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 A voice vote to change the DNC party platform turned to chaos Wednesday night.
September 6th, 2012
03:24 PM ET
Conventions leave atheists asking: What political party represents me?By Dan Merica, CNN Washington (CNN) – This convention season has not been good for atheists. The word "God" was reinserted in the Democratic platform after it had been removed. A plan to raise atheist billboards in the convention cities was stymied by opponents. And though there were preachers and rabbis and other religious leaders opening and closing each day of each convention, there wasn’t an avowed atheist talking up unbelief on either convention’s speaking list. The political lockout has left many nonbelievers asking, “What political party represents me?” “We are deeply saddened by the exclusion of a large number of Americans by both parties,” said Teresa MacBain, a spokeswoman for the group American Atheists, in an interview on Thursday. “It amazes me that in modern-day America, so much prejudice still exists.” After word spread Wednesday that Democrats left God out of their platform, atheists rejoiced. “Truly amazing news,” wrote Loren Miller on Atheist Nexus, a popular atheist blog. “The Republicans remain in the firm grasp of right-wing Christian religiosity, and I really don't know what it's going to take to free them from it.” But the convention committee immediately received huge pressure get God back in the platform. Even President Obama, according to CNN reporting, said, “Why on earth would that have been taken out?” when he first heard of the omission. In an awkward session that required three voice votes on the convention floor, the Democrats opted to add “God” back to the platform. For atheists, the Democrats were seen to be taking away a hard-fought victory. “We had 24 hours of joy as we felt (that) finally our government values all people,” said MacBain. “But that was short-lived. The vote last night angered many atheists and left them feeling excluded once again.” Online, atheist websites and Facebook pages went from upbeat to downcast as news spread of the platform revision. “Obama was the first president to acknowledge non believers,” Mark Musante wrote on the American Atheists’ Facebook page. “I wish he would stick to his guns.” Musante was referring to Obama’s 2009 inauguration speech, when the president said, “We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus, and nonbelievers.” Beverly Sitherwood, on the Friendly Atheist blog Facebook page, accused the Democrats of “Pandering for power.” Some atheist leaders used the platform defeat as a rallying call. “I guess a tiny step was too much to ask for,” David Silverman, president of the American Atheists, told CNN. “This was a clear message to the 16% of the voting population - we don’t count. Well, guess what, Dems - we do. And we vote.” Silverman says that 16% of the voting public identify as nonbelievers. According to the Pew Forum on Religion and Public Life, 12% of the electorate in 2008 was made up of people with no religious affiliation, though experts say the number of avowed atheists is much smaller. While acknowledging atheists, Obama has given platforms to high-profile religious leaders, including Rick Warren, a megachurch pastor who prayed at his inauguration, and Catholic Cardinal Timothy Dolan, who is giving the final prayer of the convention on Thursday night. American Atheists’ plans to raise billboards ridiculing the presidential candidates’ faith ended in failure. After the group put up billboards in Charlotte, North Carolina, the site of the Democratic National Convention, last month, it quickly removed them due to “physical threats to not only our staff, but the billboard company as well.” American Atheists had also planned on a billboard in Tampa, Florida, to coincide with the Republican National Convention there. But American Atheists said that all the billboard companies in Tampa rejected a sign taking aim at GOP presidential candidate Mitt Romney’s Mormon faith. Perhaps because of the Republican Party’s ties to conservative Christianity, atheists tend to be Democrats. According to a 2012 Pew study, 71% of Americans who identified as atheist were Democrats. “The Republicans who spoke at the RNC seemed more like televangelists than politicians,” MacBain said. “The message was clear from the RNC: Get God, or get out.” The Republican’s 2012 platform mentions God 12 times, many of which describe the “God-given” rights that the Republican Party says are inherent to the American idea. Though most atheist groups claim that there are closeted atheists serving as representatives and senators, only one has come out as such. In September 2007, Rep. Pete Stark, Democrat of California, affirmed his atheism in a speech at the Humanist Chaplaincy at Harvard University. soundoff (3,922 Responses)« Previous 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 Next »
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Wow, I am so sad for those atheist. I agree with KB, -and what exactly were they going to talk about? they certainly can't open or close a convention with a prayer. Have your own convention and stamp your feet and pump your fists about God being a presence in the world. Oh, and while you're pumping your fist, please hand over all your US money because you can't possibly have any faith in it's value because, In God We Trust is written on it.
