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March 7th, 2011
01:00 PM ET
Muslims anxious, active ahead of radicalization hearingsEditor's Note: CNN’s Soledad O’Brien chronicles the dramatic fight over the construction of a mosque in the heart of the Bible belt. “Unwelcome: The Muslims Next Door”, airs Sunday, March 27 at 8 p.m. E.T. By Dan Gilgoff, CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor Every day this week, American Muslim activists are working overtime to prepare for congressional hearings on "the radicalization of American Muslims" that open Thursday. Sunday saw Muslim demonstrators gather in New York's rain-drenched Times Square to protest the hearings, standing with celebrities like Russell Simmons and other non-Muslims who held signs declaring "I am Muslim, too." On Monday, representatives from the Council on American-Islamic Relations - a national Muslim advocacy group - met will sympathetic Capitol Hill staffers to discuss communications strategy and grassroots organizing to counter Islamophia. On Tuesday, a coalition of major Muslim, interfaith and civil rights groups will announce a new campaign and website to push back against politicians and others they say are trafficking in anti-Muslim rhetoric. And that's before the hearings even begin. “The community is anxious, uncertain and even fearful in terms of what this could become in this environment,” says Akbar Ahmed, an Islamic studies professor at American University who has met with Capitol Hill aides in advance of the hearings. “There is a generalized sense of Islamophobia floating around, and the hearings are not doing anything to assuage Muslim fears.” Days before the first in what Rep. Peter King, the House Homeland Security Committee chairman, has said will be a series of hearings on American Muslim radicalization, many Muslims are deeply nervous at the specter of being demonized from such a highly visible platform as Capitol Hill. The hearings may stretch out for more than a year. But King’s hearings also have galvanized American Muslims, perhaps as never before, in an attempt to counter what they call a rising tide of Islamophobia, to lobby Washington about their concerns and to help shape the national narrative about their community. The efforts come a little more than six months after many Muslims were blindsided by a wave of national opposition to a proposed Islamic cultural center near New York’s ground zero last summer. “There was this sense after last summer’s events of needing to be more proactive in stemming this activity that stokes anti-Muslim hate,” said Farhana Khera, executive director of Muslim Advocates, a national legal advocacy group. “That’s why, as soon as we heard Rep. King say he planned to hold these hearings, we started coming forward to express our concerns,” Khera said. In February, Muslim Advocates spearheaded a letter to congressional leaders objecting to the hearings. It was signed by more than 50 organizations, including civil rights groups that had not previously been involved with the American Muslim community. The Council on American-Islamic Relations, a leading Muslim advocacy group, used its annual lobbying day last month to visit 90 congressional offices to “start offering facts about American Muslims and their role in helping prevent attacks on our nation,” said Corey Saylor, the group’s national legislative director. Two other groups - the Muslim Public Affairs Council and the Arab American Institute - held a briefing, “Islamophobia: A Challenge to American Pluralism,” for Capitol Hill staffers last Wednesday. The King hearings are also spurring mosques around the country to get more political. “Muslim Americans make vital contributions every day,” said Hadi Nael, director of the Islamic Center of Temecula Valley in California, whose congregation is calling and writing Congress to voice opposition to the King hearings. “They love this country just as every American does and should not be placed under suspicion of terrorism because of their religious beliefs or ethnic background,” he said. “King’s hearings would do just that.”  Muslims and non-Muslims demonstrated in New York Many Muslim activists said that recent remarks from King, a New York Republican, including his support for a theory that 80% of American mosques are controlled by radical imams, are evidence that he intends to target the American Muslim community broadly with his hearings, rather than focus on Islamic radicals. “Let’s not fall into the same ugly patterns that were prevalent in earlier years in America, when Jews were suspected of aiding communism and Catholics were suspected of supporting fascism,” said Eboo Patel, a leading Muslim activist, summing up his opposition to the hearings. “Let’s not repeat that history by blaming all Muslims for the extremist actions of a range of people in this country.” A White House official appeared at a Muslim community center Sunday to speak about the need to prevent violent extremism, saying U.S. Muslims are part of the solution. "The bottom line is this - when it comes to preventing violent extremism and terrorism in the United States, Muslim Americans are not part of the problem, you're part of the solution," said Denis McDonough, deputy national security adviser to President Obama. "Of course, the most effective voices against al Qaeda's warped worldview and interpretation of Islam are other Muslims." McDonough also said, "We must resolve that, in our determination to protect the nation, we will not stigmatize or demonize entire communities because of the actions of a few. In the United States of America, we don't practice guilt by association." A White House source said McDonough's speech was not meant as a "prebuttal" to King's hearings, while a spokesman said the administration is finalizing its strategy to help stop violent extremism. King called for the hearings on Muslim radicalization after Republicans won control of the House of Representatives in November's elections. He declined calls from some Democrats to broaden sessions to focus on extremists of all types, including neo-Nazis, radical environmentalists and anti-tax groups. “Al Qaeda is actively attempting to recruit individuals living within the Muslim American community to commit acts of terror,” King wrote in a letter last month to Rep. Bennie Thompson, D-Mississippi, the ranking member on the Homeland Security Committee, who had suggested that King broaden the hearings’ scope. “Pursuant to our mandate, the committee will continue to examine the threat of Islamic radicalization, and I will not allow political correctness to obscure a real and dangerous threat to the safety and security of the citizens of the United States,” King’s letter continued. King told CNN's "State of the Union" with Candy Crowley on Sunday that "something from within" the Muslim community is a "threat" to America and needs to be explored. He compared the goal of the hearings to investigating the Mafia within the Italian community or going after the Russian mob in "the Russian community in Brighton Beach and Coney Island." "We're talking about al Qaeda," King said. "There's been self-radicalization going on within the Muslim community, within a very small minority, but it's there, and that's where the threat is coming from at this time." King has yet to release a full witness list for