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Papal diplomacy is not just pomp and circumstance
March 14th, 2013
09:42 PM ET

Papal diplomacy is not just pomp and circumstance

By Jamie Crawford, CNN

As Pope Francis assumes his role as leader of the world's 1.2 billion Catholics, he is also the newest head of a sovereign state that accepts and accredits foreign envoys while sending its own diplomats around the globe to advance its interests.

There currently are 179 diplomatic missions with ties to the Vatican.

To the casual observer, the post may seem like a dream assignment, full of pomp and circumstance in one of the world's most historic and beautiful cities. But there is more to the job than what meets the eye.

"It's really in a unique position to engage with the world's largest faith-based organization," Miguel Diaz, the most recent U.S. envoy to the Holy See, told CNN. President Barack Obama has yet to nominate a successor to Diaz, who stepped down in November.

FULL STORY
- Dan Merica

Filed under: Catholic Church • Pope • Pope Francis • Vatican

soundoff (123 Responses)
  1. http://socialwww.wordpress.com/

    foreign policy is a free policy people like most.let's get an idea about something... life is an adventure. mountain adventure is one of them. liked your site. Thanks (Diplomacy  Blog socialwww)

    March 24, 2013 at 8:34 pm |
  2. Socialwww diplomacy blog

    The Socialwww Diplomacy Blog' is a leading blog on public diplomacy and global. The Public Diplomacy Blog today enjoys a high page rank in search engines and is one of the most referred to and cited blog.

    March 24, 2013 at 8:33 pm |
  3. Goranesh

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    March 18, 2013 at 6:52 pm |
  4. EX catholic

    IDOLATRY is NOT a Religion. IDOLATRY is an abhorrente SIN a Very Serious Sin. Stop and Desist of all of that Nonsense. Jesus is the Christ the Son of the Living God.

    March 17, 2013 at 8:10 pm |
  5. BigAl

    Catholics = Self righteous, arrogant, obnoxious hypocrites. PERIOD.

    March 17, 2013 at 7:47 pm |
    • Bill Deacon

      Right! Also, self sacrificing, compassionate saints. We got it all baby!

      March 18, 2013 at 12:58 pm |
    • The Demon Deacon

      Bill Deacon
      Is irrelevant. Billy is an obsequious papal apologist. Not complaining about the media lately, Bill, hypocrisy much?

      March 18, 2013 at 1:06 pm |
    • Bill Deacon

      Can you show when I've ever complained about the media? I thought not.

      March 18, 2013 at 4:48 pm |
  6. hebrew expert

    [youtube=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KxyGwFL9T3c&w=640&h=360]

    March 16, 2013 at 11:11 pm |
  7. Dean

    Everything papal is all pomp and circumstance. All of it, all the time. Same for all of religion.

    Most people are stupid, gullible, and easily lead. That's all there is to the whole Catholic schtick, but apart from converts from big marketing efforts in third world countries, the whole RC thing appears to be on its way down and out at last. Serves them right, after centuries of evil and holding back human progress.

    March 16, 2013 at 3:31 pm |
    • John

      Atheists seem to relish the idea of death creating life, and being related to worms as a point of honorable inheritence and progress in acquiring knowledge. The reality is that getting right with God, figuring it out, and doing what he said to do before he makes the judgement, that is progress... because it brings you to Jesus, and his sacrifice for those that believe him.

      March 16, 2013 at 4:51 pm |
    • The real Tom

      John, how hairy are those triangles?

      March 16, 2013 at 5:02 pm |
    • John

      TRT, you think God being right is some kind of joke? God has been right so many times, it's like looking out into a field of grass and each blade is another instance. Or looking up into the sky at night... you eventually give up counting... if you believe him first. You think the black light hairy sun is a joke, to you it is, to me, it's him knowing what they didn't and giving it to a fisherman that could only know enough to write it down as best he could. And he was right... and he knew Jesus was right... and Jesus proclaimed God was right.

      God is right, he is the creator, of everything. The God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, he is God, the only one one, the best there is over all eternity. And God loved people so much, he gave his only begotten son to die for our sins.

      March 16, 2013 at 9:09 pm |
  8. enriquetabrasini

    Joseph. although Debbie`s rep0rt is incredible... on wednesday I bought a great new Mazda MX-5 after having made $9414 this – 5 weeks past and just over 10/k last month. it's certainly the most-comfortable work I've had. I began this 9-months ago and immediately startad making over $82, per-hour. I use this website............. BIT40. ℂOℳ

    March 16, 2013 at 6:01 am |
  9. Sage of EndTimes

    And lo, from the East, the reappearance of HeavenSent signaled the beginning of the tenth Crusade, also known as the Virtual Crusade. Joining HeavenSent, from the West, rose Live4Him whose righteous armies, armed with Sharpies were soon visible to all as they began to storm markets across the globe, attempting to blot out all UPC codes.

    March 15, 2013 at 5:02 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Assuming again, I read. Most Christians refuse to post any longer on this site for the simple reason that they are tired of reasoning with airheads that haven't a clue. As for me, I stay away from this site and pop in once in a while to find that you atheists are just as lost as ever.

      March 15, 2013 at 6:19 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      Nah, HS. You show up here when you're lonely. Nobody wants to be around you in real life. That's why you come here.

      March 15, 2013 at 6:24 pm |
  10. Hahahahahahha

    No. I'm sure there's a lot of pleasuring boys and men going on too!!! Hahahahahahahaha

    March 15, 2013 at 10:27 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Our Father is all knowing and all seeing, in light and in dark. Jesus knew that se.xually repressed humans would play with each other and with themselves. That is why god invented the Roman Catholic church.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:17 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Phony heavensent. Another foolish carnal post of yours. Boring and never creative. You too, continue to be a big part of the carnal problem in life. The sad thing is, you have no concept how lost you are.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:46 pm |
    • End Religion

      Our Father, the Flying Spaghetti Monster, is all knowing and all seeing, in light and in dark. Jesus knew that se.xually repressed humans would play with each other and with themselves. That is why His pasta is sticky and His balls so meaty, big and bouncy.

