October 3rd, 2011
04:24 PM ET
Justices deal with 10 Commandments display
By Bill Mears, CNN Supreme Court Producer
Washington (CNN) - The Supreme Court on Monday turned away an appeal from an Ohio judge who wanted to post a copy of the biblical Ten Commandments in his courtroom.
The case was among hundreds disposed of by the justices, who returned to start a new term after a three-month recess. Another separate, high-profile petition involved a death row prisoner challenging his conviction in the murder of an 11-year-old Florida girl.
The Ohio case was brought by the American Civil Liberties Union, which had successfully prevented Richland County Common Pleas Judge James DeWeese from posting another copy of the Ten Commandments.
He first hung the well-known passage from the Bible in 2000, alongside a copy of the Constitution's Bill of Rights, and referred to both as "the rule of law," according to court documents.Read the full story here.
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.
@Hippypoet post 9:07 Hippy, hope you come back here, with your reply, are ypou refering to my post about the U.N. wanting a one-world religion? If so, most of that post was from Robert Muller, and I'm not happy with the idea . Nonetheless, your post baffels me I don't understand what you are trying to say, unless you are refering to the U.N./RCC But the RCC didn't come in control of the world untill affter Pope Gregory, sorry I can't do copy and paste on my cell, but the RCC want religious/political control of the world and she is willing to fo anything to do it. She calculates that if the U.N. accepts the plan for a one-world government, one-wrorld religion and a one-world leader, She wants that position and She will do anything to get it. The RCC is the one to warch, for both the secular world and the whole religious world.
The RCC is dying a slow death of a thousand cuts (all self inflected) and isn’t going to be in a position to be a world anything
@Hippypoet post 9:07 Hippy, hope you come back here, with your reply, are ypou refering to my post about the U.N. wanting a one-world religion? If so, most of that post was from Robert Muller, and I'm not happy with the idea . Nonetheless, your post baffals me I don't understand what you are trying to say, unless you are reffering to the RCC But the RCC didn't come incontrol of the world untill affter Pope Gregory, sorry I forget the date and I'm too lazy to look it up. And between you and I and the fencepost
I would agree with many posters that there are far more pressing matters at hand that require our attention than this. With that said, I think it's moronic for any government who claims religious freedom to place obviously biased religious law's at the front and center of it's judicial system. There are law's contained therin that basicly say "We exclude anyone who doesn't believe like we do" when you put a plaque on the front steps of a courthouse that says "Thou shalt have no other gods before me, Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image, or any likeness of any thing that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth, Thou shalt not bow down thyself to them, nor serve them: for I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me" How are our Hindu and Muslim American citizens going to get any justice from a building that declares their religious rights invalid at the door?
"visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me"
God, who is unchanging, later said: – (Ezekiel 18:3,20) “As I live," declares the Lord God, "you are surely not going to use this proverb in Israel anymore.” “The person who sins will die. The son will not bear the punishment for the father's iniquity, nor will the father bear the punishment for the son's iniquity; the righteousness of the righteous will be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked will be upon himself.”
If god is unchanging, then how come he first told people not to eat shellfish, but then later reverse his decision? Seems like he changed his position to me.
@Observer – So, the sin's of the father are not to be passed on to the son accept for Adam's sin which is passed on to all mankind? Hmmmm, seems to me there is a flaw in biblical logic here...
What you missed, is right before your eyes,"visiting".You are comparing two different situations.Lets pick a human failing,like being a jerk.Let us say you are a jerk,that failing will be visited upon your children,that in itself does not say your children will be jerks,it only increases the probability and so on for four generations.The other verse simply says it is not right to punish your child because you are a jerk.If however your child has adopted your lifestyle and is consequently a jerk,then they will be held responsible themselves.God bless
As an proud athiest, I say loudly, people in this country need to grow up and get over dumb $h1t like this. We have real issues to deal with.
The Supreme Court made the correct ruling here (maybe they aren't as lost as I thought they were). More nonsense should be thrown out of courts, less time and money would be wasted as a result.
Those are not THE ten commandments. Look at Exodus 34.
there may be those who speak against me but all I wish to do is say that we, the human species and everything else on this planet, owe everything we were and could be given proper leadership to the ALMIGHTY SUN. think about it, its a logical thing to worship if you are to worship anything...but if you can't see and feel your "god" shouldn't you ask youself why? that is when its time to look up towards the one true GIVER OF LIFE. THE ALMIGHTY SUN, may it shine upon you always!
And do NOT forget the Son Of The Sun.
He had his light snuffed out so we could forever see the truth.
Without the Holy Trinary we would forever be pale!
Our Sols are blessed!
oh william, haven't you ever heard the lovely story of the Moon and the SUN?
well here then:
THE MOON, SO JEALOUS OF THE SUN FOR ITS ALMIGHTY POWER, DECIDED ONE DAY TO STEAL THE LIGHT and then there was darkness – all things lived in the dark and it was called the dark age. After a while the SUN thought about who may have stolen its light and it came to the idea of who would be able to use it and for why. The SUN knew the moon well, it knew that the moon had always commented on how beautifully bright and powerful the SUN'S light was. So the SUN talked to the moon one night and they made a deal...NOW THE SUN CAN REFLECT ITS LOVE AT NIGHT FOR ALL TO SEE BUT AS A PUNISHMENT, the moon would dissappear for one whole 24 night. AND THANKS TO THE SUN THE LIGHT RETURNED TO THE LAND AND ALL WERE FILLED WITH JOY AND THE WARMTH THEY HAD LONG FORGOTTEN. the end!!!