this week’s hearing, exacerbating Muslim anxiety. The sole witness whose name King has released is Zuhdi Jasser, an Arizona doctor who is Muslim but who has criticized his religion. King has also invited Rep Keith Ellison, D-Minnesota - the first Muslim elected to Congress - to testify. Ellison also appeared on "State of the Union" on Sunday, saying, "I challenge the basic premise of the hearings." "We should deal with radicalization and violent radicalization, but ... singling out one community is the wrong thing to do," he said. Democrats have invited Los Angeles County Sheriff Leroy Baca, who has praised Muslim leaders for building relationships with law enforcement authorities, to testify. A recent survey showed that 56% of Americans support the upcoming hearings, compared with 29% who think they’re a bad idea. The February survey, conducted by Public Opinion Research and the Religion News Service, found that seven in 10 Americans think Congress should refrain from singling out Muslims and should investigate all religious extremism. Not all Muslims object to the hearings. American University's Ahmed says that many first-generation American Muslims, feeling rejected both by their parents' culture and by their American peers, are at risk of being radicalized. "There's a new generation of Muslim Americans who are born here or have grown up here and are no longer fully accepted as Egyptians or Pakistanis, as their parents are," he says. "But America is also rejecting them, day and night Islam is being demonized… they’re suspended between two cultures.” "Whey you are 18, that can push you into a dangerous situation," Ahmed says. "You can go online and some idiot in the Middle East can push you in a dangerous direction. It has little to do with theology and a lot to do with anthropology." Other American Muslims interpret King’s hearings as the culmination of years of growing domestic suspicions of their community, dating back to the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001. “For the last 10 years, there has been a movement of intolerance against Muslim Americans, but it hasn’t been above the surface,” says Patel, who leads the Interfaith Youth Corps. “It’s now clear, from everything from the discussion around the Cordoba House (one name for the proposed New York Islamic center) to the way King has framed the hearings that there is an anti-Muslim sentiment in America that is reminiscent of anti-Semitism and anti-Catholicism,” he said. “But I’d rather it be out in the open like it is now,” Patel continued. According to the Justice Department, there were 107 anti-Muslim hate-crime incidents in 2009, the most recent year for which statistics are available, up from 28 such incidents in 2000. With the 10-year anniversary of the September 11 attacks on the horizon and some likely contenders for the 2012 Republican presidential nomination talking up the threat of Islamic law, or sharia, taking hold in the United States, many Muslims said they fear the worst is to come. But many are also feeling that their community is finally preparing itself to take on those challenges. “This is a very American thing, congressional hearings,” said Ahmed of this week’s King session. “Let’s present the complexity and sophistication of Islam so Americans understand it better. It’s a teaching moment.” CNN's Susan Candiotti, Bonney Kapp and Rebecca Stewart contributed to this report. soundoff (1,742 Responses)« Previous 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 Next »
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A mob of around 4000 Muslims have attacked the homes of Christian Coptics near Cairo,Egypt and have torched the church of St. Mina and St. George. Islam is NOT a religion of peace! http://www.aina.org/news/20110304222016.htm
Reverse the Muslims and Christians in that statement, while burning mosques, and CNN would be covering that item for a month.
@ AUGGIEDOGGY – Stick to the facts, not idiotic generalizations!!!
Cut the BS. The fact that I think the location of Ground Zero mosque is inappropriate does not (as the article states) qualify as anti-Muslim hate.
The Crusades
The Inquisition
The Holocaust
The destruction of the Aztecs, Incas, Mayans, Native Americans
All done by Christians, kind of speaks for itself.
These were not Christians that committed these acts. They may have called themselves Christians but they were not following the teachings of Jesus Christ.
By your argument, there are really NO CHRISTIANS. What you really mean is that all 'Christians' tend to fall on a spectrum of hypocrisy... at one end of this spectrum we have those who *actually follow* Christ's teachings (probably no one) and on the other you have politicians and televangelists. Anyone further towards the "non-follower" side than you can safely be called "not a true christian". How many of you give ALL of your money and possessions away to charity (not to the church, but a real honest-to-God charity)? How many of you will literally tear down any church where donations are a measure of righteousness? How many of you will help invite a homeless man on the street into your home for dinner, even if he's crazy, smelly and will just drink himself to death? Will you give him the coat off your back, even if your children don't have a coat, because he needs it more? (FYI – Putting your family or your fellow christians before *anyone* less fortunate is actually the first tenant of Satanism, not Christianity). How many of you will *always* turn the other cheek when struck (or when someone flies an airplane into your buildings)?
If you can always say "I do" then you might be able to say "I'm a Christian". Otherwise you are some amount of hypocrite and should perhaps instead focus your attention on improving yourself and the lot of those less fortunate than yourself, rather than worrying about inciting hatred/fears/genocides.
Brilliantly stated, Tamooj, thank you.
Sniffle........ :o)
Too bad that the majority of you all are hypocrits. Should we call a congressional hearing on you all? start burning bibles? fire you from your jobs? murder YOUR children i cold blood?
Before you start hating on all muslims (including all people who do not wear jeans and a shirt at the airport and therefore get "randomly" searched 5 times over) try refoming yourselves. alas, religion is a disease that only time and the efforts of billions of rationalists shall cure
MY NAMEIS KHAN AND I AM NOT A TERRORIST
I have no problem with these hearings just as I see no redeemable qualities in Islam. We have seen Muslims consistently kill innocent people most poignantly their own children in market place – acid attacks against girls on their way to school, arranged marriages, stoning for blasphemy and infidelity, decapitation and exploitation of pows, rampant child abuse, – etc etc etc etc. These practices are abhorred in the west and punished under western law when they surface. Now here come the Muslims – do they have mass protests over these clear human right violations – no. They condone it with silence. They do however protest against free speech – cartoon of Muhammad – yes and they do so violently! They protest and demand that the separation of church and state be abolished just for them in Islamic courts. They demand special privileges under western law that reduce women to property…. Etc etc etc.
These are FACTS.
