April 5th, 2011
01:00 AM ET

Eyeing a national museum, a collector’s Bibles hits the road

By Gabe LaMonica, CNN

Washington (CNN) - Steve Green owns a lot of Bibles, and he’s starting to show them off.

The president of Hobby Lobby, a national chain of craft stores, Green bought his first biblical artifact less than a year and a half ago. But his is already considered one of the world’s largest private collection of biblical texts and artifacts, and Green is taking it on tour in advance of opening what he says will be a national Bible museum.

The tour kicked off last week with a party at the Vatican embassy in Washington that highlighting samples from a 14,000 square foot traveling exhibition, which is called “Passages.” It’s a prelude to the high-tech Bible museum Green wants to open in the next five or so years.

“The Bible has had a huge impact on societies - politics, the arts, science, music, literature,” says Green, who is Christian. “The impact of the book is a story that we feel needs to be told and that is what we are interested in doing - and encouraging people to consider what it has to say.”

“We believe it is the most incredible book that’s ever been written,” he says. “It is a book that has been ridiculed and vilified and yet loved.”

Passages will appear at the Oklahoma City Museum of Art from May to October before moving to St. Peter’s Square in Rome. The exhibit will arrive in New York City sometime this winter.

Green says he’s unsure of the location for his eventual museum but that he wants it to rely heavily on digitized Bibles, so that visitors and scholars can interact with them.

Some items from the Green Collection are now on exhibition at museums and specialty libraries in the United States and Europe.

The collection’s 30,000 biblical antiquities emphasize Jewish, Catholic and Protestant contributions to the book.

“The Bible didn’t come from Mount Sinai to Moses and end up in a Red Roof Inn desk drawer,” says Scott Carol, director of the collection.

“There was a process and Passages tells the dramatic story of that process,” says Carol, a former college professor specializing in biblical manuscripts.

From cuneiform tablets dating back thousands of years to parts of the Dead Sea scrolls to brilliantly illuminated psalmodies (collections of psalms), Green’s collection encompasses Bibles and books that helped influence the Bible’s formation.

The collection includes one of the largest repositories of cuneiform tablets. The clay tablets, named for the wedge-shaped script in which they were written, are important tools for translating ancient biblical writings.

The collection also includes a large portion of a Gutenberg Bible, which provoked the 15th century revolution in printing, and a King James Bible, an influential English translation that’s marking its 400th anniversary this year.

Then there’s the so-called Wicked Bible from the 17th century, so named because it accidentally omits the word “not” in the commandment “Thou shall not commit adultery.”

The collection’s gem is the Codex Climaci Rescriptus, one of the world’s earliest surviving Bibles, thought to be from sometime between the 6th and 8th centuries.

Written in Palestinian Aramaic, the language used in Jesus’ home, the collection worked with Britain’s University of Oxford to develop a technology that uncovered the earliest known New Testament, also from between the 6th and 8th centuries, from a layer in codex.

- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: Bible • Christianity • DC • United States

soundoff (382 Responses)
  1. Ryan

    HeavenSent – The response was ment to be sarcasm directed toward SanOnofreSurfer.

    April 5, 2011 at 3:46 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Ryan, that was the phony heavensent that posted. I was on posting earlier, but as soon as he came on, I was bumped out of this article.


      April 5, 2011 at 4:09 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Ryan, the phony HeavenSent just posted right before me. I am so tired of this person or person(s).

      April 5, 2011 at 4:12 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      The phony HeavenSent said: "Ryan, the phony HeavenSent just posted right before me. I am so tired of this person or person(s)."

      April 5, 2011 at 4:50 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      The phony heavensent said: "The phony HeavenSent said: "Ryan, the phony HeavenSent just posted right before me. I am so tired of this person or person(s).""

      April 6, 2011 at 10:06 am |
  2. Dmoney

    i have a bridge for sale, anyone interested?

    April 5, 2011 at 3:42 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Only if the bridge is in...


      April 5, 2011 at 3:46 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Phony Heavensent posted "HeavenSent

      Only if the bridge is in...


      April 5, 2011 at 4:06 pm |
  3. San Onofre Surfer

    Hi all,
    I was up on the top of a hill in Del Mar, in Northern San Diego, yesterday, and I heard a voice say to me that the property I wanted in Rancho Santa Fe, (the most expensive suburb in the country), was given to me as my promised land. That counts as a real estate contract, right ? I seem to remember sort of the same thing happening about 1500 BC, in the Late Bronze Age Near East, and people still count it as legitimate. Mine should be good to go too don't ya think?

    April 5, 2011 at 3:27 pm |
    • PraiseTheLard

      Possibly in another 3500 years... give or take... Call me then, let me know how you're doing with the project...

      April 5, 2011 at 3:30 pm |
    • HeavenSent


      April 5, 2011 at 3:32 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      San Onofre I question whether you are even a legitimate child.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:32 pm |
    • Ryan

      If you can kill the entire armed population there with a donkey's jawbone while they're attacking you, as Samson did, then I'd say you deserve Rancho Santa Fe.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:34 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Ryan I believe that to be true, do you?

      April 5, 2011 at 3:36 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Now this is odd, the phony heavensent posted twice in the same time frame as follows:


      April 5, 2011 at 3:32 pm | Thank you for your feedback. We will look into it. |

      San Onofre I question whether you are even a legitimate child.
      April 5, 2011 at 3:32 pm |"

      April 5, 2011 at 4:04 pm |
    • San Onofre Surfer

      Hey Heaven,
      21 year olds are not children.
      Is there a way to know which one of the multiple personalities is speaking ? I've totally lost track. I think you are one, conflicted person, manifesting in multiple manifestations. Here's to integration. Urah.

      April 5, 2011 at 6:16 pm |
  4. Veritas

    Satan doesn't exsist either....

    April 5, 2011 at 3:20 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Ver it as, you will find out when you die and he is burning you forever. I will be smiling from Heaven and the Angels will sing. Until then I mean this with all due respect and ask you to go pe e up a rope.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:30 pm |
    • Colin

      Heavensent's latest ranting does bring up another, even sillier, aspect of Christian superst-itions. Non-believers will burn for eternity in hell.

      Think this through. You don’t have to kill, you don’t have to rob, hell, you don’t even have to litter. All you have to do is be obdurate in rejecting the Christian god and he will inflict a punishment upon you an infinite times worse than the death penalty….and he loves you.

      Dark Ages nonsense.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:46 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Veritas, satan is real. His name is Lucifer and he deceives the entire world.

      Colin, I didn't post until now to this question. That was the phony heavensent, liar, cheat and coward.


      April 5, 2011 at 4:00 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Fake HeavenSent, interesting how your posts follow mine to discredit me.

      April 5, 2011 at 4:16 pm |
  5. LeeCMH

    Here come the Bible quote hacks: It says in Jibberish 12:23

    April 5, 2011 at 3:17 pm |
    • Doc Vestibule

      Jibberish 12:23
      "And lo, there came unto the diadems a cloak of great purity and in that cloak there WERE dust mites. Yea, did the mites have upon them the countenance of the LORD and they DID eat of the dandruff of the Lamb."

      April 5, 2011 at 3:31 pm |
    • HeavenSent


      April 5, 2011 at 3:34 pm |
    • Stephanie

      @ Colin.. God sent His only Son to die on the cross so that your sins may be forgiven. He loves you no matter what. If you deny Him then you will perish.

