February 7th, 2011
07:39 AM ET

Gay parenting takes off in the Bible Belt

By Rich Phillips, Senior Producer

Jacksonville, Florida (CNN) – Latisha Bines and Misty Gray cheered like any other parents at a recent middle school soccer game.

They're the two soccer moms in 13-year-old Darion Bines’ life. The women and all three of Latisha’s children operate as a family. And they've turned to their church for support, suggesting a changing face of the Bible Belt.

Data from the most recent U.S. Census shows that the South has the largest share of gay parents in the country.

“There are more of us coming out,” Bines said. “We’re feeling more comfortable about who we are. I guess it gives us more of a chance than back in the '80s, when you had to stay in the closet because you were ridiculed.”

Bines came out after having three children. She and Misty were joined as life partners in 2010 commitment ceremony. They live in part of the conservative Deep South, where many communities have not been receptive to so-called gay families.

“Gay and lesbian people tend to come out later in life, in those areas, which means they are more likely to have children from a previous relationship earlier in their lives,” said Gary Gates, a demographer with the Williams Institute at the University of California, Los Angeles, School of Law.

Gates analyzed the data from the American Community Survey from 2005-09, which is administered by the Census Bureau. His analysis also showed that across the country, gay parents are more likely to be black or Hispanic than they are to be white.

According to the survey, San Antonio, Texas, leads the country in gay parenting, with 34% of same-sex couples raising children. That's followed by Jacksonville, Florida at 32%.

Read more about gay adoption in Florida.

Bines and Gray have lived in Jacksonville all their lives.

They say they’ve found that their sexual orientation and spirituality can come together and be welcomed in gay-friendly Jacksonville area churches that were once off limits.

“It was welcome. It was comfortable,” Bines said. “We’re lesbian, but our God still loves us, no matter what.”

Bines sings in the choir at the nondenominational St. Luke’s Community Church, which was firebombed three times in the 1980s, apparently because of its policy of welcoming lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender congregants.

The church's pastor, Valerie Williams, is a gay activist. She says church policy all about family acceptance, especially for children.

The goal is “acceptance of their parents and being able to be around other children who have the same makeup of families that they have,” she said. "God is love and that’s the God that we serve here.”

Some local congregations challenge Williams' approach. When word of Jacksonville’s gay parent ranking in the census began to spread, one pastor asked for everyone to pray.

Pastor Vaughn McLaughlin, of the Potter’s House Christian Fellowship, told CNN that the Bible does not teach or encourage gay relationships, which he says confuse children.

“A lifestyle of open, same-sex relationships, that can’t regenerate, that can’t produce, that can’t do anything,"  said McLaughlin, who leads a megachurch. "I find it to be over and against what I actually have found the truth of the Bible to be.”

“Marriage is between a man and a woman," he continued. "That’s the biblical premise for what we believe, for what we teach, and we’re gonna hold on to that.”

But at St. Luke’s, Williams defended the rights of gay people and their families to worship.

“The children are able to serve God , with their families, and not being judged by the person sitting in the pew in front of them… snickering, like, ‘Why do they have kids? Why are they here?’”

Williams has started a support group for the children of gay parents. There, kids can talk about problems they're dealing with, including discrimination, over a hot dog or spaghetti dinner and review their report cards with Williams, who is known by congregants as Pastor Val.

And for Bines and Gray, the church has been a welcome addition to their lives.

“It’s brought us together, structurally as a family,” Gray said. “And because of the recent death rates, the suicide rates for kids being bullied, it’s extremely strong for the church to be a factor in the kids lives.”

Gates, the demographer, and Williams said they believe a cultural or religious support system might allow people to be more honest about their sexual orientation on a government survey.

“People are more willing to indicate on these government surveys that they are part of a same-sex couple, even in the more conservative parts of the country,” said Gates. “It’s a sign of progress.”

- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: Christianity • Florida • Gay marriage • Homosexuality • Houses of worship • United States

soundoff (1,055 Responses)
  1. @iSpeakLyfe7

    GOD is and Will always Remain the same. We conform to him he doesn't conform to us.Please People Read your Bibles & Repent PLEASE! I Pray

    February 10, 2011 at 3:31 pm |
  2. Jabberwocky

    I've read a good many posts here, and i must say the most hateful, venomous and idiotic ones come from HeavenSent and CW. You two ought to marry and spare anyone else from the trauma of association with either of you.

