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What happens when candidates called by God drop out?
Kelly Oxford's tweet from Wednesday.
January 5th, 2012
11:59 AM ET

What happens when candidates called by God drop out?

By Stephen Walsh, CNN

On Wednesday, blogger and sitcom writer Kelly Oxford sent a tweet about the Republican race for the presidency that got a lot of folks asking: Is this God’s idea of a joke?

Oxford, whose Twitter feed was named by TIME magazine one of the 140 best of 2011, wrote, “Cain, Perry, Bachmann all claimed God told them to run for President, and all are out of the race. God is hilarious.”

It’s been reported that Herman Cain, Rick Perry, Michele Bachmann and Rick Santorum have all suggested that God called on them to enter the presidential race.

But here we are: Cain’s out. Bachmann’s out.

After returning to Texas to “reassess” his campaign, Perry announced he’s not throwing in the towel. Judging by his poor showing in the Iowa caucuses and the debates so far, however, many political experts think it’s just a matter of time.

The only one with supposed divine guidance who’s still in the race is Santorum.

So what gives? Did the candidates misread God’s supposed message? Does the defeat of a divinely-inspired candidate necessarily contradict a message from God?

We want to hear form you. What do you think?

- CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor

Filed under: Uncategorized

soundoff (1,906 Responses)
  1. Iqbal khan

    Promoting War on Iran

    By Stephen Lendman

    Iran poses no belligerent or terrorist threat. In contrast, America, key NATO partners and Israel are global menaces. http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article30171.htm

    The US-Iran Economic War

    By Pepe Escobar

    Here's a crash course on how to further wreck the global economy. http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article30172.htm

    Drone Wars
    U.S. Turns to Drones to "Counter" China

    By MICHAEL RICHARDSON

    The United States aims to deploy sea-based drones on its aircraft carriers in the Pacific by 2018. http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article30174.htm

    January 6, 2012 at 6:05 pm |
    • Reality

      Mohammed was an illiterate, womanizing, lust and greed-driven, warmongering, hallucinating Arab, who also had embellishing/hallucinating/plagiarizing scribal biographers who not only added "angels" and flying chariots to the koran but also a militaristic agenda to support the plundering and looting of the lands of non-believers.

      This agenda continues as shown by the ma-ssacre in Mumbai, the as-sas-sinations of Bhutto and Theo Van Gogh, the conduct of the seven Muslim doctors in the UK, the 9/11 terrorists, the 24/7 Sunni suicide/roadside/market/mosque bombers, the 24/7 Shiite suicide/roadside/market/mosque bombers, the Islamic bombers of the trains in the UK and Spain, the Bali crazies, the Kenya crazies, the Pakistani “koranics”, the Palestine suicide bombers/rocketeers, the Lebanese nutcases, the Taliban nut jobs, the Ft. Hood follower of the koran, and the Filipino “koranics”.

      And who funds this muck and stench of terror? The warmongering, Islamic, Shiite terror and torture theocracy of Iran aka the Third Axis of Evil and also the Sunni "Wannabees" of Saudi Arabia.

      Current crises:

      The global Sunni-Shiite blood feud and the warmongering, womanizing (11 wives), hallucinating founder.

      January 7, 2012 at 12:16 am |
  2. KevinE

    Change can be uncomfortable... but the work Jesus begins in us, he will finish. And the proof of his existence.. is the beautiful TESTIMONY he does through our life, through a relationship with our loving creator [♥]

    When other people see the awesome testimony in our life, they will be very attracted to what is INSIDE us that strengthens us to overcome evil, WITH GOOD [♥]

    When you're a beautiful person on the inside, there is nothing in the world that can change that about you.

    Wht makes you attractive is when you can love your enemies. When you bless those who curse you and do good to those who do bad to you. When you Love those who hate you.. That is what is attractive.

    When you can forgive the unforgivable. and Love the unlovable.

    January 6, 2012 at 5:54 pm |
    • OhPlz

      "Change can be uncomfortable... but the work Jesus begins in us, he will finish."

      With 80% of the US claiming to be Christians, and you claim the world is full of hate, then your jesus isn't finishing very well.

      January 6, 2012 at 5:56 pm |
    • KevinE

      OhPlz: How many Christians are TRUELY seeking the Lord and have a personal 1 on 1 relationship with Jesus daily daily daily??? Those who believe in God but forget God and live their lives like the heathen and follow the worlds ways and not God's ways are not going to be in constant fellowship with the Lord.

      But for those who constantly diligently seek the Lord and follow him, there will be change. The Christian Life is not necessarily a continual rise. There is growth and set back. Growth and struggle. But throughout the full course of the Christian life you will see transform and change because the God who began a great work will finish it.

      January 6, 2012 at 6:03 pm |
    • OhPlz

      "But for those who constantly diligently seek the Lord and follow him, there will be change. The Christian Life is not necessarily a continual rise. There is growth and set back. Growth and struggle. But throughout the full course of the Christian life you will see transform and change because the God who began a great work will finish it."

      It's not working if the world is full of hate idiot.

      January 6, 2012 at 6:44 pm |
  3. KevinE

    Jesus Christ is the one true living God! I want you to know that there is a God in heaven that loves you and understands what you're going through. But there is also an unseen enemy behind the scenes, the devil, who fights our soul daily and tempts us to walk in hate, not love.

    There is always going to be haters in life. They're everywhere and aren't going anywhere. It's just the world that we live in that is full of hate more than love.

    BUT.. there is A WAY to overcome the wicked force of hate that comes against us! ... Through Jesus Christ [:)] The way to defeat hate, is by LOVE.

    When you give your life to God through Jesus Christ, he comes to live inside your heart, for a relationship. You can experience the one and only true living God when you accept Jesus Christ as your Lord & Savior, who died on the cross for our sins.

    Jesus WILL prove himself to you if you open the door of your heart to him, who has power over the enemy. People look for God's existance by proof, but you can experience the living God for yourself when you open the door of your heart for Jesus. To know God, is to know Jesus Christ. When Jesus gets in your life, he changes lives for the better [:)]

    The fruits of God's spirit are [♥] LOVE [♥] Joy [♥] Peace [♥] Patience [♥] Kindness [♥] Gentleness [♥] Faithfulness [♥] Goodness & [♥] Self-Control.

    There is so much to gain in Jesus Christ. True LIFE!!! He heals broken hearts, gives you everlasting life in heaven when you accept him and follow him, works on the inside of your heart to perfect inward beauty more and more, etc. Because God is LOVE.

    The choice is yours sistuh [♥] I'm not messaging you to judge you or anything like that. But to let you know these things out of love. Not to force anything on you, but to put it out there. cuz Love doesn't force. n Neither does God force himself upon people for a relationship.

    Much love!!! may Jesus bless u <3

    January 6, 2012 at 5:50 pm |
    • OhPlz

      "It's just the world that we live in that is full of hate more than love."

      LOL! and christians like to quote that most of the world believes in a higher power and a god, so the hate is coming from your own kind. DUH!

