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January 31st, 2012
04:32 AM ET

Belief Blog's Morning Speed Read for Tuesday, January 31

By Dan Merica, CNN

Here's the Belief Blog’s morning rundown of the top faith-angle stories from around the United States and around the world. Click the headlines for the full stories.

From the Blog:

CNN: Catholics clergymen come out swinging against HHS regulation
Catholics around the country got an earful on Sunday from the pulpit over a new health insurance policy by the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services that forces employers to cover contraception and abortion as part of preventative care regardless of religious beliefs. The use of abortion and contraceptives violates Catholic teachings.

CNN: Islam doesn’t justify ‘honor murders,’ experts insist
Leading Muslim thinkers wholeheartedly endorsed the Canadian judge's verdict, insisting that "honor murders" had no place and no support in Islam.

Tweet of the Day:

From @EricCNNBelief: What do you think – will the HHS policy on contraception hurt Obama in the race for #2012 with Catholics?

Enlightening Reads:

Jewish Daily Forward: Sundance Town Goes Kosher
The picturesque resort town of Park City is known for many things — among them powdery snow and a prestigious independent film festival. Kosher cuisine, not so much. This may be changing.

Catholic News Service: Bishops, religious to attend major conference on preventing abuse
Representatives of most of the world's bishops' conferences and 30 religious orders will meet in Rome in early February to launch a global initiative aimed at improving efforts to stop clerical sexual abuse and better protect children and vulnerable adults.

The Christian Post: Thousands Join Brooklyn Bridge March to Protest Ban on Churches Renting Schools
Some 3,500 people marched across the Brooklyn Bridge to City Hall Park Sunday in protest of the ban on churches renting New York City's public schools on the weekends.

Quote of the Day:

It’s the kind of happiness that gets into your bones and promotes a deep-seated authentic love of life, seeping into everything you do.

According to Mark Williams and Danny Penman, authors of “Mindfulness: A Practical Guide to Finding Peace in a Frantic World,” chocolate is, in fact, an answer for inner peace. With Valentine’s Day just around the corner, this is a finding that many will be happy to hear about.

Today’s Opinion:

Religion Dispatches: Speaking with Palestinian-American Republican Who Confronted GOP at Debate
Half the fight against bigotry, to paraphrase Woody Allen, might just be in showing up. When Abraham Hassan stood up at Thursday night’s CNN debate, he introduced himself as a Palestinian-American and a Republican. Plainly, that’s not what I expected to hear.

Join the conversation…

Centerville Patch: Mosque Opening on Hold After Vandals Trash Windows
Under the cover of darkness Sunday night, vandals downed alcohol, threw rocks and smashed the windows—along with over a decade of hard work, financial sacrifices and prayers—of a Chantilly mosque.

- Dan Merica

Filed under: Uncategorized

soundoff (166 Responses)
  1. md2205

    Re posts related to the origin of the world:
    Science cannot prove or disprove that G-d does or does not exist. Much of what a scientist says when it comes to the origin of the universe is weakly based extrapolation, starting from what we see now and going backwards to try to imagine what the starting point was. In advancing these theories they disregard factors universally admitted by all scientists – that in the initial period of the "birth" of the universe, conditions of temperature, pressure, radioactivity, and a host of other catalytic factors were totally different than those existing presently, including the fact that we don't know how single atoms or their components would bind and consolidate, which involved totally unknown processes and variables, as single atoms behave far differently than conglomerations of atoms.
    A person would have to believe either atoms came into being somehow by themselves, and somehow combined to form the universe; or that they existed forever – both of which are beliefs and cannot be proven. If he says the atoms were created, why then not a planet or the universe, for the same logic. Assumptions along these lines are what atheists hang their hats on, but assumptions lead to false reasoning, and in any case, they base their view on beliefs, even though they don't recognize it as a belief.

    January 31, 2012 at 9:04 pm |
    • Brad - to md2205

      Re: What is God – thanks for the link to chabad.org. That is much the way I perceive God. It is perhaps not enough to say that God is. More than that, everything that is derives its being (is-ness?) from God. Someone will come along at some point to demand "where is your evidence!" I'm always nonplussed at that. How can you explain to someone that his entire being and being itself comes from God (or is implied by God). Any evidence for anything is less real than God is.

      January 31, 2012 at 10:10 pm |
  2. Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

    Prayer changes things
    Grace is extended in prayer

    January 31, 2012 at 5:31 pm |
    • Nope

      STEP Proved you wrong...

      Dr. Herbert Benson of Harvard Medical School and other scientists tested the effect of having three Christian groups pray for particular patients, starting the night before surgery and continuing for two weeks. The volunteers prayed for "a successful surgery with a quick, healthy recovery and no complications" for specific patients, for whom they were given the first name and first initial of the last name.

      The patients, meanwhile, were split into three groups of about 600 apiece: those who knew they were being prayed for, those who were prayed for but only knew it was a possibility, and those who weren't prayed for but were told it was a possibility.

      The researchers didn't ask patients or their families and friends to alter any plans they had for prayer, saying such a step would have been unethical and impractical. The study looked for any complications within 30 days of the surgery. Results showed no effect of prayer on complication-free recovery. But 59 percent of the patients who knew they were being prayed for developed a complication, versus 52 percent of those who were told it was just a possibility.

      January 31, 2012 at 5:36 pm |
    • bringoutyourdead

      demon terrified at the very thought of prayer

      January 31, 2012 at 5:39 pm |
    • Nope

      "demon terrified at the very thought of prayer"

      Christians are terrified of the REAL truth so they make up lies.

      January 31, 2012 at 5:40 pm |
    • Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

      Prayer changes things
      Meet God in prayer
      Accept the salvation of God
      Experience the change
      Prayer changes things

      January 31, 2012 at 5:53 pm |
    • Nope

      You've been proven wrong it makes things worse.

      January 31, 2012 at 5:56 pm |
    • been there done that prayer wolrks

      sorry what is offered as "proof" is not anything

      January 31, 2012 at 8:31 pm |
    • Nope

      "sorry what is offered as "proof" is not anything"

      The statistical studies from the nineteenth century and the three CCU studies on prayer are quite consistent with the fact that humanity is wasting a huge amount of time on a procedure that simply doesn’t work. Nonetheless, faith in prayer is so pervasive and deeply rooted, you can be sure believers will continue to devise future studies in a desperate effort to confirm their beliefs.

      February 1, 2012 at 10:45 am |
  3. click here!

    bleepin turkey noodles!

    January 31, 2012 at 3:28 pm |
    • huh?

      now im hungry

      January 31, 2012 at 3:31 pm |
  4. Yesenia Kagemusha

    Why are religious people so angry? Especially Christians? They accuse everyone else of being angry, but their posts here are so hostile and intolerant and, well, just plain mean and angry. They lust to have everyone else be tortured for the rest of eternity.

    January 31, 2012 at 12:06 pm |
    • George, (not THAT one)

      Wow, what a beautiful name ..... Yesinia.

      January 31, 2012 at 5:35 pm |
    • Throbster

      Ooooohhhh! Yesinia! I have a giant throbbing dick pointed in your general direction! Oooooooohhhh!

      January 31, 2012 at 7:04 pm |
  5. Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

    I have no friends. Even the people at church stay away from me.

    Prayer never seems to change that.

    January 31, 2012 at 11:32 am |
    • Phillip Evans

      Shall two walk together, if they fail to make an appointment? Amo 3:3

      You must not believe in an associate. You must not trust in a mentor. From her who is lying in your bosom, keep the portals of your mouth, for the son is disgracing the father, the daughter is rising against her mother, the daughter-in-law against her husband's mother. The enemies of a man are all the mortals of his house. Yet I will watch in Yahveh. I will wait for the Elohim of my salvation. My Elohim will hear me. Mic 7:5-7. Luk 12:52-53.

      January 31, 2012 at 1:23 pm |
    • just sayin

      frustrated and desperate atheists steal a handle to try to undermine truth, it will not work

      January 31, 2012 at 5:30 pm |
    • George, (not THAT one)

      I DO hope you know what an "Elohim" was. It would behoove you to check on that.

      January 31, 2012 at 5:38 pm |
  6. Phillip Evans

    The if-then confitional is not always stated in if-then form, but in the case of Mat 19:17 the Hypothesis is clearly identified.

    Mat 19:17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but IF thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

    IF thou wilt enter into life (P), (THEN) keep the commandments (Q).

