Can 'true Catholics' support same-sex marriage?
Ex-priest Jim Smith, opponent of Minnesota's ballot to ban same-sex marriages, says these are difficult days to be Catholic.
June 20th, 2012
09:35 AM ET

Can 'true Catholics' support same-sex marriage?

By Chris Welch, CNN

Minneapolis (CNN) - Jim Smith is a former Roman Catholic priest who left his post with the church 10 years ago. He's an ex-priest for several reasons, he says, but one of his main concerns was the church's stance against same-sex marriage and other LGBT issues.

But Smith remains a Catholic - though he says being a Catholic who actively campaigns for legalized same-sex marriages can be difficult these days.

"I'd much rather this wasn't happening," Smith says of the division that the issue has created among Minnesota  Catholics. "But it does provide some real opportunities because it challenges us to talk to each other, Catholics talking to other Catholics."

Minnesota has become the newest epicenter in the same-sex marriage fight. This November, voters will decide whether they want an amendment added to the state's constitution that would ban marriage between members of the same sex.

Smith will be voting "no." And he has helped spearhead efforts in the state to persuade other Catholics to do the same.

A group he helped form,  Catholics for Marriage Equality-Minnesota, aims "to encourage Catholics to consider the profound sacredness of same-gender relationships and to defeat this marriage amendment," Smith says.

Vatican edicts against same-sex marriage often give Catholic same-sex marriage supporters the impression they're in the minority.

Related story: Same-sex marriage by the numbers 

But a recent poll by the Public Religion Research Institute (PRRI) suggests 59% of American Catholics support rights allowing gay and lesbian couples to legally marry. One reason behind that statistic - says PRRI CEO Robert P. Jones - is because U.S. Catholics "overwhelmingly reject the idea that sexual orientation can be changed." A PRRI poll bears that out – with 69% of Catholics nationwide saying a person's sexual orientation cannot be changed.

In the Midwest alone, Catholics are evenly divided on the issue of same-sex marriage -– with 46% in favor, 47% against.

Opinion: GOP support for same-sex marriage growing

Related story: Both sides re-energized for upcoming same-sex marriage fight

Like Jim Smith, Michelle LaFrance is a Catholic who has also taken the bold step against the church in support of marriage equality.

"I remember thinking 'wow, maybe I shouldn't [remain a Catholic],' " LaFrance said. Ultimately they've remained with the Catholic faith, citing its many positive aspects including going to church. It's an important weekly ritual for LaFrance, her husband and their three kids.

"The Catholic Church, despite the media [attention] it typically gets, does a lot of great things, a lot of great social justice," LaFrance said. She noted the church "feeds the poor, houses the homeless, takes care of the abused."

The LaFrance family belongs to the Church of St. Margaret Mary in the Minneapolis suburb of Golden Valley, a congregation which LaFrance describes as fairly progressive. She says the majority of her fellow parishioners agree with her stance on same-sex marriage.

But when LaFrance hears the archdiocese telling people how they should think about it, she can't help but sometimes feel like less of a Catholic.

"I don't think anybody - whatever their religious denomination - whole-heartedly follows every single rule down to the letter."

Related story: U.S. history of same-sex marriage

On the other side of the debate stands Dave Deavel.

Although he agrees with LaFrance to an extent, he says he believes there are certain pillars of the Catholic faith that people should follow. One of those is the church stance that marriage should remain between one man and one woman.

"The whole point of what the church teaches is to form people's consciences," Deavel says.

For Deavel, his wife and their five children, attending church is so important they strive to go multiple times a week.

He's active with Minnesota for Marriage, which supports of the same-sex-marriage ban, and has written various blog posts on the topic for the Minnesota Catholic Conference.

Asked whether he believes a person can be "less of a Catholic" for disagreeing with the church, Deavel says the Vatican "doesn't really have a certain category for 'less of a Catholic.' "

"But they certainly don't represent what the church teaches," he said. "Is it a spiritual problem? I think yes."

Opinion: The secret gay agenda

In a written statement the MCC said groups such as Catholics for Marriage Equality "do not have any right to call their organizations 'Catholic.'"