      January 6, 2012 at 5:53 pm |
    • KevinE

      @OhPlz: Feel the beauty that lives inside you. You can only perceive the beauty that lives outside u wen u feel the beauty that lives inside u. Honor ur body and accept it as it is. You have the right to feel beautiful and enjoy it.
      We are born in truth and beauty, but we grow up believing in lies. One of the biggest lies in the story of humanity is the lie of our imperfection. When we believe this lie, we use the lie to judge ourselves, to punish ourselves, and to justify our mistakes.
      U know wut makes someone attractive? Wen one has a strong faith in GOD. Wen the Holy Spirit is in them and is active. That's wuts makes them attractive. [♥]
      The more Godly you become, the more godliness you are attracted to and attract.
      The more sinful you become, the more sinfulness you are attracted to and attract.
      wut makes them attractive is wen u can love ur enemies. Wen u bless those who curse u and do good to those who do bad to u. Wen u Love those who hate u.. That is wut is attractive.
      *wut makes u attractive is wen u can love ur enemies. Wen u bless those who curse u and do good to those who do bad to u. Wen u Love those who hate u.. That is wut is attractive.
      Wen u can forgive the unforgivable. and Love the unlovable.

      January 6, 2012 at 5:58 pm |
    • OhPlz

      "Feel the beauty that lives inside you. You can only perceive the beauty that lives outside u wen u feel the beauty that lives inside u. Honor ur body and accept it as it is. You have the right to feel beautiful and enjoy it."

      Yet you think the world is full of hate, guess it's not working so well for you.

      January 6, 2012 at 6:45 pm |
  4. Mr. Izz

    Ok, people... here's the thing. These presidential candidates were not "called of God." They weren't. They can say that over and over and over, but they are politicians, and are just trying to sway us.

    The candidates were just trying to cash in on some cheap votes and support from the "Evangelical Leaders" everyone is talking about. If a person sees that a candidate says that God told them to run for office, and compares themselves to Moses... a few things happen. Suddenly, the "Evangelical Leaders" see that the candidate is religious, so that bumps them up a notch. These "leaders" can see that their congregation responds to a supposed religious person... another notch. And heck, who doesn't like Moses? Seriously. Even if you aren't religious and don't believe it, you've got to be cheering for the underdog here anyway! Another notch. (Hopefully some of you can find the humor here....)

    The candidates say these things to boost their small numbers. Are they called of God? Nope, regardless of your beliefs, these people aren't called by God. The candidates aren't stupid, they want and need every tiny bit of support they can muster, especially if they are at the bottom of the political ladder. Most of them will do and say nearly anything to get your vote, and to get you on their side.

    One last thing, for the religious folks here, why would God call an individual to run for President of the United States? This seems way out of God's character and pattern. And yes, I am talking about the stories in the Bible (Old and New Testament). If God were to call someone, not only would they never give up, because seriously, that would be amazing to be truly called of God; but they would not be asked to run for a political office based on their own personal opinions. Cain says this, Bachmann says that, they contradict each other. God isn't like that. He will not contradict himself. Consequently, there isn't one candidate that is in the best interest of what God wants.

    When has God ever called someone in the position that these individuals are in to do anything Biblical worthy? Look at all of the notable figures in the Bible. Many came from poor families, the others came from wealthy families, but threw it all away to pursue what God told them, etc. None of these stories really come close to how our current candidates are.

    Maybe these people prayed and felt they should run for office, but that is definitely an incredible stretch from God telling them to run.

    January 6, 2012 at 4:28 pm |
  5. all hail me

    i'm the king of the world. prove me wrong!

    January 6, 2012 at 4:13 pm |
  6. JesusLives

    In four years you'll be praying palin, bachman and cain hadn't backed out. Watch and see.

    January 6, 2012 at 3:55 pm |
    • J.W

      Why? What is going to happen in the next 4 years?

      January 6, 2012 at 3:57 pm |
    • mike.alston@hotmail.com

      It staggers me to think that there could be more than 6 idiots in this country who would actually vote for Palin.

      January 6, 2012 at 4:39 pm |
    • SeanNJ

      I'm going to see how many of those people I can get to send you an e-mail...

      ...mike.alston@hotmail.com is it?

      January 6, 2012 at 4:46 pm |
    • paul

      nobody with a brain will be praying that bachman or perry or santorum be our president. nobody. if there were a god, then we'd all know it, for sure we would.

      January 6, 2012 at 5:00 pm |
  7. RnTexas

    Ever since Man created the god-myth there have been delusional lying fools. Unfortunately the United States has an over abundance of other fools who throw their money and votes to those morons.

    January 6, 2012 at 2:21 pm |
    • JesusLives

      Yes and the rest of the brilliant ones vote for obama. whatever.

      January 6, 2012 at 3:54 pm |
  8. Yo

    What if God were one of us, not a slob like one of us

    January 6, 2012 at 2:12 pm |
  9. God

    Hi folks,

    God here. You know, I was worried everyone would be mad at me when these jokers dropped out. I mean, I asked all these clowns to run for the comic relief. What, with the recession's recovery and all, I thought I'd give you mortals a break. Give you something to laugh about. But, I can't keep it up forever, even though I'm eternal. I'm pleased you like my act so much. Give a round of applause to my willing servants, too. Peace to all, God.

    January 6, 2012 at 1:14 pm |
  10. Mark from Middle River

    Hmm... Maybe its the movie SuckerPunch. Cain, Bachmann and Perry are Rocket, Amber and Babydoll and maybe Santorum or Romney is Sweat Pea. 🙂

    Everyone knew that the press and shows like Saturday Night Live were going to go after who ever was the front runner. Each time one of the other candidates came to the front they were jumped on now when the first caucuses are beginning it might be too late.

    Maybe God told them to be pawns or cannon fodder in this election.

    January 6, 2012 at 1:03 pm |
  11. Enoch

    It means you have the choice, the free-will, yet, you fools chose the wrong one, as usual - the going will get tough - are you ready to rumble?

    January 6, 2012 at 12:42 pm |
    • Franklin

      If someone holds a gun to your head and then 'asks' you to do something, how free is your will?

      January 6, 2012 at 12:49 pm |
    • God

      Enoch, my man. How's your hammer hanging, bro? Haven't seen you around the holy city in a few hundred years. What's new? Methuselah says you're doing well. Shoot, we should catch up and drink some brews. Hey, remember that time I hid you away and everyone was confused? Good times, good times...

      January 6, 2012 at 12:52 pm |
    • David Johnson

      Christians say, "Free will is given to man, by God". Each person can choose to accept god's love and spend eternity in Heaven or to reject god and spend eternity being tortured in Hell. How is that freedom of choice when it is the same thing as The Godfather, making you an offer you cannot refuse?

      The problem with free will is, that Christians have insisted on their god being Omniscient, Omnipotent, and Omnibenevolent.

      No god can be all three at the same time. The attributes contradict each other.
      If god knows what He will do in the future and because He is Omnipotent, does something else, then He is not omniscient.
      If god knows what He will do in the future and cannot do something else, then He is not omnipotent.
      See the problem?
      If God knows the future, if the future can be known, that means that the future is predictable and unchangeable. This, in turn, means that our actions are predetermined. If god is all knowing, free will is an illusion.
      This also binds god, in that He knows what he will do in the future, and He must do it. It doesn't matter if He lives outside time or what He is made of. If the future can be known, then everything is predetermined.

      Let's look at Jesus and his predictions that Judas would betray him and Peter would deny him.
      Those were future events. Do you think Judas could have used his free will to opt out? Not, if Jesus/God was omniscient. Same goes for Peter.
      The actions of Peter and Judas were predetermined. They had no choice.

      When Moses was attempting to secure the release of the Jews from Egypt, God repeatedly "hardens Pharaoh's heart". God did not allow Pharaoh to release the Jews, until He had delivered His 10 plagues upon the Egyptian people. Pharaoh didn't have free will. The Egyptian people, who suffered the plagues, didn't either.

      Biblical prophecy would not be possible, unless events and human actions were predetermined and there is no free will.
      The fulfillment of a prophecy cannot be left to random chance.