    If we say, "I keep the commandments" (Q), we may NOT conclude, "THEREFORE, I wilt enter into life" (P). That is a fallacy called Affirming the Consequent.

    (Thus P -> Q is logically equivelant to ~P v Q.)

    Therefore, if the Apostle Paul is "contrary" in Rom 3:28 & Gal 2:16, then LOGICALLY CONCLUDE the truth of the Antecedent (P) WITHOUT Affirming the Consequent (Q) in the light of "there is none good but one, that is, God"...

    January 31, 2012 at 11:25 am |
  7. Phillip Evans

    The "flyers" of Leviticus 11.

    The "flyers" (CLV) (Heb oph).

    1. KINGDOM. Animalia. 11:13-23.

    2. PHYLUM Chordata. 11:13-19. / PHYLUM Arthropoda. 11:20-23.

    3. CLASS Aves. 11:13-19-. / CLASS Mamalia. 11:-19. / CLASS Insecta.

    FACT: birds and the bat are the only chordate flyers on earth.

    FACT: the first group of organisms listed in Lev 11:13-19- are members of the CLASS Aves: birds.

    FACT: the last organism listed in Lev 11:-19 is a member of the CLASS Mamalia: the bat.

    FACT: birds are NOT MEMBERS of the CLASS Mamalia.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is NOT a bird.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the eagle. 11:13.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the ossifrage. 11:13.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the ospray. 11:13.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the vulture. 11:14.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the kite. 11:14.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not every raven. 11:15.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the owl. 11:16.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the night hawk. 11:16.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the cuckow. 11:16.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the hawk. 11:16.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the little owl. 11:17.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the cormorant. 11:17.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the great owl. 11:17.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the swan. 11:18.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the pelican. 11:18.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the gier eagle. 11:18

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the stork. 11:19.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the heron. 11:19.

    CONCLUSION: the bat is not the lapwing. 11:19.

    INQUIRY: If leviticus is unreliable as a taxonmic source, then fromthe text of Leviticus 11:13-19 and the Scientific Classificationj System, then L-O-G-I-C-A-L-L-Y CONCLUDE that the bat is a bird...

    January 31, 2012 at 9:38 am |
    • George, (not THAT one)

      Go feed the monkeys, and take your pills.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:46 am |
    • Phillip Evans

      George, (not THAT one)

      Go feed the monkeys, and take your pills.
      January 31, 2012 at 9:46 am | Report abuse |

      Insufficient response.

      FACT: the first group of organisms listed in Lev 11:13-19- are members of the CLASS Aves: birds.

      FACT: the last organism listed in Lev 11:-19 is a member of the CLASS Mamalia: the bat.

      FACT: birds are NOT MEMBERS of the CLASS Mamalia.

      CONCLUSION: the bat is NOT a bird.

      INQUIRY: If leviticus is unreliable as a taxonmic source, then fromthe text of Leviticus 11:13-19 and the Scientific Classificationj System, L-O-G-I-C-A-L-L-Y CONCLUDE that the bat is a bird...

      January 31, 2012 at 9:50 am |
    • Observer

      I think you were supposed to conclude that some things may be eaten, others not. A basic guideline that will tide you over until you have a handle on Leviticus: don't eat anything that is bigger than your head.

      January 31, 2012 at 12:51 pm |
    • Phillip Evans

      In Leviticus 11:2-7, the behemoth are Structured by Introversion and Alternation of the Taxonomic Rank referred to as "Orders".

      A. Lev 11:4. ORDER Artiodactyla.The camel. "gerah"

      B. Lev 11:5. ORDER Hyracoidea. The coney. "gerah"

      B. Lev 11:6. ORDER Lagomorpha. The hare. "gerah"

      A. Lev 11:7. ORDER Artiodactyla. The swine. "lo garar gerah"

      It is quite factual that the camel chews a cud, while the swine does not.

      But "all flesh is not the same flesh". 1Co 15:39.

      A Hyracoidea is NOT an Artiodactyla.

      A Lagomorpha is NOT an Artiodactyla.

      HOWEVER, both the Hyracoidea & the Lagomorpha share a common feature: their teeth grow continuously throughout their entire life span, requiring the need for constant chewing to prevent them from growing too long.

      "garar", by analogy, means "to saw." Furthermore, the Lagomorpha are Precocial, they are born live and active. They will quite literally "raise up sawing". "alah gerah"

      January 31, 2012 at 2:04 pm |
    • George, (not THAT one)

      Sorry to burst your bubble, but EVERYONE knows that the babble is FULL of errors, and contradictions. Your one example is not important. Get over it.

      January 31, 2012 at 5:41 pm |
  8. just sayin

    Think of omniscience in the eternal sense, alpha and omega, not only a) and b) but every alphabet everywhere, all the endless possibilities and results not limited by space or time.

    January 31, 2012 at 9:05 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @just sayin
      That is the definition of Omniscience all right!
      So what of Mirosal's question?
      There is no alternate definition of the word for gods and men – the concept is precisely the same.
      Is God omniscient?

      January 31, 2012 at 9:53 am |
    • George, (not THAT one)

      There is no "eternal", if there is no time.

      January 31, 2012 at 5:42 pm |
  9. hippypoet

    (this is for believers only)

    what is god to you?

    (no cheating by looking at others anwers, it must come from you and your true feelings of what god is and stands for)

    January 31, 2012 at 9:04 am |
    • just sayin

      God Is

      January 31, 2012 at 9:21 am |
    • George, (not THAT one)

      I FEEL god is not starched undies.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:47 am |
    • hippypoet

      no, really... i was hoping for some serious answers – i wish to know what those that believe in god think of god – i want to understand YOUR (speaking to believers) understanding of god... is that wrong? and i am not doing this to make fun or poke at you, i merely want to have a better understanding of how believers view god...and how it differs from each believer.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:50 am |
    • Me

      God is the benevolent creator of the universe (I don't believe in h e l l so yes, he is benevolent. In fact there is more biblical evidence againt h e l l than for it). He knew that humanity was going to sin before they ever did but because he loves us, he sent his Son Jesus in the body of a human to die for our sins because we could never pay God back for what we did. That is why people no longer sacrifice animals to show their repentance. They pray to God for forgiveness and because Jesus paid for our sins God forgives us.

      January 31, 2012 at 10:34 am |
    • UhOh

      "They pray to God for forgiveness and because Jesus paid for our sins God forgives us."

      If your Jesus already paid for your sins, then no one should have to continually ask for forgiveness because you are already been forgiven for life.

      January 31, 2012 at 10:58 am |
    • J.W

      Well God is the creator of the Universe first of all. But usually when I think of God I think I about Psalm 23, like I do not need to worry about anything, because God will help guide me and make sure nothing bad happens to me.

      January 31, 2012 at 11:26 am |
    • UhOh

      "like I do not need to worry about anything, because God will help guide me and make sure nothing bad happens to me."

      That's not true at all. Isaiah 45:7 affirms that God creates darkness and disaster. It is not a creation of mankind, nor of fallen beings or Satan. The Hebrew word here that is translated as "disaster" could also mean "wickedness", "hurt", "affliction" or "adversity". God creates these things directly. Any argument that asserts that evil is a result of Human free will must first get over the fact that the Christian Bible states that God creates evil and disaster itself. Not only does this God create darkness and disaster, but it actively "does" them too. It doesn't merely create them as possibilities for other people, it actively chooses to do them itself.

      January 31, 2012 at 11:29 am |
    • J.W

      Well I haven't ever had any disaster or evil done to me, so I guess God just likes me better.

      January 31, 2012 at 11:33 am |
    • UhOh

      "Well I haven't ever had any disaster or evil done to me, so I guess God just likes me better"

      Give it time

      Jesus said:

      Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household. Matthew 10:34-37

      Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division: For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three. The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. Luke 12:51-53

      January 31, 2012 at 11:36 am |
    • hippypoet

      @UhOh – please save your arguments, this is just to see the differences in how those who believe in god view there almighty and what is stands for.....the time for posing an argument is later on and by doing it now only serves one purpose – to side track.

      i can't stop you or anything, but if you wait long enough and read the responses – your argument will present itself to you rather then you seeking it out.

      January 31, 2012 at 11:37 am |
    • J.W

      Well I think that there is division. People have been arguing about Jesus for centuries. That won't cause anything bad to happen to me though.