    What a pair of azzholes. You're both disgusting.

    February 9, 2011 at 7:01 pm |
  3. matthew

    the bible also says that slavery is ok, that women should obey there husband like they obey christ, and that people with pore vision or are handicap can not take comunion. It is all up to interpratation.

    February 9, 2011 at 6:14 pm |
  4. Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

    Really, is this all you people can do? Condemn anyone who doesn't adhere to what you interpret the Bible to mean? I would urge anyone who is gay to look for churches that have more to offer than the ones CW and HeavenSent attend. There are many Christian churches in which people possess the intellect to see that there is not just one interpretation of the Bible that is "correct" or "best", no matter what the zealot here state. Go to one of those and leave the jerks who think h om o s3 xuality is "wrong" to break their arms patting themselves on the back. Why would anyone want to share a pew with them, anyway?

    February 8, 2011 at 10:15 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Tom, Tom, All practicing Christians, which means those of us that read Jesus' truth, are to relay His truth. If it falls on deaf ears like yours. So be it. We allow miserable folks to stay miserable and crawl back under the rock that houses them.

      As for churches that accept any/all sinners. That's what churches are suppose to do. The newest sinners, will learn Jesus' truth the way He had it written. Not how sinners want it changed to continue on with their sinful natures. When I write this, I am referring to ALL sin.


      February 8, 2011 at 11:57 pm |
  5. LJ

    @CW it's not wrong. That is what you don't want to hear. There are many Christians that disagree with your interpretation of the Bible, they will continue to welcome gays and Lesbians into their churches as well as worship with them. I can't post the true long arguments to this discussion on this thread the filters won't allow it.

    @Brandon your post is a great example as to why interpretation of the written word can be mistaken in their meaning and condemned. Thanks for making such a great example of my point! Does your judgment of me make you feel empowered.

    February 8, 2011 at 5:51 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      LJ, Haven't you read that Jesus likes when His followers are salty with His truth.

      CW is just being a salty messenger of His truth.

      I don't know where some of these LOVE, God is only Love Christians on this site learned only this part of His truth, but Jesus likes when His followers get a little salty with His word. CW is ensuring that people hear ALL of His truth. As a Christian, you should sharpen your knowledge and take in what CW is saying, then constantly being PC with all his writings.

      Mark 9:50 Salt [is] good: but if the salt have lost his saltness, wherewith will ye season it? Have salt in yourselves, and have peace one with another.


      February 8, 2011 at 10:10 pm |
    • LJ


      February 11, 2011 at 8:31 am |
    • LJ

      You believe to know the right truth is not coming from a place of love. Hist0ry has shown that Christians inter-pre-tation of the bible has been wr0ng. It's atti-tu-d3s like yours that is tearing our society apart instead of bringing it together. If people paid more attention to themselves we wouldn't have children in orphanages, homelessness and people starving in this world. Greed is a far greater problem than people who have been medically shown not to have a mental disorder or can't who they are based on solid research.

      February 11, 2011 at 8:37 am |
  6. Stephanie

    So I'm a woman, married to a man, like Jesus likes. We medically took care of things so we can't have kids, because we don't like them. He's also an atheist. Still legal. No one shuns us when we go out in public. Would just *love* to hear McLaughlin's take on how we confuse the bible's message.

    February 8, 2011 at 5:32 pm |
  7. Yoshi-chan

    Articles like this always come out and people always have blown-up debates about them...I'm Roman Catholic, but c'mon guys...even I know acceptance is the key.
    Peace out.


    February 8, 2011 at 4:21 pm |
  8. LJ

    CW Genesis makes abundantly clear is that ALL creation came forth from God, including Adam and Eve, Steve, Sara and Lisa, Frank and Diane, Linda, Bob, Terrance, and all who are God’s children, each and every one. As for the multiply comment you can't use that argument since then it will also discriminate against infertile couples, single people, the elderly, the disabled, etc... You need to look at your heart, recognize your prejudice view points and release them to God.

