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Filmmaker: I found God in Hollywood
Lee Stanley, right, and his son, Shane, left, with Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson on the set of their 2006 film, "Gridiron Gang."
March 31st, 2011
01:00 AM ET

Filmmaker: I found God in Hollywood

By Steve Almasy, CNN

(CNN) - It’s not impossible to be a Christian in Hollywood, Lee Stanley will tell you. What it does take is guts - the same guts it takes to be a Christian anywhere, he says.

Stanley wasn’t a believer when he moved from New England to California in the 1960s. He was in love with a fantasy – not the idea of making it big on the big screen, but being around the water all the time.

The aspiring baseball player had realized he wasn’t going to make it to the major leagues, so he turned to another passion - diving. He had no idea the trek West would lead him on the road to becoming a filmmaker who tells stories of redemption and faith.

Stanley details his life in “Faith in the Land of Make-Believe,” published this month by Zondervan. In a phone interview from his boat, he said he wrote the book to “to encourage people that have wandered away or lost the confidence in the things that have been on their heart for years.”

For years Stanley was lost, he just didn’t know it, he said. He spent his youth caring only about himself. He was raised to never show a weakness. He just wanted to have fun, make a little cash and spend time in the water off Catalina Island. He even thought about taking off on a tramp steamer setting sail for Greece, where he could do some diving.

But a friend of a friend knew people in the movie business, and Stanley - then 19 - got a job as an extra on a Frank Sinatra film. He was intrigued by the industry, so he took other bit parts in film and television and soon signed with MGM. In 1966, he was considered for the part of Benjamin Braddock in “The Graduate,” but it went to Dustin Hoffman instead. His last acting role was in 1972’s “The Candidate,” where he appeared alongside Robert Redford.

He was beyond bored, though. Too much sitting around and waiting, he says. So he started making documentaries. His distributor was a kind man named Dave Adams.

Adams invited Stanley over for brunch with his wife but said they were going to church first. Stanley tried to get out of it, saying he had no jacket or tie and wouldn’t be presentable. Adams told him to come as he was. Stanley agreed - to appease the man with the money.

They went to Church on the Way in Van Nuys, where a few hundred eager people were waiting for the first service to let out. He went from blasé to curious. Then the doors opened, and the smiling churchgoers spilled out. Now Stanley really wanted to see what was inside.

He says it hit him right away once inside. He calls it The Voice. It said, “Welcome home. We have a lot of things to do together.”

Stanley embraced making faith-based films and documentaries, but he chose not to make them overly Christian. As an example of what he didn’t want to do, he remembered a film he saw shortly after moving to Hollywood. It was a beautiful work that touched all of his emotions, he said, but the one he felt at the end was anger.

“It became a 10-minute, finger-pointing altar call,” he says. “I felt trapped and betrayed.”

That’s not the way to win over non-believers or people struggling with their faith, he thought, not on screen nor in person.

“I don’t lead with scripture any more than I expect people that have their own faith to constantly try to push me into it,” he said.

On the other hand, when a studio or distributor pushed back on the themes of his movies, he would not compromise. He remained steadfast and worked with the people who accepted his philosophy.

“I’ve been in a lot of good fights,” he says. “Sometimes I was a winner, sometimes I got kicked back where I belonged.”

His commitment led to an award-winning documentary, “Desperate Passage.” After meeting a youth offender at a correctional institution, Stanley found it in his heart to make a documentary about young criminals. In an unusual move, he petitioned the court to release seven juveniles into his custody, so that he could film them during a 10-day sail on his yacht.

It took four years to get permission.

“Everything I was asking for was illegal,” he says. “You weren’t supposed to take pictures of young offenders. I also asked to have my pick of the kids, and there were no guards [on the trip].”

The struggles didn’t end after shooting wrapped. No TV station wanted to air the documentary. Two years later, a Los Angeles station director agreed to show it, and it got tremendous ratings. It won two Emmys and confirmed his mission in life.

“We all have a God-ordained purpose in our life, but I have to add to that because I learned … that before he will lead us into each stage of our purpose, drawing us closer and closer, he has to do things in our life so we when we get to that next stage, we won’t misfire, destroy or lose,” he says.

“That’s the wonderful thing about God.”

Stanley also made "Gridiron Gang," starring Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson. Stanley’s son, Shane, helped produce it.

Stanley and his third wife, Linda, are sailing these days as he writes the screenplay of his next project. It’s a victory story, he says.

It appears the same can be said for his.

- Producer/Writer

Filed under: California • Movies • TV

soundoff (322 Responses)
  1. T-party

    @ steve the real one. do not apologize you believe what you believe ....I am agnostic I thats how I am ....I will never apologize for it

    April 1, 2011 at 10:39 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      Thanks t-party. I apologized for how I represented myself. I can never apologize for my faith but thank you t-party!

      April 1, 2011 at 11:32 pm |
  2. Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

    Those who can only see black and white are doomed to a colorless existence devoid of any shades of gray that are visible to those who have brains and an education and have learned that the world isn't so simple.

    Steve, you sound like a very immature kid. I hope you gain some wisdom and insight someday. I doubt you will, because you've closed your mind already. You fail to grasp the fact that your religious beliefs are not facts and that every religion claims to be the "true" path and calls all others false. Yours is no different and you are no more guaranteed anything in the hereafter than is anyone else.

    You can keep pretending or ignoring, but it won't change a thing. You don't know what happens after death. No one does.

    April 1, 2011 at 7:20 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      I will admit I came off yesterday in an ridiculous manner. I have apologized for that. I have apologized for my delivery. Tom, the message of Christ is one of love and I did not reflect that. So I apologize to yo as well. In saying that it does not change my faith. I have insight and by God's grace will gain more! You may never understand that and you don't have to. It appears that you have closed your mind to faith because it is not real to you. It is real to me! Tom, Jesus is the example of what happens to those who place their trust in God and yes that includes after death! You have closed you mind to this! Science while useful saves no souls! Only Christ can do that!. I am not pretending nor am I ignoring anything! You are right it (including your name calling) will change nothing. I will still believe ! That is how it will be! You don't have to understand it nor like it! just know this is what I chose. I am fine with it Tom! Thanks for the the chat!

      April 1, 2011 at 7:45 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You really are diim, aren't you? I'm not opposed to faith in the slightest. What I despise is your assumption that YOUR brand of faith and your beliefs are the only valid ones. You are too stupid to grasp the point and can only continue to mumble nonsense that makes it quite apparent you have no idea what I have said. None.

      What you believe is simply that. Your belief. Not truth or fact. Nor is your belief the only valid and valuable belief system in the world. So what if it works for you? You nincompoop, you and your like have cast out all who don't see things as you do and then proceed to bray that your beliefs are the sole "true" ones. All the while telling everyone who doesn't fit your mold that they're cast out and doomed. Way to persuade others that your beliefs are meant for all.

      That breeze you feel ruffling your ponytail is the point flying right over your empty head.

      April 1, 2011 at 10:40 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Ecclesiastes 1:1 The words of the Preacher, the son of David, king in Jerusalem.

      Ecclesiastes 2:1 I said in mine heart, Go to now, I will prove thee with mirth, therefore enjoy pleasure: and, behold, this also [is] vanity.

      Ecclesiastes 3:1 To every [thing there is] a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:

      Ecclesiastes 4:1 So I returned, and considered all the oppressions that are done under the sun: and behold the tears of [such as were] oppressed, and they had no comforter; and on the side of their oppressors [there was] power; but they had no comforter.

      Ecclesiastes 5:1 Keep thy foot when thou goest to the house of God, and be more ready to hear, than to give the sacrifice of fools: for they consider not that they do evil.

      Ecclesiastes 6:1 There is an evil which I have seen under the sun, and it [is] common among men:

      Ecclesiastes 7:1 A good name [is] better than precious ointment; and the day of death than the day of one's birth.

      Amen.

      April 14, 2011 at 7:52 am |
  3. Up Your Rear Admiral

    Steve (the really stupid, ignorant one)

    Peter's "buybull" is a dam-n appropriate spelling for that evil pile of nonsense. The buybull/bible, whatever you want to call that Christian book of evil, is full of errors, and furthermore, to use it as proof of what it claims is circular and invalid.

    April 1, 2011 at 5:40 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      It's pointless to bother with the dolt. He isn't capable of anything approaching real thinking. It's just more of the same crap HS and CW shovel out, piled higher and deeper.

      April 1, 2011 at 6:58 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      UYRA, it is clear you have never read the Bible with spiritual insight. if you did, you would have a differing take on it! The Holy Spirit makes it come alive. This is the missing ingredient for you.

      April 1, 2011 at 7:27 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son
      It's pointless to bother with the dolt. He isn't capable of anything approaching real thinking. It's just more of the same crap HS and CW shovel out, piled higher and deeper.
      ---------–
      Good afternoon Thomas! Sorry you feel the way you do but that is your right. You make it sound like you know me! I am sure we have never met. C continue on with your assumptions if you must. Have a great weekend!

      April 1, 2011 at 7:30 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      What are you, about 17? How do you know what anyone needs? It seems you're confusing yourself with God, yet again, Steve-O.

      April 2, 2011 at 1:00 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Psalm 55:15; 69:22-28; 109
      Revelation 6:10
      2 Timothy 4:14

      Amen.

      April 14, 2011 at 7:47 am |
  4. ***dude***

    What?

    April 1, 2011 at 6:59 am |
  5. Frederica

    Hollywood needs to find history properly as well.

    April 1, 2011 at 5:54 am |
  6. TWalkins

    From and outside perspective, I see two sides....

    I see atheist, agnostics or whatever you want to call yourselves, calling people of faith out, by using bitter discourse, and callous talk that in no way adds to a civil discussion. I see a general argument used often that goes something like this, "hey people of faith, you all are ignorant, and dumb to think you know the truth, its impossible for you to know it, but wait, even though I just called you out on knowing the whole truth, I am going to claim I know the truth." I see a lot of logical fallacies in your arguments. You use arguments (not necessarily on this forum but others) like religion has destroyed this world (and I can see some points, like religious dogma and people using faith for personal gain) but lets look at Nazi Germany, the Soviet Union, Communist China, North Korea, Myanmar and so on, these countries had killed, not a couple people, not a thousand people, but millions of people in attempts to rid the wold of religion, millions, I guess if your pro-genocide, then you would agree with these places. I challenge you to use civil discourse, not harsh words that weaken your argument, acting someones character does not prove a point. I believe some of you are pretty intelligent people, but if you really want to be intelligent, you would avoid using ad hominem's and Hasty generalization fallacies.