      April 5, 2011 at 4:03 pm |
    • Magic


      What kind of god have you invented? One that is appeased, satisfied and happy as a clam that someone (himself?) suffered and died?!! This is a definition of an insane monster.

      April 5, 2011 at 4:10 pm |
    • Stephanie


      April 5, 2011 at 4:15 pm |
    • Magic


      You want someone to love you who gets his jollies from suffering and death - you are strange.

      April 5, 2011 at 4:18 pm |
  6. Dmoney

    There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown." Genesis 6:4-5 (KJV).

    i dont know why angels stop coming to earth now, the chicks are much hotter than back in the day...Kim Kardashian, Jessica Alba, Brooklyn Decker...if i was an angel i would be like Peace out God, im going to Earth to hook up and make a Giant!

    April 5, 2011 at 3:04 pm |
    • Magic


      What kind of god have you invented? One that is appeased, satisfied and happy as a clam that someone (himself?) suffered and died?!! This is a definition of an insane monster.

      April 5, 2011 at 4:08 pm |
    • Magic

      sorry, wrong slot...

      April 5, 2011 at 4:09 pm |
  7. jude

    ya the bible did have a huge impact on science in oppressing it. the catholic church did everything it can to halt scientific knowledge for the sake of some silly old book, people today actively try to oppress science for the same reasons. science in the mean while has let us live cozy lives with our houses, televisions, computers, fresh water, food, transportation, communication, etc, etc. i will always choose what has actually given me the life i live over some book which has been used countless number of times to oppress and kill and start wars.

    April 5, 2011 at 2:39 pm |
    • Ryan

      Kinda like evolutionists do nowadays. The refuse modern evidence against their all-powerful Theory of Evolution such as human and dinosaur tracks and bones in the same layer, utter lack of the thousands or even millions of transitional fossils from ape to man, or from whatever the ape came from, the fact that carbon dating is extremely innacurate (it often shows several million year discrepancies from the same rock sent to different labs), studies that show the moon would be inside the Earth less than one million years ago based on its' ever-widening orbit (it's getting further and further away, so do reverse math), and that nearly every missing link from Nebraska Man to Piltdown has been proven false. Bear in mind, Sir Isaac Newton, Copernicus, Galileo, Leonardo da Vinci, Werner von Braun, Albert Einstein, Aristotle, Louis Pasteur, Marie Curie, and nearly all of the most noteworthy scientists of history were religious people. Science advanced, all right – not even Darwin believed his own theory after he looked it over. Open your eyes and look at the facts.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:45 pm |
    • PraiseTheLard

      Ryan wrote: "Open your eyes and look at the facts."

      Like the bible???

      April 5, 2011 at 3:49 pm |
    • Colin

      @Ryan. I am not going to try an individually point out the many falsehoods in what you just posted. I am prepared to assume you did not finish high school and have been cuddling your bible like a moron ever since.

      I don't so much care that you people in the "talking snake" school of evolutionary biology are super-stupid, I just wish you would stop spreading your lies as there are people out there who really have an interest in the natural history of the planet and do not know enough to know that a 6,000 year old planet is simply and inarguably impossible.

      Do not bother responding, you can safely assume that I know (i) it is actually the evolutionist who are doing the lying; (ii) there is a wolrd-wide conspiracy against creations science; (iii) I am evil and will burn in h-e11.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:56 pm |
    • jude

      @Ryan like a typical creationist you are a liar and completely ignorant of any science. i hate to be mean but the world laughs at such utter ignorance of people who fail to grasp basic science. evolution is one of the strongest supported scientific theories with evidence from within the fossil record to observed speciation, all of which you can easily look up using google. a great example is darwins finches or peppored moths in england for evidence of evolution.

      carbon 14-nitrogen 14 dating is only used to date objects up 50,000 years years old. to date objects of millions or even billions of years old you must use different radioactive materials such as uranium-lead dating. as for the supposed inaccuracies scientists take into account different factors that would lead to inaccurate dating, faulty techniques yield faulty results.

      as for the moon being inside the earth less than a million years ago again wrong, simulations consistantly show that the moon was roughly 20,000 miles from earth at its formation

      does it really matter some famous scientists were religious? their personal beliefs hold no weight in the fact that the scientific theories they developed were and still are strong. you are the case and point as to why i say that religion at every turn does its best to hault and oppress science for the sake of petty religion

      April 5, 2011 at 4:34 pm |
  8. The Grand Viizier

    CNN Belief Bloggers,
    How long does it take to get one's respectful, resonable, thoughtful postings on this blog "moderated". Just Curious. Thanks

    April 5, 2011 at 1:12 pm |
    • Helpful Henry

      The Grand Viizier,

      Your "awaiting moderation" post will never appear.

      Here is a list of oddities, courtesy of @Reality and @Sum Dude:

      CNN posting tips for new visitors – GNU public license – feel free to copy for your very own
      bad letter combinations / words to avoid if you want to get past the CNN "awaiting moderation" filter:
      Many, if not most, are buried within other words, but I am not shooting for the perfect list, so use your imagination.
      You can use dashes, spaces, or other characters to modify the "offending" letter combinations.
      ar-se.....as in Car-se, etc.
      co-ck.....as in co-ckatiel, co-ckatrice, co-ckleshell, co-ckles, lubco-ck, etc.
      co-on.....as in rac-oon, coc-oon, etc.
      cu-m......as in doc-ument, accu-mulate, circu-mnavigate, circu-mstances, cu-mbersome, cuc-umber, etc.
      cu-nt.....as in Scu-ntthorpe, a city in the UK famous for having problems with filters...!
      ef-fing...as in ef-fing filter
      ft-w......as in soft-ware, delft-ware, swift-water, etc.
      ho-mo.....as in ho-mo sapiens or ho-mose-xual, ho-mogenous, etc.
      ho-rny....as in tho-rny, etc.
      jacka-ss...yet "ass" is allowed by itself.....
      ja-p......as in j-apanese, ja-pan, j-ape, etc.
      koo-ch....as in koo-chie koo..!
      pi-s......as in pi-stol, lapi-s, pi-ssed, therapi-st, etc.
      pr-ick....as in pri-ckling, pri-ckles, etc.
      ra-pe.....as in scra-pe, tra-peze, gr-ape, thera-peutic, sara-pe, etc.
      se-x......as in Ess-ex, s-exual, etc.
      sp-ic.....as in disp-icable, hosp-ice, consp-icuous, susp-icious, sp-icule, sp-ice, etc.
      ti-t......as in const-itution, att-itude, ent-ities, alt-itude, beat-itude, etc.
      tw-at.....as in wristw-atch, nightw-atchman, etc.
      va-g......as in extrava-gant, va-gina, va-grant, va-gue, sava-ge, etc.
      who-re....as in who're you kidding / don't forget to put in that apostrophe!
      add "spa-nk" and "hoo-ters" to the banned list. Sorry. Shoot is okay, but hoo-t is not.

      April 5, 2011 at 1:27 pm |
    • The Grand Viizier

      Thanks. Appreciate your help. Interesting that none of your examples, or anything close, was in my attempted post. Obviously CNN does not care about it's readers, and thoughtful bloggers. I will not be back. Thanks again.

