Who is on God's side of the marriage debate?
March 25th, 2013
11:00 PM ET

Who is on God's side of the marriage debate?

By Dan Merica, CNN
[twitter-follow screen_name='DanMericaCNN']

Washington (CNN) – As the Supreme Court considers two major same-sex marriage cases that could change marriage in the United States, religious leaders on both sides of the debate believe they are on God's side of the contentious issue.

In the months leading up to this week's Supreme Court hearings, religious leaders from across the country have held prayer vigils and rallies for their respective causes.

At each event, even those with diametrically opposed views, leaders cite biblical principles as the foundation for their beliefs.

"I believe I am on God's side," Dr. Richard Land, president of The Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission and and opponent of same-sex marriage, told CNN. "I have no question in what God says marriage is."

"I do think we are on God's side because my idea of God is someone that is loving," said the Rev. Gary Hall, dean of the Washington National Cathedral and a proponent of same-sex marriage. "My understanding is that kind of God that loves everyone and wants everyone to live a joyful life."

This week, the Supreme Court will hear two cases. One will examine the constitutionality of Proposition 8, a law that prohibited same-sex marriage in California, and the other will test the Defense of Marriage Act, the 1996 legislation that forbids the recognition of same-sex marriages nationwide and bars married gay and lesbian couples from receiving federal benefits.

Marriage and the Supreme Court: Five things to watch

Land and Hall each have actively worked on his side of this debate.

Hall, after taking the reins at the National Cathedral in 2012, decided to marry same-sex couples in the historic church. Land, who has counseled Republican presidents and members of Congress, has written and spoken at length about why same-sex marriage goes against biblical principles.

And although they both believe in the Bible, their opinions on how the text views same-sex marriage are shaped by their views on how literally to read the holy book.

"I come from a tradition that looks at the big story," said Hall, an Episcopalian. "The image of Jesus in the Bible is of someone who really makes everyone welcome, and it is from that perspective that I operate."

Hall acknowledges, however, that the Bible isn't the only guide for this belief.

"Our argument is not entirely scriptural-based," Hall said, after acknowledging passages of the holy book that define marriage as being between a man and a woman. "There is no place in the Bible that I can point to that says Jesus performed a same-sex marriage or anything like that."

In addition to scripture, Hall said, "tradition and reason" anchor his belief that same-sex couples should be allowed to wed. There are about 2 million Episcopalians in the United States.

CNN Belief: My Take: Will gay rights infringe on religious liberty?

Land, on the other hand, cites the chapters and verses that guide his views on same-sex marriage.

"The people who take a more conservative view of the Bible and believe that they are under the authority of scripture almost universally oppose same-sex marriage," Land said about people who agree with him.

For Land, this view is not only consistent but  also roots his belief in "traditional values" and his disgust with "moral relativism."

Land, a Southern Baptist, continued: "The people who are religious and support same-sex marriage tend to take a Dalmatian view of scripture. They believe the Bible is divine in spots, and they think they can spot the spots."

If the Supreme Court decides in favor of same-sex marriage, Land said, the decision would be on par with the court's 1973 decision on Roe v. Wade, which affirmed a woman's right to an abortion.

"I think it will evoke a similar reaction," Land said.

Southern Baptists count 16 million members in the United States.

CNN Poll: 'Rob Portman effect' fuels support for same-sex marriage

This split over the biblical reasoning behind each side of the marriage debate extends beyond just Land and Hall, however. Churches around the country have been divided on the issue, with some choosing to allow same-sex marriage and others to forbid it.

The Rev. Jacqui Lewis, the senior minister at Middle Collegiate Church in New York who has worked with the Gay and Lesbian Alliance Against Defamation on same-sex marriage, comes down in favor of same-sex marriage.

She uses the Bible - and civil rights - in her reasoning.

"I don't think that people who are supporting gay marriage need to distance themselves from the Bible in needing to find support," Lewis said. When asked about how the Bible anchors her beliefs, she cited Mark 12:31: "Love your neighbor as yourself."

