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On Sunday, Catholic Mass won't sound the same
Rev. Benny George is a associate pastor at St. Francis Xavier Parish in Burbank, California.
November 26th, 2011
01:40 PM ET

On Sunday, Catholic Mass won't sound the same

By Jim Roope, CNN Radio National Correspondent

(CNN)–If you’re Catholic, mass this Sunday will sound different for  the first time in nearly half a century.

You’ll hear it in the prayers of both the people and the priests.

“We have come back to a more accurate translation of the Latin from the Roman Missal,” said Fr. Rick Hilgartner, executive director of the Divine Office of Worship for the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops. “The language of prayer should be evocative, speaking in terms of imagery and metaphor.”

The changes are enormous, said Fr. Richard Albarano, of St. Francis Xavier Church in Burbank, California, and should help the 280 million English-speaking Catholics grow in their  love for the mass. “The mass is the center of our lives,” said Albarano.

Not since the Second Vatican Council in 1965 have such sweeping changes been made.

The Vatican II changes were radical – the priest spoke in English instead of Latin and he faced the people instead of having his back to them. An Old Testament reading was also added to the mass, a surprise to many who thought of the Catholic Church as a New Testament only church.

Other changes, large and small, were designed by Pope John XXIII to get the people (and not just the priest) involved in the mass. But the changes were not communicated in advance. People showed up one Sunday morning, and it was all changed.

“They wondered if they were even in a Catholic church,” said Albarano.

This time, the Catholic Church has been talking about the changes, and communicating them to parishes, since 2000. For the past three months, many parishes have been working to ready their followers for the changes in the wording of the prayers.

That doesn’t mean some won’t be caught by surprise. “It’s going to be like Vatican II all over again,” Albarano said. “I haven’t heard much about catechizing across the Los Angeles Archdiocese at all. We said we were going to do it. I hope we did.”

To hear the complete story, click the audio player.

- CNN

Filed under: Catholic Church • Mass

soundoff (1,372 Responses)
  1. Jonathan

    Mass should be spelled with a capital 'm.' Please fix this CNN, out of respect for the proper name. The words mass and Mass mean two different things. Thank you

    November 29, 2011 at 1:42 am |
    • TruthPrevails

      It's the wonderful joy of the English language...so many different meanings for the same words. Capitalizing a word usually gives the word some respect. When we speak of mass in the sense of the catholic church no respect is given. They harbor pedophiles and until they stop doing so, they deserve no respect!

      November 29, 2011 at 6:39 am |
    • well

      It is a shame that the only group that bigots can openly revile today are Catholics. I mean where are all the good jokes about Jews, blacks, Mexicans and Asians? All a bigot has left are jokes about Catholic Priests, who, by the way abuse at statistically lower rates than public school teachers and the same as Protestant ministers. Not that a bigot would care.....

      November 29, 2011 at 9:24 am |
  2. rod1148

    No one has explained why the Latin of the 1950s (and before) was the highest expression of prayer. Didn't the 2nd Vatican council mandate bringing the Church into the 20th century? There were a lot more changes than just the language. Priest faces people, Hebrew scriptures were added, the liturgical readings now operated on a 3 year cycle not just one year. Lay people became lectors and Eucharistic ministers and many other changes. That would seem to indicate that the Mass had not reached it's full potential in the 50s. The church should be about growth not stagnation with a dead language as its source. The Church is alive but the powers that be seem intent on making it into a museum. BTW, I am a 63 yr old Catholic and have lived and grown through all the changes of Vatican 2. I am finding it very difficult to go back and pretend that what we had in the 50s was as good as it could be.

    November 28, 2011 at 6:28 pm |
    • gerald

      The Mass is no better or worse in one form or another. Christ is no less in the Eucharist in one Mass over another. People however change and so in order to connect them to the Mass more deeply changes are made from time to time. That's all. The Mass is always the highest form of prayer no matter in what language.

