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July 25th, 2011
11:13 AM ET
Is 'Christian fundamentalist' label correct for Norway terror suspect?By Dan Gilgoff, CNN.com Religion Editor (CNN) - Given initial suspicions that Friday's bombing and mass shooting in Norway were carried out by Islamic militants linked to al Qaeda, the way police ended up describing the suspect behind the attacks came as a big surprise even to many security experts: The alleged attacker was called a "Christian fundamentalist." But experts on European politics and religion say that the Christian fundamentalist label could overstate the extent to which the suspect, Anders Behring Breivik - who has told authorities that he carried out the attacks - was motivated by religion, and the extent to which he is tied to a broader religious movement. "It is true that he sees himself as a crusader and some sort of Templar knight," said Marcus Buck, a political science professor at Norway's University of Tromso, referring to an online manifesto that Breivik appears to have authored and which draws inspiration from medieval Christian crusaders. My Take: Norway attacks shows terrorism isn't just Islamic "But he doesn't seem to have any insight into Christian theology or any ideas of how the Christian faith should play any role in Norwegian or European society," Buck wrote in an email message. "His links to Christianity are much more based on being against Islam and what he perceives of as 'cultural Marxism.'" From what the 1,500-page manifesto says, Breivik appears to have been motivated more by an extreme loathing of European multiculturalism that has accompanied rapid immigration from the developing world, and of the European Union's growing powers, than by Christianity. "My impression is that Christianity is used more as a vehicle to unjustly assign some religious moral weight," to his political views, said Anders Romarheim, a fellow at the Norwegian Institute for Defence Studies. "It is a signifier of Western culture and values, which is what they pretend to defend." "I would say they are more anti-Islam than pro-Christian," Romarheim said in reference to what appear to be Breivik's views. The manifesto is religion-obsessed in that it rants for long stretches against Muslims and their growing presence in Europe. Who is Anders Behring Breivik? It calls for a European civil war to overthrow governments, end multiculturalism and execute "cultural Marxists." The manifesto includes a link to a video asserting that the majority of Europe's population will be Muslim by 2050 "unless we manage to defeat the ruling Multiculturalist Alliance." The author of the document identifies himself as Breivik, but CNN could not independently verify that he wrote the document, and Norwegian authorities would not confirm that the man in their custody wrote the manifesto, saying it was part of their investigation Opposition to booming Muslim immigration to Europe, exacerbated by high birth rates in the Muslim community, has become a mainstay of Europe's burgeoning far-right, helping right-wing parties gain seats in parliaments across the continent. But those right-wing movements are mostly secular. Europe's hard right does not have deep ties to Christianity in the way that the United States' conservative movement is entwined with evangelical Christianity and other theologically conservative religious movements. A far-right comeback in Europe Recently adopted European laws aimed at curbing Islam's public visibility, including France's new burqa ban and Switzerland ban on minarets - towers that a part of mosques - were secular causes, not ones championed by Christian interests. Many Christian groups oppose such bans. "The bulk of the anti-Muslim sentiment is not against Muslims as such, but is a secular rejection of how some Muslims allegedly want to place Islam at the center of society," Buck said. "It is more anti-religious than anti-Muslim." Breivik's apparent manifesto, by contrast, cites biblical verses to justify violence for political ends. "Clearly, this is not a pacifist God we serve," it says. "It's God who teaches our hands to war and our fingers to fight. Over and over again throughout the Old Testament, His people are commanded to fight with the best weapons available to them at that time." "The biggest threat to Europe is the cultural Marxist/multiculturalist political doctrine of 'extreme egalitarian emotionalism,'" the manifesto goes on. "This type of political stance involves destroying Christendom, the Church, our European cultures and identities and opening up our borders to Islamic colonization." The video that's linked to in the manifesto also includes some religious language: "Celebrate us, the martyrs of the conservative revolution, for we will soon dine in the Kingdom of Heaven." Experts on religion in Europe said those faith-infused views are likely peculiar to the suspected gunman and do not appear reflect wider religious movements, even as they echoes grievances of Europe's right-wing political groups. "He was a flaky extremist who might as well have claimed to be fighting for the honor of Hogwarts as for the cause of Christ," said Philip Jenkins, a Pennsylvania State University professor who studies global religion and politics, describing the suspected Norway attacker. "He did not represent a religious movement. ... People should not follow that Christian fundamentalist red herring." At the same time, Breivik told investigators during interviews that he belongs to an international order, The Knights Templar, according to Norwegian newspaper VG, which cited unnamed sources. He described the organization as an armed Christian order, fighting to rid the West of Islamic suppression, the newspaper said. He also told investigators he had been in contact with like-minded individuals and said he counts himself as a representative of this order, it said. For many in Norway, the potential implications of the suspected killer's religion are still settling in. "This is the first time we've heard of Christianity/religion as a driving force behind right-wing extremism," Buck said. "The mainstream right-wing movements in the Nordic countries (very small and disorganized groups in Norway) would generally point to the Old Norse beliefs, if anything." "Norwegian, Nordic and European society," he said, "were totally unprepared for a violent attack from someone who calls himself Christian." soundoff (1,640 Responses)« Previous 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 Next »
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And let the current batch of excuses for christian terrorism begin. Same as always, he wasn't a real christian. Now those muslim terrorists they are real muslims but this guy wasn't a real christian. The christians, muslims and jews all worship the same blood god and are responsible for most of the death and destruction around the world. Death to the blood god no matter how it is worshiped.