I have seen americans burn holy books, murder children, fire workers, harrass travellers, discriminate in many other ways, like a few NonMUSLIMS ONLY signs, adapted from the whites only signs.
CHristans massacred millions (crusades, imperialism on "inferior" races, etc.)
hindus rioted and killed
muslims have killed many too
as well as people from other religious sects. i see no redeeming qualities in religion whatsoever, but get you FACTS straight....not only Islam following muslims are bad
Adding to that they want to condemn but not be condemned ? How does that work?
Why is this even in the "Belief" blog?
Wouldn't it be better if this story was on the front page instead?
And still everyone clings to their delusion...
Geez, we're screwed!
EVERY religious book (Bible, Talmud, Quran, etc.) contains brutal and barbaric parts. Generally, those parts are ignored, EXCEPT for ONE book. Guess which one? Guess which book makes it from fantasies on paper to real blood?
Yes, which is the ONLY book that instructs its followers to go out and kill nonbelievers - to spread it by the sword? Who wrote that? Why did he write that? Just a madman like Hitler that wanted nothing more than to kill Jews and Christians? Muslims can spout all the crap they want about their religtion, but they cannot explain away the stated fact that Mohammed wants blood. Jesus told us to love our neighbor, to turn the other cheek. Mohammed told his followers to kill their neighbors. Yeah, now there's a prophet for you. And we see footage of the bearded primitives in black robes telling the Muslim youth to go out and set off bombs, that Muslim armies are going to sweep across the world and put us all under the yoke of Islam. Let's all believe Mohammed and walk in lockstep with this bloodthirsty monster..
Exactly. Not one other 'Religion' causes this much mayhem , destruction and killing, by ordering its followers to do what the Koran/'Death book ' instructs. If they had their way, we would all be killed for discussing the truth about 'Mohammed' the Beheading Warlord. All the beheadings of Americans,Westerns that have traumatized us all, can be traced back to the Koran & its writer Mohammed.
@ ben cooper: WOW (appluase) you are a COMPLETE IDIOT! Actually, christias have MASSACRED umbers on par with islamists
Hitler didnt target christians.
Ed
The Crusades
The Inquisition
The Holocaust
The destruction of the Aztecs, Incas, Mayans, Native Americans
All done by Christians, kind of speaks for itself.
furthuremore, even the bible has incredbly gory parts.
Islam also says the whole turn cheek thing as well...rad the quran before you speak, or voice opinion of any kind...as I have read many of the religious texts of Many religions.
Hey, where's Joseph McCarthy when you need him. GOP planning to run on an anti-Muslim platform in 2012?
Do we have to go through all this stupidity AGAIN? The more irrational extremists that come out trying to attack the Muslims, just like the extremists have tried to do to a long list of groups down through the years, the more rational responsible people will feel the need to come out in open support of the Muslims, just like rational responsible people have done for other groups down through the years. This is SUCH a waste of social energy. Does this country really need to play this immature game AGAIN?
Keith, sadly, it appears that it does.
Over and over and over again.
This issue here is that we let these people cone to America in the first place. Now you are wanting to call the "Muslim Americans". There can be no such phrase ever. I say close all Mosque' and deport all of them. Based solely on their religion which is evil. They and their devil Allah have no place in a free Christian society. The only reason Islam goes anywhere is to terrorize the current Christian population. We need to treat these people like the dogs they are. Islam is like a cancer once it starts it spreads its evil all over. America wake up and understand what we are dealing with. There goal is to bring America under Sharia Law. Do you want your daughters to be to live like dogs in the street. We must stop putting our heads in the sand. Islam needs to be outlawed in America and we need to banish this evil from our Christian shores before its too late.
Muslim come to Christian societies to destroy Christians?
Is this what happened in Bosnia 1992-1995; Kosovo? Afghanistan – first Russians killing them for 20 years now American troops etc etc
If you actually did any kind of education research you would find out that Muslims have suffered many genocidal acts done by Christians against them including the ones listed above. Type in Srebrenica in google and learn something!
Right, so all of the drug wars going on and the gangs in the streets don't cause any terror in YOUR HOMELAND. And a majority of these gangs are more than likely raised Christian. I guess we should deport them all too for their "cancer" of a religion that is spreading throughout America!
Wow! So, you wish for a repeal of the first amendment?
So, WHICH one will be the official state religion of the USSA?
The only way to stop all this hate etc is for everyone to go back to their own country. Ethnic groups just cannot fit in here. They do not want to follow our laws. They want America to be just like their own country. This is America. Follow our rules. We have one America. Learn english, follow our laws, one flag. Assimulate or leave.
If Muslims in this country are such habitual scofflaws as you imply, why do they not comprise the majority of incarcerated in our prisons?
You are quite correct – All the so-called 'americans' of Asian, Middle Eastern and European descent should go back to their native countries. Only the Sioux, Cherokee, Pawnee, Cheyenne, Abernaki, etc etc. should be allowed to remain.
Well spoken Tamooj. while we have differing views on religion as a whole, we clearly agree that these bigots need to *try* to be intelligent.
@MJB: I completly agree with you. Furthermore, what flavor would you like our meltingpot to be your highness.......grow a pair and learn that the world woes not live to pander to you and wthat what gives america strenghth is the work ethic of all the immigrants who come here and replace you lazy, bigoted nativists
Perhaps I am getting a little to worked up about these posts. You see, post 9-11 we had a riot, and my family was murdered
“Let’s present the complexity and sophistication of Islam so Americans understand it better. "
No need to understand all that complexity. The only question America needs is: "Can a non-follower of your religion reach salvation?" and "Do you publicly reject all the barbaric and brutal parts of your holy book(s)".
You are in love with saying that one.
When you apply that very question to Christianity, non-believers are doomed. Hence, your first sentence is specious and incorrect.
As nobody wants me to answer that question about brutal punishments and battles in the bible, I'll not ask THEM the question:
Are you now or have you ever been a member of the communist party?
For, that is where the Representative is trying to go AND you wish to go. Back to McCarthyism.