In the past, the conference has issued statements accusing Catholics for Marriage Equality of trying "to confuse Catholics and the public about authentic church teaching" on marriage.

"Catholics for Marriage Equality MN attempts to convince Catholics that they can be in good standing with the church and oppose church teaching about human sexuality and marriage, which centers on the complementarity of the sexes and the mutual self-gift of loving spouses in marital union," said an MCC statement.

The Archdiocese of St. Paul and Minneapolis declined CNN's request for an interview, but it agreed with sentiments expressed by the Minnesota Catholic Conference.

Does church doctrine make it impossible for same-sex marriage supporters to be true Catholics?

"There is no judgment intended about an individual's 'Catholicity' or 'Catholic-ness,' " says MCC spokeswoman Jessica Zittlow.

Minnesota's November ballot proposal to ban same-sex marriage isn't an amendment against LGBT individuals, say the MCC and the St. Paul and Minneapolis Archdiocese. Instead, they say it should strictly be viewed as an amendment supporting traditional marriage.

For ex-priest Jim Smith, grappling with the issue has been difficult - a personal struggle that extends to the heart of his faith.

The inner conflict between what Smith believes is right and his love for the church has pushed him to consider leaving the Catholic religion altogether.

In the end, Smith vows he will stay. "It's in my bones."

- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: 2012 Election • Catholic Church • Christianity • Faith • Minnesota • Politics • Polls • Same-sex marriage

soundoff (2,849 Responses)
  1. p41

    "You cant serve GOD and mammon (man)." Being gay and stating that you serve GOD is a contradiction. " A sick man can't be an effective physician," to paraphrase a quote.

    June 25, 2012 at 10:36 am |
    • SoldierOfConscience

      Shhh these people dont want to hear the truth. all they want are new-agey liberal stuff.

      June 25, 2012 at 4:59 pm |
    • HawaiiGuest

      Gay people are only sick in your opinion, and the bigotry about gays has been on a decline as of late. Your bigotry is going the way of the bigotry that fueled racial segregation and bans on interracial marriage.

      June 25, 2012 at 5:01 pm |
    • sam stone

      so, sinners (in your mind) cannot serve god?

      June 28, 2012 at 9:52 am |
  2. Sage

    "Repeat a lie often enough and it becomes the truth"

    - Looks like some people are following this first axoim of propaganda

    June 24, 2012 at 8:50 pm |
    • Dorothy

      I know.....those conservative right wingers just won't give up.

      June 24, 2012 at 9:09 pm |
    • Dorothy

      I wouldn't worry about it too much, however......most Americans are smart enough to see through the bigotry and lies that they post about gays. The empiric data tells the truth and most Americans are smart enough to read and understand it. That's why gay marriage will ultimately become common place. That's why most Catholics are honest enough to support the truth. That is why most Catholics are scandalized by their hierarchy. The truth always wins out in the end.

      June 24, 2012 at 9:14 pm |
    • Sage

      But, for people who do not understand, they can be swayed. So when people post 'yes or no' questions like the one below from solderOf, somebody should respond. I dont know much about what he's saying but it doesnt seem right. I checked out the first "fact" posted, it was true. Mr Hay did support.... So?

      June 25, 2012 at 9:38 am |
    • Dorothy

      Soldier's little rants can easily be responded to with empirical data. The Journal of the American Medical Association published an article that showed that 90% of pedophiles are males and of that 98% of those were straight and 2% were gay. Recent stats also show that approximately 5-10% of the population is gay. Hence, while there are deviants in both groups, the statistics would indicate that the majority of deviants are in the straight community. Also, the American Psychological Association has recently published empirical studies that showed that children raised in gay households are psychologically as well adjusted as children raised in straight households. There orientation rates compare to those of the general population. Most educated people are going to follow empirical data rather than the anecdotal propaganda of the lunatic fringe.

      June 25, 2012 at 10:10 am |
    • Dorothy

      oops....their (not there) orientation rates......(too big of a hurry running off to work).

      June 25, 2012 at 10:12 am |
  3. SoldierOfConscience


    Oz is calling you. The ruby red slippers are waiting. Scratch that, actually, there is a new position : the witch of the north. HA HA!

    June 24, 2012 at 8:24 pm |
  4. Be

    Ewww......soldier boy.....I think you just got beat up by a girl!

