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On Sunday, Catholic Mass won't sound the same
Rev. Benny George is a associate pastor at St. Francis Xavier Parish in Burbank, California.
November 26th, 2011
01:40 PM ET

On Sunday, Catholic Mass won't sound the same

By Jim Roope, CNN Radio National Correspondent

(CNN)–If you’re Catholic, mass this Sunday will sound different for  the first time in nearly half a century.

You’ll hear it in the prayers of both the people and the priests.

“We have come back to a more accurate translation of the Latin from the Roman Missal,” said Fr. Rick Hilgartner, executive director of the Divine Office of Worship for the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops. “The language of prayer should be evocative, speaking in terms of imagery and metaphor.”

The changes are enormous, said Fr. Richard Albarano, of St. Francis Xavier Church in Burbank, California, and should help the 280 million English-speaking Catholics grow in their  love for the mass. “The mass is the center of our lives,” said Albarano.

Not since the Second Vatican Council in 1965 have such sweeping changes been made.

The Vatican II changes were radical – the priest spoke in English instead of Latin and he faced the people instead of having his back to them. An Old Testament reading was also added to the mass, a surprise to many who thought of the Catholic Church as a New Testament only church.

Other changes, large and small, were designed by Pope John XXIII to get the people (and not just the priest) involved in the mass. But the changes were not communicated in advance. People showed up one Sunday morning, and it was all changed.

“They wondered if they were even in a Catholic church,” said Albarano.

This time, the Catholic Church has been talking about the changes, and communicating them to parishes, since 2000. For the past three months, many parishes have been working to ready their followers for the changes in the wording of the prayers.

That doesn’t mean some won’t be caught by surprise. “It’s going to be like Vatican II all over again,” Albarano said. “I haven’t heard much about catechizing across the Los Angeles Archdiocese at all. We said we were going to do it. I hope we did.”

To hear the complete story, click the audio player.

- CNN

Filed under: Catholic Church • Mass

soundoff (1,372 Responses)
  1. Ungodly Discipline

    "God's plan" is the way that Christians traditionally explain things like amputations, cancer, hurricanes and car accidents. For example, if a Christian dies a painful and tragic death because of cancer, she dies as part of God's plan. Her death has a purpose. God called her home for a reason. Even if something bad happens to a Christian, it is actually good because it is part of God's plan.

    “Because God made you for a reason, he also decided when you would be born and how long you would live. He planned the days of your life in advance, choosing the exact time of your birth and death.
    The Bible says, "You saw me before I was born and scheduled each day of my life before I began to breath. Every day was recorded in your book!" [Psalm 139:16]

    There is also this:

    Regardless of the circ umstances of your birth or who your parents are, God had a plan in creating you.

    Under this view of the universe, God plans everything.

    He planned the days of your life in advance, choosing the exact time of your birth and death."

    Let's examine one simple implication of this statement. What this means is that God has pre-planned every abortion that has taken place on our planet.

    November 26, 2011 at 7:39 pm |
    • Joe Ecklund

      God's plan: what a brilliantly perverted concept. If it's all in God's plan, we can't really blame him or get mad at him, can we? Or say that he is "not good?" Can we?

      It's humorous to me how so many people say "God is good" every Sunday. God, by his very nature CANNOT be good, as good is a concept applied to humans from God's point of view. E.g. God says "killing" is bad when committed by one human upon another. When a few verses later, God is ordering his servants to "kill" entire tribes, villages, and peoples in HIS name. Thus, how can humans refer to God as "good" when he does not apparently hold himself to his own standards. Rather, humans who choose to worship that god should proclaim: "God is beyond good and evil! God is greater than us, and therefore we worship him!" Surely we cannot delude ourselves into believing that "God" as the Old Testament portrays him, is "good" in any way, when judged by his own standards for human behavior. This "God" has no problem whatsoever, killing people for touching his holy box (1 Samuel 6:2-7, also see verse 19), or ordering his followers to kill "every man, woman, and child" in a non-believing tribe, and subsequently taking away his blessing from a king that chose not to follow God's command to commit what we would today consider a heinous, unpardonable wartime atrocity (1 Samuel 15:2-3, 33).

      To many Christians: Please stop offending God by telling the world that he is "Good." Start telling the world that you submit to God out of fear because he is bigger than you, stronger than you, and "his ways are beyond [your] ways." But don't drag his name through the mud by equating his moral state with a positive moral state attached to human behavior.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:56 pm |
    • Pat in IL

      That is a thought provoking, but very weird statement.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:57 pm |
    • Joe Ecklund

      How is it weird? I am curious. It is very logical and rational, from my point of view. Is it weird because I call the western religious portrayal of "God" on the carpet for his alleged behavior?