Atheist regimes have killed more people than any other in human history (ex: Stalin). Human nature is to blame. Take away religion and you will still have war, famine, and murder. Human evil is the problem.
Hmmm, Hitler might just have had a higher body count then 'Uncle Joe'. And Hitler was a practicing Catholic that wanted to get rid of all Athiests. I remember a few years back when the Lutheran church issued an apology for all the Lutheran's who took part in the attrocities of WWII on the German side.
Shall I label all atheists as homicidal maniacs? Then why label Christians as the cause of evil in this world? Seriously, get a grip.
TAKE A LOOK AT WHAT THE SCRIPTURE SAYS ABOUT "FALSE PROPHETS" AND YOU WILL HAVE A CLEARER UNDERSTANDING OF THIS LUNATIC'S "IDEOLOGY" OR "MANIACOLOGY." HE FITS THE DESCRIPTION PERFECTLY.
So do Palin, Rush, Pat Robertson and every other right wing nut in America.
I agree with you Ray. They are also HYPOCRITS
WHAT? I DON'T THINK I HEARD YOU. THERE'S TRAFFIC OUTSIDE. TYPE LOUDER.
I had to stop reading this piece when I read this early paragraph.
"But he doesn't seem to have any insight into Christian theology or any ideas of how the Christian faith should play any role in Norwegian or European society," Buck wrote in an email message."
Insight is irrelevant and be it deep or superficial – Xtians of nominal and zealous natures have long been tweaking the moral code of the Religion to suit their own agendas for centuries. How informed a Believer might or not be is irrelevant, as the majority of Xtians tend to make up their own personal theology anyways...so to bring up this homegrown terrorist's lack of insight only shows the other Xtian tendency to scramble for a means to push one of the sheep out of the herd.
Except this guy doesn't claim to be a Christian in his manifesto. In fact, there are many incidences where he professes his doubts about whether a god exists.
Belloch, the manifesto is too long for me to read right now (I'm at work), but from what I can see, the entire purpose of the first part (which is what I skimmed) was to defend Christianity while attacking Islam. IE, "People say that Islam and Christianity are the same, but they aren't, and here's why..."
It could be that he never claims to be Christian, but that would be like saying that Steven Jay Gould may not believe in evolution, even though he's written several books defending the subject, because he never uses the word "evolutionist."
Have you seen any Christian dancing and celebrating in the street after the murderous act of this individual? No! But, how many Muslims and Atheists have rejoiced after the World Trade Center was attacked? 95% of Muslims, 66% of Atheists.
So now atheists are the same as Islamic extremists...? Care to support that claim? I dont know ONE atheist that danced at the felling of the towers.
But I do know many who immediately guessed it was linked to religious zealotry.
Please provide evidence of the joyous muslims and atheists because this sounds like a complete fabrication you are using to demonize people whom you hate. If you cannot provide said evidence, then your contention, much like your stupid myths, fall. You're a true idiot sir. Do the world a favor and kick that nasty oxygen habit you have.
Liar. Cite your sources!
Your percentages are 100% pulled from your posterior.
Are you serious? Just pulled those numbers out of your own head, eh? Please, if you want to be taken seriously, try citing the sources for such a statistical claim (and no, wikipedia or blogs/forums do not count as credible sources- sorry).