      March 15, 2013 at 6:48 pm |
    • sam stone

      Oooh.....more carnal talk from the trailer park plaything

      March 17, 2013 at 6:33 pm |
  11. William Demuth

    Sending a diplomat to the Vatican is no different than sending a diplomat to the Manson Family.

    This is a cult, pure and simple. A cult directly implicated in the buggery of 40,000 children.

    To offer it even a shred of legitimacy is to make yourself complicit in child abuse.

    This organization needs to be smashed, and then burnt to the ground, with it ashes spread on the graves of its victims

    March 15, 2013 at 10:11 am |
    • Bill Deacon

      OK, I'll bite. Show the link to 40,000

      March 18, 2013 at 1:00 pm |
    • Bill Deacon

      I thought not.

      March 18, 2013 at 4:49 pm |
  12. Vic

    Why a Pope when we have Jesus Christ?!

    March 15, 2013 at 10:09 am |
    • mzh

      If you study Christianity since the time of it is originated, you will find that it has been transformed to what it is today from what it was during the time Jesus... i.e. Catholic prays Marry and promots a dead person to a saint and believes that this dead person cures/heals them... and many more.... what is the source of these innovation in the practice of Christianity? also what is being practiced today, contradicts with what is even in Bible if you look at it carefully... but unfortunately these 1.2 billions ppl who are all my brothers and sisters in mankind do not even think for a second that they are being sold with these teachings....

      March 15, 2013 at 10:28 am |
    • HeavenSent

      mzh, Jesus warned everyone (the woes in the Bible) that most were not sent by Him (wolves in sheep's clothing). That's why Jesus told everyone to read His letter to us (the Bible) so we can strengthen ourselves in His truth and discern whether a person produces fruit of His knowledge or are dried twigs producing nothing but babble, wells without water.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:48 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Find his real truth at http://www.gaychristian101.com

      March 15, 2013 at 11:51 am |
    • *

      Fake HeavenSent,

      Please don't start...
      (let bethany and her cohorts make a mockery of christianity - don't do the same for non-believers)

      March 15, 2013 at 12:18 pm |
    • Vic

      Jesus Christ is the ONLY Mediator between us and God the Father; therefore, I don't believe in Papacy!

      1 Timothy 2:5
      "5 For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,"

      Hebrews 8:6
      "6 But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, by as much as He is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises."

      Hebrews 9:15
      "15 For this reason He is the mediator of a new covenant, so that, since a death has taken place for the redemption of the transgressions that were committed under the first covenant, those who have been called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance."

      Hebrews 12:24
      "24 and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood, which speaks better than the blood of Abel."

      Jesus Christ the Great High Priest

      Hebrews 14:14-16
      "14 Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has ascended into heaven, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold firmly to the faith we profess. 15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to empathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet he did not sin. 16 Let us then approach God’s throne of grace with confidence, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help us in our time of need."

      [Scripture is from the New American Standard Bible (NASB)]
      http://www.biblegateway.com

      March 15, 2013 at 12:33 pm |
    • Vic

      !!CORRECTION!!

      Jesus Christ the Great High Priest

      Hebrews 4:14-16
      "14 Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. 15 For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin. 16 Therefore let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need."

      [Scripture is from the New American Standard Bible (NASB)]
      http://www.biblegateway.com

      March 15, 2013 at 12:38 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Spot. It's by the grace of God that you can put one foot in front of the other.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:48 pm |
    • Akira

      Catholics believe that the bishop of Rome inherits the mantle of Peter, apostle of Jesus Christ who was entrusted with the administration of his church after he died.
      A pope is the supreme legislative, executive, and judicial authority in the Roman Catholic Church.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:51 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Vic, Jesus Christ is God who came to earth in human form. God sent himself to earth. He called Jesus His son so people could grasp the concept of what He did to save us.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:57 pm |
    • Vic

      Apostle Peter was called "Simon Peter," was married and had a son:

      Matthew 10:2
      "2 Now the names of the twelve apostles are these: The first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; and James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother;"

      Matthew 8:14
      "14 When Jesus came into Peter’s home, He saw his mother-in-law lying sick in bed with a fever."

      Mark 1:30,31
      "30 Now Simon’s mother-in-law was lying sick with a fever; and immediately they spoke to Jesus about her. 31 And He came to her and raised her up, taking her by the hand, and the fever left her, and she waited on them."

      Luke 4:38
      "38 Then He got up and left the synagogue, and entered Simon’s home. Now Simon’s mother-in-law was suffering from a high fever, and they asked Him to help her."

      1 Peter 5:13
      "13 She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you greetings, and so does my son, Mark."

      Jesus Christ is the ONLY Mediator between us and God the Father; therfore, I don't believe in Papacy!

      1 Timothy 2:5
      "5 For there is one God, and one mediator also between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,"

      Hebrews 8:6
      "6 But now He has obtained a more excellent ministry, by as much as He is also the mediator of a better covenant, which has been enacted on better promises."

      Hebrews 9:15
      "15 For this reason He is the mediator of a new covenant, so that, since a death has taken place for the redemption of the transgressions that were committed under the first covenant, those who have been called may receive the promise of the eternal inheritance."

      Hebrews 12:24
      "24 and to Jesus, the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood, which speaks better than the blood of Abel."

      Jesus Christ the Great High Priest

      Hebrews 4:14-16
      "14 Therefore, since we have a great high priest who has passed through the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our confession. 15 For we do not have a high priest who cannot sympathize with our weaknesses, but One who has been tempted in all things as we are, yet without sin. 16 Therefore let us draw near with confidence to the throne of grace, so that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need."