      Glad you read it, though.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:59 pm |
    • fda

      Deuteronomy 30:15 "See, I have set before you today life and good,
      death and evil, 16 "in that I command you today to love the Lord your
      God, to walk in His ways, and to keep His commandments, His statutes,
      and His judgments, that you may live and multiply; and the Lord your
      God will bless you in the land which you go to possess. 17 "But if
      your heart turns away so that you do not hear, and are drawn away, and
      worship other gods and serve them, 18 "I announce to you today that
      you shall surely perish; you shall not prolong [your] days in the land
      which you cross over the Jordan to go in and possess. 19 "I call
      heaven and earth as witnesses today against you, [that] I have set
      before you life and death, blessing and cursing; therefore choose
      life, that both you and your descendants may live.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:59 pm |
    • Joe Ecklund

      @fda. Good quote. Precisely my point. 🙂

      November 26, 2011 at 8:00 pm |
    • fda

      Thanks Joe, these liberals are so easy to refute... They blame abortion on God... how stupif can you possibly be... what does a person go through to arrive at such ignorance?

      November 26, 2011 at 8:06 pm |
    • AtheistSteve

      You do realize that if life begins at conception as was proposed in a recent legislation in Mississippi then God is indeed responsible for many abortions. Natural ones where eggs fail to implant to miscarriages to stillbirths. So much for your idea that God is good.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:13 pm |
    • Ungodly Discipline

      Now let's examine another implication: Right wing "Pro Life" political groups and activists are actually working AGAINST God's will by trying to stop abortion. According to the Bible, the Mothers and Doctors do not have free will. NOW let's look at war, say WW II and Hitler. The concentration camps. According to the Bible, GOD killed all of those people. It was his "plan".

      November 26, 2011 at 8:14 pm |
    • Joe Ecklund

      You bet, fda. I really don't think that "God" is responsible for abortion, but I do think that that would be the logical continuation of the portrayal of God in the Old Testament. Hopefully, that is what Ungodly Discipline was trying to say...

      However, from a typical fundamentalist point of view, quoting unrelated Bible verses out of context, one could arrive at the conclusion that "God" supports abortion, or at least has no problem with it.

      For example,
      "So I congratulated the dead who are already dead more than the living who are still living. But better off than both of them is the one who has never existed, who has never seen the evil activity that is done under the sun."
      Ecclesiastes 4:1-3

      or

      "If a man has a stubborn and rebellious son who does not obey his father and mother and will not listen to them when they discipline him, his father and mother shall take hold of him and bring him to the elders at the gate of his town. They shall say to the elders, "This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious. He will not obey us. He is a profligate and a drunkard." Then all the men of his town shall stone him to death."
      Deuteronomy 21:18-21

      or

      The account of child sacrifice TO God in Judges 11:29-40.

      I'm not a liberal, personally, but I don't think they are all that easy to refute, my friend.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:17 pm |
    • fda

      Ungodly, I dont really believe you believe what you write. I dont know why you think about these pathetic questions. God is responsible for concentration camps? I don't know what bible you are reading but you should think about buying the one at the ProLife Center.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:19 pm |
    • Ungodly Discipline

      @fda
      1. You said it is easy to refute me but you didn't. If it is easy to refute me then refute me.
      2. I don't even believe in God stupid. This is YOUR religion I am analyzing. I don't believe this nonsense!
      3. Did I mention you are stupid?

      November 26, 2011 at 8:19 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      He should think about buying one at the pro-life center? Why? Do you think their version of the Bible is accurate?

      Good grief. You idiots are insane as well as stupid and ignorant.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:21 pm |
    • fda

      And sorry Atheist, I don't give people like you the time of day. I see you as an adolescent intellectually. I once made an atheist a catholic and he told me many of the things I said to him hurt his feelings and he later told me the best way to cure an atheist is to prayer for him. WHich I did everynight before his conversion. We are best friends and he still asks me questions that can were answered to me in 4th grade religon class.
      Therefore I concluded atheists should not be treated like lepers. The best proof of God I can tell you is that the day you believe in him, the day you enter his church and say with love and meaning that you want him to forgive you, you will feel grace for the first time. You will feel loved. That is your proof. ANd its something you should love forward too.
      Every Catholic knows what it is to be loved. I dont know how you live without it.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:25 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      BWhahahahhahhhahhaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa! I got as far as "to prayer for him", fda, before I started to laugh.

      You'll have to do better than that if you expect anyone to listen to your drivel.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:27 pm |
    • Ungodly Discipline

      Ok, for those of you Christians who can't follow along....
      I DON'T believe God is responsible for abortions or the holocaust. YOU do!

      If you don't, perhaps you are NOT a Christian! Congrats!

      November 26, 2011 at 8:27 pm |
    • lacey

      the more people i meet, the more im convinced that pro-choice is a good thing. lots of pro-choice poster children (and adults) out there.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:30 pm |
    • fda

      Hi Lacey, you're probably rationalizing Barrack Obama's opposition to the born alive infant protection act as well?