And the child of the Sun and the Earth the Moon has forever turned its eyes from our happiness, until it can once again eclipse our holy father and thrust the believing into the darkness of its shadow.
Blessed be the Sun and The Son of The Sun! And beware the Evil moon and his Lunatic Followers!
lol – my favorite Lunatic – ReinField from Bram Stoker's Dracula...with Bela Lugosi... the sceen where Reinfield is standing at the bottom of the stairs in the boat cargo hold just laughing while in the light of the Moon. good stuff!
"If you must worship something, worship life. Every last crawling bit of it. For we are all in this beauty together." -Frank Herbert
If Osama had taken out the Supreme Court he would have destroyed us.
Could you imagine George Bush naminating an ENTIRE new court at one time?
That would have meant either an immediate civil war, or the changing of Americas trajectory to the EXTREME right.
I recall a false report at the time that scared me more than anything else.
It is lucky for us it wasn't true, because if the court had perished, we would have torn each other apart.
@BRC, Thanks for your reply. That's true the Pleiades have known about for who know how long, I can well believe the may have even been worshiped, but it wasn't known untill modern astronomy that they were traveling through space at a fast clip, all together, or that they were even moving. This is only one of dozens of things that people of old knew before modern science. Sorry that I won't be able to post again untill later, I have a doctor's appointment. Got'a go!
Be sure to tell him to wash the leeches before he puts them on your arm.
there are actually a good number of astronomers and mathematicians from antiquity and the middle ages that determined that teh "heavens" were constantly in motion, without any need of the bible to tell them so.
Bo, you are totally wrong my friend... the all powerful and ful of hate church has kept a lid tightly nailed to make sure what they have been saying the past 2000 years wasn't just complete bs, they were willing to take a tad bit on faith. 🙂 darwin had to publish his work with care planning around work usage or death was his next outting... same with nearly everyone at different points in history, mostly thanks to the church, but they don't take all the blame....for all people take power and become tryants.
Converting To Atheism:
1. Spelling and Grammar Critiquing (This is most important!!!!)
2. Learn to Sound smart or else you cant be in the scuba squad.
3.Cite information from C+ scientists
4. Prove God Doesnt Exist
5. Blame God for all the problems in the world.
6.Writing page long replies = win
7.Ctrl + C & Ctrl + V is easier than thinking
8. 4 billion years of history minus 33 years-thats how we roll.
9. Skyfairies sound less H0m0-ish
10. Gang up on Mary
Converting To Christianity
1) Suspension of rational inquiry (MOST IMPORTANT)
2) Learn to disguise contempt with scripture or you can't play in public
3) Cite 2,000 year old literature as fact
4) Prove that your gut feeling are correct about everything
5) Blame atheists for the perceived decline of society
6) Ad hominem attacks = win
7) Quoting Bible verses is easier than thinking
8) 2,000 years is how long morality has existed. That's how we roll.
9) The scientific method is for losers and heretics
10) Wedge religion into every corner of American life, especially schools and courts.
Use bigoted epithets to prove how tolerant and loving Jesus has made you.
How did that smiley sneak in there?
Note to self: Use dots to delineate, not brackets.
No conversion needed.
We are not the ones claiming that there is a god, therefore the burden of proof lies on the ones claiming. As for ganging up on Mary-you mean the apparent virgin mother? You do realize that being a virgin and a mother are contradictory, right?
As for your CTRL+C, CTRL+V...not much different than when christians post from a bible, we just choose to use science, logic and reason to back us?
Your derogatory statement at the end (FA.G.GOTS) is an inappropriate use of the word. You may wish to look it up in a dictionary but fear that you are not capable of doing such, the proper definition would be:
1. a bundle of sticks or twigs, esp when bound together and used as fuel
2. a bundle of iron bars, esp a box formed by four pieces of wrought iron and filled with scrap to be forged into wrought iron
3. a ball of chopped meat, usually pork liver, bound with herbs and bread and eaten fried
4. a bundle of anything
Doesn't sound like us at all.
Response from an existing atheist-
1. Never done that, my own spelling is atrocious, though better grammar would make these discussions easier to understand.
2. We actually prefer that people be smart, the sounding smart tends to develop right behind that.
3. Last I checked there's no "atheists' scientist transcript database" so it's hard for us to ONLY use C+ students, but since we usually site what is accepted by the scientific community as a whole, I'm sure there are some involved
4. Redundant, we already said we're talking about atheists
5. No, we point out the problems that people believing in god causes, can't blame something you don't believe in.
6. Yes, we do prefer that people's ideas are well rounded and have in depth thought involved. Takes longer to explain things when you don't just say "God did it".
7. No, but it is easier than typing. If the facts haven't changed what's wrong with repeating them?
8. Really, no idea what this one was trying to say.
9. Are you saying that the atheist pejorative for gods is less fruity than their original names? Odd.
10. I thought "God" and the Holy Spirit were responsible for this one.
Did he just call for throwing a train on the virgin mother?
