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April 30th, 2012
12:24 PM ET
Columnist Dan Savage stands by comments on 'bulls**t in the Bible'By Dan Gilgoff, CNN.com Religion Editor (CNN) - Columnist and gay-rights advocate Dan Savage is standing by his comment that “we can learn to ignore the bulls**t in the Bible about gay people” at a recent conference for high school students, a line that prompted some to walk out and spurred intense online debate. In a blog post on Sunday, Savage wrote that his remark at a conference for the Journalism Education Association and the National Scholastic Press Association was "being spun as an attack on Christianity. Which is bullshhh… which is untrue.” “I was not attacking the faith in which I was raised," Savage wrote. "I was attacking the argument that gay people must be discriminated against — and anti-bullying programs that address anti-gay bullying should be blocked (or exceptions should be made for bullying 'motivated by faith') — because it says right there in the Bible that being gay is wrong.” Some Christian students walked out of the Seattle speech, prompting another controversial line from Savage: “It’s funny to someone who is on the receiving end of beatings that are justified by the Bible how pansya**ed people react when you push back.” CNN’s Belief Blog: The faith angles behind the biggest stories Savage apologized for that specific remark in Sunday’s blog post, writing that his word choice “was insulting, it was name-calling, and it was wrong.” One of the teachers attending the speech with his students told CNN’s Carol Costello on Monday that he was taken aback by the speech and that he supported the decision of some of his students to walk out of it. “It took a real dark, hostile turn, certainly, as I saw it,” said Rick Tuttle, a teacher at Sutter Union High School in Southern California. “It became very hostile toward Christianity, to the point that many students did walk out, including some of my students.” Follow the CNN Belief Blog on Twitter “They felt that they were attacked … a very pointed, direct attack on one particular group of students. It’s amazing that we go to an anti-bullying speech and one group of students is picked on in particular, with harsh, profane language.” Watch CNN Newsroom weekdays 9am to 3pm ET and weekends. For the latest from the CNN Newsroom click here. |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.  |
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Hey you Christian out there, how does it feel being on the receiving end of the stick. Not so good, huh? Pansy – pu**y is right. You can dish it out but you can't take it.
I can dish it and take it out. It is the gays who think that they are a special class who cannot be criticized.
Exactly! What about the part about women must have long hair and not dress like a man (pants, I presume). Let's all descriminate against them. Wait...no...let's pick and choose what we want to follow in the bible. That's what makes it such a joke.
@Alice: Criticized? Yes. Discriminated against? No.
I think everyone should be able to treat christians with the same unjustified bigotry that they use to discriminate against others.
Alice.. the problem is that Christianity, as do most religions empower others to pick on a segment of society they decide is different,,, usually based on some interpretation in a book. Those that feel they are doing it for " god" and as such they are justified not thinking that these are fellow humans they are picking on or attacking.. It is thuggery pure and simple. Why do you think it is wrong for those folks to take a stand against an organised dislike?
EvolvedDNA
Stop it! This attack of yours on Christians is going to ruin your soul. I am sorry if you were hurt by a Christian but get some help.
People pick on people that are different. In the animal kingdom other animals are acutely aware of what is not normal. Predators key in and separate and devour the easy pickings. You yourself take a second look when someone is not normal. Jesus said stop it but, Christians did not because they are human not because they are Christian.
Fred.. what are you on about..it is not an attack on Christians.. I have pointed out that your particular believe allows attacks on individuals you deem as unworthy because of this god you cannot prove, allows it that as all.. muslims are the same way. Why would needed to been hurt to point that out..?
EvolvedDNA
Thanks, Christianity does not allow for attacks on others it is the opposite. We are to love even our enemy. I was thinking there must be a reason you think Christians attack and one would be if a well intended Christian hurt you some how. My concern was a focus on the negative aspects of Christ rather than the truth.
The walkout was planned in advance and disingenuous. Another attempt by xenophobic Christians to assert their right to tread upon people whom they perceive as different.