      [Scripture is from the New American Standard Bible (NASB)]
      http://www.biblegateway.com

      March 15, 2013 at 12:57 pm |
    • Akira

      Yes, Vic, and as I stated before, Peter didn't introduce the celibacy doctrine, and many Popes and priests in early Christianity/Catholicism were married and had families. Nothing you have printed disproves that, so what is your point?

      March 15, 2013 at 1:45 pm |
    • Akira

      Oops, sorry, Vic, I stated it on another blog, not this one. But it remains true; I am aware that Peter was married, and that he didn't start the celibacy discipline.

      March 15, 2013 at 2:12 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Psalms 14:2-4.

      Amen.

      March 15, 2013 at 6:25 pm |
    • End Religion

      Vic, stop whipping out your Peter in public!

      March 15, 2013 at 6:46 pm |
    • Akira

      ER: *snicker*

      March 15, 2013 at 8:02 pm |
  13. mzh

    hello there....

    I wish u all the best....

    March 15, 2013 at 9:30 am |
  14. CIA

    The Feds ARE monitoring these comments.

    March 15, 2013 at 9:27 am |
    • midwest rail

      Only yours, since you are obviously insane.

      March 15, 2013 at 9:39 am |
    • Read the Bible

      They would be better off to read what God said.

      March 15, 2013 at 10:54 pm |
  15. Over 40,000 denominations of insanity

    Some believe that celibacy is appropriate for certain people, or for certain positions. It's ridiculous. Celibacy is unnatural and will continue to cause problems for the religious institutions that employ it.

    Many of the people from these same institutions advocate against abortion, but don't understand the realistic benefit of the morning after pill or even basic contraception; their unrealistic wishful thinking is causing the death of many at the hands of disease. Realistically, many abortions could be avoided if a morning-after pill were not viewed as such an evil option. Many of these same people bring children into the world at a high pace, and then would prefer that the rest of society take over and educate their children in their particular brand of religion when they don't plan well.

    In the U.S. recently we learned of the head of LCMS chastising a minister of that church for participating in a joint service for the victims of the Newtown school shooting.

    One sect calls homosexuality an abomination while the next one in the same denomination is already performing gay marriage.

    One sect, the Westboro Baptist Church believes Americans are being killed at war because America is too kind to "fags".

    One sect believes that Jesus and Satan were brothers and that Christ will return to Jerusalem AND Jackson County, Missouri.

    One sect believes women to be subservient, while another sect in the same denomination promotes equality between the sexes.

    Conflicted right from the very beginning, Christianity continues to splinter and create divisions and more extremism as it goes.

    =================================================
    Has anything improved with Christianity since 200+ years ago?

    Thomas Jefferson, POTUS #3 (from Notes on the State of Virginia):

    Millions of innocent men, women, and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites. To support roguery and error all over the earth.

    James Madison, POTUS #4, chief architect of the U.S. Constitution & the Bill of Rights (from A Memorial and Remonstrance delivered to the Virginia General Assembly in 1785):

    During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What has been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the clergy; ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry, and persecution.

    John Adams, POTUS #2 (in a letter to Thomas Jefferson, 09/03/1816):

    I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved – the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced! With the rational respect that is due to it, knavish priests have added prostitutions of it, that fill or might fill the blackest and bloodiest pages of human history.

    Ben Franklin (from a letter to The London Packet, 3 June 1772):

    If we look back into history for the character of present sects in Christianity, we shall find few that have not in their turns been persecutors, and complainers of persecution. The primitive Christians thought persecution extremely wrong in the Pagans, but practised it on one another. The first Protestants of the Church of England, blamed persecution in the Roman church, but practised it against the Puritans: these found it wrong in the Bishops, but fell into the same practice themselves both here and in New England.

    Thomas Paine (from The Age of Reason):

    All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit.
    ======================================================================

    March 15, 2013 at 8:52 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Personally, I'm tired of your ignorance about Jesus' teachings. Jesus teaches us His righteous spiritual truth how to live our lives in human form. He teaches us that there is always a fork in the road for making decisions through life. We can either take the righteous fork in the road which the results are good for us as well as everyone involved or, take the unrighteous fork in the road which seems good for the unrighteous person at the time (who never worked at having eyes to see nor ears to hear His truth) only and who cares about all others. Unfortunately, taking a unrighteous path in the road of life is never good for for anyone, not only the person that gets superficial carnal benefits at the time. The unrighteous person stays stagnant and frustrated in life, never growing spiritually. Therefore, their maturity is stunted.

      You complaint is about humans trying their best to teach Jesus' truth. Some people succeed, where others fail. Get over your blindness and know, that you too are part of the human conditioned problem for rejecting Jesus' truth.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:12 am |
    • In Santa we trust

      HeavenSent. Explain how "god's guidance" is any more predictable than pure chance. If god were guiding the 7 billion currently alive and would know who was naughty and who was nice and therefore who to bestow its benificience on. Why do good people die young? why do prayers go unanswered? I know you'll say "god works in mysterious ways" – so mysterious that it is indistinguishable from pure chance.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:29 am |
    • .