      What about the child who is murdered by a monster, or a people slaughtered by a stronger opponent (or a god)?
      Did they choose to be harmed? Where was their free will? These acts show that the strong or the people in power have greater free will than their victims. Hmm... Isn't this a lot like what would happen if there was no god?

      If god has a "plan for each of us", if there is an agenda, then that pretty much rules out free will.

      "For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the LORD, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future." [Jeremiah 29:11]

      "You saw me before I was born and scheduled each day of my life before I began to breathe. Every day was recorded in your book!" [Psalm 139:16]

      You might argue, that while god has a plan for each of us, He doesn't force us to follow this plan. The problem with this argument, is that if a person does not follow god's plan, it may affect my ability to follow god's plan. A drunk driver may run me down. A robber may shoot me. My plan would be cancelled.

      Ephesians 1:11 "We have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will."

      "this man [Christ Jesus] delivered over by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God" (Acts 2:23a NASB).

      The 5 point Calvinists believe our fates are sealed, even before we are born. This would mean that god allows humans to be born, knowing they will someday burn forever. Seems wrong to me, even for a mysterious god.

      There is no evidence that a god gives or safeguards free will. In fact, there is much evidence to the contrary.

      Humans have free will not because of god, but because god does not exist.

      Cheers!

      January 6, 2012 at 1:00 pm |
    • ChrisS

      Wow, David Johnson sure does conform to the 'teachings' of the 'book', huh? You have free will to believe all that garbage you just posted on CNN's thread, just as I have the free will to tell you how ludicrous you sound. You Christians sure love to call things 'fact' when they can't be proved one way or another, and continue to denounce FACTS that have been proven through science...i.e. EVOLUTION...seriously, get a grip, you live on EARTH, and when you die, you will be buried ON EARTH.....

      January 6, 2012 at 1:27 pm |
    • David Johnson

      @Franklyn

      Of course it was assumed that the candidates would win. God was on their side. Since there was only one position for president open, it was obvious that at least 2 of them were crazy or lying. Turns out, all three were lunatics or liars. These candidates have embarrassed themselves, their church and god. Their church should excommunicate them.

      Perry – I think when a man can watch a video and have a total conversion against allowing abortions for a ra_pe or incest victim, which just might help him win more Evangelical and Catholic votes is a liar. Especially, since this conversion came when he was in the dumpster with Bachmann.

      Bachmann, I think may have actually heard the "voice of god". She is a lunatic. Like Sharon Angle and I am not a witch...Christine O'Donnell.

      Cain – Liar. Most definitely.

      @Enoch

      The Christian god is very unlikely to exist. Jesus was / is a myth.

      Cheers!

      January 6, 2012 at 1:39 pm |
    • Horizon

      Ok ChrisS. Are you against David Johnson or with him because it sounds like you're mistakenly trashing the guy over a message that you support? Could be possible that you just had an unsual first sentence that came across the wrong way.

      January 6, 2012 at 1:44 pm |
    • David Johnson

      @ChrisS

      Dude! Read my comment again. It is an argument to the claim that man has free will.

      I believe man has free will, because there is no god. Not, because god gave us this nifty gift.

      I am an atheist. I have my membership card and everything.

      Cheers!

      January 6, 2012 at 1:45 pm |
    • fred

      David Johnson
      David Johnson
      “Christians say, "Free will is given to man, by God". Each person can choose to accept god's love and spend eternity in Heaven or to reject god and spend eternity being tortured in Hell.”
      =>Hell is reserved for Satan and his demons. They actually like that world so how do you come off saying it is not free will. You will most likely get exactly what you deserve.
      “No god can be all three at the same time. The attributes contradict each other.
      If god knows what He will do in the future and because He is Omnipotent, does something else, then He is not omniscient.
      If god knows what He will do in the future and cannot do something else, then He is not omnipotent.
      See the problem?”
      =>YEAH you still think God is like you with your limitations. God referred himself to “IAM” this means past present future are as one. You are man and cannot be or do that. This is why you
      “Let's look at Jesus and his predictions that Judas would betray him and Peter would deny him.”
      =>Jesus was giving them both an additional opportunity to change. As with you and I we do not change much. A warning in the form of prediction is not the same as predetermination. Once again “I AM”= past, present and future in Gods order of things.

      “You might argue, that while god has a plan for each of us, He doesn't force us to follow this plan. The problem with this argument, is that if a person does not follow god's plan, it may affect my ability to follow god's plan. A drunk driver may run me down. A robber may shoot me. My plan would be cancelled.”
      =>It actually removes chance and luck as your cause for where you end up. Because everyone is subject to the same element it is not a deciding factor for who is chosen and who is not. God is one step ahead of you David at all times. When you die by whatever cause or means you will be held accountable for what you did with what you were given. Not rocket science.
      “There is no evidence that a god gives or safeguards free will. In fact, there is much evidence to the contrary.”
      =>No, go back and in the very beginning you see two trees in the garden there is your safe guard. As a matter of fact God went way beyond a fair choice. He provided everything for man that was good except one. That one taboo, that one tree in the middle gave man the advantage to succeed. God could have put an equal number of choices out there but no, just one bad all others good.

      January 6, 2012 at 2:23 pm |
    • Rebecca

      “Hell is reserved for Satan and his demons. They actually like that world so how do you come off saying it is not free will. You will most likely get exactly what you deserve”
      LOL! Therein lies the problem, fred can’t comprehend.

      “YEAH you still think God is like you with your limitations. God referred himself to “IAM” this means past present future are as one. You are man and cannot be or do that. This is why you
      “Let's look at Jesus and his predictions that Judas would betray him and Peter would deny him.””
      So that means your god let eve eat the apple, knew he was going to create hell, knew he was going to kill most of humanity and knows who he is going to condemn in hell after they die. That’s not a god, that is a monster.

      “A warning in the form of prediction is not the same as predetermination. Once again “I AM”= past, present and future in Gods order of things.”

      You’re saying you’re god already knows the future the choices you are going to make, yet for many doesn’t do a thing to change it. Just like all those being killed through natural disasters. Your god is a monster.
      “It actually removes chance and luck as your cause for where you end up. Because everyone is subject to the same element it is not a deciding factor for who is chosen and who is not. God is one step ahead of you David at all times. When you die by whatever cause or means you will be held accountable for what you did with what you were given. Not rocket science.”
      Again, your god knows the future and does nothing to save the lives of millions of people starving, dying from natural disasters, that’s not a god, that is a monster.

      “No, go back and in the very beginning you see two trees in the garden there is your safe guard. As a matter of fact God went way beyond a fair choice. He provided everything for man that was good except one. That one taboo, that one tree in the middle gave man the advantage to succeed. God could have put an equal number of choices out there but no, just one bad all others good.”

      You’re god still knew eve would eat the fruit, you even says he knows the future, so your god planned hell, planned on using fear to control you, to make choosing it more appealing, that is a monster and a tyrant. Oh, that’s right it’s a fairy tale, that’s why your god is so evil and controlling.

      January 6, 2012 at 4:47 pm |
    • David Johnson

      @Fred

      I said: 'Christians say, "Free will is given to man, by God". Each person can choose to accept god's love and spend eternity in Heaven or to reject god and spend eternity being tortured in Hell.'

      You replied: "Hell is reserved for Satan and his demons. They actually like that world so how do you come off saying it is not free will."

      Because the pitch goes, that it will be eternal torture for humans. So the choice is: Living in bliss or Eternal torture. That is not a choice. It is as I said, a gun to your head.

