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 A picture of Anne Frank, perhaps the most famous victim of the Holocaust.
February 22nd, 2012
05:11 PM ET
After Anne Frank baptism, Mormons vow to discipline membersBy Dan Gilgoff, CNN.com Religion Editor (CNN) - Reacting to a report that well-known Holocaust victim Anne Frank had been baptized by proxy in a Mormon temple, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints says it is committed to disciplining members of its church who conducted such baptisms, which violate church policy. Word of the Frank baptism came a week after the issue of Mormon posthumous proxy baptism of Jews attracted national attention. This controversy surfaced after it was reported that the dead parents of Jewish Nazi hunter Simon Wiesenthal had been baptized in a Mormon temple. The church apologized for that baptism, blaming it on a technical glitch in its system for submitting names for posthumous proxy baptism. “It takes a good deal of deception and manipulation to get an improper submission through the safeguards we have put in place,” LDS Church spokesman Michael Purdy said in a statement Tuesday, responding to the report about the Anne Frank baptism. Explainer: How and why do Mormons baptize the dead? Though the church regularly conducts proxy baptisms for dead, in what it calls an attempt to give everyone a chance to accept salvation through Jesus, it has a 1990s-era policy against conducting such baptisms for Holocaust victims. The policy was adopted after complaints from Jewish groups, which said it was offensive to conduct Mormon baptisms for Holocaust victims who were killed because of their Jewish faith. “The Church keeps its word and is absolutely firm in its commitment to not accept the names of Holocaust victims for proxy baptism,” said Purdy in his Tuesday statement. The church said it is “committed to taking action against individual abusers by suspending the submitter’s access privileges,” the statement continued. “We will also consider whether other Church disciplinary action should be taken.” According to Helen Radkey, a former Mormon who tracks Mormon posthumous proxy baptisms, the one for Anne Frank was conducted on Saturday in the Dominican Republic. soundoff (1,379 Responses)« Previous 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 Next »
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Poor Anne. She just keeps getting killed over and over.
It's okay... I just had a ceremony here, that was just as effective, to un-baptize Joseph Smith and everyone else identifying as a Mormon...so the church doesn't really exist anymore.
Well done. I still find it odd how someone could be upset about a ceremony that, according to their own religion beliefs, would have no impact.
They're dead...I'm sure they could not care less...
1 Corinthians 15:29 – Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?
God loves all his children and all will have the chance to accept or reject salvation. All are alike unto God... both Jew and Gentile.
@Tad Pole... because it is insulting. It is like speaking ill of the dead. It is saying, "this person was in hell so we'll do this thing so they won't be anymore", when it is your belief that this person was a good person and not in hell. It is saying that you will go to hell because you believed the same thing as the person they want to baptize after death. Does not matter if it won't do anything religiously – it is a major insult... like desecrating a grave.
Imagine if they wanted to remove a star a David off a headstone and replace it with a cross... you might as well replace it with a swastika. It is an insult.
It doesn't matter what they say. There is no such thing as proxy baptism. I can say I have a invisible purple dinasuar in my backyard but that doesn't make it true. Not only are they hurting the Mormon religion, but they are hurting ALL religions, showing how bogus and made-up they all are.
By this logic, NO baptism is real because it's all just made up anyway, and I completely agree.
You say they are hurting all religious for exposing them as bogus. It seems to me that they are helping people by exposing religion as bogus
If you google for the list of famous people who have been posthumously baptized, you get quite a weird collection including Hitler and the major nazis (including the very evil Dr. Mengele), Stalin, Marx, Jesus, Ted Bundy Sid Vicious and the girlfriend he killed, Kurt Cobain, Liberace, Matthew Sherpard, and a whole lot of other people who would definitely choose to NOT be there, or by their evil SHOULD NOT be anywhere near any heaven.
Then again, people like Hitler and Bundy and Stalin really deserve to spend the rest of eternity with Mormons – what a hell that would be!
Hitler and Stalin were baptized as babies, that's what's wierd
They baptized Jesus? Wonder what John the Baptist would have to say about that.
(BTW...kudos on the best posting name I've EVER seen).
Your ancestors are not just baptized and confirmed as members of the mormon faith. Also necessary for salvation are initiatory and endowment ordinances. All names submitted to the temple are baptised, confirmed, recieve initiatory and endowment, and are then "sealed" to family over an altar. The temples frequently run out of names and "recycle", so temple work is frequently done many times per dead person.
Initiatory involves washing and anointing, partially clothed (the proxy, of course), in preparation for becoming a king and priest, or queen and priestess unto the most high god, hereafter to rule and reign in the house of Israel forever. The proxy then recieves their new name, sacred and holy, never to be repeated outside of the temple. I feel safe revealing mine, as I am an exmormon. My temple name was Ruth, as were all other ladies in the temple that day. When I returned to do the work on behalf of dead people, they recieved names like Naomi, Eliza, Abish, Esther, Lucy, and Martha.
