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A Christian debate over Halloween: Counter, co-opt, or embrace it?
October 28th, 2011
02:30 PM ET

A Christian debate over Halloween: Counter, co-opt, or embrace it?

Editor's note: Listen to the CNN Radio broadcast about the debate: By Jim Roope, CNN

Los Angeles (CNN) - For many American Christians, Halloween is innocent, harmless and fun, and they trick-or-treat, carve pumpkins and don costumes with gusto.

For others, though – especially for some conservative and fundamentalist Christians - Halloween is a celebration of evil and has no place in the life of a believer.

Halloween fun facts: Spending, eating and carving

“We don’t endorse that or we don’t celebrate that,” said Joe Hernandez, pastor of Worshipwalk Church in Los Angeles, which belongs to the conservative Pentecostal tradition. “People are celebrating the devil’s holiday.”

Halloween’s roots are believed to date back 1,400 years, to the Irish-pagan New Year’s celebration. The Celtic New Year began on November 1. People would light bonfires and wear costumes to ward off roaming ghosts and evil spirits.

Movies that scare the people who scare us

Some Christians, like Hernandez, believe Halloween’s pagan roots can open the door to evil. That’s why Worshipwalk is hosting a harvest festival in its church parking lot on Monday, with kids’ games and face painting.

Hernandez calls it harvesting hearts for God.

Some conservative churches go a step further, attempting to co-opt the holiday with haunted houses - called “hell houses” - that are designed to give a glimpse of eternal damnation in hopes of strengthening faith.

“There’s Satan’s lies and there’s Jesus’ redemption and there’s a message that will change your life,” said Keenan Roberts, who says he is the inventor of the hell house, which people walk or call through, just as they would a haunted house.

I was a zombie movie extra

“It’s designed to reach the ‘sight and sound’ age,” said Roberts. “The message is sacred but the method is not.”

Hell houses can be graphic. In Roberts’ hell house – which he markets through his Hell House Ministries – live actors depict scenes of abortion, rape, suicide and murder, though the journey through the house culminates in scenes of redemption through Jesus.

Pastor of the fundamentalist New Destiny church near Denver, Colorado, Roberts said that his ministry has received a lot of criticism for what critics say is “going too far.”

But he said today’s kids are so desensitized that he will do whatever it takes to get the message of salvation to take root.

Avoiding sexy costumes for kids

Mainline Protestants tend to take a much softer line on Halloween, with some mainline churches embracing it.

“Halloween for me is a time to have fun,” said Wayne Walters, pastor at the First United Methodist Church in Burbank, California. “I remember growing up - on Halloween I went trick-or-treating. I was in it for the candy.”

“And at Christmas I put out cookies and milk for Santa Claus, who always took time to sit down and enjoy them,” he continued. “None of those I think had a negative influence, destroyed or diminished my faith, he said.”

Walters says that many non-religious traditions associated with Christian holidays, including Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny, hardly mean those holidays are non-Christian.

- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: Christianity • Halloween

soundoff (3,144 Responses)
  1. Jay Gee

    Both Halloween and Christmas are from a Pagan tradition. Whether Christians like to admit it or not, they stole Christmas from the Pagans and painted Jesus into it You cannot dismiss Halloween but keep Christmas. Of course you can if youre a total illogical hypocritical idiot...like most evangelists.

    October 29, 2011 at 4:18 pm |
    • steve N JXN

      I agree totally- the early Christian missionaries were marketing geniuses- they could put a Christian spin on just about any festive occasion. All of the major Christian festivals were originally either Jewish or Pagan. It goes right back to Paul baptising the Athenian "unknown god" as the God of the Jews and Christians. As a Christian, I am much more concerned about where festivals like Christmas are going (just another excuse for crass materialistic excess), than where they came from.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:33 pm |
    • Brian

      Constantine chose the dates of major Christian holidays to coincide with important Pagan dates. He was trying to stave off a civil war between Christians and Pagans as he consolidated his rule. As such, most every major Christian holiday is technically a day of Paganism.

      October 29, 2011 at 5:25 pm |
  2. Diane

    Whatever Halloween might have been, what it is today is a man-made holiday. Kids aren't worshipping the devil - they're getting to dress up in costumes and trick or treat and have a party. That's it. Writing more into it is irresponsible.

