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Barton's 'Jefferson Lies' book yanked
David Barton's book attempted to dispel the popular notion that Thomas Jefferson was a secular politician.
August 10th, 2012
05:15 PM ET

Barton's 'Jefferson Lies' book yanked

By Eric Marrapodi and Dan Gilgoff, CNN

(CNN)–A best-selling book is getting boxed up and returned to the publisher after complaints of historical inaccuracies.

Publisher Thomas Nelson has withdrawn 'The Jefferson Lies" after a lengthy review found the author, David Barton, had included "historical details that were not adequately supported," said Brian Hampton, a senior vice president and publisher for Thomas Nelson.

Hampton said the move was "extremely rare" and he could not recall a time in the publisher's history when it had recalled a book in this manner. "We’re disappointed for everyone concerned," Hampton said.

Barton is the founder and president of the Texas-based WallBuilders, a group that describes itself as "dedicated to presenting America's forgotten history and heroes, with an emphasis on the moral, religious and constitutional foundation on which America was built – a foundation which, in recent years, has been seriously attacked and undermined," according to its website.

"The Jefferson Lies: Exposing the Myths You've Always Believed About Thomas Jefferson," was published in April.  In it Barton attempted to dispel the popular notion that Thomas Jefferson was a secular politician who pioneered the idea of strict church-state separation.

It was Barton's first book with Thomas Nelson and was released to great expectations.  By May 13, 2012, the book landed on The New York Times Best-Sellers list.

But even before the book was published, Hampton said Thomas Nelson began receiving complaints.

"First concerns came our way from people who hadn’t read the book," he said.  The publisher thought the complaints were from people on the opposite ideological spectrum from Barton, a conservative political star who has long billed himself as an evangelical historian.

"We still took them seriously and began a review process," Hampton said.  Despite the complaints, the book still went to press.

As Thomas Nelson was conducting its own review, so were academics.

Warren Throckmorton, an associate professor of psychology, and Michael Coulter a political science professor,  both at Grove City College, a conservative Christian school in Pennsylvania, were also conducting their own review.  They published their own e-book that fact checked Barton called "Getting Jefferson Right."

Barton had written off other critics as "liberal elites," but this was a searing attack from within the evangelical community.

Hampton said there was no outside tipping point for the publisher.

“We were monitoring everything that was happening out there,” he said.

He said concerns were expressed about the book from a variety of sources. “What was most compelling to us was engaging with the manuscript.”

“The first thing we did was go back to the book and see what was a matter of opinion or analysis,” Hampton said.

After the internal review of Barton's book, Hampton said, “We became convinced there were parts of the book that were not historically supported.”

“Both withdrawing it from the marketplace and reverting the rights back to him seemed like the best thing for us to do,” he said.

Barton told Bob Smietana, a religion reporter for the Tennessean, a Nashville-based newspaper, “All I got was an e-mail saying it was canceled,” he said. “It was a complete surprise.”

In a statement issued by WallBuilders late Friday night Barton said, “while Thomas Nelson may have ‘lost confidence’ in the work, others have not and thus the book has already been picked up by a much larger national publisher and distributor. Even at the time Nelson dropped the work, they admitted that it was still selling very well.”

A representative for WallBuilders would not name the new publisher, suggesting the details were not final and the final word would come through their website once those details could be worked out.

Barton’s statement pushed back hard against Thomas Nelson’s review of his material.
“As is the case with all of our published items, we go above and beyond with original source documentation so that people can be thoroughly confident when they see the truth of history for themselves,” the statement read.

“We find it regrettable that Thomas Nelson never contacted us with even one specific area of concern before curtly notifying us they had dropped the work. Had they done so, we would have been happy to provide them with the thorough and extensive historical documentation for any question or issue they raised; they never asked,” the statement continuted.

“The Jefferson Lies has not been pulled from publication and it will continue to sell nationally,” it concluded.

The book is still available through Barton’s website. Amazon.com was no longer carrying the book on Friday through its regular processes, instead was directing customers to used booksellers who carried the book.

Barton told the Tennessean he thought some of Throckmorton's critiques were off base.

“This is one of the cases where he is just nuts,” Barton told the Nashville paper.

Barton wears a variety of hats in Republican and conservative circles. He is a former top official in the Texas GOP and a sometimes consultant with the Republican National Committee, a behind-the-scenes political operative who advises presidential candidates and coordinates trips to Israel for the likes of Glenn Beck, and a prolific author, speaker and Washington tour guide on the evangelical circuit.

Beck wrote the forward to 'The Jefferson Lies."

Barton and his work were also featured prominently in former "Growing Pains" star Kirk Cameron’s movie “Monumental,” about the role of religion in American history.

- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: Belief • Books • Christianity • Church and state

soundoff (861 Responses)
  1. TheVocalAtheist

    Barton claims:

    Demonic powers control the government.
    The Founding Fathers opposed the teaching of evolution.
    Jesus opposed the minimum wage.
    The Bible opposes Net Neutrality.
    The US would have won the Vietnam war if it had flown just one more bombing run.
    Prayer stopped the BP oil spill.
    Intolerance of gays is a sign a nation is undergoing a spiritual revival.
    We can't find a cure for AIDS because it is God's punishment for sin.
    Life begins not at conception, but before conception.
    People are probably on welfare because they are not reading the Bible enough.

    August 11, 2012 at 11:17 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Thank you for that synopsis! Maybe you can fill TOOOOOOLIE in on the salient points; he bought the book (or so he claims) but can't seem to read it....

      August 11, 2012 at 11:21 pm |
  2. Dave

    Typical, under handed atheist technique, burying David Barton response – 07/12/2012 takes on his critics.
    http://www.wallbuilders.com/LIBissuesArticles.asp?id=118208

    August 11, 2012 at 8:06 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @Dave,

      again Dave, you must be getting worn out with all that link pasting.

      What is this, the tenth time you've posted the same thing?

      August 11, 2012 at 8:28 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @Dave,

      this clip is fun. Here you hero says: ... go back to the founding fathers, as far as they were concerned, they've already had the entire debate on creation/evolution ..."

      Ummm ... how is this possible, 80 years before Charles Darwin published "The Origin of the Species"?

      [youtube=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgJp9qd9xOQ&w=640&h=360]

      August 11, 2012 at 8:40 pm |
    • No Truth, Just Claims

      So part of his agrument is he is more popular. This is a very basic fallacy. Popularity does not equal truth.

      Chris Rodda has written a well doc.umented book refuting David Barton and is almost done with another addressing this book. Here is a response she gave to Barton co-host Rick Green who issued a challenge to his critics. She accepted his challange....but he has have yet to respond....my bet is he won't. It is also interesting that Barton refuses to debate anyone. He does not come off as being very confident of being able to respond to criticism.

      Here is the link

      http://freethoughtblogs.com/rodda/2012/08/11/barton-radio-co-host-issues-challenge-ive-accepted/

      August 11, 2012 at 9:53 pm |
    • Rufus T. Firefly

      I think he knows he's full of it, he's just a smart enough snake oil salesman to ride the wave as long as he can. Participating in debates, peer review, or any other legitimate scholarship would shorten his ride. He's making profits and pushing the fundie agenda while he can – he knows that his audience is not sophisticated enough to expect (or perhaps to even recognize) real scholarship anyway.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:21 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @Rufus,

      Fundies wanting real scholarship? Well I do declare, what a notion!

      They crave the complete lack of scholarship. All they want is doctrine and dogma that pay homage to their American pantheon: God, guns, money and exceptionalism.

      For God so loved Americans that he gave them half of the world's firearms so that they may accidentally and deliberately shoot each other and have eternal regret.

      Browning, Colt, Remington and Smith & Wesson – the job creators of the new millenia.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:32 pm |
    • Rufus T. Firefly

      Job creators? I thought they were the holy trinity.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:44 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      HEY! TOOLIE! Are you watching this??

      August 11, 2012 at 10:46 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @Rufus,

      Yes, I'd like to know the candidates position on American $$ being funneled to overseas corporations for purchases of 'personal safety equipment' from the likes of Glock GmbH, Heckler & Koch GmbH, Fabbrica d'Armi Pietro Beretta, etc.

      'Personal safety equipment' has such a NEWSPEAK way about it.

      But I've strayed off topic and crossed the streams.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:03 pm |
    • raggmopp

      Typical religious response. And what is most frightening is the thought of education being evil.

      How do you feel when you are insulting God? You know He gifted you with the ability to learn, to think, to reason. So why do you reject His gifts.

      August 12, 2012 at 2:24 am |
  3. Fritz Hohenheim

    Wow, a book blessed by Glenn Beck recalled. Who would ever think Glenn Beck would approve of lies. I am so very much disappointed in him :((((

    August 11, 2012 at 7:39 pm |
  4. Michael

    Money won the battle but TRUTH will win the war! Hold on David, help is on the way! Romney/Ryan 2012

    August 11, 2012 at 7:12 pm |
    • Manda

      Well, this whole thing went right over your head, didn't it?

      August 11, 2012 at 7:48 pm |
  5. spartyon

    Yet another televangelist lying, this isn't something new.

    August 11, 2012 at 5:29 pm |
  6. exlonghorn

    So much for separation of church and state...as I've suggested many times, the stated goal of many Christians is to impose their beliefs on others in line with directives of the bible. That Christians don't understand this is a complete violation of the rights of others, and is directly opposed to the spirit and letter of our Const.itution. From Barton's website...