On the other side of the argument is Robert Gagnon, a biblical scholar at Pittsburgh Theological Seminary who has worked with the Family Research Council on the issue.

"Only a woman is a true sexual compliment to a man and vice versa," said Gagnon, citing Genesis 1:27 and Genesis 2:24, along with the Gospels of Mark and Matthew, as the reasoning behind his view on same-sex marriage.

"That is why a man leaves his father and mother and is united to his wife, and they become one flesh," reads Genesis 2:24.

As for how he feels about people such as Hall who use the Bible to defend their position in support of same-sex marriage: "You are rejecting Jesus himself. ... Just go ahead and make up your own religion."

- Dan Merica

Filed under: Belief • Christianity • Gay marriage • Politics

soundoff (2,640 Responses)
  1. eekwal

    Marriage equality for Polygamists !!!
    Down with bigotry.

    Religious freedom for everyone !!!
    Utah should be allowed to go back to polygamy. See statehood of 1896.

    March 27, 2013 at 4:10 pm |
    • loveforall

      Only if you make it TOTALLY equall and allow women to have many husbands. Honestly, doesn't that sound like a happier house hold? Less Estrogen

      March 27, 2013 at 4:11 pm |
    • ME II

      sure, why not

      March 27, 2013 at 4:13 pm |
    • BRC

      If someone can find a way around the nightmare that multi-party divorces would be (how do you divide up money/property between 3 or 4, who broght what into teh marriage when, how do you deal with custody issues?), then sure why not; let as many consenting adults marry as they want. No real reason not to.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:13 pm |
    • Chuckles

      It won't work purely on a tax basis. Our system isn't set up to recognize more than 2 people in a marriage. For you to really push legislation to allow polygamy in the US you'll have to find a lot of people sympathetic to your cause. Can you do that?


      March 27, 2013 at 4:14 pm |
    • eekwal

      oh yes. One woman. 20 men. 5 horses. 3 dogs. Yes, that's fine.

      20 women, 20 men, and 20 men pretending to be lesbians is ok too.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:15 pm |
    • Chuckles


      How can a man pretend to be a lesbian? Also, why does polygamy upset you so much?

      March 27, 2013 at 4:17 pm |
    • The Bottom Line

      If people are dumb enough to want it, then fine. Traditionally polygamy has been nothing but a harem for the male, and why any woman would want or accept being anything less than an equal partner, that's just weird.

      Polygamy is rarely if ever found outside the realm of religious extremism, where the harem got sanctified. No self-respecting woman would go for it. And it causes massive complications in domestic harmony, the raising of more children than you can afford, and divorce becomes a nightmarish tangle: a man with two wives and two ex-wives is penniless, and the children destitute.

      Polygamy: another wonderful idea from religion.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:17 pm |
    • ME II

      @BRC and @Chuckles,

      You raise valid points. I hadn't considered that.

      "5 horses. 3 dogs."

      1 Red Herring

      March 27, 2013 at 4:18 pm |
    • eekwal

      Allowing the states to decide for themselves is an option that has been stated.
      Therefore let Utah decide.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:18 pm |
    • Paris Hilton's Disco Apocalypse

      I would be happy to experiment with amateur male lesbianism. I always wanted to be a vagitarian.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:19 pm |
    • eekwal

      So a person with billions of dollars can have dozens of wives and dozens of children purely based on the fact that they can afford to feed the family. Income-based rules on marriage. Pretty cool !!!

      March 27, 2013 at 4:21 pm |
    • Paris Hilton's Disco Apocalypse

      "So a person with billions of dollars can have dozens of wives and dozens of children purely based on the fact that they can afford to feed the family"

      That's the Biblical model.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:22 pm |
    • eekwal

      That's the Oprah model.