Buy that man a beer!
God is too busy dealing with people that actually matter, so he sent me to beat your @ss with a belt.
@Doc...your point? thats like saying the sky is blue.
@Truth....have you ever heard of artificial insemination? i guess your science knowledge doesnt surpass the 4th grade. Oh and congrats for knowing how to use a dictionary.....If i had a choice i would pick door number 3.
@BRC....you are like the smartest kid with down syndrome....so im gonna leave you alone.
If I have this right, you put out a spiteful message full of non-facts and ending with an epithet for a group of people that have nothing to do with what you're complaining about, then when you recieve 3 reasoned responses to counter with what can basically be described as "nuh-uh, you're all stupid"and take a shot at another group of people that have nothing to do with the conversation.
In 2 posts you provided no facts, insulted people with alternative lifestyles, insulted the developmentally disabled, and did exactly what you were implyin that other people did. GREAT. We have now firmly established that you pretty much have to be a troll, and I don't have to worry that someone walking around actually thinks like you. It's a load off my mind, I was kind of worried for a minute. Thanks for clearing that up, and if you ever have any more statements you need disproved or discreditted just let us know.
Hey Moron: Have you ever heard of the fact that regardless, unless a c-section is had, the child still needs to born? Thus it breaks the term virgin! And in case you are not aware most cases of artificial insemination would involve breaking the hy.men in order for insemination to occur. Guess you're not so intelligent after all...surprise surprise!
btw: the beats your as.s with a belt? is that how your Mommy and Daddy punish you? you do realize that falls under assault right? great christian (NOT) you are to even consider using violence...clue in here child, a virgin birth back in the time where Mary apparently has jesus was not possible, it is due to science that artificial insemination is even possible.
@BRC Are you kidding me? I dare you to go through every article and every comment page, and tell me that there's no insults thrown from unbelievers. ha. You just seem a lil angry that you all get back a taste of your own medicine. well cry me a river dude, aint got no tissues. callin me a troll huh? think you need to look farther back at user Reality.
@Truth wow, so that's you definition of virginity? you really need some edumacation. i can see you've never felt a womans warmth. that's ok dont worry there are many 40yr virgins out there. And whenever has it been stated a fact that when the "H" breaks you are no longer considered a virgin? It is only an indication of the possibility. Any strenous excercise or even athletic activities can do such.
Why are you guys wasting your time with a carnival freak show reject like AthyistRAnnyng. He (and religious people like him) is the best argument against religion. He is so obviously repellant that he needs no rebuttal.
I never said there weren't hateful, pety spiteful, childish atheists. There are. Plenty, about the same as there are believers. However, other people's poor behavior and useless namecallign doesn't mean that my posts were baseless or derissive, and certainly don't necessitate you taking shots at gy people and those with down syndrome, who I will bet money never did anything to you.
You made a statement, I calmly refuted it, then you tried to result to insults, so I called you out on a lack of substance, and you claimed that I just have my feelings hurt. Read that chain of events again and tell me it makes sense. I promise nothing anyone says on this blog will hurt my feelings, people can be infuriatingly slow and stubborn, but that just leaves me frustrated and stunned not offended.
If you want to hald a reasonable discussion, I'm in. If you aren't interested in that, and want to revert to the name calling that you say you are so against, feel free- maybe if I get really really bored I'll play along.
@BRC you are right dude. Sorry. I apologize for the insult...I get so worked up sometimes seeing all the hateful comments on here that i just blurt out the same content.
regardless of what way we look at it...you are a moron. your point was that Mary was a virgin and could have been artificially inseminated...total fallacy given that she apparently lived 2000 plus years ago. There has never been a recorded virgin birth anywhere in scientific history nor will there ever be. The christians took a word that could also mean young maiden and made it out to be something that it isn't. You seemed to skip over where I stated that it was science that came up artificial insemination...no god required. You are the one uneducated given that you believe in this crap.
It happens, I've gotten frustrated and made generalizations that I saw were incorrect later (generalizations pretty much always are).
What has artificial insemination to do with anything ? Have you ever watched a delivery ? OMG ! Sheesh.
You give christian's a bad name. We aren't all like YOU. Harsh, judgmental, and ignorant. Atheists, I ask that you please ignore that creature and continue posting entirely rational responses and arguments. @AthyistRAnnyng- The mark of a true idiot would be insulting someone when you are outdone. Please. Please. Be quiet.
@HotAirAce 12:20 post "ATOM" by Kraus ? sounds as though it may it may be an interesting book, is it found in the astromy or si-fi section, I enjoy both. I also like to read in the book of Job about all the things that God has made and how He controls them and not man. In chapter 38:31 He asks Job if he can bind together the Pleiades, a group of stars, held together by apperently magnetic force, traveling together though space. How did Job know this when it wasn't known untill man had modern telescopes. In fact Bible readers didn't know what the text even meant untill modern astronomers learned about it. There are a few other astronomical facts found in the same chapter that were not even known about untill modern telescopes were made, yet somehow Job knew them about it 3000 years ago. I think it is fascinating to learn from the Bible that even though there are numberless stars there are not two alike. David knew about currents in the sea and modern man didn't know about them until the late 1800's.
That bible should be in the fiction section too.
