 |
|
|
|
|
May 4th, 2012
05:01 PM ET
Bible reading marathon wraps up in WashingtonBy David Ruff, CNN The Bible marathon began with a reading of Genesis 1:1 at 5 p.m. on Sunday, April 27. For 23 years, a small nonprofit group called the International Bible Reading Association has one purpose: "To encourage reading the Bible, both publicly and privately," says the Washington organizer Michael Hall, senior pastor of People's Church in Washington. Volunteers take turns reading through the text 24 hours a day for five days. The group relies on the security of the Capital Hill Police, who are stationed all around the Capitol. Hall says the readers have never had any problems or threats from onlookers or other groups. CNN’s Belief Blog: The faith angles behind the biggest stories Because of permit restrictions, the readers can't use heaters or any protective cover. When rain threatens, the group covers the bibles with plastic sheets and the volunteer readers wear rain jackets. "It's a wonderful celebration of our First Amendment rights. We have people coming from all around the world and they're stunned that we can do this. We’re one of the few countries in the world who has a Bill of Rights," Hall says. Hall says this is a nonpolitical event that draws people from all walks of life who have one thing in common. "We’re not a small group, Christians. We’re all around the world. We’re in every country." Bible readers include children being home schooled, church groups, individuals and even legislators. With Congress out of session, the only lawmaker to participate was Rep. Robert Aderholt, R-Alabama, who read on Tuesday morning. Hall says in years past, around 24 lawmakers usually read. Some read the Bible in their native language, as was the case with readers from the Korean Baptist Church in Washington. The Scriptures are read on a Bible-shaped podium. The organizers set up a table and display 100 Bibles in different languages. “What we’re doing is a great witness for this country and a great witness for God.” The last verse of the Bible, Revelation 22:22 was read in a small ceremony at the West Front of the U.S. Capitol on Tuesday, May 1 at 2 p.m.
Next entry »My Faith: Returning to church, despite my doubts
« Previous entryPrisoners play Jesus and disciples
|
  About this blog
The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.  |
|
|
|
Great goods from you, man. I've be mindful your stuff prior to and you're simply too great. I really like what you've bought here, certainly like what you are stating and the way in which through which you say it. You're making it enjoyable and you continue to take care of to stay it wise. I cant wait to learn far more from you. That is actually a terrific website.
1. For you.
A thought to consider without a typical ego response
Accept Jesus Christ as your lord and savior. You never know how soon is too late. Transcend the worldly illusion of enslavement.
The world denounces truth....
Accepting Jesus Christ (for me) resulted in something like seeing a new color. You will see it .....but will not be able to clearly explain it to anyone else..... Its meant to be that way to transcend any selfism within you.
Also... much the world arranges "surrounding dark matter into something to be debated" in such a way that protects/inflates the ego.
The key is be present and transcend our own desire to physically see evidence. We don't know anyways by defending our own perception of dark matter.
Currently.... most of us are constructing our own path that suits our sin lifestyle. Were all sinners. Knowing that we are is often an issue. But both Christians and non are sinners.
We don't like to Let go and let god. We want control to some degree. This is what Jesus asks us to do. "Follow me".
It's the hardest thing to do... but is done by letting the truth of scripture lead you (redemptive revelation)... as I said .
Try reading Corinthians and see if it makes sense to you. Try it without a pre conceived notion of it being a fairy tale.
See the truth...
do we do what it says in today’s society... is it relevant... so many have not recently read and only hinge their philosophy on what they have heard from some other person...which may have been full of arrogance pride or vanity..
Look closely at the economy ponzi, look at how society idolizes Lust , greed , envy, sloth, pride of life, desire for knowledge, desire for power, desire for revenge, gluttony with food etc .
Transcend the temporal world.
Just think if you can find any truth you can take with you ....in any of these things. When you die your riches go to someone who will spend away your life..... You will be forgotten.... history will repeat itself.... the greatest minds knowledge fade or are eventually plagiarized..... your good deeds will be forgotten and only give you a fleeting temporary reward . your learned teachings are forgotten or mutated..... your gold is transferred back to the rulers that rule you through deception. Your grave will grow over . This is truth .
Transcend your egoism and free yourself from this dominion of satan. Understand you are a sinner and part of the collective problem of this worldly matrix... Repent.... Repent means knowing (to change)
Evidence follows faith. Faith does not follow evidence.....
Faith. Above. Reason. In. Jesus. Christ.
Faith comes by Reading or Hearing the word of god from the bible. Ask Jesus in faith for discernment and start reading the New Testament... You will be shocked when you lay down your preconceived notions and ....see and hear truth ... see how Christ sets an example ... feel the truth....
Read Ecclesiastes. Read Corinthians.
You can’t transcend your own egoism by adapting a world philosophy/s to suit your needs. Seek the truth in Christ.
Sell all your cleverness and purchase true bewilderment. You don't get what you want ....you get what you are in Christ.