    Now for people of faith, I see alot of people playing into discourse, If i remember correctly, scripture calls us to love others, not to condemn them, not to belittle them, but to love them unconditionally. I understand your standing up for your faith, I am not telling you to stop, but I am telling any of you, who feel the need to condemn people you dont know, quit it. Your the type of religious people that Jesus talked against, people who feel superior to others, because I am not better of a person than anyone else on this forum, I challenge you to love all these people on here (not superfically, but truly love them, like we are taught). I know...they might come back and mock me and call me a coward for caring for them, or somehow telling me not to, but do it regardless of there actions.

    And last point to both groups, you will NEVER, EVER solve something on a forum, you will always have ridiculous people on both sides, saying ridiculous things. Also, majority of people on here come her with an agenda, and that agenda most likely isnt going to be changed in 4 sentences. I challenge both sides to civil discourse, but Im going to assume that probably wont happen

    April 1, 2011 at 12:48 am |
    • SeanNJ

      tldr;

      April 1, 2011 at 10:32 am |
    • Steve (the real one)

      I have read what you wrote and as much as I wanted to just read it and move on, I cannot. Your words brought conviction because your words are true! I sounded a bit like a jack-a-s-s yesterday, although not intentional, that is still the result. As NL, so stated my delivery needed some work. I said I would pray about it and I did . The answer to my prayers was found in your post! So as correction was given, I recieve it. My thanks to you for being bold enough to say what you did. My thanks to NL, for offering the challenge! My apologies to those I have needlessly offended. Please note, I cannot apologize if God's word offends but I can and will for my delivery. As stated before, I do care for those that are lost! I really do! Course correction was required and it will be done! I was overzealous and too defensive! Again, for that I apologize. I am not perfect and God knows my heart and my intentions! I will still be posting, more carefully and thoughfully and will still share the gospel. Never believed I was better than anyone else! yet due to delivery, that was not clear. For those that are willing, I do ask forgiveness!

      April 1, 2011 at 11:54 am |
    • LJ

      Steve learning to write on the forums can be a challenge but what you need to reflect on is how you are receiving what you are reading as well. We all come from different walks of life, experiences, cultures., etc. How we receive and understand information is formed by our personal reality. What I am writing and how I am writing it may seem simple enough to me but it does not guarantee you will understand this intent because you have a personal choice on how you are going to receive it. If I say to you that you are a b*stard you will choose how to receive it. You can get angry because you find it offensive, you can laugh it off because I could be joking, you could dismiss it since I don’t know you but you are choosing how you are interpreting it, not me. We form personal stories in our head of what we think is going on with others we encounter, but we actually have to challenge ourselves to make sure what we are assuming is true or not.

      There are two children and a father riding on a train. The children are being loud, running up and down the aisles, grabbing toys from each other and carrying on. The father is sitting on a seat nearby looking at a newspaper not really paying attention to the children. The passengers on the train are getting upset over how loud and obnoxious the children are being, the way they are carrying on.

      So, up until now Steve what is your interpretation of this what has been written?

      April 1, 2011 at 1:30 pm |
    • LJ

      Now, Steve take how you just interpreted the story of the children, the assumptions you made and realize that the father doesn't know how to deal with the Children because they just left the hospital where they watched their mother die. What just happened to your interpretation of the story now?

      April 1, 2011 at 1:36 pm |
    • PeterVN

      Actually, social pressure and embarrassment do work to change opinions, whether presented in forums or otherwise. On that note, I present a quote from earlier post again,

      "Religion is for the ignorant, the gullible, the cowardly, and the stupid, and for those who would profit from them."

      There is no substantial evidence for the Christian god and a ton of evidence against a god existing with the characteristics that Christians claim for it. So which group do you want to be in?

      April 1, 2011 at 2:32 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      PeterVN
      Actually, social pressure and embarrassment do work to change opinions, whether presented in forums or otherwise. On that note, I present a quote from earlier post again, "Religion is for the ignorant, the gullible, the cowardly, and the stupid, and for those who would profit from them." There is no substantial evidence for the Christian god and a ton of evidence against a god existing with the characteristics that Christians claim for it. So which group do you want to be in?
      -------
      Well PeterVN, I will assume you use of ignorance simply means lack of knowing. If that is the case welcome to the club as I don't know everything (hence ignorant about somethings) and neither do you! I am not cowardly, stupid, nor gullible! You actually think only Christians fall into the category of names you provided? Sorry PeterVN, not buying it! As for what group I want to be in? I thought I made that clear when I told you I am a Christian! There are tons of evidence for God, IF you really want to discover them! I apologized for my delivery of the message, not for the message! I am a Christian, whether that is soicially acceptable to you or not. I will die one (well, actually continue to live as one). That is the group I am in, no need to debate it or argue it. It is what it is and I am more than good with that! Just as you feel my faith offers you nothing, I feel the same about atheism. Like I said, it is what it is!

      April 1, 2011 at 2:57 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      LJ
      Now, Steve take how you just interpreted the story of the children, the assumptions you made and realize that the father doesn't know how to deal with the Children because they just left the hospital where they watched their mother die. What just happened to your interpretation of the story now?
      ----–
      Good point LJ. I have a question for you. Are Christians ever mis-interpreted or would that only apply to non-believers?

      April 1, 2011 at 3:01 pm |
    • LJ

      "Actually, social pressure and embarrassment do work to change opinions, whether presented in forums or otherwise. On that note, I present a quote from earlier post again," No they don't unless you choose to allow it. I personally have never been influenced by social pressure or embarrassment. What does influence me on a personal level is the opinions of those I love and respect. If we are talking about over all social change then I would look at the examples set by MLK or Gandhi.

      As for the simple question of which group, neither. I am a spiritual being that doesn't belong to either group. LOL!

      April 1, 2011 at 3:05 pm |
    • LJ

      "Are Christians ever mis-interpreted or would that only apply to non-believers?" Neither, it only applies to you.

      April 1, 2011 at 3:09 pm |
    • LJ

      I meant to say to yourself.

      April 1, 2011 at 3:16 pm |
    • LJ

      Steve take some of your favorite scriptures and then try this.

      1. Who is the author of the pa.s.sage?
      2. Who were the recipients?
      3. What is the historical background of the pa.s.sage?
      4. What is the outline/structure of the pa.s.sage?
      5. Are any words repeated? Any significance to the repeti-tion?
      6. Are there any unusual words in the pa.s.sage that call for more exploration?
      7. How does the pa.s.sage fit into the surrounding paragraph? Chapter? Book?
      8. Why did the author place the pa.s.sage here and not somewhere else?
      9. In one sentence, what is the main point of the pa.s.sage?
      10. How would the original audience have been affected by the pa.s.sage?
      11. How does this pa.s.sage connect to the overall storyline of the Bible?
      12. How does this pa.s.sage reveal Jesus as savior?
      13. How does God want this pa.s.sage to function in my life?
      14. What kind of response does this pa.s.sage call for?

      April 1, 2011 at 3:28 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      LJ

      Steve take some of your favorite scriptures and then try this.

      1. Who is the author of the pa.s.sage?
      2. Who were the recipients?
      3. What is the historical background of the pa.s.sage?
      4. What is the outline/structure of the pa.s.sage?
      5. Are any words repeated? Any significance to the repeti-tion?
      6. Are there any unusual words in the pa.s.sage that call for more exploration?
      7. How does the pa.s.sage fit into the surrounding paragraph? Chapter? Book?
      8. Why did the author place the pa.s.sage here and not somewhere else?
      9. In one sentence, what is the main point of the pa.s.sage?
      10. How would the original audience have been affected by the pa.s.sage?
      11. How does this pa.s.sage connect to the overall storyline of the Bible?
      12. How does this pa.s.sage reveal Jesus as savior?
      13. How does God want this pa.s.sage to function in my life?
      14. What kind of response does this pa.s.sage call for?
      -----–
      Great suggestion!

      April 1, 2011 at 3:39 pm |
    • PeterVN

      @Steve(the real one) Present any evidence of substance for the existence of your god. You would be the first person to ever do so. And no, buybull quotes do not suffice.

      April 1, 2011 at 4:28 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      PeterVN
      @Steve(the real one) Present any evidence of substance for the existence of your god. You would be the first person to ever do so. And no, buybull quotes do not suffice.
      -----
      1. Sorry PeterVN, not gonna get caught up in this game
      2. Bible quotes works well for me! I believe in using what you got!
      3. Why do you atheists get to make the rules of engagement?
      4. It is spelled Bible! but its your call!

      April 1, 2011 at 4:41 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Matthew 7:6 and Jude 4 come to mind.

      Amen.

      April 14, 2011 at 7:41 am |
  7. Steve (the real one)

    Spencer
    Steve you wrote “Wrong! You mock God's Word!” but you haven’t been preaching “God’s word” you have been preaching yours. God’s word is the actual scriptures not something you write here on this blog. “they have been exposed to the Gospel of Christ.” No, you have been writing about yourself not Christ’s Look back at what you are writing just in this blog, it’s not truly about God, Christ, it’s about you. You are critical of others to make yourself seem righteous.
    -------–
    In your attempt to accuse me of judging, are you not judging me? What is in my heart Spencer? Why am on this blog? To make me look good? Really? Who does that help? I can save no one, not even myself!. All I can do is warn people that Jesus is soon returning and to urge them to get right with God! Maybe that is not to you liking or expectation of how I should say something! If you have a better idea, share it. If you feel scriptures need to be quoted, Spencer quote them! I have quoted scripture in the past! I will do so again! You are wrong to think this is about me! That however is your call!
    I said this before and will do so again, My only claim to righteousness is what Jesus bestowed on ALL believers. We are told that we are the righteousness of God through Christ Jesus! that is my only righteousness not from self but from Christ Jesus!. Should I back down from that, Spencer? You don't have to answer! I will! NO I WILL NOT! ! People need to know Spencer. Are you going to tell them? You say you were tired of reading this CR@P , so can I assume you will share nothing? Question Spencer, where do you stand with the Lord?

