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September 3rd, 2010
11:25 AM ET
Religious leaders hit back at Hawking on Godless creationReligious leaders in Britain on Friday hit back at claims by leading physicist Stephen Hawking that God had no role in the creation of the universe. In his new book "The Grand Design," Britain's most famous scientist says that given the existence of gravity, "the universe can and will create itself from nothing," according to an excerpt published in The Times of London. "Spontaneous creation is the reason why there is something rather than nothing, why the universe exists, why we exist," he wrote. "It is not necessary to invoke God to light the blue touch paper [fuse] and set the universe going."
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.  |
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I believe that "God" comprises of an intelligent entity that we currently cannot see, detect or understand (yet). This intelligent entity exists outwith our current Laws of Physics, and comprises of an energy source and transcends space and time. This entity is "eternal" and has existed since before the beginning of time (as we know it). In fact, since this entity created the Universe (as we know it) and the Laws of Physics (that help to sell Stephen Hawking books, amongst a few other things) then the concept of "infinity" does not apply, since before the Laws of Physics were created there was no concept of time. The energy for the creation of the Universe (as we know it) came from this intelligent energy entity (that we called God). That is, God created the Universe out of "himself". I believe that Stephen Hawking is dead wrong, and he has got himself so tied up in complex (hypothetical) physics that he cannot see the wood for the trees. But I'll probably still read his book – to try to understand why he has got it so wrong. I do think that one day Man will develop his/her knowledge enough to understand the Physics of God. It would therefore be helpful if genius' like Stephen Hawking spent as much time trying to understand the Physics of God as they do in debunking God (and trying to destroy so many People's religious beliefs as they do so).
He' not perfect. Its not like he's Jesus or something, I guarantee you he can't walk on water.
Neither did the Robin Hood like figure known as Jesus. He was just a rebel against the Romans – not a miracle maker.
The heavens are full of fools -poor little man he is struggling and he is trying to prove to him self that his butt just came into being. maybe in the dark corners of his mind there are more deeper issues ,like why he came out the way he did and blames God and hates God, if only one could start to intrude into the mine of a great mad man!
" ...if only one could start to intrude into the mine of a great mad man!"
Oh, so now Prof Hawking is mad? Actually, you don't need to intrude into his mind, he's already invited you in. Just read any of his writings or attend any of his lectures or other speaking engagements.
Christ! Some people...and I suppose I'll fry for eternity for say that will I!
Accept religion for what it is. It's been responsible for war, death, starvation, mutilation, cruelty than anything else in this fragile planet's existence.
Religion is something for people to cling to in hope.
Get real.
@michael
You said, "like why he came out the way he did and blames God and hates God, if only one could start to intrude into the mine of a great mad man!"
It is despicable that people would claim Hawking's views are due to his affliction. It is a blow below the belt, but I guess in the mind of a fundie, all is fair.
Prof. Hawking isn't basing his theory on his feelings about god. Hawking is not at war with god.
He is world famous. He would discredit himself and end his career if he did that. His peers would crucify him. ( oops! bad choice of words?)
Scientists are not setting out to to destroy religion. They couldn't if they wanted to. There is no way anyone, in his country, is going to make you believe something you don't want to. You can believe in leprechauns if you want.
Science can lead you to the truth, but science cannot make you think. Thinking is optional.
What are you fundies so afraid of? If god really does exist, then science will eventually arrive at that conclusion, or Jesus or Mohammed or whoever will come back and enlighten us.
Truth will always come out. If there is a god, science will find him.
If science rules god out...why, you can always close your eyes, cover your ears and scream, "Is not! Is not!"
God always provides a way my fundies. God always provides a way.
But, I bet they don't LOL!
@michael
You said, "like why he came out the way he did and blames God and hates God, if only one could start to intrude into the mine of a great mad man!"
It is wrong that people would claim Hawking's views are due to his affliction. It is a blow below the belt, but I guess in the mind of a fundie, all is fair.
Prof. Hawking isn't basing his theory on his feelings about god. Hawking is not at war with god.
He is world famous. He would discredit himself and end his career if he did that. His peers would crucify him. (oops! bad choice of words?)
Scientists are not setting out to to destroy religion. They couldn't if they wanted to. There is no way anyone, in his country, is going to make you believe something you don't want to. You can believe in leprechauns if you want.
Science can lead you to the truth, but science cannot make you think. Thinking is optional. Thinking is scary.