    June 24, 2012 at 5:55 pm |
    • SoldierOfConscience


      So you think. This "girl" does not address any issues that I raise, just says that i'll turn my wife into a ...

      issues like "is it ok for boys to play with dolls?" yeah it was just once.. normally he is with other boys being a boy etc etc. SO I havent been beat up, just tantrumed (I know that is not a word). what girls normally do when they are lost for conversation.

      June 24, 2012 at 8:05 pm |
  5. Dorothy

    Catholic Hierarchy Agenda: 1. Keep clergy out of jail. 2. Control women's reproductive rights. 3. Protect assets from taxes and lawsuits.

    Gay Agenda: 1. Marriage – to live in legally recognized monogamous relationships. 2. Family – to be allowed to raise their children in a stable, loving home as a couple. 3. Service to country in the military.

    I believe God always sides with good. Seems like He's abandoned religion in favor of being gay.

    June 24, 2012 at 2:49 pm |
    • SoldierOfConscience

      (secret) gay agenda:
      a. get extra rights (e.g. 'anti-discrimmination')
      b. protect p3d0ph1les (e.g. 'Harry Hay', journal issue called 'male intergenerational intimacy'. one of the posters here posted references)
      c. corrupt society by destabilizing traditional marriage, enabling all kinds of others to get 'marriage'
      d. undermine all religion, thus destroying morality. which fits with their immoral agenda.
      e. push their ideas down our throats

      June 24, 2012 at 3:07 pm |
    • SoldierOfConscience

      YES/NO questions for Dorothy:

      1. Harry hay supported N*A*M*B*L*A? TRUE OR FALSE?
      2. The j0urn@l of h0m0s3xuaity had a SPECIAL DOUBLE issue called "male intergenerational intimacy". Said issue told to embrace p3d0s showing interest in one's son. TRUE OR FALSE?
      3. Mark Foley was a politican who s3xted young boys he had contact with. When caught, he resigned, said "sorry I did it coz im g@y. and headed into rehab. TRUE OR FALSE?
      4. A young boy learns how to be a MAN by looking at his father. TRUE OR FALSE?
      5. A young boy learns how to relate to women by seeing how his dad relates to his mom. TRUE OR FALSE?
      5. A young girl learns how to be a WOMAN by looking at her mom. TRUE OR FALSE?
      6. A young girl learns how to relate to men by seeing how her mom relates to dad. TRUE OR FALSE?
      7. Mr. Kodie from TLC show sistr wife has made noise about suing for recognition of polygamist lifestyle coz g@ys have it. TRUE OR FALSE?

      (credits to previous poster BIBLICAL for some of above points. I researched following his lead, and added some of my own)

      June 24, 2012 at 8:12 pm |
  6. SoldierOfConscience

    I came to know that one of the boys (lets call him Paul) who played with my son was adopted son of two g@ys

    SO this conversation played out (over a period of time, not at one go)

    ME to SON: Ask paul about his momma

    SON to PAUL: How's your momma

    PAUL TO SON: I dont have a momma

    SON to ME : Paul doesnt have a momma

    ME to SON: Isnt that sad? Dont you love having a momma?

    SON to ME : yes.

    ME to SON: You should tell Paul how sad you feel for him, since hes your friend

    SON to PAUL : I feel really sad for you that you dont have a momma

    PAUL to SON (angrily): I dont want a momma. my 2 daddies are great. go away. {within my earshot}

    SON to ME: Paul is very mean. I dont want to play with him

    ME to SON: Why?

    SON to ME: Is it OK to have two daddies?

    ME to SON : How many people other than Paul do you know having two daddies?

    SON to ME: (quiet for some time) None

    Mission accomplished!!

    June 24, 2012 at 12:06 pm |
    • Dorothy

      Yup.....you've convinced me....even though 99.9% of people are born with their se x ual orientation, you definitely could make your wife chose to be a lesbian.

      June 24, 2012 at 2:22 pm |
    • Dorothy

      Yup.....you've convinced me....a guy like you could definitely make a woman switch teams and become a lesbian.