    You said "“they have been exposed to the Gospel of Christ.” No"
    actually YES. many others have posted scripture (book, chapter and verse) on this blog,myself included. so yes folks have been exposed to the Gospel of Christ!

    Guess what Spencer, same rejection and same criticism! I'm a grown man, so I can take it. In fact we are told that we will be hated because He (Jesus) was hated! When I feel I cannot take it, I am driven back to the cross! Either way you look at it I am encouraged!

    March 31, 2011 at 11:14 pm |
    • Spencer

      "to make me look good? Really? Who does that help? " Your ego, which is why you continue to post here. Thanks for proving it with this post! LOL! Hmmmm... the post was all about you....again.

      March 31, 2011 at 11:20 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      Spencer believe about me what you will, it does not matter anyway. I know me purpose. I know what is in my heart! You did not answer my question. Where do you stand with God? Let's make this about you!

      March 31, 2011 at 11:27 pm |
    • Reality

      Standing tall using truth and rational thinking:

      The Apostles' Creed 2011: (updated based on the studies of historians and theologians during the past 200 years- see the list of 35 books and articles to peruse that were previous noted)

      I might believe in a god whose existence cannot be proven
      and said god if he/she/it exists resides in an unproven,
      human-created, spirit state (as per Aquinas and JPII) of bliss called heaven.

      I believe there was a 1st century CE, Jewish, simple,
      preacher-man who was conceived by a Jewish carpenter
      named Joseph living in Nazareth and born of a young Jewish
      girl named Mary. (Some say he was a mamzer.)

      Jesus was summarily crucified for being a temple rabble-rouser by
      the Roman troops in Jerusalem serving under Pontius Pilate,

      He was buried in an unmarked grave and still lies
      a-mouldering in the ground somewhere outside of
      Jerusalem.

      Said Jesus' story was embellished and "mythicized" by
      many semi-fiction writers. A bodily resurrection and
      ascension stories were promulgated to compete with the
      Caesar myths. Said stories were so popular that they
      grew into a religion known today as Catholicism/Christianity
      and featuring dark-age, daily wine to blood and bread to body rituals
      called the eucharistic sacrifice of the non-atoning Jesus.

      Amen

      April 1, 2011 at 12:02 am |
    • Steve (the real one)

      Reality,

      Good night. I still think you posts fail but that is for another time! Jesus is Lord!

      April 1, 2011 at 12:10 am |
  8. Steve, the real one

    Folks,

    If I talk sports, food, and s-e-x all day, not a one of you would be offended. In fact some of you would be cheering me on, especially the s-e-x part. Yet you are offended by the Word of God. Why?, because it challenges you. It upsets your spiritual status quo. It shakes the kingdom of darkness. While most of you may not understand this, this is a spiritual battle we are in and there are only 2 sides to this. That is why this shakes you. That is why you see this as hatred and bigotry , it is not! Yet the enemy of your souls portrays it as such. I pray for that you come to Christ before it is too late. That is my only purpose here! I cannot apologize about that! What I will do is pray about my delivery! We will see!

    March 31, 2011 at 4:25 pm |
    • Doc Vestibule

      And I am here to get people like Steve, CW and HeavenSent to accept the reality of moral relativism.
      Your book of answers is but one of many throughout all of history.
      Until you have studied other viewpoints with the same willingness to accept them as valid truths that you give the religion with which you were raised, I won't stop.
      And with that, the good Doctor is going home to his family.
      (a family that gets me a one way ticket to hell, by christian standards)

      March 31, 2011 at 4:31 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Baloney. It doesn't "shake" me. It repulses me that you think you're qualified, along with CW and HS, to decide what God thinks and knows and predict what will happen to others who don't see things your way. You think your belief equals fact and that your interpretation of the meaning of the Bible is the only correct one. Your insistence that ONLY the Bible and what your preacher tells you it means are the path to enlightenment and eternity are simply nothing but your opinion and that of others who happen to adhere to your brand of Christianity.

      Everyone else claims exactly the same thing.

      Which would be just fine, but for the self-righteous behavior you and the rest of your ilk exhibit. You sit here and judge, judge, judge others, all the while looking less and less like the Christ you are supposed to emulate.

      It's repulsive behavior. Stop telling others what to do and go do it yourself. Your posts do nothing to convince anyone of the rightness of your cause; all they do is reinforce the stereotype that CW and HS represent to the nth degree. I have no desire to be like any of you or have anyone in my life like you. You are self-aggrandizing hypocrites. All talk, no action.

      All judgment, no compassion.

      March 31, 2011 at 4:49 pm |
    • Spencer

      Steve you wrote “Wrong! You mock God's Word!” but you haven’t been preaching “God’s word” you have been preaching yours. God’s word is the actual scriptures not something you write here on this blog. “they have been exposed to the Gospel of Christ.” No, you have been writing about yourself not Christ’s Look back at what you are writing just in this blog, it’s not truly about God, Christ, it’s about you. You are critical of others to make yourself seem righteous.

      March 31, 2011 at 4:53 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son
      Baloney. It doesn't "shake" me. It repulses me that you think you're qualified, along with CW and HS, to decide what God thinks and knows and predict what will happen to others who don't see things your way. You think your belief equals fact and that your interpretation of the meaning of the Bible is the only correct one. Your insistence that ONLY the Bible and what your preacher tells you it means are the path to enlightenment and eternity are simply nothing but your opinion and that of others who happen to adhere to your brand of Christianity.

      Everyone else claims exactly the same thing.

      Which would be just fine, but for the self-righteous behavior you and the rest of your ilk exhibit. You sit here and judge, judge, judge others, all the while looking less and less like the Christ you are supposed to emulate.

      It's repulsive behavior. Stop telling others what to do and go do it yourself. Your posts do nothing to convince anyone of the rightness of your cause; all they do is reinforce the stereotype that CW and HS represent to the nth degree. I have no desire to be like any of you or have anyone in my life like you. You are self-aggrandizing hypocrites. All talk, no action.

      All judgment, no compassion
      --------–
      Here is how I will answer you:
      1. Do you realize the Bible are God thoughts? It reveals how he feels about evil, how he feels about those who trust in him. so yes, I know the thoughts he has revealed!
      2. God uses willing human beings for His purposes. Read about anyone who God used, you will find they were regular folk who were willing to be used. He does the same today! Yes regular people who still struggle with sin! That is who He uses. Including me!
      3. Jesus Himself proclaimed to be THE way, THE truth, and THE life (all singular by the way). He also said that NO man comes to the Father (God) but through him. I take that to heart and that is what I believe! You don't. That is your choice!
      4. I have NO brand of Christianity, I have only Christ!
      5. Christ is the judge! How am I judging when I am repeating what He said in His word? You just don't like what is being said!
      6. You stated I look less like the Christ I am supposed to emulate. What do you really know about Christ? Meek and humble like a little lamb? beat down and worn out! if that is how you see Him you have it all wrong! He is the righteous judge! He is the Lion of the tribe of Judah. He is King and He is Lord.
      7. What am I telling others that I am not doing myself? You have no clue! it starts with me BEFORE I can tell you or anybody else! That does not mean I do it perfectly! Give me but one example of what I am telling others but fail to do myself! Just one!
      8. Of course it is repulsive, to the kingdom of darkness!
      9. Your last lines make a whole lot of assumptions and I base that on the fact you know nothing about what is in my heart!
      10. In your quest for tolerance at any cost, you are being played by the very enemy of your soul!
      11. I understand why you you are repulsed and that reason is strictly spiritual! yet you cannot comprehend it.
      12. "All talk and no action", once again, you know this how? You see me at church, at work, on the weekends? Once again a false assumption!

      March 31, 2011 at 10:45 pm |
    • YeahRight

      Steve(HeavenSent ) "I base that on the fact" Fact of what the Bible that is filled with different interpretations, contradictions,not everyone follows especially the OT, and has 41,000 different denominations. You think you know the truth but the reality is you don't. You are basing your criticism of those posting based on what "you" think is right even though others keep proving you are wrong.

      March 31, 2011 at 11:16 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      YeahRight
      Steve(HeavenSent ) "I base that on the fact" Fact of what the Bible that is filled with different interpretations, contradictions,not everyone follows especially the OT, and has 41,000 different denominations. You think you know the truth but the reality is you don't. You are basing your criticism of those posting based on what "you" think is right even though others keep proving you are wrong.
      --------
      Please enlighten me then, what is the truth? You seem so certain that I don't have it so can I assume you do? What is the truth?

      Who has proven me wrong?

      March 31, 2011 at 11:31 pm |
    • Brenbl

      Well said Steve the real one. Its sad that such a majority of people do not love the Creator, would rather walk in darkness. We know from reading the bible that these things would happen. I am so THANKFUL that I know God and God knows me, reagrdles of what people think. Darkness is for worldly people. We can pray for them and just continue to love them, we can try as Christ did but its kinda hard at times...trying to love worldly people that do not understand and are afraid to try to even give God a try. Why not? Steve continue to walk in the light and may God continue to Bless you.

      April 1, 2011 at 4:41 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      To all you non-believers on this post. Steve is his own man. He is not me so stop with your assumptions. Christians don't play games of hiding behind multiple handles. You own that all on your own. Same with your sinful natures you love so much. You own it. Besides, there is NO sin in Heaven. Have you not listened?

      Romans 3:3-4

      3 For what if some did not believe? shall their unbelief make the faith of God without effect?
      4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar; as it is written, That thou mightest be justified in thy sayings, and mightest overcome when thou art judged.

      Amen from the real HeavenSent.

      April 14, 2011 at 7:34 am |
  9. Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

    Are you idiots STILL here? While you've been here flapping your gums, I've managed to write several pages of manuscript.

    All you've done is protest your lack of irritation at being mocked and, really, Steve and CW, you won't win any Oscars for that acting. Your anger comes through loud and clear.

    And Stevie, baby, look up 'self-righteous'. Your picture is in the dictionary, right next to the definition. I'd tell CW the same, but he's illiterate and doesn't know what a dictionary is, other than a big book he uses as a doorstop.

    March 31, 2011 at 4:20 pm |
    • Steve, the real one

      Well Tommy Boy, what the reason for your return? One more time , I am not angry! What's the use in that. The only thing I know of you is a few words every now and then. Should I be angry at that? Not self-righteous at all! Why are you offended? I have asked that several times and have not yet gotten one answer! will you be the first?

