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November 28th, 2012
05:49 AM ET
Rick Warren on gay marriageAmerican evangelical Christian pastor Rick Warren discusses homosexuality and gay marriage with CNN's Piers Morgan. |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.  |
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I wonder when Warren is going to come out of the closet?
Maybe he's waiting because he knows that he would make one ugly gay man.
I think Rick and Marcus Bachmann would make a cute couple..
As soon as he gets a "Deep Throated endorsement" from Franklin Graham, like Romney did. (look it up)
1) Two people date. They fall in love. They get engaged. They get married. They chose not to have children.
2) Two people date. They fall in love. They move in together. They adopt a child.
3) Two people date. They fall in love. They get engaged. They get married. They are past child bearing age.
4) Two people date. They fall in love. They get engaged. They get married. They have five kids.
All four couples have intercourse regularly. Some use birth control. Some don't have to. Which couple is "right"?
It doesn't matter..... because it is none of anyone else's business....amd in that respect they all are "rght".
There's no such thing as the "gay lifestyle". It's a term blowhards such as Rick Warren use to suggest that being gay is a choice. It's suggests something one decides for one's life such as Mountain living or Urban Lifestyle. He's preposterous. So far as I know Christ never preached against being gay but there is a discussion in the Bible about the sin of gluttony, something he should work on given the size of his waistline.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genetics_of_obesity
Could someone please let me know what the "gay lifestyle" is? I went to work this morning, plan on going to Wendy's for lunch, have Taco Bell for dinner and eventually head to bed with my boyfriend. I don't have any rainbows on my car, don't draw attention to myself by acting ludicrously flaming, and don't shove anything in anyone's face. You love who you love, I love who I love. I guess I miss the part where that it effects anyone else.
As far as choice goes. I guess I chose to date a blond guy, but I'm not sure I did anything to prevent myself from seeing not being all that interested in the ladies like that. They're nice to be around and I certainly wouldn't burst into flames seeing one. Just at the end of the day I'm quite happy with the situation I'm in.
The religious just use "gay lifstyle" as a term of derision in an attempt to create an "us" vs "them".
I have never understood how gay people do harm to them. I know their magic book and invisible friend don't like you but they have quite the crusade going.
Free gift available. Life saving information available.
Do you want it?
No thanks, I already have health care.
We all die eventually there are no absolute life saving techniques.
Like all frauds, the free gift isn't really free is it?
Worship me and love me unconditionally, or I will torture you for all eternity. Your god is simply a souped up wife-beater.
The problem with Christianity is it first requires one to be convinced that they are fundamentally broken. Unfortunately for Christianity it is very difficult to convince happy healthy people that there is something wrong with them.
Problem is, you have to die before you can ever know if God lives up to his end of the bargain.
Let's say you were in a crowded room and you saw a bunch of people going up to others, insult them, and then leave the room never to return. You ask somebody what's going on and they tell you that there's a rumour that some guy is handing out new Ferraris filled with cash to anyone who did this, would you be tempted?
@Huebert,
The problem with Christianity is it first requires one to be convinced that they are fundamentally broken.
THIS. This right here. Very well written, thank you. I can not tell you how long it took me to understand not only this, but the fact that I wasn't broken.
Unfortunately for Christianity it is very difficult to convince happy healthy people that there is something wrong with them.
Especially not ones who at one time believed that they were fundamentally broken, but have found that the only thing broken was their perception of the person they were.
Your religion implies that god wants to punish us with unimaginable pain for all of eternity because of what we are, even though he created us. It also implies that the only way god will forgive us (for something we didn't do) is with a blood sacrifice in the middle east as a form of scapegoating. Do you not see the flaws in this idea?
If it was actually free why would it matter if it was accepted of not?
It sounds to me like "an offer you can't refuse" from the Godfather....if you know what's good for ya!
@Huebert
For the record, I believe in Yeshua and YHWH. You are correct, those who live life happy do often fail to see the need. I also see that the atheists / anti Bible people are posting more true statements than the people claiming allegiance to the Bible. So I have neither the time nor ability to argue my faith on a forum such as this. So to the Christians I say, you really need to reexamine the Book. Are yours posts factual? Do the reflect how we share our faith? How often did the one you call Jesus attack others ? Why are Christians so lacking in Good News, love, service to the poor, mercy, compassion, and just plain Bible knowledge. Why do you spout the big name preacher words over the Bible? And read the Book. The God in the Bible used nonbelievers to shame believers. Their rightiousness often a contrast to the believers. So be careful in setting yourselves up as a judge. These posts by Christians make me cringe.
If someone had cancer or aids, would you want them to know?
If someone's child was attached by a wolf, would you tell the parents?
If a person found a million dollars with your name on a note saying it belong to you, would you want themto find you and give it to you?
If someone had a gift worth all the gold in the world, would you want that gift?
If you were drowning, a man in a boat says "here's a life line", would you accept it?
GOD is sending people into all of your lives with both bad news and the GOODNEWS. Salvation is available for anyone and everyone who will receive and accept it.
ONLY HE CAN SET YOU FREE, HEAL YOU AND REDEEM YOU.
GOD loves you.
Open your hearts today.
And your rambling has what to do with the fundamental civil right for gays to marry?