As has been said before, there is nothing impressive about the bible's claim that "God" pulled together the Pleiades. It's a cluster of stars held together by their own gravitational interaction. they are extremely bright visible stars that have been visible to and noted by every ancient culture that was in the right hemisphere duing the correct season (even those that pre-date and never heard of Judaism or Christianity).
The statement is simply a call to observence, not a matter of proof.
“He asks Job if he can bind together the Pleiades, a group of stars, held together by apperently magnetic force, traveling together though space. How did Job know this when it wasn't known untill man had modern telescopes.”
Oh nonsense! First, they are stars, which are attracted by gravity, not magnetism, as any tenth grade science student can tell you. This is as fundamentally erroneous as thinking the moon is made of blue cheese. Second, they are not travelling together through space – they are, in fact, disbanding and drifting apart. Third, they have been visible to human beings’ naked eyes since we started looking up at the night sky. They are in the constellation Taurus and easily visible on a clear night. The only reason they look like a group is their apparent angle from Earth and the fact that they are young and bright and close to Earth.
“There are a few other astronomical facts found in the same chapter that were not even known about untill modern telescopes were made, yet somehow Job knew them about it 3000 years ago.”
“David knew about currents in the sea and modern man didn't know about them until the late 1800's.”
Man has been using the currents to navigate for thousands of years. That is how Polynesia and Micronesia were settled, how the Aboriginals made it to Australia and the Maoris to New Zealand and the Chatham Islands, how Vikings made it to North America, how the Chinese traded up and down Asia and how Asians made it all the way to Madagascar.
If you are going to make stuff up, at least be good at it!
Not to mention that the currents in the Mediterranean and the Persian Gulf had been charted for thousands of years before that book was written.
"Atom" by cosmologist Lawrence Krauss. Follow the journey of an oxygen atom from the Big Bang to life on Earth. A speculative but still science based novel that would not be found in the sci-fi section. Krauss is in many ways comparable to Carl Sagan in conveying science to laypeople with wit and humor. Highly recommended is his video lecture "A Universe from Nothing" which can be found using Google or on youtube.
The Ancient Greeks knew all about the constellations. You are simply wrong.
Many OT, NT and koran thu-mpers are actually thu-mping the rules and codes of the ancients like King Hammurabi and the Egyptians who wrote the Book of the Dead and who did NOT need revelations from angels or mountain voices to develop needed rules of conduct for us h-o-minids.
"Hail to thee, great God, Lord of the Two Truths. I have come unto thee, my Lord, that thou mayest bring me to see thy beauty. I know thee, I know thy name, I know the names of the 42 Gods who are with thee in this broad hall of the Two Truths . . . Behold, I am come unto thee. I have brought thee truth; I have done away with sin for thee. I have not sinned against anyone. I have not mistreated people. I have not done evil instead of righteousness . . .
I have not reviled the God.
I have not laid violent hands on an orphan.
I have not done what the God abominates . . .
I have not killed; I have not turned anyone over to a killer.
I have not caused anyone's suffering . . .
I have not copulated (illicitly); I have not been unchaste.
I have not increased nor diminished the measure, I have not diminished the palm; I have not encroached upon the fields.
I have not added to the balance weights; I have not tempered with the plumb bob of the balance.
I have not taken milk from a child's mouth; I have not driven small cattle from their herbage...
I have not stopped (the flow of) water in its seasons; I have not built a dam against flowing water.
I have not quenched a fire in its time . . .
I have not kept cattle away from the God's property.
I have not blocked the God at his processions."
"The Book of the Dead was written circa 1800 BCE. 2 The Schofield Reference Bible estimates that the Hebrew Exodus from Egypt and the provision of the Ten Commandments on Mount Sinai occurred in 1491 BCE., some three centuries later. Many religious liberals, historians, and secularists have concluded that the Hebrew Scripture's Ten Commandments were based on this earlier docu-ment, rather than vice-versa."
plz hit rteport abuse on all reality posts
plz help me with my Reality obsession.
The idea that the doctrine of separation of church and state could be used to (i) prevent school prayer; (ii) disallow the display of the 10 commandments in court; or (ii) prevent local authorities from sponsoring nativity scenes would never have occurred to the framers of the US Consti.tution.
Fortunately, we as a society are slowly graduating from our Bronze Age supersti.tions and religion is increasingly seen as a neutral, or even a negative thing in society, rather than being considered as unquestioningly positive, as it once was.
Onwards and upwards!! May the illuminating influences of science, reason and free thought drive the remaining gods, ghosts and goblins out of our society for good. We don’t need our invisible friends and foes any more. We are all grown up.
I think the following makes more sense than the 10 Commandments from the buybull:
TEN COMMANDMENTS FOR A GLOBAL HUMANISM
(Dr. Rodrigue TREMBLAY)
1- Proclaim the natural dignity and inherent worth of all human beings.
2- Respect the life and property of others.
3- Practice tolerance and open-mindedness towards the choices and life styles of others.
4- Share with those who are less fortunate and mutually as.sist those who are in need of help.
5- Use neither lies, nor spiritual doctrine, nor temporal power to dominate and exploit others.
6- Rely on reason, logic and science to understand the Universe and to solve life's problems.