      -------------------------

      I said: "No god can be all three at the same time. The attributes contradict each other.
      If god knows what He will do in the future and because He is Omnipotent, does something else, then He is not omniscient.
      If god knows what He will do in the future and cannot do something else, then He is not omnipotent."

      You replied: "YEAH you still think God is like you with your limitations. God referred himself to “IAM” this means past present future are as one. You are man and cannot be or do that. "

      The future is the future. If it can be known or witnessed by god, either because He predestined everything or simply because things are predetermined, then the future is written in stone. It cannot be changed. If it can be changed, then god is not omniscient.

      God looks and sees a huge tsunami hit Ja_pan. Since He is all knowing, what he sees is what must / will happen.

      Since god is all powerful (Omnipotent), He could calm the waters. But, this would mean He had not seen the actual future the first time. God would be wrong. And if god was wrong, He is not Omniscient.

      If god tried to calm the waters, and because it was predetermined to happed, He could not...then god could not be all powerful.

      God could have either one of these attributes, but not both.

      ---------------------------------------------

      I said: "Let's look at Jesus and his predictions that Judas would betray him and Peter would deny him.”

      You replied: "Jesus was giving them both an additional opportunity to change. As with you and I we do not change much. A warning in the form of prediction is not the same as predetermination. Once again “I AM”= past, present and future in Gods order of things."

      Jesus told Peter he would deny Him 3 times before morning. That is a prediction. Not just an opportunity to change.

      Ephesians 1:11 "We have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to His purpose who works all things after the counsel of His will."

      "this man [Christ Jesus] delivered over by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God" (Acts 2:23a NASB).

      Biblical prophecy would not be possible, unless events and human actions were predetermined and there is no free will.
      The fulfillment of a prophecy cannot be left to random chance. Had Peter denied Jesus any more or less than 3 times, Jesus would have made a bad prediction. The same goes for Judas. If Judas had not betrayed Jesus, then Jesus would have been wrong. A demigod can't be wrong.

      Still denying predestination? LOL

      ----------------------------------------------------

      I said: “You might argue, that while god has a plan for each of us, He doesn't force us to follow this plan. The problem with this argument, is that if a person does not follow god's plan, it may affect my ability to follow god's plan. A drunk driver may run me down. A robber may shoot me. My plan would be cancelled.”

      You replied: "It actually removes chance and luck as your cause for where you end up. Because everyone is subject to the same element it is not a deciding factor for who is chosen and who is not. God is one step ahead of you David at all times. When you die by whatever cause or means you will be held accountable for what you did with what you were given. Not rocket science.

      "For I know the plans I have for you,” declares the LORD, “plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future." [Jeremiah 29:11]

      "You saw me before I was born and scheduled each day of my life before I began to breathe. Every day was recorded in your book!" [Psalm 139:16]

      If god has a plan for each of us, then predestination exists. There is no free will. Remember your god can see the future. God would know if you will be saved or damned, before you were conceived. Yet, the damned live, awaiting their ultimate fate.

      Also you didn't mention the child that is attacked or the people that are victims of genocide. When did they give their permission to be tortured and die? Where was / is their free will?

      Free will appears to be given out in greater abundance to the powerful. Pfui!

      ----------------------------------------------

      “There is no evidence that a god gives or safeguards free will. In fact, there is much evidence to the contrary.”

      You said: "No, go back and in the very beginning you see two trees in the garden there is your safe guard. As a matter of fact God went way beyond a fair choice. He provided everything for man that was good except one. That one taboo, that one tree in the middle gave man the advantage to succeed. God could have put an equal number of choices out there but no, just one bad all others good."

      Except the trees never existed. The garden, the snake and the god, are all myth.

      Evolution, with its evidence of transitional fossils, geological column, DNA evidence, vestigial organs etc., is very damning to the biblical Creation Story.

      If god created all the organisms on the planet, then He must have created even the diseases that have caused and are causing so much death and misery for humans and animals. He would have had to fashion the tick and the flea. The mosquito and blood flukes. And worms that bore into a child's eye.

      How could an all good god do such a thing? Why would He spend His time creating gruesome things to cause human suffering? Yet, these horrors exist. And if god didn't create them, who did?

      Evolution explains the diversity of the planet's organisms, including the pathogens and the parasites that have caused so much human death and misery.

      If the Creation Story is a fable, then Adam and Eve did not exist.

      If Adam and Eve did not exist, then there was no original sin.

      If there was no original sin, then it cannot be the reason god allows so much suffering in the world. Instead, there are natural causes for earthquakes and floods and other disasters.

      If there was no original sin, then there was no need for a redeemer.

      If there was no redeemer, then Christianity is a based on a false premise.

      "If we cannot believe in the First Adam, why believe in the Last [Christ]?" 1 Corinthians15:45

      If the Creation story is a myth, then there is no reason to believe any of the bible, for the entire bible is based on Genesis.

      If we evolved, there is no soul –> no afterlife –> no need of a heaven or hell.

      And no need for me to reply to you anymore.

      Cheers!

      Cheers!

      January 6, 2012 at 5:17 pm |
  12. TR6

    Since Cain and Bachman seem to be lying about god calling them, shouldn’t god incinerate them with bolts of lightening

    January 6, 2012 at 12:16 pm |
    • Eric G

      Uh, that would be Zeus.

      January 6, 2012 at 12:27 pm |
    • Nonimus

      oh, right... a bolt of frogs then?

      January 6, 2012 at 12:28 pm |
    • Mark from Middle River

      >>>"oh, right... a bolt of frogs then?"

      ...That would be old testament .. they would have to be Jewish. 🙂

      January 6, 2012 at 12:36 pm |
    • God

      I'm thinking of going back to some old practices. I kind of liked it when I turned Lot's wife into a pillar of salt. I have a thing for crystals. So, don't expect any lightening bolts for a while. That's too... comic-bookish, you know what I mean?

      January 6, 2012 at 12:42 pm |
    • Bright

      Its very simple, these politicians continually take advantage of good hearted people of faith by telling them what they want to hear, its politics 101. They do it for political gain, although it was more effective in past years, it seems every passing year voters get more and more educated and informed and realize that these candidates also have to have some substance. Politicians will continue to do it just as long as they get a 'bump' in the polls for saying 'I am called by God.' This is not a knock on our God, but an embarassment to politicians in general and those voters who are fooled by those politicians.

      January 6, 2012 at 12:49 pm |
    • Franklin

      Mark from Middle River
      "...That would be old testament .. they would have to be Jewish."
      Oh, that's right, Christians don't see anything in the Old Testament that applies to them. 🙂

      January 6, 2012 at 12:52 pm |
    • David Johnson

      @Eric G.

      As usual you are right about Zeus. But, this ability was also given to the Christian god. When lightening rods were first invented, they were forbidden to be used. It was believed that their use would interfere with the Christian god's use of lightening bolts to punish. Interesting, since many churches burned due to lightening strikes to their tall, pointed spires.

      I find it odd that Christians feel that an almighty god could be stymied by a lightening rod or anything else man could come up with. I think we learned our lesson when we built that tower that was just inches from Heaven.

      Cheers!

      January 6, 2012 at 1:10 pm |
    • Primewonk

      Well, according to Zechariah 13, the parents of a false prophet have stab them.

      "And if anyone still prophesies, their father and mother, to whom they were born, will say to them, ‘You must die, because you have told lies in the LORD’s name.’ Then their own parents will stab the one who prophesies."