Should they have done as Columbia University students regularly do and storm the stage?? That's better right?
Prayer changes things .
You're a proven liar. Prayer doesn’t not; you are such a LIAR. You have NO proof it changes anything! A great example of prayer proven not to work is the Christians in jail because prayer didn't work and their children died. For example: Susan Grady, who relied on prayer to heal her son. Nine-year-old Aaron Grady died and Susan Grady was arrested.
An article in the Journal of Pediatrics examined the deaths of 172 children from families who relied upon faith healing from 1975 to 1995. They concluded that four out of five ill children, who died under the care of faith healers or being left to prayer only, would most likely have survived if they had received medical care.
The statistical studies from the nineteenth century and the three CCU studies on prayer are quite consistent with the fact that humanity is wasting a huge amount of time on a procedure that simply doesn’t work. Nonetheless, faith in prayer is so pervasive and deeply rooted, you can be sure believers will continue to devise future studies in a desperate effort to confirm their beliefs!,!
Why would he have to defend his remark? It's ok to love the Bible and think it is glorious. Why is it not ok to think it's horrid (which I do, too). Freedom of religion is an individual right that includes a wide range of opinions.
Horus is on the phone for you................
@ Jesus – prayer works for me; apparently, God must hate you. Sorry, dude, but you're going to burn for eternity. That's a long time. Maybe you should say a prayer – couldn't hurt...
"God must hate you. Sorry, dude, but you're going to burn for eternity. That's a long time. Maybe you should say a prayer – couldn't hurt"
Don't you just love Christians who can't follow their own rule book. LOL! Hey roughly 70% of the people on this planet don't believe in your god, that means your god is going to burn over roughly 4 billion people for eternity. That means your god is a monster and doesn't deserve to be worshiped.
If you missed this on page 17 here it is again
From Gumbo Ya-Ya
Please take a moment and picture an America where the K KK, Na z is, A l Qu aeda, and Southern slaveowners were dominant forces in American society, and all vociferously pushed their beliefs regarding women, ho mose xuals, bla cks, je ws, etc. in the public sphere.
Now imagine that all or some of these groups started screaming and whining that they were unjustifiably under attack and discriminated against every time someone publicly pushed back at their big oted beliefs. Rather than hearing or accepting any form of criticism (regardless of whether they felt the criticism was valid), these groups just stood on the grounds that they are somehow immune from criticism, with the strong implication that their immunity stems from their worldviews being a. morally superior, and/or b. mandated from G od. Coupled with the "fact" that they are self-proclaimed "good people" who are supporting "family values" and "not trying to hurt anybody."
Knowing what you know now, would any person here HONESTLY advocate for these groups, or criticize the critics of these groups for being "too harsh," "bullying," or "disc riminatory?" Most people, obviously, would not, but would join in the criticism until the darkness inherent in these groups was eradicated or contained. If you would, however, criticize the critics, in my opinion you are a frightening person, but at least you would not lack the courage of your convictions. I would beg you, however, to reconsider your own moral worldview.
In my opinion, this is precisely what the Fundam entalist/Evang elical "Ch ristians" are doing today. Just because someone SAYS that they follow a religion of peace, or that they strive to be good, nice, moral people, or that the founder of their religion taught love and in fact loves the entire world, AND backs it up by citing examples of when they or their religion donated to charities, gave to the poor, etc, DOES NOT MEAN that a. they are "good" people, b. their religion is "good" and founded on "truth" and "love," c. that any of what they say is true or meritorious, and/or d. that they are in any way immune from honest criticism and stark confrontation in the public sphere which they have so readily thrust themselves into.
Fire away, oh you people who love decency, who love virtue, who admire honesty and courage, and who LOVE your fellow man. And don't stop fighting until the world rises up to join you against this darkness. In my opinion, it's better to stand and fight for what these people consider a "he llish" and "de monic" cause than to adopt their hypocritical forms of "goodness" and "love."