You aren't capable of considering a view point other than your own are you?
@ Help – your first five examples are easily measurable, quantifiable, repeatable, observable, and can be tested. You then try to equate your unfounded statements about your god to the first five examples. Nothing that you claim about your god is measurable, quantifiable, repeatable, observable, and your claims cannot be tested.
@help me help you: ....................................here's a word of advice; HELP YOURSELF.
those that think like you are you,those that don't never will so just you do you and let us do us.
thanks. 🙂
yes, please do help yourself first. Go get some help for your mental illness. Get out of the cult you are in.
From each of the responses, your answers would be "no", if that person's view of your life style choices differ from the person trying to help you.
Interesting.
Okay, you made your choice.
I'm good with that. Have a day only you can enjoy.
@ help – using your example of the drowning man – he is drowning, and a boat come s along. There are two people in the boat. They each have a piece of advice for you to follow. But, you are only allowed to follow one piece of advice. Man # 1 says, here, take this lifeline that i will throw to you, and I'll pull you to the boat. Man # 2 says, Pray to god to save you. BTW, the answer – "he prayed to god and god sent the man with the lifeline" is not available.
Which course of action would you take? Praying to god, or grabbing the lifeline?
" if that person's view of your life style choices "
Except, of course, that being born gay is an orientation, not a choice. It seems like your underlying Dunning-Kruger effect is prohibiting you from understanding this.
@help you: "differ from the person trying to help you."
1) who the FRACK asked you for help? NO ONE.
2) if your opinion differs from mine while you are "trying to help me" then take the hint and STFU.
3) i aid plenty of people regardless of........well anything that makes them different from myself, i just don't preach at them while i help.......................nor do i act like your preachers and ask for money.
4) if your god was so powerful why doesn't he just pluck you out of the water to save you from drowning? well i guess he was very lonely and "ready for you to come home."
Why do you think your list of real, proven threats is in any way similar to the supposed threat of God's wrath? Why not list someone about to walk into vampire territory, or someone about to do something against their horoscope?
Actually, I do appreciate your efforts to save me. I mean it's annoying to listen to and all, and don't even try and get up in my face in person, but given what you believe, I think trying to save me makes sense. That said, it's not going to work, but really, thanks for caring enough to try. As a tip, I'd lay off the ALL CAPS...it tends to look a bit silly and turn people off.
@Help,
If someone had cancer or aids, would you want them to know?
Have you ever had either? Ever known anyone who did? I have held the hand and taken the final walk with many. Both diseases ravage the body, strip dignity and self reliance away and devastate not only the people who are ill, but everyone around them. Using this in your flawed analogy is disgusting and repugnant..
If someone's child was attached by a wolf, would you tell the parents?
I'm guessing you mean "attacked" not "attached" but either way I'm sure the parents already know.
If a person found a million dollars with your name on a note saying it belong to you, would you want themto find you and give it to you?
Only if it actually did belong to me, but seeing as I've never HAD a million dollars, nor have I earned a million dollars, I'm guessing it doesn't, so no. I would rather they gave it to whoever it actually belonged to, and if the "owner" couldn't be found, I'd rather see it given to organizations that do good work in making a difference in the world.
If someone had a gift worth all the gold in the world, would you want that gift?
No. Very much no. There isn't enough no in the world.
If you were drowning, a man in a boat says "here's a life line", would you accept it?
Depends on whether or not I was actually drowning or if the man just thought I was drowning, and whether the rope was actually a rope or a noose, and whether that life line came with caveats.
GOD is sending people into all of your lives with both bad news and the GOODNEWS. Salvation is available for anyone and everyone who will receive and accept it.
The REALLY good news? You don't need a god to save yourself. I won't lie and tell you that isn't a world of work, but I'm living proof that it can be done. Look in the mirror, really see yourself. Not the broken facade that you've been taught to see, but the person you are under that.
ONLY HE CAN SET YOU FREE, HEAL YOU AND REDEEM YOU.
The only redemption you need is from the lies you've told yourself. Set yourself free.
GOD loves you.
But do you love yourself?
If someone is in an abusive relationship wouldn't you pull them aside and try and help them.
pssst....come here
Signs you are in an abusive relationship
– Monitors what you're doing all the time
– Decides things for you that you should be allowed to decide (like what to wear or eat)
– Threatens to hurt you, or your children
– Blames you for his or her violent outbursts or shortcomings
-Being s.e.xually controlling
– You have an impending sense of consequence that will come if you don't "obey."
AMEN!
If you want to be gay, go be gay, live in total gay bliss, it is your choice. But please stop trying to convince the rest of us that it is more than a lifestyle choice. We are not buying it.
" it is your choice...." False, but you already knew that, and posted a lie anyway. How very Christian of you.
