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July 14th, 2011
05:11 AM ET

Irish report damns Catholic Church abuse response

By Richard Allen Greene, CNN

The Catholic Church in Ireland did not take serious steps to stamp out child abuse by priests even after the scandal blew up worldwide and the Irish bishops put rules in place to stop it, a new report says.

The report demolishes claims by the Catholic Church there that policies it put in place in 1996 have enabled it to get a handle on the problem.

The Church's explanation that it was on a "learning curve" in handling allegations of abuse "could not have had any basis or relevance in Cloyne," said the report, which focuses on the diocese of Cloyne around Cork in southern Ireland.

Ireland's top churchman, Cardinal Sean Brady, called the report "another dark day in the history of the response of Church leaders to the cry of children abused by Church personnel."

Ireland's Foreign Ministry summoned the Vatican representative in the country, Archbishop Giuseppe Leanza, for talks with Foreign Minister Eamon Gilmore on Thursday following the publication of the report.

The report accuses Bishop John Magee, who was responsible for policing abuse in his diocese, of not backing the policy himself and failing to take action against abusers.

"Magee took little or no active interest" in child sex abuse cases for 12 years after the new policy was put in place, the report says, and Monsignor Denis O'Callaghan, who ended up in de facto charge of policing abuse "did not approve of the requirement to report to the civil authorities," the comprehensive report says.

Allegations of abuse within the diocese of Cloyne were so worrying that the Church appointed a special administrator to oversee it.

That archbishop, Dermot Clifford, said he accepted the findings of the report and "humbly apologized" to victims and their families.

And he expressed horror that the church did not act on its anti-abuse policies.

"It appalls me that, up to 2008, 13 years after these procedures were put in place, they were still not being implemented in the Diocese of Cloyne" Clifford said in a statement.

Clifford said Magee and O'Callaghan "accepted full responsibility and apologized for their failures."

Pope Benedict XVI accepted Magee's resignation as bishop of Cloyne in March 2010.

The report also details allegations against Magee himself.

A man referred to by the pseudonym "Joseph" reports that Magee held him in "protracted" embraces, asked him if it "felt good," kissed him on the forehead, told him that he loved him, and said he had dreamed about him.

"Joseph" considered the attention paternal at the time, he told the report's authors, but later reconsidered in light of reports into abuse and raised the issue with another priest.

"I began to think that maybe it wasn't as innocent as I originally thought or assumed it was," he says. He says the events occurred when he was 17 and 18 years old.

The priest to whom Joseph complained reported the matter to the church's own child protection authorities, who considered it "inappropriate" but ruled it did not constitute abuse.

They did not report it to the police but did tell Magee about the accusation and reported it to church officials as high as Cardinal Brady and the Vatican's representative in Ireland, the report says.

Joseph took the issue to the police, who also told him it did not constitute abuse, the report says.

The Vatican also failed to back Irish anti-abuse rules introduced in 1996, saying they were not official policy, according to the report, which was released Wednesday.

While it focuses on the diocese of Cloyne, it follows four earlier independent reports into abuse by Catholic priests and officials in Ireland going back decades.

The 421-page report, which is partially redacted, details complaints against 19 clerics in the diocese between 1996 and 2009.

CNN's Carol Jordan and Journalist Peter Taggart contributed to this report.

- Newsdesk editor, The CNN Wire

Filed under: Catholic Church • Ireland • Scandal • Sex abuse

soundoff (624 Responses)
  1. Catholic church child victim of gang sod--om--my at age 9, the first at age 8

    The scandal is larger in the USA. We victims of abuse know the abiusers from all walks. However the catholic church is the one organization that lobbies to stop exposure, to protect the pedo-philes first. All families and victims lose, no matter who abused.

    The difference is that the Irish were strong enough to hold the catholic church accountable. The US politicians protect this organization to preserve catholic votes. One politician in Syracuse NY, Senator Defransisco, knew the bishop abused me at age 8 and this bishop protected other pedos. Yet he gave the pedophile bishop a plaque PAID for by New York tax payers, maybe to help deflect from the truth. This plaque praised this pedo-philes work. Meanwhile many victims are mentally ill and others committed suicide due to the abuses. A Bill in New York to expose pedos, no matter who the pedo, was squashed in a committee by this same NY senators participation.

    One mother of a suicide victim in the same diocese as the bishop cried to her dead, she fought hard to expose laws, but lost.

    The catholic church lobbies to stop laws that would expose all pedo-philes. New York senators cater to the catholic church over the truth of victims. The truth is the greatest healer, the catholic church denies victims and families healing, with the help of a few senators. Two of those pedo-philes held a camp for disadvantaged boys, we could do nothing and the parishioners praise them – not knowing the truth.

    Watch those who protect the curch post against this one, rather than to demand the truth exposed. Why not ask for truth exposed? Is asking for the truth so anti-jesus?

    July 16, 2011 at 8:47 am |
  2. christianmother

    @William I see you here on this blog still being an idiot. Why are you so angry about everyone's religion? ??