      January 31, 2012 at 11:46 am |
    • FU hippypoet Loser

      THE ONE TRUE GOD IS ALL LOVING AND CARING. ALL KNOWING AND FORGIVING OF ALL SINS. THE PATH IS TO SALVATION IS THRU JESUS, THE SON OF THE GOD, ONE WITH HIM, AND WITH HIM ALL IS POSSIBLE.
      TO DENY ANY OF THIS IS TO TAKE YOUR SOUL AND HAND IT TO SATAN.

      January 31, 2012 at 11:54 am |
    • Theophilus7

      Confession of sin for the believer is different than confession of sin for the unbeliever. For an unbeliever, you confess to get saved. For the believer, you confess sin as it occurs to maintain fellowship with a holy God. Salvation was purchased once and for all, and applied generously to anyone who will believe on the LORD Jesus Christ. Once you are a believer, you are called to walk a holy life by living in the Spirit, who fruit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, and self-control. If you step out and walk in the flesh and commit sin, then confession is about restoring the fellowship with our Savior. Holy God covenants with holy people. He grants us the holiness through our faith. We want that relationship with our God to be close. So we seek to live holy lives. So to answer your question, for the believer only – asking forgiveness for sin is about restoring fellowship not about losing salvation. See one of my other posts about Leviticus. Also see Jesus conversation with Peter about the washing of feet.

      January 31, 2012 at 12:09 pm |
    • Theophilus7

      Follow up to UhOh – 22But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
      23Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
      Galatians 5:22-23
      Read Romans 8 about the Christian’s calling to walk in the Spirit.
      1John.1
      [1] That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life;
      [2] (For the life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and shew unto you that eternal life, which was with the Father, and was manifested unto us;)
      [3] That which we have seen and heard declare we unto you, that ye also may have fellowship with us: and truly our fellowship is with the Father, and with his Son Jesus Christ.
      [4] And these things write we unto you, that your joy may be full.
      [5] This then is the message which we have heard of him, and declare unto you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all.
      [6] If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:
      [7] But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.
      [8] If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
      [9] If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
      [10] If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
      ________________________________________
      1John.2
      [1] My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
      [2] And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world.

      (Might as well just read the whole book of First John – it's a short one, but will help you connect to this)

      January 31, 2012 at 12:17 pm |
    • Theophilus7

      To UhOh – rebellion began in heaven (read Ezekiel), then occurred in the garden. Once you get started you will begin to reconcile the issue of evil. God is not evil. Be careful if you teach this, especially if you don't know what you're talking about. There's a huge warning in the book of Hebrews to those who do so. I would quote it for you, but I'm trying to encourage people to look. Get active. -- if you give up, I'll point you to it.

      January 31, 2012 at 12:21 pm |
    • UhOh

      "To UhOh – rebellion began in heaven (read Ezekiel), then occurred in the garden. Once you get started you will begin to reconcile the issue of evil. God is not evil. "

      The immoral doctrine of original sin, where children are punished for the sins of their parents is hardly the scheme of a moral god. Adam and Eve were punished with death, pain, suffering and caused the evil of all mankind... yet they themselves 'sinned' before they knew the difference between Good and Evil. God must be immoral, if it punishes innocent people for sins they do not understand and could not resist.

      Some of the genocides committed by God in the Bible are of the young, the innocent, and some are even the results of accidents.

      1. 2 Kings 2:23-24 : 42 children are killed for calling a prophet "baldy", by two she-bears.
      2. 1 Samuel 6:19 : God kills 50 -70 (or 70) of the men of Beth Shemesh for looking in (or "at") the Ark of the Covenant.
      3. 1 Kings 20:30 : God makes a wall fall on and kill 27 000 of an army retreating from some Israelites.
      4. Numbers 16:16-49 : Death to all those who complain (14 950 of them altogether).
      5. 2 Samuel 6:6-11 : God kills someone for accidentally touching the Ark of the Covenant.
      6. The Flood, which saw God wipe out all of humankind, is neither a good response to being displeased, nor is it even a good moral story symbolically. The authors of this story believed in an immoral and fearsome god.

      January 31, 2012 at 12:28 pm |
    • Theophilus7

      UhOh – You might benefit by reading the book of Job. You will see a good dialogue back and forth about such things. But be very careful. Job comes to this conversation with reverence for God. It doesn't sound like you do. If you're merely trying to reconcile the existence of evil with a holy God, then yes, you're on a journey that if you remain intent for the truth you will not pervert your understanding of how a holy God could allow evil. If you make it through then what a paradigm shift it will be for you. If you shipwreck, then you join many who have. Diligence with the right heart will help.

      January 31, 2012 at 1:38 pm |
    • Theophilus7

      UhOh – several hurdles to jump in pursuit of reconciling existence of evil. First, must learn about God's holiness. You will best learn by reading from beginning and just keep going. Second, must learn about covenants. A holy God cannot coexist with sinful man. Imagine the sun moving from its current position 93 million miles away to 10 miles away. It's not an issue of desire or emotion. The sun will simply flat out scorch us from this distance. Likewise, when you understand this aspect of holiness, it is a wonder that He would even choose to show mercy when his creation has rebelled. Since He can't violate His justice, sin must be reckoned with, and it is done through shedding of blood. When Adam and Eve sinned, they hid. God found them – He found them... not the other way around. God's love compels Him to find a way to restore Himself to us without violating His holiness. If you read the account, God provides a covering for them through shedding of blood. Starts there. Now trace blood covenants throughout Bible without forgetting the holiness of God. If I'm wasting my time trying to help you here, let me know.

      January 31, 2012 at 2:11 pm |
    • UhOh

      if you remain intent for the truth you will not pervert your understanding of how a holy God could allow evil."

      Allow evil? No supposedly your God created everything INCLUDING evil. Sorry dude your rose colored glasses are hysterical and your excuses for and evil god are pathetic.

      January 31, 2012 at 3:08 pm |
    • George, (not THAT one)

      There are as many concepts of gods as there are brains. A generalization would be "god = whatever is most important to me".

      January 31, 2012 at 5:43 pm |
    • md2205

      Because cnn doesn't allow long posts, I can't answer your question satisfactorily. A question like that, of course, cannot be expected to be answered in only a few sentences. It is too important. However, please look at the following website: chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/433240/jewish/What-Is-Gd.htm. It's a nice article that changes the angle of how to look at the question and the answer just comes.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:31 pm |
  10. hippypoet

    first lets start with prayer changes nothing – it is a complete waste of time save from the shallow meaningless belief that (if god exists) god cares so much about you he stopped and took time to listen to your thoughts.....the reality – (again, if god exists) he is too busy beating, ra.ping, and killing those who can't defend themselves to care about you nevermind give you the time is would take to listen to all your issues – you are an ant to god and the bible shows us how god looks upon ants.....have you ever killed an ant and thought "oh, now i feel bad" i doubt it! And that was just you playing god – imagine a real one – a world wide flood sound familar? as a kid you may have poured water on an ant hill and saved only a few with a stick (noahs boat) so lets come to grips people....if god exists, he cares not for your life but only that your life bring him enjoyment – the horrors of this world (if god exists) could be taken out without a moments notice yet they are ALLOWED to exist along side us so we have to fight to live, that is not a god but a child taking enjoyment at our hardships and failures......

    And to the argument that all who believe are NOT delusional – i give you this

    Delusional disorders are a relatively common mental illness that frequently goes unreported by patients. The severity of the condition is a wide range, with some patients experiencing only mild effects of the delusional disorders and others that are so severe that they extremely limit how a person is able to function in the world. Delusional disorders are split into six specific groupings: erotomanic, jealousy, grandiose, somatic, persecution, and mixed types. All of these subtypes are quite similar in nature, but they are represented in society in different ways. To define delusional thinking, the criteria developed by Karl Jasper in 1917 is commonly used. His definition stated that the specific delusion had to be believed completely and that no argument or proof of its falsity would sway a patient’s mind. Also, the delusion must be false in nature or impossible.
    The persecution type of delusional disorder is the most common variety of the condition. A person with this problem will have a paranoid delusional definition that they are being unjustly pursued or persecuted by a specific force. The paranoid delusional definition does not require that the patient be able to name the source of the persecution and many cases involve only the feeling of being persecuted. However, in other cases, the patient may feel as though they are being followed by governmental organizations or that family members are trying to harm them. The paranoid delusional definition is also involved in the jealousy type of delusions. In this subtype, a patient feels as though his se.xual partner is committing se.xual acts with another person. In some cases, the patient will assemble false evidence to support the theory and confront the partner. This evidence is often wildly inaccurate and only serves the delusional person’s purpose.
    One example of the somatic subtype delusional disorder is known as delusional parasitosis. In this specific example, a patient feels that they are infected with parasites. They will often claim that they can feel the parasites under the skin. As the delusion can be very strong, the problem will often be referred to a dermatologist or entomologist for study as the person is sure of the problem. The erotomania subtype occurs when a patient is convinced that a person is in love with the patient. Often, this love will be thought to have been communicated through body language, including special looks or signals, or through supernatural abilities, such as telepathy. In most cases, the patient finds that it is someone famous that is trying to communicate with them. The grandiose subtype occurs when a person has true delusions of grandeur, believing that they are somehow more powerful than ordinary people. Mixed delusions are when a person experiences more than one type of delusion at the same time.

    which one are you?