"Ronald Regonzo" who degenerates to:
"Salvatore" degenerates to:
"Douglas" degenerates to:
"truth be told" degenerates to:
"Thinker23" degenerates to:
"Atheism is not healthy ..." degenerates to:
"another repentant sinner" degenerates to:
"Dodney Rangerfield" degenerates to:
"tina" degenerates to:
"captain america" degenerates to:
"Atheist Hunter" degenerates to:
"Anybody know how to read? " degenerates to:
"just sayin" degenerates to:
"ImLook'nUp" degenerates to:
"Kindness" degenerates to:
"Chad" degenerates to
"Bob" degenerates to
"For the Lulz" degenerates to:
"nope" degenerates to:
"2357" degenerates to:
"WOW" degenerates to:
"fred" degenerates to:
"!" degenerates to:
"John 3:16" degenerates to:
"pervert alert" is the degenerate.
This troll is not a christian.
T.A. – I disagree. Lulz demonstrates the 3 prime attributes of contemporary Christians quite well.
Lulz, several times so far this morning you have sttated that gays choose to be gay. And severral times you have been asked to provide the citations to the actual peer-reviewed scientific research that supports your contention. So far, you have refused to do this.
Can you either provide these citations, or explain why you are unable to do so?
@ Lulz – so, then will you share with the comment board your experiences of sitting in your bedroom, flipping a coin, trying to decide if you were going to be gay or straight, or bis-exual, or a-s-exual.
Not sure why everyone is over analyzing one word in your post. The point is 1Cor5
Let's stop worrying about the lifestyles of those around us and in return, they should accept our differences with their views on life. We should be more concerned with ourselves first and our Church family. This country allows us to be everything from Amish to Neo Nazi's. We can't fix everyone and it's not our job. We simply preach the Good News and serve the poor and needy. Those that listento the Message, we teach and train in the Word. And fixing people to our interpretation of the Bible that most Christians misunderstand, is dangerous and puts us in God's role.
@ AaaaCaaa – gay folks are not "broke", thus there is nothing to "fix".
For the Lulz
I guess you think being left-handed is just a lifestyle choice too, eh?
I'm not left-handed and I have no temptation to even try being left-handed for a little while, so it must be just some weird thing some people do just to be "different". Sick people, why can't they just be like everyone else, the way I am, the way God must have intended us to be. 😉
@ Paul – we obviously need to go back to the days when we would beat the left handedness out of kids. That would stop them from experimenting with this dangerous lifestyle choice!
You lulz...don't worry, we don't care if you're "not buying it" it's not for sale. Take your dark ages and go live under your rock.
@primewonk. Understood there is nothing to fix. I was being partly sarcastic and partly looking at the Christian point of view that feels the need to wrongly interpret Scripture, misapply it, and the force others to live by their version.
Primewonk
That wasn't so long ago. I went to Catholic school and the nuns did beat kids on the knuckles with rulers for trying to write with their left hands. One guy in my second grade class writes with his left now, but still has terrible handwriting because he wasn't allowed to practice in school. I'm a bit odd. I'm right-handed except when I shoot or throw darts. I'm a switch-hitter too (in baseball 🙂 )
Funny, the Bible actually has 25 verses degrading left-handedness, and there's a strong Christian tradition linking red-headedness to evil as well. let's hope this last superst ition dies like these others soon.
"have turned from that lifestyle to a normmal lifestyle"
This is not true which is why hundreds of thousands of experts in this country released this statement.
Heterosexual behavior and homosexual behavior are normal aspects of human sexuality. Despite the persistence of stereotypes that portray lesbian, gay, and bisexual people as disturbed, several decades of research and clinical experience have led all mainstream medical and mental health organizations in this country to conclude that these orientations represent normal forms of human experience. The American Academy of Pediatrics, the American Counseling Association, the American Psychiatric Association, the American Psychological Association, the American School Counselor Association, the National Association of School Psychologists, and the National Association of SocialWorkers, together representing more than 480,000 mental health professionals, have all taken the position that homosexuality is not a mental disorder and thus is not something that needs to or can be “cured."
Some of these same "experts" are now trying to say that Ped0phillia is genetic. Scientists also claimed the world was flat in the medieval times. Believe what you want...
@ Lulz – pedophiia is wrong becausee it violates the rights of another. Not sure why you nutters keep trying to use this argument.
And no actual scientists in the middle ages said the earth was flat. Scientists as far back as the Greeks and Persians said the earth was spherical.
There was a recent "scientific" report about it, google it....
Primewonk they have to use that argument because they don't have any real facts to back themselves up on the gay and lesbian issue so they deflect to other things that are illegal and harmful to others. It just continues to prove the point that prejudice people are simply uneducated.
@ lulz...
"Pedophilia" was an accepted practice in all cultures throughout history, regardless of any current claims of the "philosophers" of Human Genetics.
And, I am quite unfortunate in that I missed that day in my Texas high school education...could you remind me which "scientists" "believed" in a flat earth?
I can't help but think that the Texas School Board of Education would have made that a highlight of K-12 History, right along side those Science classes on how Noah had cages big enough for dinosaurs (photos and all, from the Soviet expedition)...
Gay Gene – right.... Kind of like the murder gene, thief gene and I don't like chocolate cake gene...
"Gay Gene – right.... "
Look up a phenotype. All major medical professional organizations concur that sexual orientation is not a choice and cannot be changed, from gay to straight or otherwise. The American, Canadian, Australian, New Zealand, and European Psychological, Psychiatric, and Medical Associations all agree with this, as does the World Health Organization and the medical organizations of Japan, China, and most recently, Thailand. Furthermore, attempts to change one's sexual orientation can be psychologically damaging, and cause great inner turmoil and depression, especially for Christian gays and lesbians.