    July 16, 2011 at 6:20 am |
    • fimeilleur

      Why? Because your religion tries to impose itself on our daily lives. Stop trying to block stemcell research, stop killing abortion providers, stop blocking Doctor assisted suicide, Stop INTERFERING! When your god proves himself to us, THEN and ONLY then, will we consider his opinions on these subjects.

      July 17, 2011 at 2:12 am |
  3. SnowVeil

    The Irish need to trust in Jesus as a nation again.

    July 16, 2011 at 1:21 am |
  4. SnowVeil

    There are many fakes of me on this page, even using my former user names. Atheists always lie and lying is no problem to them because they have no faith but in filthy themselves.

    July 16, 2011 at 1:20 am |
    • Why attack atheists?

      It is good people who do good works, that includes the religious, atheists and realist. Why must you discriminate against good people? Organizations do nothing, it’s people.

      July 16, 2011 at 8:55 am |
    • SnowVeil

      @Why-, you should call upon your fellow atheists to be authentic and honest though it'll be impossible.

      July 16, 2011 at 9:17 am |
    • Beilever

      I agree, it is all good people who do good works and that includes atheists. In fact the media, made up of all different groups, bring out awareness when help is needed. The USA, made up of all different groups – including atheists, is the largest contributor to good works. Yes, tax dollars paid for by all Americans is the largest, by far, contributor to help those in need. No other organization comes close. Keep in mind that religious organizations also get tax dolars as grant money too.
      Though we are not competing here, we are only being truthful. Please speak the truth now..

      July 16, 2011 at 9:26 am |
    • pfeffernusse

      @SnowVeil,

      “Do not judge, and you will not be judged. Do not condemn, and you will not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.”
      Luke 6:37

      You are also bearing false witness, which, if I’m not mistaken, is on the Top Ten No-No’s List. When you say, “Atheists always lie and lying is no problem to them because they have no faith but in filthy themselves”, you are lying. I am an atheist. I don’t like lying. I avoid it at all costs. Also, I happen to be very altruistic and I understand that it’s not all about me. I’m pretty sure I am not unique in these feelings.

      Perhaps you should concentrate on living up to the tenants of your faith, as your savior calls you to do. Otherwise, you would be a hypocrite and a very poor representatives of Christians and Jesus.

      July 21, 2011 at 3:37 pm |
  5. Norm - not that one

    Wake up! The bottom line problem, here, is: Can a national or international organization (who has the right to create its own rues and regulation – and image), use that, AND one hell of a lot of pompous, self serving, arrogance, as an excuse to absolve itself from following the rules, legislation and laws of Nations?
    All too often, the RCC and the Pope have acted as though they (and their organizations) are above everyone elses laws and legal rules.
    In this instance, the RCC is acting more like the Mafia, than any honorable religion.

    July 15, 2011 at 5:25 pm |
  6. Adelina

    The pope does the work of the Devil and quit living in sin.

    July 15, 2011 at 5:18 pm |
    • fimeilleur

      your meds are wearing off...

      July 15, 2011 at 6:03 pm |
  7. SnowVeil

    I love you ZeldalinaSent.

    July 15, 2011 at 4:09 pm |
    • News Flash

      @FredericadelinaSentrainVeilOdessaHeaven,
      What are you wearing ?

      July 16, 2011 at 8:45 am |
  8. scandalized

    this is an example of a foreign power (vatican city state) interfering with the internal business of another country – ireland

    July 15, 2011 at 3:09 pm |
    • Out of control

      The catholic church has even more influence in the USA. The Catholic Bishops lobby to ensure they keep getting grant money and they lobby to stop exposure of their crimes. (Catholic church employs more grant writers than any other organization. What you believe is good works through donations, is mostly US tax payer dollars. <– Fact)

      July 16, 2011 at 8:59 am |
  9. Xlpain

    Men of god ayyyyy? Strengthening my belief that organized religion is crap, find spirituality in your own way, not in a church where you are lied to and children are abused

    July 15, 2011 at 2:12 pm |
  10. Rainer Braendlein

    The Church of the little Christs. A riddle?

    Why isn't the pope able to abolish celibacy?

    If you remove the plug of the bathtub, the water disappears.

    If the pope would remove celibacy, Roman Catholic Church would disappear.

    How is this possible?

    According to the doctrine of the RCC, every priest is a small Christ (a priest is "in persona Christi"). They believe, an Eucharist is solely vaild on the condition that it is celebrated by a consecrated priest that means by a little Jesus Christ. They believe the blood and body of Christ would be offered again at every Eucharist.

    They even belief, a once consecrated priest can never become a ordinary man again. By consecration a man gets really changed into a little Jesus Christ.

    Also they believe, Christ and the Holy Spirit would be solely present in the Church by the presence of the priests and bishops and the pope. The priest and the bishops are vehicles or bearers of the Holy Spirit.

    They misinterpret Mattew 19: 12: The Lord had told the apostels, it would be very, very hard to remain without wife. Only people, having a very special gift you risk it. The RCC says, the verse would mean, following Christ would mean renounce marriage.