And if you don't believe me, fine. Tell it to Joseph K ony.
meh
Nice
Agreed
There's not a person here that will slander my religion "GOD IS GREAT"
Don't you have a bridge to hide under?
Go blow up a building mohammed ( why am i not surprised thats your name) haha its gona be great when you die and all that happens is your disgusting sandmonkey corpse rots away
there's no difference between your god and my daughter's imaginary friends.
its not the gods that are the problem its the people who are fanatical and completely misintepret what their prospective religions say...
You know I dont really care who is gay and who isnt. Everyone walks their own walk in life. I am a Christian and I am very tolerent of others. My own sins, drug addicts, alcoholics etc. But dont ask me to accept your lifestyle. I am happy if you are happy but to have 'special' sentences for criminals who beat up a gay person vs an old lady is just wrong. All this crying from the left about fair fair fair, well that is not fair. Why is fair liberals view of fair. It just aggravates me
So wait, you're not allowed to be hostile to christians? But it's ok for christians to be hostile to gays? Or anyone else for that matter?
The sooner our society learns to ignore ALL the BS in the bible, every last word, the better off we'll be.
first of all we are not hostile towards gays, we do not support the actions of gay people. as i recall atheists do everything to get christianity out of our government. we tolerate gay people, but they don't tolerate us
Peace, yes. So simple yet so profound
@Peace: So, you tolerate gays by discriminating against them, and then justify it with a belief system that you can present no verifiable supporting evidence is even accurate? Maybe we should start at the begining. Please present any supporting verifiable evidence that your god exists. Once you have done that and your gods existance is verified, you can then present evidence that supports your claim the he is not in favor of others lifestyles.
I anxiously await your evidence for verification.
He is hostile to school kids you moron, that's the difference. I am not a religious man, I am agnostic, But I think there is so much hate from people so called " seeking" to destroy hate. There is NO justification to talk to high school kids like that.
So if you're claiming "every last word" in the Bible is BS, than you're including Romans 13:8, "Owe no one anything, except to love each other, for the one who loves another has fulfilled the law"? Either you are anti-love or decided not to read the Bible before you criticize it.
peace.. what makes Christians. then, expect others to accept what they want? Why are your views any more important than say a gay person or an atheist? it is because you think you have a connection to a god....and you assume that your gods wishes supersede those of a democracy. What if i wanted all children in school to carve out wands because i think that Harry Potter is real .. would you try to get to Potterism out of the school because it conflicts with your equally unproven views?
EvolvedDNA
Potter is not the Western World View which we have lived under for almost 2,000 years. It would have been very healthy for people to have known the truth of what Jesus said. Now, we have a bunch of people filled with lies and their own religion. Reason? Very simple man is designed to worship and has done so since the Neanderthal. Man will fill that void with something and in this regard the godless have spelled doom for humanity. Nice job your team has done !
Religion should NEVER be a part of politics. Your faith and spirituality are private issues that should be left at home. That is why atheist try to get Christians and other religious followers out of public office. They should not be platforms for any religious beliefs.
Who? Never heard of him. Famous wanna be shock jock.
It's about time someone had the balls to say it. Your ancient collection of oral traditions is a nice literary work, but dangerous and worthless for any kind of guidance, insight, or aid past the Middle Ages. We go AROUND THE SUN, people, AROUND THE SUN.
I know all those pesky rules, Dont kill, Dont steal, Dont cheat on your wife, Honor your parents.............
"I know all those pesky rules, Dont kill, Dont steal, Dont cheat on your wife, Honor your parents"
Yeah, too bad so many Christians can't even follow their own rule book.
and we are the first to admit we are sinners
"and we are the first to admit we are sinners"
Supposedly 80% of the people in America are Christians, well now look at the state of America now, the greed, gluttony and corruption has always plagued us which is why Christians can't even follow their own rule book. LOL!
@C... and the first to point fingers and judge.
"I know all those pesky rules, Dont kill, Dont steal, Dont cheat on your wife, Honor your parents............."
