April 30th, 2011
05:44 PM ET

Pope John Paul II's path to sainthood

Former Pope John Paul II will be beatified Sunday, but not without some controversy, as CNN's Jim Bittermann reports.

- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: Catholic Church • Pope Benedict XVI • Pope John Paul II • Vatican

soundoff (23 Responses)
  1. DetDan

    That crooked path to "sainthood" is just a sham, a fraud, a contrived and made-up bunch of crap.
    Nothing he did will erase the evil he has done. It will remain forever, like his soul in hell.

    May 1, 2011 at 8:08 pm |
  2. jsaiditfirst

    WHO is JESUS?

    The roman catholic church steadfastly adheres to the doctrine found in its own "catachizm of the catholic church" which defines God as being "truin in nature". That is, God the Father, God the Son, God the Holy Spirit, three Gods that are distinctly individual and yet ONE.
    I recently asked the pastor of a small rural church to explain for me, who God was. He was quick to state the very same thing that i mentioned above, and then, as if describing the "string theory" went off about God being to omnipotent and great for any mortal man (mortal, i thought we had an immortal soul?) to understand. At the conclusion he said: 'to put it simply, 1+1+1=1.

    Well, i've done the math and the answer is wrong. If i paid bills based on his analogy i would be broke. And it goes without saying that any person who put their trust in his religious leadership skills might also find themselves spiritually broke.

    It's more than interesting to note that during an address to over 100,000 people at a Youth Faith rally in Melbourne Aust. in 2007, Pope Benedict XVI stated that based on a clearer understanding of the holy scriptures, the long held doctrine of the "Holy Ghost" was in error, and that the holy ghost is now recognized as being "something" a "force", and merely the power God uses to accomplish his will!
    What the Pope said, in effect, defies current theology, and squarely challenges conventional idealology with respects to the trinity teaching. One would think in fact, that in light of such an admission that the church would redifine its standing doctrine. Well don't hold your breath, because changing the current theology from trinity to duality is tantamount to stripping investment speculators of there right to cast fear into the oil market which is the tool they use to drive-up prices. The trinity, like speculation, is an invaluable tool that keeps the masses confused, guessing and sitting in the pews with all their misplaced hopes in the hands of leaders they hope, will have the authority to grant them salvation.

    Christendoms leaders, babylon the great, the world empire of false religion is fused together and united in its false teachings that does nothing to provide spiritual guidence to the flocks of people who entrust it to sheppard them toward God. And its not that they can't. By consrting with the likes of Mugabe, Stalin and hitler they clearly show the fruits of what they offer.
    My God, and my Gods Son, are not their God and their Gods Son. They did not know them in the times of Jerusalem, and they don't know them now.

    WHO is JESUS? The answer is so simple:

    Jehovah himself produced me as the beginning of his way, the earliest of his achievements of long ago. 23 From time indefinite I was installed, from the start, from times earlier than the earth. 24 When there were no watery deeps I was brought forth as with labor pains, when there were no springs heavily charged with water. 25 Before the mountains themselves had been settled down, ahead of the hills, I was brought forth as with labor pains, 26 when as yet he had not made the earth and the open spaces and the first part of the dust masses of the productive land. 27 When he prepared the heavens I was there; when he decreed a circle upon the face of the watery deep, 28 when he made firm the cloud masses above, when he caused the fountains of the watery deep to be strong, 29 when he set for the sea his decree that the waters themselves should not pass beyond his order, when he decreed the foundations of the earth, 30 then I came to be beside him as a master worker, and I came to be the one he was specially fond of day by day, I being glad before him all the time, 31 being glad at the productive land of his earth, and the things I was fond of were with the sons of men.
    -Proverbs 8:22

    May 1, 2011 at 2:34 pm |
  3. jsaiditfirst

    There is so many convoluted interpetations of who jesus really is, or was, (and yes i offer yet another) that even the roman catholic church sits on the fence-line of controversy. The Vatican's current Pope has proposed a possible "edict" that may, at some future point, join the church with the scientific field, and would amount to nothing more than an agreement between the parties not to defame one another. (the church cannot withstand much more scandal)
    Unlike so many religions today, Jesus at least had the courage to face his accusers without shame. There can be no doubt that he truly was the "greatest man who ever lived". His courage, trust and faith were all bound (like his hands) and directed towards a power higher, and greater than himself.
    I find it disturbing how the world literally paints a picture of an impoverished, sad faced and ill stricken man who by all appearences is unable to defend himself. Is this (picture of a man) someone you would put your trust in? Certianly not I.