    It seems, they think like this: Either a wife or Christ. Either you marry and become no priest (little Christ) or you renounce marriage and become a little Christ (that is according to paragraph 1618 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church, where it is written that marriage and the "full-connection" with Christ cannot be united.)

    July 15, 2011 at 11:20 am |
    • Rainer Braendlein

      To sum it up:

      Christ was not married, thus the RCC believes, priests are not allowed to marry, because they are little Christs.

      That is, what I have figured out.

      July 15, 2011 at 11:31 am |
    • Rainer Braendlein

      The mystery of RCC Eucharist:

      Host and wine are changed into the "body and blood" of Christ by the priest, who is a Christ-Wizard or a Christ-Mage.

      Never attend an RCC Eucharist, it is an occult ceremony. And never eat that crap, or do you want to receive Satan's ghost?

      RCC = Roman Catholic Church

      July 15, 2011 at 12:02 pm |
    • Artist

      Christ didn't marry because he liked to lay with his apostles.

      July 15, 2011 at 12:54 pm |
    • Rainer Braendlein

      @Artist

      He, whom you mock, will judge you. Maybe now.

      July 15, 2011 at 1:06 pm |
    • Artist

      Rainer Braendlein

      @Artist

      He, whom you mock, will judge you. Maybe now.

      ----------–
      Perhaps, perhaps not. I do not fear judgement from any of the gods. I have yet found one worthy to respect or worship. So far they have done a p! ss poor job. I would rather face judgement than lie and smile at a god.

      July 15, 2011 at 1:13 pm |
    • A little Christ asnwers the riddle. and puts the plug back in the bathub and makes the water reappear

      @Artist
      Maybe not.

      July 15, 2011 at 2:48 pm |
    • Adelina

      You mock Jesus being gay as if it is wrong.

      July 15, 2011 at 5:19 pm |
  11. AvdBerg

    In our view the issue is not going to go away but even get worse! We have been involved in the dialogue on this issue in our local community for more than twenty years. In our area there are presently more than 400 church properties for Sale to help pay for a Settlement for victims. For a better understanding of the subject issue we invite you to read the many entries of the Current Events page and a number of articles listed on our website http://www.aworlddeceived.ca

    July 15, 2011 at 10:28 am |
    • geraldh

      Looks like your just plugging a book. Tell me, unless the words in the book are taking DIRECTLY out of scripture how is it not an interpretation of scripture?

      July 15, 2011 at 11:06 am |
    • AvdBerg

      @geraldh

      Most of the key Chapters are listed on the website and nothing is written without the use of Scriptural References. If you read anything that you think is false and you are able to confirm it with the Word of God, please do write us and we will remove the whole article. In twenty six years of service we have never had to remove anything as people have been unable to prove us wrong. Rather, our writings are based on the Spirit of Truth, whom the world cannot receive (John 14:17).

      July 15, 2011 at 2:30 pm |
    • Bucky Ball

      psssttt Gerald
      "unless the words in the book are taking DIRECTLY out of scripture how is it not an interpretation of scripture?"
      -- There are NO original editions of ANY book in those texts. They are ALL translations of translations of translations.
      There is NOTHING except "interpretation". Beside THAT fact, there is also the one that just your picking out, (ie reading), a line from one of the translations, in itself, IS / INVOLVES another "interpretation".

      July 15, 2011 at 3:22 pm |
  12. RightTurnClyde

    All of my comments today have been ate .. gone

    July 15, 2011 at 9:43 am |
    • Bucky Ball

      Except this one ?
      Assuming you are not being filtered by email name, or moniker, or the "bad word" list, then there must be another factor in play. It may be frequency or length or both. How often in, say, 5 minutes, do you post how many characters ? Are they long postings ? Have you tried to break them up ? Once, when I first came here, got a pop-up from CNN that said I was posting too often. It never happened again, but may be a part of the filter.

      July 15, 2011 at 10:23 am |
    • William Demuth

      Jesus is gunnin for you dude.

      Belt out some Our Fathers real quick, and make sure your PC is properly grounded.

      July 15, 2011 at 10:44 am |
    • News Flash

      Change your name, and see what happens.

      July 15, 2011 at 11:10 am |
    • Bucky's Evil Immaginary Twin

      Bingo.

      July 15, 2011 at 11:12 am |
    • Bucky's Evil Imaginary Twin

      oops 😈

      July 15, 2011 at 11:16 am |
  13. SnowVeil

    Another German descent beside Dietrich Bohoeffer whom every German must know:
    "Saint Maximilian Maria Kolbe (8 January 1894 – 14 August 1941) was a Pole of German ethnic heritage and a Conventual Franciscan friar, who volunteered to die in place of a stranger in the Nazi German concentration camp of Auschwitz, located in German-occupied Poland during World War II." (from Wikipedia)

    July 15, 2011 at 8:40 am |
    • William Demuth

      And how is that relevant?

      The WHOLE United States Marine Corp volunteers to die for strangers EVERY day, and they do not support child buggery.