      March 31, 2011 at 4:44 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      I'm not offended, you freak. I'm disgusted by your blinders and your unwillingness to see anything other than black and white, zeros and ones.

      March 31, 2011 at 4:52 pm |
    • Steve (the real one)

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son
      I'm not offended, you freak. I'm disgusted by your blinders and your unwillingness to see anything other than black and white, zeros and ones.
      --------
      As much as you may hate to hear this Tom but the Bible is black and white, there is no middle ground! God or Satan, Heaven or Hell, right or wrong, good or evil. That is it! The word will not change because I don't like something. I have to adjust to the word and not the other way around! IF you want life, that is only found in God, you will have to do the same! Yes it is strong but I cannot nor will not apologize for it!

      March 31, 2011 at 10:12 pm |
    • YeahRight

      "he Bible is black and white" LOL! That is why there are over 41,000 denominations of Christians. LOL!

      March 31, 2011 at 11:07 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      1 Corinthians 1:14-21

      14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
      15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.
      16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.
      17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.
      18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
      19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.
      20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?
      21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

      Amen.

      April 14, 2011 at 7:25 am |
  10. Steve, the real one

    Spencer

    Dude you are here to pat yourself on the back, think you are all "religious" but the reality is if we looked at your life – you are a sinner. People like you are a joke, getting all righteous and s-h*t. Yeah, I could post a bunch of "praise Jesus" stuff too, doesn't mean I am actually a good Christian. Jesus might have been offensive to others but it doesn't give your measly soul the right too. Jesus is suppose to be the son of God, not you! I am so sick or reading your pathetic c-r*p! Actually forget that keep posting, that way people will know what not to do
    ------
    I'm not sure If I am the dude you are referring to but I am will respond anyway:

    1. While we all do sin, the Bible refers to all believers as saints!
    2. I have no reason to pat myself on the back, or highfive myself either! I was saved by the same grace that all believers are saved by
    3. I am not religious. Religion equates to human attempts to reach out to God. That is impossible. If God never reached out to man, no one would be saved. Rather than religion, we have RELATIONSHIP with God thru Christ!
    4. Why are you offended? Those right with God have no need to be!
    5. I do hope you keep reading!
    6. You mentioned something about me "getting all righteous". All believers are the righteousness of God through Christ Jesus. The Bible clearly states that. I did not make myself righteous, Christ did and that is nothing to be ashamed of!
    7. Spencer I am not sure what the deal is with you but all I am doing is sharing the Word of God! Why the offense, Spencer?

    March 31, 2011 at 3:58 pm |
    • Karen

      "While we all do sin, the Bible refers to all believers as saints!"

      Hey CW you reading this one? That means gays who believe are saints!

      March 31, 2011 at 5:05 pm |
    • Sum Dude

      Steve, you are a real "something" that's for sure....

      March 31, 2011 at 7:06 pm |
  11. HeavenSent

    CW well said.
    Amen..

    March 31, 2011 at 3:31 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Well, that's a ringing endorsement.

      March 31, 2011 at 4:21 pm |
  12. Steve, the real one

    Doc Vestibule

    @CW and Steve
    I know you think you're doing people a service when pointing out what you consider their sins and warning them of impending damnation, but it does indeed come off as judgemental. Your definition of sin is a personal one, no matter how much you believe it to be factual and based on the infallible Word of God. For example, my definition of sin is that it lies only in harming others unnecessarily. If your goal is to guide others to salvation, the only effective way to do it is to lead by example. Show your neighbours true Christian love by accepting them unconditionally, regardless of their sins. Be humble enough to recognize that your path to righteousness may not be the only one.
    If you start listing others transgressions against your beliefs, you will be met with resistance. If you condemn others, you too shall be condemned.
    -----–
    Doc,

    I asked that question with a purpose. The purpose is this; I am repeating what Jesus himself said. Too harsh? Unacceptable? I can condemn no one. I am just sharing what Jesus said. The Word of God is offensive Doc! The Word called me a sinner, one who would be separated from God in this life and in the next. I was offended too. Yet in my offense I could not change that truth. All i could do was accept it! God's Word does not and will not change because anyone has a problem with it. All of you are valuable souls, yet without Christ and I know the consequences of being in that state! We have been created by God in love and made to love and serve him. That is why I want to see people saved. Not just to avoid hell (although that is a major reason) but to also enjoy a relationship with God Himself while still on earth! That is my purpose! Unfortunately not everyone is going to heed the alarm! Some will still say it is a joke or a delusion! I am not perfect Doc and my imperfections will always show! Yet God somehow uses the imperfect to proclaim what is perfect! Maybe I am trying too hard. All I know is time is almost up! Where will you stand Doc when this life is done? We only get this one life and the decisions we make in this life affects the next! Stop focusing on the style of delivery, that can change. Focus instead on the message, that will never change! I do care! That is why I am here! Would you pay more attention and heed these words if I came off more like a spineless, uncertain punk? Somehow Doc, I think not! The truth of God will stand on it's own! We take time for granted! How much of it do you have, Doc? Decisons we make today, will bear the fruit of tomorrow, whether good fruit or bad. As for your last point, the path I am on is the ONLY TRUE path! Jesus Himself said so! While that may come off as anything but humble, it is the truth!

    March 31, 2011 at 1:59 pm |
    • Peace2All

      @Steve, the real one

      How goes it, -Steve...? It's been awhile, I hope that you are well...?

      Respectfully,

      Peace...

      March 31, 2011 at 2:03 pm |
    • CW

      @ Steve, The real one,

      Man....200% agree.....GREAT POST!!!!

      March 31, 2011 at 2:05 pm |
    • Steve, the real one

      Peace2All
      @Steve, the real one
      How goes it, -Steve...? It's been awhile, I hope that you are well...?
      Respectfully,
      Peace...
      -------
      Hi Peace I am good. I had to get a way for a while. I hope you are well also!

      March 31, 2011 at 2:19 pm |
    • Robert

      Steve the problem with your reasoning is that as we have become more knowledgeable our interpretations of the scriptures HAVE changed. The biggest one is the Old Testament. Christians today realize there are many instances that don’t make sense to abide by the laws in the Old Testament and they have become obsolete. Even though Jesus clearly stated, "think not that I come to destroy the law or the prophets; I come not to destroy, but to fulfill ." Although Christians should obey God, our salvation is received on the basis of faith, not on the basis of our obedience, since the only one who has ever been perfect is Christ, not us.

      March 31, 2011 at 2:30 pm |
    • Steve, the real one

      CW
      @ Steve, The real one,
      Man....200% agree.....GREAT POST!!!!
      ------
      CW,
      God's Word is offensive! I don't take this lightly! Souls are in the balance. Jesus was misunderstood! All those who firmly stand on the truth will be as well! People still see Jesus as always smiling, always a with friendly word, lamb-like Christ. That is partly true! He is the righteous Judge! He is the Lion of Judah! He is coming soon! No more time for patty-cake Christianity! I really care about the folks I encounter here! That is why I am here! As harsh as it may sound judgement is still going to come! Both on believers and non-believers! The difference is believers will be judged for reward. Their place in the Kingdom of God has been secured! Not so with others! That is who I want to reach!

      March 31, 2011 at 2:34 pm |
    • Spencer

      Dude you are here to pat yourself on the back, think you are all "religious" but the reality is if we looked at your life – you are a sinner. People like you are a joke, getting all righteous and s-h*t. Yeah, I could post a bunch of "praise Jesus" stuff too, doesn't mean I am actually a good Christian. Jesus might have been offensive to others but it doesn't give your measly soul the right too. Jesus is suppose to be the son of God, not you! I am so sick or reading your pathetic c-r*p! Actually forget that keep posting, that way people will know what not to do.

      March 31, 2011 at 2:48 pm |
    • Steve, the real one

      Robert

      Steve the problem with your reasoning is that as we have become more knowledgeable our interpretations of the scriptures HAVE changed. The biggest one is the Old Testament. Christians today realize there are many instances that don’t make sense to abide by the laws in the Old Testament and they have become obsolete. Even though Jesus clearly stated, "think not that I come to destroy the law or the prophets; I come not to destroy, but to fulfill ." Although Christians should obey God, our salvation is received on the basis of faith, not on the basis of our obedience, since the only one who has ever been perfect is Christ, not us.
      ----------–
      Robert,
      I agree that we are saved by the grace of God, throught faith. Yet the Bible clearly states that faith without works is dead. At the same time how do we show that we love God but by our obedience? We are clear told to obey! The Bible says Obedience is better than sacrifice! I am not sure what your point is.

      March 31, 2011 at 2:52 pm |
    • Doc Vestibule

      Judgement day has been just around the corner for 2000 years now.
      While I do believe that Christ's character is a fine one to emulate, I and countless others do not believe in a spiritual world.
      One man's magic is another man's engineering. "Supernatural" is a null word.
      This short life is all we have. I do not chose to waste is living in fear of divine reprisal, or being a spiritual sycophant to gain reward.
      I am a naturalist and a materialist.
      Until someone can show me an armor clad locust with the face of a man, the hair of a woman, the teeth of a lion and the tail of a scorpion, I'll not live in fear of your god's judgement day.
      Many Gods have come and gone throughout history and studying mythology is crucially important if one wishes to understand humans and our diverse cultures – but in the end they are all stories. Tales made by humans to explain the unknown.
      But nothing remains unknown forever.

      March 31, 2011 at 2:53 pm |
    • CW

      @ Doc,

      Two things from you post:

      1 you "choose" not to follow and live a life for christ.
      2 Nothing remains unknown forever

      focusing on number 2....have you ever thought about this one? You see one day it will be known....so in es-s-ence do you want to have a "prove it" or "I'll wait and see" a-tt-it-'ude or do you want to have the "faith" and add to it "obedience" and then you won't have to worry about number 2 at all.

      March 31, 2011 at 3:15 pm |
    • Tonya

      CW that was such a great example of informal fallacy.

      Oh and that is defined as an argument whose stated premises fail to support their proposed conclusion. The deviation in an informal fallacy often stems from a flaw in the path of reasoning that links the premises to the conclusion.

