 is also making no commentary on the evolution of life. Since the creation is account is highly stylized, imposing on it the claim that it offers an explanation for the tremendous diversity in organic life is...well...silly.

    July 27, 2010 at 7:55 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.