      November 29, 2011 at 11:23 am |
    • gerald

      BTW we are not going back to the Latin Mass. However for years now there has been a noted lack of reverence for the Mass. The more formal language of the changes is meant to bring back some of the reverence. For God's sake Jesus Christ is on the altar! Why should the Church not desire more reverence?

      November 29, 2011 at 11:25 am |
  3. Muneef

    I wonder the number of times the changes took place for such masses and if such acts has ever changed the course and the understandiwhere wonder where will such changes taking place for religions in general end it to be in different eras...?!

    November 28, 2011 at 6:14 pm |
  4. Muneef

    Bro.Iqbal Khan.

    Think this post link should look good if you post it in (israels-backers-step-up-efforts-to-win-african-american-support/comment-)...

    November 28, 2011 at 6:02 pm |
  5. Luther&CalvinWereCorrect

    Let me know when the Catholic Church decides to repeal the Council of Trent, then we can talk. It only cemented the errors of their theology and the divide between catholics and reformers.

    November 28, 2011 at 5:27 pm |
  6. Iqbal khan

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sPLKA7tRx8s&feature=related

    November 28, 2011 at 4:39 pm |
    • Muneef

      Repeat.

      Bro.Iqbal Khan.

      Think this post link should look good if you post it in (israels-backers-step-up-efforts-to-win-african-american-support/comment-)...

      November 28, 2011 at 6:05 pm |
    • offensive beard

      Iggy piggy you can post these videos where ever u want...no one really cares

      November 28, 2011 at 8:57 pm |
    • Muneef

      Iggy piggy.

      You never know who cares but assure you not every one are as careless as you are...

      November 29, 2011 at 5:49 pm |
  7. Ginny Dear

    Who Cares!! Cannot understand why the Catholic powers that be would even spend one second changing "words"
    when they have MAJOR problems they refuse to address.

    November 28, 2011 at 2:26 pm |
    • TR6

      Well, since their T1tanic has already struck the ice berg of pedophilia there’s not much they can do besides rearrange the deck chairs

      November 28, 2011 at 4:33 pm |
  8. holyhellministry

    The posts and comments on this article have been very interesting and somewhat diverse from the original story theme. They've pointed out the deadening unformity aspects of so called traditional Catholicism; the bland repelling black & white elements of an old traditional church in a modern world of living color. Not stereotyped "hatred" as implied. I think the comments alone on this article would themselves make a nice book for charity and provide a near complete objective view into the history and development of the Catholic Church.

    November 28, 2011 at 8:33 am |
    • Ghera

      The comments on this board would indeed make an excellent book; however, the book would exemplify the utter failing of public education and parents. Clearly, this country has failed to produce civil and intelligent individuals who can debate a topic.

      November 29, 2011 at 6:20 am |
  9. Ghera

    Credenza,
    I agree. I would be appropriate and refreshing if the individuals who post on these boards did stick to the topic and simply comment on the changes in the Mass. Unfortunately, it seems that any time a topic having to do with Catholicism is posted, it provides an opportunity for certain persons to spew their vitriole at the Church. In order to do this, the mantra is almost invariably references to the pedophile issue, the age old "Catholics don't read the Bible and worship statues" or atheism denying the existence of God.

    Seventy-five years ago, their predecessors would have put on their white hoods and under the cloak of anonymity, set fire to churches, synagogues and the homes of Blacks. Now, the white hood has been traded for the anonymity of the internet. Same bigotry, different century. Ironically, some of the very same groups that are so quick to bash Catholics have been the victims of bigotry and oppression themselves. Guess it makes it ok to engage in the same behavior as long as you can be the bully/oppressor. Something about the pot/kettle.

    So, no matter how innocuous or benign the topic, if it has to do with Catholicism, out they come. It is impossible for these types to stay on topic because that would not provide a platform or venue for their hate.

    As for the topic at hand, several posters have noted the changes in the language. As I understand it, this was initiated by Pope John Paull II. He noted that as the Mass had been translated from the original Latin, it had become more colloquial. In addition, there were some countries that translated from English to their native language losing even more. In the interest of uniformity, they have opted to implement language that is closer to the original Latin.