      November 26, 2011 at 8:36 pm |
    • AtheistSteve

      fda

      Don't make me laugh. My left pinky has more intelligence than you. I grew up catholic you dolt and regret ever moment I wasted believing in your drivel. So you managed to convert some idiot only proves that misery loves company. I'm far and away more enlightened through discovering the true majesty of the natural world than you'll ever know or learn through your god-goggles. You have my pity fool.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:36 pm |
    • fda

      I don't doubt you are more intelligent. But based on what you write I cannot tell your intellectual level. I can tell you that I've studied science and 'natural' science in great depth. I am a nanotech for biomedical engineering. I have a phd in medicine and I have been recognized by the ASTM board of directors for my advancements and publishing for 3 medical journals.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:40 pm |
    • Joseph Ecklund

      bump. just another reason not to trust doctors.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:43 pm |
    • apostate

      @fda "I see you as an adolescent intellectually."

      You're the one with an imaginary friend.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:56 pm |
    • *frank*

      Ah, the good old "i'm a scientist" lie, here spouted by a clown who can't even spell the U.S. President's name right...

      November 26, 2011 at 8:58 pm |
    • fda

      And then there's you Frank, a person who has trouble with the definition of scientist and engineer...

      November 26, 2011 at 9:02 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      And then there's you, fda. Someone who must be quite practiced at lying through his teeth. You're a fraud.

      November 26, 2011 at 9:16 pm |
    • Josep E cklund

      You're right, Tom.
      Public Service Announcement: the FDA does not approve of fda.

      November 26, 2011 at 9:24 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      fda
      Hi Lacey, you're probably rationalizing Barrack Obama's opposition to the born alive infant protection act as well?
      -----

      Oh, look, yet another blatant lie! Quelle surprise.

      Yanno, fda, you've done far more for the unbelievers than they could have achieved on their own. You should be a poster child for atheism. Idiots like you step in cowpies so often it's a wonder you still remember how to walk on dry land.

      November 26, 2011 at 9:31 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Yah, fda, and I'm the Queen of England. Come on over to Buckingham Palace anytime. We'll have tea and crumpets.

      You are so lame, it's embarrassing to share the label of "human" with you.

      November 26, 2011 at 9:33 pm |
    • AtheistSteve

      A Christian scientist? Isn't that an oxymoron? Ok..so perhaps you have the credentials you claim...who am I to judge? Like my friends Colin, Doc, DavidJ etc. we all have our fields of expertise. I have a degree in Engineering, amateur astronomer, student of cosmology and carpenter. I understand enough of the methodology behind Evolution to accept the conclusions of experts in the relevant fields. Which by the way should coincide with yours. Meaning if you believe in evolution then you have the unfortunate predicament of defending conflicting accounts whereas if you don't then your application of scientific principles is suspect. What all of us(meaning we atheists) have in common is the rejection of the idea that a book that states within its text that it is the word of God can possibly be taken seriously. If that were true it would be absolutely indisputable, perfectly clear and blatantly obvious. Saying it was written by fallible men is a cop out. An all powerful god would know beforehand and understand that the message would end up as the garbled mess we have now and prevent it. Or he's an idiot. A deity that wanted to make itself apparent wouldn't depend on "text" to do so. God has been reduced to an anonymous author.

      November 26, 2011 at 9:36 pm |
    • N

      Please prayer for me, and while you're at it, say one for your English teacher.

      November 26, 2011 at 10:15 pm |
    • TR6

      @ fda: “God is responsible for concentration camps? I don't know what bible you are reading”

      Typical a$$ hole Christian cherry picking the bible

      "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things." (Isaiah 45:7)

      And the LORD said unto him, "Who hath made man's mouth? or who maketh the dumb, or deaf, or the seeing, or the blind? Have not I the LORD?" Exodus 4:11 (KJV)

      November 26, 2011 at 10:18 pm |
  2. No Dice

    Yes, they're obviously doing this because parishioners are leaving in extremely large numbers and they don't know what to do except try new tricks. I'm sure even that won't be enough to bring them back, however.

    November 26, 2011 at 7:34 pm |
  3. John

    Atheist are sad, they rant about things they know nothing about, make up wild tales with no basis, and spend too much time on religious blogs. I have the Church, and the Church has miracles that no religion on the planet can boast or explain. atheist responses to the incorrupt saints, Lanciano, Fatimah, and the unexplained properties of the Guadalupe tilma are laughable.

    November 26, 2011 at 7:29 pm |
    • Mack

      Really? That was a joke, right? Atheists never claimed ANYTHING. You're the one that has a lot of explaining to do.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:37 pm |
    • Ungodly Discipline

      What do athiests rant about that they know nothing about and what do athiests make up? Please qualify your statement.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:43 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      "Atheist are sad"? Did you mean "atheists"? Really, dude, get a clue. If you can't even figure out how to make "atheist" plural, you're too friggin' stupid to tell anyone else what to do or think.