    Its kinda like Christmas. Whatever Christmas might have been, now people put up lights and trees and exchange gifts. When Christians celebrate Christmas, are they too giving gifts, eating big family meals, and enjoying lights and trees?

    The way I see it, you can't be a christian and condemn modern Halloween without condemning modern Christmas. They are holidays to bring family and friends and community together and to enjoy.

    October 29, 2011 at 4:16 pm |
  3. Creepy Child Toucher Guy

    I love Halloween... When else am I going to have droves of children coming to my door so I can give them candy?

    October 29, 2011 at 4:15 pm |
    • TheDudeAbides

      Yeah, yeah. Nobody's falling for that one. Pick another personality.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:16 pm |
    • Father Dan

      I agree. I tell the kids in my church to go trick or treating every Halloween, especially if they live in my neighborhood!

      October 29, 2011 at 4:19 pm |
  4. TheDudeAbides

    Fundamental Christians believe in supernatural good. Therefore, they also believe in supernatural evil. So who believes in Halloween more?

    Heck, they should be PROMOTING this holiday. It validates their existence.

    October 29, 2011 at 4:15 pm |
    • John Markham

      Correct. Especially when they practice cannibalism on Sundays, eating flesh and blood.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:17 pm |
    • Raevyn

      Is doing the Happy Dance in response to your comment sinning?

      October 29, 2011 at 4:19 pm |
  5. Jay Gee

    Hey Lisa, you can be fully educated and still be a totally brainwashed idiot. Truth.

    October 29, 2011 at 4:12 pm |
    • Raevyn

      Marry me Jay Gee.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:18 pm |
    • Lisa

      I am not brainwashed and have tried out religions. You do not know me.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:34 pm |
  6. Johnny

    Any religious belief, tradition or practice that does not line up with the Word of God should be discarded if we desire God's favor upon our lives. A true believer and follower of Christ has the potential within to discern which is right and which is not.

    Man's different opinions on halloween celebration doesn't matter. What really matters is what God says.

    October 29, 2011 at 4:10 pm |
    • armyvet33

      It is obvious that you are a devout believer, and I commend you for that. But, who can tell me what God's feelings on Halloween are? Is he a fan of worshiping evil, or of riske' costumes. Probably not. Does he have a problem with my 5 yo dressing up like Cinderella, or my 3 yo dressing up like Spider Man, and getting candy from friends and neighbors. I sure hope not. I really think people sell God short sometimes we we try to put Him into this little box and say "this is Godly" and "this is not." I surely hope that when we step back and look at the complexity of the universe, we can understand and appreciate that all of life isn't some damn trial. I think (here's my bias) that God made life to be enjoyed, to help one another, and to admire His creation. Not to think that we're always under some imagined thumb, enduring a trial until death finally delivers us to some fun.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:21 pm |
    • MOCaseA

      I suppose God talks in your ear too...

      You know, they have medications that will fix that.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:22 pm |
    • ThatSatanGuy

      Christianity is for the blind and foolish and teaches you to be miserable, monogamous, and never have any fun. Satan wants you to be happy and indulge in pleasure. ALL HAIL SATAN!!!

      October 29, 2011 at 4:25 pm |
  7. c5qu4r3d

    As usual christians should just mind their own damn business....one group here is handy out bibles instead of candy how ridiculous is that?

    October 29, 2011 at 4:10 pm |
  8. ThatSatanGuy

    All hail the mighty Satan, the true ruler of man!

    October 29, 2011 at 4:09 pm |
    • AGuest9

      satan exists not more that god.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:11 pm |
  9. zincandgermanium

    Bravo weirdo fundamentalist Christians that hand out bibles on Halloween, you've just secured your spot as the creepiest house in the cul de sac.

    October 29, 2011 at 4:08 pm |
  10. Jay Gee

    I'm tired of the pure stupidity on the part of Christians (what a shocker that they display ignorance of another culture's beliefs) that equate pagan tradition with 'Satan". it takes real self-absorption to take a concept from your own faith and force it into the culture of another faith that didn't believe in said concept to begin with. It is and always has been erroneous to equate paganism with a Christian concept like Satan. Halloween is harmless fun, leave it to Christians to suck the childlike wonder and joy out of anything and turn it into some brainwashing 'message'...about fictional places used to bully people into 'moral' behavior (such as bigotry, intolerance and greed). Fine example you're setting, Christians, a FINE example.