    January 31, 2012 at 8:50 am |
    • hippypoet

      just focus your attention on this part – it will serve you well!

      To define delusional thinking, the criteria developed by Karl Jasper in 1917 is commonly used. His definition stated that the specific delusion had to be believed completely and that no argument or proof of its falsity would sway a patient’s mind. Also, the delusion must be false in nature or impossible.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:53 am |
    • Brad

      My guess is that you'll have the most trouble with the last part, hippypoet: "the delusion must be false in nature or impossible". People keep going around an around on this issue precisely because the assertion that God exists is not falsifiable.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:31 am |
    • hippypoet

      i agree brad. this is a post i tossed over to chad – for this reply i think it will work great... as tony the tiger would say "greeeeeeeaaaaat"

      god is an idea, such an improbable idea that many have, to make the idea inarguably, said that the idea is beyond human comprehension and so be doing remove the need but more importantly the ability to prove and so make it an untouchable notion of truth all based on an idea....how is that different then being delusional? you hold fast to an idea of an improbable , incomprehensible , untouchable nature as if its fact!

      January 31, 2012 at 9:45 am |
    • Chad

      @hippypoet "god is an idea, such an improbable idea that many have, to make the idea inarguably, said that the idea is beyond human comprehension and so be doing remove the need but more importantly the ability to prove and so make it an untouchable notion of truth all based on an idea....how is that different then being delusional? you hold fast to an idea of an improbable , incomprehensible , untouchable nature as if its fact!"

      => you talk of the God of Abraham as if he is a philosophical idea like the Greek notion of Areté.

      God is not an idea, He is (for lack of a better term) a person.
      Jesus Christ was fully man and fully God, the Word became flesh and dwelt among us.

      January 31, 2012 at 10:35 am |
    • FU hippypoet Loser

      FUC YOU! YOUR THE ONE THATS DELUSIONAL! @-HOLE!

      January 31, 2012 at 10:38 am |
    • UhOh

      FU hippypoet Loser has anger management issues and a low self esteem, you just proved hippypoet correct.

      January 31, 2012 at 10:40 am |
    • hippypoet

      @FU hippypoet Loser – wow, such anger.... you may wish to seek gods help before you go postal! LOL idiot!

      @chad – you said two words that caught my eye – he and person – so god is a male person..and you know this to be true i take it... how? jesus WAS a person sure, as far as the son of this god "person" well thats another one of those notions that can ONLY be taken on faith which i am not discussing. I am talking about that which is provible! god is only an idea for none have proof nor anything suggesting existence of any kind of all powerful being. Your grasps at reality are shallow at best. But i do enjoy watching the game played out.

      for your own information – definitons
      faith – strong belief in God or in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual apprehension rather than proof.
      delusion -A belief strongly held in spite of invalidating evidence (or lack thereof to the contrary)

      until you have tangible evidence of the existence of god, the notion of god remains in the realm of ideas...and thats a factual statement! 🙂

      January 31, 2012 at 10:57 am |
    • FU hippypoet Loser

      YOUR JUST AFRAID OF THE TRUTH!
      YOU WILL BURN IN HELL!
      PEOPLE LIKE YOU SHOULD ALL BURN IN HELL!
      NEVER, EVER BASH MY GOD!
      IF YOU HAVE NEVER FELT MY GOD'S LOVING WARMTH THEN YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!
      FUC YOU!

      January 31, 2012 at 11:21 am |
    • UhOh

      "NEVER, EVER BASH MY GOD!
      IF YOU HAVE NEVER FELT MY GOD'S LOVING WARMTH THEN YOU JUST DON'T KNOW!"

      Your god is a monster, Isaiah 45:7 affirms that God creates darkness and disaster. It is not a creation of mankind, nor of fallen beings or Satan. The Hebrew word here that is translated as "disaster" could also mean "wickedness", "hurt", "affliction" or "adversity". God creates these things directly. Any argument that asserts that evil is a result of Human free will must first get over the fact that the Christian Bible states that God creates evil and disaster itself. Not only does this God create darkness and disaster, but it actively "does" them too. It doesn't merely create them as possibilities for other people, it actively chooses to do them itself.

      January 31, 2012 at 11:27 am |
    • FU hippypoet Loser

      @UhOh – go fuc yourself! I hope so muslim blows you up!

      @hippypoet – Christianity is the only path and in that path one must follow the TRUE SAVIOR of mankind, jesus, the only begotten son of the Lord Almighty, the father, Our lord God. And since you don't, BURN IN HELL WITH THE REST OF YOUR MUSLIM FRIENDS!!!

      January 31, 2012 at 11:50 am |
    • Theophilus7

      To HP – in the course of your friendships, do you have anyone whose opinions or thoughts about you matter more than others? Maybe it's your mom, or your dad, or a close friend. In that particular relationship, you are more inclined to listen than talk. I would hope. Since this is a person whose opinions you consider important to yourself. Prayer is a lot about listening and less about talking. If your concept of the God of the Bible is comparable to a genie in a bottle, you've been terribly led astray. Believers pray in the manner that Jesus taught with all kinds of prayers, all day long, everyday. We are communicating with our God. He is not our servant that we call Him to do our duty. We are His children, and we seek to understand His desires for us in a given moment. Sometimes we cry for help. And sometimes, like Christ on the Cross, there is a meaning far bigger than we understand that is in play regarding our prayers.

      January 31, 2012 at 12:43 pm |
    • Paul

      "We are communicating with our God. "

      It's a one way communication because lets face it dude if you're hearing voices in your head you need to seek professional help because it's just you talking back to yourself.

      January 31, 2012 at 3:29 pm |
    • George, (not THAT one)

      chad, THAT is ALL anthropomorphic COMPLETELY culturally based projection. God is a she, and Jesus was an "it". Yahweh Saabaoth" was the "god of the armies", among many others. Why does your god have NOT one characteristic that is not a human concept, experience, or imagination. Crappy "revelation" I'd say.

      January 31, 2012 at 5:55 pm |
  11. TruthPrevails

    "Dr. Herbert Benson of Harvard Medical School and other scientists tested the effect of having three Christian groups pray for particular patients, starting the night before surgery and continuing for two weeks. The volunteers prayed for "a successful surgery with a quick, healthy recovery and no complications" for specific patients, for whom they were given the first name and first initial of the last name.

    The patients, meanwhile, were split into three groups of about 600 apiece: those who knew they were being prayed for, those who were prayed for but only knew it was a possibility, and those who weren't prayed for but were told it was a possibility.

    The researchers didn't ask patients or their families and friends to alter any plans they had for prayer, saying such a step would have been unethical and impractical. The study looked for any complications within 30 days of the surgery. Results showed no effect of prayer on complication-free recovery. But 59 percent of the patients who knew they were being prayed for developed a complication, versus 52 percent of those who were told it was just a possibility.

    Dr. Harold G. Koenig, director of the Center for Spirituality, Theology and Health at the Duke University Medical Center, who didn't take part in the study, said the results didn't surprise him. "There are no scientific grounds to expect a result and there are no real theological grounds to expect a result either," he said. "There is no god in either the Christian, Jewish or Moslem scriptures that can be constrained to the point that they can be predicted." ...Science, he said, "is not designed to study the supernatural." "

    January 31, 2012 at 8:11 am |
    • Jesus

      Two hands working can do more than a thousand clasped in prayer.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:35 am |
    • Chad

      Obviously as a Christian I would love to see every Christian prayer answered.