      November 26, 2011 at 8:23 pm |
  4. bobcat2u

    The last time I went to a catholic church, they were still saying the masses in latin. Since then, they've turned the altars around so you can see what the priest is doing, the parisoners interact with the priests on prayers and they've even added bands. Some even claim to be born again. I never thought I would see it. A born again catholic.

    November 26, 2011 at 7:24 pm |
  5. Kenbob

    The opposite of faith isn't disbelief, the opposite of faith is certainty.

    If you are certain there is no God, then you can go about your life without religion.
    But if you aren't certain, faith is for you.
    Wouldn't it be nice to see both kinds of people respecting each other without using this forum to verbally destroy each other?

    November 26, 2011 at 7:22 pm |
    • Mack

      Frankly, not really. When Scientologists spew their nonsense you don't give pause to it's validity, right? Unless you know – and there's a way to prove – then let's not waste our time on unbelievable hypotheses.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:39 pm |
  6. Limbaugh is a liberal

    Only MY belief is true! I am BETTER than all of you because I believe the right things and you don't! And I know I am right because I believe I am right! Only MY interpretation of the Bible is correct! And I know it's correct because my interpretation of the Bible clearly says so, right there in the Bible that I am right! It is incontrovertible proof that I am right! If you correctly read the passages of the Bible MY way, and believe what I believe, you will know that my belief is the only right belief!

    November 26, 2011 at 7:22 pm |
  7. ThisIsWhy

    Tom t p s. You really need to work on the rage issues. People who lash out like you have inner turmoil, perhaps you should talk to someone. You spend far too much time ripping everyone else apart for their beliefs. Do you hate yourself?

    November 26, 2011 at 7:16 pm |
  8. Ungodly Discipline

    Ask yourself this simple question: Why, when you read the Bible, are you not left in awe? Why doesn't a book written by an omniscient being leave you with a sense of wonder and amazement? If you are reading a book written by the all-powerful, all-knowing, all-loving creator of the universe, wouldn't you expect to be stunned by the brilliance, the clarity and the wisdom of the author? Would you not expect each new page to intoxicate you with its incredible prose and its spectacular insight? Wouldn't you expect the author to tell us things that scientists have not been able to discover yet?

    Yet, when we open the Bible and actually read it, we find it is nothing like that at all. Instead of leaving us in awe, it leaves us dumbfounded by all of the nonsense and backwardness that it contains. If you read what the Bible actually says, you find that the Bible is ridiculous. If we are honest with ourselves, it is obvious that an "all-knowing" God had absolutely nothing to do with this book.

    The reason why the Bible contains so much nonsense is because God is imaginary. The Bible is a book written thousands of years ago by primitive men. A book that advocates senseless murder, slavery and the oppression of women has no place in our society today.

    November 26, 2011 at 7:10 pm |
    • Cindy

      Apparently you don't know how to read the Bible. I feel sorry for you. You have lost the wonderment and meaning of life. You are a lost sheep, but before you die, you will ask for forgiveness.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:22 pm |
    • Ungodly Discipline

      Cindy, I can read and I read the Bible. What do you mean by "I don't know how" to read it. I am a literate college educated person and quite capable of reading and understanding just about anything. What is the "right" way to read the Bible that I don't understand?

      November 26, 2011 at 7:29 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Ungodly Discipline – Well, apparently, when the unbeliever is reading the Bible and it doesn’t leave you an awe or with sense of wonder & amazement is because you are reading with a carnal mind. A carnal mind can not grasp what the Word of God is saying. You can not speak for us who has experience a sense of wonder, amazement, and left with aw when we read it. It can only be done by the Spirit of God that draws the heart of the person.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:30 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Baloney. Anyone can read the Bible as literature. It doesn't take a Christian or a believer to understand it. Only a brain. That's why Higgy has such difficulty.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:37 pm |
    • Ungodly Discipline

      @Cindy and HelsGod
      Your arguments make me think you have not in fact read the Bible for yourself, but have instead perhaps relied on "Bible Study" groups that are mediated and sermons for your understanding. In my opinion, the Bible is FAR from inspired. Hence I have no faith that there is anything supernatural about it. Commen sense. (and nothing is supernatural anyhoo. If it exists, it can be explained)

      November 26, 2011 at 7:48 pm |
  9. Mathew

    I was brought up in the catholic tradition however I have always struggled and still struggling to identify the role of church in my life and its necessity to humanity as a whole! I read the Bible passionately. I can connect well with the scripture and find it comforting than the heady catholic sermons administered in the church. The daily reading and its explanations, I find it concocted and never living up to the ideas that Jesus tried explaining through the simple parables. The gilded attires and the splendor portraied in a catholic mass is really a far cry from the simple nominal existence of its founder. I think rather than making these cosmetic changes to keep the followers, they should introspect and really turn to Christ for help. It takes commitment, pain and living to principles to have followers. The show that Vatican and the Church puts up sunday after sunday, is nothing more than expensive puppetry!