    February 8, 2011 at 4:08 pm |
  9. MP

    The bible CLEARLY states NO SIN is greater than that of another. Those who JUDGE are sinning. Let people LIVE. There is NOTHING WRONG with LOVE. God is the final judge after all. So CW who are you? LOL...I SUPPORT Gay Rights & equality in general.

    February 8, 2011 at 2:28 pm |
  10. Kermit

    "We" as a society have come a long way. At this very church in September 1986, the first AIDS Vigil of the UFMCC was held, at all MCC churches around the world, a weekend of prayer for a cure for AIDS and for those with HIV/AIDS. And we had to have Police outside the church. I remember going in around 2am for a shift that was not signed up for, and I did feel some fear, but mostly proud to be there.

    I've spent over 10 years of my life working within the AIDS pandemic, and there is one thing I can tell you for sure: not one of the men that I've worked, who shared with me how he felt, ever made a choice to be gay. Many men wanted to marry and have children, but felt that was being dishonest to a female partner. Many married anyway and ended up giving HIV to their female partners (not on purpose, before it was known how transmission occured).

    Who would make a choice to be "different" and made fun of all of their school years for being effeminate? I remember one friend of mine telling me he was beat up an average of 2-3 times a week just because he was effeminate. He said he would have done anything to be "normal."

    Especially in recent years, we have all watched all the "hate and anger" in middle eastern countries. Folks, you don't have to visit anywhere else but your backyard to see the hate. Just read these boards. Its here in black and white.

    February 8, 2011 at 2:08 pm |
    • Big Lou

      Kermit; Two things first – I applaud the efforts given in the work you have described. It is necessary to tend to the sick just as you have explained – and that is whether the ill are straight or g ay. It just so happens – I was even told by the mother about my "effeminate" qualities – so I better not "land in jail". That was consoling. As far as conscious choices – they may have happened when young – I don't even remember most of my childhood (for me – abuse was involved). Did most of the men remember the past at all? Not being demeaning – just asking a question.

      February 8, 2011 at 2:26 pm |
    • Brotherboy

      KERMIT, very well said. Thank you. And thanks for your dedication to helping others.

      February 9, 2011 at 1:32 pm |
  11. Big Lou

    LJ; Sorry but I do not agree with the interpretation of "it is not good for a man to be alone". In context to me – he made woman for man not to be alone, not another man. And I wonder – what is the reason for only being able to develop a relationship with the same gender. There are many answers. People fear many things, rejection being one of the most feared because we are "creatures" that must have relationship (because of the one lost due to the fall). In some cases – as for myself – regressing into isolation (not good either) was tried. As you said, aloneness was even "on the mind" of God to make a helpmate. Given your initial reference – I am believe that aloneness was not solved, by another man, but by a woman in Adam's instance.

    February 8, 2011 at 1:41 pm |
  12. John

    Christians: Please stop and think... some of you are missing your mark here. No matter if you think this is right or wrong you need to remember that even a saved man or woman like yourselves can sin. No one is prefect. We all fall short of the glory of God. Our job is not to tell others of our views nor judge them. Only God has the right to judge. We are only suppose to tell others of God. And that if they wish to be saved all they have to do is to ask Jesus Christ to come into their hearts. With that one act they will be saved and they will no longer have to fear Hell because they will be saved from it. After they are saved it is up to them if they follow God or not. That's between them and God. Please just share God's word and be happy.

    February 8, 2011 at 12:31 pm |
    • Brandi

      Now I would listen to what you said before I would people screaming "You will rot in hell if you don't do it this way"

      February 9, 2011 at 11:01 am |
  13. MarkinFL

    Since I have never met a Christian that lives by ALL tenets of the bible, I see you all as equal; gay, straight, republican or democrat. Equally suffer from magical thinking.

    February 8, 2011 at 12:30 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      MarkinFL, DITTO.

      February 8, 2011 at 9:41 pm |
  14. brad

    "Therefore, in order to keep me from becoming conceited, I was given a thorn in my flesh, a messenger of Satan, to torment me. Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me. But he said to me, “My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness." 2 Corinthians 12:8

    They taught us this scripture in the Catholic church. My guess is that everyone posting here, has some "thorn" they'd like to be rid of whether they are straight, religious, atheist, or guy. I'm glad that St. Paul didn't name his thorn. That way, we can fill in the blank and add our own affliction.