Your ignorance is stunning. Well done. BTW, I guess before the Civil War no one had faith in American money either, because "In God We Trust" wasn't on it then.
Here is what your forfathers thought about "In god we trust"
1.“Christianity is the most per.verted system that ever shone on man"- Thomas Jefferson
2. "The hocus-pocus phantasm of a God like another Cerberus, with one body and three heads, had its birth and growth in the blood of thousands and thousands of martyrs." -Thomas Jefferson
3. "It is too late in the day for men of sincerity to pretend they believe in the Platonic mysticisms that three are one, and one is three; and yet the one is not three, and the three are not one- Thomas Jefferson
4. "And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will be cla.ssed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away with all this artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine doctrines of this the most venerated reformer of human errors."- Thomas Jefferson
5. "There is not one redeeming feature in our superst.ition of Christianity. It has made one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites."- Thomas Jefferson
6. "Lighthouses are more useful than churches."- Ben Franklin .
7. "The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason."- Ben Franklin
8. "I looked around for God's judgments, but saw no signs of them."- Ben Franklin
9. "In the affairs of the world, men are saved not by faith, but by the lack of it."- Ben Franklin
10. "This would be the best of all possible worlds if there were no religion in it"- John Adams
11. "The New Testament, they tell us, is founded upon the prophecies of the Old; if so, it must follow the fate of its foundation.'- Thomas Paine
12. "Of all the tyrannies that affect mankind, tyranny in religion is the worst."- Thomas Paine
13. "I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish Church, by the Roman Church, by the Greek Church, by the Turkish Church, by the Protestant Church, nor by any Church that I know of. My own mind is my own Church. Each of those churches accuse the other of unbelief; and for my own part, I disbelieve them all."- Thomas Paine
14. "Take away from Genesis the belief that Moses was the author, on which only the strange belief that it is the word of God has stood, and there remains nothing of Genesis but an anonymous book of stories, fables, and traditionary or invented absurdities, or of downright lies."- Thomas Paine
15. "All national inst.itutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit."- Thomas Paine
16. "It is the fable of Jesus Christ, as told in the New Testament, and the wild and visionary doctrine raised thereon, against which I contend. The story, taking it as it is told, is blasphemously obscene.”- Thomas Paine
17. "Religious controversies are always productive of more acrimony and irreconcilable hatreds than those which spring from any other cause. Of all the animosities which have existed among mankind, those which are caused by the difference of sentiments in religion appear to be the most inveterate and distressing, and ought most to be depreciated. I was in hopes that the enlightened and liberal policy, which has marked the present age, would at least have reconciled Christians of every denomination so far that we should never again see the religious disputes carried to such a pitch as to endanger the peace of society."- George Washington
18. "The Bible is not my book, nor Christianity my profession."- Abraham Lincoln
19. "It may not be easy, in every possible case, to trace the line of separation between the rights of religion and the Civil authority with such distinctness as to avoid collisions and doubts on unessential points. The tendency to unsurpastion on one side or the other, or to a corrupting coalition or alliance between them, will be best guarded agst. by an entire abstinence of the Gov't from interfence in any way whatsoever, beyond the necessity of preserving public order, and protecting each sect agst. Trespa.sses on its legal rights by others."- James Madison
20. "Religious bondage shackles and debilitates the mind and unfits it for every noble enterprise."- James Madison
I am an Athiest, and I have no problem with both parties doing what they think is best to win. Personally, the thought of a Republican president is terrifying, I want Obama to win this election and if his party thinks the best thing for that is to bring God back into the party for the election, then so be it. In the end I am confident the Democrat's policies are much more suited for an Athiest like myself, but I am not naive enough to think a platform geared towards Athiests is a winning one in this day and age, maybe in 30 years.