      March 31, 2011 at 3:22 pm |
    • civiloutside

      CW, your argument supports accepting at face value quite literally any unverifiable claim anyone would ever choose to make simply on the basis of "well, it could be true..."

      March 31, 2011 at 3:35 pm |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @CW
      By nothing remains unknown forever, I mean that through patient application of the scientific method – observing, hypothesizing, testing, sharing the results and repeating the process over and over – we can and will close the gaps in knowledge previously occupied by mythology.
      It may take many lifetimes of men to find the answer to a particular question, but we will find it (and open up 100 more questions for every one we answer). It may take many more lifetimes for facts to be accepted (as in heliocentrism, young earth creationism, flat earth etc) but facts are sterile, neither vulgar nor sublime, and they cannot be denied.
      Mankind's greatest as.set is his insatiable curiousity. Our advancement as a species does not hinge on passivity – we must always question authority!
      This is science's great advantage over dogmatic reliance on divine authority – it allows, indeed encourages and invites skepticism. It asks us all to find out for ourselves by providing the exact details of the methodology used to arrive at a given answer.
      Faith means never questioning, even in teh face of incontrovertible evidence contrary to a given proposition.
      That, to me, means betraying what it is to be human.

      March 31, 2011 at 3:38 pm |
    • Steve, the real one

      Doc Vestibule

      Judgement day has been just around the corner for 2000 years now.
      I am a naturalist and a materialist.
      Until someone can show me an armor clad locust with the face of a man, the hair of a woman, the teeth of a lion and the tail of a scorpion, I'll not live in fear of your god's judgement day.
      --------
      1. You're right jugement day has been just around the corner for 2000 years. All that means is we are 2000 years closer!
      2. Revelation is full of imagery. Written centuries ago by John. Could that armor clad locust he speaks of be a helicopter armored up for war? I don't know, but what I do know is John used what he knew during his time to describe what he saw but could not adequately describe. That lack takes nothing away from what he saw and what will come!

      March 31, 2011 at 4:07 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      John 5:37-39

      37 And the Father himself, which hath sent me, hath borne witness of me. Ye have neither heard his voice at any time, nor seen his shape.
      38 And ye have not his word abiding in you: for whom he hath sent, him ye believe not.
      39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

      Amen.

      April 14, 2011 at 7:19 am |
  13. Jesús Malverde

    "We all have a God-ordained purpose in our life" Funniest statement I have heard in a long time. That little muslim girl that was beaten and flogged to death served her purpose. God likes to watch and we are on his tv.

    March 31, 2011 at 12:22 pm |
    • CW

      @ Jesus Malverde,

      I don't agree with the beating that the little muslim girl got but, who says it was someone who was a christian that did it? The story I read didn't say anything about the religion of the person who did this sh-'ameful act. Also God does have a purpose for us all we just have to choose to seek him to show us.

      March 31, 2011 at 1:24 pm |
    • Sum Dude

      @CW
      Your callousness and blindness are, to put it mildly, infuriating and disgusting. That girl was murdered and all you can say is "God does have a purpose for us all we just have to choose to seek him to show us."
      ARE YOU SERIOUS?

      So your god showed that little girl what his purpose was, eh? She was ordained to die in a brutal murder?
      See, this is the sort of thing that makes me want to rip out your guts and burn your godddamn church to the ground.

      Your doctrine is seriously non-functional and it has no redeeming value in my eyes when you say such things like the biggest religious retard that ever lived. You cannot resolve her murder with your god having her murder as his purpose or else he is not the god you think he is, GET IT?

      Either your god did this, or your god does not exist. I am going with the latter, for there is absolutely NO proof of any god past or present actually existing.

      If your god exists then he did this thing. Therefore let us put him on trial for the murder of every human being in the world that ever existed. He's guilty of murder. And you want to tell us that he is a god of love and had a purpose for that little girl? That is just sick. Just fucking sick.
      You should be ashamed of yourself for even saying such a thing, but I expect you to sound hurt and bewildered and ask "what did I do?" like a dumb hick.
      I feel sorry for your family...and for you. Your doctrine makes no sense even from your own point of view, dumb-ass!

      March 31, 2011 at 6:47 pm |
  14. PeterVN

    Good post I saw on another site recently, worth quoting:

    "Religion is for the cowardly, the ignorant, the gullible, and the stupid, and for those who would profit from them."

    The profit aspect is even more prevalent in Hollywood.
    I also think that it is indeed cowardice, not guts, to believe that there is a benevolent big old man in the sky looking after you personally, when the preponderance of evidence says that there isn't, and when disasters are killing people indiscriminately worldwide without regard to the goodness or badness of those people.

    March 31, 2011 at 11:56 am |
    • Colin

      In a similar vein, I have a coffee cup that reads, "The first priest was the first fraud to meet the first fool."

      March 31, 2011 at 12:00 pm |
    • NL

      Perhaps all of these recent end-of-the-world movies are trying to profit from the folks who are most into that kind of stuff, rapture-ready Christians?

      March 31, 2011 at 12:34 pm |
    • CW

      @ PeterVN,

      Proverbs 1:7
      7 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge,
      but fo-'ols despise wisdom and instruction.

      I don't think I have to say anything else.

      March 31, 2011 at 12:56 pm |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @NL
      I wonder how those rapture ready Christians feel about the 144,000 Jews who get a free pass come judgement day. Jesus not required for them!

      March 31, 2011 at 3:50 pm |
    • PeterVN

      CW, you won't get anywhere by spewing select buybull quotes at me. How about you get into the nasty, naughty bits of your buybull too, and be honest about what your evil book really says for a change.

      So which poor animal did you bloodily sacrifice to your god idol today, as the Christian buybull clearly demands that you do, with explicit bloody directions?

      It's high time for you to get past your nasty god delusion.

      March 31, 2011 at 4:22 pm |
    • NL

      Doc Vestibule-
      Well, they're supposed to be equally from all the tribes, except Dan who gets no representation, and Joseph who gets double. Oh, and they're supposed to be virgins, young, 'purchased' and wearing white robes as well, so one as.sumes the rapture won't be happening after Labor Day, but with today's loose rules of fashion, who knows, right?

      April 1, 2011 at 12:20 am |
  15. civiloutside

    At least his work is appropriately ti-tled. The man does indeed have faith in a land of make believe.

    March 31, 2011 at 11:41 am |
  16. CW

    @ all the Atheist, I guess a sa-'tanist and non believers,

    You know instead of getting angry at you....I feel sorry for you. The bible talks about how all of you feel and think. Ephesians 4:18-19 was wrote just for you as well.

    18 They are dark-'ened in their understanding and s-'eparated from the life of God because of the ignor-'ance that is in them due to the ha-'rdening of their hearts. 19 Having lost all s-'e-nsitivity, they have given themselves over to s-'e-'ns-'uality so as to indulge in every kind of im-'p-'-urity, and they are full of greed.

    Other than that.....I don't know what to say other than....please don't stand near me on judgement day.

    March 31, 2011 at 8:54 am |
    • Steve, the real one

      I also feel for them. They are laughting it up and mocking the Lord now! That will soon change! The problem CW is everytime they open up this blog, they have been exposed to the Gospel of Christ. As such, they are responsible for it! No more excuses! They cannot claim to have never heard! I am no longer willing to argue with them, I will continue to share but will no longer particpate in their "prove it" game. That is just a distraction! I will pray for them and share but no more arguing! I was also angry and had to step way for about a month! I am all good now and a bit wiser! keep sharing, don't get angry. Learn to move on! even the disciples had to learn to shake the dust off of their sandals and move on! God bless!

      March 31, 2011 at 9:21 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Oh, bushwa, Steve. I don't mock God. I mock idiots like CW, HS, and Freddy, and anyone else who proclaims, "No eternity for you" like the Red Queen in Alice in Wonderland. "Off with their heads! Those ho mo se xuals, Buddhists, Muslims, atheists, agnostics, etc., etc." In other words, anyone who doesn't agree with your brand of religion is doomed.

      That's what I mock. You know-it-alls who can't write a simple sentence to save your lives, yet think your interpretation of the Bible is flawless, while you sit on your rumps doing nothing for those who need help.

      Mockworthy, all of you.

      March 31, 2011 at 9:31 am |
    • Steve, the real one

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son
      That's what I mock. You know-it-alls who can't write a simple sentence to save your lives, yet think your interpretation of the Bible is flawless, while you sit on your rumps doing nothing for those who need help.
      Mockworthy, all of you.
      -----–
      Wrong! You mock God's Word! I'll admit I am not the fine, professional typist that you are. Major props to you for that! i did take typing in the 7th grade though! Guess what?? Proper english and professional typing are NOT requirements for Heaven. if you knew a little bit of te truth of God's word, you would have known that! One last thing, you said" while you sit on your rumps doing nothing for those who need help". Prove it! Prove I do nothing for those in need! I dare you to prove it! Understand something,clearly. What I do , I don't need to advertise it! It is between God, the reciever and me! I never got the memo to include you! Sorry! All you have to do, once again, is prove your accusation! I'll be patiently waiting!

      March 31, 2011 at 9:44 am |
    • SeanNJ

      @Steve: You still sound pretty angry.
      @CW: We feel sorry for you too. I'm comforted that you'll likely never have to know your belief is a delusion.

      March 31, 2011 at 9:57 am |
    • Steve, the real one

      SeanNJ
      @Steve: You still sound pretty angry.
      ------
      Not angry Just more determined Even if I were angry, Jesus himself got angry with evil, as well. I not angry SeanNJ, really not, I just know my mission has changed and i am more determined to not play those same old games that seem to entertain you guys! What I mean by that is no more "prove it", "no you prove it"! I don't have time for that anymore. I will just share the truth! I cannot make anyone accept it! I see you are still refering my faith as delusion. No matter how often you speak it, it is stiil a lie! See I said that with absolutely no anger whatsoever!!

      March 31, 2011 at 10:24 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @CW
      The definition of Christianity is to live your life in the image of Jesus Christ. Faith in miracles, divinity, resurrections, and other fantastical flourishes isn't required to live a life of pacifism, charity, love and humility.
      What most non-believers hope is that religionists will one day be able to live their lives based on their purpoted tenets without wagging a judgemental finger at anyone who doesn't agree with the specifics of their particular dogma.