      Your church is a cabal of deviants who torment and exploit BILLIONS.

      Your days are drawing to an end. Now its OUR turn to judge you.

      July 15, 2011 at 8:48 am |
    • RightTurnClyde

      sobering .. talk about the entire USMC.. (and the USMC is less than a corps .. but an Army is 3 corps .. 75,000 to 90,000 ) and then .. USAF and USN ..even the USCG was in Vietnam http // www virtualwall org/iStates.htm

      July 15, 2011 at 9:16 am |
    • Bucky Ball

      @William
      The question raised here, (as I see this), is just because some religious people do good, does that mean good would NOT be
      done if they were not religious. I see that as a fallacy, and an unfounded, (indeed insulting) assumption. Non-religious people do good all the time, everywhere, and religious people do not have a monopoly on doing good.

      July 15, 2011 at 9:45 am |
    • William Demuth

      Plus Bucky, it is my experience that the winners write the history, and LOTS of folks believe nonesense.

      I had a huge debate with my daughter this morning about who suffered more and contributed more to the defeating of the Nazi's.

      She whole heartedly believes the US played a more pivotal role than the Russians. No amount of thruth can change her perception. She has a master degree, yet her mind is STILL closed.

      We are an obstinate race!

      July 15, 2011 at 10:48 am |
  14. SnowVeil

    @Rainer, child abuse was norm in human societies until the Catholic and Protestant Church corrected and educated the world. You just have no idea how valuable and essential celibacy is to the Catholic servants of God. Parents and teachers may need your lecture, not Catholic priests or nuns.

    July 15, 2011 at 8:34 am |
    • William Demuth

      Priests bugger little boys.

      They are damaged goods that are RECRUITED because they can't function in normal society.

      July 15, 2011 at 8:39 am |
    • Rainer Braendlein

      Why isn't the pope able to abolish celibacy?

      If you remove the plug of the bathtub, the water disappears.

      If the pope would remove celibacy, Roman Catholic Church would disappear.

      How is this possible?

      According to the doctrine of the RCC, every priest is a small Christ (a priest is "in persona Christi"). They believe, an Eucharist is solely vaild on the condition that it is celebrated by a consecrated priest that means by a little Jesus Christ. They believe the blood and body of Christ would be offered again at every Eucharist.

      They even belief, a once consecrated priest can never become a ordinary man again. By consecration a man gets really changed into a little Jesus Christ.

      Also they believe, Christ and the Holy Spirit would be solely present in the Church by the presence of the priests and bishops and the pope. The priest and the bishops are vehicles or bearers of the Holy Spirit.

      They misinterpret Mattew 19: 12: The Lord had told the apostels, it would be very, very hard to remain without wife. Only people, having a very special gift you risk it. The RCC says, the verse would mean, following Christ would mean renounce marriage.

      It seems, they think like this: Either a wife or Christ. Either you marry and become no priest (little Christ) or you renounce marriage and become a little Christ (that is according to paragraph 1618 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church, where it is written that marriage and the "full-connection" with Christ cannot be united.)

      How can celibacy be finished? Only one solution: Chase the pope away!

      July 15, 2011 at 11:18 am |
    • Artist

      I see Adelina is back with yet another name.

      July 15, 2011 at 1:14 pm |
    • Scott

      Didn't you read the story? Mybe you did. Infact your right they don't need ledtures, they need prison

      July 15, 2011 at 9:44 pm |
  15. SnowVeil

    Celibacy is the most honorable and sacrificial Christian discipline for Jesus in Catholic Church. It must not be abolished unless Pope so decides.

    July 15, 2011 at 8:29 am |
    • Rainer Braendlein

      @SnowVeil

      We are about to chase the pope away. Then we will abolish celibacy, this devilish bollocks.

      July 15, 2011 at 8:36 am |
    • William Demuth

      Hopefully he shall be assainated for all of his evils

      July 15, 2011 at 8:40 am |
    • SnowVeil

      Rainer, the Pope is a man of God.

      July 15, 2011 at 8:42 am |
    • RightTurnClyde

      Celibacy is a perversion .. by and for perverts

      July 15, 2011 at 9:20 am |
    • fimeilleur

      @ SnowVeil,
      – the Pope is a man of God.

      No the Pope is a man, because there is no god, he cannot be a "man of the figment of your imagination", he must assume responcibilty for his actions... including facilitation of the r ape of children. Under Pope JPII, it was HIS job to help conceil the evils of the RCC.

      July 15, 2011 at 9:22 am |
    • Bucky Ball

      The practice of using, creating, and maintaining professional eunuchs in not unique to Catholicism. Indeed it has a long and widespread history in many religions and cultures.

      "The practice of religious castration continued into the Christian era, with members of the early church castrating themselves for religious purposes, although the extent and even the existence of this practice among Christians is subject to debate. The early theologian Origen found scriptural justification for the practice in Matthew 19:12,.[42] where Jesus says, "For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by others, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Let anyone accept this who can." (NRSV)

      Tertullian, a 2nd century Church Father, described Jesus himself and Paul of Tarsus as spadones, which is translated as "eunuchs" in some contexts. Quoting from the cited book: "...Tertullian takes 'spado' to mean virgin...". The meaning of spado in late antiquity can be interpreted as a metaphor for celibacy, however Tertullian's specifically refers to St. Paul as being castrated.