7- Conserve and improve the Earth's natural environment—land, soil, water, air and space—as humankind's common heritage.
8- Resolve differences and conflicts cooperatively without resorting to violence or to wars.
9- Organize public affairs according to individual freedom and responsibility, through political and economic democracy.
10- Develop one's intelligence and talents through education and effort.
Develop through education and effort?Might you be the same "truth"prevails that insisted there were no nations mentioned in the book of Revelation then went on to post 20 or so various translations and paraphrases listing two nations in Revelation?How is your list working out for you?I think i'll go with real intelligence and stay with Gods ten.God bless
Nice straw man argument herbert. How about you comment on the content of his post instead of spraying BS around?
@Herbert: Like the book you follow, your comment is a little outdated!
@HJ What two nations are mentioned in the bible? And don't say Gog and Magog unless you can point them out on a map whose accuracy is generally agreed upon.
The nations tend to change depending on who is identified as the enemy of the US at the time when televangelists needs to sell a expensive Revelation 'guide' to a new set of elderly old ladies.
Gog – centered on 185W, 97N
Magog – centered on 192E, 103S
I hope that helps
@herbie: Oh yes, god’s ten are obviously superior to anything that has ever been envisioned. All of them are critically important to the survival of humanity especially the one about not cooking a babe goat in its mother’s milk, but for some reason Christians don’t like to mention that one
Aren't they also 40,000 leagues under the sea? 🙂
@ThinkforYourself Are those coordinates mentioned in Revelation? Or are you (gasp!) interpreting scripture and, if so, on what basis do you choose the coordinates?
Try to focus freddy, that is not one of the 10 commandments,it is found in the 600 or so additional laws,dealing with and defining a series of practices the ancient Hebrews were to observe.There is more to explain but if you don't know the difference why would I bother.God bless
Your wisdom is lacking and has been shown to be in need,that never goes out of date.God bless
So, herbie, you the pot or the kettle?
Although I could never understand how exactly displaying the 10 Commadments has anything to do with the goverment establishing a particular religion or denying the freedom to exercise a religion, evidently the Supreme Court does. (trivia: the 10 comandments are inscribed circulating the base of the dome on the U.S. capital building. Because the letters are so small, about 2in high, without the aid of a telescope or binoculars simular device, they can not be read by the average person on the ground)
Well, it establishes a Judeo-Christian basis for the laws of the land. Ask yourself how you would feel if you were brought before a judge who liked to rule people against some quote from Confucius, the Qur'an or the Buddha? Actually, depending on which version and/or division of verses you chose to display, you are alienating either the Catholics, some protestants or the Jews themselves. The law of the land really should apply to everyone equally, yes?
What I want to know is, which ten commandments are they talking about?
I believe the one's that go against Separation Church and State (the buybull).
I think he means Exodus 20:1–17 or Deuteronomy 5:4–21, and what division of verses in either, favored by Catholics, Jews, some protestants, or evangelicals? Choosing just one alienates a whole lot of believers.
How about Exodus 34:28? The only palce in your book where it acautally has the words "The Ten Commandments".
And those are a totally different set than the other ones that the character Moses broke after he came down the mountain the first time. Just a big book of multiple choice.
I think the biggest problem people have with the Bible is that they view it as a single book written with a solid consensus, and not the collection of books by different authors grouped together by a common theme that it is.
Reminds me of the quote that M.A. Ferguson supposedly made, that “If English was good enough for Jesus Christ, it ought to be good enough for the children of Texas.” I think that some people kinda envision that the first copy of the Bible (a KJV) was left behind by Jesus as he checked out of the inn on the day he died.
Mary, please educate yourself on reality and logic.
I already have. It is called a Bible. Maybe you should think about reading it sometime.
Did you know there are many people in the world who could give a rat's ass about the bible? Athiests, Agnostics, Muslims, Buddhaists, Hindus, dogs, frogs and many many more. Who the fuk do you think YOU are telling people what to believe. Take your path, walk it. Enjoy it. But leave everyone else alone. Are you going to eat those tots? IDIOT I'm freakin' starving.
I don't want to end up where you'll be going. If that's how you feel, enjoy your choice of eternity.
Mary, please tell our eager audience where me, the tribes in Africa and South America, and the religions of Baha'i, Buddhism, Confucianism, Hinduism, Islam, Jainism, Judaism, Shinto, Sikhism, Taoism, Wicca, Zoroastrianism, and Druidism, in addtion to the athiests and various flavors of agnostics in the world will be going. Are you really going to say hell? Please surprise me with something half intelligent for once. For me, I would like to bunny heaven. I can dream can't I?
>>>"Who the do you think YOU are telling people what to believe. "
You mean on a basically international discussion blog on the website of one of the largest news media outlets on the planet? On a blog where mostly everyone is trying to convince others to believe and feel as they do?
Central, you might not like what she has to say but in a field of others with mostly the same motivations in their post.... why single her post out? Is it because you just disagree with her view? Are you being fair and pointing out even those post that hold your views and asking who do "they" think they are or do you find yourself conveniently silent?
The majority of the post here are not that much different than her's.... please let her speak and just debate her views.... because who the she is , is pretty much the same you have backing you up. 🙂
I already have. It is called a Bible. Maybe you should think about reading it sometime.'