      I would love to see every Christian instantly have all health problems addressed and become instantly successful in all activities. I would love to see every hungry Christian child fed, every abused Christian women/child protected.

      I would love to see the world wide Christian Church united and be like minded.

      However, this is not what the Bible says. Complain as much as you want about the situation, it is consistent with what the Bible teaches.

      This verse has been distorted by many, when you read it you need to remember the qualification "in my name". And no, that doesnt mean just adding "in the name of Jesus" after your prayer:

      "Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it." – John 14

      Presenting a prayer "in his name" means to present it in agreement with him.
      Prayer is God's way of enlisting us in what He is doing.
      God says to seek and you will find.
      God doesn't (usually) answer demands for signs.

      "What causes fights and quarrels among you? Don’t they come from your desires that battle within you? 2 You desire but do not have, so you kill. You covet but you cannot get what you want, so you quarrel and fight. You do not have because you do not ask God. 3 When you ask, you do not receive, because you ask with wrong motives, that you may spend what you get on your pleasures." – James 4

      "A wicked and adulterous generation looks for a sign, but none will be given it except the sign of Jonah.” Jesus then left them and went away. " – Matthew 16

      God is not a vending machine, Gods unqualified promise to all of us to seek and you will find.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:37 am |
    • Paul

      ""Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13 And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. 14 You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it." – John 14"

      If Jesus will do whatever you ask for in prayer, then you should be able to ask for Jesus to appear in the flesh, and he should appear? Right?

      January 31, 2012 at 8:42 am |
    • Chad

      @ Paul "If Jesus will do whatever you ask for in prayer, then you should be able to ask for Jesus to appear in the flesh, and he should appear? Right?"

      =>You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it."
      If you ask "in his name" , in agreement with Him, yes.
      God isnt going to do something that isn't His will just because you ask Him. The qualification is right there "in his name".

      and no, that doent just mean tacking on "in the name of Jesus" to the end of your prayer.

      God is not a vending machine.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:00 am |
    • hippypoet

      @chad – "god is not a vending machine"

      well duh! god is an idea, such an improbable idea that many have, to make the idea inarguably, said that the idea is beyond human comprehension and so be doing remove the need but more importantly the ability to prove and so make it an untouchable notion of truth all based on an idea....how is that different then being delusional? you hold fast to an idea of an improbable , incomprehensible , untouchable nature as if its fact!

      not good chad! not good at all!

      January 31, 2012 at 9:19 am |
    • Phillip Evans

      Are you one of the Twelve?

      January 31, 2012 at 9:36 am |
    • Chad

      @hippypoet "god is an idea, such an improbable idea that many have, to make the idea inarguably, said that the idea is beyond human comprehension and so be doing remove the need but more importantly the ability to prove and so make it an untouchable notion of truth all based on an idea....how is that different then being delusional? you hold fast to an idea of an improbable , incomprehensible , untouchable nature as if its fact!"

      => you talk of the God of Abraham as if he is a philosophical idea like the Greek notion of Areté.

      God is not an idea, He is (for lack of a better term) a person.
      Jesus Christ was fully man and fully God, the Word became flesh and dwelt among us .

      January 31, 2012 at 10:36 am |
    • hippypoet

      @chad – you said two words that caught my eye – he and person – so god is a male person..and you know this to be true i take it... how? jesus WAS a person sure, as far as the son of this god "person" well thats another one of those notions that can ONLY be taken on faith which i am not discussing. I am talking about that which is provible! god is only an idea for none have proof nor anything suggesting existence of any kind of all powerful being. Your grasps at reality are shallow at best. But i do enjoy watching the game played out.

      for your own information – definitons
      faith – strong belief in God or in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual apprehension rather than proof.
      delusion -A belief strongly held in spite of invalidating evidence (or lack thereof to the contrary)

      until you have tangible evidence of the existence of god, the notion of god remains in the realm of ideas...and thats a factual statement!

      keep at it, maybe you will find something – and i will say that i would love to know beyond a doubt that god exists...so please, go and find "him"! lol

      January 31, 2012 at 11:25 am |
    • Chad

      @hippypoet "you said two words that caught my eye – he and person – so god is a male person..and you know this to be true i take it... how?"
      => the bible refers to God as "He", and "father", so I refer to him using likewise. Does God have an actual male body the way that I do? I honestly dont know.

      @hippypoet "jesus WAS a person sure, as far as the son of this god "person" well thats another one of those notions that can ONLY be taken on faith which i am not discussing"
      =>agreed, the question is whether or not Jesus was divine.

      @hippypoet "until you have tangible evidence of the existence of god, the notion of god remains in the realm of ideas...and thats a factual statement!"
      =>so questions:
      1. How did our universe originate?
      2. How did life on this planet originate?
      3. When one considers the "evolution" of fish to amphibian to reptile to mammal , why do we have virtually no fossil evidence doc umenting the transitions between these major groups? There had to have been millions of interim species, why did they all escape fossilization? Why does stasis dominate the fossil record?
      4. Why did Jesus of Nazareth claim to be the Jewish messiah? Is it really plausible that a person who seems so rational and coherent could at the same time be utterly insane?
      5. Why did the behavior of the disciples change so radically after they reported witnessing a resurrected Jesus? From denying Christ and running, to proclaiming Christ and standing (and being tortured to death for that belief)

      IMO, a person has to answer those questions in a coherent manner to say there is no God.

      January 31, 2012 at 12:38 pm |
    • hippypoet

      @chad – well, first i shall address the "him/father" remark -in the bible it does indeed say "father" as well as him" but if you are to use the bible for an exact reference then shouldn't you take the whole literally? It was written by men who lived in a day and age where women had no rights and the only creature that could hold power was man! So of course in that world the god would have been written to depict a man as god. I need only to ask : if you wash your feet before prayer, and when the last stoning was that you attended : to get my point across…but you did say I had to answer in a coherent manner…:)

      Yes, the jesus story... one of those that many love to argue about, even me at times in my life have i taken the position of "he never existed"....but most of us know he did, the only real question is his divinity. So in this we are in an agreement.

      your questions – 1. How did our universe originate?
      2. How did life on this planet originate?
      3. When one considers the "evolution" of fish to amphibian to reptile to mammal , why do we have virtually no fossil evidence doc umenting the transitions between these major groups?

      I can't answer any of them, but nor can you. I can however do exactly what you do when one askes you to answer them....make stuff up or regurgitate someone elses answers which of course are made up as well. (we hope our own answer sounds better then the latter) However i will offer this tid bit out, there are reasons one can think of to answer without full knowledge of truth that would in place of false information be better used for an answer even thou both are equal in the sense that neither can be proven correct. For instance, before the discovery of any other humanoid species it was considered truth that we were the only types of primate alive like us, ever! And so with such truths, one can easily say, yes, there is a god who must have created us for we are unlike anything on this planet. However the truth is far from that. We have found many different humanoids in recent years to connect how we came from trees to streets. Now as far everything else, fossils no – your right that we are MISSING fossils from the records due to fossils yet found, but i will say that the proof for evolution over time is found in the DNA of species. We can track most species to a common ancestor species and then due to earths history of m@ss extinctions, minor extinctions, and many ice ages realize that a great many species may have died off due to lack of available food. Since the creatures may have died in less traumatic events left corpses, the corpses may have been eaten and then its bones exposed to the weather and then no fossils – But this is only one of many possible answers.
      The truth is, both evolution and god are but ideas, however one idea has evidence while the other (god) has only believers and a long history of them.

      4. Why did Jesus of Nazareth claim to be the Jewish messiah? Is it really plausible that a person who seems so rational and coherent could at the same time be utterly insane?
      Answer to question 1 : many people at this time and ALL THOUGHOUT history have made such claims. Right now there is someone in South America who claims to be the reincarnated jesus himself – that’s not a joke! And get this, he is rational, coherent and most likely completely not insane!
      Answer to question 2 : Being rational is subject to the whims of society. Example – a woman hands a man a cup of tea, he calls her a witch and the whole town backs him over her and puts her to death. Coherent is only the ability to remain consistent. So if jesus was schizophrenic his whole life, believed the voices in his head telling him he was the messiah, and was consistent about it then in his day and age he would not have been considered to be insane. The definition of insanity is : In a state of mind that prevents normal perception, behavior, or social interaction. He lived in a world that was LITERALLY waiting for “his” arrival so he was not exactly off the beaten track. Oh and you can’t make such claims to jesus being so rational and coherent being you weren’t there, just so you know! 🙂

      Now as for the disciples, they fit the bill of those who would believe the words of jesus utterly and completely to the point of being made to believe someone saw jesus walking around after his execution. All that’s needed for such belief is the right person telling the story of “I saw him”! And again, this is where FAITH takes over for believers… from this point on all which is known is from accounts from those who knew people who talked to people who were friends with a guy who was there. The closest account to the date of death of jesus is still 60 plus years off. There is too much room for story telling. And lets not forget that this culture is a desert culture, there entire history is based on oral traditions, STORY TELLING!