      For a more complete discussion of this subject see : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eunuch

      July 15, 2011 at 10:00 am |
    • geraldh

      Rainer, celibacy is recommended by both paul and jesus. See Matt 19 and 1 Cor 7. Better start reading your bible dude.

      July 15, 2011 at 11:08 am |
    • Scott

      You say that like it's a good thing.

      July 15, 2011 at 9:45 pm |
  16. Rainer Braendlein

    Concerning the issue of child abuse we must have a short look on ecclesiastical history.

    The history of the Church started in Jerusalem. After Christ's ascension and the arrival of the Holy Spirit the disciples started to gather within the Temple, that they you used as a church building. The Temple of Jerusalem was the first Christian cathedral. Besides many small congregations in Israel, Antiochia became the second center of Christianity. Antiochia was the home church of St. Paul. In the course of time the Church spreaded from Israel to Asia Minor (today Turkey) and Greece and Italy.

    It is interesting how the Church in Jerusalem developed. According to Acts, first the 12 apostles were deciding. But we should not imagine that they ruled like kings or bosses or like any earthly rulers. The 12 apostles were "guardians of God's mysteries". They had lived together with the Lord for years and were witnesses of his death and resurrection. Christ was the cornerstone of the Church and they were the foundation stones of the Church. They had a profound knowledge of the Christian doctrine, which they had received by Christ. Their capability to teach the truth gave them a supremacy within the Church (of course, the were not greedy for power). Within any company the elders just have a supremacy, because they have a lot of experience and knowledge. In the course of time the Church of Jerusalem elected elders. This shows that the apostles did not want to hold on any power (a real clergy will never reach out for power, but will take care of the souls of his brothers and sisters). When there were questions about the doctrine, the apostel, the elders and the whole congregation gathered, in order to figure out the truth, led by the Holy Spirit. Read Acts, and check it out.

    In conclusion: The Early Church did not know any papacy. They had more or less a parlamentary system (influenced by the Holy Spirit).

    What has all this to do with child abuse?

    Answer: The Roman Catholic Church (controled by the pope) has developed out of the Christian Church (parlamentary ruled). From her (RCC) very biginning the wicked popes tried to concentrate all power within the Church on themselves. This is an ongoing process, that has not yet finished. The RCC more and more becomes a body (in the real sense of the word) with the pope as its head.

    Arround 1000 years after Christ the wicked Roman Catholic clergy decided to establish mandatory celebacy, which was not known within in Church up to this point of time. The clergy wanted to prevent ordinary Christians (laymen) for reaching out for ecclesiastical offices. Up to 1000 after Christ elders or bishops were simply elected from the congregation. By preventing married men of a local congregation from holding ecclesiastical offices, the pope wanted to make sure that he had the control over every single congregation.

    This system we still have within the RCC today. The priests are not eclected from the midst of the congregation, but imposed on the congregation by the pope.

    Thus, child abuse is a consequence of the wicked pope's greed for power, honour and money. The pope established celibacy, in order to increase his power, but as side effect of celibacy he has caused child abuse.

    Chase the pope away, and become happy! No celibacy, no crime!

    Note: Only a few people can live in celibacy without losing their hormonal balance. Better touching my wife, than any child!

    Additon:

    Up to the time when celibacy was established, the German Catholic Church was still somewhat independent from the pope. Then a reactionary group emerged and fighted for more influence of the pope on the German Church. One of their claims was celibacy.

    July 15, 2011 at 8:25 am |
    • JT

      The other main reason for celebacy is quite basic...money. Married men would pass their wealth down to their children or spouse but a non-married man would send the wealth back to the church. It's all about greed and power and suckers still flock to this cult to this day no matter what atrocities this cult perform.

      July 15, 2011 at 9:20 am |
    • The Bobinator

      > Concerning the issue of child abuse we must have a short look on ecclesiastical history.

      No, we don't. It should not occur and if it does, those who acted upon it and those who permitted it should be brought to justice.

      > The history of the Church started in Jerusalem. After Christ's ascension and the arrival of the Holy Spirit the disciples started to gather within the Temple, that they you used as a church building. The Temple of Jerusalem was the first Christian cathedral. Besides many small congregations in Israel, Antiochia became the second center of Christianity. Antiochia was the home church of St. Paul. In the course of time the Church spreaded from Israel to Asia Minor (today Turkey) and Greece and Italy.