    November 26, 2011 at 7:10 pm |
    • David

      Then it is obvious you fail to connect the sacraments and the joy it brings to people to practice those sacraments throughout their lives. The sacrament of marriage and the powerful understanding when you meet another Catholic and the BELIEVE "Till death do you part" and the maturity it takes to make that decision. I'm sorry you cannot find the good in it. Most born Catholics cannot. I am a convert so I have a different perspective. Most people say "There is no God". Well, the teachings do me well and if there IS no God it does ME no harm in believing and practicing faith, kindness and charity.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:29 pm |
  10. Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

    If anyone had faith, reading Higgy's posts would destroy it.

    November 26, 2011 at 7:10 pm |
  11. Catholic

    Faith and religion is up to the individual who practices it. I am amazed at why many readers get irritated at the catholic church since it is the only faith that refused not change moral values. Yes, few individuals sinned. However, one cannot forget the remaining 90+ percentile who dedicated their lives to serve God. I myself have experienced many miracles. This year I saw a medically "impossible" situation was cured the same day after administering the anointing of the sick.

    November 26, 2011 at 7:04 pm |
    • Ungodly Discipline

      Bulllshi t. There are no miracles, if it happens it can be explained. Period.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:06 pm |
    • Catholic

      Absolutely! For every miracle there will be a scientific explanation. However, the coincidence of these elements at that specific moment is what makes a miracle a miracle. For ex, one can say that the split of sea at the time of Moses could very well be a tsunami. However, the occurrence of that tsunami dividing the sea happening at the time when israelites came is what made it a miracle. God works thru physics too!

      November 26, 2011 at 9:23 pm |
    • Ungodly Discipline

      Nice try Catholic. And every morning when I take a sh it, the toilet flushes just in the nick of time.

      November 26, 2011 at 9:50 pm |
    • Ungodly Discipline

      Catholic, let me ask you this. Where is God when people are perishing and suffering in natural disasters? Hurricanes, Tsunamis, tornadoes, Earthquakes, etc. ? He can't be bothered? He had a little spare time 2000+ years ago but now he has lost interest?

      November 26, 2011 at 9:54 pm |
  12. Just Saying

    The entire basis of religion is perception. Regardless of which one you choose, if any, to follow it is up to you how to interpret the teachings. It is important to remember while learning and following your path that written tenets and values came from the minds of man, not God. What you are really choosing is how you wish to live your life. I hope that at least some will make the best decision for themselves. I know I have.

    November 26, 2011 at 7:03 pm |
  13. Mike

    Mankind is a "virus" that needs to be extinguished. The perfect circle of nature is interupted by the plague of humanity. We need to flush the toilet and zero out. Give the planet back to nature and this time whatever criminal created us should skip the human ingredient altogether.

    November 26, 2011 at 7:00 pm |
  14. HeIsGod

    Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

    Hahaha, are you too dumb to even understand what I was trying to write? Again, you are you to tell me or anyone else how much time we should or shouldn’t spend on here? I am not the one that says that those who don’t believe are dam ned for eternity, it is God…..COMPRENDE? Of course I am not qualify to state what will happen to ANYONE after death because God can even save the very soul of a person before he/she lives, so only God knows. The thing I am qualify for is to preach the Gospel of the Good News……warning comes before destruction. Too bad your parents fail to raise you to believe in God and you are too full of pride to seek God for yourself instead of being here spewing your hate and showing how bitter you are. I pity you so much.

    Why don’t you demonstrate how the work of Christ should be? Maybe, I can learn from you. I am always opened to learn from a follower of Christ, but with that foul mouth of yours, I doubt you can even show anyone anything and bring inspiration to anyone.

    Christ loves you, honey.

    November 26, 2011 at 6:57 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Correction:

      *before he/she dies.*

      November 26, 2011 at 6:58 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      And I don't command anyone to help others, you idiot. CHRIST did. You are wasting time here because it's easy and requires no sacrifice on your part. Get off your butt and stop yapping on the internet. You aren't needed here. You're needed by those who are hungry. By those who are homeless. By those who are lonely and alone. You're just too lazy and too cowardly to do what you should be doing instead of what you feel like doing.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:04 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Oh, right. "Christ love you, honey." But I have a "foul mouth" and you think it's your place to say so, don't you? You are such a fraud.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:08 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son – If you know what Christ commands, why are you not doing what He says? OBEDIENCE is better than SACRIFICE – saith the Lord.