    February 8, 2011 at 11:11 am |
  15. jones

    God brought Adam Eve. God is not ok with gay couples or anyone being gay, no more then he is with a liar or any sin. but he loves us all and will forgive us when we repent of our sin.

    February 8, 2011 at 10:44 am |
    • Brotherboy

      Repent THIS

      February 8, 2011 at 12:10 pm |
  16. Mad

    u mad bro?

    February 8, 2011 at 10:14 am |
  17. CW

    @ HeavenSent,

    I haven't read all your post's but if your telling those on this blog that the G-'AY LIFESTYLE IS WRONG I stand right beside you.

    @ All others that think this lifestyle is okay,

    You can believe what you want but the Bible spells it out pretty well on how God views it. There is no grey area....its black and white....see old testament as well as new testament. As a matter fact see Romans 1 or 1 Corithians 6:9 for your proof. Like I said the only view on this is God's view...you can either take God's view or answer to him on Judgement Day.

    February 8, 2011 at 9:55 am |
    • LJ

      There is no grey area? Really that is why the interpretations of many of the scriptures have changed over time such as slavery, women, selfish, clothing, etc.

      February 8, 2011 at 11:03 am |
    • CN

      Believe? How's this for a belief: the Christian "command" for those who are gay to live alone and celibate is evil, immoral, and inhumane. Even though I've never met you and know nothing about you or your life, I am 100% certain that you've never met anyone who claims, "In my last life I was gay. I did as my Christian commanded, and I was rewarded in heaven, and got a new life where I could be straight, get married, have children, and live my life to the fullest." Indeed, if you did meet such a person, even though I don't know you, I am 100% certain you wouldn't believe them.

      Thus, it is EVIL in its fullest to command human beings to be alone and celibate in THIS, the only life we KNOW we get, not to mention immoral and unspeakably cruel. No wonder people reject your religion as the scrawlings of illiterate sheep herders.

      February 8, 2011 at 11:50 am |
    • justbenice

      Has it ever occurred to you that there are many people who do not believe the bible is the word of God? Regardless of what the bible may or may not say, it is a person's own belief system that matters. What you feel and believe is right based on your own interpretation of the bible has absolutely nothing to do with other peoples' rights to believe as they see fit. There are many gay parents in this country doing outstanding jobs of raising beautiful, responsible children. Just because you feel it isn't something you believe in doesn't make it right for you or others who feel like you do to try to take away the rights of fellow Americans. I wish I could find a church as open and accepting as this one. My friends and i would love to be a part of something like this. Bless Preacher Val for teaching the true message to love each other!

      February 8, 2011 at 1:22 pm |
    • Monday

      If you knew ANYTHING at all.. Then you would realize that the bible has been rewritten over and over again. Parts left out, parts added in, just so certain parts would need certain criteria... WHOLE BOOKS have been ommitted from it.
      And, hey genious, God did NOT write the bible. MAN DID.

      And each and EVERY thing that is written in the bible can have SEVERAL interpretations. Get over yourself, grow a brain, and quit trying to make the religion look like it was created by monkeys who didn't know their a s s e s from their face.
      The bible is NOT black and white. Its very VERY GREY. There are very specific parts in the bible that condone slavery, polygamy, the way women are treated. It also says how one should dress, that you shouldn't cut your hair, you shouldn't eat pork or shellfish...
      So. Picking and choosing are we?

      February 8, 2011 at 5:00 pm |
    • HeavenSent


      The gay lifestyle, as well as bashers of Jesus' truth, cheating on your married spouse, over eating, lying, drinking, drugging, stealing, manipulating, etc. and many more life choices (that's right folks, it's a choice you make) are an abomination to the Lord. The reason said individuals listed above continue on with conducting unrighteous acts is because they are still thinking, believing, acting on a carnal level. They don't want to give up their lifestyles which they made comfortable in their minds. Anyone can read Jesus' truth via the scriptures in the Bible but they miss the main request that Jesus asked all of us to do before we take up our cross and follow him. Shelf our egos. Shelving our egos so that we can go humble, clear our mind of the earthly way of thinking (the way of man) they way Jesus' requested. Then and only then, can we begin our Journey into comprehending His spiritual teachings. If the ego is in full throttle, it will constantly critique Jesus' spiritual teachings. Egos believe they know better than what Jesus' has written.