      April 5, 2011 at 1:57 pm |
    • Reality

      The Grand Viizier,

      Some added help:

      The moderators of this blog have set up a secret forbidden word filter which unfortunately not only will delete or put your comment in the dreaded "waiting for moderation" category but also will do the same to words having fragments of these words. For example, "t-it" is in the set but the filter will also pick up words like Hitt-ite, t-itle, beati-tude, practi-tioner and const-tution. Then there are words like "an-al" thereby flagging words like an-alysis and "c-um" flagging acc-umulate or doc-ument. And there is also "r-a-pe", “a-pe” and “gra-pe”, "s-ex", and "hom-ose-xual". You would think that the moderators would have corrected this by now considering the number of times this has been commented on but they have not. To be safe, I typically add hyphens in any word that said filter might judge "of-fensive".

      • More than one web address will also activate “waiting for moderation”. Make sure the web address does not have any forbidden word or fragment.

      Sum Dude routinely updates the list of forbidden words/fragments.

      Two of the most filtered words are those containing the fragments "t-it" and "c-um". To quickly check your comments for these fragments, click on "Edit" on the Tool Bar and then "Find" on the menu. Add a fragment (without hyphens) one at a time in the "Find" slot and the offending fragment will be highlighted in your comments before you hit the Post button. Hyphenate the fragment(s) and then hit Post. And remember more than one full web address will also gain a "Waiting for Moderation".

      April 5, 2011 at 11:46 pm |
  9. GSA

    @HeavenSent – I can't be doing evil by writing what I post because Jesus told me he is the truth and the life and he told me what to write.
    Amen to you as well and happy Festivus!

    April 5, 2011 at 12:45 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      GSA, you have free will.


      April 5, 2011 at 1:30 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      GSA, I hope you enjoy the flames. You do the work of the Devil.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:06 pm |
    • Veritas


      April 5, 2011 at 3:19 pm |
    • Ryan

      Veritas – Yes, Hitler was once Catholic, as I stated, but he converted. Read the whole comment. He didn't use the Bible for anything but fuel for his book burnings (he ordered all Bibles burned). Darwin was a priest in training, so he must've been Christian, right? Therefore, we should follow the Bible based on the fact that Darwin believed in it at one point, using your logic. People change, for better or worse.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:31 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      GSA, I didn't write "GSA, I hope you enjoy the flames. You do the work of the Devil.
      April 5, 2011 at 3:06 pm | Report abuse |"

      That was the fake heavensent who's a liar, cheat and coward.


      April 5, 2011 at 3:56 pm |
  10. GSA

    The Bible is a very important book and one of the most influential in history, whether you believe what's written in it or not. I personally do not but welcome debate on the topic.
    What I don't get is ppl that credit the great things that have happened on Earth with Christianity and believing in the Bible.
    @theoldam wrote – "Millons have come to a living faith in Christ Jesus over the millennia. There was a time in the U.S. when virtually ALL Hospitals and Universities were founded by Christian organizations."
    This to me would be very similar in saying that the Iranian president should be revered and looked upon as a Saint since he has built schools and provided many with jobs. Even though it is true it totally ignores the wrong and evil that he has done. You have to take the good with the bad, i'm sure if the Bible and Chritianity have done so much good over the years as many say these same ppl should be able to cite incidents where the Bible and Christianity have done evil, if in fact they have truly studied the Bible and its history and effect on mankind.
    Me being a Sikh, I admit wholeheartedly that many ppl calling themselves Sikh have been honest, hard-working ppl that have been charitable and made a positive difference in the world but there are also ppl that call themselves Sikh that commit evil and terrifying acts and justify it by quoting passages from our holy book and twisting them to fit their needs. The 3 major relilgions seem to not want to admit this and instead when an evil act is perpetrated by an individual in their respective religion they just say that that person is not truly a follower or they justify it, ie. the hate of gays as an example.

    April 5, 2011 at 11:11 am |
    • HeavenSent

      GSA, you do evil just by writing what you post.

      Jesus said to him, I am the Way and the Truth and the Life; no one comes to the Father except by (through) Me.

      John 14: 6


      April 5, 2011 at 12:15 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      GSA, you are also going to burn in hell

      April 5, 2011 at 12:21 pm |
    • Nonimus

      @HeavenSent I or II (real or fake),
      If you were running the government, I have a feeling you would outlaw freedom of speech, which is why I don't want religion in my government.

      April 5, 2011 at 12:35 pm |
    • Reality

      Hmmm, "I am the Truth" i.e. John 14:6. This passage was not said by the historical Jesus but was wishful thinking and an embellishment by John to make Jesus more like the ancient and local gods of first century Palestine. 210-. Place of Life: (1) Dial. Sav. 27-30, (2) John 14:2-12; http://www.faithfutures.org/Jesus/Crossan2.rtf

      April 5, 2011 at 1:06 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Fake HeavenSent, you wrote "GSA, you are also going to burn in hell

      Because you were posting at the same time I was on using my handle you forced me off the site I was posting on. Which means, you work for CNN.


      April 5, 2011 at 1:28 pm |
    • SeanNJ

      @HeavenSent: Doesn't matter. We can't tell the difference between the real one and the imposter anyway.

      April 5, 2011 at 1:31 pm |
    • Ryan

      @ Reality – Wow, you found one and a quarter million killings over a span of several thousand years in the Old Testament. Not bad! However, I've got you beat. Atheist Hitler killed four times that many in Jews alone in just seven years from 1938-1945, not to mention people of other religions. Also, for those who say Hitler was Catholic, he converted after he wrote "Mein Kampf" and long before he even started the Nazi Party back in the 1920s.

      April 5, 2011 at 2:39 pm |
    • Magic

      The number 1 killer of humans over the ages is Malaria, with approx. 27 BILLION deaths attributed to it. (Ahem, and who, according to believers, came up with that little trick?)

      Time to put away killing over imaginary gods and unite to fight real things.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:07 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      No ni m us, there is only one law and that is God 's Law of the Holy Bible. We need to change of few things in our Con st it u tion and some day we will. There is only free dom under the bible and God 's Law will pr e va il.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:10 pm |
    • Veritas

      Hey Ryan
      Hitler was a xain...Catholic....and used the buy bull to convince people for the killing of the Jews....

      April 5, 2011 at 3:18 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Nominus, actually my freedom of speech was violated as well as freedom of assembly and other rights that have been on the books. I know exactly how it feels. Besides, it was the phony heaven sent that replied to you first on this issue. I also know how people change writings on you. I wonder if the phony heavensent knows my former bosses? They're cut from the same cloth.


      April 5, 2011 at 3:47 pm |
    • Reality

      "The allegation is sometimes made that Hitler was a Catholic – a Christian until the day he died. This claim is based upon the fact that Hitler was born and raised in a Catholic family.

      However, as an adult, Hitler specifically rejected the Catholic Church, as well as Christianity in general. He described himself as "a complete pagan".

      The book Hitler's Secret Conversations: 1941-1944, published by Farrar, Straus and Young, Inc. (1953), contains definitive proof of Hitler's real views. The book was published in Britain under the t-itle, Hitler's Table Talk: 1941-1944, which t-itle was used for the Oxford University Press paperback edition in the United States.

      Some excerpts:

      All of these are quotes from Adolf Hitler:

      Night of 11th-12th July, 1941:

      "National Socialism and religion cannot exist together.... The heaviest blow that ever struck humanity was the coming of Christianity. Bolshevism is Christianity's illegitimate child. Both are inventions of the Jew. The deliberate lie in the matter of religion was introduced into the world by Christianity.... Let it not be said that Christianity brought man the life of the soul, for that evolution was in the natural order of things. (p 6 & 7) "

      10th October, 1941, midday:

      "Christianity is a rebellion against natural law, a protest against nature. Taken to its logical extreme, Christianity would mean the systematic cultivation of the human failure. (p 43)"

      April 5, 2011 at 3:47 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Thanks Sean. I'm glad some folks use their gray matter.