    Personally, I appreciate the closer adherence to the original Latin; however, I am not fond of the music that has been chosen to accompany the changes. Much more of a traditionalist.

    November 28, 2011 at 5:41 am |
    • chief

      100 years ago priests were doing their ped duties on american indian children..... they ran out and now go for white and black kids..... and people like you defend the church that supports peds

      November 28, 2011 at 9:29 am |
    • catholic engineer

      For general information: At one time in history, latin was considered to be the highest of all languages. Naturally, it made sense that praising God should be done in the highest language. After Jerome, the Bible was copied in Latin. In those days, anyone who could read or write, read or wrote Latin. After the printing press and Gutenburg Bible, bibles could be printed in the languages of the masses. However, still illiterate, the masses needed the scriptures interpreted to them ( under whose authority?). So, I appreciate the Latin old latin mass, too.

      Anyone listening to the media has got to ask, "Does the media know what it's talking about? Is it telling the truth? What's it's agenda?" Unlike the media, with the changes to the Mass, we know what we're getting.

      The church has operated in nearly every culture and society since the beginning. You can't do that without being resilient.
      Or it can just wait. The Church always outlasts her enemies and is usually there to bury them. When people say "the church should get with the times", they are really saying, "catch the latest fad, and become irrelevant when the fad does."

      November 28, 2011 at 9:53 am |
    • News Flash

      Considered "the highest" by whom ? The users of it ? The non-users of it ? The believers ? The objective linguists ? Let's see the data.

      November 28, 2011 at 10:39 am |
    • catholic engineer

      @chief "......and people like you defend the church that supports peds". I"m going to apply your reasoning to the events at Penn State. How's this: " they hid pedophelia at Penn State. I always knew football was an evil sport."

      November 28, 2011 at 12:15 pm |
    • catholic engineer

      @news flash "Considered "the highest" by whom?" Well, by the early counterparts of those who are making language changes today- church liturgists. Something similar happens in civil law. More than once you and I have been confused by the language in contracts, patents, copyrights, or gubment bills, ballots. Such language is "over our heads."

      November 28, 2011 at 12:29 pm |
    • Credenza

      Thanks for your response Ghera, I appreciate it. Respect and Peace to you and yours.

      November 28, 2011 at 12:52 pm |
    • blackfeather53

      It is depressing to see what appears to be news is nothing more than smear tactics against the Jewish nation of Israel and fuel for more racist issues to cause divisions.

      November 29, 2011 at 6:27 am |
    • Ghera

      Catholic engineer re: your response to chief: You referenced logic and you are absolutely correct in the statement; however, time and time again I have observed these individuals to be unable to comprehend any form of logical arguement.

      November 29, 2011 at 6:28 am |
  10. mwa

    Mr. Roope:
    re "The Vatican II changes were radical... An Old Testament reading was also added to the mass, a surprise to many who thought of the Catholic Church as a New Testament only church." Perhaps you are not familiar with the prayers of the Extraordinary Form (pre-Vatican II) Mass, but they include numerous texts from the Old Testament–at every Mass, most of the propers: the introit, gradual or tract, alleluia, offertorio, communio, were almost always from the Old Testament!

    November 28, 2011 at 1:01 am |
    • Credenza

      Absolutely right mwa – I was brought up on it.

      I wish some people who read these articles would refrain from making wild statements without any personal knowledge of the Faith.

      November 28, 2011 at 12:55 pm |
  11. Reality

    Again, for the next change:

    The Apostles' Creed 2011: (updated by yours truly based on the studies of NT historians and theologians of the past 200 years)

    Should I believe in a god whose existence cannot be proven
    and said god if he/she/it exists resides in an unproven,
    human-created, spirit state of bliss called heaven?????

    I believe there was a 1st century CE, Jewish, simple,
    preacher-man who was conceived by a Jewish carpenter
    named Joseph living in Nazareth and born of a young Jewish
    girl named Mary. (Some say he was a mamzer.)