      January 6, 2012 at 2:23 pm |
    • Jimmy

      Bright
      ALL politicians tell people what they want to hear. It's just that people of faith are far more likely to take them at their word if they claim to be Christians as well.

      January 6, 2012 at 5:25 pm |
  13. David

    http://www.sightlikeaconstructionworker.blogspot.com/2012/01/candidates-called-by-god.html

    January 6, 2012 at 12:15 pm |
  14. Kelley M

    Omg. Hahahahahahaha! Did anybody else see the cripple fight? abinadi and JesusLives are goin' at it!!!!!!

    abinadi

    @JesusLives."7 Surely the Lord God will do nothing, but he revealeth his secret unto his servants the prophets." Amos 3. "Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation." 2 Peter 1:20. Since neither you nor anyone in your church is a prophet, you have no right to say what is or isn't scripture nor do you have any right to interpret scripture.
    January 5, 2012 at 3:29 pm | Report abuse | Reply

    abinadi

    Sorry, but you belong to a false church, brother, and you need to correct your ways!
    January 5, 2012 at 3:32 pm | Report abuse |

    January 6, 2012 at 12:14 pm |
  15. Daniel Dessinger

    While I cannot speak for any candidate, it would be a mistake to assume that there's an error when multiple candidates called by God to run for President eventually withdraw.

    Did God tell you to run for President? Or did He tell you that you would be the next President? Quite a distinction there. Sometimes people make assumptions based upon the call of God. Training for the Olympics is different than competing in the Olympics, just as much as it is different than winning a gold medal in the Olympics.

    If you are told to train for the Olympics and upon hearing that you assume that you will be competing in the Olympics, you have just made an assumption outside the realm of what you were told.

    January 6, 2012 at 12:01 pm |
    • Franklin

      You have to ask yourself if any of them, after feeling that God 'called' the to run for the presidency, didn't also feel that God thought them a good choice for the position. If they didn't, then what did they suspect God had in mind for their running? A shameful waste of contributor's money and volunteer time, both of which could have been put to better use in charity? Is this what God would have wanted?

      January 6, 2012 at 12:57 pm |
  16. Kelley M

    God PUNK'D them. Beat THAT, Ashton Kutcher.

    January 6, 2012 at 11:52 am |
    • God

      Thanks for the support, Kelley M. I have a difficult time getting my voice heard over Ashton's. He has so many twitter followers. It sucks.

      January 6, 2012 at 12:44 pm |
  17. JesusLives

    Answer: Bible prophecy is fulfilled.

    January 6, 2012 at 11:28 am |
    • OhPlz

      "Bible prophecy is fulfilled."

      Do you know how many times people have made that claim and it turned out to be false. What an idiot.

      January 6, 2012 at 11:39 am |
    • MartinT

      Answer: Another religious NUTJOB rises up out of the ashes of ignorance.

      January 6, 2012 at 11:42 am |
    • God

      God speaking here. Thank you, JesusLives. I try to make good on my promises. Wait for the big one coming in a few years, when my son returns. I know I've been stringing you folks along for a while now, like the hot girl in high school who would get you to do her homework, but never let you feel her up. But, unlike her, I promise I won't disappoint, my child.

      January 6, 2012 at 12:47 pm |
    • David Johnson

      @JesusLives

      Jesus was a myth. He was fashioned after the sun gods, like Mithra and Horus.

      Cheers!

      January 6, 2012 at 1:52 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      "He was fashioned after the sun gods, like Mithra and Horus."

      This is factless opinion. Unless you have evidence that the writers of the NT sampled those other faiths...do you?

      Remember...correlation does not imply causation.

      January 6, 2012 at 1:56 pm |
    • David Johnson

      @Uncouth Swain

      Source: Copyright 2007 Near-Death Experiences & the Afterlife

      The religion of Mithra preceded Christianity by roughly six hundred years. Mithraic worship at one time covered a large portion of the ancient world. It flourished as late as the second century. The Messianic idea originated in ancient Persia and this is where the Jewish and Christian concepts of a Savior came from. Mithra, as the sun god of ancient Persia, had the following karmic similarities with Jesus:

      Identical Life Experiences

      (1) Mithra was born on December 25th as an offspring of the Sun. Next to the gods Ormuzd and Ahrimanes, Mithra held the highest rank among the gods of ancient Persia. He was represented as a beautiful youth and a Mediator. Reverend J. W. Lake states: "Mithras is spiritual light contending with spiritual darkness, and through his labors the kingdom of darkness shall be lit with heaven's own light; the Eternal will receive all things back into his favor, the world will be redeemed to God. The impure are to be purified, and the evil made good, through the mediation of Mithras, the reconciler of Ormuzd and Ahriman. Mithras is the Good, his name is Love. In relation to the Eternal he is the source of grace, in relation to man he is the life-giver and mediator" (Plato, Philo, and Paul, p. 15).

      (2) He was considered a great traveling teacher and masters. He had twelve companions as Jesus had twelve disciples. Mithras also performed miracles.

      (3) Mithra was called "the good shepherd, "the way, the truth and the light, redeemer, savior, Messiah." He was identified with both the lion and the lamb.

      (4) The International Encyclopedia states: "Mithras seems to have owed his prominence to the belief that he was the source of life, and could also redeem the souls of the dead into the better world ... The ceremonies included a sort of baptism to remove sins, anointing, and a sacred meal of bread and water, while a consecrated wine, believed to possess wonderful power, played a prominent part."

      (5) Chambers Encyclopedia says: "The most important of his many festivals was his birthday, celebrated on the 25th of December, the day subsequently fixed - against all evidence - as the birthday of Christ. The worship of Mithras early found its way into Rome, and the mysteries of Mithras, which fell in the spring equinox, were famous even among the many Roman festivals. The ceremonies observed in the initiation to these mysteries - symbolical of the struggle between Ahriman and Ormuzd (the Good and the Evil) - were of the most extraordinary and to a certain degree even dangerous character. Baptism and the partaking of a mystical liquid, consisting of flour and water, to be drunk with the utterance of sacred formulas, were among the inauguration acts."

      (6) Prof. Franz Cu_mont, of the University of Ghent, writes as follows concerning the religion of Mithra and the religion of Christ: "The sectaries of the Persian god, like the Christians', purified themselves by baptism, received by a species of confirmation the power necessary to combat the spirit of evil; and expected from a Lord's supper salvation of body and soul. Like the latter, they also held Sunday sacred, and celebrated the birth of the Sun on the 25th of December.... They both preached a categorical system of ethics, regarded asceticism as meritorious and counted among their principal virtues abstinence and continence, renunciation and self-control. Their conceptions of the world and of the destiny of man were similar. They both admitted the existence of a Heaven inhabited by beatified ones, situated in the upper regions, and of a Hell, peopled by demons, situated in the bowels of the Earth. They both placed a flood at the beginning of history; they both assigned as the source of their condition, a primitive revelation; they both, finally, believed in the immortality of the soul, in a last judgment, and in a resurrection of the dead, consequent upon a final conflagration of the universe" (The Mysteries of Mithras, pp. 190, 191).

      (7) Reverend Charles Biggs stated: "The disciples of Mithra formed an organized church, with a developed hierarchy. They possessed the ideas of Mediation, Atonement, and a Savior, who is human and yet divine, and not only the idea, but a doctrine of the future life. They had a Eucharist, and a Baptism, and other curious an_alogies might be pointed out between their system and the church of Christ (The Christian Platonists, p. 240).

      (8) In the catacombs at Rome was preserved a relic of the old Mithraic worship. It was a picture of the infant Mithra seated in the lap of his virgin mother, while on their knees before him were Persian Magi adoring him and offering gifts.