      March 31, 2011 at 10:37 am |
    • CW

      @ Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son,

      You say:
      Oh, bushwa, Steve. I don't mock God. I mock idiots like CW, HS, and Freddy, and anyone else who proclaims, "No eternity for you" like the Red Queen in Alice in Wonderland. "Off with their heads! Those ho-'mo-'se 'xuals, Buddhists, Muslims, atheists, agnostics, etc., etc." In other words, anyone who doesn't agree with your brand of religion is doomed.

      That's what I mock. You know-it-alls who can't write a simple sentence to save your lives, yet think your interpretation of the Bible is flawless, while you sit on your rumps doing nothing for those who need help.

      I say:
      First off....you can make fun of me all you want it doesn't hurt me OR bother me in the least. I'm not the fine english writer that you are...never have claimed to be. Second....the interpretation I used is the infallible words of the Bible...Its not MY interpretation but eventhough I don't have good writing skills as you say...I do have an understanding of what words mean.....as for the H-'om-'o comment...I don't know what you derive from Romans 1 or 1 Corinthians 6:9 but it couldn't be more clear than that. I'm sure for you it has to be the voice of Almighty God that appears to you and tells you....what he meant when he used man to write his good book. Third I don't have a "brand" of religion...even our Lord h-'ate-'d the "works" religion that the pharissees and sudduccess practiced during his time on earth.

      @ SeanNJ,

      I have to ask...how do you know my belief in God is a delusion? I'll leave you with this scripture Proverbs 3:5-6. I challenge you to look at this passage because it is a warning to all of us.

      @ Steve, the real one,

      Your right it is easy to get angry and say something out of anger.....I have to step away at times too b/c a lot of these people are so blinded with a ha-'rd heart that I know its not going to be me that gets through to them. Folks like Reality keep reposting 1 of about 11 rants....he or she doesn't realize that it won't change a fire and brimstone christian.

      March 31, 2011 at 10:44 am |
    • Ron

      Doc Vestibule
      This is exactly what most of the various Pagan religions think. We hear all the time about how great this is, that is, ad nausum but conservative Christians are great at talking and especially best in judging others. They spend so much time selling their religion and constantly judging. I think more people would be at ease with them if they simply followed what they preach rather than their continuous self-righteous judging. Imo, justification will be conservative Christianities undoing in this world because people are simply sick and tired of the non-ending rants and judgments.

      March 31, 2011 at 11:10 am |
    • The Bobinator

      > I have to ask...how do you know my belief in God is a delusion?

      It's actaully quite simple. Is it demonstratable? If not, it rests in the exact same level of evidecne as someone believing they're napoleon or the fact that underpants gnomes come and steal underpants.

      Thinking is fun!

      March 31, 2011 at 11:11 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @Bobinator
      You're not a Gnomist? Then how do you explain the widespread, global disappearance of undergarments throughout history?
      If you have faith, their grandeur of their business model will fill the spiritual void in your heathen life.
      Phase 1: Collect Underpants
      Phase 2: ?
      Phase 3: Profit

      March 31, 2011 at 11:20 am |
    • The Bobinator

      > Wrong! You mock God's Word!

      I wouldn't do that if you were Tom. Remember, God is kind, loving and forgiving. Unless of course you insult God or don't worship him. Then God will burn you and torture you forever. Cause he's good and loving like that.

      And heaven help you if you mock CW or Steve. Remember Elijah and how God sent two bears to rend apart 42 children for calling him "bald".

      It's sad when Atheists don't see what a kind and loving being God is when they read the bible.

      March 31, 2011 at 11:29 am |
    • The Bobinator

      > You're not a Gnomist? Then how do you explain the widespread, global disappearance of undergarments throughout history?

      I can't explain it. I suppose that because I don't know the answer, the next logical step of course is for me to accept your statement as fact, because if you know for sures and I don't, you must be right.

      At least, that's what the theists would have us believe.

      March 31, 2011 at 11:32 am |
    • The Bobinator

      > Folks like Reality keep reposting 1 of about 11 rants....he or she doesn't realize that it won't change a fire and brimstone christian.

      Evidence will change the mind of an atheist.

      No amount of evidence will change the mind of a diehard Christian.

      Who's being open minded, rational and not stubborn?

      March 31, 2011 at 11:33 am |
    • Steve, the real one

      The Bobinator
      > Wrong! You mock God's Word!
      I wouldn't do that if you were Tom. Remember, God is kind, loving and forgiving. Unless of course you insult God or don't worship him. Then God will burn you and torture you forever. Cause he's good and loving like that.
      And heaven help you if you mock CW or Steve. Remember Elijah and how God sent two bears to rend apart 42 children for calling him "bald".
      -------
      Tell me Bobinator, where did I state that I even care If I am mocked? Couldn't car eless! Help yourself! As smart as you are, you keep adding to my posts! Now why is that? And as for your choice of scripture I wonder why you atheists sprint to the Old Testament? Ever hear of the New Testament. Let me hear you quote a little of that once in a while. Start in John, humor me Bobinator! Just this once! try the NT, quote about the blood that was shed, quote about the cross. Quote me where Jesus said he is the Way, the Truth , and the Life and how no man comes to the Father but through Him. Try that for a change. Unless you are not quite up to it! Let me know!

      March 31, 2011 at 12:18 pm |
    • Steve, the real one

      Hi Doc Vestibule
      The definition of Christianity is to live your life in the image of Jesus Christ. Faith in miracles, divinity, resurrections, and other fantastical flourishes isn't required to live a life of pacifism, charity, love and humility.
      What most non-believers hope is that religionists will one day be able to live their lives based on their purpoted tenets without wagging a judgemental finger at anyone who doesn't agree with the specifics of their particular dogma.
      -----
      I have a question for you. If I state a particular lifesytle is sin am I wagging a judgmental finger?

      March 31, 2011 at 12:22 pm |
    • Reality

      Another "rant" that needs to be "thum-ped" to counter the 2000 years of Christian myths:

      Jesus was a bit "touched". After all he thought he spoke to Satan, thought he changed water into wine, thought he raised Lazarus from the dead etc. In today's world, said Jesus would be declared legally insane.

      Or did P, M, M, L and J simply make him into a first century magic-man via their epistles and gospels of semi-fiction? Most contemporary NT experts after thorough analyses of all the scriptures go with the latter magic-man conclusion with J's gospels being mostly fiction.

      Obviously, today's followers of Paul et al's "magic-man" are also a bit on the odd side believing in all the Christian mumbo jumbo about bodies resurrecting, and exorcisms, and miracles, and "magic-man atonement, and infallible, old, European, white men, and 24/7 body/blood sacrifices followed by consumption of said sacrifices. Yummy!!!!

      March 31, 2011 at 12:30 pm |
    • NL

      CW and Steve-
      If you really do care about the fate of us non-believers then your delivery of 'God's message' needs a lot of work. What you're doing now is like someone wanting smokers to quit, but all they do is yell at them that they can't wait to see them die slowly from cancer. Only someone who doesn't really want people to quit, but who loves to see people suffer would say such a thing, right? You may not intend to, but that's how you guys come off. Just saying!

      March 31, 2011 at 12:52 pm |
    • CW

      @ Steve the real one,

      I have a question for you. If I state a particular lifesytle is sin am I wagging a judgmental finger?
      ---

      I have the same question for Doc. Loved the post...God Bless

      @ Reality,

      Wow!!!! Like I said....I feel sorry for you. Now your little post is reason to believe that insanity is alive and well with you.

      March 31, 2011 at 12:54 pm |
    • CW

      @ NL,

      Okay.....NL. Maybe your right....we are all sinners even myself. I can tell you that not a day goes by that I don't get on my knees and ask for forgiveness. Do you forgive me if I sound a little harsh? I hope so. Yes I do care for all non-believers, atheist,...all people for that matter. What you have to realize is this...we as christians are never and should never be expected to be perfect. We do get mad at folks..making fun...belittling God so its hard not to let that anger be seen in a post. I will try to do my best to work on this...you have my word.

      As for the message....yes there is always room for improvement...no doubt about it. What would it take for you to change your life?

      March 31, 2011 at 1:03 pm |
    • SeanNJ

      @CW: I'll stick with Austin 3:16 which says, "I just whooped your a.s.s, and that's the bottom line because Stone Cold says so."

      March 31, 2011 at 1:08 pm |
    • CW

      @ SeanNJ,

      Okay Sean....I admit...I did chuckle at your post. Your missing the point.....I hope you read Proverbs....there are 31 in all. They by themselfs have a lot of wisdom in how to live. You could read one a day....never know....might change your mind and your thinking.

      March 31, 2011 at 1:13 pm |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @CW and Steve
      I know you think you're doing people a service when pointing out what you consider their sins and warning them of impending damnation, but it does indeed come off as judgemental.
      Your definition of sin is a personal one, no matter how much you believe it to be factual and based on the infallible Word of God. For example, my definition of sin is that it lies only in harming others unnecessarily. If your goal is to guide others to salvation, the only effective way to do it is to lead by example. Show your neighbours true Christian love by accepting them unconditionally, regardless of their sins. Be humble enough to recognize that your path to righteousness may not be the only one.
      If you start listing others transgressions against your beliefs, you will be met with resistance. If you condemn others, you too shall be condemned.

      March 31, 2011 at 1:19 pm |
    • CW

      @ Doc,

      I do accept everyone regardless of what or who or how they were in the past. You see your definition of sin is a good one but let me ask

      1. Is it right for someone to steal from someone who is rich beyond belief and would never miss the mone....if the person who stole the money gave to the poor?

      You see if your definition of sin holds then you would keep accepting this person eventhough in the Bible it is wrong. I have the same concept of sin. You don't keep sinning and people just "accept" it. You see when you accept Christ in your heart you turn from all wrong doing....not just keep on doing it b/c "it hurts on one"....because in reality all sin hurts someone...that person could be yourself.

      March 31, 2011 at 1:32 pm |
    • Steve, the real one

      NL

      CW and Steve-
      If you really do care about the fate of us non-believers then your delivery of 'God's message' needs a lot of work. What you're doing now is like someone wanting smokers to quit, but all they do is yell at them that they can't wait to see them die slowly from cancer. Only someone who doesn't really want people to quit, but who loves to see people suffer would say such a thing, right? You may not intend to, but that's how you guys come off. Just saying!
      -----
      I really appreciate that an I am not above listening and learning. I really care and that is why I am on this blog. That is why I share. What do you recommend? In all seriousness, what is your recommendation?