    October 29, 2011 at 4:08 pm |
    • Nom de Plume

      This gets into theological grounds perhaps beyond the scope of this current, ah, discussion. Note that in a discussion of Halloween, you are not only dealing with the original pagan practices, but also with post-pagan folklore. Nor were all of the pagan practices benign, even by secular standards.

      It is somewhat bemusing to see so many people upset that many Christians choose not to celebrate Halloween. That's like getting upset when someone chooses not to attend an OWS rally.

      October 29, 2011 at 5:16 pm |
  11. Raevyn

    Nice to see the CNN censors working overtime today....and with a christian bias to boot.

    October 29, 2011 at 4:07 pm |
    • Helpful Hints

      Raevyn... don't go all paranoid and persecuted on us:

      Bad letter combinations / words to avoid if you want to get past the CNN automatic filter:
      Many, if not most, are buried within other words, so use your imagination.
      You can use dashes, spaces, or other characters to modify the "offending" letter combinations.
      ---
      ar-se.....as in ar-senic.
      co-ck.....as in co-ckatiel, co-ckatrice, co-ckleshell, co-ckles, etc.
      co-on.....as in rac-oon, coc-oon, etc.
      cu-m......as in doc-ument, accu-mulate, circu-mnavigate, circu-mstances, cu-mbersome, cuc-umber, etc.
      cu-nt.....as in Scu-ntthorpe, a city in the UK famous for having problems with filters...!
      ef-fing...as in ef-fing filter
      ft-w......as in soft-ware, delft-ware, swift-water, drift-wood, etc.
      ho-mo.....as in ho-mo sapiens or ho-mose-xual, ho-mogenous, etc.
      ho-rny....as in tho-rny, etc.
      jacka-ss...yet "ass" is allowed by itself.....
      ja-p......as in j-apanese, ja-pan, j-ape, etc.
      koo-ch....as in koo-chie koo..!
      nip-ple
      o-rgy….as in po-rgy, zo-rgy, etc.
      pi-s......as in pi-stol, lapi-s, pi-ssed, therapi-st, etc.
      p-orn… as in p-ornography
      pr-ick....as in pri-ckling, pri-ckles, etc.
      que-er
      ra-pe.....as in scra-pe, tra-peze, gr-ape, thera-peutic, sara-pe, etc.
      se-x......as in Ess-ex, s-exual, etc.
      sh-@t.....but shat is okay – don't use the @ symbol there.
      sl-ut
      sn-atch
      sp-ic.....as in disp-icable, hosp-ice, consp-icuous, susp-icious, sp-icule, sp-ice, etc.
      sp-oon
      strip-per
      ti-t......as in const-itution, att-itude, ent-ities, alt-itude, beat-itude, etc.
      tw-at.....as in wristw-atch, nightw-atchman, etc.
      va-g......as in extrava-gant, va-gina, va-grant, va-gue, sava-ge, etc.
      who-re....as in who're you kidding / don't forget to put in that apostrophe!
      wt-f....also!!!!!!!

      There are more, some of them considered "racist", so do not assume that this list is complete.

      This article probably generates a bunch of "spo-oky"s and "superst-itions".

      October 29, 2011 at 4:11 pm |
    • Raevyn

      Actually, what they are blocking are blocks of scripture I tried to post showing so-called christian "feminism" about the fact that christ supposedly taught that women are to be in subjection to their husbands and their work is to stay at home and raise a family. It's very strange. I'm also not allowed to reply to lisa anymore apparently, I was a bad little commenter. I guess the devil made me do it *evil grin*.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:14 pm |
    • Helpful Hints

      Raevyn, Check your scripture quotes - and your posts to Lisa - for those word fragments... or continue with the persecution complex - whatever...

      October 29, 2011 at 4:20 pm |
    • Kenneth

      Wow, Raevyn, you really are that stupid.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:21 pm |
    • Lisa

      No, they censored mine, too.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:36 pm |
    • Aarod

      Wow, Lisa, you really are that stupid.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:41 pm |
    • Lisa

      I am not stupid. My IQ was tested as 152 on a standardized test (SAT).

      October 29, 2011 at 4:50 pm |
    • Helpful Hints

      There is NO LIVE CENSOR/MODERATOR here... only the stupid automatic nanny filter. I guess I must have a huge IQ then, if I can figure it out 🙂

      Yes, it is ridiculous – but sheesh, kids, adapt... or not.