    WallBuilders' goal is to exert a direct and positive influence in government, education, and the family by (1) educating the nation concerning the Godly foundation of our country; (2) providing information to federal, state, and local officials as they develop public policies which reflect Biblical values; and (3) encouraging Christians to be involved in the civic arena.

    To assist in the formation of sound public policy, we have established the WallBuilders' ProFamily Legislative Network. This arm of WallBuilders monitors and collects pro-family legislation from the various states in over a dozen different areas (e.g., marriage, abortion, education, public morality, gambling, parental rights) which we then make available to legislators and activists in other states at their request, thus enabling pro-family legislation to be introduced in states across America. We also support efforts by groups such as The National Association of Evangelicals (NAE) and Cornwall Alliance for the Stewardship of Creation that seek to provide principled Christian leadership in diverse policy areas, including a comprehensive call to civic responsibility and a call to truth on environmental stewardship.

    Thanks guys for providing another source to reinforce the views of Atheists.

    August 11, 2012 at 3:36 pm |
  7. danielwalldammit

    This is a positive development.

    August 11, 2012 at 3:27 pm |
    • Henderson

      Yes it is. Barton is either a compulsive liar, a moron, or both.

      August 11, 2012 at 3:38 pm |
  8. Davis123

    David Barton is a Godly man who stands up for biblical values and Godly standards. For those of you who don't understand God and Have a relationship with him, I completely realize why you don't agree David!! Praise the Lord!!!

    August 11, 2012 at 3:08 pm |
    • LinCA

      @Davis123

      You said, "David Barton is a Godly man who stands up for biblical values and Godly standards."
      So, falsifying history is a "biblical value and a godly standard"? Got it.

      I would call it highly immoral, but to each his or her own. Lying and cheating to keep the fairy tale alive does seem to be the religious MO.

      August 11, 2012 at 3:20 pm |
    • Rufus T. Firefly

      Could you please explain where lying and deceiving people fits in with biblical values?

      August 11, 2012 at 3:21 pm |
    • danielwalldammit

      David Barton is a hack who lies for a living. That he does so for Jesus should be no comfort to anyone who believes in Jesus. You ought to protect your faith from charletons, not support them when they are caught lying in the name of your beliefs.

      August 11, 2012 at 3:28 pm |
    • exlonghorn

      Rufus, do you feel like L. Ron Hubbard deceives people? How about John Smith?
      How about Jimmy Swaggert? Jerry Falwell? Jim Baker? There are dozens of names on the unflattering list of church leaders who have lied and deceived. Not to mention the unpleasant behaviors of several preists.

      LinCA's point is that there is a pattern of church leaders deceiving and lying to those they lead. It's not a big stretch of the imagination to think that the same behavior occurred with Jesus, Muhammad, or any other central figure. Of course this is the actions of a few bad apples amongst the faithful, but hopefully that conveys why he made the comment.

      August 11, 2012 at 4:16 pm |
    • Rufus T. Firefly

      Exlonghorn, I agree wholeheartedly with you and LinCA on this. My comment was intended in response to Davis123, and was intended to be delivered with a hint of sarcasm.

      August 11, 2012 at 4:34 pm |
    • tallulah13

      Wow. I hope you understand that with that statement you admitted that lying is a christian value.

      August 11, 2012 at 4:54 pm |
    • exlonghorn

      Hehe...whoops. Cheers. 🙂

      August 11, 2012 at 7:46 pm |
    • exlonghorn

      Don't you ever agree with us Rufus coz we're not done with you yet! And tallulah is such a peach.

      See my point?

      August 11, 2012 at 9:48 pm |
    • Rufus T. Firefly

      The safest best is to adamantly disagree with everyone!

      August 11, 2012 at 10:24 pm |
    • raggmopp

      And who are you to define the Godly standards? You have rejected His gifts of the ability to reason and to decide. Instead you choose to spew lies and intolerance.

      Achieving bliss through ignorance is not a Godly standard, that is a direct insult to God.

      August 12, 2012 at 2:31 am |
    • L o_o K

      Yeah, raggmopp is the one who gets to define "Godly" standards, you heathens!

      August 12, 2012 at 2:43 am |
  9. trying to sift through it all

    I usually try not to judge a book by its cover, so someone please tell me this dude is not the offspring of a pirranha and a chicken mcnugget.

    August 11, 2012 at 1:16 pm |
    • trying to sift through it all

      I apologize. That was unkind. My eyes were so fixed on his teeth that I mistook those Chic-Fil-A patty ears for mcnuggets.

      August 11, 2012 at 2:09 pm |
    • danielwalldammit

      He isn't. What's wrong with Barton is what passes for his mind. His looks have little to do with it,

      August 11, 2012 at 3:29 pm |
  10. Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

    Prayer changes things .