      So, CW, the saga of the ego attacking Jesus' spiritual truth continues.


      February 8, 2011 at 9:36 pm |
    • LJ

      It's so amazing you are seeing the specks in other peoples eye and can't see the log in yours. I am sure if we were to look at your lifestyle it will be filled with bad choices. As for ego all you have to do is read your posts on this forum to understand your greatest demon.

      February 11, 2011 at 8:42 am |
  18. Putt

    That mega-church pastor is an insult to intelligence. He clearly reads the bible in a biased and discriminatory manner. So yes God said a man should leave his mother and father and be with his wife, but where does it say that two women or two men cannot join together? Didn't Jesus say WHAT God joined together let no man put asunder? Didn't Jesus say all men were not born to be with women? These anti-gay pastors and their supporters are being unjust to gays and I am certain God will charge them for their iniquity. Times and things change. The bible teaches that God has a vested interest in our differences, so why these so-called Christians are against gays, when gays simply serve to show how immeasurable God's love for man is?

    February 8, 2011 at 9:29 am |
  19. Gay Christian

    Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven.
    (Matthew 5:11,12)

    February 8, 2011 at 9:02 am |
    • brad

      Bless you, Gay Christian. While people on this page are obsessed with you and you're nature, you seem to be keeping your eyes on Christ.

      February 8, 2011 at 9:54 am |
    • CW

      @ Gay Christian,

      Let me ask...how do you reconcile your self to scriptures in Romans....and Corithians? To be exact 1 Corinthians 6:9 and Romans 1?

      Saying your a christian and living the lifestyle you do is like saying its okay to steal and call yourself a christian....they don't mix. Let me give another example...remember how God forgave Mary M. in the streets when all wanted to stone her? He said "go and sin no more". When you have truely accepted and repented of your sins....you go and do your best to not sin anymore. That isn't what your doing now. You can say I'm judging but God also said when a brother is sinning to show him his wrongs in order to get him back to Christ. You have a choice..a choice to follow your own desires or turn from your sin. God spells out what your doing as wrong...there is no grey area.

      G-'ay Lifestyle and being a christian...don't mix. I pray you will repent.

      February 8, 2011 at 10:03 am |
    • LJ

      @CW those scriptures are about pagan rituals, idolatry, male pro-st-itu-tion. The truth about ho-mo-s3x-ual-ity is coming out, that it's not a mental disorder, it's not a choice and it can't be voluntarily changed. When you take that truth into account and put the text into historical context it doesn't not fit the definition of ho-mo-s3x-ual-ity as we know it today. Nowhere in the bible does it condemn the loving saved ho-mo-s3x-ual. Please note the wording of that last sentence you seem to have a problem in this area.

      February 8, 2011 at 11:00 am |
    • Anglican

      CW. If you are without sin, cast your stone. If not, hold it, and remove the tree from your eye.

      February 8, 2011 at 11:10 am |
    • CW

      @ LJ,

      Sounds to me you have a problem...Like I said those scriptures make it sooooo plain...that this lifestyle is wrong....and NO its not talking about male pro-'st-'itu-'tion. In those scriptures he is referencing what the Israelites did...and how God punished them. In addition like I said before....its not grey here....very black and white.

      @ Angelican,

      I have removed the trees from my eye.....what you forget is that in the Bible it talks about those who sin and how we as brothers and sisters are to guide them back to Christ. In es-'sence we are to keep each other accountable to God's word. Also....as I recall in the Bible Jesus dealth harshly with the establishment of the day...ie the Pharisees and Saducees about how there re-'ligi-'ous laws were con-'trary to the word of God. You can see this however you want it...but it is sin...period.

      February 8, 2011 at 11:26 am |
    • brad

      The worst anyone can say about H0m06ualitie is that it is a disorder. But guess what! All of humanity is disordered in one way or other. Our Lord didn't just come for "alternatives".

      February 8, 2011 at 11:29 am |
    • Anglican

      CW. Answer the question. Are you a sinner as well? Jesus said, judge not. It is not your job to judge. You are to love your neighbor, not judge him. Otherwise, what does your neighbor see,... not Christ. "I came not to judge" Peace.