    I prefer instead, to believe that jesus Christ was nothing short of the absolute personification of his Father, my God, your God and his God that truly did send his very best representative to this earth in our behalf. To tout ourselves as true christian and yet believe anything less than that, makes a mockery of who God truly is and the sacrifice he himself made in providing his own son in our defense.
    How much courage can anyone imagin is needed to stand, with your hands bound, along side the very person (Pontius Pilate) who has scourged you just short of death, and to be jeered by not just your own people, but also by the high priests who go about the selling of lies in the very synagogue built in behalf of your God.
    Now, there are those who have referred to me in this blog as someone not fully trusting in Jesus. Nothing could be farther from the truth. There is no end to my faith and trust in Jesus Christ has the one who so willingly and lovingly handed over his perfect human soul, just so that someone like myself, me of all people, might have the hope for everlasting life.

    In closing i will say that i trust in God as the creator of all things, and i believe in the Christ as my ransomer. And the church, well, its on its own.

    May 1, 2011 at 12:46 pm |
  4. scott501

    Didnt a lot of molestation happen on this CEO's watch?

    May 1, 2011 at 10:20 am |
  5. MartyTInOZ

    Of all of the really stupid practices of organized religions in general, sainthood (i.e.essentially the deification of dead hums by humans that will one day be dead themselves) is high amongst the most ridiculous/ludicrous/laughable!

    May 1, 2011 at 3:31 am |
    • CNN teacher

      @Marty..Was Ahmed your seatmate?

      May 1, 2011 at 5:09 am |
  6. hmed

    i have a few questions and i have looked for answers >
    is jesus is God?
    or if he GOD son??
    and whos fathers jesus?i
    its impossible because in bible the God is one >>soooo jesus in not God he is messenger of God and he wasnt killed ..

    May 1, 2011 at 3:17 am |
    • Thomas

      Jesus Christ is the son of David, his earthly father. His Spiritual Father, and the Father of all of humankind is God, the Eternal Father. Jesus Christ is part of what is known as the Godhead. The Father, The Son, and the Holy Ghost. God, our Heavenly Father has a ressurected body of flesh and bones as does Jesus Christ. The Holy Ghost is a personage of Spirit and is also a God, but has no body. The concept of a "Trinity" – 3 Gods in one, is a deceptive notion of the Devil. We ALL lived with our Father in Heaven, and His son Jesus Christ before we came to this earth to receive a body. Jesus Christ was foreordained to be the Saviour of the world. Thus he was the only sinless person and also gave his life for ALL of Heavenly Father's children. There was a war in Heaven and Lucifer with a 1/3 of his angeles were cast out. He became the devil and his angeles, and they rejected the Plan of Salvation whereby Jesus Christ was atone for all of our sins. Thus the devil and his angeles do not have bodies, but are spirits sent to this earth to tempt us. Jesus Chirst is the God of the Old Testament and his law of Moses was given to Him by God the Father. It was a "schoolmaster" of ordiances and performances to bring the jews to Christ; but when he came in the flesh, they killed their King. When Jesus was baptised of John the Baptist in the river Jordon, we hear the voice of God the Father from Heaven saying "This is my beloved son, in whom I am well pleased." (Matthew 3:17) KJV. So because Jesus Christ was perfect in all of God's commandments, He is a God himself. Only a God could overcome he bands of death; "As in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive" (1 Cor. 15:22) KJV. The Holy Ghost is a revelator and testifier of ALL truth and He bear witness of the Father and the Son.

      May 1, 2011 at 3:51 am |
    • CNN teacher

      hmed..just go back after you passed 2nd grade.

      May 1, 2011 at 5:05 am |
    • jimtanker

      @ Thomas

      How could the fictional character of Jesus have had a father if he was born of a virgin mother.


      May 1, 2011 at 5:45 am |
    • Paul (Adelaide, Australia)

      @Thomas: You forgot to begin with "Once upon a time"...

      May 1, 2011 at 6:50 am |
    • TJDJL

      Thomas, what a believer you are in all things Biblical. Have you ever wondered about the world, about life, and drawn your own conclusions, or do you simply accept on faith what was written down by men almost 2000 years ago, men who were seeking positions of religious authority over the mostly ignorant of their time?
      But even if it is true that God allowed the sacrifice of Jesus so that the rest of the human race from that point forward could be forgiven of their sins, doesn't that mean God made a horrific mistake in the creation of the human being? Having to sacrifice the perfect (Jesus) for the imperfect (mankind) is a very strong indication that something horribly wrong had happened.