      Personally, HS, I'm tired of your ignorance, period.
      OP's post was talking about what different SECTS believe, not of what Jesus taught.
      And of what out founding fathers thought.
      It's a good reminder of why YOUR beliefs have no place in OUR laws...because everyone interprets Jesus's words differently. If you were intelligent, you'd see that.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:35 am |
    • HeavenSent

      In Santa we trust, first a person needs to humble themselves to ask Jesus to come into their life. Jesus will water anyone with His truth if they take the first step to seek Him. Most people get fooled by thinking that attending church is all they need to do. It's the laziness of generations that exists today to just do the basics, thinking they will get by. It takes work and courage to be a practicing Christian. It's easy to stay lazy and live as a heathen.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:56 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Spot, I did answer the question. You can't see or read what I postedt. Why? It's simple because you don't want to. The poster is complaining about unrighteous people who got to the top ranks of the churches. Jesus warned us that most of these phonies were not sent by Him. It's phonies playing church. Same with other situations in society. Evil takes short cuts to get to the top, whereas, righteous folks work step by step to learn what is being taught, but, eventually get there.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:02 pm |
    • In Santa we trust

      HeavenSent. First, you didn't answer the question. Second, I would say it's easier using god as a crutch than dealing with the uncertainties of life.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:03 pm |
    • Brian M

      "first a person needs to humble themselves to ask Jesus to come into their life. "

      blah blah blah

      Response perfectly illustrates why we need to have separation of church and state.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:04 pm |
    • .

      Again, HS, YOUR archaic beliefs do not belong in the laws of the United States. Please learn to comprehend what you read.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:29 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      In Santa we trust, I did answer your question. You just don't know how to decipher what I wrote you. Carnally writing, anyone can learn anything if they are willing to learn it first. That's the same thing with seeking Jesus. First the person has to want to understand what He teaches. When they do this. Guess what. They learn.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:53 pm |
    • Damocles

      So it's a bit like poison, or carnal poison if you prefer.... if you really want to understand it, you just keep drinking it and damn the consequences.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:56 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Damocles, just because you walk onto a college campus without ever studying doesn't mean you learned anything.

      March 15, 2013 at 4:22 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Spot, the laws of our country are founded on Jesus' Christs teachings. You'd know that if you had eyes to see and ears to hear his spiritual truth.

      March 15, 2013 at 6:28 pm |
    • .

      Uh, no, they're not, HS, something you would know if you ever put down the Bible long enbough to learn how governments work. I'm not even going to try and educate someone who is so clueless. Stay carnal, my little idiot friend, stay carnal.

      March 15, 2013 at 6:35 pm |
    • End Religion

      source for "laws of our country are founded on Jesus' Christs teachings"?

      March 15, 2013 at 6:39 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      HS is questioning someone else's educational background after posting that it was "sewing seeds"?

      Priceless.

      March 15, 2013 at 6:39 pm |
    • OTOH

      HS has the IQ of a pin cushion.

      She was called out on her "sewing seeds" on another article; and she still doesn't get it.

      March 15, 2013 at 6:46 pm |
  16. Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

    Prayer changes things,

    March 15, 2013 at 7:32 am |
    • Jesus

      Prayer does not; you are such a LIAR. You have NO proof it changes anything! A great example of prayer proven not to work is the Christians in jail because prayer didn't work and their children died. For example: Susan Grady, who relied on prayer to heal her son. Nine-year-old Aaron Grady died and Susan Grady was arrested.

      An article in the Journal of Pediatrics examined the deaths of 172 children from families who relied upon faith healing from 1975 to 1995. They concluded that four out of five ill children, who died under the care of faith healers or being left to prayer only, would most likely have survived if they had received medical care.

      The statistical studies from the nineteenth century and the three CCU studies on prayer are quite consistent with the fact that humanity is wasting a huge amount of time on a procedure that simply doesn’t work. Nonetheless, faith in prayer is so pervasive and deeply rooted, you can be sure believers will continue to devise future studies in a desperate effort to confirm their beliefs!

      March 15, 2013 at 10:58 am |
    • Really?

      "Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things"

      That's why the data, has shown that atheists have happier and healthier lives than conservative Christians. Your post is built on a lie!

      March 15, 2013 at 11:03 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Really? What data? Data that you know how to spell LOVE, COMPASSION, RIGHTEOUSNESS etc., but you can't experience the fullness of it? Must be convenient staying at the simplistic level of life and never comprehending Jesus' abundance of life that he wants all to experience.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:17 am |
    • Yup

      "but you can't experience the fullness of it? "

      Yes we can a fuller than you.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:20 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Yup, I can tell that you are carnally full of yourself.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:04 pm |
    • Jesus

      "Yup, I can tell that you are carnally full of yourself."

      And I can tell you're going to hell for your judgmental attitude and lies.

      March 15, 2013 at 2:49 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Jesus does the judging. Those that follow His truth discern whether someone is bearing fruit or are wells without water. There seems to be a drought on this site.

      March 15, 2013 at 4:25 pm |
  17. HotAirAce

    The Vatican is only considered a country because the RCC supported the Italian fascists, not to forget their support of Hitler. All countries should call their ambassors home and lay child abuse charges against The Rat and the current Pope-A-Dope.

    March 14, 2013 at 10:56 pm |
    • Science

      And the big one the fake origin story

      Creationists and bible thumpers TIME LINE is what ?

      Five-Million-Year-Old Sabe-Toothed Cat in Newly Discovered Genus Discovered in Florida

      Mar. 14, 2013 — A University of Florida researcher has described a new genus and species of extinct saber-toothed cat from Polk County, Fla., based on additional fossil acquisitions of the animal over the last 25 years.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/03/130314140909.htm

      Was the bible around back then ?

      Human Y Chromosome Much Older Than Previously Thought

      Mar. 4, 2013 — The discovery and analysis of an extremely rare African American Y chromosome pushes back the time of the most recent common ancestor for the Y chromosome lineage tree to 338,000 years ago. This time predates the age of the oldest known anatomically modern human fossils.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/03/130305145821.htm

      No god(s) required for the Y

      Peace

      March 15, 2013 at 6:31 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Science, come up with new material to knock Jesus' truth. Jesus never told us (meaning it is not written in scriptures, and if it is, no one has uncovered His truth as written yet) how old the world is. Read First Earth Age destroyed with water. "Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished" [2nd Peter 3:6]. Then you can read [Job 40:15-19]. "Behold now behemoth, which I made with thee; he eateth grass as an ox. Lo now, his strength is in his loins, and his force is in the navel of his belly. He moveth his tail like a cedar: the sinews of his stones are wrapped together. His bones are as strong pieces of brass; his bones are like bars of iron. He is the chief of the ways of God: he that made him can make his sword to approach unto him." Behemoth is God's word and man uses the word dinosaur.