      February 8, 2011 at 11:53 am |
    • Brotherboy

      @ CW ** You seem to be just another human being blinded by his old comic book bible = hateful in the name of 'christianity'. You should be ashamed.

      February 8, 2011 at 12:04 pm |
    • LJ

      @CW that is your interpretation and of course you are going to hold onto it since it's the only way you can justify in your mind the personal prejudice that you hold. Thankfully there are churches, pastors and other Christians that disagree with you and all ho-mo-s3x-uals are welcomed and it's not a sin.

      February 8, 2011 at 12:17 pm |
    • CW

      @ Angelican,

      You and I will disagree on this. I answered your question...but here goes...yes we are all sinners including me. I will say this if I was sinning I would want my fellow brother or sister in Christ to encourage me not to keep sinning. That is all I'm trying to do...let me ask you a question...if your best friend was an doing wrong....wouldn't encourage them to do what is right before God?....is that judging..by your standards it is.

      @ LJ,

      For your church comment....yes the Bible also talks about wol-'ves in she-'eps clothing coming and teaching wrongly as well. The Bible says to run from such wo-'ves...because the are not from God. Ms. Val....the preacher...if that is what YOU want to call her....I call her a wo-'lve in she-'eps clothing....is wrong on this. She is teaching contrary to what the Bible says.

      February 8, 2011 at 2:18 pm |
    • Anglican

      CW. We all should live a blameless and holy life. That being said, we all fail. I have blogged this before: if reform was possible, we would all be rightous from Sinai on. The Passion dealt with sin once and for all. Salvation is by grace through faith in Christ, period. Should we keep on sinning, no, but it is fact that we all fall short. My problem is why pick on the GL persons and not the rich lawyers and business leaders who lie in court and stick it to the poor. White-collar sin. How often do you preach against those?

      February 8, 2011 at 2:30 pm |
    • CW

      @ Angelican,

      I want you to understand that I don't endorse the rich fle-'ec-'ing of the poor. I think that it is detestable as it says so in the Bible but this isn't what the news story is about. Its about a destestable lifestyle that America is getting more and more confortable with. This I stand against wh-'ol-'e'-'hear-'tely because it is sin as you just noted. If it is sin....shouldn't we encourage our brothers and sisters who say "I'm a christain" to repent because this lifestyle isn't Bilblical nor is it right. If your a christian you have to make choices....some really really hard. I'm know its hard to turn from fleshy desires but that is the choice one has to make if they are to tr-'ue-'ly follow Christ.

      Lastly to let you know...I stand against anything...that is against the Bible's tea-'chi-'ngs....from the rich fle-'ec-'ing and l-'ying to the poor to the Wo-'lves in she-'ep's clothing...which this pastor is....b/c they are leading there con-'gre-'ga-'tion in the entirely wrong direction.

      February 8, 2011 at 3:08 pm |
    • CN

      CW–you're right. This is why LGBT should reject the Christian religion and resist its evils.

      February 8, 2011 at 3:37 pm |
    • CN

      CW–you're against lying? So you can truthfully tell people–indeed, guarantee them–that if they do as you say, they will get into everlasting paradise?

      Indeed, all the evidence that we have is that is that all they get from your command that they die alone and unloved, is to waste the only lifetime which i'm sure you know they get alone and unloved, which is evil, wicked, immoral, unethical, and inhumane in the extreme. which is why i have no doubt you're the "truest" christian on here.

      February 8, 2011 at 3:43 pm |
    • Anglican

      CW. I give up. Remember, your charge, as a Christian, is to annouce the Good News of Christ's life, death, and resurrection, and annouce salvation through faith in Him, not judge and exclude. I am afraid those who cross your path will never see the love of Christ. May God bless you and keep you. Peace.

      February 8, 2011 at 3:54 pm |
    • Steve the real one

      CW. If you are without sin, cast your stone. If not, hold it, and remove the tree from your eye.
      This comes from the story of the woman caught in adultery. If I am not mistaken, Jesus' final words to her was "Go and sin no more". Yes we have all sinned and fall short of the glory of God. The issue is we cannot nor should not linger in it!