      > It is interesting how the Church in Jerusalem developed. According to Acts, first the 12 apostles were deciding. But we should not imagine that they ruled like kings or bosses or like any earthly rulers. The 12 apostles were "guardians of God's mysteries". They had lived together with the Lord for years and were witnesses of his death and resurrection. Christ was the cornerstone of the Church and they were the foundation stones of the Church. They had a profound knowledge of the Christian doctrine, which they had received by Christ. Their capability to teach the truth gave them a supremacy within the Church (of course, the were not greedy for power). Within any company the elders just have a supremacy, because they have a lot of experience and knowledge. In the course of time the Church of Jerusalem elected elders. This shows that the apostles did not want to hold on any power (a real clergy will never reach out for power, but will take care of the souls of his brothers and sisters). When there were questions about the doctrine, the apostel, the elders and the whole congregation gathered, in order to figure out the truth, led by the Holy Spirit. Read Acts, and check it out.

      > In conclusion: The Early Church did not know any papacy. They had more or less a parlamentary system (influenced by the Holy Spirit).

      > What has all this to do with child abuse?

      Nothing? You're trying to intellectually seperate the acts of men you'd normally consider good so that you can feel better about your faith?

      > Answer: The Roman Catholic Church (controled by the pope) has developed out of the Christian Church (parlamentary ruled). From her (RCC) very biginning the wicked popes tried to concentrate all power within the Church on themselves. This is an ongoing process, that has not yet finished. The RCC more and more becomes a body (in the real sense of the word) with the pope as its head.

      Really? Can you tell me why Jesus endorsed slavery, which I consider to be a much worse act then buggering a kid. At least when you bugger a kid the child isn't a slave for all his life. At least he's not property to be used and abused.

      > Arround 1000 years after Christ the wicked Roman Catholic clergy decided to establish mandatory celebacy, which was not known within in Church up to this point of time. The clergy wanted to prevent ordinary Christians (laymen) for reaching out for ecclesiastical offices. Up to 1000 after Christ elders or bishops were simply elected from the congregation. By preventing married men of a local congregation from holding ecclesiastical offices, the pope wanted to make sure that he had the control over every single congregation.

      More moronic rambling. You don't need to dance around a point if it's valid.

      > This system we still have within the RCC today. The priests are not eclected from the midst of the congregation, but imposed on the congregation by the pope.

      So what?

      > Thus, child abuse is a consequence of the wicked pope's greed for power, honour and money. The pope established celibacy, in order to increase his power, but as side effect of celibacy he has caused child abuse.

      Wow, you're a moron. So because the church didn't approve a pope, therefore the pope is the cause of this. Idioicy.

      > Chase the pope away, and become happy! No celibacy, no crime!

      There are cases of evangelicals doing nasty things too. Doesn't this refute your point?

      > Note: Only a few people can live in celibacy without losing their hormonal balance. Better touching my wife, than any child!

      ?

      > Up to the time when celibacy was established, the German Catholic Church was still somewhat independent from the pope. Then a reactionary group emerged and fighted for more influence of the pope on the German Church. One of their claims was celibacy.

      More moronic rambling. I'm beginning to wonder if you're not borderline retarded.

      July 15, 2011 at 9:32 am |
    • geraldh

      JT, how can the issue be money when the priest does not own the parish, the Bishop does not own the diocese? Therefore he has no right to pass it to his family.

      July 15, 2011 at 11:12 am |
    • geraldh

      Rainer,

      The funny thing about your theories is they are not based on reality. First of all as a Catholic I in no way feel "ruled" by the Pope in the manner which you claim. He is not a dictator over the Church and diocese in general are autonomous. Only in issues requiring commonality does the Pope make decisions. With regard to celibacy, if it were the cause of abuse because of lack of contact with women, then why is it that the incidence of child abuse is higher in the general population and I dare say even among protestant pastors if you check the research of Phil Jenkins who is a protestant professor who has studied the matter?

      July 15, 2011 at 11:16 am |
    • gerald

      Rainer,

      If child abuse is a catholic problem related to celibacy then why are all these protestant pastors who are married child abusers?

      http://stopbaptistpredators.org/news.html

      July 15, 2011 at 11:37 am |
    • gerald

      Some more articles related to my last post.

      http://www.reformation.com

      July 15, 2011 at 11:37 am |
    • A little Christ asnwers the riddle. and puts the plug back in the bathub and makes the water reappear

      The "funny thing" about Rainer and gerald discussing what is "based on reality" is that it'ss like the Red Queen telling Pinocchio he is a figment.

      July 15, 2011 at 3:10 pm |
  17. SnowVeil

    The Church alone has always fought against every kind of sin, protecting the integrity of humanity and innocent people. This guy Reality just missed it, as usual.

    July 15, 2011 at 7:39 am |
    • Adelina

      My blinders are securely in place, as usual

      July 15, 2011 at 7:53 am |
    • SnowVeil

      The above Adelina is a fake. Atheists stalk and bully.

      July 15, 2011 at 8:00 am |
    • The Bobinator

      If you can make that claim, then you're completely ignorant of your faith's history.

      July 15, 2011 at 9:34 am |
    • SnowVeil

      I'm the real Adelina and I love her carnally.

      July 15, 2011 at 5:01 pm |
    • Artist

      SnowVeil

      The above Adelina is a fake. Atheists stalk and bully.

      ----
      That is because you are the Adelina. Pathetic but still funny.