      October 29, 2011 at 5:21 pm |
    • Lisa

      OK, I really am that stupid.

      October 29, 2011 at 5:25 pm |
    • Get Real

      Lisa, SATs do not give an IQ score. Maybe you should get your money back from your college/university.

      October 29, 2011 at 5:25 pm |
    • Nom de Plume

      Raevyn, it's a two-way street. The same scripture, if you read on, declare that men are to love their wives as Christ loved the church. When you consider Jesus gave His life, that's a pretty high standard. There's also scripture that warns husbands to treat their wives well, so their prayers won't be hindered. You can't take one without the other; it's a package deal.

      October 29, 2011 at 5:26 pm |
    • Lisa

      If you do a search on the internet, you can easily find a scale based on what you scored on the SAT. A 700, for instance, is the equivalent of a 152 IQ. So uneducated....

      October 29, 2011 at 10:35 pm |
    • Lisa

      I read on an internet conversion site a few years ago that a math score of 700 was equivalent to a 152 math IQ. I cannot find this now. However, I just found several other conversion sites. This is one: http://www.iqcomparisonsite.com/oldSATIQ.aspx. Since I took the SAT in 1993 and scored about a 1300, my IQ is probably at least in the 130s. What I am trying to say in that I am not stupid. It so sad when people call you stupid anyway. It is a sign that they have no argument and are probably frustrated they cannot think of anything clever to say. My test score would get me into MENSA.

      Of course, I am incorrect all of the time and do not think that I know everything. I believe God is real because of faith and the peace that the Holy Spirit gives me.

      October 29, 2011 at 11:16 pm |
  12. Wrod

    Christmas was a Pagan holiday before the Christians took it. They would bring live evergreen trees into homes during the harsh winters as a reminder that their crops would grow again. I don't see how you can steal one Pagan holiday and then call another the "devils holiday".

    October 29, 2011 at 4:06 pm |
    • Nom de Plume

      The Christmas Tree is a "mash-up" of pagan and Christian belief. Take one part legend of Boniface declaring the fir tree dedicated to Jesus Christ in his ministry to the Germanic peoples; one part Paradise Tree from the Feast of Adam and Eve, celebrated on December 24; one part pagan tradition of keeping some evergreen indoors during winter; mix well, and there's your Christmas tree. It's doubtful that we'd have our current version without all three. The Paradise Tree in particular was decorated with fruits as a symbol of the Garden of Eden. Christmas Tree ornaments, anyone?

      October 29, 2011 at 5:33 pm |
  13. Ground Zero

    **** peick

    Your argument presumes that whatever a religion thinks it is worshiping is what it actually is worshiping. In the Christian milieu, Satan deceives people into believing lies and can appear even as an "angel of light." So if you are worshiping a "harmless" pagan deity that is all about "good and light," and if that deity is not real but a deception of Satan (which we believe it is), then you are worshiping the devil indirectly.

    APPLY THAT TO YOUR POPE.
    THE ANTI CHRIST.

    October 29, 2011 at 4:05 pm |
  14. Tim

    If believers... that is, believers in what the Bible has to say, actually observe what is in the Bible, then this matter of Halloween, Christmas and Easter would all be answered very easily. Christmas and Halloween can be responded to by observing Sukkot and Easter by the observance of Pesach (Passover) and the Feast of Unleavened Bread. The biggest problem for Christians is not Halloween, Saturnalia or anything else. The biggest problem with Christians is that neither their teachers nor their followers read for understanding. They simply pull stuff from wherever they want it, in order to control others. This is covered elsewhere with a view of the Nicolaitans. Christians choose victory over the people, rather than mastery of their own lives and all of this stuff is a result of it. They get what's coming to them.... CONFUSION!

    October 29, 2011 at 4:04 pm |
  15. daveinOhio

    Wouln't this be a better world if people would stop shoving their beliefs in the face of others? Let my beliefs alone and I'll do the same for you.

    October 29, 2011 at 4:03 pm |
    • Jeb

      Yep

      October 29, 2011 at 4:09 pm |
  16. Rosann

    Hell houses are mental abuse. Christians need to lighten up and lose their myths...