    August 11, 2012 at 12:47 pm |
    • kindless

      Actually, atheism is wonderful for children and all people! Prayer as it turn out, is mostly a time-sucker-upper. Who would've thought. If you need to meditate to collect your thoughts, then, by all means do so, but it's best to keep all those little imaginary characters you may think about to yourself.

      Atheists help people be productive and spend more time contributing to society rather than wasting it on make-believe notions.

      Atheists encourage people to take responsibility for their actions within society instead of having their misdeeds excused and often hidden within their religion (comforting their weak minds, but simultaneously disserving society).

      Break the matrix of deception by all religions. Break the fallacy of revelation.

      If the thought leaving your imaginary friends behind is just too much, or makes you want to go p00py, then try Atheism Lite™ (agnosticism) for a period of time to ease your way into a much more rewarding, peaceful life.

      It is written. RIF

      heavenSnot

      August 11, 2012 at 1:09 pm |
    • TR6

      The Pope, by riding in his bulit proof pope-mobile doesn't seem too impressed with the power of prayer

      August 11, 2012 at 9:45 pm |
    • Jesus

      Prayer does not; you are such a LIAR. You have NO proof it changes anything! A great example of prayer proven not to work is the Christians in jail because prayer didn't work and their children died. For example: Susan Grady, who relied on prayer to heal her son. Nine-year-old Aaron Grady died and Susan Grady was arrested.

      An article in the Journal of Pediatrics examined the deaths of 172 children from families who relied upon faith healing from 1975 to 1995. They concluded that four out of five ill children, who died under the care of faith healers or being left to prayer only, would most likely have survived if they had received medical care.

      The statistical studies from the nineteenth century and the three CCU studies on prayer are quite consistent with the fact that humanity is wasting a huge amount of time on a procedure that simply doesn’t work. Nonetheless, faith in prayer is so pervasive and deeply rooted, you can be sure believers will continue to devise future studies in a desperate effort to confirm their beliefs!*

      August 12, 2012 at 11:51 am |
  11. Nietodarwin

    This is SO funny. There are so many Talibangelicals that believe that Jefferson was all religious, and didn't espouse and ensure separation of church and state, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT THEY'VE BEEN TOLD, and never read anything but their darn good ole' bibles. Now this book is recalled by the educated few in their ranks. Oh yeah, it's the atheists who seem like crazy liars in this. I guess educated evangelicals and atheists are on the same side on this onw. HA HA It's good to see these Talibangelicals called to the carpet.

    August 11, 2012 at 11:41 am |
    • hinduism, denial of truth

      Thomas Jefferson knew truth of hinduism, denial of truth absolute labeled as Christianity, based not on truth absolute of human equality but hinduism, racism of hindu Jews, pagan secular s og Egypt and Persia, known as hindu Mithra ism, pagan savior ism, he rejected hind filth of hinduism, racism and deleted hinduism, religions from fundamentals of America. Reason for hindu pagan Christions to hate Thomas Jefferson.

      August 11, 2012 at 12:30 pm |
  12. Sim34

    No wonder Kirk Cameron loves the book. He lies about evolution the way Barton lied about Jefferson. Liars for Christ, is this what Christians have hitched their wagon to?

    August 11, 2012 at 11:39 am |
    • save the world and slap some sense into a christard today!

      sadly yes, this is what many of them do. and this is nothing new. just start with oh say paul the self-proclaimed "apostle" and go forward from there...

      August 11, 2012 at 11:48 am |
    • hinduism, denial of truth

      hinduism, pagan ism of Christ ism, Mithra ism, savior ism was religion of hindu, pagan Paul, and belief of hindu, pagan Christianity is nothing else but hindu , stink of Paul Jaundice.

      August 11, 2012 at 12:37 pm |
    • Rufus T. Firefly

      This is a repost from earlier, but I think it fits right in:
      The common thread between the discussions of creationism on this blog and the story of Barton's book being recalled, is the frustrating irony in the values of so many Christians that it is okay to lie – to lie outright and to never apologize for your dishonesty – as long as you are lying in the name of Jesus.

      Somehow it is considered moral and righteous to knowingly spew absolute falsehoods to argue in favor of Christianity. Chad's dishonest arguments about evolution (which themselves are merely plagiarisms of thousands of other lies) and Barton's stubborn misinformation about American history are just two examples of this willingness to stand in front of the cross with their hands on their hearts and lie, lie, lie.

      The only benefit of the doubt that I can think to offer them is that they are so brainwashed by this idea that "if it disagrees with God's word, then it by definition cannot be true" that they simply cannot recognize what is real and what isn't, and end up lying in order reconcile the real world with what their preachers are telling them.