What are you fundies so afraid of? If god really does exist, then science will eventually arrive at that conclusion, or Jesus or Mohammed or whoever will come back and enlighten us.
Truth will always come out. If there is a god, science will find him.
If science rules god out...why, you can always close your eyes, cover your ears and scream, "Is not! Is not!"
God always provides a way my little fundies. God always provides a way.
Who cares what Hawking thinks? It proves nothing one way or the other its just his theory. Relax people!
It bugs them that there are people who can't be bullied into shutting up about the truth. People who aren't afraid to tell the children that Santa isn't real. People willing to shed light into the few remaining dark corners. They are angry that the Church doesn't have the power to force Hawking to retract what he has found like it did Galileo.
I forgot, it bugs them most that science doesn't discover anything to lessen their need for blind faith, but is, in fact, making it harder and harder to believe.
So where did the gravity come from? His book will end up in the ash heap along with Origin of Species. Who is Stephen Hawking, anyway. I suppose 1 + 1 = 3 now, too? The Great and Powerful Oz, er uh, I mean Stephen Hawking, has spoken! You'll excuse me if I don't rip up my Bible and tell the last person out of the church to 'turn the lights off'.
Origin of Species is in the ash heap? This is news to the rest of the sentient world. By the way, what is your explanation of gravity? Is the hand of the Almighty holding you down, or are you a proponent of Intelligent Falling? That you chose to remain clueless will in no way impede the rest of the world from advancing, thank you very much.
Keith-
"Who is Stephen Hawking, anyway."
A pretty good summation of his education, works, research, many accomplishments, awards, distinctions and other aspects of his qualification to make this scientific conclusion are easily found at Wikipedia and other sites. He probably has more education than all the teachers you've ever had combined. I tell you this because it's rather sad to witness how your posts have degraded to nothing more than childish rantings.
Keep clinging to that bible, the all powerful book of knowledge that has all the answers to life's problems. Don't bother reading anything else, and burn all those evil science books that contradict everything you've come to know and believe in from your precious verses. Heck, ignore the fact that there are contradictions even within the pages of your own book, and let's not forget that there are countless different versions that have been translated through multiple iterations of very diverse languages and cultures. But the real question is why would someone blindly follow the words of a single book and vehemently refuse to consider any other perspectives or points of view?? Oh yeah, because the book tells you to.
If there is no God, then let's have this talk after were all dead.....oh wait. :[
I think Stephen Hawkins should stick to science. God is not part of any scientific theory or study. There has not been any evidence of God or gods in science, so SH should not be concerned about the issue of God in his scientific theories and studies. As long as those that believe in God do not try and bring God into the scientific relm they should be left alone.
Saying that the universe could create itself without the help of a god is science.
Now, does religion have a right to speak on scientific issues?
@ David
I have no problems taking my chances with Jesus Christ because of His teachings of peace and love. You touched on one of the main reasons I believe in Christianity... we don't have any "infidels" in our religion. We are tought to love all people and treat everyone equally. I would sincerly question any religion not teaching those same beliefs... including Islam.
Jesus said that you can whip a slave who deliberately disobeys his master more severely than a slave who disobeys the master without knowing it (Luke 12:47). Jesus tell his disciples to steal a horse (Mark 2:23). He said you should castrate yourself to enter heaven (Matthew 15:22-28. Many religious men have done this to themselves, and ministers did it to male children to keep their choirs intact). There are many other examples of Jesus's cruelty and stupid advice in the gospels.
Jesus is love? Perhaps you should re-read your bible. Jesus showed tremendous cruelty and was probably mentally ill.
How do you know your god is the one true god? Because of a feeling in your heart? The members of all the religions and denominations, feel their god in their heart.
So what is your proof? Is it the King James? The King James contains errors. If there is even one error, how can you trust any of it?
All the great religions have their religious texts and bibles. How do you know one of their's isn't the true word of god(s)?
A person's beliefs are largely based on two factors: Where they live and what religion their parents practiced.
No child is born a Christian, or a follower of Islam, or a Baptist, or a Catholic. or any other religion. The parents start to program in their desired religion, almost at birth.
The US has heavy Christian influence.
If you were born and raised in Iran, there is almost a 100% chance that you would be bleating, "Allahu Akbar".
There are more than 1000 different denominations of Christianity. Each of these, can show you passages in the bible, that theirs is the one the baby Jesus loves best.
You have no proof except for a feeling in your heart and a flawed bible.