    October 29, 2011 at 4:00 pm |
    • Lisa

      It is not a myth. I was healed of a terminal heart condition by the Holy Spirit. I'll bet you have not read any historical accounts on the life of Jesus or done any significant reading of the Bible.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:03 pm |
    • Jeb

      Millions of Christians are suffering from terminal silliness.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:11 pm |
    • CJG

      Lisa, I'm an atheist and I have read every single word of the bible (I did a year-long reading plan...biggest waste of time ever). I'm going to go ahead and say you were most likely healed by science, technology, and the doctors who used them for good. Give credit where credit is due for once in your life.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:11 pm |
    • AGuest9

      Lisa, I am guessing that a cardiologist would disagree with your assumption.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:13 pm |
    • MOCaseA

      Lisa... Let me guess. The Holy Spirit worked through the doctors who spent DECADES learning their craft, and the pharmacologists who spend 20-30 years testing and perfecting the treatments you took.

      Or did some semi-transparent personage appear before you, touch you and suddenly your heart was all better?

      October 29, 2011 at 4:16 pm |
    • Lisa

      O my goodness, I was not healed by science or technology!!!! For 9 years doctors could not diagnose me. Finally, I did research on the internet and found I had an arythmia. I told the next doctor this. He did not even know what test to give me. I had to tell him to give me a tilt test. I was on Norpace CR and had to take up to 8 pills a day. I was so tired I could not walk more than a block without getting out of breath. With the Norpace, I grew worse and worse and needed to sleep about 23 hours a day. Then I prayed and believed God's promises for Christians and was healed. Science definitely did not heal me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am happy to praise wonderful doctors. My best friend is a doctor and God uses doctors to heal many people.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:21 pm |
    • CJG

      Lisa, thanks for clearing that up. I now have further proof that you're a lunatic.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:27 pm |
    • MOCaseA

      So you prayed for the one hour each day you were awake (instead of eating and performing your daily ablations) and suddenly you were healed! You no longer needed to take any medications, and the next day you were up hopping skipping singing and dancing without a twinge or problem! Praise the Lord! You've just converted me (back) if true!

      Or was it a gradual healing, like say over the course of several month where you had to rebuild your muscles, take a steady regiment of different drugs, and then after a long uphill battle you were given a clean bill of health?

      Also, if your Doctor didn't know what arrhythmia was, I'd have dropped him in an instant as even Paramedics know what one is, and how to treat a flare-up. Also, if your "cardiologist" didn't know what one was or how to test for it, then he WASN'T a Cardiologist.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:34 pm |
    • Lisa

      The doctors said I have fireballs of the eucharist.

      October 29, 2011 at 5:22 pm |
  17. armyvet33

    I am so tired of America being being so divided - "you're either on this side or that side." And part of the reason is stories like this. Remember when your news was 30 minutes a night, or maybe and hour, and half of it was local with weather thrown in? Now we have 24 hour access, and they have to fill the space with garbage like this. There was a time when it was normal to be normal. For Halloween, normal was having a pretty easy, fun day at school on Halloween, going home and getting costumed up, going Trick or Treating, maybe getting scared at a couple of houses, eating too much candy, and then talking about it the next day at school/church. Nobody thought about it. It's just what we did. Now we have stories like "Christians are scared to death of Halloween" and "Hollywood Starlet Bimbo McGhee Lets it all Hang Out of Her Costume." People, remember that neither extreme is the norm, and don't let it be. Let your kid dress up, keep 'em same, let them get some candy, and just be a kid for one frik'n night. The world isn't fun enough to take another piece of childhood away.

    October 29, 2011 at 3:56 pm |
    • armyvet33

      Meant "keep them safe." Pretty late here in Iraq.

      October 29, 2011 at 3:58 pm |
    • chicago7

      You said it all. I have nothing to add except, "What (s)he said."

      October 29, 2011 at 4:02 pm |
    • daveinOhio

      Exactly right. This would be a pretty boring world for some people if they didn't have so many unimportant things to worry about.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:06 pm |
    • Ground Zero

      If it upsets you so much, stop reading them.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:09 pm |
  18. Danelle

    It's easy to counter in a very peaceful and even fun way. Here's how. Halloween was originally " All Hallows Eve" and was a Christian belief that God gave "bad souls" a last chance to roam the Earth before being condemned to Hell for eternity. It is followed by "All Saints Day" which is celebrated November 1st and is the Christian (Catholic) belief that all "good souls" are rewarded and given dominion over the Earth. So to counter any negative Halloween issues, simply celebrate All Saints Day. It could actually become a very big and joyous celebration that emphasizes positive aspects of life and one that conservative Christians, parents and societies could embrace.