      April 5, 2011 at 3:49 pm |
    • Reality

      The Twenty (or so) Worst Things People Have Done to Each Other:

      From : http://necrometrics.com/warstatz.htm#u (a necessary reference for all to peruse)

      o The Muslim Conquest of India

      "The likely death toll is somewhere between 2 million and 80 million. The geometric mean of those two limits is 12.7 million. "

      Rank <<<Death Toll <Cause <<Centuries<<<Religions/Groups involved*

      1. 63 million Second World War 20C (Christians et al and Communists vs. Christians et al, Nazi-Pagan and "Shintoists")

      2. 40 million Mao Zedong (mostly famine) 20C (Communism)

      40 million Genghis Khan 13C (Shamanism or Tengriism)

      4. 27 million British India (mostly famine) 19C (Anglican)

      5. 25 million Fall of the Ming Dynasty 17C (Buddhism, Taoism, Confucianism, Chinese folk religion)

      6. 20 million Taiping Rebellion 19C ( Confucianism, Buddhism and Chinese folk religion vs. a form of Christianity)

      20 million Joseph Stalin 20C

      8. 19 million Mideast Slave Trade 7C-19C (Islam)

      9. 17 million Timur Lenk 14C-15C

      10. 16 million Atlantic Slave Trade 15C-19C (Christianity)

      11. 15 million First World War 20C (Christians vs. Christians)

      15 million Conquest of the Americas 15C-19C (Christians vs. Pagans)

      13. 13 million Muslim Conquest of India 11C-18C

      14. 10 million An Lushan Revolt 8C

      10 million Xin Dynasty 1C

      16. 9 million Russian Civil War 20C (Christians vs Communists)

      17. 8 million Fall of Rome 5C (Pagans)

      8 million Congo Free State 19C-20C (Christians)

      19. 7½ million Thirty Years War 17C (Christians vs Christians)

      7½ million Fall of the Yuan Dynasty 14C

      *:" Is religion responsible for more violent deaths than any other cause?

      A: No, of course not – unless you define religion so broadly as to be meaningless. Just take the four deadliest events of the 20th Century – Two World Wars, Red China and the Soviet Union – no religious motivation there, unless you consider every belief system to be a religion."

      Q: So, what you're saying is that religion has never killed anyone.

      A: Arrgh... You all-or-nothing people drive me crazy. There are many doc-umented examples where members of one religion try to exterminate the members of another religion. Causation is always complex, but if the only difference between two warring groups is religion, then that certainly sounds like a religious conflict to me. Is it the number one cause of mass homicide in human history? No. Of the 22 worst episodes of mass killing, maybe four were primarily religious. Is that a lot? Well, it's more than the number of wars fought over soccer, or s-ex (The Trojan and Sabine Wars don't even make the list.), but less than the number fought over land, money, glory or prestige.

      In my Index, I list 41 religious conflicts compared with 27 oppressions under "Communism", 24 under Colonialism, 2 under "Railroads" and 2 under "Scapegoats". Make of that what you will."

      April 5, 2011 at 3:52 pm |
  11. CW


    I see a lot of the Atheist and Non-believers have made it on the post's for this article. You see the problem lies in this...I read one respons saying the following:

    From: Jose Sanchez

    "Sure has, Mr. Green. That's why your Hobby Lobby chain donates a portion of its proceeds to anti-gay groups like the ADF, isn't it? A book that's been driving people to hate for over 2000 years – it's had a 'huge impact' on societies much like a meteor strike."

    @ Jose Sanchez,

    I say:

    The Bible has never preached H-'ate ash you say it towards people. It does preach H-'ate towards sin for which H-'om-'o-s-'e-'xuality is a sin. And your point about this person donating money to help fight against this...I have NO problem with it since you have every G-'ay person out there trying to preach that this lifestyle is okay and pushing their G-'ay pride everywhere.

    Let me pose a question to you: Since in your mind the Bible preaches h-'ate to G-a'y folks then does it also preach h-'ate to a mur-derer or does it preach h-'ate towards the sin of mur-der?

    Now answer that.

    @ All others,

    Now with that said I don't agree with making the Bible something that we need to worship what so ever. I do agree that the Bible should be "used" to guide us in how to live and how to worship God. The Bible is the word of God. The Bible is Truth from God to us. The Bible is "guide book" on how to live our very lives. It covers all and any situations and always shows us how to deal with every situation.

    April 5, 2011 at 10:14 am |
    • Colin

      You're right CW, the Bible is a guidebook on how to live our lives. The next time I take the land of a neighboring tribe, I will be sure to kill all the men, r-a-p-e all the virgins, smash the heads of the infants and take (but not release) all the slaves.

      and, if I see anyone worshipping an idol, I will be sure to smite them.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:25 am |
    • CW

      @ Colin,

      Perfect case....grade "A" on how your very blind in your so called Bible bashing. Your right those things were the guidelines in the Old testament....and it also explains why that was the case in the Old testament. I dare say to you though that you need to study the scriptures in the New testament as well.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:32 am |
    • jimtanker

      So the OT is irrelivant? So then we dont have to listen to either versions of the ten commandments then. Good thing, only, why are chrisitans always up in arms defending the ten commandments? The wrong ten commandments BTW.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:42 am |
    • Spencer

      CW you lack critical thinking skills that's the issue. Since you don't understand critical thinking this might help.

      A Critical Thinker:

      1. Is open-minded and mindful of alternatives
      2. Tries to be well-informed
      3. Judges well the credibility of sources
      4. Identifies conclusions, reasons, and assumptions
      5. Judges well the quality of an argument, including the acceptability of its reasons, assumptions, and evidence
      6. Can well develop and defend a reasonable position
      7. Asks appropriate clarifying questions
      8. Formulates plausible hypotheses; plans experiments well
      9. Defines terms in a way appropriate for the context
      10. Draws conclusions when warranted, but with caution
      11. Integrates all items in this list when deciding what to believe or do

      April 5, 2011 at 10:43 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      I dare say you should learn some grammar, CW. It's "you're". Not "your". "You're" is a contraction for "you are". "Your" is a possessive adjective, describing something as belonging to 'you'.

      I don't take advice on the Bible or any other literature from someone who is incapable of learning to write a simple sentence.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:44 am |
    • PeterVN

      CW, your claim that the bi-ble does not pre-ach ha-te is ab-surd in fhe face of your religion's dic-tum of eter-nal tor-ment (he-ll) for simply not believing its incre-dible tall tales. And that's only the beginning. We need only look at some of the ha-teful stuff in Matthew just as examples (see e.g. Skept-ics Annotat-ed B-ible for more details) Awful ha-te and hor-rors are present in new tes-tament and old.

      So as usual, I have to ask, which poor animal did you cru-elly and bloo-dily slaug-hter today to please your hor-rid, hat-eful Chris-tian god, as the bib-le com-mands you to do?

      April 5, 2011 at 10:53 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      Some New Testament nuggets of peace and love.
      Let's go slaughter a whole town at God's behest!
      Samuel 15:3
      "Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass."

      Next town please. The slaughter was fun, but I'd like some virgins to take as s.ex slaves.
      Numbers 31:17
      "Now kill all the boys [innocent kids]. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man."