Someday, in the not too distant future, ALL religions will die the natural death they deserve. Humankind will then finally be able to advance from a superstitious caveman mentality to one based on simple ethics and the scientific method. If we don't, we are doomed. The oncoming collapse of the Roman Catholic Church over the sexual abuse of young boys by priests is a wonderfully encouraging sign.
Here's a thought...
I believe in God and Jesus Christ. If I'm wrong, in the end I just turn into dirt. If your wrong, you spend eternity in hell. That's one heck of a gamble, and I wish you all the best of luck... hoping for your sake that I am wrong.
@Scott
Your argument is just another variation of "believe/behave or the bogey man will get you!" I don't believe in bogey men, and have the courage of my convictions to say so, unlike may supposed believers that are just hedging their bets. My gamble, if I'm maing one and I don't believe I am, is that if I life a moral and legal life, and do want I can to help others, and I'm wrong about bogey men, they'll understand. And don't even think about claiming that a bogey man and a mythical mystical book is required to live a good life.
@Scott McDaniel
You said, "I believe in God and Jesus Christ. If I'm wrong, in the end I just turn into dirt. If your wrong, you spend eternity in hell. That's one heck of a gamble, and I wish you all the best of luck... hoping for your sake that I am wrong."
Hmmm...Maybe not Scott. What if the one true religion is Islam? The followers of Islam think Christians are infidels. They think Christians are going to hell. There are over 1000 different Christian denominations. Many believe only their members will be saved. Did you pick the right one? There is always risk Scott. You could very well find yourself at a very large barbecue.
If there is no god, then there is no everlasting life. That makes this life the only life. The time you spend worshipping a nonexistent god is a waste of your time. When you are dead, you might wish you had that time back. LOL.
@ HotAirAce
There's no question you have your mind made up on this subject, and I wouldn't expect your lifetime of experiances and beliefs be changed due to a CNN article comment section. All I can do is wish you the best of luck in this life and the next and remind you that if you ever do decide to change your mind, God would be very happy to have you.
charlene
@ scott..if you and i believe in god and jesus.. only to find out we are wrong and there is nothing after death.... then you as a believer in god can not possibly believe in HELL . where god sent his angel that turned on him, to suffer the pain of never. being able to be in gods presence again... god created hell... so your theory does not wash by your own definition.
Scott wrote: I believe in God and Jesus Christ. If I'm wrong, in the end I just turn into dirt. If your wrong, you spend eternity in hell. That's one heck of a gamble, and I wish you all the best of luck... hoping for your sake that I am wrong.
... ... ...
I respond:
The average person lives about 75 years. But in your mind, if I steal a potato chip and then get hit by a potato chip truck later the same day and die, I go to hell, not just for a lifetime, not just for a million years but for 13.7 billion years to the power of 13.7 billion and then some. All because I died without a pure heart. Hell was invented for and by comedians so go join the comedy circuit.
It simply amazes me how many people cannot even see the futility in their own arguments. While I respect everyone's right to believe whatever it is they want to believe, attempting to explain logic to anyone who accepts anything on blind faith is pointless. There are so many contradictions of logic that must be accepted in order for anyone to truly believe in any modern day religion, but yet so many people refuse to have faith in their own reasoning abilities that they just follow along, smiling and nodding, because religion fills their psychological needs. I actually really like Jack's argument and it's similar to one I've been making for years: If your "God" made me, then it was "He" who gave me my critical thinking abilities and designed my brain to make it impossible for me to accept illogical arguments and accept anything on blind faith. Therefore, if "He" exists, and "He" is truly all forgiving, then he couldn't possibly send me to "Hell" for doing exactly what "He" created me to do.
@Kyle
Kyle, Kyle, Kyle...
You are forgetting about free will! God (capital G only because of punctuation rules, not any silly custom to honour a non-existent supreme being) set things in perfect motion, and then we messed it up...
RESPECK
It seems hawking is simply trying to share the logical understanding of the necessity of god without stepping on your non-believing toes.
from a purely mathematical perspective if you can use a concept of infinity in math then you can darn well "believe" it exists in nature. in both time and space.