      Wait my phone's ringing. Must be her people now

      March 27, 2013 at 4:23 pm |
    • BRC

      That's pretty much how it works now, difference is the person has to get a divorce between each marriage, but as long as they can keep up with alimony and child support, there is nothing stopping them from having dozens of wives and children. People want to gripe about the sancttiy of marriage, try fixing that instead of worrying about the relationship of two loving consenting adults who want a committed relationship.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:25 pm |
    • Chuckles


      First, I'm positive if a vote for ok-ing polygamy came up in Utah it would be thrown out immediately. Mainstream mormonism doesn't support it. It wouldn't make sense to go through the whole process of banning it at a state level at this point because it would just be busy work.

      Second, no one is saying that only the rich should be able to have multiple wives, what everyone on this thread is pointing out is the nightmare it would be to go through divorce and divide up the estate.

      Trying to incorporate polygamy into tax code and law is something that goes beyond granting a right that's already granted to any hetero american citizen.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:28 pm |
    • eekwal

      yes, that's the same exact argument used by bigots.

      Things do change 🙂

      March 28, 2013 at 3:11 pm |
    • Saraswati

      It's possible that some sort of polygamy could be established, but it is a much more complex issue than allowing interracial or same-se’x marriage.

      1. In most cultures that have allowed multiple spouses they have allowed either a man to have multiple wives or a woman to have multiple husbands, not both. But in our society we would be talking about allowing both which would create a rarer set of very complex relations.

      2. Even in societies that have allowed multiple spouses we have seen a very high rate of discontent as it is almost impossible to get true agreement from all members. In the majority of these scenarios, where a man has been allowed multiple wives, the wives have had little say (other than a lip service agreement under fear of divorce) and are not happy about it. There certainly do exist cases where this isn't the case, but even those scenarios are subject to change and a large number of parties could make the handling unmanageable. In the US we see a larger set of scenarios that have true consent, but even hear fear of loss drives a lot of supposed “agreements”.

      3. If these marriages end up skewing to scenarios where one man has multiple wives we end up with a larger number of single males in society. This usually means wealthy men have multiple wives while poorer men are left with fewer and has a strong negative impact on crime and violence as well as a general less contented society. Somehow men always seem to think polygamy means they get more women...but unless you are in the most desirable category it almost always means you have less chance of being married or partnered with the woman of your choice.

      4. As mentioned previously, divorce becomes extremely difficult and complex when you are looking at, potentially, a marriage with hundreds. Introducing same-se’x marriage we don’t even have to touch most divorce laws. Polygamy means thousands of extra lawyers for years.

      5. If you can have as many spouses as you want it makes "industry" marriages such as for immigration much more profitable.

      6. In a society in which we still rely on spousal benefits we have a particular problem both financial and legal. Many people already marry for benefits but usually when already together as a couple. Fear of lost opportunity keeps this from becoming an industry. A limitless polygamy would allow a person to marry hundreds to give them benefits which would not be financially feasible.

      This complexity could be handled somewhat by putting limits on size such as "a union of 4" or "2 men and two women" but it gets legally prohibitively complex very quickly. Certainly the informal relations that now exist should be studied for plausibility and possible legal structures investigated, but I think it will be a long time before we see anything put into law.

      This isn’t to say some measures mightn’t make things easier for people in these relationships. An overhaul of the inheritance system, eliminating all estate taxes, could, for instance, make distribution of wealth after death fairer. But this is not a simple issue when you are talking about potentially having a legal state that applies to large (10s, 100s, 1000s of people?) social groups.

      March 29, 2013 at 7:05 am |
  2. loveforall

    Technically marriage is a financial agreement between two families in order to combine assests including property and money.

    And Gave, there most certainly was a sense of ownership over not only one's wife but one's children. Granted that was years ago, but yes, there was a sense of ownership.

    March 27, 2013 at 4:06 pm |
    • Saraswati

      Marriage also exists in most matriarchal societies.

      March 27, 2013 at 8:33 pm |
  3. Snowshoes

    God is long suffering but this may put Him over the edge...pray and keep praying Brothers and Sisters in the Lord.