    Jesus was summarily crucified for being a temple rabble-rouser by
    the Roman troops in Jerusalem serving under Pontius Pilate,

    He was buried in an unmarked grave and still lies
    a-mouldering in the ground somewhere outside of
    Jerusalem.

    Said Jesus' story was embellished and "mythicized" by
    many semi-fiction writers. A bodily resurrection and
    ascension stories were promulgated to compete with the
    Caesar myths. Said stories were so popular that they
    grew into a religion known today as Catholicism/Christianity
    and featuring dark-age, daily wine to blood and bread to body rituals
    called the eucharistic sacrifice of the non-atoning Jesus.

    Amen

    November 27, 2011 at 11:17 pm |
    • Reality

      Some added references concerning the historic Jesus:

      o 1. Historical Jesus Theories, earlychristianwritings.com/theories.htm – the names of many of the contemporary historical Jesus scholars and the ti-tles of their over 100 books on the subject.
      2. Early Christian Writings, earlychristianwritings.com/
      – a list of early Christian doc-uments to include the year of publication–
      3. Historical Jesus Studies, faithfutures.org/HJstudies.html,
      – "an extensive and constantly expanding literature on historical research into the person and cultural context of Jesus of Nazareth"
      4. Jesus Database, faithfutures.org/JDB/intro.html–"The JESUS DATABASE is an online annotated inventory of the traditions concerning the life and teachings of Jesus that have survived from the first three centuries of the Common Era. It includes both canonical and extra-canonical materials, and is not limited to the traditions found within the Christian New Testament."
      5. Josephus on Jesus mtio.com/articles/bissar24.htm
      6. The Jesus Seminar, mystae.com/restricted/reflections/messiah/seminar.html#Criteria
      7. Writing the New Testament- mystae.com/restricted/reflections/messiah/testament.html
      8. Health and Healing in the Land of Israel By Joe Zias
      joezias.com/HealthHealingLandIsrael.htm
      9. Economics in First Century Palestine, K.C. Hanson and D. E. Oakman, Palestine in the Time of Jesus, Fortress Press, 1998.
      10. 7. The Gnostic Jesus
      (Part One in a Two-Part Series on Ancient and Modern Gnosticism)
      by Douglas Groothuis: equip.org/free/DG040-1.htm

      November 27, 2011 at 11:26 pm |
    • Credenza

      Reality, you've been showing off with this juvenile tripe before on a different forum. Do try to stick to the current discussion about the relatively few changes to the Mass.
      Repeating your boring exhibitionist piece doesn't cut it!

      November 27, 2011 at 11:33 pm |
    • Jeff in Columbus

      Why feel the need to denigrate other people's beliefs? Simply because they don't adhere with your own?

      And Catholics don't need "proof" of our religion. Its called FAITH for a reason. For example, do you need "proof" every day that your spouse don't cheat on you? Or do you just have FAITH in them that they will be...well.."faithful" to their vows?

      November 28, 2011 at 7:05 am |
    • Reality

      Saving Christians from the Infamous Resurrection/Easter Con/Disease:

      From that famous passage: In 1 Corinthians 15 St. Paul reasoned, "If Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith."

      Even now Catholic/Christian professors of theology are questioning the bodily resurrection of the simple, preacher man aka Jesus.

      To wit;

      From a major Catholic university's theology professor’s grad school white-board notes:

      "Heaven is a Spirit state or spiritual reality of union with God in love, without earthly – earth bound distractions.
      Jesus and Mary's bodies are therefore not in Heaven.

      Most believe that it to mean that the personal spiritual self that survives death is in continuity with the self we were while living on earth as an embodied person.

      Again, the physical Resurrection (meaning a resuscitated corpse returning to life), Ascension (of Jesus' crucified corpse), and Assumption (Mary's corpse) into heaven did not take place.

      The Ascension symbolizes the end of Jesus' earthly ministry and the beginning of the Church.