WZRD1: you keep stealing my thunder!
Perhaps we should alter the statement slightly. the question we should ask is "should we continue to be a load of crazy fanatical religuos zelots, or get a move on with the 21st century?"
Kahn, I agree completely. When faced with a choice of moving forward or backward in history and culture, I choose forward, where WAY too many seem to wish to go backward.
I'll answer your questions, Ramon. First, we can't say who will get into heaven. That's up to God to decide and we are all dependent on His Mercy, even the best of us. There are passages in Qur'an stating that some among Christians and Jews, those who worship God sincerely, will be rewarded.
Second, I want to clarify the passages on fighting or jihad. I became a Muslim in 1980, during the Iranian hostage crisis, and I was so fascinated by what it was all about that I convinced my advisor to let me write my doctoral dissertation on jihad. If you read carefully the verses in the Qur'an, you will see there are conditions. First, jihad is generally defensive, and the purpose is to fight oppression. Second, innocent civilians should not be killed. Other conditions in the sayings of Muhammad are that Muslims should never kill by use of fire (or napalm or atomic weapons) and we must not destroy property unnecessarily. Also, prisoners of war must be treated humanely and justly. Just because there are Muslims that don't follow these conditions, that doesn't alter the meaning of jihad. It just means that they're ignorant of their own religion.
Go ahead and read the Qur'an. And when you come to a verse about fighting, reading it in context. I'm a Muslim convert and the only Muslim in my family. But I have very good relationships with my mother, sisters, and all my relatives. That's what Islam teaches.
They are anxious? I have been anxious every day since 9/11/2001. I never had a bad thougt about Muslims in my life before that day. My eyes were opened and I am not going back to sleep.
Do you know what, James? I have also been anxious since September 11, 2001.For weeks I couldn't sleep on Monday nights because the attacks happened on a Tuesday and I didn't know when we would be attacked again. I am a Muslim but I had no part in the 9/11 attacks and neither did anyone I know. Are you aware that approximately 800 Muslims died in the attacks, not as hijackers but as workers in the WTC or as emergency responders or as airline passengers. I would not leave the house for weeks after the attacks without also taking my teenage sons with me because I was afraid of being assaulted by someone who was angry at Muslims. We Muslims have also mourned those who died in the attacks, and we also condemn those attacks and others. I'm an American, James, born and bred, and so are my kids. We have no other country.
Any muslim who says that he is an AMERICAN first and everything else is secondary will have have a place outside his/her country of origin. I
It would help if the Muslim leaders in the US would publically and loudlycondem the radical muslim positions and activities here in the US an abroad. Their silence is taken as approval of radical positions and actions.
They have repeatedly condemned such things in the past and even now.
How would you like them to do it NEXT time they condemn those things? With a megaphone stuck to your ear, as you are unable to hear them, read their words or see their statements on TV?
Hire a skywriter? What?
If THIS ancient old Christian can see, hear and read their condemnation for each and every attack, injustice and event, how is it that you are incapable of doing so? Why, they've done it here in this area of CNN, in the news portions and on TV and radio.
They don't make a sound, do they? Not a peep. I call that silence deafening, approval by the absence of collective condemnation. Never happen though. They don't give a sh–, never did, never will.
So, WRZD, you just happened to have access to Arab TV in five countries? I mean, are you saying that the Arabs didn't sympathize/empathize with the 9/11 terrorists? Is that what you're saying, sport? And who would believe that? The Koran makes Muslims hostage to their dictatorial leader. Yes, they let you into their homes. But Mohammed tells his stupid followers to look at Jews and Christians with a smile but harbor bad will toward them in their hearts. Guess you missed that, huh? Or maybe you asked them what was in their hearts, and they lied to you. The Koran is such a lovely bit of writing with words of extortion and threats to kill. Some religtion of peace and contentment, I'm sure you agree. The fact is that U.S. Muslims did NOT demonstrate against the 9/11 terrorists. They kept their mouths shut. If they really wanted to prove their loyalty to the U.S., let them form a division and go fight the Taliban head to head. That'll be the day, right?
You are right. They have come out and said they are against the killing of innocents but they don't tell you that only Muslims are considered innocent. They don't issue fatwas against death for apostasy, death for blasphemy, that lesser jihad is against the faith, that women can wear whatever they want. In fact they denounce men like Dr. Jasser and Ayaan Hirsi Ali who are critical of the faith. They should be supporting criticism of the faith. Just look at how Christians are treated at Muslim events in Dearborn Michigan. Muslims should be ashamed of themselves and their spokesmen.
Excuse me LOUD CONDEMNATION RIGHT HERE!
Also, it is the US that keeps people tied to their dictators. you see, (and im trying to sound as soothing as i can here, like i would speak to a two year old) we set tose dictatorships up.....people are scared of retribution...from US
Ben, I actually DID have access to the media in MORE than 5 countries. One of the benefits of being with US CENTCOM.
Ben, we don't segregate our forces, like YOU would like us to. I'm sorry, but it's unlawful.
We DO have 10000 Muslim service members fighting in that theater RIGHT NOW.
See my post about my being with US CENTCOM. I'll give you a further hint, I recently retired after over 27 years of military service to this nation, a fair amount was special operations.
Those homes that I was guest in, I was not accompanied in many, so if ill will were harbored, it would easily have been accomplished to those unacquainted with my abilities. I spent a lot of time in areas off limits to regular troops, to evaluate any potential threats, places recognized as unsafe for military personnel.
I'm still alive and well with ZERO incidents.
So, the FACTS AND EVENTS disagree with your views.
The ONE and ONLY question that needs to be solved is this. The Muslim leaders should be inquired: "If I am not a Muslim, can I reach salvation?" and "Do you condemn and reject all the barbaric and brutal parts of the Quram"?
EVERY religion has answered the above in positive (Bible, Talmud, etc), except for one.