      If you walk with Christ, you'd better be armed to the teeth!
      Luke 22:36
      "He said to them, 'But now if you have a purse, take it and also a bag; and if you don't have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one."

      Revelation 2:22 shows us an angry, vengeful Jesus.
      "So I will cast her on a bed of suffering, and I will make those who commit adultery with her suffer intensely, unless they repent of her ways. I will strike her children dead."

      April 5, 2011 at 11:13 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      And by the way, God commands the murder of children by bashing their heads against rocks, as well as the r.ape of your enemie's wives in the New Testament as well as the Old

      Psalm 137:8-9
      "O Daughter of Babylon, doomed to destruction, happy is he who repays you for what you have done to us- he who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks."

      Isaiah 13:16
      "Whoever is captured will be thrust through; all who are caught will fall by the sword. Their infants will be dashed to pieces before their eyes; their houses will be looted and their wives ravished."

      April 5, 2011 at 12:04 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      CW, I wonder what Colin would have said to his neighbors as the heathens came and ravished the town, burned his house down, speared him through the gut and left him for dead. Would he cry out for God to help him?


      April 5, 2011 at 12:11 pm |
    • Doc Vestibule

      He would've said
      "$h1t! Here comes that Jewish carpenter again with his band of thugs armed with swords to kill my children, burn my town and r.ape my daughters!"
      "I'd cry out to God for help, but His Son is leading the marauders!"

      April 5, 2011 at 12:17 pm |
    • Colin

      @Heavensent. The next time a tribe of Hit-ites or Cananites come pouring into Raleigh, I'll be sure to heed the Bible's advice and throw out my daughters to be ravished, leaving me and my guests in peace.

      April 5, 2011 at 12:30 pm |
    • Ashok the Hit-ite

      Awesome! Thanks!

      April 5, 2011 at 12:39 pm |
    • Reality

      The atrocities listed in the OT/Torah:

      •Exodus 32: 3,000 Israelites killed by Moses for worshipping the golden calf.
      •Numbers 31: After killing all men, boys and married women among the Midianites, 32,000 virgins remain as booty for the Israelites. (If unmarried girls are a quarter of the population, then 96,000 people were killed.)
      ◦Joshua 8: 12,000 men and women, all the people of Ai, killed.
      ◦Joshua 10: Joshua completely destroys Gibeon ("larger than Ai"), Makeddah, Libnah, Lachish, Eglon, Hebron, Debir. "He left no survivors."
      ◦Joshua 11: Hazor destroyed. [Paul Johnson, A History of the Jews (1987), estimates the population of Hazor at ?> 50,000]
      ◦TOTAL: if Ai is average, 12,000 x 9 = 108,000 killed.
      •Judges 1: 10,000 Canaanites k. at Battle of Bezek. Jerusalem and Zephath destroyed.
      •Judges 3: ca. 10,000 Moabites k. at Jordan River.
      •Judges 8: 120,000 Midianite soldiers k. by Gideon
      •Judges 20: Benjamin attacked by other tribes. 25,000 killed.
      •1 Samuel 4: 4,000 Isrealites killed at 1st Battle of Ebenezer/Aphek. 30,000 Isr. k. at 2nd battle.
      ◦2 Samuel 8: 22,000 Arameans of Damascus and 18,000 Edomites killed in 2 battles.
      ◦2 Samuel 10: 40,000 Aramean footsoldiers and 7,000 charioteers killed at Helam.
      ◦2 Samuel 18: 20,000 Israelites under Absalom killed at Ephraim.
      •1 Kings 20: 100,000 Arameans killed by Israelites at Battle of Aphek. Another 27,000 killed by collapsing wall.
      •2 Chron 13: Judah beat Israel and inflicted 500,000 casualties.
      •2 Chron 25: Amaziah, king of Judah, k. 10,000 from Seir in battle and executed 10,000 POWs. Discharged Judean soldiers pillaged and killed 3,000.
      •2 Chron 28: Pekah, king of Israel, slew 120,000 Judeans

      •TOTAL: That comes to about 1,283,000 mass killings specifically enumerated in the Bible.

      April 5, 2011 at 1:00 pm |
    • PraiseTheLard

      Reality wrote: "That comes to about 1,283,000 mass killings specifically enumerated in the Bible."

      You mean that the people who actually "wrote" the bible finally came to their census?

      April 5, 2011 at 3:24 pm |
    • jg

      to all the misled, read the bible for yourself and for all who just see the violence remember big rats produce little rats.
      we are being overrun with too many little vermin. the time is near.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:37 pm |
  12. theoldadam

    Only one of two will happen one meets the Jesus of the Bible.

    Either you will die...or He will die.

    April 5, 2011 at 9:01 am |
    • Waffle Bob

      Nobody will meet him, or Allah or Buddha or Thor or Horus. When you die, you stop. It's just what it looks like.

      It's a shame, though, that the people who wasted their lifes in service of a delusion will never get to realize that they were fools. Especially the ones who forced tha tfoolishness upon others (which is almost all of them).

      April 5, 2011 at 10:14 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Revelation 20:9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

      Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet [are], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

      Revelation 20:11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.

      Revelation 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is [the book] of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.

      Revelation 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.

      Revelation 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

      Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.


      April 5, 2011 at 12:05 pm |
    • Reality

      In the spirit of equal opportunity "thu-mping":

      "Nineteenth-century agnostic Robert G. Ingersoll branded Revelation "the insanest of all books".[30] Thomas Jefferson omitted it along with most of the Biblical canon, from the Jefferson Bible, and wrote that at one time, he "considered it as merely the ravings of a maniac, no more worthy nor capable of explanation than the incoherences of our own nightly dreams." [31]

      Martin Luther "found it an offensive piece of work" and John Calvin "had grave doubts about its value."[32]

      April 5, 2011 at 12:57 pm |
    • Magic


      You think the book of Revelation is real? It is a very old science-fiction, horror, fantasy story, created by a guy with a wild imagination or perhaps with mental illness and hallucinations.

      April 5, 2011 at 1:15 pm |
    • SeanNJ

      @Waffle Bob: Yeah, that's the one part of "divine justice" that I'm going to miss...the looks on their faces.

      April 5, 2011 at 1:22 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Reality, I already posted my answer to that question articles ago. All those men lived at a time that the Book of Revelation didn't make sense to them. It's as if we were describing automobiles, computers, microwaves or even sound systems with CDs to them. They would have no clue to what we were talking about in their day and age. The Book of Revelation means to reveal. It applies to your generation. End of days. The prophesies started coming quicker and quicker since Israel got their land back.


      April 5, 2011 at 1:22 pm |
  13. Colin

    Whatever else you think of it, the liklihood that the Bible contains an accurate picture of the life of Jesus is virtually zero. First, the gosplels were not written by eyewitnesses. The four gospels were written between 35 and 65 years after he died. That would be a long time today, but it was more than a generation then, when life expectency was about 40. At no point does any gospel say "I saw Jesus do this..." They are all copies from earleir sources or mere word of mouth. In places, they themselves acknowledge this.

    Second, we have no Earthly idea who wrote them. The tradional Catholic story, created a couple of hundred years after he died is the famour quartet, M, M,L and J. Truth is, the authors are totally unknown. Which, if you think about it means millions of Christians base their entire faith on the writings of four people they do not even know anything about!!

    Third, there are distinct differences in the four gospels about pretty basic stuff. They flat contradict each other.

    Finally, they were written by people who were feverishly committed to Jesus as the son of god. The chances are that they were more concerned with establishing his divinity than with accurately recording his life. Think how likely it is that an ardent Branch Davidian would accuaretly record David Koresh's life.