      Only Luke's Gospel records it. The Assumption ties Jesus' mission to Pentecost and missionary activity of Jesus' followers The Assumption has multiple layers of symbolism, some are related to Mary's special role as "Christ bearer" (theotokos). It does not seem fitting that Mary, the body of Jesus' Virgin-Mother (another biblically based symbol found in Luke 1) would be derived by worms upon her death. Mary's assumption also shows God's positive regard, not only for Christ's male body, but also for female bodies." "

      "In three controversial Wednesday Audiences, Pope John Paul II pointed out that the essential characteristic of heaven, hell or purgatory is that they are states of being of a spirit (angel/demon) or human soul, rather than places, as commonly perceived and represented in human language. This language of place is, according to the Pope, inadequate to describe the realities involved, since it is tied to the temporal order in which this world and we exist. In this he is applying the philosophical categories used by the Church in her theology and saying what St. Thomas Aquinas said long before him."
      http://eternal-word.com/library/PAPALDOC/JP2HEAVN.HTM

      The Vatican quickly embellished this story with a lot CYAP.

      Of course, we all know that angels are really mythical "pretty wingie talking thingies".

      With respect to rising from the dead, we also have this account:

      An added note: As per R.B. Stewart in his introduction to the recent book, The Resurrection of Jesus, Crossan and Wright in Dialogue,

      p.4

      "Reimarus (1774-1778) posits that Jesus became sidetracked by embracing a political position, sought to force God's hand and that he died alone deserted by his disciples. What began as a call for repentance ended up as a misguided attempt to usher in the earthly political kingdom of God. After Jesus' failure and death, his disciples stole his body and declared his resurrection in order to maintain their financial security and ensure themselves some standing."

      p.168. by Ted Peters:

      Even so, asking historical questions is our responsibility. Did Jesus really rise from the tomb? Is it necessary to have been raised from the tomb and to appear to his disciples in order to explain the rise of early church and the transcription of the bible? Crossan answers no, Wright answers, yes. "

      So where are the bones"? As per Professor Crossan's analyses in his many books, the body of Jesus would have ended up in the mass graves of the crucified, eaten by wild dogs, covered with lime in a shallow grave, or under a pile of stones.

      November 28, 2011 at 9:32 am |
    • TR6

      @ Jeff in Columbus: “Why feel the need to denigrate other people's beliefs”

      When those beliefs cause the deaths of millions of people in Africa because they discourage the use of condoms, yes, they do need denigration

      November 28, 2011 at 4:44 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's

      Bravo, TR.

      November 28, 2011 at 9:10 pm |
    • Reality

      Using Guttmacher Inst-itute data on birth control method failure rates, one is able to calculate the number of unplanned pregnancies resulting from the current use of male condoms in the USA. It is an horrific number of 1.2 million/yr. Even perfect use of would result in 138,000 unplanned pregnancies.

      (And what is the abortion rate in the USA? ~1,000,000/yr CDC data.)

      And B16 expects male condoms to prevent contracting AIDs?

      Conclusion: currently, a perfect barrier system does not exist. Time to develop one. In the meantime, mono-masturbation or mutual masturbation for heterose-xuals are highly recommended for those at risk. Abstinence is the another best-solution but obviously the se-x drive typically vitiates this option although being biological would it not be able to develop a drug to temporarily eliminate said drive?

      November 29, 2011 at 12:55 am |
  12. RichardSRussell

    Do you know of any other organization besides religion that has to get together at least weekly to repeat over and over again "We're not wrong! No, we're not wrong! Everything we believe is absolutely true!"? Sounds like massive insecurity to me. And, may I add, fully JUSTIFIED insecurity.

    November 27, 2011 at 10:06 pm |
    • Credenza

      Richard you're obviously not a Catholic, so why on earth would it bother you?? We don't ONLY go to church once week and although we follow the format – every Mass is different. Different Gospel readings; different sermons and even humour!!!!
      We're happy being close to God, and secure in our beliefs.

      You sound ticked off because you're missing out, yes? Otherwise why bother yourself. Get on with your life.

      November 27, 2011 at 10:34 pm |
  13. Ghera

    Hmmm. I just noticed that TTPS does not seem to scrutinize, correct, and proof the other posts. It can only be that all of the others use impeccable grammar, spelling and punctuation.