      Please keep in mind that if one has complete faith in anything, it should always be oneself over anything no matter how grand the idea or painful the consequence!

      hugs and kisses
      The Hippypoet 🙂

      January 31, 2012 at 1:58 pm |
    • Theophilus7

      Paul – keep reading... try the epistle of First John near the back of the Bible. You will find here a direct key that you're missing. specifically First John 5:14 – the prerequisite of prayers answered is to ask according to His will (not ours). Read my other other post to UhOh above. If you're digging into the Bible and wrestling with this stuff with the right heart, you're going to discover a lot of answers. Most fail because they don't read. The pull out a piece, rip it from the context of the entire counsel of God, then throw it in someone's face like a great "ah hah!" moment. Well, the stuff written in the Bible is to lead you to salvation. If you are intent, you will do your homework, and you will discover the message written there.

      January 31, 2012 at 2:26 pm |
    • Paul

      "If you're digging into the Bible and wrestling with this stuff with the right heart, you're going to discover a lot of answers."

      Oh you mean totally gullible and without logic, gotcha.

      January 31, 2012 at 3:19 pm |
    • Chad

      @hippypoet "if you are to use the bible for an exact reference then shouldn't you take the whole literally?"
      =>Literally in the sense of completely understanding what the original author said, and what he meant when he said it. yes absolutely.
      =>Literally in the sense of taking a single verse out of context and attempting to erroneously make it into something else, no.

      I'm sure you'll agree that it's always best to first seek to understand what the author was saying prior to attempting to criticize it, right? 🙂 🙂

      @hippypoet "It was written by men who lived in a day and age where women had no rights and the only creature that could hold power was man!
      =>Not exactly correct, see Deborah, Judges 5

      @hippypoet "if you wash your feet before prayer, and when the last stoning was that you attended"
      =>nope, and never been to one. See New Testament: John 19.

      @hippypoet "iI can't answer any of them, but nor can you"
      =>actually I can answer all of them. See Genesis

      @hippypoet "i your right that we are MISSING fossils from the records due to fossils yet found, but i will say that the proof for evolution over time is found in the DNA of species. We can track most species to a common ancestor species"
      =>ah, but that fact doesnt differentiate between supernatural creation of major life forms using genetic mutation as a vehicle, vs an entirely naturalistic process that occurs randomly.

      @hippypoet "both evolution and god are but ideas, however one idea has evidence while the other (god) has only believers and a long history of them."
      =>well, "evolution" doesnt really say anything one way or the other about God.
      "Evolution is any change across successive generations in the heritable characteristics of biological populations"

      so, what you have to say is "Evolution by an entirely random process with out supernatural intervention"
      and, unfortunately that doenst really say anything yet..

      you have to explain how life got here.. so what you have to say is
      "Spontaneous generation of a life form based on random combinations of available molecules, then followed by evolution by an entirely random process with out supernatural intervention"

      and, unfortunately, that doesnt say anything either.. because how did the universe get here to begin with?
      so, you have to say: "First there was nothing, nothing at all. No time, no space, nothing.. not the vacuum of space, but literally nothing, then, that nothing exploded and all of the matter in the universe was created, space and time itself created, from literally nothing.. in such a precise manner that it enable the universe to cool and matter to gather.. then spontaneous generation of a life form based on random combinations of available molecules, then followed by evolution by an entirely random process with out supernatural intervention"

      so... you were saying something about evidence?

      January 31, 2012 at 5:13 pm |
    • Chad

      @HippyPoet " many people at this time and ALL THOUGHOUT history have made [the claim that they are the offspring of divine origin] Right now there is someone in South America who claims to be the reincarnated jesus himself – that’s not a joke! And get this, he is rational, coherent and most likely completely not insane!
      =>hmm.. I think I'll have to call your bluff on that one.. provide a pointer to some of his calm and rational statements.

      @HippyPoet "[Jesus was crazy but not perceived as such by the society of His time]" (paraphrase mine)
      =>we arent relying on their as sement though, we have what he said in the gospels to make our own judgement on that matter. right?

      January 31, 2012 at 5:18 pm |
  12. JamesSRowe

    I was told by a friend that something called "Penny Medical" is offering health insurance plans starting just $1 a day. That is some thing we all can agree.

    January 31, 2012 at 7:58 am |
  13. Chad

    "You must picture me alone in that room in Magdalen, night after night, feeling, whenever my mind lifted even for a second from my work, the steady, unrelenting approach of Him whom I so earnestly desired not to meet. That which I greatly feared had at last come upon me. In the Trinity Term of 1929 I gave in, and admitted that God was God, and knelt and prayed: perhaps, that night, the most dejected and reluctant convert in all England. I did not then see what is now the most shining and obvious thing; the Divine humility which will accept a convert even on such terms. The Prodigal Son at least walked home on his own feet. But who can duly adore that Love which will open the high gates to a prodigal who is brought in kicking, struggling, resentful, and darting his eyes in every direction for a chance of escape?" – C.S. Lewis

    Brilliant guy if you have ever read any of his stuff.

    January 31, 2012 at 7:53 am |
    • TruthPrevails

      oh my, the other part of the asylum's group of delusional christards is in our presence...where the hell is that island when we need it?

      January 31, 2012 at 7:58 am |
    • Theophilus7

      TP – oh you'll get that island alright, only you'll be there alone. Death catches us all in due time. If you're right and there is no God, then no worries. If you're wrong, and the God of the Bible is true, you'll have no excuse. And you will be very alone. This is a very weighty topic, nothing to be flippant about. The implications are significant for yourself.

      January 31, 2012 at 2:37 pm |
    • AtheistSteve

      I need TP for my bunghole!

      January 31, 2012 at 3:23 pm |
    • Paul

      "If you're right and there is no God, then no worries. If you're wrong, and the God of the Bible is true, you'll have no excuse. And you will be very alone. This is a very weighty topic, nothing to be flippant about. The implications are significant for yourself."

      Too funny how Christians try to use fear to make others believe in their stupidity. There is no proof of your God, it's been centuries and still no proof. It's amazing how stupid and gullible people still are in our society.

      January 31, 2012 at 3:27 pm |
  14. Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

    prayer changes things
    me, myself, and just sayin are one

    January 31, 2012 at 7:40 am |
    • just sayin

      What kind of sad lonely unwanted human filth impersonates a handle on an anonymous blog, can anyone really be that desperate for attention. Too bad your mommy didn't love you little troll

      January 31, 2012 at 7:43 am |
    • Jesus

      Yes they are the same in their stupidity.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:17 am |
    • just sayin

      so it is you then you have my sympathy

      January 31, 2012 at 8:52 am |
    • Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

      wrong, it is me!

      January 31, 2012 at 3:25 pm |
  15. Mirosal

    m'lady .. I think this actually may BE a 'bot' of some kind. It's using the exact words I have used, in a different fashion as its reply

    January 31, 2012 at 7:22 am |
    • AtheistSteve

      Yes that's what I've suspected all along. No real content or discussion. Best to just ignore it whether it's a person or a bot.

      January 31, 2012 at 7:35 am |
    • Mirosal

      and hello to you Sir Steve 🙂 .. ready to bury "just spewin"?

      January 31, 2012 at 7:37 am |
    • AtheistSteve

      Good day to you as well friend Mirosal...
      just spewing buries himself in his delusions. Everything is the product of his God because he doesn't have the intellect to discern anything outside his God-bubble. Ignorance is bliss...truth takes hard work and study.

      January 31, 2012 at 7:46 am |
    • Mirosal

      but I only have one small question for the idiot, but he's afraid to answer because his little soap-bubble world will get popped. I'm pretty sure his cherry isn't popped yet either.

      January 31, 2012 at 7:49 am |
    • TruthPrevails

      I believe it is a bot also just like just spewin' is a roach.