The endowment involves watching a film, (or live action in select temples), which details the mormon view of the creation. A series of special handshakes and passwords are learned to ensure access to heaven. Mormons are strongly cautioned to keep these ceremonies secret, though they prefer the term sacred. Penalties, spiritual and physical, are threatened if confidentiality is breached. As I've left the church, I feel safe! Details of these ceremonies can be found with a simple google search.
bla bla bla angry person who had a fight with someone so left their religion
You are disregarding the sacredness of one's personal submission to God in the manner (perhaps previous baptism) chosen by the individual/s themselves. To attempt to alter someone's else's other than your own connection to God for salvation and frankly using a pagent in an attempt to upstage God Almighty is a useless abomination. If dead
You are disregarding individual personal submission to God in whatever manner taken, perhaps previous baptism. Our Dead have left the earthy stage: They are within the environs of GodLand and God is entirely capable of doing what is needed for continued spiritual existence. How dare you to assume any right here. Do not attempt to upstage God anymore. This is the vanity condemned, not just a couple of words. I don't reckon God being to happy about your messing with His established connections with those already in his domain.
You are disregarding individual personal submission to God in whatever manner taken, perhaps previous baptism. Our Dead have left the earthy stage: They are within the environs of GodLand and God is entirely capable of doing what is needed for continued spiritual existence. How dare you to assume any right here. Do not attempt to upstage God anymore. This is the vanity condemned, not just a couple of words. I don't reckon God being to happy about your messing with His established connections with those already in his domain.
Only for the newbies:
Putting the final kibosh on religion to include Mormonism
• There was probably no Abraham i.e. the foundations of Judaism, Christianity and Islam are non-existent.
• There was probably no Moses i.e the pillars of Judaism, Christianity and Islam have no strength of purpose.
• There was no Gabriel i.e. Islam fails as a religion. Christianity partially fails.
• There was no Easter i.e. Christianity completely fails as a religion.
• There was no Moroni i.e. Mormonism is nothing more than a business cult.
• Sacred/revered cows, monkey gods, castes, reincarnations and therefore Hinduism fails as a religion.
• Fat Buddhas here, skinny Buddhas there, reincarnated Buddhas everywhere makes for a no on Buddhism.
A quick Google, Bing or Yahoo search will put the kibosh on any other groups calling themselves a religion.
e.g. Taoism
"The origins of Taoism are unclear. Traditionally, Lao-tzu who lived in the sixth century is regarded as its founder. Its early philosophic foundations and its later beliefs and rituals are two completely different ways of life. Today (1982) Taoism claims 31,286,000 followers.
Legend says that Lao-tzu was immaculately conceived by a shooting star; carried in his mother's womb for eighty-two years; and born a full grown wise old man. "
There is scholarly evidence for both Abraham and Moses and quite a bit of evidence for reincarnation, so you need to redo whatever "research" led you to your conclusions.
Joe,
In fact there is NO scholarly evidence of Abraham, Moses or reincarnation. None.
You think the mass exodus of Jewish slaves would be mentioned in the Egyptian heiroglyphs. It ain't there.
It seems we aren't safe from religion even when we're dead. Depressing.....
Prayer takes people away from actually working on real solutions to their problems.
Prayer prevents you from getting badly needed exercise.
Prayer makes you fat.
Prayer wears out your clothes prematurely.
Prayer contributes to global warming through excess CO2 emissions.
Prayer fucks up your knees and your neck and your back.
Prayer can cause heart attacks, especially among the elderly.
Prayer reveals how stupid you are to the world.
Prayer exposes your backside to pervert priests.
Prayer makes you think doilies are exciting.
Prayer makes you secretively flatulent and embarrassed about it.
Prayer makes your kids avoid spending time with you.
Prayer gives you knobbly knees.
Prayer makes you frothy like Rick Santorum. Just google him to find out.
Prayer dulls your senses.
Prayer makes you post really stupid shit.
Prayer makes you hoard cats.
Prayer makes you smell like shitty kitty litter and leads you on to harder drugs.
Prayer wastes time.
Reading your post was a waste of time.
Agreed. Big waste of time...
You see? This is why mommy doesn't want you playing with her computer when she's going potty. Now pick up your toys and take your nap.
Prayer changes things.
evidence?
Untrue. I keep praying you'll change your posts.
hippypoet
fuc.kget ash wednesday...... want meat, eat it! No imaginary sky fairy will tell me otherwise ~ not that the fairy is talking to anyone anyway, or ever has for that matter! And just so you all know, fish and chicken are NOT to be eaten either – why you ask, why the definition of the word meat may be of service here – meat :The flesh of an animal as food. Fish and birds are animals too for any who are too stupid to not know that already!