And that is your problem...you fail to come out of the dark ages when that book was written. Not everyone accepts it as truth any more. You have no right to push it down other peoples throats. If your god is so real then maybe he just end all our questioning minds and prove himself to exist, until he does we will continue to follow reason and logic.
You must be what 60-70 years old? I say this because you obviously are so indoctrinated and stuck in your delusions that it wouldn't matter what was said to you, you are never going to come away. You keep annoying people and you do yourself absolutely no favor by doing so. You only make yourself look more ignorant with each post you make. I'm not certain how you can possibly feel good about yourself when you offend so many people. If your so called he.ll exists, it would be you spending eternity there for judging people...stop being a hypocritical biatch and learn the facts. (that is the vast difference between us good Atheists and you delusional literalistic christians...we don't use he.ll to threaten people...we have laws that do that and the laws we go by are the only ones that matter b/c they based in the here and now)
btw: most of us on here have read the bible and have found it to be about as valid as Cinderella; Snow White & The 7 Dwarfs
People like Mary are going to hell. It's in the bible! And it was Jesus himself who said so!
Burn, Mary, burn!
> I don't want to end up where you'll be going. If that's how you feel, enjoy your choice of eternity.
Actually, God sends us to hell based on the criteria he established. I don't have a choice in the matter, as I cannot believe in things that are silly and have no supporting evidence.
And if there was a God who made me specifically, Godwould clearly understand this and know that judging someone based on a fault hat he himself put in is stupid.
Just because someone has a different understanding of what the Bible says than you do doesn't mean that they haven't read it. Interpretation is open to debate, but there are recognized academic experts in this field like John Dominic Crossan. Perhaps your ego is preventing you from seeing this?
There is no choice of eternity. We all end up dead.
How Islam should be Judged?
Before Islam they worship idols
After worshiping the one absolute God
Before Islam they didn’t know Jesus or Mary or any prophets
After Islam who deny Jesus or Mary become blasphemer
Before no payers no charity no family relation
After Islam it become must
Before Islam us-u-ry and slavery adultery was common
After Islam got forbidden
Before Islam women has no value and all her property to her husband
After Islam become her own she can do what she like within Islamic laws
Before Islam the girls-child were buried alive
After Islam no girls-child were buried alive
Before Islam no laws or guidance to people
After Islam established the laws or guidance to people( sharia)
Before Islam tribes killing each others
After Islam they became brothers
Before Islam there was no education
After Islam became must and first word came to Muhammad from the angle was (read)
Before Islam no scientific study
After Islam seculars in chemistry and math the no.1234 are Arabic and innovated the ZERO
Before Islam they were tribes
After Islam became empire from Spain to china
And More……. I cannot do it
The Big change in history done by ( illiterate ) prophet Muhammad peace be up on him brought the people from darkness to light , but most people killed by the pride they do not want to admitted .
40) And certainly We have repeated (warnings) in this Quran that they may be mindful, but it does not add save to their aversion. (41).
(88) And certainly We have explained for men in this Quran every kind of similitude, but most men do not consent to aught but denying. (89).
And certainly We have explained in this Quran every kind of example, and man is most of all given to contention. (54).
Islam is most hated for forbidding (Us-u-r-y) and Slavery-1
Islam is most hated for forbidding (Us-u-r-y) and Slavery-2
Islam is most hated for forbidding (Us-u-r-y) and Slavery-3
Islam is most hated for forbidding (Us-u-r-y) and Slavery-4
Some examples of The Real Islam:
The Muslim Conquest of India – 11th to 18th century
■"The likely death toll is somewhere between 2 million and 80 million. The geometric mean of those two limits is 12.7 million. "
and the 19 million killed in the Mideast Slave Trade 7C-19C by Muslims.
and more recently
1a) 179 killed in Mumbai/Bombay, 290 injured
1b) Assassination of Benazir Bhutto and Theo Van Gogh
2) 9/11, 3000 mostly US citizens, 1000’s injured
3) The 24/7 Sunni-Shiite centuries-old blood feud currently being carried out in Iraq, US troops killed in action, 3,480 and 928 in non combat roles. 102,522 – 112,049 Iraqi civilians killed as of 9/16/2011/, mostly due to suicide bombers, land mines and bombs of various types, http://www.iraqbodycount.org/ and http://www.defenselink.mil/news/casualty.pdf
4) Kenya- In Nairobi, about 212 people were killed and an estimated 4000 injured; in Dar es Salaam, the attack killed at least 11 and wounded 85.
5) Bali-in 2002-killing 202 people, 164 of whom were foreign nationals, and 38 Indonesian citizens. A further 209 people were injured.
6) Bali in 2005- Twenty people were killed, and 129 people were injured by three bombers who killed themselves in the attacks.
7) Spain in 2004- killing 191 people and wounding 2,050.
8. UK in 2005- The bombings killed 52 commuters and the four radical Islamic suicide bombers, injured 700.
9) The execution of an eloping couple in Afghanistan on 04/15/2009 by the Taliban.
10) – Afghanistan: US troops 1,385 killed in action, 273 killed in non-combat situations as of 09/15/2011. Over 40,000 Afghan civilians killed due to the dark-age, koranic-driven Taliban acts of horror
11) The killing of 13 citizen soldiers at Ft. Hood by a follower of the koran.