    October 29, 2011 at 3:55 pm |
    • MOCaseA

      Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!

      Thank you for that laugh...

      Now be a good little christian and go pretend to read your bible while your religious leadership tells you what to think. What ever you do, don't research the actual roots of Halloween, because it will contradict what your pastor/priest told you and only leave you confused.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:12 pm |
    • Father Dan

      Halloween is for the children though (and for those of us who really like children).

      October 29, 2011 at 4:21 pm |
    • ThatSatanGuy

      Father Dan, you sound evil. Are you sure you're not one of us?

      October 29, 2011 at 4:49 pm |
    • A Christian

      The church (I mean Roman Catholic) had a habit of co-opting the local people's festivals. I think what we call Halloween was actually a pagan new year festival on the night of which spirits of those who had died that year walked the earth. The church changed the name from Samhain to "All Hallows Eve". Yule became Christmas, scholars think Jesus was actually born during the spring. Easter gets it's name from a fertility goddes named Eoster, who appeared in the form of a rabbit (Easter Bunny anyone)? Point is that the the local people were used to a party at certain times, to help with converting to Christianity the church said OK, you can have your party, now it's just called All Hallows, Christmas, Easter and now it's a Christian celebration.

      October 29, 2011 at 5:32 pm |
  19. Lisa

    Jesus was actually a feminist. In Jewish culture, men were not openly conversed with woman in public. He did. He also allowed many woman to be part of his ministry. In addition, the first person who saw him was a woman. He also forgave and released the woman who committed adultery. Jesus was progressive towards woman. God allowed the feminist movement because he does not want woman to be oppressed.

    October 29, 2011 at 3:53 pm |
    • Raevyn

      You got an "A" in brainwashing 101, didn't you?

      October 29, 2011 at 3:54 pm |
    • Lisa

      Sorry, I meant: Jesus was actually a feminist. In Jewish culture, men did not openly converse with woman they did not know in public. He did. He also allowed many women to be part of his ministry. In addition, the first person who saw him after he was raised was a woman. He also forgave and released the woman who committed adultery. Jesus was progressive towards woman. God allowed the feminist movement because he does not want women to be oppressed.

      October 29, 2011 at 3:57 pm |
    • Magic

      Lisa, Odd that none of those old-timey Hebrew "prophets" foresaw this unique situation and had it written down, eh?

      October 29, 2011 at 3:59 pm |
    • Lisa

      No, I was not brainwashed. I am highly educated and have a master's degree. I have received As in school, including graduate school.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:02 pm |
    • Tim

      If believers... that is, believers in what the Bible has to say, actually observe what is in the Bible, then this matter of Halloween, Christmas and Easter would all be answered very easily. Christmas and Halloween can be responded to by observing Sukkot and Easter by the observance of Pesach (Passover) and the Feast of Unleavened Bread. The biggest problem for Christians is not Halloween, Saturnalia or anything else. The biggest problem with Christians is that neither their teachers nor their followers read for understanding. They simply pull stuff from wherever they want it, in order to control others. This is covered elsewhere with a view of the Nicolaitans. Christians choose victory over the people, rather than mastery of their own lives and all of this stuff is a result of it. They get what's coming to them.... CONFUSION!

      October 29, 2011 at 4:03 pm |
    • Lisa

      I observe Passover, Rosh Hashanah and other Jewish Holidays. Jesus was the fulfillment of the Jewish prophesy and the Jewish promises. The Hebrew word for feast, I believe, means a meeting with God. As Christians, we should still observe the Jewish Holidays. God has revealed himself through the Biblical feasts. He was crucified on Passover, raised on the Feast of Firstfruits and the Holy Spirit came on the Feast of Penecost. He will probably return on another feast.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:10 pm |
    • Grace Of The Witch

      Jesus was a gay hippy.
      Long hair, beard, sandles.
      Hung around with 12 guys drinking wine.
      You do the math.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:16 pm |
  20. Lisa

    More wisdom from the Bible: "One who isolates himself pursues selfish desires; he rebels against all sound judgment." Prov.18:1

    "A fool does not delight in understanding, but only wants to show off his opinions." Prov. 18:2

    October 29, 2011 at 3:45 pm |
    • Raevyn

      The bible is a book written by men. It is contradictory, misogynistic, and is used by men everywhere as a tool to put them in positions of power over people and have an easy income.