      Therefore Science, just because you never cared to learn Jesus' truth, doesn't mean practicing Christians didn't take the time to study. There are more levels to mathematics too if you got past the basics.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:32 am |
    • .

      " He moveth his tail like a cedar: the sinews of his stones are wrapped together. His bones are as strong pieces of brass; his bones are like bars of iron. He is the chief of the ways of God: he that made him can make his sword to approach unto him." Behemoth is God's word and man uses the word dinosaur."

      No matter how many times they insist he's a dinosaur, Behemoth is not at all a dinosaur. Here is the factual reason why.

      According to the passage, Behemoth is said to eat grass like an ox. Sauropods on the other hand can only browse among the treetops like a giraffe. Unlike cows, they completely lack chewing teeth. They're unable to chew their food because their jaws can only move up and down like the jaws of a crocodile, not in a circular pattern like the jaws of a cow. They had to swallow stones, instead. These stones called gastroliths travel down the necks and into the gizzard area. There, the stones help to grind their food by mashing plant matter into a digestible pulp with the help of special muscles found inside of the gizzards.

      Believe it or not there were grass growing at the time of the dinosaurs. Once thought to first appeared around 40 million years ago, grass is now known to appear in the late Cretaceous period at the very end of the dinosaur age. Grass must have evolved as method of defense against the marauding chewing jaws of dinosaurs like Homalocephale and Edmontosaurus simply by having the ability to grow fast and have very tough fibers that made things difficult for an animals to digest it without having an adequate digestive system like what cows and horses have. Thus, dinosaurs, at that time, took advantage of this new food source and begin eating it just like what a Titanosaur had done 65 million years ago, then took a dump and left a pile on the ground that eventually became a coprolite fossil unearthed recently by scientists who were caught off guard when they first look at the fossil up close and saw remnants of grass blades found inside of it. The fossil dung is dated back between 70 and 65 million years ago and the grass inside of it was eaten by hadrosaurs and titanosaurids who took advantage of this new rapid growing food source. This perhaps explains why do Hadrosaurs and Titanosaurs have broad mouths. Although, it is now known that there were grass growing at the time of the dinosaurs as depicted in Rudolph Zallinger's classic paintings, this does not serve as a justification of Behemoth being a sauropod dinosaur due to the dinosaur's lack of chewing teeth.

      Movements, Not Size

      Behemoth, in the passage, is said to have strength in his hips and powerful muscles in his belly. However, the next verse becomes an unwitting victim of deliberate verse mining. What do I mean on that? It means the creationists have misquoted the verse on purpose.

      The verse in full context says,

      "He moveth his tail like a cedar: the sinews of his stones are wrapped together."

      But creationists took that verse and distorted it to make the verse erroneously say,

      "His tail is like a cedar: the sinew of his stones are wrapped together."

      In their false reasoning as illustrated in many of their literature including Duane Gish's book Dinosaurs by Design, it means the tail of Behemoth were as big and thick as a large cedar tree in comparison to the small tails of the hippo and the elephant. Thus, confirming the notion of Behemoth being a sauropod dinosaur because unlike the tail of an elephant and the hippo, sauropod dinosaurs has huge, long, thick, chunky tails that can easily be compared to a cedar tree.

      Even Allan K. Steel, on this page from Ken Ham's idiot site make claims of this falsehood by giving out what he claims to be technical explanations of what he claims Behemoth was by giving out a whole list of the same verse he misquote in purpose coming from different versions of the English Bible and concludes that the tail of Behemoth is a lot like a cedar tree. Thus, Behemoth, according to Steel, is indeed a dinosaur because its tail is exactly like a cedar tree.

      This is flat out false. The verse in full context does not say "His tail is like a cedar." The verse actually says, "He moveth his tail like a cedar.." which means there is absolutely nothing in the verse that says anything about the size of the tail. Instead, it only has everything to do with the tail's movements. Nothing else.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:41 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Spot, you can pat yourself on the back all you want for believing frail men/women in the world and what they. Jesus is truth. Amen.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:06 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      I dropped the remainder of sentence because I have to go. It was suppose to be frail men and women and what they teach.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:08 pm |
    • End Religion

      There is no evidence for the existence of your jeebus. The typical offerings of such proof, which I do not consider evidence, can be found:
      atheist at large [dot] org [slash] 2010 [slash] 04 [slash] literary-record-for-jesus-christ
      http://atheistatlarge.org/2010/04/literary-record-for-jesus-christ

      March 15, 2013 at 6:44 pm |
    • o

      The proof of Jesus, is the Holy Spirit

      March 15, 2013 at 11:29 pm |
    • End Religion

      Ah, so there was no Jesus then, eh?

      March 16, 2013 at 9:58 am |
    • John

      ER, you as an atheist, you have to first believe the account, or you will never figure it out. Without the Holy Spirit, Jesus would not have been born. It was described in the gospels that the angel showed up to Mary, described to her that she could be the mother of Jesus, and if she accepted the Holy Spirit would form Jesus within her such that she became pregnant and would give birth later to him. But if you don't get past the first hurdle, belief, you'll never figure out the Holy Spirit, to get the proof you're after... because you'll doubt it all the way along the path you're traveling on. It's like Jesus said, your faith makes you whole... without faith.... nothing.

      March 16, 2013 at 5:15 pm |
    • Moby Schtick

      Real things work regardless of any doubt you have that they are real or that they do what they do. Doubt in a bullet's existence will not affect how it works. Faith is fine for putting forth a testable hypothesis but not for determining what is true. Science begins with faith that the question being investigated is worthwhile but belief uses faith as an end to reasoning and evaluation. Anything can be believed if all you use is "faith."