      (9) He was buried in a tomb and after three days he rose again. His resurrection was celebrated every year.

      (10) McClintock and Strong wrote: "In modern times Christian writers have been induced to look favorably upon the assertion that some of our ecclesiastical usages (e.g., the inst_itution of the Christmas festival) originated in the cultus of Mithraism. Some writers who refuse to accept the Christian religion as of supernatural origin, have even gone so far as to inst_itute a close comparison with the founder of Christianity; and Dupuis and others, going even beyond this, have not hesitated to pronounce the Gospel simply a branch of Mithraism" (Art. "Mithra").

      (11) Mithra had his principal festival on what was later to become Easter, at which time he was resurrected. His sacred day was Sunday, "the Lord's Day." The Mithra religion had a Eucharist or "Lord's Supper."

      (12) The Christian Father Manes, founder of the heretical sect known as Manicheans, believed that Christ and Mithra were one. His teaching, according to Mosheim, was as follows: "Christ is that glorious intelligence which the Persians called Mithras ... His residence is in the sun" (Ecclesiastical History, 3rd century, Part 2, ch. 5).

      "I am a star which goes with thee and shines out of the depths." – Mithraic saying

      "I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright morning star." – Jesus, (Rev. 22:16)

      January 6, 2012 at 4:10 pm |
    • .....

      David don't waste your time on Lycidas they won't have a comprehensive reply it will be more questions to cause you to do research their too lazy to do.

      January 6, 2012 at 4:13 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      Ignoring the troll...thank you for putting something up David.

      (1) Mithra was born on December 25th as an offspring of the Sun.

      ~According to pantheon.o r g "Mithra was born from a rock (or a cave)."
      Just thought I would throw that bit out but since did the God of Abraham equate to the Sun god of the Romans.
      From Merkelbach's Mithras, there is no evidence that states that Mithra was born on Dec 25th.
      I could be wrong on this, I admit that....but if you can find some actual historical evidence from that time period that goes with it...ok.
      Just a reminder though: correlation does not imply causation. Did the NT writers lift info from the Mithra story? Yes or no.

      "Next to the gods Ormuzd and Ahrimanes, Mithra held the highest rank among the gods of ancient Persia....etc"

      ~There is no evidence that Roman Judea was under the Persian influence in any way. There is a lot of evidence that they were under the Greek influence. Not to mention that such early Christians as Paul were from an orthodox background which makes the very concept that one would lift info from another faith kind of silly.
      I also love the fact that the Christianity-haters love to imply that the founders of Christianity were illiterate and ignorant about the world around them. However, they were smart enough to be well versed in another faith to take details from it and add it to their faith without any of their learned pagan contemporaries pointing it out.

      "(2) He was considered a great traveling teacher and masters. He had twelve companions as Jesus had twelve disciples. Mithras also performed miracles."

      ~correlation does not imply causation and I could only find a follower named Varuna...who were the supposed other 11?
      I also have to laugh because just about every major leader in the ancient world could be called a great traveller. Have you ever really seen distance that Jesus walked? Paul would have been considered a great traveller perhaps, but not really Jesus.

      "(3) Mithra was called "the good shepherd, "the way, the truth and the light, redeemer, savior, Messiah." He was identified with both the lion and the lamb."

      ~No he wasn't. He killed a bull with the astrological signs around him though.
      If you could provide some real evidence...that might be nice. Unless you are leaning on "appeal to authority".

      "(4) The International Encyclopedia states: "Mithras seems to have owed his prominence to the belief that he was the source of life, and could also redeem the souls of the dead into the better world ... The ceremonies included a sort of baptism to remove sins, anointing, and a sacred meal of bread and water, while a consecrated wine, believed to possess wonderful power, played a prominent part.""

      ~It included a "sort of baptism"..really? Care to explain.

      "(5) Chambers Encyclopedia says: "The most important of his many festivals was his birthday, celebrated on the 25th of December, the day subsequently fixed – against all evidence – as the birthday of Christ."

      ~The b-day of Christ isn't Dec 25th. So what's your point? That centuries after Jesus some Christians put one of their holidays in direct competi_tion with another faith they disagreed with? What so shocking about that?
      Now if you could show that the Christian founders put the b-day of Christ at Dec 25th right off the bat you might have something. But you can't. Truth be told, pre-Contantine Christianity didn't seem to care that much on the b-day of Jesus.

      Oy...most of the other stuff is just garbage to put it bluntly. Mithra was not born of a virgin mother but of a rock.

      Not to be mean but the entirety of what you put up could be put under:

      1. correlation does not imply causation
      2. appeal to authority

      There is NO evidence that any of the writers of the NT was influenced by the Mithra faith. Considering that the real hay-day of Mithraism came after the time of Christ....it could be just as easily said that they borrowed from the Christian faith.
      I see a lot of references to I suppose learned individuals but I don't see anything to back it up. Where is the ancient Mithra texts from before Jesus? Where is the archaeological evidence from before Jesus?
      I admire the info you put up but all it proves is that there are some ppl that think (and cannot prove) that Christianity borrowed from Mithraism.

      January 6, 2012 at 4:43 pm |
    • Jimmy

      Uncouth Swain
      "This is factless opinion. Unless you have evidence that the writers of the NT sampled those other faiths...do you?"

      Do you have evidence that they didn't? Of course not! You take it on faith that the New Testament writers didn't, which is just as much 'factless opinion" as anything else.

      January 6, 2012 at 4:46 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      @Jimmy-"Do you have evidence that they didn't?"

      Are you wanting me to prove a negative? Ask the average atheist on here what one should think about that.

      January 6, 2012 at 5:24 pm |
    • George

      "Mithraism came after the time of Christ"

      Really, it came before Christ by 600 years. What resource did you use to make that statement?

      January 6, 2012 at 5:34 pm |
    • JustForFun

      Identical Life Experiences

      (1)
      Mithra was born on December 25th as an offspring of the Sun. Next to the gods Ormuzd and Ahrimanes, Mithra held the highest rank among the gods of ancient Persia. He was represented as a beautiful youth and a Mediator. Reverend J. W. Lake states: "Mithras is spiritual light contending with spiritual darkness, and through his labors the kingdom of darkness shall be lit with heaven's own light; the Eternal will receive all things back into his favor, the world will be redeemed to God. The impure are to be purified, and the evil made good, through the mediation of Mithras, the reconciler of Ormuzd and Ahriman. Mithras is the Good, his name is Love. In relation to the Eternal he is the source of grace, in relation to man he is the life-giver and mediator" (Plato, Philo, and Paul, p. 15).
      (2)
      He was considered a great traveling teacher and masters. He had twelve companions as Jesus had twelve disciples. Mithras also performed miracles.

      (3)
      Mithra was called "the good shepherd, "the way, the truth and the light, redeemer, savior, Messiah." He was identified with both the lion and the lamb.

      (4)
      The International Encyclopedia states: "Mithras seems to have owed his prominence to the belief that he was the source of life, and could also redeem the souls of the dead into the better world ... The ceremonies included a sort of baptism to remove sins, anointing, and a sacred meal of bread and water, while a consecrated wine, believed to possess wonderful power, played a prominent part."