I promise this has been the truth for me. In Jesus christ .
Think of what you really have to lose. ...your ego?
Break the Matrix of illusion that holds your senses captive.
Once you do . you too will have the wisdom of God that comes only through the Holy Spirit. Saved By grace through Faith. Just like seeing a new color.... can't explain it to a transient caught in the matrix of worldly deception.
You will also see how the world suppresses this information and distorts it
You're all smart people . I tell the truth. Its hard to think out of the box when earthly thinking is the box.
It’s a personal free experience you can do it free anytime.
Don't wait till you are about to die.. START PUTTING YOUR TREASURES WHERE THEY REALLY MATTER >
It’s awesome… and it’s just between you and Jesus..
"A thought to consider without a typical ego response"
Your posts reek of ego so the rest of it is moot, especially since you keep posting this garbage over and over again. LOL!
Show's over folks. Nothing to see. Move along.
These aren't the droids we're looking for. He can go about his business. Move along.
Prayer changes things. .
~Prayer doesn’t not; you are such a LIAR. You have NO proof it changes anything! A great example of prayer proven not to work is the Christians in jail because prayer didn't work and their children died. For example: Susan Grady, who relied on prayer to heal her son. Nine-year-old Aaron Grady died and Susan Grady was arrested.
An article in the Journal of Pediatrics examined the deaths of 172 children from families who relied upon faith healing from 1975 to 1995. They concluded that four out of five ill children, who died under the care of faith healers or being left to prayer only, would most likely have survived if they had received medical care.
The statistical studies from the nineteenth century and the three CCU studies on prayer are quite consistent with the fact that humanity is wasting a huge amount of time on a procedure that simply doesn’t work. Nonetheless, faith in prayer is so pervasive and deeply rooted, you can be sure believers will continue to devise future studies in a desperate effort to confirm their beliefs!.~.
Poor, desperate phony just sayin. The desert heat must be getting to you. God bless
"I have the same amount proof that you have for your god"
"As suspected a liar and a blowhard, mouth flatulence"
You shouldn't talk about your god that way.
It is pretty interesting how most of the commentors on the Belief Blog are atheists. It is because they actually do believe in God.
No, it's because we enjoy coming here and poking fun at the bibletard fundies.
DERP
I also enjoy the not so intelligent comments like the one you just made. It seems like you don't know how much of a fundie you yourself sound like.
Nii
Why don't you go talk to a snake.
Are u better than a talking snake? I have my doubts. Maybe you can convince me.... Lol
Does that mean the Christian commentators are really atheists ?
No, CJ, it's at least partly because Christian fundiots vote and impact the laws that the rest of us have to live by in ways that are detrimental to our lives and freedoms, so we need to speak up against excessive religious influence at every opportunity.
Ask the questions. Break the chains. Join the movement. Be free of Christianity and other superstitions.
http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/
"I have my doubts. Maybe you can convince me.... Lol"
I have doubts about talking snakes, magic apples, virgin births, talking mules, walking on water, living in whales, the dead rising......etc etc etc.
Maybe you can convince me?
What a silly waste of time. Upsetting that taxpayers have to pay for security for these bozos. Why not spend that time working at a food bank, animal shelter or child care center? When will thumpers accept that we are all simply here, alone-together and must make THIS world the best we can. Religion and Reality will never mix.
I AM SO TIRED OF YOU ATHEISTS MOCKING AND MARGINALIZING MY BELIEFS. CNN – IT SEEMS TO ME AS IF THIS IS YOUR INTENTION; TO ALLOW ANTI-GOD, ANTI-RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS ON YOUR WEBSITE TO PROMULGATE YOUR OWN AGENDA. I HAVE BEEN A LOYAL LISTENER AND CNN WATCHER, BUT THIS HAS MADE ME WALK AWAY. THESE PEOPLE DON'T SPEAK FOR ALL OF US. THEY ARE DISCRIMINATING AND HATING AS BADLY AS ANYONE ELSE THEY POINT AT IN SOCIETY. JESUS LOVES YOU TOO...
@Ron
You said, "I AM SO TIRED OF YOU ATHEISTS MOCKING AND MARGINALIZING MY BELIEFS."
Maybe you should reconsider your beliefs.
You said, "CNN – IT SEEMS TO ME AS IF THIS IS YOUR INTENTION; TO ALLOW ANTI-GOD, ANTI-RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS ON YOUR WEBSITE TO PROMULGATE YOUR OWN AGENDA."
Their "agenda" is to draw readers. Their agenda is to make money from advertisements.
You said, "THESE PEOPLE DON'T SPEAK FOR ALL OF US."
No, just for the rational part.
You said, "THEY ARE DISCRIMINATING AND HATING AS BADLY AS ANYONE ELSE THEY POINT AT IN SOCIETY."
Showing how infantile, unreasonable and irrational a belief in gods is isn't hate. It's a public service.