I'd love to see where american muslims who lost family in the towers were celebrating. Or, in my case, better yet- the 66% of atheists.
You sir, are a moron.
Athiest's celebrated? That's pretty odd...considering I don't live far from the area and knew quite a few of them that volunteered to go to Ground Zero and help with rescue attempts and first-aid.
This guy is not a christian ... in the same way as the religious conservatives in the US aren't christians and muslim extremists aren't muslim.
They are simply intolerant and hateful and use (any) religion as an excuse to feel righteous.
Amen! But you forgot the word HYPOCRITS!!
The name of Jesus Christ has been used by humans for human benefit, since the beginning. These "Right Wing Christians" are the Antichrist....the Devil alive and well and moving over earth.
Your comment rightly reflects many people's journalistic concerns with labeling this terrorist a "Christian Fundamentalist" with scanty evidence - a complete rush to throw those evil Christians under the bus.
IT DOESN'T MATTER WHAT RELIGION HE CLAIMS- HE SURE DOES NOT PRACTICE IT. SO TO ALL YOU CHRIST HATERS TRYING TO BLAME CHRIST AS THIS MANIAC DID: UP YOURS.
Well, that's not a terribly Christ-like response.
@kake79
Im afraid he/she is right. there is some frustration in the statement, but it is true that this action is completely against the teachings of Christ and therefore not Christian.
Aren't there rules against typing in all caps?
@the one true god,
up yours? ouch sounds like your going to the darkside.
Another Timothy McVeigh !!! Hopefully this "nut job" meets the same fate. The sooner the better!!! If Norway does not have a death penalty, then there is always the "oops" accident. "While transporting Breivik to prison via an aircraft, the cabin door suddenly opened and he fell 30,000 ft. He did not survive the frigid waters of the North Atlantic. "
press the report abuse button on this, it's just copy-paste
"But he doesn't seem to have any insight into Christian theology or any ideas of how the Christian faith should play any role in Norwegian or European society," Buck wrote in an email message. "His links to Christianity are much more based on being against Islam and what he perceives of as 'cultural Marxism.'"
That describes the christoFascists Tea Party perfectly.
That, and fear of a black president.
American Christian fundamentalists are simply not Christian. They are discriminatory, hateful, self-righteous and so many other things that Christ would find disgusting.
Thats exactly what Muslims think of al-qaeda.
If following what he Bible says makes me a fundie, then so be it. Unfortunately the fundie label doesn't fit this guy becuse he DOESN"T follow the Bible – Jesus didn't say go out and slaughter your enemies.
This man is NOT A CHRISTIAN! CHRISTIANS DON'T COMMIT MASS MURDER! This individual committed a crime. To call him a Christian is an insult to Christians. THE MEDIA NEEDS TO STOP STEREOTYPING CHRISTIANS! CHRISTIANS ARE BEING DEMONIZED BY THE MEDIA!
yes, I agree. They are spreading false vibes about the truth of God.
If you read your bible, you'll see that your Christian god is a mass-murdering homicidal maniac.
So the crusades were a misunderstanding?
The same thing is done to Islam. Don't cry martyr because a self-described Christian is a terrorist.
the crusades were brought about by selfish kings searching for gold and a few ignorant religious fools. Christ would never have accepted the crusades for their true purpose ... riches at the cost of human life.
Amen
@rr
"Christians don't commit (mass) murder ?"
-- Really ? REALLY ? What is your cutoff between murder and mass murder ? The studies of inmate population of US prisons prove you wrong. They ARE Christians. In point of fact YOU are the one here who is stereotyping Christians, by implying they NOT murderers. If he says he IS a Christian, he IS a Christian. Where do I sign up for the "christian "test ?
If only we would apply such dispassionate analysis to the terrorists of the Middle East, we'd realize they are only as "Islamic" as this guy is "Christian" - that is, not at all. And yet we are all too quick to paint all of Islam with the broad brush of terror.
What are you talking about? The Bible is full of atrocities!
http://www.thethinkingatheist.com/page/bible-atrocities
@News Flash
No group has a monopoly on murder. However, you should not stereotype a group because of a single madman. That is insane. Agree with your point, but the truth is the overwhelming vast majority of Christians are not murderers and condemn such acts as evil
The majority of Muslim's do not identify with mass murder, either yet we call a jihadist suicide bomber a "Muslim Extremist". It is what it is – he identifies himself as a Christian so you'll have to endure the poor stereotyping just like most Muslims do.