      To clarify, my criticism is aimed at historical revisionists who would say anything to argue that our founding fathers intended this to be a Christian nation, and at creationists who will say anything to try and convince people that basic biology and geology are in doubt. Although this accusation can easily be extended to include people who claim that being gay is a choice, who claim that every word of the bible has been proven by archaeologists, and so on and so on. These are not matters of a "difference of world view." There are real, knowable things in the world that are not a matter of opinion. These are facts, and to knowingly misrepresent them is to lie. I'm not arguing that these people are idiots, I am making the argument that these people are liars.

      I am not asserting that all Christians are dishonest. I am pointing out that there is a fairly outspoken subset of Christians who apparently believe dishonesty is excusable if it is done for the sake of promoting their faith. That said, it sure would be reassuring to hear a louder voice from within the Christian community condemning this behavior. Silence accommodates it.

      August 11, 2012 at 1:23 pm |
    • danielwalldammit

      One big ignorant crowd there, all wallowing in the Dunning-Kruger effect and wondering why the rest of us do not celebrate Barton's ignorance.

      August 11, 2012 at 3:32 pm |
    • Chad

      @Rufus T. Firefly "Somehow it is considered moral and righteous to knowingly spew absolute falsehoods to argue in favor of Christianity. Chad's dishonest arguments about evolution (which themselves are merely plagiary of thousands of other Christian lies) "

      =>example please?

      on the other thread, you refused to provide an example.. any chance this will be different?
      😉

      some guidelines to help you out:
      1. Something along the lines of "Christians say evolution isnt true when we all know it is", is to vague a statement to begin with.
      "evolution" is defined only as any change across successive generations in the inherited characteristics of biological populations

      that word alone does not distinguish between

      -. Evolutionism (atheist): is the atheistic/naturalistic worldview that says life developed without God and without purpose, namely that purely random genetic mutations preserved by natural selection is the process by which we have arrived at the current complexity of life from the first proto-cell.

      -. Theistic evolution: the theistic worldview that says life developed at the direction of God, either through direct intervention or by supernatural orchestration of natural processes.

      atheists love to say "well, if you dont believe in evolution, you dont believe in science
      which is of course utter nonsense
      =first because both atheists and theists believe that there is inherited change in genes
      =second because the word "evolution" alone is insufficient to distiinguish between theistic and atheistic views on the origin of the complexity of life.

      whether atheists use that statement out of ignorance or dishonesty, I know not which.. It probably varies..

      -–
      2. Atheists tend to fling the term "dishonest" around, every time someone disagrees with them..

      Dishonesty is defined as: to act without honesty. It is used to describe a lack of probity, cheating,[1] lying or being deliberately deceptive or a lack in integrity, knavishness, perfidiosity, corruption or treacherousness. Dishonesty is the fundamental component of a majority of offences relating to the acquisition, conversion and disposal of property (tangible or intangible) defined in criminal law such as fraud.

      atheists have this extraordinarily odd view that anyone that doesnt agree with their viewpoint, and provides data supporting an opposite viewpoint, is automatically being dishonest. very odd.. to disagree doesnt make a person dishonest.

      ---
      3. The atheist claim that "Christians arent allowed to use data presented by atheist scientists to support their arguments"

      Atheists have this weird conviction that unless a scientist agrees with your interpretation of the data, you arent even allowed to discuss that data.. when in reality, challenging interpretations is the HEART of science.
      weird, irrational...

      August 11, 2012 at 10:24 pm |
    • Chadwatch

      Meanwhile, Chad's young, beautiful wife is lying in bed, waiting, waiting......

      August 11, 2012 at 10:25 pm |
    • Chadwatch, a public service

      Q: When do you know when The Chad is being dishonest?
      A: When he writes a comment.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:28 pm |
    • Chadwatch, a public service

      Q: How do you know when Chad's wife is dissatisfied with their s3x life?
      A: Chad is breathing.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:40 pm |
    • Chadwatch, a public service

      Q: How do you know Chad has a wife?
      A: Because that's the safest way to hide one's suppressed homosexuality.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:47 pm |
    • Chadwatch, a public service

      Q: How do you know Chad really exists?
      A: Who would want to pretend to be someone like him?

      August 11, 2012 at 10:53 pm |
    • Rufus T. Firefly

      Chad, I already declined to re-enter this debate with you on another page.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:06 pm |
    • Chad

      @Rufus T. Firefly "I already declined to re-enter this debate with you on another page."

      =>exactly my point..

      you are clearly quite comfortable making statements and declining to back them up with any data, as you indicated.

      bizarre to say the least, if you arent going to back the accusation up, why exactly are you making it?
      someone was saying something about dishonesty?

      August 11, 2012 at 11:11 pm |
    • Chadwatch, a public service

      Chad, you are full of shit, everyone here knows it, and it's ridiculous for you to deny it. Your dishonest tactics are notorious. No one has to prove it.