Infantile? Your reply post shows insult and no regard for anyone or anything unlike you – but yet you are the liberals? Ironic and idiotic double standards.
Amazing – call yourselves reasonable and call me infantile, while you are the one who seems to denounce and insult whatever it is that is different from you. Yet – you are the liberals?? What a laugh. Ironic and idiotic double standards.
@Ron. CNN is mainly interested in getting people to read their page. And to their credit, they put a lot of quality religious articles on their site. And yes, there are great numbers of commentators who think that their "service to society" is to mock any faith based articles. So be it. Simply read the articles and skip the comments. I sometimes read them, sometimes not, but always expect on CNN.com to get a healthy number of, "you might as well be worshiping the tooth fairy" and such comments of similar "depth." There is some wheat in the chaff though if you can let it roll off like water off a duck's back.
@Ron
You said, "Infantile?"
How else would call a belief in the Tooth Fairy or Santa Clause? A belief in gods is no different.
You said, "Your reply post shows insult and no regard for anyone or anything unlike you"
While I respect your right to hold the silly beliefs you obviously do, those beliefs don't deserve the same.
You said, "but yet you are the liberals? Ironic and idiotic double standards"
Who said anything about being liberal? Being atheist isn't the same as being liberal.
@Tom Paine
You said, "but always expect on CNN.com to get a healthy number of, "you might as well be worshiping the tooth fairy" and such comments of similar "depth.""
While you may not like the comparison, I have yet to hear an argument that shows it to be inaccurate. Just claiming that it lacks depth doesn't do anything to disprove it. While most will readily agree that the Tooth Fairy is a myth, god for which there is equal evidence don't get dismissed. It's simply a double standard.
You said, "There is some wheat in the chaff though if you can let it roll off like water off a duck's back."
True, you could just ignore the reasonable (but I admit, somewhat insulting) comments, or you could use it to evaluate what it is that makes you believe in a being for which there is no evidence.
"I AM SO TIRED OF YOU ATHEISTS MOCKING AND MARGINALIZING MY BELIEFS"
Well, you believe in talking snakes, virgin births, rib women, magic apples, dead people who come back to life, people who live inside whales, walking on water, massive boats with two of every animal aboard, horned god beasts, and a flat 6000 year old earth.
Yet you expect to be taken seriously?
@ Ron. See what I mean? The answer is not to play the bull when they want to pull out their red capes. People who honestly seek answers do not tend to dialog on here but it does attract people who think their arguments prove their supposed intellectual superiority.
@Tom Paine, @Ron
It is much more comfortable to just plug your ears, close your eyes and remain ignorant, than to honestly evaluate why you believe what you believe. Your religious leader prefer you that way. They'd be out of a job if too many of their flock would actually question their beliefs.
Odds are that you believe what your parents told you when you were growing up. The only reason you shed your belief in Santa, yet clung to your belief in your god, is because when you were told Santa wasn't real, your parents didn't insist he was. Your god didn't receive the same courtesy.
TOM PAINE
I love your submission. Pretty much the situation here! A typical example is LinCA who felt compelled to post as he saw himself described. They do not understand basically that all learning is by Man and it helps to know and understand all rather than marginalise the most helpful part.
Have a good one Nii! 🙂 I enjoy reading your posts.
@Nii
You said, "A typical example is LinCA who felt compelled to post as he saw himself described."
No, not described, but misrepresented. I realize that someone who hasn't reasoned himself, or herself, into a particular position, isn't likely to be reasoned out of it. I realize that most believers that post here aren't going to shed their silly beliefs because of what I tell them. Most either aren't willing (Like Tom Paine), or apparently unable (like Ron) to formulate a counter argument.
You said, "They do not understand basically that all learning is by Man and it helps to know and understand all rather than marginalise the most helpful part."
Knowledge comes from evidence. Understanding comes from piecing evidence into a cohesive theory. Insight comes from understanding what the theories predict. Faith yields no evidence. There is no knowledge, understanding or insight gained by taking things on faith alone.
LINCA
As a scientist I weep when you keep trying to use subjective legal arguements to promote your worldview while mangling science and religion in the process. Science is objective and does not use the same rules of evidence as Law. Its rules of evidence are closer to religion's rules of evidence.
@Nii
You said, "As a scientist [...]"
ROFLMAO
You said, "Its rules of evidence are closer to religion's rules of evidence."
You've got to be kidding me, right? The only "rule of evidence" for religion is "because I said so".
LinCA
Jesus said the only proof we will receive is the witness and testimony from those whose lives have been transformed. I am one whose life has been changed and consider myself born again. This process has been repeated since Jesus hundreds of millions of times. Tell me why this empirical evidence is not acceptable. I understand why you do not have knowledge or insight into the nature of God but, fail to understand how you completely discount this massive consistent volume of data.