The scientific evidence of the innateness of homosexuality, bisexuality, and transgenderism is overwhelming, and more peer-reviewed studies which bolster this fact are being added all the time. Science has long regarded sexual orientation – and that's all sexual orientations, including heterosexuality – as a phenotype. Simply put, a phenotype is an observable set of properties that varies among individuals and is deeply rooted in biology. For the scientific community, the role of genetics in sexuality is about as "disputable" as the role of evolution in biology.
On the second point, that there is no conclusion that there is a "gay gene," they are right. No so-called gay gene has been found, and it's highly unlikely that one ever will. This is where conservative Christians and Muslims quickly say "See, I told you so! There's no gay gene, so being gay is a choice!"
Many of these reparative "therapists" are basing this concept on a random Bible verse or two. When you hold those up against the mountain of scientific research that has been conducted, peer-reviewed, and then peer-reviewed again, it absolutely holds no water. A person's sexuality – whether heterosexual, homosexual, or bisexual – is a very deep biological piece of who that person is as an individual.
The fact that a so-called "gay gene" has not been discovered does not mean that homosexuality is not genetic in its causation. This is understandably something that can seem a bit strange to those who have not been educated in fields of science and advanced biology, and it is also why people who are not scientists ought not try to explain the processes in simple black-and-white terms. There is no gay gene, but there is also no "height gene" or "skin tone gene" or "left-handed gene." These, like sexuality, have a heritable aspect, but no one dominant gene is responsible for them.
Many genes, working in sync, contribute to the phenotype and therefore do have a role in sexual orientation. In many animal model systems, for example, the precise genes involved in sexual partner selection have been identified, and their neuro-biochemical pathways have been worked out in great detail. A great number of these mechanisms have been preserved evolutionarily in humans, just as they are for every other behavioral trait we know (including heterosexuality).
There are many biologic traits which are not specifically genetic but are biologic nonetheless. These traits are rooted in hormonal influences, contributed especially during the early stages of fetal development. This too is indisputable and based on extensive peer-reviewed research the world over. Such prenatal hormonal influences are not genetic per se, but are inborn, natural, and biologic nevertheless.
Whether or not something is a choice is not a suitable criterion for whether someone should have equal rights and protections. Religion is indisputably a choice, but that fact is a not a valid argument for discriminating against a particular religion.
I know you are trolling to try and point out, in a satirical way, how stupid the anti-gay christian argument is, but the problem is that a lot of them actually think this way.
So people who have left the gay lifestyle, I know several, were hit by gamma radiation or something to kill said gene???
I'm always curious about why folks who purposefully choose to be ignorant about science come onto internet message boards and demonstrate that ignorance for all to see.
No one who understands the basic science involved here says there is a gay gene. At least in humans – there does appear to be a gene in male drosophilia that we can switch on and off and alter their orientation. Humans, of course, are more complex. In humans sèxual orientation is a biological multivariate based in genetics – NOT a single gene, but groups of genes, and more importantly, how those genes are expressed – what they code for; along with hormonal baths in utero, neuronal plasticity, neuroanatomy, etc.
By the way Lulz, still waiting for you, or another fundiot, to post your citations to peer-reviewed scientific research showing gays choose to be gay.
So I am sure all those who have been rejjected by the opposite gender, abbussed or just experimenting have half of those genes maybe?
There aren't people who have changed their orientation. They are either repressing their hômosèxualiity, or they were bisèxual to start with.
Even Spitzer admits he was wrong.
@ lulz...
perhaps a course in Human Genetics (or just a library book) might help you.
...(and the Liberty University correspondence course on "Genetics" isn't recommended).
@ burning man – I would love to see how these fundiot nutters explain ERVs and cytochrome c.
@wonk
I think I read an abstact on it in the the issue before the last issue of the "Creation Research" Journal.
It was on the page with the ad for Josh McDowell's NKJV Study Bible where he highlights DNA evidence for the empty tomb.
@lulz: the gay gene. given i don't buy the term, however the effects of a birth defect such as "hymaphrodite" proves that various complications during gestation can lead to rather curious outcomes.
now seeing god loves children, don't you find it odd that he/it would permit such genetic defects to afflict children?
To be against gay marriage from a biblical point of view is to presuppose that we get our morals from the bible. Nobody actually gets their morals from the bible. You pick and choose which bible verses you want to follow based on your OWN moral guide, which is proof that you already have a moral guide that exists independent of the bible. If you actually got your morals from the bible you would have no problem with slavery, child-killing, or stoning people to death for working on the sabbath. You are just cherry picking verses to justify your bigotry while disregarding others, all the while claiming the entire book to be infallible.
ROFL! Please, please, please, educated yourself on a topic if you are going to try to criticize it. You obviously have zero clue about what the Bible says. Read it! Okay, I will make it easier for you, just read the words in red in the bible and see if your argument is still valid...
I have read it and everything I said is true and taken in context.
@forthelulz....I have read the bible and its the main reason I am an Atheist. What he stated above is true. The bible is nothing but a collection of stories stolen from earlier civilizations.