      (5)
      Chambers Encyclopedia says: "The most important of his many festivals was his birthday, celebrated on the 25th of December, the day subsequently fixed - against all evidence - as the birthday of Christ. The worship of Mithras early found its way into Rome, and the mysteries of Mithras, which fell in the spring equinox, were famous even among the many Roman festivals. The ceremonies observed in the initiation to these mysteries - symbolical of the struggle between Ahriman and Ormuzd (the Good and the Evil) - were of the most extraordinary and to a certain degree even dangerous character. Baptism and the partaking of a mystical liquid, consisting of flour and water, to be drunk with the utterance of sacred formulas, were among the inauguration acts."

      (6)
      Prof. Franz Cumont, of the University of Ghent, writes as follows concerning the religion of Mithra and the religion of Christ: "The sectaries of the Persian god, like the Christians', purified themselves by baptism, received by a species of confirmation the power necessary to combat the spirit of evil; and expected from a Lord's supper salvation of body and soul. Like the latter, they also held Sunday sacred, and celebrated the birth of the Sun on the 25th of December.... They both preached a categorical system of ethics, regarded asceticism as meritorious and counted among their principal virtues abstinence and continence, renunciation and self-control. Their conceptions of the world and of the destiny of man were similar. They both admitted the existence of a Heaven inhabited by beatified ones, situated in the upper regions, and of a Hell, peopled by demons, situated in the bowels of the Earth. They both placed a flood at the beginning of history; they both assigned as the source of their condition, a primitive revelation; they both, finally, believed in the immortality of the soul, in a last judgment, and in a resurrection of the dead, consequent upon a final conflagration of the universe" (The Mysteries of Mithras, pp. 190, 191).

      (7)
      Reverend Charles Biggs stated: "The disciples of Mithra formed an organized church, with a developed hierarchy. They possessed the ideas of Mediation, Atonement, and a Savior, who is human and yet divine, and not only the idea, but a doctrine of the future life. They had a Eucharist, and a Baptism, and other curious analogies might be pointed out between their system and the church of Christ (The Christian Platonists, p. 240).

      (8)
      In the catacombs at Rome was preserved a relic of the old Mithraic worship. It was a picture of the infant Mithra seated in the lap of his virgin mother, while on their knees before him were Persian Magi adoring him and offering gifts.

      (9)
      He was buried in a tomb and after three days he rose again. His resurrection was celebrated every year.

      (10)
      McClintock and Strong wrote: "In modern times Christian writers have been induced to look favorably upon the assertion that some of our ecclesiastical usages (e.g., the institution of the Christmas festival) originated in the cultus of Mithraism. Some writers who refuse to accept the Christian religion as of supernatural origin, have even gone so far as to institute a close comparison with the founder of Christianity; and Dupuis and others, going even beyond this, have not hesitated to pronounce the Gospel simply a branch of Mithraism" (Art. "Mithra").

      (11)
      Mithra had his principal festival on what was later to become Easter, at which time he was resurrected. His sacred day was Sunday, "the Lord's Day." The Mithra religion had a Eucharist or "Lord's Supper."

      (12)
      The Christian Father Manes, founder of the heretical sect known as Manicheans, believed that Christ and Mithra were one. His teaching, according to Mosheim, was as follows: "Christ is that glorious intelligence which the Persians called Mithras ... His residence is in the sun" (Ecclesiastical History, 3rd century, Part 2, ch. 5).

      "I am a star which goes with thee and shines out of the depths." – Mithraic saying

      "I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright morning star." – Jesus, (Rev. 22:16)

      January 6, 2012 at 5:38 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      @George- "Mithraism came after the time of Christ"

      If you are going to cherry-pick my statement...plz at least include the full quote, "Considering that the real hay-day of Mithraism came after the time of Christ."

      As for evidence....the statues showing Mithra killing the bull of heaven all come from after the time of Jesus.

      January 6, 2012 at 5:56 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      @JustForFun- (1) Mithra was born on December 25th as an offspring of the Sun.

      ~According to pantheon.o r g "Mithra was born from a rock (or a cave)."
      Just thought I would throw that bit out but since did the God of Abraham equate to the Sun god of the Romans.
      From Merkelbach's Mithras, there is no evidence that states that Mithra was born on Dec 25th.
      I could be wrong on this, I admit that....but if you can find some actual historical evidence from that time period that goes with it...ok.
      Just a reminder though: correlation does not imply causation. Did the NT writers lift info from the Mithra story? Yes or no.

      "Next to the gods Ormuzd and Ahrimanes, Mithra held the highest rank among the gods of ancient Persia....etc"

      ~There is no evidence that Roman Judea was under the Persian influence in any way. There is a lot of evidence that they were under the Greek influence. Not to mention that such early Christians as Paul were from an orthodox background which makes the very concept that one would lift info from another faith kind of silly.
      I also love the fact that the Christianity-haters love to imply that the founders of Christianity were illiterate and ignorant about the world around them. However, they were smart enough to be well versed in another faith to take details from it and add it to their faith without any of their learned pagan contemporaries pointing it out.

      "(2) He was considered a great traveling teacher and masters. He had twelve companions as Jesus had twelve disciples. Mithras also performed miracles."

      ~correlation does not imply causation and I could only find a follower named Varuna...who were the supposed other 11?
      I also have to laugh because just about every major leader in the ancient world could be called a great traveller. Have you ever really seen distance that Jesus walked? Paul would have been considered a great traveller perhaps, but not really Jesus.

      "(3) Mithra was called "the good shepherd, "the way, the truth and the light, redeemer, savior, Messiah." He was identified with both the lion and the lamb."

      ~No he wasn't. He killed a bull with the astrological signs around him though.
      If you could provide some real evidence...that might be nice. Unless you are leaning on "appeal to authority".

      "(4) The International Encyclopedia states: "Mithras seems to have owed his prominence to the belief that he was the source of life, and could also redeem the souls of the dead into the better world ... The ceremonies included a sort of baptism to remove sins, anointing, and a sacred meal of bread and water, while a consecrated wine, believed to possess wonderful power, played a prominent part.""

      ~It included a "sort of baptism"..really? Care to explain.

      "(5) Chambers Encyclopedia says: "The most important of his many festivals was his birthday, celebrated on the 25th of December, the day subsequently fixed – against all evidence – as the birthday of Christ."

      ~The b-day of Christ isn't Dec 25th. So what's your point? That centuries after Jesus some Christians put one of their holidays in direct competi_tion with another faith they disagreed with? What so shocking about that?
      Now if you could show that the Christian founders put the b-day of Christ at Dec 25th right off the bat you might have something. But you can't. Truth be told, pre-Contantine Christianity didn't seem to care that much on the b-day of Jesus.

      Oy...most of the other stuff is just garbage to put it bluntly. Mithra was not born of a virgin mother but of a rock.

      Not to be mean but the entirety of what you put up could be put under:

      1. correlation does not imply causation
      2. appeal to authority

      There is NO evidence that any of the writers of the NT was influenced by the Mithra faith. Considering that the real hay-day of Mithraism came after the time of Christ....it could be just as easily said that they borrowed from the Christian faith.
      I see a lot of references to I suppose learned individuals but I don't see anything to back it up. Where is the ancient Mithra texts from before Jesus? Where is the archaeological evidence from before Jesus?
      I admire the info you put up but all it proves is that there are some ppl that think (and cannot prove) that Christianity borrowed from Mithraism.

      Considering all you did was repost what David put up...it was easy to answer.

      January 6, 2012 at 5:58 pm |
    • JustForFun

      "1. correlation does not imply causation"

      1. It’s dismissive. It is often used to dismiss data from which something can be learned. The life-saving notion that smoking causes lung cancer was almost entirely built on correlations. For too long, these correlations were dismissed.