Psst, Ron, shouting at us in all caps isn't helping you make your case for your superstition. Not that there is any case there to be made.
Ask the questions. Break the chains. Join the movement. Be free of Christianity and other superstitions.
http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/
fred, you seem to lack any concept of what the term "evidence" means.
Explain in detail how your life has been changed such that it proves that a divine entity was involved, and what other reasons you have that support that case. Your vagueness ain't helping your case so far, and your claim of millions is vapid if none of those millions of people have proof of divine influence. Millions of people once thought the earth was flat too (and perhaps you still do...)
Ask the questions. Break the chains. Join the movement. Be free of Christianity and other superstitions.
http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/
Bob
Jesus himself said no evidence will given you except the sign of Jonah so if a Christian comes up with one it would prove God a liar. Jesus also said the only proof will be the witness and testimony of saved lives which is what we see today. That witness and testimony is given by a few these days the rest lose their testimony and only witness to the fact they are just like non believers. So I agree with you we blew it and destroyed the only evidence we were given. So today I for one will try and be a witness and testimony to the truth that the Word of God is the power to change lives. Assuming people begin to notice that there is something good and desirable in that Christian I just met we could begin to build a case, yes?
So, tell me if you met some kind soul that loved you for who you were and went out of his or her way to be of service helping and encouraging you would that be a testimony to the truth of God ?
@fred
You said, "Jesus said the only proof we will receive is the witness and testimony from those whose lives have been transformed."
Very convenient. In other words, only those that already believe will believe. Well, duh. Unfortunately that holds no persuasive powers for those that don't already believe.
You said, "I am one whose life has been changed and consider myself born again."
Fine. Good for you. You are free to believe that whatever changed you was caused by your imaginary friend.
You said, "This process has been repeated since Jesus hundreds of millions of times. Tell me why this empirical evidence is not acceptable."
– Because it tends to happen to those already indoctrinated by the faith that they are "changed" by.
– Because it happens to believers in all religions. Are all these religions equally true?
– Because if there was a real god, why doesn't it happen to everyone? Why would he withhold this from a part of his own creation (the more intelligent part, I might add)?
Show me a study of people who had that experience without having any prior knowledge of your religion. Show me that this happens to people who know nothing of your Jesus. I doubt you will find any. If your friend really exists, why would he exclude those that haven't heard about him?
You said, "I understand why you do not have knowledge or insight into the nature of God"
That's where you are wrong. I understand gods pretty well. It is pretty obvious how they came to be and what their uses are.
Gods were invented to provide "answers" to questions beyond the capacity of primitive man, and provide power to those doing the speaking for the gods. Gods are used to control the masses.
You said, "but, fail to understand how you completely discount this massive consistent volume of data."
Just because it is data, doesn't mean it is evidence of your god.
LinCA
I said: "Jesus said the only proof we will receive is the witness and testimony from those whose lives have been transformed." Which means those who have been saved and transformed by Christ will tell others about what they experienced and speak of the Glory of God. This does not mean you will believe it just means this is the only proof Jesus said will be given to non believers. I have no idea how you came up with your reply “Very convenient. In other words, only those that already believe will believe.”
“Because it tends to happen to those already indoctrinated by the faith that they are "changed" by.”
=>Ok, why do you get to us broad statements like this yet you attack others and claim it is not acceptable proof. By your own definition your statement is not acceptable proof.
“ Because it happens to believers in all religions. Are all these religions equally true?”
=>Jesus said He is the way the truth and the life and no one comes to the Father but through Him. We are not specifically told how Jesus will reach out to the others that did not have the advantage of a Christ centered culture. The overall impression is that God will give everyone the full opportunity to accept or reject the offer of eternal life in Christ. The answer is no there is one true God and all religions are not equal.
“Because if there was a real god, why doesn't it happen to everyone? Why would he withhold this from a part of his own creation (the more intelligent part, I might add)?”
=>We are not told we only know that some people are sought out by God as with Saul of Tarsus.
“ If your friend really exists, why would he exclude those that haven't heard about him?”
=>There is an example where Jesus goes back to the souls of old that did not have the opportunity and explains what was going on. We are told if that will happen for the current generation. My guess is no since we were given the holy spirit to guide us. Once again the Bible states no one comes to the Lord unless they are drawn. I have witnessed people from atheist homes, Jewish and Muslim believers convert to Christianity. There has not been a study that I am aware of.
“I understand gods pretty well. It is pretty obvious how they came to be and what their uses are.”
=>once again you get to use broad unsupported common sense to explain away God yet I cannot use broad common sense to explain my personal witness.
“Gods were invented to provide "answers" to questions beyond the capacity of primitive man, and provide power to those doing the speaking for the gods.”
=>You must be about ready to convert because I notice your arguments are beginning to sound more and more like mine. How do you get away with it?
“ Gods are used to control the masses.”
=>right out of the communist play book without any explanation on how the masses will be controlled once God is dead.