      July 15, 2011 at 5:17 pm |
    • Scott

      If the liberties of the American people are ever destroyed, they will fall by the hands of the clergy.

      –General Marquis De Lafayette, 1789

      July 15, 2011 at 9:57 pm |
  18. Reality

    Why did today's pope, prelates, preachers and rabbis, so focused on society's se-xual sins, lose sight of clerical se-xual sins?

    FEAR, SHAME and GUILT and COVER IT ALL UP!!!

    Obviously ordination in any religion is not assurance of good behavior !!!!!

    Neither is coronation!!! e.g. Henry VIII, King David.

    Neither is marriage as 50% of those men convicted of pedophilia are married.

    Neither is being elected president of the USA!! e.g. Billy "I did not have se-x with that girl" Clinton, John "Marilyn Monroe" Kennedy"

    Neither is possessing super athletic skill!!! e.g. Tiger "I am so sorry for getting caught" Woods.

    Neither is being an atheist or pagan since pedophilia is present in all walks of life.

    If someone is guilty of a crime in this litany of "neithers" they should or should have been penalized as the law dictates to include jail terms for pedophiliacs (priests, rabbis, evangelicals, boy scout leaders, married men/women), divorce for adultery (Clinton, Kennedy, Woods), jail terms for obstruction of justice (Clinton, Cardinal Law, Bishop Magee) and the death penalty or life in prison for murder ("Kings David and Henry VIII).
    +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    July 15, 2011 at 7:31 am |
    • William Demuth

      Huh?

      None of these people calim divine providence, and none of these people have taken the bung holes of little boys as their personal pumping station.

      I hope one of the victims gets to educate in an alley behind your demonic church.

      July 15, 2011 at 8:45 am |
    • Reality

      Some words of wisdom for posting on William D's refrigerator:

      SAVING 1.5 BILLION LOST MUSLIMS:
      THERE NEVER WAS AND NEVER WILL BE ANY ANGELS I.E. NO GABRIEL, NO ISLAM AND THEREFORE NO MORE KORANIC-DRIVEN ACTS OF HORROR AND TERROR

      SAVING 2 BILLION LOST CHRISTIANS:
      THERE WAS AND NEVER WILL BE ANY BODILY RESURRECTIONS I.E. NO EASTER, NO CHRISTIANITY

      SAVING 15.5 MILLION ORTHODOX FOLLOWERS OF JUDAISM:
      ABRAHAM AND MOSES PROBABLY NEVER EXISTED.

      Added details upon request.

      July 15, 2011 at 4:56 pm |
  19. Kate

    CNN does not block trolls but they block a perfectly legitimate comment by me which I might add is the only comment on this blog that mentions the cold hard truth about pedophiles and the church. Instead CNN posts a bunch of idiotic responses from people debating religion and numerous other things that have nothing to do with the subject of this article. Good going CNN. Block out anything that you deem to be too controversial. Why are you afraid of offending the pedophiles? This blog is a joke.

    July 15, 2011 at 12:52 am |
    • News Flash

      CNN does not block anything. Your post got hung up in the WordPress automated filter which screens out combinations of embedded letters like su.ck, and t.it, (enti'ty). Look for them, break them up, and stop being paranoid. Someone help her out here with the list of naughty letter combos.

      July 15, 2011 at 6:55 am |
    • Reality

      The moderators of this blog have set up a secret forbidden word filter which unfortunately not only will delete or put your comment in the dreaded "waiting for moderation" category but also will do the same to words having fragments of these words. For example, "t-it" is in the set but the filter will also pick up words like Hitt-ite, t-itle, beati-tude, practi-tioner and const-tution. Then there are words like "an-al" thereby flagging words like an-alysis and "c-um" flagging acc-umulate or doc-ument. And there is also "r-a-pe", “a-pe” and “gra-pe”, "s-ex", and "hom-ose-xual". You would think that the moderators would have corrected this by now considering the number of times this has been commented on but they have not. To be safe, I typically add hyphens in any word that said filter might judge "of-fensive".

      • More than one web address might also activate “waiting for moderation”. Make sure the web address does not have any forbidden word or fragment.

      Sum Dude routinely updates the list of forbidden words/fragments.

      Two of the most filtered words are those containing the fragments "t-it" and "c-um". To quickly check your comments for these fragments, click on "Edit" on the Tool Bar and then "Find" on the menu. Add a fragment (without hyphens) one at a time in the "Find" slot and the offending fragment will be highlighted in your comments before you hit the Post button. Hyphenate the fragment(s) and then hit Post. And remember more than one full web address will also gain a "Waiting for Moderation".