    November 27, 2011 at 9:42 pm |
  14. Cuervo Jones

    for bible believers it simoly says

    god is love. described as such in the bible. an emotion also known to be invisible but certainly real. yes?

    November 27, 2011 at 9:13 pm |
    • Cuervo Gold

      God is the biggest killer in the Bible. What were you saying about love?

      November 28, 2011 at 5:06 am |
  15. dixiejon

    maybe this will shut Pat Buchannan, Bill O'reilly and Mel Gibson up.... for a minute

    November 27, 2011 at 8:24 pm |
  16. kara

    I have friends that are Catholic, Protestant, Atheist, Agnostic, and the list goes on. They are all good people, regardless of their religious beliefs or lack of. Some people choose to follow a certain religion, while others choose not to. What is so wrong with this concept????!! I would never look down on anyone for their beliefs, nor would I associate one person with the actions of another (Catholics and pedophiles, Muslims and terrorists, etc.)

    November 27, 2011 at 8:10 pm |
    • Ghera

      Very nicely said.

      November 27, 2011 at 8:27 pm |
  17. Tom

    The Nature and Scope of the Problem of S3xual Abuse of Minors by Catholic Priests and Deacons in the United States, commonly known as the John Jay Report, is a 2004 report by the John Jay College of Criminal Justice, commissioned by the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops, based on surveys completed by the Roman Catholic dioceses in the United States

    November 27, 2011 at 7:18 pm |
    • john smith

      which didn't conclude a number of 5000. Karen Terry ( a friend no less) found that the accusations were largely unsubstantiated even going back to the bulk of them in the 1960's and 70's. So your numbers are inflated well above what the report describes.

      November 27, 2011 at 7:58 pm |
    • Tom

      Yes, I rounded up to the nearest thousand deviant priests.

      November 27, 2011 at 10:07 pm |
    • Credenza

      And your comments have .....what....... to do with the changes to the Mass. It's really hard work trying to have a rational discussion with people who don't grasp what's going on!

      November 27, 2011 at 10:47 pm |
    • TR6

      The number 4,392 comes from the 2004 John Jay Report commissioned by the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops. Which was based on surveys completed by the Roman Catholic dioceses in the United States between 1950 and 2002.

      The number is only for the united states and leaves out the rest of the world including Ireland, Australia, New Zealand, Canada, and countries in Europe, Latin America and Asia, all of which have a significant popuoation of priestly child m0le$ters. The number leaves out every thing after 2002 when a very significant number of abuses came to light. And

      it is BASED ON NUMBERS PROVIDED BY THE CATHOLIC CHURCH which is not noted for it's honest and forth right approach to the subject.

      Considering all the above, the number 4,392 must be substantialy less than the minimum possible number exclusivly for the United States for a period of time before the major scandal started

      November 28, 2011 at 5:32 pm |
  18. Predictable Reaction

    Every major organized religion has been consistently losing servants (As % of Life GDP) year after year for about 50 years now. Predictably, the first step taken is to roll back the clock on their methods to a time when they were more convoluted, ambiguous, and confusing. After all, they know it works – Those who were indoctrinated in the 1950s and 60s are still some of the most deluded and easiest to control individuals, even to this day.

    Remember, there are entire industry-sized establishments that depend heavily upon your (and others') ignorance, and thus, loyalty, and it's their sole intention to keep that Clockwork ticking.

    November 27, 2011 at 4:57 pm |
    • Ghera

      Yes, Predictable, I am a pre-Vatican II Catholic. My adherence to Catholicism is based upon recognition that the Church represents a force of good and humanity that has lasted over 2000 years. It is embodied by Mother Theresa, Saint Maximillian Kolbe, Saint Francis of Assisi, Pope John Paul II and many many others who devoted their lives to making the world a better place. What better "industry" to support and keep ticking than one that has produced such incredible examples of humanity.