      LOL, wow, so you are needed here, right? For what exactly? Tell me? So, my guess is, you don’t care about the homeless that you rather spend your time to spew you lies and hate on here, eh? Well, if I am too lazy and cowardly to do what I should be doing instead of what I feel like doing……tell me, what exactly are you doing to make a difference in the lives of those who are lonely and alone? Again, you can’t seem to really realize how lost and bitter you have become.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:09 pm |
    • AtheistSteve

      HeIsGod

      Oh you have so overindulged in the koolaid.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:11 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son – If I would say I am perfect without sin, then yes, I would be such a fraud, but unlike you, I have a heart that goes before my Father God when I need repentance and peace within me…..that’s what separates us from the unbelievers. Unbelievers like yourself, have a heard of stone and too full of pride to realize that you need God in your lives.

      Too bad you a too blind to realize how much Christ loves you as much as he loves me.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:12 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Did I claim to be a Christian? A believer? Did I tell anyone else that if he/she didn't believe what I said that he/she was dam ned for eternity? Did I claim to know what God thinks?

      No, dear. YOU did. I don't pretend to be a disciple. YOU DO. I don't pretend to be a scholar. YOU DO. I don't pretend I'm a saint. YOU DO.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:13 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      LOL, AtheistSteve – Well, friend, it’s the best koolaid with plenty of God’s love. You should consider trying God…..He is the best koolaid there is. ; – )

      November 26, 2011 at 7:13 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Atheist Steve, Higgy is a Kool-Aid-aholic.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:14 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son
      Well, you are right about that. I can never have enough of God…..you should taste the Good Lord and see that he is good!!

      November 26, 2011 at 7:18 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Steve, you should read the vitriol Higgy posts when someone gets her goat. She's a hot tamale who flies off the handle at regular intervals whenever she's challenged.

      But you betcha she thinks she's a good Christian, all right.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:18 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      And now, as you can see, she has been sucking on the tequila for a couple of hours. Bombed, as usual, on a Saturday night. And she'll show up in church tomorrow and pray for forgiveness.

      Hypocrite, thy name is Higgy.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:19 pm |
    • AtheistSteve

      I think she also completely missed the reference to koolaid as being derisive. For her benefit I'll clarify...it means it's POISON.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:23 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son – Well, to claim that you are not a Christian, you sure try hard to tell me what Christ demands, not knowing what Christ says in the first place. Again, I will remind you, I am not the one CLAIMING that people are going to be da mned, it is the very Word of God….read JOHN 3:16 or google it, if you want or you can remain living in a spiritual dark world. I never EVER said that I know what God thinks, for NO ONE knows the mind of God. It is God who speaks to our hearts, mind, spirit and souls in order for us to understand what he is saying through his living Word. No need to pretend to be anything, I don’t need to impress anyone. It is God who approves of me, not men/women. As far as being a saint, it is God who calls his people saints and it is God who has chosen us to be His disciples. God chooses us, we can’t chose God.

      Unless a man is drawn by the Spirit of my Father, he do not belong to me. – Christ.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:24 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      I guarantee Christ NEVER said, "He do not belong to me."

      Talk about laughing out loud...

      November 26, 2011 at 7:28 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Higgy, you are such a dolt that you think only someone who proclaims himself a "Christian" knows what Christ said, at least according to the Bible. I never said I believed it; I simply stated what was said. You state what is said and claim you're a believer, yet you do not obey.

      I wonder, what would Christ consider the greater sin?

      November 26, 2011 at 7:30 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Christ doesn't belong to anyone, it is us that "should" belong to Him.....understand?

      November 26, 2011 at 7:32 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      That doesn't even address what I challenged you to answer, you moron. But of course, you don't get it. You never do.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:34 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      When you figure out the difference and the proper usage of "do" and "does", dimwit, get back to me with your erudite interpretation of the Bible.

      I can hardly wait.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:35 pm |
  15. jma58

    Religion is like politics. Both are inherently corrupt.

    November 26, 2011 at 6:37 pm |
    • RC

      No.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:43 pm |
  16. J

    Why is everyone arguing? Why can't people just allow people to have their beliefs? If you don't have anything respectful to say just keep it to yourself.

    November 26, 2011 at 6:36 pm |
    • tony

      Religion doesn't keep to itself. It's always trying to infect everyone's children.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:40 pm |
    • N

      That's nice dear. The earth is flat. Don't worry. Santy will be here on the 24th.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:58 pm |
  17. tony

    Religion. The Tried and Tested method of bypassing your Conscience and getting away with doing unbelievably Wicked Things by blaming them on the instructions of a complete fantasy creature.

    November 26, 2011 at 6:33 pm |
    • Matt

      Which is why Jesus said the most important commandment was to love God and love others as yourself...

      November 26, 2011 at 7:05 pm |
  18. boz1233

    Christianity lost the message of Jesus Christ a long time ago. Modern Christianity is completely lost, completely bereft of substance. But that's not the fault of its founder.

    November 26, 2011 at 6:31 pm |
    • Just Saying

      I agree. Religion today is based on man's perception not how it was originally intended.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:56 pm |
  19. Colin

    Let's hold a fundamental Catholic belief up against something very, very esoteric and abstruse – fifth grade math.