      January 31, 2012 at 7:55 am |
    • AtheistSteve

      The only question I would pose is this.
      What if God was testing us? But not in the way most believers think. What if the real test was to see who would use their God-given intellect to unmask the absolute lunacy proposed by religious ideology? That the real path to salvation was reserved for those of use who see through the ridiculous dogma and instead pursue truth through scientific exploration. Weeding out all the gullible fools who think hocus-pocus and supernatural mumbo-jumbo are real. After all...why would God want to be surrounded by a pile of mindless sheep?

      January 31, 2012 at 8:00 am |
    • just sayin

      God is not surrounded by mindless sheep, but by those of sound mind. This is a test but not in the manner you have suggested. The error in your question is that it does not require a savior to deal with the sin problem. As often mentioned God gave science to mankind, there is no conflict between God and science. The conflict is between God and sin.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:17 am |
    • Mirosal

      and just WHO says 'god' gave science to man?? huh?? no god means no sin, therefore no conflict.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:19 am |
    • AtheistSteve

      Au contraire... The book of magic spells commonly referred to as the Bible details these sins you mention. Since sin is the defiance of God's will and his supposed will is defined in that ridiculous tome, then the path to redemption requires buying into all the anti-science therein. Science is the product of man's intellect, not the Bible's fairy stories. The most ludicrous of which is the Jesus myth. Jesus supposedly died for our sins. The ultimate sacrifice. But wait...Jesus lives. Every Christian has said this. And he is supposed to return to pass judgement in the end times. So what exactly was sacrificed? God didn't lose his son for all eternity...Jesus endured what amounts to a bad weekend. If Jesus was roasting in hell for all eternity then that would actually be a sacrifice. Just one example of the comedy of errors that is the Bible.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:37 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @just sayin
      As we've discussed before – science has always moved onwards in spite of God and His earthly mouthpieces, not because of Him.
      The Original Sin for which all of mankind is punished forever more was gaining knowledge.
      Scientific theories that have contested church dogma have been suppressed throughout the ages and the scientists who presented such theories branded heretics and blasphemers.
      Darwin and evolution, Copernicus and Heliocentrism, Galileo and the moons of Jupiter, Tycho Brahe, Johannes Kepler and Edmond Halley and the orbits of comets and planets.
      William Buckland, Charles Lyell, Louis Agassiz, and Adam Sedgewick were geologists who set out to prove that the Genesis creation account was real – but instead could not escape the conclusion that the planet is far older than a few thousand years. As a result of publishing their finding, the Church labelled them "infidels," "impugners of the sacred record," and "assailants of the volume of God." Their geology was condemned as "a dark art," "dangerous and disreputable," "a forbidden province," "infernal artillery" and "an awful evasion of the testimony of revelation."

      January 31, 2012 at 8:43 am |
  16. Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

    Prayer changes things
    There is joy in morning prayer

    January 31, 2012 at 6:30 am |
    • TruthPrevails

      spewing it constantly doesn't make it right!! or do you continue to spew it in hopes that eventually you, yourself, will believe it??? Scientific evidence to the contrary trumps your delusions any day. Now our delusional prayer-troll please go back to your bridge and think of something useful to say!

      January 31, 2012 at 7:20 am |
    • just sayin

      Science is compatible with faith as God has given both to mankind

      January 31, 2012 at 7:24 am |
    • Mirosal

      Hey ... just spewin' .. ready for my one itty-bitty simple question?

      January 31, 2012 at 7:25 am |
    • Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

      Prayer changes things
      Even the demons believe
      And tremble with fear
      Prayer changes things

      January 31, 2012 at 7:26 am |
    • Mirosal

      I'm not a demon, therefore I don't have any fear, or belief. I am immune from your 'god'.

      January 31, 2012 at 7:28 am |
    • Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

      prayer changes things
      Atheism is pure delusion

      January 31, 2012 at 7:30 am |
    • just sayin

      i think the point is that demons are smarter than you because they believe

      January 31, 2012 at 7:31 am |
    • Mirosal

      religion is a delusion. MY eyes are not closed by a moldy book and archaic rules set by sheep herders and goat-f_ckers 2000 years ago

      January 31, 2012 at 7:32 am |
    • Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

      Prayer changes things
      Enjoy the full council of God thanks
      Do not require outside help
      God loves you
      Enjoy the love
      Prayer changes things

      January 31, 2012 at 7:33 am |
    • TruthPrevails

      @just spewin: How wrong you are!!! We can prove science exists, there is no proof for your god!!! Therefore the two are not compatible...believing it does not make it right you poor deluded lying sack of christard brainwashing techniques!!! Your god is a wretched character but unfortunately you are too blind to see that!! Don't start with me today...you won't win, as you never have won in the past...you are only capable of spewing the same biblical garbage over and over again-stuff that science has refuted over and over again!!!

      January 31, 2012 at 7:33 am |
    • Mirosal

      ready for that one question just spewin?

      January 31, 2012 at 7:33 am |
    • Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

      prayer changes things
      Atheism is the cause of bestiality

      January 31, 2012 at 7:34 am |
    • Mirosal

      and hello m'lady Truth 🙂 I only have ONE question, but I don't think he can answer it.

      January 31, 2012 at 7:34 am |
    • just sayin

      Take a pill liar prevails no one is suggesting science does not exist, to the contrary science is a gift of God to mankind, as such science itself is an evidence of Gods existence.

      January 31, 2012 at 7:35 am |
    • Mirosal

      sorry, it was your own goat-f_ckers that wrote your "holy" text ... they did it and you worship what they wrote.

      January 31, 2012 at 7:36 am |
    • just sayin

      What a sad unwanted pathetic human being to impersonate Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things on an anonymous blog. How sick and lonely do you have to be to do that?

      January 31, 2012 at 7:38 am |
    • Mirosal

      just spewin ... what are you talking about, and are you ready for my question?

      January 31, 2012 at 7:40 am |
    • just sayin

      I am what I am, and I am a schizo

      January 31, 2012 at 7:42 am |
    • just sayin

      and so am I

      January 31, 2012 at 7:43 am |
    • Mirosal

      So you're afraid to answer one little question about your 'faith'? Afraid of a little logic and reason?

      January 31, 2012 at 7:43 am |
    • just sayin

      This conversation is compromised by someone probably an atheist unwilling or unable to voice an anonymous opinion under their own handle. What causes someone to be that afraid of their own hidden voice?

      January 31, 2012 at 7:45 am |
    • Mirosal

      don't know ... don't care ... you ready? Or are you just not to sure about your own 'faith'?

      January 31, 2012 at 7:47 am |
    • just sayin

      Mirosal there is nothing i am afraid to answer you on. The problem here if you are not bright enough to see it is that this thread is infected by trolls that have stolen handles. we have no way of knowing who we are talking with. Someday there will be opportunity to answer your"question" if God allows

      January 31, 2012 at 7:51 am |
    • Mirosal

      I don't give a rat's ass about what your 'god' allows ... you ready for that question?

      January 31, 2012 at 7:53 am |
    • TruthPrevails

      @just spewin: first off, I'm not the one out there telling people prayer works when science says something completely opposite, so the liar would be you!!! second, Atheists don't hide themselves...it is you christards who come here and hide behind you veil of delusions and lie, so it would make sense that it is one of you that is hiding. You are such an uneducated hypocrite. God couldn't have given us science when god does not exist (prove it does using the scientific method...nothing else is substantial). Your blindness and ignorance are detrimental to society.

      January 31, 2012 at 7:54 am |
    • Alex Trebec

      I already have the answer Mirosal, what your question?

      January 31, 2012 at 8:02 am |
    • Mirosal

      The core doctrine of X-tianity is that 'god' is omnipotent, omnipresent, and omniscient ... is this true .. yes or no?

      January 31, 2012 at 8:06 am |
    • Alex Trebec

      Yes, but that's just part of it

      January 31, 2012 at 8:14 am |
    • Nope

      Dr. Herbert Benson of Harvard Medical School and other scientists tested the effect of having three Christian groups pray for particular patients, starting the night before surgery and continuing for two weeks. The volunteers prayed for "a successful surgery with a quick, healthy recovery and no complications" for specific patients, for whom they were given the first name and first initial of the last name.

      The patients, meanwhile, were split into three groups of about 600 apiece: those who knew they were being prayed for, those who were prayed for but only knew it was a possibility, and those who weren't prayed for but were told it was a possibility.