    In short, you are completely deluding yourself if you think the four gospels are true in anything other than the broadest details of Jesus life.

    April 5, 2011 at 8:52 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Colin, John the Baptist was Jesus' cousin. He was only a few months older than Jesus. The apostles were with Jesus. That makes 12 of them even after Judas was killed. Mark was a young boy at the time Jesus walked the earth. Should I go on how incorrect you are? Or, do you get the truth now?


      April 5, 2011 at 10:32 am |
    • Colin

      @HeavenSent. So, JTB never wrote a word, nor did Mark the apostle. My point was that none of the four authors of the gospels saw anything they recorded. They all openly recorded earlier oral traditions and long lost writings. And please don't tell me the author of "Mark's gosple" was the same Mark the apostle (if such person even existed). He certainly is not.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:38 am |
    • jimtanker

      According to the story that is. You cant use the bible to prove the accuracy of the bible. That is nothing but circular logic.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:39 am |
    • HeavenSent

      For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:

      1 Corinthians 1:22


      April 5, 2011 at 12:01 pm |
    • Something

      "For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:"

      And Christians and Muslims will believe *anything*.

      April 5, 2011 at 12:49 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Colin, I have no response. I just know.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:26 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Colin, the post right above this is the phony heavensent coward, liar and thief. CNN keeps blocking my post to you regarding
      Revelation 22

      I guess they know none of you folks will look up those scriptures on your own.


      April 5, 2011 at 3:39 pm |
  14. Reality

    The bible – one of the great con jobs of all time;

    To wit:

    Jesus was a bit "touched". According to the "book", he spoke to Satan, changed water into wine, raised Lazarus from the dead etc. In today's world, said Jesus would be declared legally insane.

    Or did P, M, M, L and J simply make him into a first century magic-man via their epistles and gospels of semi-fiction?

    Most contemporary NT experts after thorough analyses of all the scriptures go with the latter magic-man conclusion with J's gospels being mostly fiction.

    Obviously, today's followers of the "book", are also a bit on the odd side believing in all the Christian mumbo jumbo about bodies resurrecting, and exorcisms, and miracles, and "magic-man atonement, and infallible, old, European, white men, and 24/7 body/blood sacrifices followed by consumption of said sacrifices.

    See also:

    : http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F20E1EFE35540C7A8CDDAA0894DA404482

    The New Torah For Modern Minds And "Con-Free"!!

    April 5, 2011 at 8:14 am |
    • Rev. Rick

      @Reality – thanks for the link to the NYT article. I've been looking for that article for a couple of days!

      April 5, 2011 at 9:52 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Reality, the only one conning anyone is you doing it to yourself and those like you that care to believe and follow your babble.

      Since you are acting the part of the preacher. Please be aware those that preach against Jesus' truth are the first to be judged. I wouldn't want to be in that line.


      April 5, 2011 at 10:28 am |
  15. doctore0

    The bible is on the top ten list over worst books ever written;
    Only that fake bribe on eternal life in luxury will make people say the bible is a good book...


    April 5, 2011 at 6:31 am |
    • HeavenSent

      DoctorZero, you are trying to convince us that you've read a book.


      April 5, 2011 at 10:24 am |
  16. Frederica

    Christianity is forever, supreme, and incomparable. Only villains hate it.

    April 5, 2011 at 5:35 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Frederica, remember, famine upon the earth.


      April 5, 2011 at 10:22 am |
    • jimtanker

      Incomparable? You have GOT to be kidding. You can compare it to every other religion on Earth. Good thing is that they are all fiction.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:36 am |
    • HeavenSent

      John 8:42-44

      42 Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
      43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
      44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.


      April 5, 2011 at 11:58 am |
    • Reality

      From Professor Gerd Ludemann's book, Jesus After 2000 Years, p. 416,

      "Anyone in search of the historical Jesus will not find him in the Gospel of John......This verdict is the consensus among New Testament scholars."

      April 5, 2011 at 12:54 pm |
    • Fuyuko

      There is plenty to dislike in Christianity, as there is any revealed religion. Just read the old testament and see what evilness God was up to. There is also plenty of Good in the Christian faith. But not anything is 100% good and that includes the bible and the people who follow it.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:29 pm |
  17. Craz

    I hereby propose that we change the name of all Bibles to "Bibbles". Bibbles sounds like a much better word, don't you agree?

    April 5, 2011 at 3:52 am |
    • Reality

      Yes indeed!!

      •bibble – To eat and/or drink noisily; To tipple
      (or bible "thu-mping" noisily?)

      April 5, 2011 at 8:06 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Mark 3:29 But he that shall blaspheme against the Holy Ghost hath never forgiveness, but is in danger of eternal damnation:

      Mark 3:30 Because they said, He hath an unclean spirit.

      Mark 8:36 For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?

      Mark 8:37 Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

      Mark 8:38 Whosoever therefore shall be ashamed of me and of my words in this adulterous and sinful generation; of him also shall the Son of man be ashamed, when he cometh in the glory of his Father with the holy angels.


      April 5, 2011 at 11:51 am |
    • HeavenSent

      F U Craz

      April 5, 2011 at 12:16 pm |
    • Reality

      From Professor Gerd Ludemann

      "Ludemann [ in his book Jesus After 2000 Years, pp. 23-25] characterizes Mark 3:28-30 as "a word of law or a community rule" that derives from the community, rather than from Jesus. He notes the two-stage structure, with every kind of sin and blasphemy being capable of forgiveness in v. 28, and the exception that blasphemy against the Holy Spirit can never be forgiven, but does not consider the possibility that the more universal affirmation may derive from an older source."

      Mark 8: 36-37-

      "These verses have a wisdom stamp and therefore have only a slight chance of being authentic."

      Mark 8: 38

      Ludemann [Jesus, p. 344] states " this is a prophetic admonition from the post-Easter community.

      From Professor JD Crossan's analyses, said passage is a single attestaion and therefore historically unreliable.

      April 5, 2011 at 12:49 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Phony HeavenSent, you wrote "F U Craz

      You are a coward.


      April 5, 2011 at 1:16 pm |
  18. theoldadam

    Millons have come to a living faith in Christ Jesus over the millennia. There was a time in the U.S. when virtually ALL Hospitals and Universities were founded by Christian organizations.

    In the end (and the end will come one day) all that will be left will be our Lord Jesus and His new Kingdom.

    He came and died for sinners. He came to forgive you so that you might have eternal life with HIm when you need it again.

    It sounds pretty promising to me!

    April 5, 2011 at 3:43 am |
    • jimtanker

      NO, he didnt come and die for our sins. A book was written by a bunch of men in order to sway people to their religion so that they could gain money and power. Seems like it's worked pretty well so far.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:35 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Another one insisting he be thrown into the eternal flames, blotted out. No eternity for him.


      April 5, 2011 at 11:48 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Jim, you are going to hell and I will be smiling

      April 5, 2011 at 3:02 pm |
    • Doubtful1

      Showing what a true hypocrite you are: "Jim, you are going to hell and I will be smiling". Your mythical Jesus would never smile nor condone that anyone smile for someone going to hell.....

      At least if you're going to be a cult member, follow the teachings of your cult.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:17 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Doubtful1 I really dont care what you think. I spread the good word and either you accept it or you go burn forever.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:24 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Doubtful1, I didn't write that to Jim. That was the fake heavensent who steals my handle to write chaos on this site. I was thrown off the site totally when he/she posted under my handle. Notice that both of us weren't on at the same time.