    Approximately one hundred and ten thousand million (110,000,000,000) people have lived on Earth. Given all those who have, over the centuries, rejected the Christian god, or who have otherwise committed mortal sins, there must be literally thousands of millions of people burning for all eternity in the cosmic oven of hell set up by your all-loving god. Some must have been burning for thousands of years by now.

    About 100,000 people die every day. There must be a constant stream of thousands of forlorn souls every day into the one way pit of hell your all-merciful god set up and maintains.

    But, far, far worse than sheer overwhelming numbers is the extent of the punishment. There is no way out, no parole, no time off for good behavior. You don’t just burn, you burn for all eternity. Billions of people and thousands of daily new arrivals burning for all eternity!

    No criminal justice system in the history of the Human race, even those established by the most despotic of tyrants, comes close to matching the unfathomable barbarity of your “infinitely benevolent” god. I don’t have to kill, I don’t have to steal, hell I don’t even have to litter. All I have to do is refuse to believe in the Christian god and it will impose a penalty on me an infinite times worse than the death penalty.

    Hitler murdered six million Jews in his concentration camps, but compared to your god, Hitler was a bleeding-hearted wimp. A goose-stepping girlie-man. Your all-caring god not only burns billions more than Hitler, Pol Pot and all other dictators and tyrants added up, he keeps doing so to them for all eternity! I would not wish a bad sunburn on a person simply because they have a different religion to me, let alone fry them for ever.

    It is also odd that your all-loving god is also all-knowing and knows which souls will go to hell before they do. He even knows it before they are born, and yet he still creates them. He is worse than a psychopathic teenager than breeds litter after litter of kittens so he can slowly roast them in ovens.

    I guess that's the problem when you use the same sky-fairy as both the carrot and the stick. Hold it up gainst even the slightest analysis and it crumbles in a heap!

    November 26, 2011 at 6:27 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Hitler is already dead.....get over him.

      Atheists killed millions upon millions of innocent people, how are they better than Hitler? Murder is murder, no matter how you look at it.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:33 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Christians did the same, Higgy, and continue to do so.

      God even urged them to bash the heads of infants on rocks.

      Explain that, honey.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:40 pm |
    • Kaprica

      Humans are the ones who say that people who don't believe in God are going to hell and burn for all eternity. They are also the ones who say if you don't worship God as they worship God, you'll go to hell and they'll kill you to help you on your way. No one really knows how God feels about any of this. Humans endow God with human feelings of anger, pettiness, vindictiveness, viciousness, and the need for constant praise and worship.

      I suspect that God loves everyone and has never burned anyone for all eternity or any part of eternity. Many will point to the Bible as justification for their actions. The Bible was written by humans and humans are imperfect (and probably got everything wrong). Very few humans can intellectually understand God's will and act accordingly.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:46 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      LOL, Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son, before you even try to look “intelligent” on this type of articles, first post the entire Chapter and scriptures that claims that God urged them to bash the heads of infants on rocks.

      Actually, you are too ignorant to see that unbelievers are killing more people everyday….turn on the T.V. and see for yourself. Prove to me that Christians are the ones doing more killing? Of course, if the Christian kills in self defense, I would do the same thing.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:49 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Go look at the stats for the percentage of Christians in prison for violent crime vs. the percentage who are not Christian, dumbazz. Go ahead.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:52 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      "This type of articles". You can always depend on Higgy to show that English is a second language for her.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:53 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      1 Samuel 15 (New International Version)
      The LORD Rejects Saul as King

      1 Samuel said to Saul, “I am the one the LORD sent to anoint you king over his people Israel; so listen now to the message from the LORD. 2 This is what the LORD Almighty says: ‘I will punish the Amalekites for what they did to Israel when they waylaid them as they came up from Egypt. 3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy everything that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’ ”

      November 26, 2011 at 6:55 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      "Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones." (Psalms 137:9, KJV)

      "How blessed will be the one who seizes and dashes your little ones Against the rock." (Psalms 137:9, New American Bible)

      "Happy the man who shall seize and smash your little ones against the rock!" (Psalms 137:9, New American Bible)

      "a blessing on anyone who seizes your babies and shatters them against a rock!" (Psalms 137:9, Jerusalem Bible)

      November 26, 2011 at 6:57 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Ball's in your court, witless.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:58 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son – Didn't I tell you to post the WHOLE scriptures of the bible? You are only looking partially of the scriptures without understanding.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:04 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      That's what I expected–crickets chirping. Higgy doesn't have an answer.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:05 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Go right ahead an explain chapter and verse, dear. INTERPRET for us, OH SCHOLAR.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:06 pm |
    • Matt

      I think Tom needs a lesson in covenant theology as presented in the Bible

      November 26, 2011 at 7:10 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      All ears, witless. Go right ahead and tell me God didn't say what those verses say.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:15 pm |
    • Matt

      I'm not arguing about those verses...they are in the Bible. Jesus came to absorb the punishment for man's wickedness as illustrated in the verses you presented. In the OT the was no barrier between God's wrath and man. So yeah, it was a scary time back then. Jesus took the punishment for every sin that was ever committed for the rest of eternity. The punishment for breaking the covenant with God in the OT is much different than the NT. Now, all it takes is faith in Jesus to satisfy the covenant.