      August 12, 2012 at 1:55 am |
    • Chad

      actually, nothing has been presented that I would be able to deny 😉

      that's my point..

      August 12, 2012 at 9:59 am |
  13. Christian - trying to be

    What a disservice to Christ are people like Barton! The scary fact us that a number of people are willing to follow him – of course Glenn Beck's endorsement should have said something. I went to duke university started as a seminary – according to Barton I should be a seminarian! – grateful that the publisher finally decided to do his job!

    August 11, 2012 at 10:50 am |
    • Sim34

      Look at the number of Christians willing and eager to follow creationists who spread similar lies? Too many of you choose to accept claims on blind faith, without properly vetting them first, just because they sound good. If you're that desperate to shore up your faith then maybe you're faith is too weak to hold onto.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:18 am |
    • Nietodarwin

      This Sim guy is correct. Also, starting as a seminary and never finishing, is better than finishing. You might be happier as an atheist, it's quite liberating to throw off the shackles. THIS BOOK IS NOT THE ONLY SOURCE OF LIES YOU HAVE BEEN TOLD UNDER THE GUISE OF FAITH. Good luck

      August 11, 2012 at 11:46 am |
  14. ME II

    I'm glad that these types of pseudo-experts are getting exposed, although it saddens me that they get enough attention to warrant 'exposure'.

    August 11, 2012 at 10:41 am |
    • Huebert

      Better late than never though.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:44 am |
    • Prague

      Learn to write before you attempt to comment.

      August 11, 2012 at 5:05 pm |
  15. Prayer changed my oil. Alleluia, amen.

    Prayer changes things. It changed my oil.

    August 11, 2012 at 10:30 am |
  16. grahamer rhodes

    So Where are his tax returnes

    August 11, 2012 at 10:23 am |
  17. save the world and slap some sense into a christard today!

    David Barton is nothing more than a sleezeball lobbyist for christian fundamentalism and extremism. Using the personal leanings of any historical figure to promote ideas in a behind-the-scenes way that contradict the Const*itution is dangerous to our government and misleading to the minds of the under-educated. The politicians that avail themselves of his services should be ashamed.

    August 11, 2012 at 10:17 am |
  18. Elvis Presley

    “In typical Barton style, every syllable is given scholarly research and backed up with source documents. Those who hate America and God’s Word won’t like it, but they won’t be able to discredit it.” Clearly, academics such as Throckmorton, Coulter, Jenkinson, Crawford, et. al., simply don’t like what the self-evident documentation actually proves.
    -M Huckabee

    August 11, 2012 at 9:40 am |
    • AtheistSteve

      "Those who hate America and God’s Word won’t like it"

      I suspect most people don't hate America. A good neighbour and fine example of democracy established by its founding fathers with a clear separation of church and state. But many would take issue with "God's Word". What does that mean? God didn't write anything. God couldn't because he's imaginary. Primitive ignorant men wrote that garbage. The truly astounding part is how many people buy into it. Are you really so bereft of critical thinking skills that you can't form opinions about the natural world without referring to ancient tribal lore?

      August 11, 2012 at 10:08 am |
    • No Truth, Just Claims

      Mike Huckabee is a young earth creationist......nuff said.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:45 am |
    • danielwalldammit

      Huckabee too is a lying sack of filth.

      August 11, 2012 at 3:41 pm |
  19. Ting

    "It's not a lie... if you believe it".

    – George Costanza

    August 11, 2012 at 9:34 am |
    • Keith

      Like Obama's birth certificate and draft card and publisher's bio......

      August 11, 2012 at 9:46 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      It's the NUT JOB REVIEW! Starring the one and only KEEF!

      August 11, 2012 at 10:08 am |
    • TruthPrevails :-)

      Keith: How many times does the man have to produce his birth certificate and have it backed by the state of Hawaii before you people stop? He had to be a USA citizen before he could be elected, so the point should be moot!

      August 11, 2012 at 10:08 am |
    • save the world and slap some sense into a christard today!

      Always love the Constanza quotes..lol

      And Keith is an idiot. Nothing new there.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:07 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      I think he's beyond idiotic. Keith appears to be mentally ill–seriously.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:18 am |
    • sam stone

      What do you folks want from Keith? Seriously, the "man" has a bible shoved so far up his rectum that it is cutting off bloodflow to his brain.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:39 am |
  20. Nobel

    Sure not one posting here as ever read David Barton's book to critique his book objectively.
    Atheists are LIARS!!!

    August 11, 2012 at 9:25 am |
    • Discordia Nocturnum

      Apparently Barton is the liar.