      At least if you're going to be a cult member, follow the teachings of your cult.
      April 5, 2011 at 3:17 pm | Report abuse |

      April 5, 2011 at 3:26 pm |
    • Fuyuko

      The 'died for our sins' stuff is just added by early Christians to make Jesus's death more meaningful and sacrificing. Point is, I don't think a good and just god would demand human sacrifice. That is Evil.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:28 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      We all need to start posting as HeavenSent.


      April 5, 2011 at 3:30 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Doubtful1, I also didn't write the following:


      Doubtful1 I really dont care what you think. I spread the good word and either you accept it or you go burn forever.

      Good grief, the phony heavensent hasn't the courage to write under their handle. Maybe that's because they have to many handles going at the same time.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:31 pm |
  19. Cato

    A collection of Green Hornet comic books is every bit as relevant as this collection. Quick quiz:

    Q: The books in which collection were not the source of wars, murders, torture and oppression, the Bible or Green Hornet?

    A. Green Hornet

    Q. Which is more effective, praying to Jesus or praying to Green Hornet?

    A. You get exactly the same results either way.

    Q. How can you be sure that Jesus is God and not Green Hornet?

    A. You can't, not at all.

    Q. What is the difference between God and Green Hornet?

    A. Nothing. The only evidence for either of them is in books. There is not the slightest shred of independant evidence supporting the existence of either.

    April 5, 2011 at 2:55 am |
    • Waffle Bob

      Green Hornet is better written.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:20 am |
    • CW

      @ Cato,

      I find your post very dis-'gusting. How can you compare the ALMIGHTY GOD to some comic book character? I'm very glad to say to you that Jesus d-'ied for you as well. Its up to you to accept his sacrifice for your soul and accept him into your heart and life.

      As for your evidence claim.....No no one can give you that "prove it" evidence you want to see but you have to accept things on Faith.

      Let me give you and example: No one can absolutely "PROVE" where we came from right? Every one of us has been taught that some form of evolution brought us here but there has never never been absolute proof that this is the case. So what do you do accept the amount of research that has been done and have reasonable "faith" that this is true or not believe at all. Its the same thing with the Bible.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:27 am |
    • jimtanker

      There is NO evidence for your god at all.

      There is however REAMS of evidience for both the big bang and for evolution. I'm sure that you dont believe that but it's there for all to see.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:33 am |
    • CW

      @ Jimtanker,

      Just proved my point. No I don't believe in evolution...period.

      you say:
      There is however REAMS of evidience for both the big bang and for evolution. I'm sure that you dont believe that but it's there for all to see.

      I say:

      The key word in all of your post is this "evidence"....no absolute proof but evidence. Let me ask...do you know anyone that was present when the big bang happened? Did you see it for yourself? As for evolution have known anyone that can "prove" this beyond a reasonable doubt? The reason I say this is that all of this is just educated guess work....based on man's research...discoveries of human remains....by the way when they have been found none of them can talk so how do we know? You see you have to accept some of this hogwash on faith right?...I mean since this is just researched evidence and not absolute proof right?

      I'll put my faith in God.....he has all the answers

      April 5, 2011 at 10:44 am |
    • Spencer

      "The key word in all of your post is this "evidence"....no absolute proof but evidence"

      CW you don't have any absolute evidence of God either so your logic is completely flawed.

      April 5, 2011 at 10:48 am |
    • Ethan

      CW – The reasons why the Big Bang theory is believed to be correct.
      1. The universe is expanding.
      2.... There exists a cosmic background radiation field detectable at microwave frequencies.
      3.... The cosmic microwave background field is measurably isotropic to better than a few parts in 100,000 after compensation is made for the relativistic Doppler effect caused by Earth/Sun/Milky Way motion.
      4.... The cosmic microwave background radiation field is precisely that of a black body.
      5.... The cosmic microwave background radiation field has a temperature of 2.7 K.
      6.... There does exist a universal abundance ratio of helium to hydrogen consistent with the current expansion rate and cosmic background temperature.
      7.... The cosmological abundance of deuterium relative to hydrogen and helium is consistent with the levels expected given the current expansion rate and density.
      8.... There are only three families of neutrinos.
      9.... The night sky is not as bright as the surface of the Sun.
      10... The cosmic background radiation field is slightly lumpy at a level of one part in 100,000 to 1,000,000.
      11... There are no objects that have ages indisputably greater than the expansion age of the universe.
      12... There are about 10,000,000,000 photons in the cosmic background radiation field for every proton and neutron of matter.
      13... The degree of galaxy clustering observed is consistent with an expanding universe with a finite age less than 20 billion years.
      14... There are no elements heavier than lithium which have a universal abundance ratio.
      15... The universe was once opaque to its own radiation.
      16... The universe is now dominated exclusively by matter and not a mixture of matter and anti-matter.

      April 5, 2011 at 11:05 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Ethan, I'm glad you appreciate what God made.


      April 5, 2011 at 11:41 am |
    • Normon

      I'm glad you appreciate the God that I made.

      Your welcome.

      April 5, 2011 at 11:54 am |
    • Nonimus

      @CW and HeavenSent,
      Science doesn't deal in "proofs" that's math. Science deals in evidence and what best describes events and makes the best predictions of future events.
      The theory of evolution is one of the most well supported theories in science using the same methods and criteria that support the theory of universal gravitation, germ theory, and any other scientific theory.
      The concept of God however has no scientific evidence to support it. That does not mean that God does not exist. It just means there is no evidence and therefore no scientific reason to think God exists.

      April 5, 2011 at 12:28 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Nonimus, figure out where these scriptures apply.

      Genesis 2:7: "And the Lord God formed man of the DUST OF THE GROUND, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and man became a living soul." Surely, you don't take Genesis 2:7 seriously? Do you?

      Psalm 8:8: ". . . whatsoever passeth through the PATHS OF THE SEAS." How did David (the writer of Psalms) know, over 2,000 years ago, there were "paths in the seas"? David probably never even saw an ocean!

      Ecclesiastes 1:7: "All the rivers run into the sea; yet the sea is not full; unto the place from whence the rivers come, thither they return again." How did the writer of Ecclesiastes know the water cycle of condensation and evaporation in 1000 B.C.?

      Job 38:19: "Where is THE WAY where light dwelleth?" How come Job didn't say where is THE PLACE where light dwelleth? Because light is always moving. How did Job know something in 1500 B.C. ?

      Ecclesiastes 1:6: "The wind goeth toward the south, and turneth about unto the north; it whirleth about continually, and the wind returneth again ACCORDING TO HIS CIRCUITS." How did the writer of Ecclesiastes know the wind traveled within circuits? How did he know with their so-called limited knowledge thousands of years ago?

      Leviticus 17:11: For the life of the flesh is in the blood. What Moses wrote in 1490 B.C. written thousands of years ago, by men with such limited knowledge?


      April 5, 2011 at 1:13 pm |
    • Magic


      Do your homework... look back at the comments from numerous past articles and see how these wide-eyed, mouth-breather claims of wondrous insights by ancient Middle Eastern men have been debunked.

      April 5, 2011 at 1:33 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Magic, you need to comprehend what dry bones, wells without water, spiritually dead mean. I could care less that some people don't comprehend scriptures. Jesus said he would put a veil over the eyes and ears of those that refuse to see or hear His truth, keep them in their delusion. It's only when a person who refuses to hear/see Jesus' truth and ask for forgiveness will He take the veil from their eyes and ears.