As for the person on the rant about crosses at war memorials, don't you think it is a bit ignorant to put up a religious symbol as a memorial to a group of Americans who may or may not be Christian, in a country where people may or may not be Christian? Can you really not see why people would have a problem with that?
well spoken
Stephen F Roberts: “I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.”
How dumb can an atheist be thinking that they should get representation from a political group in a society that considers "god" as something real. And there's the rub. Political groups can't apease the atheists without angering the religious zealots so not all the people are represented because of their religious beliefs or non-beliefs. Yet people can sneak into out country and have more protections than natural born citizens regardless of their religious beliefs.
Oh, I agree totally. It's super-dumb that a certain class of citizens think that they deserve representation in our REPRESENTATIVE government.
To remove God would mean to experiment with an America that we have not known. The times are too unstable to integrate another variable in the equation. Namely, no references to God in politics. God (or the notion of God, for the non-believer) is a historical figure in the American narrative. He cannot be removed. That would be be intellectually dishonest.
What a load of horse-hockey.
I am an Athiest and I whole heartedly agree with you sir. Well said.
1) Provide demonstrable, objective evidence and irrefutable proof that your magic fairy actually exists.
2) Provide demonstrable, objective evidence on how this magic fairy accomplished creating everything we see and know, along with walking us step by step through the actual creation process.
3) Provide demonstrable, repeatable, and objective evidence that miraculous events actually occur in nature (while ruling out all possibilites that these events were not in fact caused by natural causes instead), as well as demonstrating that your specific fairy of choice is actually responsible for making them happen.
4) Provide demonstrable, repeatable and objective evidence that your sky-daddy came to Earth, was born of a virgin birth and ended up rising from the dead. At the same time, please demonstrate why I should regard Romulus' virgin birth as mythical, Ascepius' miraculous healing and raising the dead as mythical, Osiris' and Dionysus' resurrections as mythical, Romulus' and Heracles' ascensions as mythical, but Jesus' resurrection as factual history.
5) Provide demonstrable evidence that prayer affects anything at all in the real world (Note: countless studies have already demonstrated beyond a reasonable doubt that the act of praying does not affect anything at all, so you will have to refute all these studies during your analysis and experimentation).
6) Provide demonstrable and objective evidence that your specific sky-fairies, Yahweh and Jesus, are the deities that exist in lieu of all the other proposed deities that have been hypothesized throughout recorded history.
7) Provide demonstrable and objective evidence that any of the events portrayed in the bible actually took place in the world otherwise known as reality.
8) Convincingly explain why anyone should regard Genesis' creation account as literal history, but the earlier Sumerian Eridu and Babylonian Enuma Elish, with their striking parallels to the Hebrew account, as mythical.
9) Provide one single Old Testament prophecy which states that God will have to take the form of a man, suffer, die and rise again in order to establish salvation in the form of everlasting life.
Ready, set, go. Only peer reviewed, objective evidence for your response, please.
John,
Well spoken
Stephen F Roberts: “I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.”
the upcoming election will prove two points.
(a) that christians are believers according to convenience, and
(b) that republican christians are republicans first and christians second
Romney is a mormon which is a religion that, as well as co-optingsome parts and characters from the bible word for word, also contradicts and makes a mockery of so many key christian religious beliefs that it should be a bigger issue to christians than gay marriage and abortion. But ... the same way as christians always pick and choose which parts of the bible to loudly proclaim and which parts of the bible to pretend don't exist ... they will ignore all these issues and vote for Romney anyway.
What do you think God/Jesus will think of you if you give your vote to a man who truly believes that he will one day be a God? Or a man who truly believes that Joseph Smith, a 19th century reknowned con-man, is an equal of Jesus?
Go on christans, pretend you never read this post. Find some obscure bible quote that will justify you supporting a cult. What a joke!