Lulz,
Do you follow every rule in the bible?
(hint: the answer is no)
OK Lulz, let's play your game. Since this is an article about gay marriage, show us the red words on loving committed consensual monogamous same sèx marriage.
After that, explain to us the red words on slaves and slavery.
I threw The Babble in the garbage years ago. Are there words in red in The Babble? Are the same words in red in every Babble? That would be a tremendous feat given the 30,000+ variations of the christian death cult!
You atheists have no clue that you have more in common with Jesus than you think. He hated the same things you do. You should really READ the Bible sometime...
We might but it is because The Babble "borrowed" concepts from other cultures – it is not unique or even special. And given its unsupported claims about the supernatural, it should be considered bad fiction at best and most likely complete bullsh!t.
Very well stated, SP!
One of the most insulting things that xians proclaim about atheists is the lack of a moral guide. The xians are ignorant beyond comprehension on this issue, not to mention hypocritical.
As a single atheist male, I have had many xian friends suggest that I should start going to their church, with the goal of finding a girlfriend. These xians know I'm a non-believer, but they are willing to assist me in perpetuating a fraud upon their fellow church members. My "moral code" has intervened in every one of these suggestions by refusing to take them up on their idea. Imagine that!
Checkmate, xians!
-–
"There ain't no jesus gonna come from the sky.
Now that I found out, I know I can cry." – John Lennon
Lulz,
Jesus was not that impressive, he contradicted himself, he did not have an original thought to pass along and used cheap palor tricks to "prove" his divinity. A real god could have done better.
Right on, Sane! This is the best, brief articulation of the point I've seen!
Jeff you said "I don't agree that the bible was written by man. Yes, the actual pages were, but the words were from God. Over time, there is no book attacked more than the bible, and yet it is still here. Using common tests of accuracy and reliability, the bible is estimated to be no less than 98% pure in its translation."
No offense, but just because the authors said they were influenced by god when they wrote the book does not mean they actually were. Humans are deceitful by nature and believing someone when they say they are under a divine influence is ignorant. It has been proven that people, emperors edited the book years after it was written. Just because the bible has been attacked over time and is still here does not prove that there is a god, it only proves that there are gullible people in the world and there always will be. Please provide a citation proving the bible is 98% accurate in translation? And furthermore, shouldn't the bible be 100% accurate assuming god influenced men to write it?
And God being God and all....couldn't he have figured out a better way to get his message across than relying on the flawed humans he created...I mean c'mon....god is pi.ssed that we are so sinful and impure and yet he thnks using us is the best way to convey his message, if that god were real he would be a twit.
And if The Babble is the inerrant word of (some) god, why does it need to be translated? Shouldn't it "speak" directly to each person – or have a Babel Fish equivalent – so that there are no errors? And why would an omniscient god use such an inefficient means to spread The Official Delusional Bullshit?
@og...
nope
@ Cheese....huge fan of your posts. Thanks for your thoughtfulness and your willingness to delve into the lack of integrity displayed by believers in their worldview, their expressions here, and in their daily lives.
It is not a deep pool; it does, however, have great breadth
Thanks BurningMan,
Funny thing is these are issues that didn't make any sense to me growing up in Christianity, but I thought I was the only one and the "experts" (clergy) would give illogical answers and when pushed further it would devolve into "you just have to have faith" and "it's a mystery" and the oldy but goody, "god's ways are not our ways". I then avoided the question and the church until I found out these questions have been asked for a long time, often in better ways than I had ever asked, but the questions have been drowned out.....religion does not like questions. I think there are a lot of people that feel they are alone like I did. Thanks for the kind words...peace.
@ Cheese...when one lives in fear of living (and dying...despite the wealth of scripture that should have transformed their lives and their thinking), you can't ask questions. The answers, as they did for me, create a dissonance that simply leads away from the mindlessness...(and, of course, we had an answer for that, too..."the (carnal) mind is enmity toward God"...
An answer for everything that answers nothing...a sad existence.
"the bible is estimated to be no less than 98% pure in it's translation"
A perfectly translated lie is still a lie.
Prayer changes things .
Prayer didn't change my thing
Until you are born again there is no prayer of yours of any value. God bless
It hasn't worked for Marcus Bachmann yet.
"Until you are born again there is no prayer of yours of any value. God bless"
LOL are you god?
I don't want to be born again.....
god's mess!
not mine
God is eternal and in perfect order. In 100 years you will be long forgotten, your mess, you lose. God bless
@midwestrail
Please show where prayer has not worked for this Bachmann person, be specific, print the prayer that was offered and your perceived result.
God bless
You don't read much, do you ?
@ just sayin...
Another profound example of Evangelical Logic...then that would mean the "Sinner's Prayer" remains unheard...
Mark Noll, a Christian historian wrote the book "the Scandal of the Evangelical Mind" published in 1987. The first sentence reads: "The scandal of the Evangelical mind is that there is no Evangelical line."
Two decades later, little has changed he remains correct.
...just sayin'...
Just Sayin,
Because Marcus Bachman is still gay.
And in 100 years we will all be gone, so what.
I didn't make the mess...
god's mess!
...that is: "the scandal of the Evangelical mind is that there is no Evangelical MIND"...