12) 38 Russian citizens killed on March 29, 2010 by Muslim women suicide bombers.
13) The May 28, 2010 attack on a Islamic religious minority in Pakistan, which have left 98 dead,
14) Lockerbie is known internationally as the site where, on 21 December 1988, the wreckage of Pan Am Flight 103 crashed as a result of a terrorist bomb. In the United Kingdom the event is referred to as the Lockerbie disaster, the Lockerbie bombing, or simply Lockerbie. Eleven townspeople were killed in Sherwood Crescent, where the plane's wings and fuel tanks plummeted in a fiery explosion, destroying several houses and leaving a huge crater, with debris causing damage to a number of buildings nearby. The 270 fatalities (259 on the plane, 11 in Lockerbie) were citizens of 21 nations.
15 The daily suicide and/or roadside and/or mosque bombings in the terror world of Islam.
16) Bombs sent from Yemen by followers of the koran which fortunately were discovered before the bombs were detonated.
17) The killing of 58 Christians in a Catholic church in one of the latest acts of horror and terror in Iraq.
18) Moscow airport suicide bombing: 35 dead, 130 injured. January 25, 2011.
19) A Pakistani minister, who had said he was getting death threats because of his stance against the country's controversial blasphemy law, was shot and killed Wednesday, 3/2/2011
20) two American troops killed in Germany by a recently radicalized Muslim, 3/3/2011
21) the kidnapping and apparent killing of a follower of Zoraster in the dark world of Islamic Pakistan.
22) Shariatpur, Bangladesh (CNN 3/30/2011) - Hena Akhter's last words to her mother proclaimed her innocence. But it was too late to save the 14-year-old girl. Her fellow villagers in Bangladesh's Shariatpur district had already passed harsh judgment on her. Guilty, they said, of having an affair with a married man. The imam from the local mosque ordered the fatwa, or religious ruling, and the punishment: 101 lashes delivered swiftly, deliberately in public. Hena dropped after 70 and died a week later.
Islam can also be a force for good, like Christianity. Neither always is, which is why we challenge believers to really evaluate what values they take out of their religion, right?
This sounds just like Muneef...
Is that YOU, Muneef?
There are values from a variety of sources to be gained from said sources but one must be honest as to the foundations of these sources:
Only for the those interested in a religious value source update:
1. origin: http://query.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F20E1EFE35540C7A8CDDAA0894DA404482
“New Torah For Modern Minds
Abraham, the Jewish patriarch, probably never existed. Nor did Moses. The entire Exodus story as recounted in the Bible probably never occurred. The same is true of the tumbling of the walls of Jericho. And David, far from being the fearless king who built Jerusalem into a mighty capital, was more likely a provincial leader whose reputation was later magnified to provide a rallying point for a fledgling nation.
Such startling propositions – the product of findings by archaeologists digging in Israel and its environs over the last 25 years – have gained wide acceptance among non-Orthodox rabbis. But there has been no attempt to disseminate these ideas or to discuss them with the laity – until now.
The United Synagogue of Conservative Judaism, which represents the 1.5 million Conservative Jews in the United States, has just issued a new Torah and commentary, the first for Conservatives in more than 60 years. Called "Etz Hayim" ("Tree of Life" in Hebrew), it offers an interpretation that incorporates the latest findings from archaeology, philology, anthropology and the study of ancient cultures. To the editors who worked on the book, it represents one of the boldest efforts ever to introduce into the religious mainstream a view of the Bible as a human rather than divine docu-ment. “
2. Jesus was an illiterate Jewish peasant/carpenter/simple preacher man who suffered from hallucinations (or “mythicizing” from P, M, M, L and J) and who has been characterized anywhere from the Messiah from Nazareth to a mythical character from mythical Nazareth to a ma-mzer from Nazareth (Professor Bruce Chilton, in his book Rabbi Jesus). An-alyses of Jesus’ life by many contemporary NT scholars (e.g. Professors Ludemann, Crossan, Borg and Fredriksen, ) via the NT and related doc-uments have concluded that only about 30% of Jesus' sayings and ways noted in the NT were authentic. The rest being embellishments (e.g. miracles)/hallucinations made/had by the NT authors to impress various Christian, Jewish and Pagan sects.
The 30% of the NT that is "authentic Jesus" like everything in life was borrowed/plagiarized and/or improved from those who came before. In Jesus' case, it was the ways and sayings of the Babylonians, Greeks, Persians, Egyptians, Hitt-ites, Canaanites, OT, John the Baptizer and possibly the ways and sayings of traveling Greek Cynics.
For added "pizzazz", Catholic theologians divided god the singularity into three persons and invented atonement as an added guilt trip for the "pew people" to go along with this trinity of overseers. By doing so, they made god the padre into god the "filicider".
Current RCC problems:
Pedophiliac priests, an all-male, mostly white hierarchy, atonement theology and original sin!!!!
3., Luther, Calvin, Joe Smith, Henry VIII, Wesley, Roger Williams, the Great “Babs” et al, founders of Christian-based religions or combination religions also suffered from the belief in/hallucinations of "pretty wingie thingie" visits and "prophecies" for profits analogous to the myths of Catholicism (resurrections, apparitions, ascensions and immacu-late co-nceptions).