LINCA
Ah yes! Its even worse cos science goes like "cos I think so!". Look we scientists study everything n grade it into different levels based on our ability to test that info. We make objective observations but subjective interpretations. There are fish we thought were fossils n have rediscovered
fred, thanks for demonstrating that you don't have any evidence. Nice try at changing the subject and obfuscating, but you failed. You are of course welcome to try again, but, well, no evidence details = no points.
Ask the questions. Break the chains. Join the movement. Be free of Christianity and other superstitions.
http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/
@Nii
You may have missed my earlier point when I said, "ROFLMAO", in response to you claiming to be a scientists. It means "rolling on the floor, laughing my ass off". If you're a scientist, I'm Santa.
You said, "There are fish we thought were fossils n have rediscovered"
I'm guessing that you mean that we've discovered live examples of fish we thought was extinct. If that's what you mean, that still doesn't make a religious argument valid.
@fred
Your "my conversion is proof of Jesus" argument doesn't fly because it doesn't happen to people who don't already know about the dude. Only those that don't have any prior knowledge could be considered evidence. until you can show there are any, your argument doesn't hold water.
Furthermore, unless you are willing to accept every religion that has similar stories as equally true, how do you explain this same phenomenon in those other religions? Also, wouldn't it mean that christianity is incorrect if even one christian gives up his faith?
Isn't it far more likely that cultural influences cause believers to associate some experience they have with what they've been indoctrinated to believe? There is plenty of evidence that people can be influenced to believe almost anything (advertising wouldn't work, if they couldn't). Even rational people can be influenced. In short, there are far more reasonable explanations for the experiences that you claim as divine, that don't require magic.
Throughout history, leaders have exploited every angle they could to increase their power. Claiming divine guidance has been a very effective way. That doesn't mean that it's real. Again, earthly power is a far more reasonable explanation for gods, as it doesn't require magic.
The fact that there are simple, rational explanations for the phenomena that you claim to be divine doesn't necessarily mean that you are incorrect. It just means that you have a larger burden of proof. You'll have to show some evidence of the magic. Until you do, there really is no reason to assume that there is any magic going on.
LinCA
As you know the Bible has an excuse when a Christian gives up their faith which is “they were not committed in the first place for the right reason”. You are correct in that once a person is saved they will be provided for (as in the case of LOT). The fall back position is we are not to judge because we do not know their true status at any time.
There are many cases of Jewish believers that come to Christ. Most people have heard of this Jesus so it is difficult to get a group that would have no knowledge of Christ. There are the missionary reports where natives are saved or born again as well as other remote cultures that are introduced to Christ. So, yes there are examples of people without prior knowledge that come to Christ.
Just as there are many weight loss programs there are many “god” programs where the words contained will cause the desired effect. Just because Jenny Craig works and so does Weight Watchers does not mean your Yoga For Life program is not the real McCoy when it comes to weight loss. The existence of other religions is the result of different cultures not different gods as there is but one God.
@fred
You said, "As you know the Bible has [...]"
Do you see me quote from Harry Potter? Or from the Brothers Grimm fairy tales? There is a reason for that. Fairy tales add nothing to the discussion.
You said, "So, yes there are examples of people without prior knowledge that come to Christ."
But unless they convert to christianity before someone tells them about it, that proves nothing.
You said, "The existence of other religions is the result of different cultures not different gods as there is but one God."
Then how can you possibly know if you are doing it right? If there is only one, and he lets one group of his followers kill another, he's got more than a few screws loose. If there is only one, he is one piss poor communicator. Not worthy of worship by any stretch of the imagination.
“If there is only one, and he lets one group of his followers kill another, he's got more than a few screws loose.”
=>Unfortunately, if you believe the Bible and Harry Potter are on the same level what’s the use discussing why God allows one group to kill another. Even if you could understand the complete explanation from the biblical viewpoint as presented it is all nonsense. Why bother detailing why Potter’s saving moments came from the light and evil was veiled in darkness. It’s just a kid’s story.
“If there is only one, he is one pi-ss poor communicator.”
=>sorry, the picture is very clear God has offered you the choice to accept or reject Christ. Why guess about what God offered other people in other times or lands? 90%+ of the World is aware of the choice and each makes their own call. Sorry, God did not create the world to your specifications.
@fred
Without so much as a single shred of evidence to support the existence of your god, your bible is nothing more than a collection of tribal myths, and tale about the life of some dude that believed them. It is so horrendously inconsistent and filled with errors that there can be little doubt that it is all make believe. It never ceases to amazes me that there are adults that fail to see that.
You said, "sorry, the picture is very clear God has offered you the choice to accept or reject Christ."
Considering that there is no evidence to back up your claim that there are any gods, let alone yours, my ability to reject nonsense isn't likely to be of divine nature.
You said, "Why guess about what God offered other people in other times or lands? 90%+ of the World is aware of the choice and each makes their own call."