      March 31, 2011 at 1:34 pm |
    • Sonja

      Sin is lack of respect for God; it is a lack of love or respect for other people, even those we don't like. Where God is present, there can be no sin.

      March 31, 2011 at 1:43 pm |
    • NL

      CW-
      It's not my forgiveness that should matter to you, it's that of other Christians, the ones who disagree with your judgmental att.itude and who end up suffering by your poor example, that you owe an apology to.

      Allowing anger to get the better of you is a temptation that pulls on us all. Every misrepresentation of evolution, or claim that Hitler was an atheist, for example, when the evidence against these things is so easily available can only be an attempt to anger people. All I can say is that patience is a virtue, not rage. Rage usually betrays an idea that is too weak to stand by itself, right?

      "Anger is a killing thing: it kills the man who angers, for each rage leaves him less than he had been before – it takes something from him." Louis L'Amour

      "What would it take for you to change your life?"
      I changed my life for the better a long time ago. I still make mistakes that I regret making, but I find that I'm more willing to try making amends for them than I use to.

      March 31, 2011 at 2:33 pm |
    • SeanNJ

      @CW: Being a reformed Catholic, I have read the bible. I attended parochial grade school, where we attended mass EVERY MORNING before school. I was an altar boy, of the non-molested variety, and spent more time in a church than I'd care to remember. I also went to a Catholic high school.

      My point is that if I wasn't able to find the truth in that book during the first 17 years of my life, I'm certainly not going to find it now. To encourage me to read it seems...well...silly. Before anyone suggests that Catholicism was the problem, I will tell you that I came to the conclusion that the idea of god was ridiculous regardless of the dogma that was laid on top of it.

      March 31, 2011 at 2:54 pm |
    • NL

      Steve, the real one-
      My recommendation, if you truly wish to quit this behavior, is that you recognize the urge to judge and reference hellfire as a selfish one, as a 'temptation' if you prefer. Keep a post it note of Matthew 7:1-5 on your monitor and give the "My Take: Why Christians are jerks online' article another read.

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2010/06/29/my-take-why-christians-are-jerks-online/

      Hope that helps for a start.

      Take care!

      March 31, 2011 at 2:58 pm |
    • NL

      Sonja-
      "Sin is lack of respect for God;"
      But what if you don't believe God to be anything more than just an idea, an idea that takes almost as many forms as there are people who hold to it? Some of the forms are fairly benign, but others are downright monstrous. How are you supposed to respect something that not everyone can agree upon?

      "it is a lack of love or respect for other people, even those we don't like."
      This works both ways. Claiming to represent a god doesn't make your side immune to having to treat others as equals, even people you consider sinners.

      "Where God is present, there can be no sin."
      Perhaps the scariest idea of all in which actions that are said to be sanctioned by God get an automatic pass, even if they would be considered evil if committed by someone not imagined to be under God's banner.

      April 1, 2011 at 12:39 am |
    • Syriac

      Actually, I feel sad for atheists because they simply have nothing to live for.

      April 2, 2011 at 10:18 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Oh, boo hoo Tommie Tom. You do mock God and all of us that follow His truth. You can't stand me because I told you that you are in love with your sinful nature and don't want to give it up. God is not mocked. If you can't comprehend this then wait and see after the day of the Lord. You still want to mock Him. He'll grant you your wishes/desires. No eternity for you. Blotted out. There will be no tears for the likes of you in paradise with our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ.

      You do it to yourself for believing in your own ego.

      Amen.

      April 14, 2011 at 7:03 am |
    • HeavenSent

      True believers Judge (discern) Matthew 7:1-2

      "Do not judge according to appearance, but judge with righteous judgment." John 7:24 (Ephesians 5:11, 1 Corinthian 5:12)

      "But he who is spiritual judges ALL things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one." 1 Corinthians 2:15; 6:2-3;10:15; 14:29, Romans 16:17

      Amen.

      Those who argue and refuse to listen in this last generation in end of days Jude 4.

      Amen.

      April 14, 2011 at 7:14 am |
  17. Reality

    The movie they should make:

    The Great Resurrection Con Game:

    The Story Line-

    From that famous passage: In 1 Corinthians 15 St. Paul reasoned, "If Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith."

    Even now Catholic/Christian professors of theology are questioning the bodily resurrection of the simple, preacher man aka Jesus.

    To wit;

    From a major Catholic university's theology professor's grad school white-board notes:

    "Heaven is a Spirit state or spiritual reality of union with God in love, without earthly – earth bound distractions.
    Jesus and Mary's bodies are therefore not in Heaven.

    Most believe that it to mean that the personal spiritual self that survives death is in continuity with the self we were while living on earth as an embodied person.

    Again, the physical Resurrection (meaning a resuscitated corpse returning to life), Ascension (of Jesus' crucified corpse), and Assumption (Mary's corpse) into heaven did not take place.

    The Ascension symbolizes the end of Jesus' earthly ministry and the beginning of the Church.

    Only Luke's Gospel records it. The Assumption ties Jesus' mission to Pentecost and missionary activity of Jesus' followers The Assumption has multiple layers of symbolism, some are related to Mary's special role as "Christ bearer" (theotokos). It does not seem fitting that Mary, the body of Jesus' Virgin-Mother (another biblically based symbol found in Luke 1) would be derived by worms upon her death. Mary's assumption also shows God's positive regard, not only for Christ's male body, but also for female bodies." "

    "In three controversial Wednesday Audiences, Pope John Paul II pointed out that the essential characteristic of heaven, hell or purgatory is that they are states of being of a spirit (angel/demon) or human soul, rather than places, as commonly perceived and represented in human language. This language of place is, according to the Pope, inadequate to describe the realities involved, since it is tied to the temporal order in which this world and we exist. In this he is applying the philosophical categories used by the Church in her theology and saying what St. Thomas Aquinas said long before him."
    http://eternal-word.com/library/PAPALDOC/JP2HEAVN.HTM

    The Vatican quickly embellished this story with a lot CYAP.

    Of course, we all know that angels are really mythical "pretty wingie talking thingies".

    With respect to rising from the dead, we also have this account:

    o An added note: As per R.B. Stewart in his introduction to the recent book, The Resurrection of Jesus, Crossan and Wright in Dialogue,
    o p.4
    o "Reimarus (1774-1778) posits that Jesus became sidetracked by embracing a political position, sought to force God's hand and that he died alone deserted by his disciples. What began as a call for repentance ended up as a misguided attempt to usher in the earthly political kingdom of God. After Jesus' failure and death, his disciples stole his body and declared his resurrection in order to maintain their financial security and ensure themselves some standing."
    o
    p.168. by Ted Peters:
    1. "Even so, asking historical questions is our responsibility. Did Jesus really rise from the tomb? Is it necessary to have been raised from the tomb and to appear to his disciples in order to explain the rise of early church and the transcription of the bible? Crossan answers no, Wright answers, yes. "

    o So where are the bones? As per Professor Crossan's analyses in his many books, the body of Jesus would have ended up in the mass graves of the crucified, eaten by wild dogs, with lime in a shallow grave, or under a pile of stones.

    March 31, 2011 at 8:11 am |
    • Steve, the real one

      Just because you keep spouting this junk over and over again doesn't make it anymore true! In fact, all you are doing is simply parroting lies! Instead of "From a major Catholic university's theology professor's grad school white-board notes.." How about a name of prof AND school? It matters not that only Luke recorded the ascention! Four gospels for four view ponts! Dr. Luke wrote this from his point of view! No issue there!

      March 31, 2011 at 9:12 am |
    • The Bobinator

      > Just because you keep spouting this junk over and over again doesn't make it anymore true!

      You mean like how you keep spouting that the bible is the word of God?

      March 31, 2011 at 11:08 am |
    • Steve, the real one

      The Bobinator

      > Just because you keep spouting this junk over and over again doesn't make it anymore true!
      You mean like how you keep spouting that the bible is the word of God?
      ---–
      Not quite. Problem is those that deny are lying! THAT would be the difference!

      March 31, 2011 at 12:03 pm |
    • The Bobinator

      > Not quite. Problem is those that deny are lying! THAT would be the difference!

      According to your irrational belief in a glorified book of fairy tales. How do I know it's irrational? Because there's not proof for it.

      You believe in it because you want to believe in it. Not because it makes sense.

      March 31, 2011 at 12:20 pm |
    • Reality

      Steve, the Real One (we hope),

      In case you want to take a graduate level theology class which covers the Great Resurrection Con Game, the classes at Catholic U or Notre Dame would be good choices.

      March 31, 2011 at 12:23 pm |
    • Steve, the real one

      Reality

      Steve, the Real One (we hope),
      In case you want to take a graduate level theology class which covers the Great Resurrection Con Game, the classes at Catholic U or Notre Dame would be good choices.
      -----–
      You call that garbage theology? Reality, I thought you were better than this. You have lost a step!

      March 31, 2011 at 12:26 pm |
    • Steve, the real one

      The Bobinator
      > Not quite. Problem is those that deny are lying! THAT would be the difference!
      According to your irrational belief in a glorified book of fairy tales. How do I know it's irrational? Because there's not proof for it. You believe in it because you want to believe in it. Not because it makes sense
      --------
      You said something profound here and you don't even know it. "Not that it makes sense". Let me elaborate. When you (Bobinator) read the Bible or quote (out of context) scripture or even attempt to comprehend Christainity, your are correct it makes no sense. Why? You are leaning on your own knowledge, experience, and biases. I have been there, done that , heck, I may even have a tee-shirt somewhere. What changed you may ask? When I asked The Holy Spirit to make the Word come alive is when it made sense. I am not saying I understand it all but I am saying you are attempting to understand the spiritual with a dead spirit! Don't work like that. That is the reason you keep running to the OT and pulling out what you do. That is the sole reason you and those like you have NO clue about my faith. Just though I'd let you know! Until then you will NEVER understand! So when you challenge my faith you do so out of ignorance (lack of knowledge) because your spirit has not been awaken! That is something only Jesus can do. That is why it makes no sense!