Oh and just to give some insight here – jesus supposedly spent 40 days in the desert...the fasting is penance and inner cleansing for catholics....which is confusing because if one was to be not clean by eating meat then why eat it in the first place if once eaten one has to fast to be clean from it? Second, (in the form of a condescending question) what do you think the J man ate while in the desert? lots of vegetation there right? My answer (in the form of a condescending answser) I mean, its like a garden of eden in the desert wherever jesus went, sure – totally buy that! Or he ate anything he had at arms reach...now thats more likely, but why be rational when religion is on line...so sorry, never again, i swear to god!
hugs and kisses,
the Hippypoet
Now fuc.k off!
oh and fuc.k mormons too, they suc.k at life and thats why they feel the need to get followers after the living dies!
HP, I have to share a VERY dissappointing story with you. I went to a Scottish Fest on Saturday last, and signed up for a single malt Whisky tasting. Only ten bucks. Only problem is, they had a 10am and a 3am which both sold right out, so they added a 5pm tasting. Naturally I was first in line. The bad news is, they were out of product from the "real" tastings and grabbed some single malts from hotel that SUCKED. Very dissappointed. And the dude sitting next to me who thought he was all that told me Glenfiddich is blended. I gave him a stearn talkin to.
glenfiddich is NOT blended! HOW DARE THAT SILLY MAN, i have a right mind to shave his eyebrows!
glen is only blended when something happens like in 2009 or 2010 when a roof caved in and they had to mix years to save the casts from going nasty in the winter cold. its called phoenix... i can't wait to try it.... i have heard that they blended some others but it makes mention on the bottle and a glen blend is a special bottle so will cost more, this guy doesn't know his stuff!
Well imagine my dissappointment! I was hoping for the good stuff!!
HP,
What is the MATTER with you ?
Everyone knows one eats honey and locusts when one goes to the desert for a "purge".
Flinders,
Avoid the honeyed locusts. Just ask Strong Belwas.
Prophet, help me out I came in late. Who is helping, who in ignorant and who has questions? Thanks.
??? Did you take your meds today?
It is very obvious that "prophet" enjoys hearing itself talk. Well, type. Whatever.
I am going to babtize my favorite pet Seymore. He was a black lab that died tragically in a car accident about 35 years ago. Seymore, I still love you buddy.
What is "babtism" ? Is it related to baptism ?
I say to the Mormon baptism of Anne Frank........So what! If anything it's a tribute to her memory and just by hearing about her again, I am reminded, if left unchecked...man's inhumanity to man!
Slow news day PT
She will run into Hitler and Himmler and Mengele and Goering and Goebbels and the rest of the gang when she gets there. They have already been baptized in before her. What a tribute to Ann Frank!
Isn't it a disrespect of her belief system?
BBCM: Goebbels was excommunicated...he was the only one of the NAZI high command to be excommunicated even though many others were Catholic, including Hitler...his crime? He married a Protestant.
I thought Christians weren't supposed to "discipline" their members because it can cause spiritual blindness...
Since when do the zealots pay attention to their own rules?
I am lost here. If I go run the faucet and think about my dead Grandmother who was neithe Jew or Morman...must I now be disciplined? Can I pick the whip?
We believe in Tolerance of Religious views. Baptizing someone, by proxy, against their chosen religious views seems to be the opposite of tolerance. Therefore, you can now baptize friends and strangers to Notm Ormon, at http://www.notmormon.com.
Hey Notm, I just babtized you! Do you feel better? This proxy stuff is great!
too funny...Notm, you are a piece of work. Now go play in your padded room.
Santorum should become Mormon. He gets frothy with discipline.
frothy member discipline, maybe they need to slow down a bit...
Justin, GP...if I may.
Santorum is a fictional character carved from our nightmares of how a future apocolypse will start.
Now, wake up. Everything is ok, the Dems are in the White House and all is well.
What nonsense. A group of morons in Utah perform some silly superst.itious ritual and a group of superst.itious Jews thinks it can really affect dead people.
It is the 21st Century. When will we give up our Iron Age sky-fairies?
1000 years go by ....
It is the 31st Century. When will we give up our Iron Age sky-fairies?
I think what you and I both know, is that, if humans are still around, they will naturally replace the current God and holy books with new ones. The cycle never ends. Same ol same ol.
it is very obvious who the people are who have the problems by their use of a very basic style of language that normal healthy people don't use.
Who are the healthy sons a biches you are talkin about there pencil dik? Oh I am sorry, did I offend your feminine sensibilites?
sadly it is the ignorance of people that criticise those that try to help them that keeps them from having their questions answered
Sadly, you are a blatantly obvious and insipidly unimaginative troll maggot.
Sadly Evangelical Atheists though emotionally immature prefer to wallow in their mud. Ignorance is bliss they say and confronting their prejudice makes one a "troll" which is an object of supersti.tion they don't like. lol
Nii Croffie-
I wouldn't generalize – some of the brighter, less abusive ones have interesting things to say. Conversation is possible.
Yes Brad I agree with you so forgive my gen.eral.iza.tion.