@RobertOKUSA
Christ came to show a peaceful path. Please state where he commands war or hatred.
It must be very convenient that when someone kills in the name of Christianity, they're not true Christians because Jesus wouldn't do it and because he said how not all Christians who follow him are true Christians. Provides a nice perpetual out for this behavior, doesn't it?
I don't think I really need to add anything to this...after all they're Jesus' words as recorded by one of his faithful.
Now the interesting part is how many Christians will try to refute this. If you read the Bible, neither Jesus nor his Father were about peace...radical change of the human government and violence were part of their staking their claim to godship. And it was only for their chosen few who were in the minority in that particular cultural time.
“Think not that I came to send peace on the earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law” Matthew 10:34-35
Jesus freak slaughters children!
So what else is new?
The children of Abraham are just branches of the same poison tree.
Be they Muslim, Jew or Christian, they all reek of the blood of the innocents.
Lunatics who live in the past, and bring shame to our human race.
Thank you for your usual off the wall crazy rants.
I suppose you are either a Jew or a Muslim or an atheist. However, you have no right to insult other people's belief (for instance mine). Do not offend us, the Christians!
These Right Wing Christians........are the ANTICHRIST! They're not followers of Christ who do HIS work, for all of mankind.
Stela...Christians, Muslims, Jews, and virtually every other religion has "insulted" and "offended" non-believers like me on a continuous basis! Given the enormous harm your religion has done in this world, I have not only a right but a duty to insult it, as well as every other rational person on this Earth! See the link below for full details from Pat Condell:
http://youtu.be/1uTypnaP5X4
You're right dude. They are all complete WACK JOBS who can rationalize anything that serves them. Not all Christians... but definitely the Fundie kind.
If someone is completely wacko and commits a serious crime against humanity, you can be 95% certain that religion was a prime motivating factor.
I am sure that is pretty much the secular take on things. Religious wackos make the news because they are the exception, otherwise it wouldn't make the news.
Did you even read the article? You mentioned a statistic. Cite your sources!
You can be sure if someone uses a percentage in a comment without referencing his source, 99% of the time, he's making it up.
lol Belloch
Anyone using religion as an excuse, a motivator, or for historical revenge is a terrorist. Matters little whether it's nutbags killing abortionists, bigots killing churchgoing Black children, or fools blowing themselves up to enter cloud fairy land, the action is terrorism. Multiculturalism, Socialism, or radical Conservatism is no excuse for any violence of any kind. Ones personal wars are miniscule.
If you look all over the news and read the articles, the media (CNN and ABC at least) has portrayed the guy as a fundamentalist right wing Christian (which would be odd in Norway) but the reality is he was definitely a secularist, most likely agnostic.
Exhibit A: Go to the atlas shrugged 2000 blog
Exhibit B:
Here are some quotes from his biography/manifesto:
"I'm not going to pretend I'm a very religious person as that would be a lie. I've always been very pragmatic and influenced by my secular surroundings and environment."
"Religion is a crutch for many weak people and many embrace religion for self serving reasons as a source for drawing mental strength (to feed their weak emotional state for example during illness, death, poverty etc.). Since I am not a hypocrite, I'll say directly that this is my agenda as well."
"If praying will act as an additional mental boost/soothing it is the pragmatical thing to do. I guess I will find out... If there is a God I will be allowed to enter heaven as all other martyrs for the Church in the past. I am pursuing religion for this very reason and everyone else should as well, providing it will give you a mental boost."
The man says secularism in his influence, and that he's not religious. He says religion is a crutch, and doesn't know if there is a God but that he will pray...just in case. He certainly doesn't sound right wing Christian fundamentalist, but whatever he was, the guy was a nut.
atlasshrugs2000 typepad and look at the July 23rd entry.
So... He's just like Timothy McVeigh.
"But he doesn't seem to have any insight into Christian theology or any ideas of how the Christian faith should play any role in Norwegian or European society,"
What a load. What that really means is "he doesn't believe in our nonsensical post-modernist interpretation of the bible".
The Bible is not to be interpreted (2 Peter 1:20). For a better understanding what mankind must do to be reunited with God and to be able to understand the Bible, we invite you to read all the pages and articles of our website http://www.aworlddeceived.ca
@AvdBerg, so if it's supposed to be taken literally, that means the universe only 6,000 years old? That dinosaurs and man walked the Earth together? That man used to live until 300 years old? That the world is flat? That the Earth is the center of the universe?