      I fully expect you to go off on some rant now. I don't expect you to believe me but that's why all the arguments about OT versus like the ones you presented are getting tired and old.

      I'm going to In-N-Out now, peace.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:23 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Yeah, go chomp on some cow.

      God said it. That's what I stated. That's what you confirmed. Thanks for playing.

      November 26, 2011 at 7:31 pm |
    • Matt

      So we agree! The burger was good

      November 26, 2011 at 8:52 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      I'll bet. Not as good as the one I got at a decent restaurant with some good wine.

      Too bad you're such a prole.

      November 26, 2011 at 9:24 pm |
  20. HeIsGod

    little billy

    why doesn't god love those who dont praise him? why is the creator so insecure? seven billion people currently living in the world and he needs constant appraisal?

    Hi, little billy,

    God is a loving God, even towards those who don’t believe in Him or praise Him. His Word says that He will let it rain on the just and unjust. God isn’t insecure; it’s men who are insecure and full of pride. I wish people would just stop, think, and look around them. People are being destroyed I the hands of other human beings, not God. God doesn’t need constant appraisal. When you have gone through so much in your life with God by your side, it’s His people who can’t help but to give Him constant appraisal because at the end of every storm and tribulations, God gives us His victory to over come every storm.

    November 26, 2011 at 6:22 pm |
    • Colin

      PS: Little Billy – of course, if you disappoint him, he will burn you for all eternity, but hey, we all have our shortcomings.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:23 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      BTW, in order for God to be on your side, you have to allow Him by believing in Him. Also, God in His loving-kindness, still protects the unbelievers by sparing their lives. Unfortunately, we are tourists on earth, passing by and some day, we all will have to face death. The think He wants us to do is be prepared.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:25 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Oh, can it, Higgy. You and HS are the two biggest hypocrites on the planet. You have no business attempting to interpret the Bible or telling anyone what God thinks. You aren't even qualified to recommend a restaurant or describe the weather.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:27 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Colin – The only disappointment that God will have is the fact that He gave you so many opportunities to accept the free gift of salvation to chose life or death, but you refuse to accept it.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:27 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son – Okay, why don't you tell us what God thinks and interpret the bible for us? Please do show us how much knowledge and wisdom you have about God and the Bible? Who is HS?

      November 26, 2011 at 6:31 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You moron, I didn't CLAIM I was qualified to interpret the Bible or that I know what God thinks or how He judges or anything else. YOU DID.

      YOU AREN'T.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:33 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son – And how exactly do you know that I can't interpret the Bible? Did you speak to God and he told you that no man can do it? No wonder people such as yourself are not only lost, but are the biggest fools on earth.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:36 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      What an arrogant azz you are, Higgy. You come on here and start slinging crap about others when you're no better than anyone else. You can barely write a coherent sentence, much less figure out what is meant by any literature more complex than "See Di ck Run."

      Why don't you thumpers lead by EXAMPLE? Go do something for others and stop flapping your stupid gums here.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:37 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You tool. You have a hard time spelling 'cat' without a dictionary. Knock of the nonsense, Higgy. Everyone knows you're stupid as a houseplant.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:38 pm |
    • tony

      Please describe the sort of conversation you'll be able have in Heaven with all those "saved" little aborted fetuses.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:38 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Oh, tony, Higgy is pretty much at the same mental level as a fetus. No brain wave whatsoever.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:42 pm |
    • HeIsGod

      Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      I can never figure out why are you constantly bitter? When have I ever said that I am better than any one? Don’t worry about how I writ a sentence. It’s not me you need to understand, it’s God who you need to have knowledge of, regardless how I write a coherent sentence. Obviously, you understood everything I have said, since you keep replying to my comments. Who are you to tell anyone to post on here? This is a religious article and as you do see, it’s the Atheists who ALWAYS come looking for us, we NEVER go looking for them. God brings them to us all the time since God is too irresistible even to the unbelievers.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:42 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      "writ"? Comedy gold.

      You are such a f*c kwit, Higgy. You are here constantly, along with your idiot pal, HS, telling everyone that your beliefs are the only truth and that all MUST believe what you do or be dam ned for eternity. You can su ck on it, you hypocrite. You are not priv y to the truth of any supreme being. You aren't qualified to state what will happen to ANYONE after death.

      Yet you blather on here instead of doing the work your Christ commanded.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:49 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Oh, yeah, gotta love the "I can never figure out why..." You can't figure out how to tie your own shoes, you brain-dead moron.

      November 26, 2011 at 6:50 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.