      May 1, 2011 at 1:49 pm |
  7. Thomas

    Unfornunately the Priesthood authority does not reside with the Pope. He in fact has no authority or "keys" that were given to him. So all this hype is for nothing.

    May 1, 2011 at 1:30 am |
  8. Phil

    "Bring out your dead"

    May 1, 2011 at 1:05 am |
    • Monty

      I'm not quite dead yet.

      May 1, 2011 at 3:21 am |
  9. markjuliansmith

    The ultimate Job for the boys.

    May 1, 2011 at 12:55 am |
  10. Paul (Adelaide, Australia)

    So all those years of protecting the paedophiles and perverts are now paying off for JP II in the posthumous popularity contest that is sainthood. Clearly, supporting mass murdering dictators hasn't gone out of fashion since the 1940's either...
    If anyone else went around digging up corpses, venerating body parts and bodily fluids, symbolically consuming human flesh and blood, as well as paying/praying to resurrect the dead, you would assume they were part of some deep jungle voodoo cult or escapee from an insane asylum. What a vile, twisted and sick (not to mention delusional) group this is.
    End their tax exempt status and let's see what truly remains once the cash cow is gone.

    May 1, 2011 at 12:30 am |
  11. Steve (the real one)

    Glad you said that. I wonder how many of his own citizens this man killed . How much land he stole from farmers solely because of skin color. One thing is for certain as long as he is at the Vatican, he cannot reek havoc at home!

    April 30, 2011 at 7:56 pm |
    • jsaiditfirst

      That he entertains a mass murderer (just as they had done in wwii and even croatia) signifies the churches continued deep ties with hidden powers

      May 1, 2011 at 1:13 am |
    • kenneth(nigeria)

      am also glad you said that steve atleast that implies that you also are aware of the thievery of the west. when you accuse mugabe, dont forget the many sons of africa that tho west carted off. dont forget the many lands that were stolen from the nationals in zimbabwe, kenya, nigeria, south africa and other fertile african climes. but have they been hindered the worship of God? have they been stopped from going to any church? the problem of mugabe cannot (as it has been clearly shown) be solved by sanction upon sanction. i pray that one of the miracles of the late pontiff should be mugabe's conversion.

      May 1, 2011 at 3:09 am |
    • wipeOut

      Ey steve..good to see you here and to know that your holier than thou.

      May 1, 2011 at 5:13 am |
  12. jsaiditfirst

    From Jesus teachings, the apostle Paul well knew that true christians would fall away from their faith, not in Christ, but in their continueing endeavor to seek out accurate knowledge of God. This was the apostasy which had been foretold, and in his letter to first century christians in Corrinth, he reminded them about the consequences of false idealogy that could contaminate and corrupt the congregation.

    He addresses the matter quite eloquently in 2 Corr 6:14:
    Do not become unevenly yoked with unbelievers. For what fellowship do righteousness and lawlessness have? Or what sharing does light have with darkness? 15 Further, what harmony is there between Christ and Be′li‧al? Or what portion does a faithful person have with an unbeliever? 16 And what agreement does God’s temple have with idols? For we are a temple of a living God; just as God said: “I shall reside among them and walk among [them], and I shall be their God, and they will be my people.” 17 “‘Therefore get out from among them, and separate yourselves,’ says God, ‘and quit touching the unclean thing’”; “‘and I will take YOU in.’” 18 “‘And I shall be a father to YOU, and YOU will be sons and daughters to me,’ says the Almighty.”

    Certianly this man Mugabe represents the darkness that the apostle Paul warned of, and if so, and were the Vatican the "light" they claim to be, they would have no bussiness with one another, would they?

    It's obviouse that Pope Benedict the XVI, like his predecessor, John Paul, and the church they represent, share a common thread with this ruthless dictator Mugabe

    April 30, 2011 at 7:50 pm |
    • kenneth(nigeria)

      J why is your theology so shallow?how you forget that christ came for the sinners and not righteous people like you and the pharisees of his time. how you forget that what you now accuse the papacy and the church of was first said of christ "HE WELCOMES TAX COLLECTORS AND DINES WITH SINNERS" how you forget that the church has a special ministration to the sinners. how you ignore the log in your eye and seek to remove the splinter in the church.

      May 1, 2011 at 3:02 am |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.