      June 24, 2012 at 2:23 pm |
    • TrueBlueCatholic

      Thanx Soldier. you gave me a great idea on how to deal with my daughter being friends with this gal adopted by 2 l3zz1es.

      June 24, 2012 at 8:15 pm |
    • SoldierOfConscience

      TrueBlue, there is a part 2 of the story. (again, over time not on one coversation)

      SON to WIFE : Mommy, Paul was mean to me
      WIFE to SON : My, my.. just be nice and talk to him again ok?
      ME to SON (outside WIFE's earshot) : Next time you talk to Paul, tell him you asked him about his momma because you love your momma and want him to have a momma's love too
      SON to PAUL : i only asked you about your momma because i love my momma and think every kid needs a momma { I distract my wife with some topic, both of us are near when this happens}
      PAUL to SON : DONT TALK TO ME, you mean boy. go AWAY, stomps away
      WIFE to ME : What's wrong with that Paul?
      ME to WIFE : Dont know
      WIFE to ME : Im going to call up those two men and rescind Paul's invite to {SON}'s birthday party
      ME to WIFE : are you sure?
      WIFE to ME : yes I am

      Am I not brilliant???

      June 25, 2012 at 9:21 am |
  7. SoldierOfConscience

    Talking about gender roles, I saw my very young son playing with my niece's dolls. When we got home, I told him that boys who play with dolls are called wusses and not real men. That cars, rockets, lego sets are suitable for boys. COuple of weeks later, my wife tells me that in her presence my son told my niece that he wont play with her dolls because he is a "real man". Apparently that triggered the niece asking her parents what toys are good for her, and her namby pamby parents told her "whatever toys you like sweetie", with a mean look at my wife. Of course, the wifie overreacts and yells at me.. typical female behavior.

    June 23, 2012 at 8:29 pm |
    • Dorothy

      So good to see you're in such a healthy hetero se x ual relationship (sarcasm off).

      June 23, 2012 at 11:46 pm |
    • Dorothy

      No wonder you are so afraid of gay marriage. Your wife would finally have options.

      June 23, 2012 at 11:53 pm |
    • SoldierOfConscience


      Go back to Oz.

      My wife loves and supports me very much thank you. A few days after that, she came and told me I did the right thing by stopping the doll thing.. YOU tell me, how many boys do you see playing with dolls?

      June 24, 2012 at 11:56 am |
    • Dorothy

      Yup.....for the most part I believe that people are born with their se x ual orientation, but you give a pretty convincing argument that YOU could turn your wife into a lesbian.

      June 24, 2012 at 2:19 pm |
  8. dorothy

    Ken – The story of Sodom and Gomorrah, according to most Catholic Biblical scholars had nothing to do with ho mo se x ua lity. It was about how the people of those cities abused and mistreated the strangers (who were odd to them( when they cam to their city rather than treating them with kindness and compassion. Hmmmm....on second thought, maybe it is a lesson about ho mo se x uality.......maybe it is a lesson to us about how we as a christian community are treating the gay community and what will be the outcome of our wicked ways.

    June 23, 2012 at 2:22 pm |
  9. cb

    The key words with most anti-gay groups are “tax exempt”. If all the money made by groups like this were TAXED, they would fine a real job. I just do not think gay life is that big a deal for most people? Most of us have a hard time worrying about our own life. For anti-gay groups it is all about the money. But if you DO spend every day of your life worrying about “the gays”, you may just want to talk to someone.

    June 23, 2012 at 11:08 am |
  10. ken

    AS catholics we are supposed to follow the teachings of Christ and in no way does his teachings commend gay marriages. It is not normal. Check out Sodom and Gommorah. What is the point creating woman? Some will say welcome to the 21st century. I wonder what new thing will come up in the middle of this 21st century, legalization of bestialty or paedophilia?

    June 23, 2012 at 3:36 am |
    • SoldierOfConscience

      Ken, here is the list of so-called orientations waiting in the wings:

      1/ polygamy
      2/ bestiality
      3/ incest
      4/ p3d0ph1lia
      5/ necr0ph1lia
      6/ other (e.g. I love his piece of stone so need a tax break for it)

      June 23, 2012 at 11:05 am |
    • Be

      Right soldier, because all of those can consent to a relationship, right? All of those can become equal partners, right? The fact that you and others like you (particularly in the Catholic Church) do not understand that distinction is why those atrocities exist in the first place. They have nothing to do with gay marriage.