Awesome!
Dyslexic = anxiety
take your meds but skip the prayer
Hi, Christian here. You atheists need to work on unity. One guy just went on about separation of church and state and now you want to mock those Christians who don't vote for Christians... Anything to argue I suppose.
At any rate, if vote for a mormon, it will be because I have more belief in his economic policies and foreign policies than anything else. I don't particularly care what a president's religious beliefs are... the president isn't raising my kids or building my family – that's my job. I just want the economy fixed.
MOVE – I'm tired of the majority changing for the minority when it comes to God. I'm not asking you to change your belief, but please stop expecting me to change mine to relieve you of anxiety or being out of your comfort zone. Please find a new comfort zone – in another country if needed.
Kathy: if you are wondering why athiests and agnostics comment as vitriolically as they do on this site, check out au . org which is a site devoted to the first amendment and the separation of church and state.
many christians (but by no means all) in this country are behaving like the taliban and trying to change the laws and education to force the christian religion down everyone's throats. this has got to stop.
Kathy,
Noone is asking you to change your faith or your beliefs. We just want you to realize that the religious beliefs you hold can not and must not be allowed to have and official or legal effect on other people's lives.
I couldn't agree more. If anyone would just take the time to read a book or manuscript drafted by the founding fathers, they could plainly see that this country was founded upon Judeo/Christian beliefs. There will always be those that want to rewrite history, but the facts, not opinions, prove over and over that God was essential in the development and success of this nation.
@Myka,
No it wasn't. This nation was founded on certain core principles (independence, freedom from tyrany and control, personal responsibility, a foundation of citizen driven law, and the ability of all to come together and works as one to defend the common good). Some of the values, and the personal moralities of the founding fathers are the same as those espoused (though in my opinion not always followed) in Judeo/Christian techings, but none of them came from Christianity or Judeaism. All of those principles existed outside of and in many cases before anyone ever even heard of Jesus, or cared about Abraham. So no, it doesn't matter how strongly you're opinionated to make it so, this Country is not founded on Judeo/Christian beliefs/morals/ethics. It is founded on principles that resemble them, and yet are so much better.
That vote was a joke. They didn't have the votes needed to pass it. Another example of Dems not listening and just doing what the President wants even though the people don't want it.
Tough ti$$&^s, atheists.
And still, after 2,000 yeras not one single shred of evidence for your invisible sky fairy. Truth hurts, doesn't it?
"Nonbelievers" is a stupid term. Sorry that we believe in science.
If we didn't have GOD, "atheist's" wouldn't exist. So, you can thank him...go!!!
Prove it.
There is no god...go!
Atheism is a response to the belief in gods. Something does not have to exist in order for people to believe in it, see Santa Clause and Big Foot.
Who are you kidding? There have been atheist parties before, and even atheist countries. Why, just look no further than the Soviet Union, North Korea, and Cuba... Why shouldn't we aspire to be like that?
Atheist are not a political party nor is it a religion.
ah Cuba some of the best free health care in the west
"I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God." – George H. W. Bush.
Ah America ... not the land of the free after all.
Let us with caution indulge the supposition that morality can be maintained without religion. Reason and experience both forbid us to expect that national morality can prevail in exclusion of religious principle.
George Washington
Read more at http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/g/george_washington.html#lS8odM7xR4cPcy3M.99
The Dems clearly.
I don't care what the Atheists feel...nobody gives a poo about religious freedom anymore anyways...
Catholics strictly are against contraception and abortion, but this country wants to control the religious right of practicing the Catholic faith by forcing Catholic facilities to do something they don't believe in and force them to sin.
No respect for the religious...no one cares about the non religious.
This country is messed up.
So much for a "free country", lol.