Um, pretty sure most Christian faiths require you to "accept Jesus Christ as your lord and savior" and that unbaptized children can't go to heaven. Was a pretty big battle between the church I'm a member at and other churches of the same denomination who our church didn't quite get along with.
I'm not sure where you get that data, I grew up with a GREAT many Christians who would NEVER condemn any part of the Bible, not even the parts where they stoned children to death at the edge of the city, and I would estimate at least 90% of the Christians I grew up would NOT say that you can reach salvation by way of any other religion. Did you really think by writing that that nobody would question the veracity of the inherent blatantly false presupposition?
There's a big surprise – not!
1700 years and 911 speak for themselves. deport everyone of them!
Lou is another idiot
911 was an inside job go check Dov Zakheim and listen what Alan Sabrosky is saying
goole or find on youtube.
Lou,
What you wish to do is summarily exile US citizens because of their faith. A more blatant violation of the first amendment, I've never heard of.
You are talking about US citizens, born and raised here. You are talking about people who have been in this nation for up to 6 generations.
So, if you are unhappy with our laws and our amendments, you are perfectly free to renounce your citizenship and depart this land forever. I'll even buy your plane ticket for you, one way.
American White Boy and Khan are the idiots. Go live in Damascus, smart boy, and see how far you get. By the way, where were the American Muslims after 9/11? Did you see them parading in the streets against their brothers? I didn't. Must have missed that event. Wonder why it wasn't televised. Did you see Arabs overseas dancing in the streets after the towers fell? That I did see. You must have missed it. So shut your mouth, moron. Not only is Islam a cancerous cult masquerading as a reliigion, it is utterly preposterous to think that God would install an Arab at the top of the food chain when the bible and gospels Mohammed PLAGIARIZED are full of nothing but Jewish figures up to and including Jesus. Mohammed was a jealous, spiteful, vindicitve, power-hungry madman that got a lot of stupid people to believe he was God's prophet while extorting money from nonbelievers in exchange for their lives. Really admirable guy, huh? Yeah, if your IQ is less than 80, you, too, can be a Muslim.
Ben, your words give you away as a religious extremist of the worst and militant kind.
I happen to HAVE saw demonstrations against the attacks.
Yes, I DID see the PALESTINIANS dancing in the streets. But, not the Saudis, not the Kuwaitis, not the Omanis, not the UAE, not the Qatari and not the Iraqis.
Now, what would *I* know of Islam? Only what I've learned by observation in the Persian Gulf region for nearly 5 years, where I lived off base and interacted with Arabs on a daily basis. I was even invited into many Arab homes.
But, then I've also met YOUR kind. Indeed, you sound VERY like a man who claimed to be an ordained minister, who was representing his local KKK chapter, who told me that dark skin was the mark of Cain.
Which is interesting, as ALL of Cain's progeny drowned in a flood that was rather great. According to the bible, anyway.
But, after a half century of life and way too much time in special operations, I must be gullible and YOU, who has traveled from his sofa to the bathroom knows far more than I or any of my men.
Wzrd1, i would probaby have replyed to ben, butyou said most of what i wanted to say anyways, so i will merely appluad your reasonedness.
ITS A "MASJID" AND NOT a mosque. A CONGREGATION PLACE FOR MOSLEMS IS A "MASJID" AND NOT A MOSQUE. BUNCH OF IDIOTS DONT UNDERSTAND THIS. if we repsect this it will be a respect of all human-kinds.
Wow! So, the House Un-American Activities Committee is back in business. No budget, but they'll have plenty of time to blacklist people!
It never ceases to amaze me, the number of people that keep repeating the same mistakes.
Its not so much a religion as it is a culture. A culture that really contradicts the current culture in America (Yes we have our own culture). You will not stop people from feeling that their American way of life under attack. I mean look at the attempts to bring in Muslim law into our courts. If Muslims as a group would melt more into the existing American culture, but they don't. Our way of life goes against what many of them want in their way of life. It is scary and we should be wary of it.
Again, another idiot who know nothing about anything.
Parkerman, you're an idiot. THERE HAVE BEEN NO ATTEMPTS TO BRING SHARIA LAW INTO THE US COURTS.
NEVER.
Ever.
It's illegal. Some first amendment thingy.
Try learning FACTS instead of spewing forth the lies of others.
What a moron.
You want laws dictating cultural norms now too? Are we going to outlaw passing gas, wearing unstylish clothing, listening to unpopular music? Rooting for the underdog team? When I was a kid it was socially counter-culture to read books that weren't comics,or tinker with computers while the popular kids played football. I'm a lot more proud of our laws regarding freedom of personal choice and to live as we see fit than I am of our "pop culture."
Oh yes, and christianity doesnt do the same thing?
look at OUR CONTRY WITH GOD GOD GOD everywhere. swear in courts on a....bible.
I will not call you a stupid moron with no knowledgewhatsoever who speaks his empty mid waaayyy to much, i will simply call you LOGICALLY-Impedimented
What is truly funny is that the VERY ARGUMENT against Islam being a culture more than a religion was said of the Catholics when Irish, then Italian Catholic immigrants came to this nation.
Eventually, THAT turned into open religious warfare on the streets of several cities, requiring the US Army to come in and quell it, using Artillery in one case.
Religion is scary, how can any rational person believe in cosmic Genies human society is under threat. There are more stars on the beaches of the whole world than there are stars in our Universe.
That's trillions if you are counting. That would make god a pretty busy wo(man) s(he) is out there.
57:16] Is it not time for those who believed to open up their hearts for GOD's message, and the truth that is revealed herein? They should not be like the followers of previous scriptures whose hearts became hardened with time and, consequently, many of them turned wicked.
[57:20] Know that this worldly life is no more than play and games, and boasting among you, and hoarding of money and children. It is like abundant rain that produces plants and pleases the disbelievers. But then the plants turn into useless hay, and are blown away by the wind. In the Hereafter there is either severe retribution, or forgiveness from GOD and approval. This worldly life is no more than a temporary illusion.