      August 11, 2012 at 9:28 am |
    • Elvis Presley

      “In typical Barton style, every syllable is given scholarly research and backed up with source documents. Those who hate America and God’s Word won’t like it, but they won’t be able to discredit it.” Clearly, academics such as Throckmorton, Coulter, Jenkinson, Crawford, et. al., simply don’t like what the self-evident documentation actually proves.
      – Huckabee

      August 11, 2012 at 9:41 am |
    • TruthPrevails :-)

      Have you read it??? Better yet outside of the buybull can you back any of those stories up? Lets start with the obvious-virgin birth; flood; creation (which in turns means incest); resurrection-try finding actual evidence based on using the scientific method here, otherwise it is you christards who are lying. Trying providing evidence that your god even existed. This is your delusion and not one shared by everyone.

      August 11, 2012 at 9:46 am |
    • ME II

      @Nobel,
      "Atheists are LIARS!!!"
      How can you know that every Atheist has lied?
      Wouldn't that make you a liar?

      August 11, 2012 at 10:39 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Which book? Because the one discussed here has been pulled. I doubt you've read it-your post doesn't scan like that of a literary or literate person.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:45 am |
    • save the world and slap some sense into a christard today!

      Don't need to read it. I've heard him and listened to his "rationalizations". His agenda is dangerous and goes against the Const*itution in a sneaky, hidden way.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:02 am |
    • CBW

      hey piper-What are you scanning you pinhead? Stressing those two brain cells you've got, eh 😉

      August 11, 2012 at 4:53 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Aww, what's the matter, CBW? Did I hit a nerve?

      Do you read this:
      "Sure not one posting here as ever read David Barton's book to critique his book objectively.
      Atheists are LIARS!!!"

      as being the writing of anyone who has much intelligence or education? If so, I have a bridge for sale. It's in Brooklyn.

      August 11, 2012 at 6:12 pm |
    • CBW

      Stressing that empty head of yours isn't just helping ya. Just relax and let it go!

      August 11, 2012 at 7:04 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      I'm not the one having a bitch-fest, CBW. Not stressed in the slightest. Debating (if you can call it that) with you is no more stressful than swatting a sick fly.

      August 11, 2012 at 7:07 pm |
    • CBW

      Why do u stress so much IDIOT.

      August 11, 2012 at 7:12 pm |
    • Dave

      Just another typical slimmy atheist technique, burying David Barton response – 07/12/2012 takes on his critics.
      http://www.wallbuilders.com/LIBissuesArticles.asp?id=118208

      August 11, 2012 at 8:07 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @Nobel,

      you know that the people who wrote the researched critiques of Mr. Barton's "Lies" are professors from a conservative Christian College right?

      August 11, 2012 at 8:31 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Who's stressing? I'm not the one posting in caps. I'm enjoying a lovely glass of Prosecco while I laugh at morons who actually think anyone pays attention to these boards.

      August 11, 2012 at 8:33 pm |
    • CBW

      Pity you poor Idiot stringing some words together does not a sentence make.

      August 11, 2012 at 8:44 pm |
    • Dave

      conservative Christian College = man made lies.

      August 11, 2012 at 9:16 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @Dave,

      really Dave, according to their mission statement:
      Grove City College remains true to the vision of its founders. Rejecting relativism and secularism, it fosters intellectual, moral, spiritual, and social development consistent with a commitment to Christian truth, morals, and freedom.

      Sounds like a 'Christian College' to me!

      August 11, 2012 at 9:31 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      "Pity you poor Idiot stringing some words together does not a sentence make."

      Class? Class, your assignment is to punctuate this string of words so it makes grammatical and syntactical sense.

      You may begin now.

      August 11, 2012 at 9:33 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @Dave,

      pressing further:

      Gregg Frazer of The Master’s College, evaluated Barton’s video America’s Godly Heritage and found many of its factual claims dubious, such as a statement that “52 of the 55 delegates at the Const'tutional Convention were ‘orthodox, evangelical Christians.’"

      According to the mission statement for the Master's College:
      The mission of The Master's College is to empower students for a life of enduring commitment to Christ, biblical fidelity, moral integrity, intellectual growth and lasting contribution to the Kingdom of God.

      I suppose even the Christian Colleges are now part of the liberal 'elite' to you?

      August 11, 2012 at 9:34 pm |
    • Dave

      4 horns ushering in Satan. Educational system is one of them.

      August 11, 2012 at 9:47 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      So Dave, 'ignorance is bliss' eh? In the kingdom of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.

      With Mr. Barton's love of the warrior priest mythos (John Peter Gabriel Muhlenberg, and presumably the Crusader knights) blurring the lines between church and state, and war and religion we're dangerously close to these ideas:

      IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH
      WAR IS PEACE
      FREEDOM IS SLAVERY

      Recognize them?