Some of you will read this and say "ah, just another believer in myths." its ok. just understand that we all believe in myths. whether you think science supports your myth is up to you. I personally believe that most SCIENTIFIC observations of life, the universe and everything, support my belief in God. The observations are so good and useful; the conclusions of "the science community" at large, maybe not so much. ok... have fun with that. bye
Looking at Stephen Hawking in the condition he is in, I think that he could either not believe in a God who would let him be in such a state. Or he could look at his being alive and having such a brilliant mind as being a gift from God. I believe in God and evolution. And I believe they go hand in hand. But that's just my belief. If Stephen Hawking doesn't want to believe in God, that's his business. Being a Christian, I'd like everyone to come to know God and love Him. But I don't cram that down people's throats. It would be nice if everyone would just respect each other's right to their own religion or lack thereof.
@coco
You said, "Looking at Stephen Hawking in the condition he is in, I think that he could either not believe in a God who would let him be in such a state. Or he could look at his being alive and having such a brilliant mind as being a gift from God."
Some of you people make me want to scream.
Prof. Hawking isn't basing his theory on his feelings about god. Hawking is not at war with god.
He is world famous. He would discredit himself and end his career if he did that. His peers would crucify him. ( oops! bad choice of words?)
Scientists are not setting out to to destroy religion. They couldn't if they wanted to. You say, you believe in God and evolution.
You are evolving with the scientific discoveries. Many Christians are doing this. No one can take god from you.
What are you fundies so afraid of? If their god really does exist, then science will eventually arrive at that conclusion, or Jesus or Mohammed or whoever will come back and enlighten us.
Truth will always come out.
I believe in God and evolution. And I believe they go hand in hand. But that's just my belief. If Stephen Hawking doesn't want to believe in God, that's his business. Being a Christian, I'd like everyone to come to know God and love Him. But I don't cram that down people's throats. It would be nice if everyone would just respect each other's right to their own religion or lack thereof.
And then we have the likes of Franklin Graham who gets $800,000/yr for preaching 2000 year-old mumbo jumbo. Hawking just wants a piece of the pie acting as a contrarian.
A better view at no cost. The universe is and always will be. It "simply" expands and shrinks recycling as the Big Bang and then going into the Gib Gnab stage and then repeating the cycle every 40 billion years.
@Reality
Where you been...? I think I have seen this posting of yours...hmmmmm. 🙂
Hope that you are well....
Peace....
Reiteration is a major tool for education.
GOSH – Everybody sounds so intelligent, almost everybody, that is. Lots of interesting information. I admire Stephen Hawking and the work he is doing. I will probably read the book. It seems to me, though, that he is going out of his way, using his amazing intellect to attempt to disprove the existence of a higher being. Mr. Hawking has his own god – his mind. That's his choice and conviction just like people who believe in a creator whatever label they choose for their belief. Science has proven abundantly that there is more to life than what we can observe with the senses or what is measurable. Since we cannot prove Spirit other than by personal experience – why argue about it? Nobody is above or below anybody else.
I personally feel that life without acknowleding Spirit is not a full life. I have lived it. I have seen the dead eyes of people on drugs and I have seen the change in a deceased person's face after the spirit leaves, sometimes hours after death. I call myself a Christian. And I pray. I may not agree with all the tenets of certain religions, but that doesn't matter. Nobody has all the answers. Science has yet to prove the first event – the beginning. And in the beginning is God.
@lone ranger
You have yet to prove that God is the beginning, kemosabee. Try logic as a silver bullet instead of religious dogma.
Surprised the old creationism versus evolution chestnut hasn't surfaced.
Though I have no doubt that Hawking is a very smart man, I tend to be a bit skeptical whenever anyone claims to know how or why the universe was formed. Nothing in science is certain. Perhaps Hawking has lost sight of that fact.
I don't think Hawking has lost site of the fact that science must be proven to be accepted – he's stating his theories and proposing conclusions based on evidence and research. That's what science is all about. Although I do wonder if his attack on modern religion is partly intended to increase his book sales – not many "average" folks will pick up a book about physics, but if you throw "God" into the mix that stirs up quite a bit of controversy.
@Kyle
I agree in part... nicely said... Just speculation here. But, I doubt that Professor Hawking is drumming up the 'god' card just for the sake of book sales. Could be wrong though.
Peace....
@GRH
"God given boundary"
He/She should have stopped us some where before gunpowder, internal combustion and nukes.
Amen Dr. Hawking!
It takes just as much or even more faith to believe in Hawkings M theory than it takes to believe in God.
@rich
Science continues to create verifiable and testable models of our world. Religion *proves* nothing. Belief in God, as you say, especially the God as described in the christian bible, jewish old testament, or the qur'an is *very* hard for a lot of people to ever believe. More myth and imaginary friend type thinking...
Peace....