      March 16, 2013 at 5:28 pm |
  18. Fury

    I am sorry, but what exactly is the hat supposed to do? If it is to look like a flame, it doesn't.

    I can't even imagine Jesus walking around with the flame hat on, let alone hand them out to apostles to wear when he ascended.

    March 14, 2013 at 9:51 pm |
    • Larru of Nazareth

      The big pointy hat was originally the two crowns of upper and lower Egypt put one on top of the other, back in the days of the Pharoahs. It signified the unity of Egypt. The Romans got it when they took over Egypt, and used it for their own high priests I believe. Then they gave it to the Christians during the time of Constantine.

      So in a weird way, it respects the ancient Egyptian gods.

      As you might expect, almost everything about the Papacy and clergy was simply taken from other existing forms and traditions. Christians were better at usurping things like holidays and fashions than inventing them.

      March 14, 2013 at 10:01 pm |
    • Fury

      So many people interacted with God and the angels, and I imagine them being much the same as anyone else walking around then. Moses, Daniel, Isaiah, the apostles, Jesus, Zechariah, Joseph, Mary... they strike me as plain ordinary people. They got to interact with God, directly... and in some instances, they were told to remove their shoes, Jesus removing his garment to wash the apostles feet... a pointy hat doesn't make sense for washing the other apostles feet.

      March 14, 2013 at 10:26 pm |
    • Larry of Nazareth

      Jesus got naked and gave men foot massages?

      March 14, 2013 at 10:55 pm |
    • Tricks of the Trade

      the only known purpose of the hats back then was to beg money and food.

      March 14, 2013 at 10:58 pm |
    • Fury

      John 13:4 – He riseth from supper, and laid aside his garments; and took a towel, and girded himself. After that he poureth water into a bason, and began to wash the disciples' feet, and to wipe [them] with the towel wherewith he was girded. Then cometh he to Simon Peter: and Peter saith unto him, Lord, dost thou wash my feet? Jesus answered and said unto him, What I do thou knowest not now; but thou shalt know hereafter. Peter saith unto him, Thou shalt never wash my feet. Jesus answered him, If I wash thee not, thou hast no part with me. Simon Peter saith unto him, Lord, not my feet only, but also [my] hands and [my] head. Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash [his] feet, but is clean every whit: and ye are clean, but not all. For he knew who should betray him; therefore said he, Ye are not all clean. So after he had washed their feet, and had taken his garments, and was set down again, he said unto them, Know ye what I have done to you? Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for [so] I am. If I then, [your] Lord and Master, have washed your feet; ye also ought to wash one another's feet. For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you. Verily, verily, I say unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord; neither he that is sent greater than he that sent him. If ye know these things, happy are ye if ye do them.

      March 14, 2013 at 11:11 pm |
    • Larry of Nazareth

      So there is evidence Jesus was gay. Okay. Thanks for that.

      March 14, 2013 at 11:16 pm |
    • Fury

      The text gave you what you wanted when you didn't want to find or know God.

      Others read the text and see what Jesus said and did, and how it would have been silly for him to put on a pointy hat, to serve them. Jesus used the same towel he had put on, to wipe the dust and dirt off their feet. He didn't put on special clothes or pointy hats, he put on a towel that ended up getting dirty and wet. He told them if they didn't allow him to do that, they had no part with him.

      I don't see that now, I see something else.

      March 14, 2013 at 11:31 pm |
    • Reality

      I am an agnostic who likes to know the history of things. For example, the papal garb is wrapped in history. For example the pope's hat/skull cap:

      "The zucchetto began existence as the Greek pilos and is a descendant of the beret (which itself was originally a large zucchetto). It was adopted circa the Early Middle Ages, if not earlier, to keep clerics' tonsured heads warm. Its name derives from its resemblance to half a pumpkin. Its appearance is almost identical to the Jewish kippah (yarmulke), though its significance is quite different.[3][4]"

      The history of the other pieces of papal garb can be found in less than ten seconds using any of the large search engines.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:20 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Reality, big deal. Spiritually stunted humans playing church. Then again, some (most of the men in their organization) know and preach Jesus' spiritual truth despite the carnal ego of some that made it to the top ranks and put road blocks in front of the humble ones that work for Jesus' truth.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:38 am |
    • God that’s a funny image

      Jesus and the gang sitting around the last supper table all wearing papal party hats

      March 15, 2013 at 2:00 pm |
    • frank

      Actually I think it was supposed to be like that for the last supper. But that token wife that we recently found out that Jesus kept – you know, very Michele Bachmannish – was most likely lurking around the joint (probably straightening up doilies and such) and I'm sure she made everyone remove their hats.

      March 15, 2013 at 2:09 pm |
    • Reality

      The Last Supper? It was not an historic event. See http://wiki.faithfutures.org/index.php/016_Supper_and_Eucharist

      An excerpt:

      "At the same time, Luedemann concludes that the portrayal of Jesus celebrating such a ritual on the night before his death is not historical. He is clear that there is "no generic relationship" between any actual final meal and the Lord's Supper understood in cultic terms. He also denies the Passover character of the supper as a Markan creation. Like Meier (below), Luedemann does accept the saying (Mark 14:25) about drinking wine in the kingdom of God as authentic. He concludes: (this saying) "hardly came into being in the early community, for in it Jesus does not exercise any special function for believers at the festal meal in heaven which is imminent. Only Jesus' expectation of a the future kingdom of God stands at the centre, not Jesus as saviour, judge or intercessor."

      March 15, 2013 at 4:21 pm |
    • Reality

      An update on the Last Supper review:

      http://www.faithfutures.org/JDB/jdb016.html

      March 15, 2013 at 4:33 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Matthew 15:12-14
      12 Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?