      August 11, 2012 at 10:06 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Pretty obvious this nitwit Dave has had little exposure to education, within a system or otherwise.

      The moron can't manage to write a coherent sentence consisting of as few as fifteen words.

      Probably home-schooled in a trailer down by the river.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:11 pm |
    • TOOL Tom

      "Which book? Because the one discussed here has been pulled. I doubt you've read it-your post doesn't scan like that of a literary or literate person."

      Let me help you Tom Tom, you can borrow mine. I've purchased a copy before it was "yanked". Just e-mail me @tom.tom_isatool@yahoo.com. Or, you may borrow from somebody else, it won't be hard to find one. The book was bestseller.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:11 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Did you mean "a best-seller"? So was "Harry Potter", honey. And this tome was no more factual than that one.

      You never read anything that contained words of more than three syllables, sweetie. Unless your mommy helped you out.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:13 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      If you want a good scary movie that will give you the creeps, look at Mr. Barton's 'Black Robe Regiment' video:
      http://brr.wallbuilders.com/

      He is unambiguously going to war against the doctrine of separation. This seems more treasonous to me, rather than 'patriotic'.

      From his handle, I infer that Dave is clearly a surrogate of Mr. Barton.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:22 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You give "Dave" far too much credit. He and TOOLie aren't bright enough to know what a 'surrogate' is.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:24 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      @TTTPS,

      this just in, a category 3 Chad warning (a 388 word Chad posting) bearing north on this page, courtesy of Chadwatch.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:36 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      TOOLIE, why don't you enlighten everyone here as to what this "best-seller" has to offer? What did you learn from reading it? Have you checked to see whether what was written had any bearing on reality? What sources did you use to determine the accuracy of Barton's claims and statement?

      August 11, 2012 at 10:38 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Thanks for the storm warning!

      I have to say, Chadwatch is the best entertainment here! Umm, aside from YOUR posts, of course! 😉

      August 11, 2012 at 10:41 pm |
    • TOOL Tom

      All I wanted was to resolve your "Which book? Because the one discussed here has been pulled." concern. That's why I offered the copy that I bought prior from the pull-out has been made so it won't bother that much.

      I recognize your effort as a volunteer CNN spellchecker and salute you as a grammar-nazi. But if that's the best you've got, I can't do anymore help.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:46 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      It looks like Chadwatch is violating their primary rule of engagement – don't!

      I liked the "Hay and straw make odd bedfellows but the venetian blind give comfort and shade." etc for Mr. Denial. It seems to have helped.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:48 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      TOOLIE, you couldn't help anyone to do anything if your little life depended on it. If you bought and read this travesty of a tome, shame on you for being an idiot. Anyone who would go out and spend a dime on a book with a foreword by GLENN FVCKING BECK is too stupid to warrant anything but scorn.

      But I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. I don't think you bought the book at all, because i don't think you have two nickels to rub together.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:51 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Hey, there, Not. I doubt that doofus can be "helped" but maybe sounding out the syllables has kept him busy for an hour or so.

      As for Chadwatch, eh, I think if ridicule is the object, rather than argument, the objective is met. Any action that discredits the clown is worthy, as long as it doesn't allow him an audience for his nonsensical performances.

      August 11, 2012 at 10:57 pm |
    • TOOL Tom

      Tomitina, noted. Okay, let me get it straigh. Your previous question and statement that says and I quote "Which book? Because the one discussed here has been pulled." was M-O-O-T.

      I think I need to spell it out to you because the thing at the end of your neck is oozing but obviously not working.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:01 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Aww, how sweet. Do you have any revelations to relate, TOOOOOOL? Did you actually gain any INSIGHTS from your *idol* Barton's tome?

      Or were you unable to actually READ it?

      August 11, 2012 at 11:15 pm |
    • Men&Mice

      What really scares me is, Tom Tom murders someone, because his/her/its words here, warrants the 8th Amendment.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:32 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Men/Mice, you should worry about whether a mouse has more brains than you do. It's a far more valid and realistic concern.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:34 pm |
    • Men&Mice

      It seems that Tom Tom have missed his/her/its med(s). I'm outta here, bye!

      August 11, 2012 at 11:38 pm |
    • TOOL Tom

      "INSIGHTS"

      How sweet the word (w/ matching all-caps) it sounds coming from someone who doesn't have an ounce of it.

      August 11, 2012 at 11:50 pm |
    • CBW

      As English is clearly not your first language and you failed to grasp the earlier post here it is for ya Verlierer, Won't blame an IDIOT like you for being born that way.

      August 12, 2012 at 7:09 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      CBW, do you have a screw loose? Your posts are nearly unintelligible.

      August 12, 2012 at 6:15 pm |
    • CBW

      What a pathetic idiot you are.

      August 12, 2012 at 9:16 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.