      February 8, 2011 at 4:15 pm |
    • Monday

      This article, the people it talks about, and those of you who support it are all things that show that the human race still has some dignity left. As a child growing up in the south, raised in a fairly strict pentecostal church, and then realizing at the age of 13 that I was a lesbian... Its not easy. I cast religion aside for years and years. Not because I didn't believe in God. I've always maintained the belief that, "If there is a God, he loves all his creations and children the SAME." BUT, because of the bigots and all the ignorant judgemental "Christians" that looked at me as if I were less of a person.
      People like CW.
      There is no more room left in this world for your hate. And for hating, judging, and telling everyone else THEY are going to burn.. Well sir.. I think it will be you and your kind that rot in hel l.
      If theres a God, I'm sure he doesn't appreciate anyone downing any of his children.

      February 8, 2011 at 4:53 pm |
    • CW

      @ Angelican,

      We will have to disagree b/c according to the way you see it that God will allow for Idolitors and such to keep on worshiping God and Money or whatever.

      February 8, 2011 at 4:59 pm |
    • Progressive Christian, Enjoys Free Nation

      @CW, the BIble also calls for men who lie with men to be put to death. Please explain your advocacy for capital punishment for LGBT individuals or why you believe the Bible is wrong.

      February 8, 2011 at 5:11 pm |
    • Anglican

      Steve the Real One. You are correct. Did she sin again?, yes. Impossible not to. What you are trying to do is send the tax collector back in the temple with the Pharisees' speech. We throw our selves on the altar and ask for forgiveness everyday. The G and L parishioners in my church are as devout as I. Do they sin, yes. Do I sin, yes. Salvation by grace through faith. Do me a favor, read Robert Farrar Capon's book, Parables of the Kingdom, Grace and Judgement.

      February 8, 2011 at 5:13 pm |
    • Anglican

      CW That made no sense.

      February 8, 2011 at 5:30 pm |
    • Brandon

      @ Progressive Christian, Enjoys Free Nation
      There are two kinds of deaths. Mortal death and Spiritual death. All will die a mortal death if one man dies earlier than the other there is no difference. And all those that sin and do not repent, will die a spiritual death and be seperated from God for eternity.

      February 8, 2011 at 5:34 pm |
    • Anglican

      Christians are to proclaim the Good News of Christ Jesus, Love God and Love Neighbor. We can not and should not presume to know the final acts of God. Serve God, serve man and stop judging others.

      February 8, 2011 at 5:57 pm |
    • Brotherboy

      Can we all just get over this and....well....get on our knees?

      February 8, 2011 at 7:39 pm |
    • Anglican

      Brotherboy. You are right. May God bless you and keep you.

      February 8, 2011 at 10:28 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Anglican, Christians are to debate the word of Jesus so that we sharpen our knowledge in His truth. You take one message of spreading His truth and pick and choose to leave all the rest of His wisdom behind??????

      As for this judging baloney everyone is throwing about on these blogs. Christians are suppose to explain His truth and we have the right to discern if others comprehend His scripture(s) or not. If you don't like hearing all of His truth from other Christians, you don't need to continue blogging with me or any of them.

      As for judging. God will judge. Christians that follow His truth, discern facts of His truth from fiction, or spun around propaganda that are being shoved down the throats of other Christians by non-believers.

      :Christians are to proclaim the Good News of Christ Jesus, Love God and Love Neighbor. We can not and should not presume to know the final acts of God. Serve God, serve man and stop judging others.

      February 8, 2011 at 11:23 pm |
    • CW

      @ Monday,

      I think its your that needs to get on your knees to repent. I believe if our Lord were here right now he would say "my child...if you are truely one of mine why do you still insist on wal-'low-'ing in your sin"? As calling me a big-'got...you can call me what you want...I stand on God's word....I can back up my belief's with God's Truth. What can you use to back up that your lifestyle is acceptable....I would say ponder this.

      @ Angelican,

      Sounds to me...like we will not agree on this....Please read Heavesents message to you...this is what you need to hear. As for my point on idolitry....What I was saying was that by your standards its okay to keep sinning...ie living a g-'ay lifestyle as long as you confess to be a christian. My point is that these things DON'T MIX.