      Besides Magic, you haven't figured out why so many are against Jesus' truth.


      April 5, 2011 at 2:01 pm |
    • Spencer

      Hey HeavenSent these quotes you keep pasting over and over again are getting a tad boring.Hey look I can paste from websites too.

      “All the streams flow into the sea, but the sea is not full, and to the place where the streams flow, there they will flow again. “

      1 tn Heb “are going” or “are walking.” The term הֹלְכִים (holÿkhim, Qal active participle masculine plural from הָלַךְ, halakh,“to walk”) emphasizes continual, durative, uninterrupted action (present universal use of participle). This may be an example of personification; this verb is normally used in reference to the human activity of walking. Qoheleth compares the flowing of river waters to the action of walking to draw out the comparison between the actions of man and the actions of nature.

      2 tn Heb “there they are returning to go.” The term שָׁבִים (shavim, Qal active participle masculine plural from שׁוּב, shuv, “to return”) emphasizes the continual, durative action of the waters. The root שׁוּב is repeated in to emphasize that everything in nature (e.g., wind and water) continually repeats its actions. For all of the repeti-tion of the cycles of nature, nothing changes; all the constant motion produces nothing new.

      *****This verse does not refer to the cycle of evaporation or the return of water by underground streams, as sometimes suggested. Rather, it describes the constant flow of river waters to the sea. For all the action of the water – endless repeti-tion and water constantly in motion – there is nothing new accomplished.*******

      April 5, 2011 at 3:10 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Oh, I suppose the Green Hornet and his sidekick Kato weren't violent?


      April 5, 2011 at 3:15 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Wrong answer Spencer. Keep searching to find out who proved those scriptures to be TRUE. I've got the answers, but CNN mod squad won't let me post them, nor the other scriptures that have been proven true.

      Get that gray matter into gear.


      April 5, 2011 at 3:19 pm |
    • Magic


      Here's another one biting the dust:
      "Psalm 8:8: ". . . whatsoever passeth through the PATHS OF THE SEAS." How did David (the writer of Psalms) know, over 2,000 years ago, there were "paths in the seas"? David probably never even saw an ocean!"

      Jerusalem, where David lived, is only about 30 miles from the Mediterranean SEA, which, wonder of wonders, has currents (paths) and was well-traveled back in those days. Even if David didn't make that *impossible* journey to the sea, he was the freakin' King, for crying out loud, and he had access to information from people all over the place.

      Please take these bits of nonsense from the Groggy Noggin and deep-six them.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:22 pm |
    • Spencer

      HeavenSent you keep believing your lies you are going to burn in hell.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:26 pm |
    • Magic

      "...but CNN mod squad won't let me post them"

      Do your homework... research past articles from this blog, and you will find that at least 100 times you have been told that THERE IS NO INSTANT "MOD SQUAD" HERE (apologize to everyone else for shouting, but this numb-skull needs it for this).

      April 5, 2011 at 3:29 pm |
    • Syriac

      I get really annoyed when people say that praying dosen't work when they never try. If I prayed and nothing would be the result, why would I pray? Because I KNOW praying works. When I pray, my prayers always get answered.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:29 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      @Syriac: Stamen.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:31 pm |
    • Tracy

      “Job 38:19: "Where is THE WAY where light dwelleth?" How come Job didn't say where is THE PLACE where light dwelleth? Because light is always moving. How did Job know something in 1500 B.C. ?”

      This has nothing to do with scientific light as we know and understand it today.

      light = order, clarity, openness
      dark = disorder, obscurity, hiding

      In terms of these scriptures it means spiritual truth, light refers to spirituality and dark refers to the illusion of the mind. These verses are not talking about literal light or darkness, but it’s about God and a person’s ability to understand good and evil. It has nothing to do with reality of scientific light.

      It's amazing the cr*p people come up with to distort God's truth.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:38 pm |
    • Magic


      Evangelical Rule of Thumb:

      – If a bible verse furthers the cause, it is to be taken literally.

      – If a bible verse is detrimental to the cause, it is either: taken out of context; is allegorical; refers to another verse somewhere else; is a translation or copyist's error; means something other than what it actually says; is a mystery of god or not discernible by humans; or is just plain magic. (courtesy of @David Johnson)

      April 5, 2011 at 4:02 pm |
    • Lycidas

      I would have to disagree with you on that Magic.

      April 5, 2011 at 4:04 pm |
    • Nonimus

      You said, "Nonimus, figure out where these scriptures apply."

      Why? I was talking about scientific evidence. In what way are your quotes, scientific evidence?

      April 5, 2011 at 5:40 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Nonimus, my post that I just wrote you is being rejected. I'm logging off for the evening. Go onto the net and see what they are called today.

      Good night.

      April 5, 2011 at 6:12 pm |
  20. Jose Sanchez

    "“The Bible has had a huge impact on societies"

    Sure has, Mr. Green. That's why your Hobby Lobby chain donates a portion of its proceeds to anti-gay groups like the ADF, isn't it? A book that's been driving people to hate for over 2000 years – it's had a 'huge impact' on societies much like a meteor strike.

    April 5, 2011 at 1:37 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Jose, sounds to me like you're the one doing the hating.


      April 5, 2011 at 11:37 am |
    • Ron

      You're right Jose. Bigotry in the name of god, justified by the bible (atleast for some).
      While they like to toot the positives, lets not forget the negatives. Destruction and complete murder of indigenous peoples and their cultures and religions (in the name of their god), wars, pestilence, disease, repression of science and scientists. There are plenty of other things that can be mentioned and it is equally important that their negatives not be white washed to make the feel better and justified in their position.

      April 5, 2011 at 11:51 am |
    • Chris

      @ HeavenSent.... I sense no hate in his writing. He speaks the truth about religion. There have been more murders, and crimes in the name of god than anyone or anything else. Take for example the crusades, inquisition, and the current Jihad... The sooner people like you open your eyes the better the world will become.

      April 5, 2011 at 2:47 pm |
    • sealchan

      Whether you appreciate the Bible or not, it is still a great cultural artifact. As such I would even support introducing it into school curriculum. If we can't foster a discussion on the Bible between those who believe and those who don't then our democracy is in jeopardy.

      April 5, 2011 at 2:55 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Chris, there will not be peace until Jesus Christ comes back to earth. Until then, men/women will always create war.


      April 5, 2011 at 3:11 pm |
    • Peace2All


      Hi -Sealchan...

      I would possibly agree with introducing it into school curriculum. And, I think, in some school systems it may already be there. As long as it is in classes such as: Comparative literature, Comparative religions courses, etc... and 'not' put into a 'science' class.

      That's a quick as-sessment, but other than that... I believe we are in agreement with some strong parameters.



      April 5, 2011 at 3:16 pm |
    • Fuyuko

      The bible has both good and bad contents just as any revealed religion does. It is sad that the bible is used to oppress people and harm others. That is why it is up to the faithful to update their text and to question whether it is truly the word of god or the word of people who penned it.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:31 pm |
    • R

      Jose, do not hate. He is donating money to ADF so what ? He is like Hitler. He funded scientific projects like developing Gas chambers. Most important part is, Hitler donated and so do Steve Green. See positive side, he is creating Jobs for Anti Gays, same way as Hitler created Jobs for Gas chamber scientists. Both learned from Bible.

      April 5, 2011 at 3:31 pm |
1 2 3 4
About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.