"Ronald Regonzo" who degenerates to:
"Salvatore" degenerates to:
"Douglas" degenerates to:
"truth be told" degenerates to:
"Thinker23" degenerates to:
"Atheism is not healthy ..." degenerates to:
"another repentant sinner" degenerates to:
"Dodney Rangerfield" degenerates to:
"tina" degenerates to:
"captain america" degenerates to:
"Atheist Hunter" degenerates to:
"Anybody know how to read? " degenerates to:
"just sayin" degenerates to:
"ImLook'nUp" degenerates to:
"Kindness" degenerates to:
"Chad" degenerates to
"Bob" degenerates to
"nope" degenerates to:
"2357" degenerates to:
"WOW" degenerates to:
"fred" degenerates to:
"!" degenerates to:
"John 3:16" degenerates to:
"pervert alert" is the degenerate.
This troll is not a christian.
Prayer does not; you are such a LIAR. You have NO proof it changes anything! A great example of prayer proven not to work is the Christians in jail because prayer didn't work and their children died. For example: Susan Grady, who relied on prayer to heal her son. Nine-year-old Aaron Grady died and Susan Grady was arrested.
An article in the Journal of Pediatrics examined the deaths of 172 children from families who relied upon faith healing from 1975 to 1995. They concluded that four out of five ill children, who died under the care of faith healers or being left to prayer only, would most likely have survived if they had received medical care.
The statistical studies from the nineteenth century and the three CCU studies on prayer are quite consistent with the fact that humanity is wasting a huge amount of time on a procedure that simply doesn’t work. Nonetheless, faith in prayer is so pervasive and deeply rooted, you can be sure believers will continue to devise future studies in a desperate effort to confirm their beliefs.
I don't believe in Atheism.
We can only hope.
Did you, like oh so many 'christians' pray for Obama to lose the election? Or that Marriage Equality would fail in Maine, Maryland, Washington state? Yeah, I'll bet you did... didn't work out so well, did it?
Baseline data from the EXPLORE behavioral intervention trial illustrate a number of features that are critical for the conduct of this trial and that can provide information for the conduct of other intervention trials among MSM. Furthermore, these baseline data underscore that the HIV epidemic among MSM residing in the United States continues to be a major public health issue.
One relevant study feature was the recruitment of a large cohort of high-risk MSM. This recruitment effort was the result of a coordinated effort among and within study sites and a variety of recruitment methods. Almost half of the EXPLORE respondents were recruited via direct street outreach and outreach at venues frequented by MSM, in conjunction with advertising efforts. The remainder of the cohort was recruited by means of a variety of strategies that were necessary to facilitate the recruitment of younger men and minority men, important subpopulations of MSM at particular risk.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1447872/pdf/0930926.pdf
One of the challenges in developing an effective intervention is to ensure that it is relevant to population subgroups and their circu.mstances. Previous studies have shown that MSM base their choice of whether to engage in unprotected anal se.x on several partner or relationship characteristics, including known or perceived partner serostatus, relationship status (e.g., regular vs casual), and number of partners.19–22 Most researchers have found that elevated risks are associated with primary partners. In contrast, the EXPLORE baseline data indicate that men with multiple partners of unknown and positive status were engaging in just as much unprotected anal se.x as were men with only 1 primary partner. This finding is of particular concern, as such situations carry risks of disease acquisition from partners who are HIV positive, a group that includes recently infected men who may report that they are HIV negative but who in fact may be highly infectious.
EXPLORE also showed that men with multiple partners positive for HIV antibodies were more likely to report unprotected insertive anal se.x than unprotected receptive anal se.x. From a risk reduction perspective, these men may be taking a calculated risk, in that unprotected insertive anal se.x carries a significant but lower risk of HIV acquisition relative to unprotected receptive anal se.x.23 Almost 25% of men with multiple partners positive for HIV antibodies reported unprotected receptive anal se.x, a percentage only slightly lower than that observed among men with 1 primary positive partner. Clearly, this is a situation involving high risk of HIV transmission.
Finally, there is the possibility that “negotiated safety” discussions are occurring among these men and their antibody-negative partners,20,22 although this aspect of relationships was not assessed in the EXPLORE study. About half of the men with 1 primary HIV-negative partner reported unprotected se.x. These data support the need to understand the relationship status and known or perceived serostatus of potential partners before counseling MSM about se.xual risk.
Interventions targeted at MSM also need to directly address use of alcohol and drugs. Of particular concern is the high proportion of EXPLORE men who reported drug use and engaging in unprotected receptive anal se.x with partners of positive and unknown status, the se.xual behavior with the highest risk. Although the present analysis demonstrates only the correlation between se.xual risk and substance use, this combination has been observed in numerous studies conducted among MSM24–26 and continues to be an important factor in defining se.xual risks in this population. Furthermore, given that 10% of the study population reported recently injecting drugs, interventions must inquire about injection drug use and provide guidance for prevention strategies.