      June 23, 2012 at 11:20 am |
    • midwest rail

      Obviously, SoldierofConscience isn't bothered at all by continually posting the same logical fallacies over and over again, no matter how often the flaws are pointed out. He knows he is posting disingenuous nonsense ( lies ? ) but it certainly doesn't seem to bother his conscience.

      June 23, 2012 at 12:51 pm |
    • Dorothy

      Ken and Soldier – It would appear that neither straight nor gay marriage has any correlation with pedophilia. However, I cannot conclude based on the anecdotal evidence before us that there is no correlation with celibacy. Maybe we need to take a second look at all of our teachings on human se x uality. eh?

      June 23, 2012 at 2:05 pm |
  11. a


    June 22, 2012 at 11:42 pm |
    • Be

      As Catholics we ate supposed to follow the teachings of Christ and in no way does his teachings commend that the earth circles around the sun. It would not be the normal order of the universe. Check out Genesis. What is the point of making humans if we are not the center of the universe? Some will say welcome to the 17 th century, I wonder what new thing will come up. Will man defy nature and fly?

      Geez history does repeat itself. Dorothy is right. People will keep their minds closed as long as possible to hold on to their prejudices. And btw, dogs and children lack the capacity to enter into that type of relationship. Your obvious lack of knowledge about that distinction is possibly why those to evils actually exist in the world. Sad, very sad.

      June 23, 2012 at 11:07 am |
  12. Be

    As the article states, 59% of Catholics already support gay marriage, so the answer to the question was in the article, "yes, obviously Catholics can and do support gay marriage.". I can hear the conservatives now bemoaning that you can't be catholic and not follow the church teaching. That, of course, is not true. There have been many dissenters throughout history who ultimately been vindicated in their beliefs (Galileo for one). Modern science has now shown us that being gay is natural and healthy for some people. Further many theologians have concluded that with an authentic interpretation of scripture one can no longer conclude that the Bible condemns it (no more than it condemns inter- racial marriage). It usually takes the catholic hierarchy about 400 years to catch up with its faithful if Galileo is any indication. Hence, Catholics who have informed consciences will probably support gay marriage and the blind sheep will follow along in about 400 years. The sadder group who hold on to their beliefs in order to justify their bigotry are the most disheartening. They usually have the capacity to understand the argument for gay marriage but their prejudices do not allow them to move forward.

    June 22, 2012 at 7:58 pm |
    • Dorothy

      Be – You are never going to convince those that oppose gay marriage that they are wrong. People who opposed interracial marriage or women's vote or desegregation used the Bible, religion and whatever else they could think of to hold on to their prejudices. This will be no different. People get so ingrained in their prejudices that logic and empirical data will not budge them. Once it becomes common place, their children will look back and will wonder how people could ever think that way, much in the same way we look at interracial marriage, desegregation and the women's vote and wonder how people could be so blind and closed minded and hateful. The fact that 59% of catholics actually admit that they are for gay marriage probably means that the true number is closer to 70%.....many within the church would be afraid to admit it at this point.

      June 22, 2012 at 9:47 pm |
    • SoldierOfConscience

      Be :-

      'Bigot' is the fav 4 letter word of the liberals when they have no counterargument. Anybody who doesnt agree with them is a bigot. Whereas, actually, they are the ones who show the most bigotry when it comes to diversity of OPINION.

      Ask : 1. Justice Thomas, 2. the conservative latino dude who withdrew from consideration for judgeship (forget his name) 3. Herman Cain

      Diversity of APPEARANCE is important, opinion. NOT!

      June 24, 2012 at 8:38 pm |
  13. Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

    Prayer changes thing s

    June 22, 2012 at 7:00 pm |
  14. SolderOfConscience

    g@ys special right# 222 :

    getting to shower in army loo with people they can ogle it. If I want to I cant get co-ed shower.

    June 22, 2012 at 6:40 pm |
    • SolderOfConscience


      June 22, 2012 at 6:46 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      So it won't affect you at all. Thanks!