NONE of which were original with Christianity. They are, in fact, common to pretty much every ethical system on the planet.
if he had any real guts he would have bashed the Qur'an, but like a good little lefty we will never do that.
They're both evil, dangerous books when believed by the foolish. What's your point again?
When we have crap from the Quran being shoved down our throats and made into laws like we do with the bible, then we'll worry about the Quran!
Good point. I don't subscribe to any religion, but I do see that the left leaning people in the US are attacking Christianity because it is assumed that all Republicans are Christians.
While the left/liberals won't say anything negative about Islam and Muslims. Frankly it's because Christianity has evolved and changed and is tolerant, those that were upset left. I dare this guy to attack Islam and say the Koran (or however we are spelling it this week) is BS. He won't do it because he's the pansy@ss pu$$y and is afraid he will be attacked by a Muslim.
Mr howdydoody..interesting that you show your real name as well when talking about Muslims, ... If you read books like the God Delusion and God is Not Great there are many references to the horrors of Islam... We think that all religions are crazy, as to most others of opposing faiths. But it is interesting to see that it is only the one you belong to is real...why is that?
The Christians quietly left the rude hypocritical absurdity, but liberal Progressives routinely have no problems with shouting down conservative guests on American campuses, so weak and fearful are they of the might of free speech. Danny boy, (not behaving like a man) showed himself a bully himself, childishly name calling with a bully pulpit for all to see!
You're wrong Afterburner. The Christians and Conservatives just bully people they don't like from a. the pulpit, or b. CNN comment boards.
It's funny how christians cry now that they can't stomp on everyone else constantly like they did for the past 2000 years.
your the first smart person ive seen post on this website. Christianity is not evil, it teaches to love each other, treat each other with respect, to all be equal. then again if you don't like it deal with it. were gonna be here for a LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOONG time
We can't fight hate with hate. I fail to see how this inflammatory rhetoric encourages someone to be less of a bully. It fans the flames of controversy.
thank you for having common sense
C'mon, this guy's the s c u m of the earth, the dregs of society, anybody with a shred of common sense knows that.
And the irony and hypocrisy of his bullying teenagers from his bully-pulpit during a "presentation" that was supposed to be against bullying - if the hypocrisy and irony of the situation is lost on you, then you must be a full-fledged liberal ... and as such, psychotic.
Typical of a leftist 'protected species'.... hurling insults at the 95% of the population that don't agree with your peculiar lifestyle, and then wanting sympathy from the same.... Dude do whatever the heck you want to do behind closed doors, but the majority of normal people A). Don't give a f$%^ what the heck you do in your bedroom. B). Don't even want to hear your pathetic BS in these days of serious crisis..... Go gay!!! Yeah!!! Now can the rest of us get back to real work, instead of listening to this filth make a living just being gay..... I don't give a cod that you are gay!!!!!!!!!!!!! You loser!!!!!!!!!!!
Site your source for 95%?
your God teaches you to hate or it that in your Bible?
>Site your source for 95%?
He meant to say 95% of his trailer park.
Actually the problem is that the majority of people, at least according to the gop, bible thumpers and right wing fanatics want to control what goes on behind closed doors. More importantly, the bible is not secular law and is not justification for doing whatever one wants in society. If that were the case I could go around killing the 1st born of any that I don't consider believers in whatever I hold sacred. It would be justified "because it's in the bible".
It takes people like this to bring attention to such issues because those who are against shout twice as loud. They wave their bible like it is the law of the land and they are here to smite someone until they believe or die. So, you can go back to your closed door and let people who have something to fight for, fight for it in public. I do agree that those who seemed so offended, are probably the ones doing most of the bullying.
billythebigbone
there is a difference between hate and angry.
@ "m":
Please, get your facts correct before you try such 'diatribe.' It's embarrassing. If hmsxls WOULD keep their business behind closed doors, as you say, we wouldn't be HAVING this conversation. The problem is, they militantly are shoving it in the faces of the majority of others and DEMANDING that we call it normal. Insanity. Stop misquoting the B ible. Really, really embarrassing.