Adulterous preachers, pedophiliac clerics, "propheteering/ profiteering" evangelicals and atonement theology,
3. Mohammed was an illiterate, womanizing, lust and greed-driven, warmongering, hallucinating Arab, who also had embellishing/hallucinating/plagiarizing scribal biographers who not only added "angels" and flying chariots to the koran but also a militaristic agenda to support the plundering and looting of the lands of non-believers.
This agenda continues as shown by the ma-ssacre in Mumbai, the as-sas-sinations of Bhutto and Theo Van Gogh, the conduct of the seven Muslim doctors in the UK, the 9/11 terrorists, the 24/7 Sunni suicide/roadside/market/mosque bombers, the 24/7 Shiite suicide/roadside/market/mosque bombers, the Islamic bombers of the trains in the UK and Spain, the Bali crazies, the Kenya crazies, the Pakistani “koranics”, the Palestine suicide bombers/rocketeers, the Lebanese nutcases, the Taliban nut jobs, the Ft. Hood follower of the koran, and the Filipino “koranics”.
And who funds this muck and stench of terror? The warmongering, Islamic, Shiite terror and torture theocracy of Iran aka the Third Axis of Evil and also the Sunni "Wannabees" of Saudi Arabia.
The Sunni-Shiite blood feud and the warmongering, womanizing (11 wives), hallucinating founder.
5. Hinduism (from an online Hindu site) – "Hinduism cannot be described as an organized religion. It is not founded by any individual. Hinduism is God centered and therefore one can call Hinduism as founded by God, because the answer to the question ‘Who is behind the eternal principles and who makes them work?’ will have to be ‘Cosmic power, Divine power, God’."
The caste/laborer system, reincarnation and cow worship/reverence are problems when saying a fair and rational God founded Hinduism."
The caste system and cow worship/reverence.
6. Buddhism- "Buddhism began in India about 500 years before the birth of Christ. The people living at that time had become disillusioned with certain beliefs of Hinduism including the caste system, which had grown extremely complex. The number of outcasts (those who did not belong to any particular caste) was continuing to grow."
"However, in Buddhism, like so many other religions, fanciful stories arose concerning events in the life of the founder, Siddhartha Gautama (fifth century B.C.):"
Archaeological discoveries have proved, beyond a doubt, his historical character, but apart from the legends we know very little about the circu-mstances of his life. e.g. Buddha by one legend was supposedly talking when he came out of his mother's womb.
Bottom line: There are many good ways/values of living but be aware of the hallucinations, embellishments, lies, and myths surrounding the founders and foundations of said rules/values of life.
Then, apply the Five F rule: "First Find the Flaws, then Fix the Foundations". And finally there will be religious peace and religious awareness in the world!!!!!
fix the flaws hit report abuse to all reality posts
Hi Mary, help me understand this: Modern man has walked the Earth for 200,000 years. They didn't have the Bible. Were they judged?
God is merciful. Do you believe He would send them all to hell? I do not.
Mary believes a lot of weird sh!t. Maybe she smokes it too.
And by your logic I am going to be judged because why?
Because you have free access to the Word. If you choose to ignore it, then God will tell you to leave His sight forever.
Mary you don't make any sense at all but you are entertaining.
I make perfect sense. You simply choose to ignore what I'm saying.
Mary I'm sorry, what were you saying? Oh yeah, the good book. I agree, I use me dictionary all the time. In fact I have many good books in my library. All written by humans, just like the bible and none divinely inspired because that is just obviously just silly.
@Central: Don't feed the trolls. We all do it but the only answers she has are related to the buybull. She has never picked up any other book and it was probably the only book her parents allowed in their home. You can't change stupid. This woman comes here and all she ever does is fill the board with hate and hypocritical statements...she seriously needs her anti-psychotic meds administered by injection so they are sure to be taken instead of trusting her to do so herself.
Keep up your fight but don't expect her to change her 70 years of thinking.
Most of you people have the brain the size of a flee! It is wrong for the president of Iran to say what he says about the Jews and Hitler but it suppose to be alright what you say about God and Moses! Wake up people before we really get more of the wrath of God on our Nation(USA)! Remember the plagues(10) of Egypt! The USA is now the Egypt of OLD!
before you start talking about people with brains the size of a flea, you better go back to school and learn some English.
Correct. Not ok for him. Ok for us. That is the difference between reality and fiction. Contrats you figured it out.
How would you expect us to say anything good about a god that is so violent?
Actually I think the USA is closer to Sodom and Gomorra than biblical Egypt. However your god (if it exists) is totally impotent. It didn’t save his chosen people from the Nazis and it hasn’t sent bolts of lightning to incinerate any of the naughty televangelists or mega church pastors. In fact there is no evidence of it ever having done anything. So I’m not much worried about its current wrath
There are many different instances in the bible where God allowed his people to suffer death and destruction for various reasons. Also is it reasonable to assume that just because someone hasn't been punished immediately they've escaped punishment completely? Beyond that, if you did see a so-called "evil doer" suffer a most horrific and unfortunate cirumstance would you lay that misfortune at the feet of biblical wrath or would you just count it as some random incidence of bad luck? I only ask because I wonder what it would take to convince you.