Even among his followers in the US there are thousands of different denominations, sects and cults. If there is only one gods, he fucked up, and appears to be indifferent about it.
If there is a god, he must not give a shit about his creation. Yet, according to some, he will judge us after we die, and torment us for eternity if we used our brains, followed the evidence (or the lack thereof), and came to the wrong conclusion. The term "monster" doesn't even start to describe such a creature.
You said, "Sorry, God did not create the world to your specifications."
It is extremely unlikely that any gods were involved in it at all.
LinCA
“Without so much as a single shred of evidence to support the existence of your god”
=>We have the history of man that has worshiped God and attempted to make representations of that God in the form of manmade gods which points to something. Like a compass that pointed North long before we figured out why. Evidence was that something was there that called out the needle. We have plenty of evidence that something calls man to seek God you are simply demanding that the evidence is made of matter that can be tested by your rules.
You are looking for the origin of life because you know that there is one. You simply prefer the 2,000 year old monument of the Greeks to their unknown God while we prefer by faith to accept the unknown.
“your bible is nothing more than a collection of tribal myths, and tale about the life of some dude that believed them”
=>myths do not produce observable results in the present. We have conversions. We have the two sons of Abraham fighting to this day as mentioned in the Bible 3,400 years ago. We have the Nation if Israel God promised to bring through to the end still around today.
“ It is so horrendously inconsistent and filled with errors that there can be little doubt that it is all make believe.”
=>this is not so and every one of the Dawkins claims touted by atheists has been proven unfounded.
“ It never ceases to amazes me that there are adults that fail to see that.”
=>90%+ of the population over the past 3,000 years saw what you fail to see. Hum……..sounds like it is time to bring back the witch burnings so that number can get back up to 99.9%. Memo to homeland security………….just kidding.
@fred
You said, "We have the history of man that has worshiped God and attempted to make representations of that God in the form of manmade gods which points to something. Like a compass that pointed North long before we figured out why. Evidence was that something was there that called out the needle. We have plenty of evidence that something calls man to seek God you are simply demanding that the evidence is made of matter that can be tested by your rules."
Argumentum ad populum. It is very comforting to belong to a group that believes like you do. That doesn't mean the beliefs hold water. Also, as I mentioned earlier, gods are a pretty easy way to explain what can't be explained by other means (at the time). Especially for tribal leaders, it is far more useful to claim to have special knowledge, and converse with a god, then to have to say "I don't know yet, but we'll work on that".
The same is still true today. People often just want an answer. They don't particularly care whether it is true. Most don't have the capacity to distinguish one from the other, anyway. Have you ever noticed that in murder cases, especially when it is a particularly gruesome one, the public is demanding justice? Any conviction will do. It doesn't matter a whole lot if the suspect is actually guilty.
You said, "You are looking for the origin of life because you know that there is one. You simply prefer the 2,000 year old monument of the Greeks to their unknown God while we prefer by faith to accept the unknown."
In other words, I'll tend to believe evidence based science, while you believe a fairy tale.
You said, "myths do not produce observable results in the present. We have conversions."
We went over this already. Your conversions don't count until you find some that happened to people who had no prior knowledge of your fairy tale.
You said, "We have the two sons of Abraham fighting to this day as mentioned in the Bible 3,400 years ago."
You lost me there, but if you think some old geezers arguing is evidence your bible is correct, you must not go to retirement homes often.
You said, "We have the Nation if Israel God promised to bring through to the end still around today."
Very much a self-fulfilling prophesy.
You said, "this is not so and every one of the Dawkins claims touted by atheists has been proven unfounded."
You haven't read it then, I imagine.
You said, "90%+ of the population over the past 3,000 years saw what you fail to see."
Argumentum ad populum again. The higher number of believers in a particular story don't lend it more credence. Validity of a theory isn't established by how many people believe it, but by the evidence that supports it.
Also, in centuries past it could be very hazardous to your health if you didn't follow church doctrine, much less if you actively went against it. The religious organizations were very powerful and didn't shy away from violence to ensure everybody believed.
Open societies and the progress of science will continue to erode those numbers. Having the freedom to practice your religion as you see fit, will be instrumental in it's undoing. There will come a day that believers will be a mere fringe group.
LinCA
"We went over this already. Your conversions don't count until you find some that happened to people who had no prior knowledge of your fairy tale."
=> Missionary indoctrinations to primitive tribes count? Jewish people who claim Jesus did not exist count? Atheists count?
""We have the two sons of Abraham fighting to this day as mentioned in the Bible 3,400 years ago."
You lost me there, but if you think some old geezers arguing is evidence your bible is correct, you must not go to retirement homes often.""
=>No, I was referring to God when he said he would bless the children of Isaac (Jewish) and Ishmael (Arabs) and they would be great nations but, the one will kick against the other. My point was they fight to this day as stated thousands of years ago. One is the son God promised and the other the son Abraham made because he did not trust Gods promise.