      March 31, 2011 at 12:41 pm |
    • civiloutside

      Steve, is there any real, practical difference between what you just said and the following:

      "I know it's nonsense. I chose to believe it anyway because it made me feel better. I don't actually understand it any better now, but that doesn't matter anymore because I've abandoned the idea that making sense has more value than making me feel better."

      After all, one cannot meaningfully "ask the Holy Spirit" to enter you unless you've already accepted the proposition that the holy spirit exists.

      March 31, 2011 at 1:36 pm |
    • Steve, the real one

      civiloutside
      Steve, is there any real, practical difference between what you just said and the following:
      "I know it's nonsense. I chose to believe it anyway because it made me feel better. I don't actually understand it any better now, but that doesn't matter anymore because I've abandoned the idea that making sense has more value than making me feel better."
      After all, one cannot meaningfully "ask the Holy Spirit" to enter you unless you've already accepted the proposition that the holy spirit exists.
      -----
      If one has decided to reject God, that does not the Word of God. What it changes is the rejector, and not for the better. That person's spirit is dead and cannot recieve spiritual truth. That person will continue to see God and His Word as a joke! To answer you, What I said and what you state is as different as night and day!

      March 31, 2011 at 2:12 pm |
    • civiloutside

      I would posit that the only difference is one of labels and atti-tudes. You label something that makes no sense and has no evidence, but choose to believe anyway, as "spiritual truth," and adhere to the atti-tude that it's a good thing. I label it "delusion," and have the atti-tude that it's a bad thing.

      Night and day can be observed regardless of the atti-tude of the observer. The same cannot be said of "spiritual truth."

      March 31, 2011 at 3:23 pm |
    • Reality

      Suggested books and articles to peruse for those who want to escape the bible trap:

      o 1. Historical Jesus Theories, earlychristianwritings.com/theories.htm – the names of many of the contemporary historical Jesus scholars and the ti-tles of their over 100 books on the subject.

      2. Early Christian Writings, earlychristianwritings.com/
      – a list of early Christian doc-uments to include the year of publication–

      3. Historical Jesus Studies, faithfutures.org/HJstudies.html,
      – "an extensive and constantly expanding literature on historical research into the person and cultural context of Jesus of Nazareth"

      4. Jesus Database, faithfutures.org/JDB/intro.html–"The JESUS DATABASE is an online annotated inventory of the traditions concerning the life and teachings of Jesus that have survived from the first three centuries of the Common Era. It includes both canonical and extra-canonical materials, and is not limited to the traditions found within the Christian New Testament."

      5. Josephus on Jesus mtio.com/articles/bissar24.htm

      6. The Jesus Seminar, mystae.com/restricted/reflections/messiah/seminar.html#Criteria

      7. Writing the New Testament- mystae.com/restricted/reflections/messiah/testament.html

      8. Health and Healing in the Land of Israel By Joe Zias
      joezias.com/HealthHealingLandIsrael.htm

      9. Economics in First Century Palestine, K.C. Hanson and D. E. Oakman, Palestine in the Time of Jesus, Fortress Press, 1998.

      10. The Gnostic Jesus(Part One in a Two-Part Series on Ancient and Modern Gnosticism)
      by Douglas Groothuis: equip.org/free/DG040-1.htm

      11. The interpretation of the Bible in the Church, Pontifical Biblical Commission
      Presented on March 18, 1994
      ewtn.com/library/CURIA/PBCINTER.HTM#2

      12. The Jesus Database- newer site:
      wiki.faithfutures.org/index.php?t-itle=Jesus_Database

      13. Jesus Database with the example of Supper and Eucharist:
      faithfutures.org/JDB/jdb016.html

      14. Josephus on Jesus by Paul Maier:
      mtio.com/articles/bissar24.htm

      15. The Journal of Higher Criticism with links to articles on the Historical Jesus:
      mtio.com/articles/bissar24.htm

      16. The Greek New Testament: laparola.net/greco/

      17. Diseases in the Bible:
      etd.unisa.ac.za/ETD-db/theses/available/etd-08022006-125807/unrestricted/02dissertation.pdf

      18. Religion on Line (6000 articles on the history of religion, churches, theologies,
      theologians, ethics, etc.
      religion-online.org/

      19. The Jesus Seminarians and their search for NT authenticity:
      mystae.com/restricted/reflections/messiah/seminar.html#Criteria

      20. The New Testament Gateway – Internet NT ntgateway.com/

      21. Writing the New Testament- existing copies, oral tradition etc.
      ntgateway.com/

      22. The Search for the Historic Jesus by the Jesus Seminarians:
      members.aol.com/DrSwiney/seminar.html

      23. Jesus Decoded by Msgr. Francis J. Maniscalco (Da Vinci Code review)jesusdecoded.com/introduction.php

      24. JD Crossan's scriptural references for his book the Historical Jesus separated into time periods: faithfutures.org/Jesus/Crossan1.rtf

      25. JD Crossan's conclusions about the authencity of most of the NT based on the above plus the conclusions of other NT exegetes in the last 200 years:
      faithfutures.org/Jesus/Crossan2.rtf

      26. Common Sayings from Thomas's Gospel and the Q Gospel: faithfutures.org/Jesus/Crossan3.rtf

      27. Early Jewish Writings- Josephus and his books by t-itle with the complete translated work in English :earlyjewishwritings.com/josephus.html

      28. Luke and Josephus- was there a connection?
      infidels.org/library/modern/richard_carrier/lukeandjosephus.html

      29. NT and beyond time line:
      pbs.org/empires/peterandpaul/history/timeline/

      30. St. Paul's Time line with discussion of important events:
      harvardhouse.com/prophetictech/new/pauls_life.htm

      31. See http://www.amazon.com for a list of JD Crossan's books and those of the other Jesus Seminarians: Reviews of said books are included and selected pages can now be viewed on Amazon. Some books can be found on-line at Google Books.

      32. Father Edward Schillebeeckx's words of wisdom as found in his books.

      33. The books of the following : Professors Marcus Borg, Paula Fredriksen, Elaine Pagels, Karen Armstrong and Bishop NT Wright.

      34. Father Raymond Brown's An Introduction to the New Testament, Doubleday, NY, 1977, 878 pages, with Nihil obstat and Imprimatur.

      35. Luke Timothy Johnson's book The Real Jesus.

      March 31, 2011 at 3:26 pm |
    • Steve, the real one

      civiloutside
      I would posit that the only difference is one of labels and atti-tudes. You label something that makes no sense and has no evidence, but choose to believe anyway, as "spiritual truth," and adhere to the atti-tude that it's a good thing. I label it "delusion," and have the atti-tude that it's a bad thing.
      Night and day can be observed regardless of the atti-tude of the observer. The same cannot be said of "spiritual truth."
      -------–
      The effects of spiritual darkness can also be observed. The only issue is you have to be in the light to know what the darkness is. You can use the natural darkness to understand what I'm saying! Most toe stubs happen in the dark, because you can't see. The same applies to spiritual darkness except a toe stub is the least of your problems!

      Once again, faith makes no sense to you because you cannot recieve it! You are in spiritual darkness!

      March 31, 2011 at 4:33 pm |
    • PraiseTheLard

      Actually, he lives in the real world... not in fantasy-land...

      March 31, 2011 at 4:41 pm |
    • civiloutside

      That's an interesting metaphor you have there, Steve. Let's pursue it a little.

      So I'm walking around with you ina darkened room. You turn to me and say "you've stubbed your toe." I say "really? I didn't feel any pain, I didn't trip, and nothing seems to be preventing me from walking forward. In fact, my toe feels just fine, and moves around when o flex it just like always. I think you're mistaken." to which your reply is "nope, your toe is broken. You just have to accept it."

      March 31, 2011 at 5:03 pm |
    • Sum Dude

      @civiloutside – LOL a good one!

      March 31, 2011 at 6:25 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      1 Corinthians 1:14-21

      Psalms 40:7

      Amen.

      April 14, 2011 at 6:55 am |
  18. The Bobinator

    Yeah, it takes real guts to be a Christian in southern america. ROFL.

    March 31, 2011 at 7:41 am |
    • Tallulah13

      I got a laugh out of that one, too.

      March 31, 2011 at 10:47 am |
    • PeterVN

      Related post I saw on another site recently, worth quoting:

      "Religion is for the cowardly, the ignorant, the gullible, and the stupid, and for those who would profit from them."

      The profit aspect is even more prevalent in Hollywood.
      I also think that it is indeed cowardice, not guts, to believe that there is a benevolent big old man in the sky looking after you personally, when the preponderance of evidence says that there isn't.

      March 31, 2011 at 11:52 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @PeterVN
      "History does not record anywhere at any time a religion that has any rational basis. Religion is a crutch for people not strong enough to stand up to the unknown without help. But, like dandruff, most people do have a religion and spend time and money on it and seem to derive considerable pleasure from fiddling with it."
      – Robert Heinlein

      March 31, 2011 at 11:59 am |
    • abcdef

      Look at this way go around a huge city where you'll see about 500 people and imagine every person that one supreme being looking into all their lives every second of everyday like a 24 hour soap opera reality show then multiply that by 14,000,000 people. If you still think there is a higher power that watches over instant of yours and everyone else's lives your sadly mistaken.

      March 31, 2011 at 12:43 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Romans 9:13-23

      Amen.

      April 14, 2011 at 6:52 am |
  19. Dante

    http://www.joyofsatan.com

    Hail Satan

    March 31, 2011 at 6:14 am |
    • Steve, the real one

      Shouldn't that be HELL instead of Hail? I guess you didn't get the memo. At the end, your "leader" loses! What does that make you?

      March 31, 2011 at 9:03 am |
    • The Bobinator

      Consider the source.

      March 31, 2011 at 11:07 am |
    • Steve, the real one

      The Bobinator
      Consider the source
      ----
      I did and the results of that consideration is, without Christ, I would be in the same boat as the satanist! That same Jesus is knocking on the door of your heart just like he did mine. I answered! Your turn, if you want life!

      March 31, 2011 at 12:08 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Steve, being in end of days, I do believe Jude 4 is coming into play on this blog with this end days generation.

      Amen.

      April 14, 2011 at 6:47 am |
  20. Oobie

    Next they'll be making a movie about a guy who makes a movie about a guy who makes a movie, etc.

    March 31, 2011 at 1:44 am |
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About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.