      October 29, 2011 at 3:51 pm |
    • MOCaseA

      So by "isolating myself" from your religion I'm pursuing my own selfish desires? So deciding I'd rather raise my children with open minds, minds that are not constrained by bigotry or religious dogma, I'm being selfish. By trying to teach them more than I know now, and encouraging them to ask questions, by keeping them from being restricted to a single viewpoint as laid down as gospel almost two millennia ago, I'm being selfish. I'm rebelling against "sound judgement" by wanting more for my children than I had and have. Sure... I'm a horrible person.

      "A fool doesn't delight in understanding, but only wants to show off his/her opinions." So just what are you doing on an OPINION blog?

      October 29, 2011 at 4:07 pm |
    • Lisa

      No, I believe you are not understanding that Proverb. It means a person who is a fool just likes to show people all of the knowledge and/or opinions s/he has. This person does not openly listen to the ideas of others and truly want to learn. A fool just wants to show everyone what s/he believes and is not seeking any understanding for herself.

      By isolating- haven't you seen how those mass murderers do not want to associate with people. If you isolate yourself and do not want to associate with people (all of the time, not just to take a short break), then you may be acting selfishly. You don't want to deal with other people.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:14 pm |
    • Grace Of The Witch

      ** "A fool does not delight in understanding, but only wants to show off his opinions

      Like Lisa.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:17 pm |
    • Lisa

      I am doing this for the people who are open-minded and seeking God. If I delighted in giving my opinions, I wouldn't post here, where I am frequently trashed. I love people and hope to reach some before it is too late.

      I am alway trying to learn. For instance, someone convinced me a few years ago of the benefits of socialism.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:25 pm |
    • ThatSatanGuy

      Here's some wisdom for you. This is for those who are open minded and seeking Satan!

      1. Satan represents indulgence, instead of abstinence!

      2. Satan represents vital existence, instead of spiritual pipe dreams!

      3. Satan represents undefiled wisdom, instead of hypocritical self-deceit!

      4. Satan represents kindness to those who deserve it, instead of love wasted on ingrates!

      5. Satan represents vengeance, instead of turning the other cheek!

      6. Satan represents responsibility to the responsible, instead of concern for psychic
      vampires!

      7. Satan represents man as just another animal, sometimes better, more often worse than
      those that walk on all-fours, who, because of his "divine spiritual and intellectual
      development", has become the most vicious animal of all!

      8. Satan represents all of the so-called sins, as they all lead to physical, mental, or
      emotional gratification!

      9. Satan has been the best friend the church has ever had, as he has kept it in business all
      these years!

      October 29, 2011 at 4:46 pm |
    • MOCaseA

      I'm going to consolidate my reply to both you posts into this one.

      Fist of all, not only am I what you would refer to as "fallen from the grace of God" (as in I turned my back on Christianity long ago) but I am also quite well versed in the Bible and it's "teachings."

      Lets start with your quoted verses:

      Proverbs 18:2 "A fool hath no delight in understanding, but that his heart may discover itself" Yes, a little different than the verse you posted (Mine was KJV while yours was NIV). In essence it says that a person who thinks they know everything, without looking for further understand, is a fool.
      Proverbs 18:1 "Through desire a man, having separated himself, seeketh and intermeddleth with all wisdom." Again KJV vs your NIV (which you didn't even quote correctly!). For accuracy I'll repost the verse: "An unfriendly person pursues selfish ends and against all sound judgement starts quarrels." But we'll not belabor the point that YOU changed the word of God to fit YOUR desires and ends. Instead we'll just concentrate on what the bible really says. In a nutshell, by separating yourself from the rest of humanity, in any form or fashion, you don't add to the collective who in gaining greater wisdom or understanding, you actually HINDER it.

      Basically by saying (and believing) you are MORE special in some way or another you are separating yourself from the rest of humanity, elevating yourself above your peers, and instead of actually bringing about wisdom and understanding you HINDER it.

      In conclusion I'd like to pull a page from your very own special book and quote a single scripture at you, one you seem to have missed the first few times around: Proverbs 18:7 "The mouths of fools are their undoing, and their lips are a snare to their very lives." (Used NIV just for you)

      October 29, 2011 at 4:54 pm |
    • Lisa

      I did not quote the NIV. I quoted the Holman Christian Standard Bible.

      October 29, 2011 at 4:59 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.