      The researchers didn't ask patients or their families and friends to alter any plans they had for prayer, saying such a step would have been unethical and impractical. The study looked for any complications within 30 days of the surgery. Results showed no effect of prayer on complication-free recovery. But 59 percent of the patients who knew they were being prayed for developed a complication, versus 52 percent of those who were told it was just a possibility.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:16 am |
    • Mirosal

      no "part" is allowed. If it were, your core doctrine is flawed. OMNI means "all" so either it is or it isn't. no middle ground there. .. so .. yes .. or ... no?

      January 31, 2012 at 8:20 am |
    • just sayin

      First it is Christianity as in "Christ". Second those are attributes of God, not doctrines. Return question are those vulgar posts yours?

      January 31, 2012 at 8:23 am |
    • Alex Trebec

      i said yes, but core doctrine or the basis of Christianity also includes: the trinity, the death and resurrection of Christ.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:27 am |
    • Mirosal

      then if 'god' is omniscient, prayer is useless, the game is already rigged. As far as jesus being the son of 'god' .. remember Hercules had Zeus for a father and a mortal mother as well. And everyone relegates Hercules to the realm of mythology. Your jesus is no different. Are there ANY other texts that show he even existed, without using a babble .. I mean bible?

      January 31, 2012 at 8:32 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @Alex Trebek
      Not all Christians are Trinitarians!
      Christadelphians, Jehovah's Witnesses, and Pentecostals are just a few examples.
      Any religion that can believe in a triune God and still call itself monotheistic can rationalize anything!

      January 31, 2012 at 8:34 am |
    • just sayin

      Yes there are other texts available that acknowledge Jesus, they have been listed multiple times on these blogs. You are also trying to do a three card monte on omniscience using a limited human interpretation of the word to illustrate what you obviously think is your brilliance. It does not work that way when considering the character of God.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:47 am |
    • just sayin

      Doc you are grouping peoples that do not belong in the true Christian category. This shows a basic lack of knowledge as to what a Christian is. A lot of people user the name Jesus Christ, we hear it all the time. Very few are Christians.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:49 am |
    • Paul

      "You are also trying to do a three card monte on omniscience using a limited human interpretation of the word to illustrate what you obviously think is your brilliance. It does not work that way when considering the character of God."

      Yet, its a human being having to make excuses for their god, just look at all the excuses the Christians come up with on this blog. . LOL!

      January 31, 2012 at 8:49 am |
    • fred

      "A lot of people user the name Jesus Christ, we hear it all the time. Very few are Christians."

      All those Christians will end up in hell too.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:51 am |
    • Mirosal

      It's a fairly simple word, rather easy to define. What 3-card monte "shell game" can there be with such an easy word to define? all-knowing... pretty cut-and-dried there. Not a lot of grey area there, unless you're lacking in grey matter.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:53 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @just sayin
      The definition of Christian is one who lives their life in the image of Jesus Christ.
      Belief in the supernatural is not required to be humble, forgiving and charitable.

      How do you know for certain whether Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, oriental Orthodox, As.syrian, Byzantine, Lutheran, Anglican, Presbyterian, Anabaptism, Brethren, Methodist, Pietism, Apostolic, Pentocostal, Charismatic, African Initiated, United, Quakers, Couthcotti.tism, Millerism, British-Isrealism, Latter Day Saints, Mennonite, 7th day Adventism, Kelleyism, Co.oneyism, Shakers, Methernitha, Strigolniki, Yehowism, Christadelphians, Christian Science, doukhobors, Iglesia ni Cristo, Makuya, Molokans, Subbotniks, Ebionism, Martinism, Rosicrucians, Rastafarianism, Santo Daime, or Umbanda is the REAL interpretation of your God's words?

      January 31, 2012 at 8:55 am |
    • Alex Trebec

      Prayer is used to trust the will of God. When the disciples asked Jesus how they should pray, he presented them with the Lord's prayer. In the beginnings of the prayer was "Thy will be done", before the words of praying for daily food, before the words of praying for those who sin against one another. Sure I might pray for someone who is sick, or needy, etc, but i also pray that his will be done, because I know the future has already been set forth. Whether or not that person is healed, or the other replenished, it is the will of God that made it so. And I trust that.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:56 am |
    • just sayin

      Paul you wear ignorance as a glove.You are butting into other peoples conversations and confusing the issue. Why not wait your turn? Omniscience as an attribute of God does not fall into the narrow interpretation mirosal thinks it does, and the differences can be adequately demonstrated.

      January 31, 2012 at 8:57 am |
    • TruthPrevails

      "Doc you are grouping peoples that do not belong in the true Christian category"

      This is better known as the no true scotsman fallacy!! As long as they all follow the same book you do even to the remotest of parts, they are christian...just a different flavor (so to speak).

      January 31, 2012 at 8:59 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @just sayin
      If "omniscient" doesn't mean "all knowing", then what does it mean?
      If God knows everything – except for a) and b), then He is by definition NOT omniscient.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:00 am |
    • just sayin

      Not quite Doc, a lot of the groups you have flung together do not belong in the Kingdom of God. The problem here is that there are a lot of fraudulent groups claiming the Christian label. Do not study the false, study the genuine.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:01 am |
    • just sayin

      divine omniscience is different that human omniscience, think about it.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:02 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @just Sayin
      I reiterate my question to you.
      Since The One True Faith must be determined using faith alone, how can you be certain that yours is the right choice?
      The punishment for choosing wrong is eternal damnation, so I assume you've a solid reason beyond simply having been indoctrinated in one particular sect.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:09 am |
    • just sayin

      I know who I have believed and am convinced that God is able to that which I have committed to God until that day.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:19 am |
    • just sayin

      I know who I have believed and am convinced that God is able to keep that which I have committed to God until that day.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:20 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @Just Sayin
      That's not much an answer.
      You've declared ex cathedra that you're right and everyone else is going to hell.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:25 am |
    • just sayin

      do not take up the filthy habit of putting words in others mouths. If I had meant that I would of said that. I am quite capable of thinking and expressing my own thoughts

      January 31, 2012 at 9:28 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @Just sayin
      So answer the question!
      How did you decide which of the thousands of Christians sects is The Truth?
      The rules say that no proof is necessary or allowed, so what precisely has convinced you that all the other interpretations of God's word are wrong?
      You've declared that multiple denominations of Christianity aren't actually Christian.
      You told me to study the genuine, but haven't given the methods you use to determine the genuine from the false.
      Does your heresy-sense start tingling when a false prophet speaks?
      Does Jesus appear before you and say "oh – that church is full of crackpots!"?
      Or do you just follow the dogmatic tenets with which you've been indoctrinated?

      January 31, 2012 at 9:38 am |
    • just sayin

      It was answered and you are getting ignorant so i'll be moving on.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:40 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      It would appear that my Universal Translator is on the fritz.
      Can any of you other fine folk find where Just Sayin' answered the question and translate it into english for me?

      January 31, 2012 at 9:44 am |
    • George, (not THAT one)

      You be even "happier" in the morning if you went jogging, or meditated...more endorphins.

      January 31, 2012 at 9:49 am |
    • SeanNJ

      @Doc Vestibule: You said, "Can any of you other fine folk find where Just Sayin' answered the question and translate it into english for me?"

      I believe it was that part where he/she said, "I know who I have believed and am convinced that God is able to keep that which I have committed to God until that day."

      Translated: "I've convinced myself that my beliefs are right contrary to any and all dissenting opinions, and that is a sufficient answer to any question that, should I entertain it, threatens that position."

      January 31, 2012 at 12:25 pm |
    • J.W

      Just sayin which denomination is true Christianity. I just want to make sure I am not following the wrong one.

      January 31, 2012 at 12:30 pm |
    • just sayin

      Truth is not found in denomination, Truth is found in Christ

      February 1, 2012 at 6:21 am |
  17. Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

    Prayer changes things

    January 31, 2012 at 6:30 am |
    • Mirosal

      no it doesn't. not in the least.

      January 31, 2012 at 6:32 am |
    • Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

      Prayer changes things
      For the least of these my brothers

      January 31, 2012 at 6:39 am |
    • Paul

      Mirosal they can't answer anything but keep repeating the same nonsense, It just proves it doesn't work because you'll never get an answer. LOL!

      January 31, 2012 at 8:44 am |
    • Throbster

      My throbbing dick is down here. Down here! L@@K!!

      3======================================================>

      January 31, 2012 at 7:07 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.