      June 22, 2012 at 6:47 pm |
  15. SolderOfConscience

    Bu!!sh1t. for me, Its common sense, the kid learns to throw a ball from his dad and the soft side of life from his mommy. over and out.

    June 22, 2012 at 6:33 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Hmm. I know a gay couple. Both women know how to throw a ball. And one of them has a black belt in tae kwon do. She could probably kick your azz.

      June 22, 2012 at 6:44 pm |
    • Over It

      My son is a great cook, so he does all the meal-planning, food shopping and cooking for his family (my daughter-in-law does the kitchen clean up).

      My daughter-in-law loves to do (and is expert at) home repair, including plumbing and electrical (she does need his muscle and height once in a while). She is also their daughter's soccer team coach.

      They both work. They both do laundry and housework 'n stuff. They and their children are all doing fine, thank you.

      Welcome to the 21st century.

      June 22, 2012 at 6:52 pm |
    • Over It


      p.s. speaking of electrical work - does your screen name mean that you are a hardened lump of melted lead? Or do you mean "Soldier"?

      June 22, 2012 at 6:57 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Ahhhahha! My bad. I missed the "solder". I need new glasses.

      June 22, 2012 at 6:59 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You'd think someone really in the military would have spelled that correctly, wouldn't you?

      The guy's just a troll.

      June 22, 2012 at 7:00 pm |
    • SoldierOfConscience

      Tom Petty:

      I never claimed to be in the military. I am a 'soldier of conscience', not a soldier. Funny you called me a troll. My brother in law did once. you see, of 3 sisters, my wife is the only one who changed her last name. At my insistence that the family must have one name. Never mind all these namby pamby new age notions. My brother is law never fails to make fun of me for that. Called me an 'old troll'. But whatever...

      June 23, 2012 at 11:08 am |
  16. SolderOfConscience

    Tom Petty: my post is not getting thru. some kind of word filter.

    June 22, 2012 at 6:31 pm |
  17. SolderOfConscience

    some people want special rights for them, thats what upsets us people of faith. If people wearing blue shirts want the law to be changed saying "If one wears blue shirts (btw, its not a choice, its in-born or genetic) then you cant fire me, I have the right to say and do anything etc etc etc. Of course we wont hurt anyone, we just want these BASIC RIGHT" what would you think?

    we think of so called anti discrimminatory laws in the same regard.

    June 22, 2012 at 6:14 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      If they're allowed to marry, how will it affect you?

      June 22, 2012 at 6:15 pm |
    • SolderOfConscience

      Tom Petty :

      That is just one of the various quibbles I have. While you are on that, if we allow this, the polygamists will be next. and God knows who else next (maybe bestialists). As long as we can define newer and newer kinds of 'orientations', the sky is the limit. So the idea is : NOBODY GETS SPECIAL RIGHTS.

      June 22, 2012 at 6:25 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      So, you're going with the "slippery slope" argument?

      Do the words "informed consent" mean anything to you?

      You still haven't answered my question. Without resorting to doomsday scenarios that haven't occurred in any of the states or countries in which gay marriage is legal, how will legalizing gay marriage affect you directly?

      June 22, 2012 at 6:29 pm |
    • SolderOfConscience

      Also, for a kid it is best for him/her to have a MALE role model and a FEMALE role model. thats how it has worked for thousands of years, and we should not change it.

      June 22, 2012 at 6:32 pm |
    • SolderOfConscience

      Yet another special right here.. to be able to inflict that on children.

      June 22, 2012 at 6:32 pm |
    • SolderOfConscience

      Bu!!sh1t argument. common sense, the kid learns to throw a ball from his dad and the soft side of life from his mommy. over and out. Yeah I KNOW there are single family households but I dont hold then to be a model. In fact for that reason we should ban no-fault divorce and go back to divorce for adulterous and abusive only. Once you get married that's IT.

      June 22, 2012 at 6:34 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Numerous studies have shown that children of gay couples in committed, stable relationships are not negatively affected at all.

      Now, can you answer my question?

      June 22, 2012 at 6:34 pm |
    • SolderOfConscience

      and tom petty, the slippery slope is real. Mr Kodie from TLC show 'sister wife' has made noises that 'g@y is recognized we should go to court for our marriage'

      June 22, 2012 at 6:35 pm |
    • SolderOfConscience

      Biased studies.