@fred
You said, "Missionary indoctrinations to primitive tribes count? Jewish people who claim Jesus did not exist count? Atheists count?"
Anyone who has been previously exposed to the fairy tale can't be shown to not be biased (even those claiming to be atheists). Only those that can be shown not to have any prior knowledge can possibly be considered as having been converted based on divine intervention.
You said, "No, I was referring to God when he said he would bless the children of Isaac (Jewish) and Ishmael (Arabs) and they would be great nations but, the one will kick against the other. My point was they fight to this day as stated thousands of years ago. One is the son God promised and the other the son Abraham made because he did not trust Gods promise."
I knew that, but could think of a snarky comment.
Pretty lame though that your god isn't able or willing to stop the bloodshed. It's almost like he doesn't even exist.
LinCA
It seems like he does not exist but, how would we know since we have never experienced a world order without God’s hand in it.
I think we both know the various arguments as to why God does not present evidence that atheists and Christians would find irrefutable.
Now, whether you believe the Bible true or not why do you conclude it presents the vision of God as; killer, incompetent psychopath? This is the opposite of what the Bible presents. Some call the Bible a love story, a story of hope, revelation of Gods compassion and love etc. It is a story of God redeeming a people and it is presented in the harsh reality of what the writers saw. A prime example would be the flood story where I see God bringing Noah’s family to safety over a troubled sea caused by depraved human sin. Gods ultimate judgment of a wicked world and those who found God. Certainly just like any hero plot evil is defeated and good protected. Why would your take away be that God is a killer?
If it is but a tale then why not conclude that when Moses ordered the killing of all Amalekites women, children because "god said" he was just using "God" to strengthen the cause or assumed that is what God wanted as with some of the crusades? An endless bunch of conjecter ....................but, why always a negative take on God from you?
@fred
You said, "It seems like he does not exist but, how would we know since we have never experienced a world order without God’s hand in it."
Natural processes. But even if someone doesn't know how stuff happened, doesn't mean your fantasy suddenly is true.
You said, "I think we both know the various arguments as to why God does not present evidence that atheists and Christians would find irrefutable."
Yup, because he doesn't exist. That's pretty obvious.
You said, "Now, whether you believe the Bible true or not why do you conclude it presents the vision of God as; killer, incompetent psychopath? This is the opposite of what the Bible presents."
You may want to read it again. In particular the Old Testament. Also, his alleged punishment for an "infraction" as small as not believing he exists, puts him well beyond any monster ever to roam the Earth. The unjust punishment he is said to inflict, makes psychopaths like Stalin, Hitler and Pol Pot look like sissies.
You said, "Some call the Bible a love story, a story of hope, revelation of Gods compassion and love etc. It is a story of God redeeming a people and it is presented in the harsh reality of what the writers saw."
Some just call a duck, a duck. Some just call the bible what it obviously is, a fairy tale, and not a very nice one.
You said, "A prime example would be the flood story where I see God bringing Noah’s family to safety over a troubled sea caused by depraved human sin. Gods ultimate judgment of a wicked world and those who found God. Certainly just like any hero plot evil is defeated and good protected. Why would your take away be that God is a killer?"
He is a vicious murderer because he allegedly killed the entire population for being as he made them. Your god is a major fuck-up, and a psychopath to boot.
You said, "If it is but a tale then why not conclude that when Moses ordered the killing of all Amalekites women, children because "god said" he was just using "God" to strengthen the cause or assumed that is what God wanted as with some of the crusades? An endless bunch of conjecter ....................but, why always a negative take on God from you?"
I guess I'm put off by your imaginary friend because of all the evil that is done is his name.
Ok see ya on some other post after I finsh reading the Bible looking for a monster that died so we can get to a perfect place where he wipes away all tears.
mi amore!
ONLY FOR NEW MEMBERS
Jesus was an illiterate Jewish peasant/carpenter/simple preacher man who suffered from hallucinations (or “mythicizing” from P, M, M, L and J) and who has been characterized anywhere from the Messiah from Nazareth to a mythical character from mythical Nazareth to a ma-mzer from Nazareth (Professor Bruce Chilton, in his book Rabbi Jesus). An-alyses of Jesus’ life by many contemporary NT scholars (e.g. Professors Ludemann, Crossan, Borg and Fredriksen, ) via the NT and related doc-uments have concluded that only about 30% of Jesus' sayings and ways noted in the NT were authentic. The rest being embellishments (e.g. miracles)/hallucinations made/had by the NT authors to impress various Christian, Jewish and Pagan sects.
The 30% of the NT that is "authentic Jesus" like everything in life was borrowed/plagiarized and/or improved from those who came before. In Jesus' case, it was the ways and sayings of the Babylonians, Greeks, Persians, Egyptians, Hitt-ites, Canaanites, OT, John the Baptizer and possibly the ways and sayings of traveling Greek Cynics.
earlychristianwritings.com/theories.html
For added "pizzazz", Catholic theologians divided god the singularity into three persons and invented atonement as an added guilt trip for the "pew people" to go along with this trinity of overseers. By doing so, they made god the padre into god the "filicider".