As an atheist, I really don’t care that most of the planet believes in ancient myths and fairy tales, I do admit that I find it amazing and unbelievable though with all the knowledge that is easily available to dismiss such nonsense. But the biggest fallacy in my opinion is theists claim that they believe in god and atheists do not… this is not the main objection to organised religion… The claim that is ridiculous is that if you follow the writings in a book written thousands of years ago, by strangers claiming to chat with god, you will join all your dead relatives and Jebus and all in a disneyland in the sky….forever… and if you do not… you will rot in fire forever…. This is why atheists mock you in the comment section… as for government representation, it would be more relevant to stress scientific involvement rather than if you believe or not in ancient fictional texts.
And you fall into your own trap.
Many who believe in God don't believe everything and/or anything in ancient texts, such as the Bible.
So yeah, don't paint with such a wide brush. Oh, and think.
I love how Christians think that they should be able to pick and choose which parts of the Bible they want to believe. The whole thing is the "Word of God", is it not?
I though the Bible was the truth...the gospel. But yet religious nuts pick and choose the parts that are convenient for their argument. Atheist are rising up. It's time to put away your childish myths. It's a new day.
The atheists are not respected because they have no respect for the right of believers to worship. They drag absurd cases to the courts, such as demanding that 100 year old war memorials be removed because they have a cross on them. They file suit against the Marines because out in the middle of the desert at 29 Palms, Marines erected a cross to commemorate their comrades that died. No, don't be fooled. The atheists demand the same respect that they refuse to give to anyone else. If a cross offends, don't look at it. But people like this are the ones that destroyed Christmas celebrations in schools, and are trying to force people of faith to never demonstrate their beliefs.
Easy there TURBO! It Is not that we don’t have any respect for religion, it’s just we don’t have much respect for fools believing in foolish long outdated mythology.
@SaltyJay,
That's crap. There are over-zealous and militant athiests who don't want any religion anywhere ever. There are also Christians who think you should die if you don't believe in Jesus. You shouldn't base definitions on extremes. The majority of athiests don't care what people believe, and you would be amazed at the number of us that serve in teh armed forces to make sur ethat you have all the rights your used to, including the ability to worship whatever makes you happy. What those athiests generally DON'T want, is the artifices of a baseless and unsupported myth forcing their way into the public square. You want to make a memorial to honor the dead, go to town, but unless you have a written affidavit from each person that died saying they're all christian, leave the cross (or any religious icon for that matter) off of it. You don't need religion to recognize loss. And you CAN NOT put religious symbols on government property (aside from Official Chapels/Worship Centers), because the Consttution says that the government shall not endorse any one religion. It's not hard to figure out.
Are there silly lawsuits like those from some atheists? Sure. But what I find more disturbing is Christian politicians passing laws based on their religion that everyone must follow.
Atheists should start their own party. They could borrow the Nazi moniker "National Socialists" which would go well with Social Darwinism espoused by Hitler. Or maybe the Stalinist party. There are precedents. It need not be a problem.
( I thought that science was supposed to liberate people from the shackles of religion. Blog atheists are making God's existence the most important question of all, and appear enslaved by their emotions.)
Hitler was a god fearing catholic you tool!
He wrote about his catholicism throughout Mein Kampf.
Yes and "Gott mit Uns!" was on EVERY Nazi belt buckle too...
You are misinformed.
Social Darwinism is distinct from the biological theory of evolution, and is only loosely connected with Charles Darwin, whom Hitler is not known to have ever mentioned in any of his writings or speeches.
Furthermore, using Hitler's belief in evolution as an argument against evolutionary science is an example of the logical fallacy of an argument from adverse consequences, suggesting that we should not accept the theory of evolution because it could lead to the kind of racist views perpetuated by Hitler. Even if the connections between the theory of evolution, social Darwinism and the Holocaust can ever be made, this does not imply that evolution is a dangerous theory, and only implies that Hitler had perverted the theory to justify his beliefs and actions.
But, Hitler did not reject religion in any way, shape or form. That is a lie perpetuated by Christians. One only has to read from his own writings to appreciate that Hitler's god equals the same god of the Christian Bible, and it is quite clear you have never even read Mein Kampf.