      And said moderators still have not solved the chronological placement of comments once the number of comments gets above about 100. They recently have taken to dividing the comments in batches of 50 or so, for some strange reason. Maybe they did this to solve the chronology problem only to make comment reviews beyond the tedious.
      Zeb’s alphabetical listing

      o “bad letter combinations / words to avoid if you want to get past the CNN "awaiting moderation" filter:
      Many, if not most, are buried within other words, so use your imagination.
      You can use dashes, spaces, or other characters to modify the "offending" letter combinations.
      --–
      ar-se.....as in Car-se, etc.
      ba-stard
      co-ck.....as in co-ckatiel, co-ckatrice, co-ckleshell, co-ckles, lubco-ck, etc.
      co-on.....as in rac-oon, coc-oon, etc.
      cu-m......as in doc-ument, accu-mulate, circu-mnavigate, circu-mstances, cu-mbersome, cuc-umber, etc.
      cu-nt.....as in Scu-ntthorpe, a city in the UK famous for having problems with filters...!
      do-uche
      ef-fing...as in ef-fing filter
      ft-w......as in soft-ware, delft-ware, swift-water, etc.
      fu-ck......!
      ho-mo.....as in ho-mo sapiens or ho-mose-xual, ho-mogenous, etc.
      ho-rny....as in tho-rny, etc.
      jacka-ss...yet "ass" is allowed by itself.....
      ja-p......as in j-apanese, ja-pan, j-ape, etc.
      ji-sm
      koo-ch....as in koo-chie koo..!
      nip-ple
      pi-s......as in pi-stol, lapi-s, pi-ssed, therapi-st, etc.
      pr-ick....as in pri-ckling, pri-ckles, etc.
      ra-pe.....as in scra-pe, tra-peze, gr-ape, thera-peutic, sara-pe, etc.
      se-x......as in Ess-ex, s-exual, etc.
      sh-@t.....but shat is okay – don't use the @ symbol there.
      sh-it
      sl-ut
      sn-atch
      sp-ic.....as in disp-icable, hosp-ice, consp-icuous, susp-icious, sp-icule, sp-ice, etc.
      ti-t......as in const-itution, att-itude, ent-ities, alt-itude, beat-itude, etc.
      tw-at.....as in wristw-atch, nightw-atchman, etc.
      va-g......as in extrava-gant, va-gina, va-grant, va-gue, sava-ge, etc.
      who-re....as in who're you kidding / don't forget to put in that apostrophe!
      wt-f....also!!!!!!!

      There are more, some of them considered "racist", so do not assume that this list is complete.
      -–
      Allowed words / not blocked at all:
      anal
      anus
      ass
      boob
      crap
      damn
      execute
      hell
      kill
      masturbation
      murder
      penis
      pubic
      raping (ra-pe is not ok)
      shat (sh-@t is not ok)
      sphincter
      testes
      testicles

      The CNN / WordPress filter also filters your EMAIL address and NAME as well – so you might want to check those.

      July 15, 2011 at 7:34 am |
  20. SnowVeil

    The problem of the Irish is they don't read on the faith of St. Patrick but only celebrate the color green meaninglessly. The nation needs Christian missionaries.

    July 14, 2011 at 10:17 pm |
    • David Johnson

      @SnowVeil

      The Catholics trace their religion all the way back to Christ and the first Pope, Peter. I respect that. Doesn't make me a believer, but Catholicism would be the religion I would embrace if I were to ever believe.

      By Christian missionaries, you are meaning Evangelicals, I would remind you Evangelicalism is a Protestant Christian movement which began in Great Britain in the 1730s.

      So, the Evangelicals are actually late comers. God had to do without a church for 1700 years. Hmm...

      Seems unlikely.

      Cheers!

      July 15, 2011 at 12:17 am |
    • JF

      The problem with Catholicism is the enormous lack of integrity. What about Judaism? It goes back much farther than Christianity. Even Jesus was a Jew. The Catholics basically stole the Jews holy book and added to it.

      July 15, 2011 at 12:59 am |
    • Jed in NY

      Actually it is dumb Irish americans that celebrate the color green and even dye their rivers green on St. Patrick's day.....also Americans are the one's killing innocent men, women and children in the Middle East while they present themselves as Christians – of course, most Americans are pagans who use the Bible to gather followers, and more importantly...MONEY! I have never seen a poor prearcher on US TV!.

      July 15, 2011 at 2:57 am |
    • SnowVeil

      @David, proper Christianity has been always Evangelical since the start for 2,000 years. @JF, The Jews are the ones who always miss out God's will by being too late in everything. They should have accepted the New Covenant by Yesha the Messiah 20 centuries ago. @Jed, you are wrong. America always liberated the world from the evil domestic tyrants. Preachers on TV is a tiny fra-ction. Most Christian preachers are very poor and still give up everything to help you.

      July 15, 2011 at 7:44 am |
    • William Demuth

      Being Irish, I believe you need a beating.

      Disparage the victim you deviant pig?

      These children were forced into abominations and tortured phsicaly and emotionaly, and YOU condemn them?

      If there was justice, you would hang on the same cross as your imaginary savior.

      July 15, 2011 at 8:43 am |
    • SnowSentZeldalinaVeil

      I love myself every day.

      July 15, 2011 at 12:12 pm |
    • christianmother

      If your screen name is William you deserve to have a beating. Who wants the paddle? ? Me!!! Me 1st!!!

      July 16, 2011 at 6:25 am |
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About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.