      November 27, 2011 at 6:13 pm |
    • Credenza

      What IS predictable is people like your good self issuing forth as if you understand Catholicism , or the Mass.
      As for rolling back the clock – the changes to the Mass are very few; a couple of words here and there – not a lot really.

      But what I can't understand is why you, who hasn't grasped the sense of it at all. is so bothered by it????? Maybe you just resemble my Great Aunt who would pick holes in everything because she had very little going on in her life.

      November 27, 2011 at 10:54 pm |
    • EvolvedDNA

      Ghera ...where does that recognition come from? other religions ? or Catholics? what force for good are you talking about...I also wonder how much money MT raised and how much made its way back to the slums? I do not see medical facilities the Pope would use if he was very ill... i think he would head off to the US, as MT did. I do not see any religion as good..they all have an agenda and believe, with out a shred of evidence, they are the true and only one endorsed by god..which ever god they think is real.

      November 28, 2011 at 12:43 am |
    • Ghera

      @DNA- Insert stunned and amazed emoticon here. Just read a little about the individuals I referenced. Unbelievable.

      November 28, 2011 at 5:49 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You sound like you just fell off the turnip truck, Ghera. Is this the first time you've been on a blog?

      November 28, 2011 at 9:05 am |
    • Ghera

      Actually, I do foolishly expect more from society. I have also changed my mind and applaud CNN for allowing society to observe and read just exactly what type of deteriorated nightmare this country has become. Always good to have a wake up call and realize what the masses are thinking (although thinking implies some sort of higher order cognition that is not present here). Maybe I will go over to the stories on the idiots that act like animals in Walmart for a change.

      TTPS- my sympathies. You have accepted this drivel as the norm. Very very sad.

      November 28, 2011 at 10:39 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      No, what I've accepted is the fact that on this blog people aren't polite and they don't say what you wish they would, Ghera. I don't like what you post. I also don't take much I read here seriously-I would suggest you do the same, but I can tell you don't take suggestions without taking umbrage at them. I also know that what most posters write here isn't a reflection of their behavior or language in real life. It's just a way to blow of steam. I don't get all incensed about the blog-if it bothered me that much I wouldn't post here. There are millions of places you can read and post. Why waste your time here if it bothers you so?

      November 28, 2011 at 2:36 pm |
    • evolvedDNA

      Ghera..I am sure that you believe that your religion is the only correct one, and all others are not. How can you expect a society to be a cohesive force if we have segregated ourselves? There is no differences between those who believe in a god than those who do not.. we are all capable of antisocial behavior. and belonging to a "god fearing group" means nothing. Your Walmart shoppers. animals as you called them, ( we are all animals actually so you are correct) are most likely members of many churches..some may even be Catholics.

      November 28, 2011 at 2:48 pm |
    • TR6

      @Ghera: “It is embodied by Mother Theresa, Saint Maximillian Kolbe, Saint Francis of Assisi, Pope John Paul II and many many others who devoted their lives to making the world a better place. “

      Like by forbidding the use of condoms and so contributing to the AIDs epidemic especially in Africa?

      November 28, 2011 at 5:51 pm |
    • Someguy

      I would just like to say, first off, that I am not necessarily the most religious person, but I do have a lot of respect for those who are. That being said, I am fascinated by scripture from every world religion, and from a linguistic and poetic point of view, the changes are very welcome. The Vatican II translations were rushed, and this change is to bring back the imagery and poetry of the original Latin. It is not to turn back the clock ,so to speak, or return it to Pre-Vatican II teachings. It's entirely linguistic, and bringing to the discussion arguments that have nothing to do with the content of the article does very little to serve your point, whatever it is. Please, research the topic at hand, and then try to stay on it.

      November 28, 2011 at 8:18 pm |
    • Ghera

      TTPS- Ok- you don't like what I post and I don't like what you post. We can agree to disagree and while I do not agree with you and found a number of your posts condescending and insulting as an attempt to attack credibility, you seem to be one of the relatively more civil and rational individuals here.

      So, I am to understand that persons who post some of these unbelievably hateful comments are really nice guys in real life and just making all of this up for sport to blow off steam? Wow. What a hobby.