Finally, and of significant concern, this contemporary cohort of MSM is at high risk of HIV infection. The largest US observational cohort investigation of MSM preceding the EXPLORE study was the first HIVNET Vaccine Preparedness Study (VPS-1), which was conducted from 1995 to 1997 at the same study sites as EXPLORE. The VPS-1 cohort exhibited an HIV incidence rate of 1.55 per 100 person-years, a high incidence.27 The level of baseline risk behaviors in the EXPLORE cohort was higher than that of the VPS-1 cohort (unpublished HIVNET data), owing in part to differences in mode of questionnaire administration (ACASI vs interview) but also as a consequence in part of EXPLORE’s efforts to increase the proportions of younger men and minority men in the cohort. The EXPLORE baseline data, in conjunction with information on the ongoing resurgence of STDs, increased HIV incidence rates, and changes in risk behaviors among MSM in many US cities, emphasize the continued need for effective behavioral strategies designed to prevent HIV infection among MSM.
High-Risk Behaviors Among Men Who Have se.x With Men in 6 US Cities: Baseline Data From the EXPLORE Study
Beryl A. Koblin, PhD, Margaret A. Chesney, PhD, Marla J. Husnik, MS, Sam Bozeman, MPH, Connie L. Celum, MD, Susan Buchbinder, MD, Kenneth Mayer, MD, David McKirnan, PhD, Franklyn N. Judson, MD, Yijian Huang, PhD, Thomas J. Coates, PhD, and the EXPLORE Study Team
June 2003, Vol 93, No. 6 | American Journal of Public Health Koblin et al. | Peer Reviewed | Research and Practice |
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1447872/pdf/0930926.pdf
*yawn*
that was so 10 years ago...
As noted on p. 1:
From below, on top, backwards, forwards, from this side of the Moon and from the other side too, ga-y s-exual activity is still mutual mas-turbation caused by one or more complex s-exual differences. Some differences are visually obvious in for example the complex maleness of DeGeneres, Billy Jean King and Rosie O'Donnell.
Yes, heteros-exuals practice many of the same "moves" but there is never a doubt who is the female and who is the male.
As noted, there are basic biological differences in gay unions vs. heterose-xual marriage. Government benefits where approved are the same in both but making the distinction is important for census data and for social responses with respect to potential issues with disease, divorce and family interactions.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
" heteros-exuals practice many of the same "moves" but there is never a doubt who is the female and who is the male."
You really need to expand your horizons. Google straight strapôn.
Strap–ons somehow turn females into males? Give us a break!!!
Well said Rick Warren. Some are confused because they think that people are "born that way". This is just not true, as many have turned from that lifestyle to a normmal lifestyle. And he is right, we must all treat each other with dignity and respect, as the Bible says that there is no degree to sin. None are worse than another. A Pastor who is stealing from the church is committing no less of a sin as someone in a gay lifestyle.
Actually, that's not what Warren said...watch the video again.
Dude, God knew Esau was a jerk before he was born. That's too much for the scientifics. They hate that knowledge.
Gay people who pretend that they are not gay are usually very unhappy. "Conversion Therapy" has been proven to do more harm that good. Science and psychology generally show that being gay is not a choice. However, religion IS a choice. Therefore, hom.os.exuality is natural and religion is unnatural.
tallulah13
You took the words right out of my mouth. Thank you for making my job a lot easier. Now I can sleep easily knowing that not everyone out there is a religious, bigoted idiot.
so using your logic, a serial killer who murders 20 people is no more sinful than a gay person.....SMH, and you wonder why people dont beileve that filth.
That would be yes, a filthy qu eer is as guilty as a mass murderer and why not. Qu eers the people who gave the world AIDS and have thus murdered millions.
The inane and delusional ramblings of the pervert are so predictable – and so entertaining in their childish clinging to false info.
The fact that your religion cannot distinguish taking the lives of others and consensual se...x between two people makes it a complete joke.
And please, do yourself a favor and research prior to posting ign....orant comments on AIDS.
Ignoring the insanity and wrongness of your knowledge of AIDS, every gay person is guilty even if individually they did nothing to spread the disease – is that your view? If yes, I assume you will condemning all Jews for the contributions a few made to the creation of the atomic bomb.
In point of fact it is true that aids came from the ho mo se xual peoples by way of bestiality and infected an innocent world.
What this world could really use is more Ugandas. There is a nation that knows what to do with qu eers. Qu eers the people who gave the world AIDS. Uganda doesn't buy some made up excuse, no thinking people do either. All qu eers must share the guilt for the filth they have unleashed on the innocent.
If the above two posters know how AIDS was spread, they will have no problem providing references to accepted scientific papers supporting their view. I believe they will have no more success doing that than they have had at proving the existence of their god(s). In short, they are hateful delusional liars without a shred of evidence for their insane views.
@alert: and that would be why uganda still has a high number of HIV cases because the infected hide for fear of their lives.....oh and btw a lot of infected happened due to ignorance during the 80's when containmentated blood transfusions were given out. striaght and gay people have died of..............well not HIV itself but of the common cold due to the effect HIV has on the human body.
i know this is pointless to tell a troll but do try and educate yourself on how this illness acts and what truly caused it.
your continuious postings of the same BS just shows a complete lack of knowledge.
I couldn't help but notice that Pravda forgot to include the citations to the actual peer-reviewed scientific research that supports his contention that gays choose to be gay.