[57:22] Anything that happens on earth, or to you, has already been recorded, even before the creation. This is easy for GOD to do.
[57:23] Thus, you should not grieve over anything you miss, nor be proud of anything He has bestowed upon you. GOD does not love those who are boastful, proud.
[57:25] We sent our messengers supported by clear proofs, and we sent down to them the scripture and the law, that the people may uphold justice. And we sent down the iron, wherein there is strength, and many benefits for the people. All this in order for GOD to distinguish those who would support Him and His messengers, on faith. GOD is Powerful, Almighty.
To Read the whole very interesting chapter kindly find it at:
http://www.submission.org/suras/sura57.html
And we sent down the iron, wherein there is strength, and many benefits for the people.
http://www.miraclesofthequran.com/scientific_30.html
Jesus Christ is lord. Every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus is the Lord. This includes all muslims as well.
Tim Ross.
What ever you say,of course We will all kneel to the prophet of God upon his return to earth from heavens as told in our holy book.
Ah, yes, the Koran-Mohammed's plagiarized version of the bible and gospels, but then he went a step further and installed himself at the top of the food chain. Imagine that - the bible and gospels, full of Jews like David, Solomon, Abraham, Moses, Joshua and, of course, Jesus - and we're supposed to believe that God installed an ARAB as His prophet, someone above Jesus? Excuse me a second - HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I mean, just how stupid does one have to be to think that would ever happen? The bible specifically states God as saying, 'I will be his father and he will be my son." Then this megalomaniac, Mohammed, shows up six hundred years after Christ and says HE is the one to follow, that God has no need to take a son. Well, Mohammed, FU. And let us not forget that Jesus said many false prophets would follow Him, and just look at this guy - a pedophilic, extorting, kill-your-neighbor prophet. Yeah, let's all follow Mohammed! Let's ignore Jesus because Mohammed said so! The entire Koran is filled with Jewish names, and the Muslims are out to kill every Jew in the world. I mean, what a disgraceful 'religion' this is.
Muneef, it appears that this idiot ben cooper will not read the quran even if it is put in front of his face.....nice try fo at least getting some other semi-intelligent people to read their "opponets" words bbefore they start spounting out of thier empty heads....
Ben....seriously, this post is about societal discrimination. if you want to debate about whose religion is better, go start your own extremist group and kill other extremists. the rest of thee sane world shall go argue on this post about societal problems. goodbye mr. religoius fanatic
Ben, you complain about their faith, claiming it's stupid.
How brilliant is it to believe that a man called off dead from work for the holiday weekend, then got better? THEN, flew away?
Mohammed married a 6 year old and drank alcohol, and also killed jews and other people to take their women. All 100% fact. So what do you have to say about that?
Kid, I have a response about applying filters to people from a thousand years ago and even explaining the culture and practices, regrettably, CNN blocks too many words, even ones not profane, to permit a honest discussion of history.
So, I'll have to let YOU learn about the culture THEN and not apply the filter of NOW to THEN AND for you to learn their practices, rather than assume, based upon TODAY, what was done THEN.
Because, facts are not permitted on CNN.
When you live in the REAL world, 8 out of 10 acts of terror right now are carried out by Muslims. White guilt or being in your 20`s wont make the facts any different. If they want this stereotype to end, then turn the "bad" ones in, truly speak out against radical Muslims and integrate into American, British or Canadian cultures ect. Until then nothing will change.
@Darren:
According to the 2010 EU Terrorism Situation and Trend Report: "294 failed, foiled, or successfully executed attacks" occurred in 2009 in six European countries - down almost 50 percent from 2007. The breakdown of attacks with respect to responsibility was thus: 237 by separatist groups; 40 by left-wing and anarchist groups; four by rightists; ten with no clear affiliation; two by single-issue groups, and one by so-called Islamists.
And yet, the report points out: "Islamist terrorism is still perceived as the biggest threat to most Member States, despite the fact that only one Islamist terrorist attack - a bomb attack in Italy - took place in the EU in 2009."
Your fear is irrational. Your fear is counterproductive. Islamophobia is far more threatening than any Muslim could ever be, for it breeds ignorance and bigotry. It also only further alienates Muslims, and if you've ever been alienated or outcast, you know how vulnerable it makes you to radicalization. It's why people join gangs; it's why people become terrorists. Nothing is more threatening than hating and fearing another person for no good reason. Look at the statistics above; go meet your Muslim neighbors, and get over it.
@Darren:
Also, at least 1/3 of all investigations of terror plots by Muslims in the US involved tips from the Muslim American community.
In some communities, Muslim Americans have been so concerned about extremists in their midst that they have turned in people who turned out to be undercover informants, including Craig Monteilh in Orange County, California, and Darren Griffin in Toledo, Ohio.
>integrate into American, British or Canadian cultures ect
What would you call the fact that the #1 name for boys in the UK last year was Mohammed . Integration? I say its an invasion through the delivery room. In 20 years, the UK will be muslim. And our biggest ally will be gone. See how the Muslim strategy has worked for hundreds of years?
pwned
Amazing! The out breeding argument. I have not heard that one since the 1960's when segregationists claimed that Martin Luther King Jr was instructing blacks to breed as many babies as they can, so that they could become the majority.
It never happened, of course, but that didn't stop the idiotic story from being promulgated.
So, if the #1 name for a boy in Pasadena were to be Jesus, it would be the Mexicans trying to outbreed us, right?
Get a new argument.
[repost for Wzrd1's skepticism about Islam's out-breeding strategy ]
Islam is a violent religion and it needs to be exposed. I was in Egypt last year and our tour guide was an archaeologist. He was Islamic but also a quasi-science person and said that the Islamic leaders in years past, wanted to grow Islam to overpower other religions. So they let their followers have multiple wives, and encouraged a lot of children so in a few decades the Islamic population would be much larger that others. They also told the natives, that if they converted to Islam, they would not pay tax, as opposed to Christian and Jewish. So they got more and more people converting to Islam. Fast forward hundreds of years later and you see the result of that cunning strategy.