      13 But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up.

      14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

      Amen.

      March 15, 2013 at 4:36 pm |
    • End Religion

      1) If unicorns had existed, then there is evidence in the fossil record.
      2) There is no evidence of unicorns in the fossil record.
      3) Therefore, unicorns never existed.

      March 15, 2013 at 6:43 pm |
    • Preferred Response

      Reality, see the fast of the firstborn... Jesus was first born, he fasted that night before the passover. It's biblical.

      God is the best there is, none better.

      March 15, 2013 at 10:22 pm |
    • Reality

      Matthew 15:12-14 has been thoroughly analyzed by many contemporary NT scholars and found to be historically nil. For example, it a single attestation found no where else in the NT. See the added reviews in Professor Gerd Ludemann's book, Jesus After 2000 Years, pp. 190-193 and p. 300 and also at http://www.faithfutures.org/JDB/jdb039.html.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:44 pm |
    • Preferred Response

      For those with eyes to see and a brain to use, use them. The 4 gospels all details the last supper. Jesus did not eat then.
      The fast of the first born is historically accurate and still observed even present day. Jesus was first born, and he observed the fast at the last supper, while the others ate.

      Luke 22:15... When the hour had come, He sat down, and the twelve [fn] apostles with Him. Then He said to them, "With [fervent] desire I have desired to eat this Passover with you before I suffer; "for I say to you, I will no longer eat of it until it is fulfilled in the kingdom of God." Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and said, "Take this and divide [it] among yourselves; "for I say to you, [fn] I will not drink of the fruit of the vine until the kingdom of God comes." And He took bread, gave thanks and broke [it], and gave [it] to them, saying, "This is My body which is given for you; do this in remembrance of Me." Likewise He also [took] the cup after supper, saying, "This cup [is] the new covenant in My blood, which is shed for you.

      March 16, 2013 at 12:09 am |
    • Reality

      While we are "thu-mping" the NT:

      JC's family and friends had it right 2000 years ago ( Mark 3: 21 "And when his friends heard of it, they went out to lay hold on him: for they said, He is beside himself.")

      Said passage is one of the few judged to be authentic by most contemporary NT scholars. e.g. See Professor Ludemann's conclusion in his book, Jesus After 2000 Years, p. 24 and p. 694.

      Actually, Jesus was a bit "touched". After all he thought he spoke to Satan, thought he changed water into wine, thought he raised Lazarus from the dead etc. In today's world, said Jesus would be declared legally insane.

      Or did P, M, M, L and J simply make him into a first century magic-man via their epistles and gospels of semi-fiction? Many contemporary NT experts after thorough analyses of all the scriptures go with the latter magic-man conclusion with J's gospel being mostly fiction.

      Obviously, today's followers of Paul et al's "magic-man" are also a bit on the odd side believing in all the Christian mumbo jumbo about bodies resurrecting, and exorcisms, and miracles, and "magic-man atonement, and infallible, old, European/Utah white men, and 24/7 body/blood sacrifices followed by consumption of said sacrifices. Yummy!!!!

      So why do we really care what a first century CE, illiterate, long-dead, preacher/magic man would do or say?

      March 16, 2013 at 12:56 pm |
    • John

      Both the Old and New Testament accounts have matched other accounts of history again and again. The only real issue you have as an atheist, is not having belief that miracles from God can happen. Otherwise you'd have no complaint.

      March 16, 2013 at 5:27 pm |
    • Reality

      And once again, the #1 in miracle cons: the resurrection-

      From that famous passage: In 1 Corinthians 15: 14, Paul reasoned, "If Christ has not been raised, our preaching is useless and so is your faith."

      Even now Catholic/Christian professors of theology are questioning the bodily resurrection of the simple, preacher man aka Jesus.

      To wit;

      From a major Catholic university's theology professor’s grad school white-board notes:

      "Heaven is a Spirit state or spiritual reality of union with God in love, without earthly – earth bound distractions.
      Jesus and Mary's bodies are therefore not in Heaven.

      Most believe that it to mean that the personal spiritual self that survives death is in continuity with the self we were while living on earth as an embodied person.

      Again, the physical Resurrection (meaning a resuscitated corpse returning to life), Ascension (of Jesus' crucified corpse), and Assumption (Mary's corpse) into heaven did not take place.

      The Ascension symbolizes the end of Jesus' earthly ministry and the beginning of the Church.

      Only Luke records it. (Luke mentions it in his gospel and Acts, i.e. a single attestation and therefore historically untenable). The Ascension ties Jesus' mission to Pentecost and missionary activity of Jesus' followers.

      The Assumption has multiple layers of symbolism, some are related to Mary's special role as "Christ bearer" (theotokos). It does not seem fitting that Mary, the body of Jesus' Virgin-Mother (another biblically based symbol found in Luke 1) would be derived by worms upon her death. Mary's assumption also shows God's positive regard, not only for Christ's male body, but also for female bodies." "

      "In three controversial Wednesday Audiences, Pope John Paul II pointed out that the essential characteristic of heaven, hell or purgatory is that they are states of being of a spirit (angel/demon) or human soul, rather than places, as commonly perceived and represented in human language. This language of place is, according to the Pope, inadequate to describe the realities involved, since it is tied to the temporal order in which this world and we exist. In this he is applying the philosophical categories used by the Church in her theology and saying what St. Thomas Aquinas said long before him."
      http://eternal-word.com/library/PAPALDOC/JP2HEAVN.HTM

      The Vatican quickly embellished this story with a lot CYAP.