Current RCC problems:
Pedophiliac priests, an all-male, mostly white hierarchy, atonement theology and original sin!!!!
2 b., Luther, Calvin, Joe Smith, Henry VIII, Wesley, Roger Williams, the Great “Babs” et al, founders of Christian-based religions or combination religions also suffered from the belief in/hallucinations of "pretty wingie thingie" visits and "prophecies" for profits analogous to the myths of Catholicism (resurrections, apparitions, ascensions and immacu-late co-nceptions).
Current problems:
Adulterous preachers, pedophiliac clerics, "propheteering/ profiteering" evangelicals and atonement theology,
What a waste of time; you would be better served by reading the Constiution, Stepen Hawking, Darwin or even J.K. Rowlingl or JRR Tolkien. How blind and automatomic has this country become? Drone on bible thumpers!
Why do atheists come to a religion blog? Is it because deep in your hearts you are searching for the truth? Truth that you are simply too blind or too proud to see?
@John
You said, "Why do atheists come to a religion blog?"
I can't speak for all atheists, but I come here because it is entertaining.
You said, "Is it because deep in your hearts you are searching for the truth?"
Doesn't every reasonable person want to know the truth?
Truth that you are simply too blind or too proud to see?
You mean the "truth" that is unsupported by any evidence? The "truth" that can only be had it you already believe it? The "truth" of talking snakes and zombies?
No religion has the truth. They are mutually exclusive.
"Why do atheists come to a religion blog?"
Because it is fun to come here and make light of you bible tards.
"Why do atheists come to a religion blog?"
Why did bible-thumpers send lawyers into my children's schools, then attempt to force public schools is several states to teach fantasy as "science"? Why do bible-thumpers post bible quotes on scientific websites as "explanations" to scientific phenomena, then argue their dogma as "truth"?
Well, there's ninety wasted hours you'll never get back.
Scientific FACT:
Women have smaller brains and are terrible at critical analysis of any subject. God gave them smaller brains so they would be more obedient. Defiance is a result of stupidity and usually results in aggressive behavior in response.
Scientific FACT:
Your mom blew goats for a penny-a-head-or-a-buck-a-herd during her pregnancy, and that is why you are such a tard.
Mark: You know who my husband is from these blogs. As wonderfully intelligent as he is, I do not obey him. He is my partner and my best friend but he is most certainly not in any way in control of me as a person. We work together and make all decisions together.
Anyone who lives under the type of control where they must 'obey' is in an abusive relationship and needs to seek help.
So to add to the long list of definitions for who you are, we can now add se.xist pig. Way to show your good christard side!
Collection plates indicate the absence of any actual power that the god they are "intended for" has. In all cases they can't even take the money themselves, but need mere mortals to spend it for them. .
Collection plates, in and of themselves, should have been a clear indicator that religion is a fraud, to anyone who isn't stupid.
Why do you need to give the church money.
Can't they just pray to some cash?
It's like the bullet proof pope mobile.
Can't god even protect the pope?
All powerful my as s.
true, true
Religion, the ultimate ponzi scheme
true true
testing this connection
I believe that gods came from man's imagination. However, I recognize a lot of people believe in gods and all the lore associated with them.
I assume it makes them feel good to think they have a personal relationship with THE all powerful creator of the universe who loves them and will protect them.
Their beliefs and values are aligned with god, therefore they must be 100% right.
When they die, they get to go to heaven for eternal bliss.
Finally, they have the satisfaction of knowing all those who doubted them will suffer god's eternal wrath.
In the end, religious belief is really all about ME, ME, and, ME.
Great! On you way to becoming like muslim extremists and.... Al Qaeda. Already starting to see it in the Southern US.
Moving the heck out of here sooner rather than later watching these reigions people. Soon Amerika will be intolerant like the the Middle-East.
Easy steps to starting a successful religion.
First, the rules:
Rule number 1: Believe or else
Rule number 2: See rule number 1.
Rule number 3: See rule number 1.
NEXT: Convince vulnerable, prospective devotees that they are worthless trash; sinners, who are certain to burn in hell and suffer the brutality of their loving god's wrath because they deserve it.
NEXT: After the vulnerable prospective devotees have been sufficiently pounded down by indoctrination on top of life's many other challenges, offer them a "get out of hell free" pass.
HOW TO OBTAIN "GET OUT OF HELL FREE" PASS: See rule number 1.
Well said!
End Religion. Grow a brain. Be spiritual if you must, but can't you people se your religion is destroying the world, By it's very nature it is segregation and pushes people apart.
Jesus was a fanny bandit.
That explains why all the apostles were men.