      @ Heavensent....Steve the real one,

      Thanks for your posts....as always....speaking God's truth's gets people into sprewing their own ha-'te speech to us. In addition to their speech on how we're judging....what they don't understand is that we are speaking God's truth's.

      February 9, 2011 at 8:01 am |
    • CN

      CW–on the contrary. I see no "truth" in anything you write–all I see is one of my fellow primates who thinks it has the right to tell others what to do. It must be nice to have such illusions.

      February 9, 2011 at 2:12 pm |
  20. meh_meh

    Isn't the bible due for an update? everything else gets updated. Maybe the Christians should appoint a council that goes through the whole thing and updates it. I cant really hold the bible at fault for the rather ancient views it has. Things were pretty bad two thousand years ago. Can you imagine how much fun a new bible would be? for instance

    – You shall not make for yourself an idol. American idol is the only one you can use.
    – Thou shalt not double dip.
    – Thous shalt not kill....try tasing instead.
    – You shall not steal....unless thy are too big to fail
    – You shall not covet your neighbor's wife.....use skype instead. That way thy can covet thy entire block.

    February 8, 2011 at 3:35 am |
    • Reality

      All "Abrahamics" believe that their god created all of us and of course that includes the g-ay members of the human race. Also, those who have studied ho-mo-se-xuality have determined that there is no choice involved therefore ga-ys are ga-y because god made them that way.----

      To wit:

      o The Royal College of Psy-chiatrists stated in 2007:

      “ Despite almost a century of psy-choanalytic and psy-chological speculation, there is no substantive evidence to support the suggestion that the nature of parenting or early childhood experiences play any role in the formation of a person’s fundamental heteros-exual or hom-ose-xual orientation. It would appear that s-exual orientation is biological in nature, determined by a complex interplay of ge-netic factors and the early ut-erine environment. Se-xual orientation is therefore not a choice.[60] "

      "Garcia-Falgueras and Swaab state in the abstract of their 2010 study, "The fe-tal brain develops during the intraut-erine period in the male direction through a direct action of tes-tosterone on the developing nerve cells, or in the female direction through the absence of this hor-mone surge. In this way, our gender identi-ty (the conviction of belonging to the male or female gender) and s-exual orientation are programmed or organized into our brain structures when we are still in the womb. There is no indication that social environment after birth has an effect on gender ident–ity or s-exual orientation."[8

      Of course, those gays who belong to Abrahamic religions abide by the rules of no adu-ltery or for-nication allowed.

      February 8, 2011 at 3:48 pm |
    • Reality


      Actually there are rewrites of the bible: For example:

      origin: http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F20E1EFE35540C7A8CDDAA0894DA404482

      New Torah(OT) For Modern Minds

      "Abraham, the Jewish patriarch, probably never existed. Nor did Moses. The entire Exodus story as recounted in the Bible probably never occurred. The same is true of the tumbling of the walls of Jericho. And David, far from being the fearless king who built Jerusalem into a mighty capital, was more likely a provincial leader whose reputation was later magnified to provide a rallying point for a fledgling nation.

      Such startling propositions - the product of findings by archaeologists digging in Israel and its environs over the last 25 years - have gained wide acceptance among non-Orthodox rabbis. But there has been no attempt to disseminate these ideas or to discuss them with the laity - until now.

      The United Synagogue of Conservative Judaism, which represents the 1.5 million Conservative Jews in the United States, has just issued a new Torah and commentary, the first for Conservatives in more than 60 years. Called "Etz Hayim" ("Tree of Life" in Hebrew), it offers an interpretation that incorporates the latest findings from archaeology, philology, anthropology and the study of ancient cultures. To the editors who worked on the book, it represents one of the boldest efforts ever to introduce into the religious mainstream a view of the Bible as a human rather than divine doc-ument. "

      Then there is the Jefferson Bible written by Thoma Jefferson and the large number of books written by contemporary NT scholars who have analyzed every passage of the NT to determine if the passages are authentic by using rigorous, modern methods of number of attestations and time of publication.. For example, see Professor JD Crossan's The Historical Jesus, Professor G. Ludemann' Jesus After 2000 Years and the Westar Insti-tute's The Five Gospels.

      February 8, 2011 at 3:58 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.