Islam creates high population growth as a strategy to dominate, and because it has no freedoms the people live in poverty.. and then turn to extremism to take by force what they don't have. It is not a religion, but a movement/philosophy of domination and conquest for the leaders. The people are born into it, and essentially are slaves.
We cannot let this type of violent oppressive and proliferating ideology take root in the US and tear it open from within.
Could you please name the source for your statistic that 8 out of 10 terrorist acts are committed against Muslims?
@merri
Or because it is a popular name, while the diversity of more Anglo names would probably prevent one of those from being the top name. Be interesting to see if you added up Matthew Mark Luke John and Christopher where that total would rank compared to Mohammed
I have no problem with these hearings just as I see no redeemable qualities in Islam. We have seen Muslims consistently kill innocent people most poignantly their own children in market place – acid attacks against girls on their way to school, arranged marriages, stoning for blasphemy and infidelity, decapitation and exploitation of pows, rampant child abuse, – etc etc etc etc. These practices are abhorred in the west and punished under western law when they surface. Now here come the Muslims – do they have mass protests over these clear human right violations – no. They condone it with silence. They do however protest against free speech – cartoon of Muhammad – yes and they do so violently! They protest and demand that the separation of church and state be abolished just for them in Islamic courts. They demand special privileges under western law that reduce women to property…. Etc etc etc.
These are FACTS.
Forgot the thousands of bombings by Christian Irishmen. And a little something called Oklahoma City.
totally agree with you. The muslim community has yet to show that their loyalty to this country. They're very quick at trying to explain away all the terrorist acts their coreligionists commit in the world and they label us as "islamophobes" if we don't accept their excuses. They never ever accept responsibility for any crimes...
In the real world, George Bush and his gang of criminal lied us into a fake war killing 150k Iraqis, a long shot from the number of Muslims who killed from terrorism. Bush and Cheney the worlds worst terrorists.
@paperjihad
Those numbers are for Europe, not America. I agree that this is concerning, but this article is about America, not the EU.
Also @merri
Why do you think the Catholic Church has been against contraception for so long? Because they really and truly believe condoms are equivalent to mini abortions or because more followers equals more donations in the offering plate? Or why previously the Mormon church supported multiple wives? I freely admit that these are all conspiracy theories (read stereotypes), but it's a little disingenuous to pick and choose the conspiracies of one religion and say therefore they are the only ones plotting to take over the world through outbreeding other religions.
paperjihad, what were the EU's stats for Sept, 2001? Perhaps lower than last years? Your argument has no merit.
The threat of Islamic Terrorism IS our greatest threat, next to the blindness of those that can't see it for what it is.
Three things you need to know about Islam. 1) Triumphalism: For all of history when Muslims had a great victory or conquest they INVARIABLY built a mosque at the site. 2.) In Islam it is NO sin to lie to a non-believer. (Which is why you don't just interrogate Muslim terrorists) 3. Islam teaches hatred of Jews and Christians. They feel it was Ishmael who accompanied Abraham (Abram.in Islam) to the top of Mt. Moriah for sacrifice. They feel cheated of their birthright and want ALL of Israel to fall into the sea. Tha's the whole story. Anything anyone else tells you falls under #2 in th points .
Not by American Muslims !!
American muslims are as patriotic as any other citizen.
I have to agree with you on this. Far too few Muslims stand up and speak out against acts of terrorism. Many prominent Muslims have actually argued that Jihad is the right way, and the Koran most definitely calls for Jihad. Choudhary is currently leading a march in DC calling for the implementation of Shari'a law in the US. I don't have to explain Shari'a law here do I? When the majority of the muslim community stands up condemns and hands over terrorists to the authorities then we can rest a little more easy. Until then, I stand behind Peter King looking into these radical muslim terrorists.
Can you be a good Muslim & a good American? Answer: NO! Their allegence is to Allah and a big frickin rock in Mecca!
They ask for tolorence when their relegion preaches that all of us Infidels must be converted or KILLED! This is written in
the Koran! I've never heard a catholic or protestant or a jew, killing others cause their relegion says so...and then ask for
tolorence? The idiots in Washington and San Francisco cry Multi-Cultursm!? Are you frickin kidden me? Most relegion is B.S.
But even the mind-bending, fire & brimstone, Baptists don't call for the murder of millions, like Islam does!
I know who the enemy is....He is Muslim!!! And if you don't learn it too...He will behead you!!! P. Evans
@Zach N
Yea, the church is causing grave harm too by advocating against condoms. But many of us don't listen because we have the freedom to tune them out, and also call them idiots if we want. Think you can do that against Islam , and in an Islamic country?? Go visit one.
You also don't hear Bishops calling for the execution of non christians, or those who draw cartoons of Jesus. Islamic clerics call for deaths all the time. They are a Mafia/Evil mob. Islam reduces all civilisations to dust. Afghanistan used to have an Afghan Elvis- Ahmad Zahir in the 70s who was very popular, part of a flourishing cultural heritage. He was critical of the govt. He was killed. Decades of no music followed. Islam basically destroyed their entire cultural heritage by muzzling it.
I'd advise people to read up on world, islam's history , to really understand how movements like Islam work and have affected the world negatively.
Yeah and us Protestants never did anything like kill people and hang them up as a message, or blow up where they worshipped, or used dogs to break up peaceful protests. Oh I forgot that was less than 50 years ago during the civil rights movement. If we are going to stereotype people based on their "history of violence" us WASPs really need to take long looks in the mirror before we make grandiose statements about how all Muslims are coming to kill us because they've been planning it for so long. People become violent when they feel threatened, and others exploit those fears to maintain their hold on power. That's been pretty consistent throughout history. Islam does not have a corner on this market.
Merri, FASCINATING! You've uncovered a vast conspiracy from your wise tour guide than ALL of the intelligence agencies in the world!