      With respect to rising from the dead, we also have this account:

      An added note: As per R.B. Stewart in his introduction to the recent book, The Resurrection of Jesus, Crossan and Wright in Dialogue,

      p.4

      "Reimarus (1774-1778) posits that Jesus became sidetracked by embracing a political position, sought to force God's hand and that he died alone deserted by his disciples. What began as a call for repentance ended up as a misguided attempt to usher in the earthly political kingdom of God. After Jesus' failure and death, his disciples stole his body and declared his resurrection in order to maintain their financial security and ensure themselves some standing."

      p.168. by Ted Peters:

      Even so, asking historical questions is our responsibility. Did Jesus really rise from the tomb? Is it necessary to have been raised from the tomb and to appear to his disciples in order to explain the rise of early church and the transcription of the bible? Crossan answers no, Wright answers, yes. "

      So where are the bones"? As per Professor Crossan's analyses in his many books, the body of Jesus would have ended up in the mass graves of the crucified, eaten by wild dogs, covered with lime in a shallow grave, or under a pile of stones.

      March 16, 2013 at 11:09 pm |
    • John

      R, the problem is that you're reading other books rather than the bible itself. That's why you're being confused about it.

      March 17, 2013 at 5:05 pm |
    • Reality

      Think about the logic (or lack thereof) of the following:

      “I believe the Bible is inspired.” “Why?” “Because it says so.” Would anyone let that logic pass if it came from the followers of any other book or person? “I believe x is inspired because x says so.” Fill in the blanks:

      x=Pat Robertson
      x=the ayatollah Sistani
      x=David Koresh
      x=the Koran”

      more “logic”?

      “I believe there is One God Jehovah because He is revealed in the infallible
      Bible. I believe the Bible is infallible because it is the Word of the One God Jehovah.”

      March 18, 2013 at 8:04 am |
  19. GodFreeNow

    "We're serious, guys! Seriously. I know all of the hats, robes, shoes, cars, and gaudy displays of well SEEM ridiculous... but it's actually pretty serious."

    March 14, 2013 at 9:50 pm |
  20. Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things

    Prayer changes things

    March 14, 2013 at 9:45 pm |
    • bobk52

      Do u ever sleep.

      March 14, 2013 at 9:48 pm |
    • Jesus

      Prayer does not; you are such a LIAR. You have NO proof it changes anything! A great example of prayer proven not to work is the Christians in jail because prayer didn't work and their children died. For example: Susan Grady, who relied on prayer to heal her son. Nine-year-old Aaron Grady died and Susan Grady was arrested.

      An article in the Journal of Pediatrics examined the deaths of 172 children from families who relied upon faith healing from 1975 to 1995. They concluded that four out of five ill children, who died under the care of faith healers or being left to prayer only, would most likely have survived if they had received medical care.

      The statistical studies from the nineteenth century and the three CCU studies on prayer are quite consistent with the fact that humanity is wasting a huge amount of time on a procedure that simply doesn’t work. Nonetheless, faith in prayer is so pervasive and deeply rooted, you can be sure believers will continue to devise future studies in a desperate effort to confirm their beliefs!

      March 15, 2013 at 11:28 am |
    • Really?

      "Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things"

      That's why the data, has shown that atheists have happier and healthier lives than conservative Christians. Your post is built on a lie!!

      March 15, 2013 at 11:29 am |
    • HeavenSent

      Really? Since you wrote the same comment, I'm copying and pasting my same response.

      Really? What data? Data that you know how to spell LOVE, COMPASSION, RIGHTEOUSNESS etc., but you can't experience the fullness of it? Must be convenient staying at the simplistic level of life and never comprehending Jesus' abundance of life that he wants all to experience.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:41 am |
    • Yup

      "Data that you know how to spell LOVE, COMPASSION, RIGHTEOUSNESS etc., but you can't experience the fullness of it?"

      Atheists know it better than Christians because we don't need an excuse of a god.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:43 am |
    • .

      HeavenSent aka Atheism is not healthy for children and other living things aka truth be told are all trolls.

      They are well known liars on this blog.

      March 15, 2013 at 11:45 am |
    • In Santa we trust

      bobk52, No it doesn't sleep but is praying for a good night's sleep. So far the invisible sky friend hasn't gotten around to it.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:14 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      Yup, keep fooling yourself. It seems to work for you. But, then again, you don't know all Jesus' truth unless you have the courage to live it.

      March 15, 2013 at 12:15 pm |
    • Jesus

      "But, then again, you don't know all Jesus' truth unless you have the courage to live it."

      You haven't been living it because you are a liar and too judgmental.

      March 15, 2013 at 2:52 pm |
    • HeavenSent

      I am only sewing seeds. It's up to you to humble yourself to ask Jesus to water you with His spiritual truth.

      March 15, 2013 at 4:39 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Piper's Son

      You're SEWING SEEDS? How, exactly, do you do that, you mindless twit?

      March 15, 2013 at 6:21 pm |
    • End Religion

      speaking of seeds....

      there are "infallible words of god" supporting not only the gay lifestyle, but also that one should have lots of sex, paid and otherwise.

      2 Corinthians 9:6 - The point is this: whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows bountifully will also reap bountifully.

      Ecclesiastes 11:6 - In the morning sow your seed, and at evening withhold not your hand, for you do not know which will prosper, this or that, or whether both alike will be good.

      Luke 8:11 - Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God.

      Galatians - For the one who sows to his own flesh will from the flesh reap corruption, but the one who sows to the Spirit will from the Spirit reap eternal life.

      2 Corinthians 9:12 - For the ministry of this service is not only supplying the needs of the saints but is also overflowing in many thanksgivings to God.

      Acts 20:35 - In all things I have shown you that by working hard in this way we must help the weak and remember the words of the Lord Jesus, how he himself said, ‘It is more blessed to give than to receive.’”

      1 Corinthians 9:11 - If we have sown spiritual things among you, is it too much if we reap material things from you?
      (the above supports prostitution)

      Bible encourages oral sex: http://goo.gl/gOKS4

      March 15, 2013 at 6:42 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.