If you don't care that Dan Sa√age is gay, what makes you call him "filth"?
The Bible-thumpers need to grow a thicker skin.
The bible's statements on slavery need to be seen in context. Slavery was a given, a fact-of-life in the ancient world. The bible made sure that a slave had certain rights and could eventually be freed. I am not a Christian, and I know that historically Christian leaders departed far from Jesus' teachings and committed terrible injustices in Jesus' name, but don't underestimate the fact that Christianity has good and kind aspects as well. It's not a case of black or white.
So, the bible condones slavery – that's essentially still all you're saying.
Great way to make excuses for the fucking bible. "Oh, but the context...."
It's always the excuse. You'd think that for a book written in light of divinity it would have been a little more clear then, eh comrade? The scripture should have said, "Slaves are ok now, but later on it won't be so just take this all in context when you read it. Don't forget. CONTEXT."
Fail. It doesn't need to be seen in context. If no longer of any use to the people of today, it needs to be corrected. Preferably by the god who allegedly authored it's content. Do you suppose he'll show up ? Or will he simply continue to allow the status quo.
I wouldn't want my high-schooler exposed to this low-life bully. I applaud the kids who walked out. Their teachers and parents should be proud. I deplore the ones who cheered, and the lefty administrators who thought it would be a good idea to invite this putz to speak.
And of course, it goes without saying, the guy's a complete hypocrite. Anti-bullying, indeed!
Sounds to me, from your rant, that your kid would be one of those who would benefit most from hearing the truth about religion.
Absolutely. He hears the truth from his teachers and from me. There is a God. He created the world. He gives free will to Man to choose well or poorly. He rewards the former and punishes the latter, either in this world or the next, according to His will. Choose wisely, because your choices will redound for your benefit or to your detriment for all eternity.
The ones who would "defend" an indefensible creepy whack-job like this are the same types who think "H o o t e r s" needs to have male waiters. And they're the same types who will tell you how they're right about their atheism, even as they spew the most deranged and seething hate-filled gibberish, they'll tell the world how they're the logical ones.
There are few things more tragic than the complacence of the willfully ignorant.
Being religious, you should then know full well all about willful ignorance.
"There are few things more tragic than the complacence of the willfully ignorant."
Well said........ Speaking of the tragedy of willful ingnorance, please provide any verifiable evidence that your God, or any Gods exist.
Come back from the twilight, zoney.
"please provide any verifiable evidence that your God, or any Gods exist."
You have it backward. It is axiomatic that God exists, the obvious corollary of a world and universe of such great complexity. The burden of proof is not on us but on you. Please provide verifiable evidence that He does not exist and then we'll talk. If you cannot manage that, as of course you cannot, I'll settle for any convincing reason to imagine that He does not exist, and that the world just popped into existence one fine day all by itself.
I'm not offended by Mr.Dan....sure wish he could have been challenged. Leviticus...really...that is so...70's....
Try these next time....Ephesians 2:8, Psalm 119:78 ...Phillipians 4:8....John 14:6....Romans5:8 and lets not forget
drum roll............MICHA 6:8........–"He has shown you, oh man, what is good and what the Lord requires of thee: but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God."
Inner peace......Peace be with you Dan. God is good!
it must be nice to be able to cherry pick the nice parts of the bible and be totally blind to the rest of it.
ignorance is bliss
With a screenname like that, you do nothing to lessen the perception that religious people are simply arrogant and self-righteous.
Cyle....not ignorant....very much aware....I choose to see the good in everything and everyone. I choose to love because...well yeah...I'm gonna say it....well because you made me......Because He first loved me 😉 If you knew me before and see my comments now .....you might be a believer too. I was soooo lost and a throw away child my friend. I cant live any other way. I'm happy...so be happy for me! God is love....too me:)
The stuff about gays is not the only bs in the bible. Most of the bible is bs... It is not the word of God. It is the word of what men think a God would have said.
Correction... It is the word of fearful men with essentially zero science at their disposal think a God would have said.