Why, you uncovered something that I had no exposure to or hint existed, which is interesting as I was deployed to the Persian Gulf region for nearly 5 years and lived off post, dealing with Arabs on a daily basis. Eating in Arab homes. Talking with them.
Getting information from them.
Astounding that such a vast conspiracy went on without notice! Why, there must be 12 billion of them after so many CENTURIES! Maybe they're in the broom closet hiding, waiting to attack or something.
Meanwhile, the ENTIRE LATTER PORTION OF YOUR ARGUMENT could LITERALLY be said of Roman Catholics.
Even to a militant argument, as the child is confirmed with the words "Soldier of Christ", the response was "Amen".
It's astounding how you spin doctor the practices and turn a cultural adaptation to a harsh environment into a vast conspiracy that should have taken over the entire inner solar system by now!
But then, I must be a dullard and gullible. After all, I'm not experienced like you, I'm only a half century old. I've only served in the military for over 27 years and recently retired. I've only been all over the Persian Gulf, the Horn of Africa, all over Europe. What would *I* know?
Zach, you protestants DID blow up and burn churches. Other than the racial attacks in the south by the protestant KKK, which will be ignored in this discussion, we'll talk about the religious WARS fought in the very streets of this nation.
The Philadelphia Nativist Riots, which ended with Philadelphia passed an ordinance that gave the city a battalion of artillery, a regiment of infantry and at least one full troop of cavalry for the purpose of providing the preservation of peace within the city when necessary.
Louisville riots.
The Bowery riots, which had both religious and draft issues that fanned the flames and ended with the US Army patrolling the streets after being forced to fire artillery into the Bowery to quell the violence.
So, DO try again. Our nation's history is littered with protestant violence, in particular, protestant vs catholic.
> wise tour guide than ALL of the intelligence agencies in the world
The tour guide thing was a side job. He was an archaeologist and taught at Cairo university. I got more honest talk about Islam and Christianity's histories from him than any other person. The Virgin mother thing? Read up on Isis too ..
YOu really have to open your eyes, and stop defending violent ideologies that lead people to behead our citizens for the camera. Learn about Mohammed.. who was a ruthless warlord, and beheaded his captives. The Crusades.. was the European christians try to get a path back to the holy land that had been conquered by Muslims. Put a lot of these historical events, facts, motives.. and see how they shaped the world today. Also know that ancient Egypt's great civilisation ended when they were conquered by the Nubians(now Sudan).
[quoting from a source online] .. "In 1380 A.D. the Sphinx fell victim to the iconoclastic ardor of a fanatical Muslim ruler, who caused deplorable injuries to the head. Then the figure was used as a target for the guns of the Mamluks."
When you think that Alexander, Julius Caesar, cleopatra, all stood before the sphinx and marveled at it.. but a fanatical Muslim used it for target practice.... and you take into account the destruction of the Buddha statues in afghanistan by the islamists.. its is a pattern. You can defend it if you choose. But you're dead wrong
@ Pat Evans
Some examples: Judges wanting the ten commandments in their courtrooms, the same ten commandments that come from the old testament with some gnarly references to smiting other races http://www.humanismbyjoe.com/Violence_and_God.htm
Nazis wanting clemency because they were just following orders.
Anti abortionists wanting laws reflecting their values, while at the same time killing abortion doctors.
Wanting marriage defined as a man and a woman when killing gays pretty heavy in the old testament there too.
Also a bit of a flawed argument in the US when the Christians have been in the position of power. Don't really need to ask permission to do things from yourself.
Uh Wzrd1, you apparently didn't get that I'm on your side. I was using irony to lead to an example of hypocrisy.
Actually, the pope and protestant christain chirches have advocated massacre and rascism since thierr creation. Open your history book to slavery, and also that of "native americans"
Merri, I am rather conversant on history, to put it mildly. I'm WELL aware of the ISIS myths and numerous other myths, to include Gilgamesh, his great flood and many other stories that later became part of our old testament and the Jewish holy texts.
As for the Sphinx, there are multiple stories on the nose damage, the most accepted is:
Muhammad Sa'im al-Dahr, a Sufi Muslim from the khanqah of Sa'id al-Su'ada. In AD 1378, upon finding the Egyptian peasants making offerings to the Sphinx in the hope of increasing their harvest, Sa'im al-Dahr was so outraged that he destroyed the nose, and was hanged for vandalism.
Yep, REAL intolerant of them, considering he was hanged for his crime.
You still cling to the absurd notion that 1.5 BILLION people want to harm you, rather than a few extremists wishing to do so.
I suppose there are no Christian extremists? The abortion clinic doctors were blown up and shot by accident? Abortion clinics blown up with patients inside was actually an accident as well? You know, someone accidentally set explosives at the clinic, right?
Churches burned to the ground with the congregation inside, more peaceful Christians that met at church, put on their sheets and murdered the night away.
Oops, those don't count. It's ALL the evil Muslims, even IF we have a LOT of them fighting in our war with us, Muslim nations helping the war effort, even Saudi intelligence warning us of incoming printer bombs.
How EVIL of them, they saved the synagogues!
I personally know men whose Muslim language interpreter saved their lives by stepping in front of incoming fire. SO EVIL!
We have 8 bases in Muslim countries, all working with the war effort and all there by the host nation's invitation. HORRIBLE of them! Why, they even paid to BUILD the bases for us! Yep, totally against us there!
Let's review a few: Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Bahrain and Qatar. Yep, sounds like they're against us, letting us put multiple bases in their countries!
Oops, they don't count, right?
ED don't forget Padilla was likely the other bomber and he was a muslim. Tool. Race doesn't mean anything its about the religion. He is a vato.
The Kid, you're right! People keep talking about racial profiling Muslims, as Islam is a RELIGION AND NOT A RACE, we'll have to identify them.
Perhaps we'll make them wear a crescent moon.
And identify their homes and offices.
It'll make it easier to take them to the camps with the big ovens later.
Oops, some people LOOK like Arabs, common genetic stock and all. We'd better have Jews wear a Star of David, for their own safety.