      If that is true, then all of the bullying and hostile behavior that has resulted in tragedy is just to blow off steam and they don't really mean it? Glad to know that. Maybe we ought to tell kids that so they understand that they are really just joking.

      Also, all of these individuals who attempt to present logical and coherent arguments while not being able to connect two dots together are really scientists and engineers? ummmmmm, ok.

      You have been trying to encourage me to leave this discussion for two days. Now, it could be that you are a real sweetheart and looking out for my well being or it could be because you know that I present some extremely good points (even if you don't agree) and it makes you uncomfortable.

      Insert winking emoticon here.

      November 28, 2011 at 8:19 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's

      You can 'insert" your emoticon where the sun don't shine, for all I care, Ghera. You are a supercilious, sanctimonious, pretentious jerk and you expect everyone to behave according to the etiquette standards of a tea party? Get a clue, dear. This isn't a debate. It's a free-for-all. I don't care whether you go, stay, or commit harikiri, honey. Have at it.

      The fact is that you know nothing about those who post here. And guess what, genius? No one knows anything about you, either. For all anyone knows, you're a serial killer.

      Get it? This isn't a salon. If that's what you're expecting, go elsewhere. Or not. I don't give a rat's patootie.

      November 28, 2011 at 8:30 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's

      Oh, and Ghera? As far as telling kids anything, maybe you can tell the ones that were abused by Catholic priests all about how wonderful the church is and what tremendous good it does. I'm sure they'll be highly impressed. Insert sarcastic emoticon in your azz.

      November 28, 2011 at 8:48 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's

      Plus: you're a pretentious twit and hardly someone I'd want to emulate.

      November 28, 2011 at 8:59 pm |
    • Ghera

      Oh Dear Gentle Reader TTTP,

      My sincerest apologies for the fact that you can only peer into the window of my world from the other side of the pane.

      In Peace

      G

      November 28, 2011 at 9:39 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's

      I thank God every day that I don't stand on the same side of the pane you do, you tedious moron.

      November 28, 2011 at 10:33 pm |
    • KandyKane

      Wow. Interesting to see the Catholic suckers defend their pedophile priests and their sick beliefs by discrediting those who question their beliefs.

      November 28, 2011 at 10:45 pm |
    • Ghera

      So the Church's position on contraception is responsible for the AIDS epidemic in Africa. Right.

      Just how does it figure that there is hardly a disproportionate number of Catholics who have contracted AIDS, syphilis or other STD's? I mean we should be dropping like flies.

      But of course, every global problem is somehow the result of Catholicism. Yes, Bravo TR6. Another fine example.

      November 29, 2011 at 11:23 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      So, Ghera, are you saying that the Pope's stance on co ndoms didn't contribute to the spread of AIDS?

      Why aren't you "dropping like flies"? Probably because medical science has made it possible to live longer once one has contracted HIV. It's certainly not because of anything the church did.

      November 29, 2011 at 6:32 pm |
  19. American Citizen

    I remember reading as a small child yellowed parchment prayer books with gold or red lettering that included the response, "...and with you..." that were set forth by the Catholic church prior to 1965. Many, many years, in fact.

    Sorry.

    These books belonged to my Great-Grandmother that are now all gone – and confiscated by police and others. For the record.

    November 27, 2011 at 4:31 pm |
    • Mildred the Mouth

      Oooooohn yeah. The great American Missal roundup, and burning. Such a tragedy. And where do you live ?

      November 27, 2011 at 6:20 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      So your ancestors were Mafia, were they, AC?

      November 28, 2011 at 7:38 pm |
  20. American Citizen

    As a child I remember reading prayer books that included, "...and with you..." that were set forth by the Catholic church before 1965. Many years, before.

    Sorry.

    November 27, 2011 at 4:28 pm |
    • happypoet

      The proper response now is: And with your spirit. It might take a little time to get used to it, but at least it's NOT with your ghost instead 😉

      November 27, 2011 at 8:55 pm |
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About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.