      2. It’s misleading. In real life, nothing unfailingly implies causation. Every data set has more than one interpretation. To “imply” causation requires diverse approaches and correlations are often among them

      3. It’s a missed opportunity — namely, an opportunity to make a more nuanced statement about what we can learn from the data.

      4 It’s dogmatic. Some correlations, such as those from “natural experiments,” imply causation much more than others.Iit does more harm than good to lump all of them together.

      January 6, 2012 at 6:12 pm |
    • Uncouth Swain

      "1. It’s dismissive. It is often used to dismiss data from which something can be learned. The life-saving notion that smoking causes lung cancer was almost entirely built on correlations. For too long, these correlations were dismissed."

      ~Actually...one can do medical testing to add substance to the correlations you are putting forth with smoking. You cannot do that with the idea that one faith borrowed from another. Your co_mparisson is faulty.

      "2. It’s misleading. In real life, nothing unfailingly implies causation. Every data set has more than one interpretation. To “imply” causation requires diverse approaches and correlations are often among them"

      ~There has been no diverse approaches to these supposed correlations. All I see from pro-mithriatic causation ppl are appeals to authority that does not seem to use anything to back up their beliefs. If there was some sort of Mithra texts that pre-dates Jesus that backs up all that has been said...then one may have something. Thus far, no one has provided.

      "3. It’s a missed opportunity — namely, an opportunity to make a more nuanced statement about what we can learn from the data."

      ~Forgive me if I have made it out that all the info should be easily thrown out. It shouldn't...it should be looked at and studied. However, I am unconvinced that the NT writers borrowed from the Mithra faith simply because of evidence that comes centuries after the time of Jesus. Again...if the supposed correletions mentioned by the pro-mithriatic ppl came prior to the time of Jesus, it would be more credible.

      "4 It’s dogmatic. Some correlations, such as those from “natural experiments,” imply causation much more than others.Iit does more harm than good to lump all of them together."

      ~I saw one pro-mithriatic correlation website state that Mithra walked on water and pointed the finger that the early Christians took that from Mithra. However...no evidece was given.
      We have testable evidence as to when the NT was written. We know the region of it's creation, it's background and culture.
      We do not however, have the evidence of when the beliefs of Mithra really came to be or where. Yes, Mithra existed in Zorastrian belief prior ot Jesus. But the correlations that ppl say Christianity took from Mithra..that we don't know when it came to be.

      To be quite honest I have seen very little physical evidence of Mithra. The best known examples come from 2nd-3rd century Roman sites. The bull slaying statues. I don't think I have to point out that is after the time of Jesus, Peter, Paul and the whole bunch.

      January 6, 2012 at 6:55 pm |
    • Jimmy

      Uncouth Swain
      Just stating the obvious, that it's all opinion really. At least claiming that Jesus could easily have been based on already established myth and religion is demonstrable, whereas accepting the Gospel writers on their word requires faith.

      January 7, 2012 at 12:03 am |
  18. GDChampions

    God may have called on them to RUN in the race, but He may not have called on them to WIN the race. God is mysterious, and may intended to use this time in their life to prepare them for future events, or to open their eyes to new ideas, maybe even to teach them a lesson or build them. God does not joke, He has a reason for everything He does.

    In God, we are all champions.
    http://www.YouTube.com/GDChampions

    January 6, 2012 at 11:22 am |
    • HellBent

      If you actually think these people all thought that god talked to them and told them to run, and that they weren't exploiting religion for personal gain, then I have some great ocean-front property in Montana you may be interested in.

      January 6, 2012 at 11:34 am |
    • MartinT

      Sure, "GOD" is mysterious.. well, I'll give you that one.. for his existence is surely mysterious to many. He's so mysterious that he doesn't exist... that's pretty mysterious to me.. Hey, Big Foot is Mysterious, so is the Loch Ness Monster, and Dolly Parton's Breasts.... Lots of mysterious things in the world...

      January 6, 2012 at 11:44 am |
    • GDChampions

      Never said I believed the individual. Do I believe in God? Absolutely. Do you? Probably not. Does that change anything? Nope. Your reply to this changes nothing, either. Anyone can troll these posts and try to redicule those who love God and all it does is waste their own time, because if I was not on my final moments at work, I would not have even read your reply. It's great to see, however, that mine make such an impact one way or the other. You can talk all the trash you want, but I gurantee if you were to see me in a supermarket, you would be polite as you passed. Quit using the internet as your therapy. You wouldn't need it if you had spiritual belief. Be blessed!

      January 6, 2012 at 11:52 am |
    • Daniel Dessinger

      Agree with this statement. Running and Winning are very different. Would you obey if you were told up front you would lose? But if the process and development you undergo during the campaign is what God was after, who are you to call it a failure?

      January 6, 2012 at 12:03 pm |
    • HellBent

      "Quit using the internet as your therapy. You wouldn't need it if you had spiritual belief. "

      Then what are you doing here?

      January 6, 2012 at 12:03 pm |
    • MartinT

      Wah, wah, what a perfectly Christian, and useless, answer. I promise you that IF I were to use this forum for MY therapy, I'd get a heck of a lot more out of it than you do from your "faith." As for my comment not making an difference, EXACTLY my point, just as YOUR comment as well as your beliefs make NO difference.

      I find your comment about passing you in a grocery store and being polite as interesting, usually it's us Atheists who make those claims. My question is, IF you knew you were passing an atheist in a grocery store would YOU be polite. I'm polite to everyone, it's just in my nature, one that I did not get from a GOD. Just curious, and I certainly hope that your "putting me in my place" made you feel better today. I bet you can go off feeling all good about yourself because you "sure told that Atheist a thing or two." I just love how a spiritual belief fixes EVERYTHING for your kind, it really amuses me to no end.

      January 6, 2012 at 12:15 pm |
    • MartinT

      @ Hellbent – good question... You see the way I see it is, I come here to question EVERYTHING, I suspect that his type comes here to challenge EVERYONE who questions ANYTHING.. just my therapy talking.

      January 6, 2012 at 12:16 pm |
    • Sue

      "Hey, Michelle! God speaking here!
      I want you to run for president of the United States, but I don't actually want you to win. After all, we both know that not enough people will possibly ever actually vote for you because, after all, you are a nut job. I just think it's really important that the real Christians out there, the moderate, tolerant, and loving people who actually follow my son's ways, really need to see your point of view, so that they can recognize who to actually vote for."

      January 6, 2012 at 1:06 pm |
    • TR6

      “but He may not have called on them to WIN the race”

      Typical Christian double speak. This is the contorted sort of logic Christians come up with when their god doesn’t come across

      Or maybe god just likes jerking Christians around…. That would explain a lot

      January 6, 2012 at 1:45 pm |
    • Jimmy

      GDChampions
      God may not joke, but maybe he appreciates a good joke enough to have convinced these bozos to run for president.

      January 6, 2012 at 4:56 pm |
  19. JesusLives

    What happens when candidates called by God drop out? The United States goes to hell in a handbag!

    January 6, 2012 at 11:21 am |
    • OhPlz

      "The United States goes to hell in a handbag!"

      Stop watching so much negative news, get off your lazy ass and become an active member in your community. You're a disgrace to this country.

      January 6, 2012 at 11:41 am |
  20. exe

    Does it mean that God makes a lot of mistakes?

    January 6, 2012 at 11:00 am |
    • MartinT

      No it means that man has made of lot of mistakes in the name of god.

      January 6, 2012 at 11:45 am |
    • Jimmy

      MartinT
      And one of those mistakes was actually inventing God in the first place.

      January 6, 2012 at 4:58 pm |
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About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.