Those who stick to "interpreting the bible" can at least dodge those ridiculous ideas, but you can't refute them if it's taken literally.
Unless he was shouting "Jesus Saves" as he shot them, much like muslims shout "God is great", then he's not a christian fundamentalist. Nice try haters. He's a nea-nazi racist facist. Period.
"he's not a christian fundamentalist.[....] He's a nea-nazi racist facist."
Yeah, and there's no murder and racism in your sacred bible, right?
@Carl – No, but there is in yours, the Origin of Species. That's why we have schools shootings like Columbine and Virginia Tech. Go educate yourself.
@Ryaninmichigan - too bad you don't seem to have availed yourself of those educational opportunities!
Oh my, what ignorance!
Can you quote a passage from Origin of Species that calls for the murder of an individual, a group, or an entire town?
Here's a couple such passages from the bible, off the top of my head:
Samuel 15:3
"Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass."
Numbers 31:17
"Now kill all the boys [innocent kids]. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man."
Can you name one individual who has killed anyone at all in the name of Darwin? Has there ever been a Darwin Inquisition in which people were tortured to death? Ever hear of teh Galapagos Crusades in which armies of evolutionary biologists have gone forth to slaughter the unbelievers?
@Ray in Michigan I'm assuming thats what they tell you in church, yeah? That Darwin was a demon from the underworld? Giving evidence and proof disproving the crap that was scribbled in the Torah / OT by a rickety old man?
People like you are why the rest of Westerners view Americans as idiots.
I'm guessing you think the US was founded by christians too, huh?
@Doc Vestibule
actually the premise of natural selection involves murder by other species "to kill with the intent to harm with malice". For instance, species have developed large canines to capture and tear apart prey, often those least fit to survive (ex: young, slower species). So murder is inherent within natural selection.
"Do not murder, do not commit adultery, do not steal, do not give false testimony, honor your father and mother, and love your neighbor as yourself."
-Matthew 19:19
@NJBob – Obviously, neither did you, with remarks like that!
@TheGuy – People like you prove my point. All Atheists want to do with history is rewrite it to make it look like they've been the good guys all along. People like you are why the rest of the world hate us. And, yes, with the sole exception of Thomas Jefferson and Benjamin Franklin, the founding fathers were all firm believers in Christ. Franklin still firmly believed in God, but had trouble with the concept of Jesus dying for his sins, leaving one Atheist founding father in Jefferson.
@Doc Vestibule – Actually, I can name some. How about the Holocaust, Soviet labor camps, the Killing Fields of Cambodia, and, like I said before, the Columbine shootings. These were done in the name of natural selection, one of Evolution's core teachings.
With the resurgent rise of a fanatical right wing in the USA, I'm scared to death that a similar act of insanity will happen here again. Timothy McVeigh hoped to inspire a revolt against what he considered to be a tyrannical federal government just 6 years ago this coming April.
1995......?
Please provide one example of this "fanatical right"
Is it 2001?
It's that public education that NJBob is talking about in his comment above; kind of explains why our math scores are so low compared to the rest of the world. I wonder if Robert even knows how to use the calculator on the computer he typed the comment on.
Why is OK for CNN to immediately jump to conclusions and post 4 different stories about the "right wing" and "Christian" conspiracies. But when a man walks into a US military base and yells allahu akbah and kills our soldiers...NO NO don't call him a Muslim! We have to find out the facts first! Maybe he had a bad childhood? Maybe the Military didn't treat him right! No way he's just a muslim extremist. How about we just realize that ALL of the people are psycho and need to be treated as such. Where are all the stories about the leftist riots that go on in Europe on almost a daily basis?
What is your source for the "daily leftist riots"
"Leftist riots" in Europe? Where? I spend 6 months a year in Europe with my company...I have yet to see a riot let alone a "leftist" riot....Have you ever actually been to Europe? i did not think so....
Better than FOX who immediately said this was the work of a suspected Islamic militant, before the shooting was even over.
Ok I was exaggerating with “Daily”. But what about recent protests in Greece? Destroying property and assaulting police officers. Of course they are just labeled “angry youth who are fed up!”
I notice nobody has commented on the Muslim shooting example.
" Norway attacks shows terrorism isn't just Islamic"
Just look at the psychotic inbreds from the westboro "church" and you can see that.
I will agree that the Westboro people are total freaks, but when exactly have they committed any acts of terrorism?