As more evidence to his claimed Christianity, he said:
"My feelings as a Christian points me to my Lord and Savior as a fighter. It points me to the man who once in loneliness, surrounded by a few followers, recognized these Jews for what they were and summoned men to fight against them and who, God's truth! was greatest not as a sufferer but as a fighter. In boundless love as a Christian and as a man I read through the passage which tells us how the Lord at last rose in His might and seized the scourge to drive out of the Temple the brood of vipers and adders. How terrific was His fight for the world against the Jewish poison. To-day, after two thousand years, with deepest emotion I recognize more profoundly than ever before the fact that it was for this that He had to shed His blood upon the Cross. As a Christian I have no duty to allow myself to be cheated, but I have the duty to be a fighter for truth and justice... And if there is anything which could demonstrate that we are acting rightly it is the distress that daily grows. For as a Christian I have also a duty to my own people.
-Adolf Hitler, in a speech on 12 April 1922 (Norman H. Baynes, ed. The Speeches of Adolf Hitler, April 1922-August 1939, Vol. 1 of 2, pp. 19-20, Oxford University Press, 1942)
It also should be noted that Adolph Hitler could never have come into power without the support of the Protestant and Catholic churches and the German Christian populace. Hitler held strong faith in all his convictions. He justified his fight for the German people and against Jews by using godly and biblical reasoning.
As for the other lunatics that you mention, not a single one of them committed those atrocities in the name of atheism. Atheism is the lack of a belief in supernatural agents and nothing more. These monsters were not interested in scientific investigation, discovery, or the pursuit of knowledge. They were simply human beings who craved power and their thrust was aimed strictly at politics. Non-belief in supernatural agents has nothing to do with mass murder, political parties or the lust for power. And not one single atheist I know or have ever encountered looks up to any of those people or their horrendous deeds. Please stop projecting your falsehoods that have no basis in reality.
A God fearing Catholic? That is hilarious. He didn't know what the heck he was, but he certainly wasn't a God fearing Catholic. He was a mixed up dude. Later in life he was involved with the occult big time.
However, here is Prime Number's point. The Nazi's used a method called Eugenics to support their race based society. Eugenics is steeply rooted in evolution and the survival of the fittest. Tell you what, just take that nugget and read about it. I live in Washington DC and have been to the Holocaust Museum on more than one occasion. It has amazing photos and periodicals that firmly support the use of Eugenics in the Nazi party.
It's amazing how many christians shout "Nazi!" when dealing with atheists. It simply shows their ignorance of history. It also shows that they are trying to create irrational hatred against atheists by using lies. It's a rather cowardly approach. These christians are not good people, no matter how "saved" they think they are.
RFBJRL:
Eugenics is as far from evolution as a poodle is from a wolf. Eugenics is breeding for specific traits. In the process of evolution, the traits that are most successful are the ones that are passed on. See the difference?
All I can say is Boo Hoo!!
I'm curious what exactly an atheist would get up an say? What exactly defines an atheist beyond normal day-to-day life. They complain about not having a recognized voice int he conventions. Would their speech basically revolve around slamming people of faith, and how bad they psyche is hurt every time they have to fight to remove religious symbols from government owned locations?
Yeah... giving that a voice at an event like a convention would go over really well (democrat or republican), in an event designed from the ground up to make the sleazy politician look like he/she relates to the common person.
Why don't the atheist's have their own convention and nominate their own candidate. Then they can have it their way.
Unfortunately Sagan, Aasimov and Hitchens are dead and Dawkins is a Brit. Sam Harris maybe?
I didn't realize you had to be religious to have a voice in this country. From you comment it sounds like it. This is one atheist that has had just about enough of your kinds crap.
That's not such a bad idea...but to gather some legitamacy,, we would need to pretend to believe in something absurd like you... maybe we could all join Homer's Illiad and pray to the cyclops as the one true god! and maybe we could get 22 mermaids as wives when we die?? theists will find my comments ridiculous...as we find yours...same thing!!
There are more gaps and contradictions in and between religion(s) than science and evolution.