Over the past 20 years we've asked folks like Pravda hundreds of thousands of times to post this evidence. And yet, sadly, not a single solitary one of these folks has every posted a single solitary citation. Ever.
I wonder why they won't do this? It's almost like they are making this stuff up.
@ wonk...
It might be hidden in a back-issue of the peer-reviewed "Creation Research" Journal...
(...can't even type with a straight face...)
Pravda – You are brainwashed. Try reading a book, one that isn't the bible.
And notice how silent truth and perv have gone when challenged to "put up or shut up?"
What was it you wanted to know, unlike you dregs of society I have a life and your opinions do not amount to a hill of crap, so there is no need to hang around here waiting for wisdom cause you ain't got any. I do stop by from time to time to point out the Truth. Qu eers infected the world with AIDS, only qu eers and idiots think otherwise.
"Qu eers infected the world with AIDS,"
Until recently, the origins of the HIV-2 virus had remained relatively unexplored. HIV-2 is thought to come from the SIV in Sooty Mangabeys rather than chimpanzees, but the crossover to humans is believed to have happened in a similar way (i.e. through the butchering and consumption of monkey meat). It is far rarer, significantly less infectious and progresses more slowly to AIDS than HIV-1. As a result, it infects far fewer people, and is mainly confined to a few countries in West Africa.
In May 2003, a group of Belgian researchers published a report in Proceedings of the National Academy of Science. By analysing samples of the two different subtypes of HIV-2 (A and B) taken from infected individuals and SIV samples taken from sooty mangabeys, Dr Vandamme concluded that subtype A had passed into humans around 1940 and subtype B in 1945 (plus or minus 16 years or so). Her team of researchers also discovered that the virus had originated in Guinea-Bissau and that its spread was most likely precipitated by the independence war that took place in the country between 1963 and 1974 (Guinea-Bissau is a former Portuguese colony). Her theory was backed up by the fact that the first European cases of HIV-2 were discovered among Portuguese veterans of the war, many of whom had received blood transfusions or unsterile injections following injury, or had possibly had relationships with local women.
Given the evidence we have already looked at, it seems highly likely that Africa was indeed the continent where the transfer of HIV to humans first occurred (monkeys from Asia and South America have never been found to have SIVs that could cause HIV in humans). In May 2006, the same group of researchers who first identified the Pan troglodytes troglodytes strain of SIVcpz, announced that they had narrowed down the location of this particular strain to wild chimpanzees found in the forests of Southern Cameroon . By analysing 599 samples of chimp droppings (P. T. troglodytes are a highly endangered and thus protected species that cannot be killed or captured for testing), the researchers were able to obtain 34 specimens that reacted to a standard HIV DNA test, 12 of which gave results that were virtually indistinguishable from the reactions created by human HIV. The researchers therefore concluded that the chimpanzees found in this area were highly likely the origin of both the pandemic Group M of HIV-1 and of the far rarer Group N. The exact origins of Group O however remain unknown.
HIV Group N principally affects people living in South-central Cameroon, so it is not difficult to see how this outbreak started. Group M, the group that has caused the worldwide pandemic, was however first identified in Kinshasa, in the Democratic Repub lic of Con go. It is not entirely clear how it transferred from Cameroon to Kinshasa, but the most likely explanation is that an infected individual travelled south down the San gha river that runs through Southern Cam eroon to the River Con go and then on to Kin shasa, where the Group M epidemic probably began.
Just as we do not know exactly who spread the virus from Cam eroon to Kin shasa, how the virus spread from Africa to America is also not entirely clear. However, recent evidence suggests that the virus may have arrived via the Cari bbean island of H aiti.
Percy, you made a claim about the origins of AIDS – what is your supporting evidence?
Sacrifice your children to Athena, chimps. Yourself, too . You pay.
Truth:
You stated,
"Chadism I am an atheist moron, but you are a bully and a disgrace on this board."
And then:
"Keep proving to the world atheists are nothing more than emotional immature jerks, which is why you keep losing the arguments and resort to bullying tactics."
I am slightly confused at the message.
Taking into consideration of disliking what you perceive to be cyber-bullying, which I understand, my question is this: are you an atheist?
Word Chad is derived from dangling Chad, means negativity, secular s, denier of truth absolute election, Al Gore, Grinch Bush, self centered , stole American Christmas, do you remember, goons?
MAR, who can forget?
A dangling chad is a useless one.
Meant MAD, sorry.
"Luk 6:22 Blessed are ye, when men shall hate you, and when they shall separate you [from their company], and shall reproach [you], and cast out your name as evil, for the Son of man's sake."
Who'd a thunk the men are 98.8% chimps? BBBBWWWahahahahaha. Round up, chumps!
""cry"
occurs 181 times in 168 verses in the KJV "
""hate"
occurs 87 times in 85 verses in the KJV"
The scientifics hate a god that knows more than them.
lol?? but you have to find a god that knows more than the scientifics ( sic) your god appears to know nothing... he only knew what was known by the folks who wrote the bible.. coincidence??? no talk of penguins, polar bears, walrus, seals...moose, any discussion of Antarctica? did he explain how the sun "burns" ? you know it not made of coal because?? science perhaps??
Man there is are some weird people on these forums
No arguments there.
I resemble..eh resent that remark!