      June 22, 2012 at 6:36 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      I'm straight and married. I don't get the big deal. Gays have always been here; they'll always be here. Withholding the right to marry won't make them go away. They'll still adopt kids or have them via artificial insemination or surrogates, just as they've been doing for years.

      Why does it bother you so much?

      June 22, 2012 at 6:37 pm |
    • SolderOfConscience

      Mr Petty : your question, how it will harm me. By getting special rights not given to others. For example this hullaboo about this dude or girl being deported coz DOMA prevents federal govt from recoginizing their 'marriage'. Next, a mormon can start a business of 'marrying' 10 people at a time to get them citizenship. This is after poly marriage is legal which is matter of course teh way we are going.

      June 22, 2012 at 6:38 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      "Biased studies"? No, these were studies published in peer-reviewed journals.

      Now, can you stop evading and answer the question? What will happen to you, yourself, if gay marriage becomes legal?

      June 22, 2012 at 6:39 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      And how do those cases affect you directly?

      June 22, 2012 at 6:41 pm |
    • HotAirAce

      Want to bet that SolderOfBigotry thinks it's OK for parents to inflict religious belief, as in indoctrinate them against their will, on children?

      June 22, 2012 at 6:42 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You continue to make an argument using hypotheticals such as polygamy. Why do you wish to avoid answering the question?

      June 22, 2012 at 6:42 pm |
    • HotAirAce

      SolderOfBigotry, your logic fails. If everbody does not have the same rights, such as when gays do not have the right to marry, then those that do have that right have a special right. Your agrument is nothing but a smokescreen to maintain the status quo, to keep doing what religion was able to get away with before people starting questioning The Babble.

      June 22, 2012 at 6:48 pm |
    • SoldierOfConscience


      if thats the case, are the polygamists, p3d0ph1les also discrimminated against?

      June 23, 2012 at 11:59 am |
    • midwest rail

      Once again, the zealots raise the spectre of ped0philia, conveniently ignoring the fact that one of those parties cannot consent to the activity. I'll be waiting for your next strawman – bestiality.

      June 23, 2012 at 12:03 pm |
    • SoldierOfConscience

      Why do you call it a straw man?

      June 23, 2012 at 12:26 pm |
    • SoldierOfConscience


      re: 'indoctrinating', this whole namby pamby notion of giving 'choice' to kids is stupid. what say we give kids the 'choice' of touching fire or not? Same way we need to save them in the non-physical world. Anyway there is no difference between you and me. You just 'indoctrinate' them to hate all religions, except the religion of atheism.

      June 23, 2012 at 12:34 pm |
    • HotAirAce

      To SolderHead,

      Re: polygamists, I have no problem legalizing polygamy provided I among consenting adults, and they col claim discrimination an I would agree. Pedophilla does not meet the consenting adult requirement so o problem saying no to them.

      Only an idiot wold confuse religious indoctrination and teaching your child to be safe – well done idiot!

      Re: my children they know exactly how I feel about religion an the consequences of becoming believers. They both have attended church, and one is dating a Mormon, but boh have made up their own mind, and are free to change their mind.

      June 24, 2012 at 9:13 pm |
  18. SolderOfConscience

    Nada, No, Never, Zilch chances. Kapeesh?

    June 22, 2012 at 2:58 pm |
  19. nikkidane

    I have to agree that one should not call themselves Catholic if they are not going to follow the teachings of the Church. That said, I strongly believe in Marriage Equality. Catholics disregard Vatican policy on birth control. abortion, divorce, women in the clergy, celibacy, mastubation and many other issues. Personally, I would feel a bit hypocritical supporting an organization with such Midevil social views. There are many other Christian Churches that support progressive social issues that deserve to be supported. In my op[inion, if you are attending the Catholic Church you are implicitly saying that you support their views. I'm sure it may be hard to leave the church you were raised in, but at some point you need to wake up and smell the coffee.

    June 22, 2012 at 2:37 pm |
  20. SolderOfConscience


    June 22, 2012 at 2:25 pm |
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About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.