    March 27, 2013 at 3:46 pm |
    • Tinky Winky

      Of course, it was his plan all along, and he knew everything before he even started it, so he really wouldn't be surprised at all, would he?

      March 27, 2013 at 3:53 pm |
    • NiceTry

      Nothing to be surprised about. These things has long been prophesied and this is just biblical prophecy coming true. Even Jesus himself stated, "The end cannot come until he has been fully rejected of this generation". That rejection is what you see happening now. The end is soon to come. Personally, I think it can't come soon enough...

      March 27, 2013 at 3:53 pm |
    • ..

      I'ma going to go ahead and assume that you guys have gone to every other country's websites that have legalized gay marriage and proclaimed the sky is falling, right? After all, he isn't just the God of the US, right?

      March 27, 2013 at 3:57 pm |
    • Tinky Winky

      Jesus said the End Times would happen, complete with a number of specific events which did not happen, in the lifetime of some of his audience. That's about 80AD at the latest.

      Big miss for an inerrant omniscient guy. But then again, he said prayer would work absolutely as asked, including having a mountain throw itself into the sea.

      Jesus wasn't too good at being right.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:59 pm |
    • ME II

      "The end is soon to come."

      Religion – providing failed prophecy for over 2000 years.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:00 pm |
    • loveforall

      60 years ago these same bigots would have had been on the side against black people marrying white people. It's just another example of people trying to treat certain types of humans as though they weren't humans. All humans should have the same rights as all other humans.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:02 pm |
    • ME II

      And 60 years before that Lutherans marrying Protestants (or whichever interfaith marriages were forbidden)

      March 27, 2013 at 4:07 pm |
    • clarity

      "this may put Him over the edge"

      Over the edge of what?

      March 27, 2013 at 4:19 pm |
    • Paris Hilton's Disco Apocalypse

      GOD ON THE EDGE!!!!

      Massacre pending. Because he loves you.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:25 pm |
    • NiceTry

      To Tinky Winky" & "ME II"… The bible is right on schedule and has never been wrong. The only thing that has failed is your misguided understanding of the scriptures…

      March 27, 2013 at 4:28 pm |
    • clarity

      @NiceTry – that's funny – nearly every Christian says that to the next Christian.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:36 pm |
    • ME II

      "The bible is right on schedule and has never been wrong"

      How exactly would you know? Not knowing the "hour" is built-in, right?

      March 27, 2013 at 4:49 pm |
    • sam

      This would put him over the edge? He's fine with everything else that's happened?


      March 27, 2013 at 4:53 pm |
    • NiceTry

      To "Clarity"… So what. That doesn't make it untrue…

      To "ME II"… Maybe because I know the truth of the scriptures and you don't...

      March 27, 2013 at 5:04 pm |
    • clarity

      NiceTry: "So what. That doesn't make it untrue…"

      LOL. Conflicted views and they are all correct? lol. Nice try, but try again.

      Some believe the Pope is the Anti-Christ. Some believe Obama is the Anti-Christ.

      Some believe that celibacy is appropriate for certain people, or for certain positions. It's ridiculous. Celibacy is unnatural and will continue to cause problems for the religious institutions that employ it.

      Many of the people from these same institutions advocate against abortion, but don't understand the realistic benefit of the morning after pill or even basic contraception; their unrealistic wishful thinking is causing the death of many at the hands of disease. Realistically, many abortions could be avoided if a morning-after pill were not viewed as such an evil option. Many of these same people bring children into the world at a high pace, and then would prefer that the rest of society take over and educate their children in their particular brand of religion when they don't plan well.

      In the U.S. recently we learned of the head of Lutheran CMS chastising a minister of that church for participating in a joint service for the victims of the Newtown school shooting.

      One sect calls homosexuality an abomination while the next one in the same denomination is already performing gay marriage.

      One sect, the Westboro Baptist Church believes Americans are being killed at war because America is too kind to "fags".

      One sect believes that Jesus and Satan were brothers and that Christ will return to Jerusalem AND Jackson County, Missouri.

      One sect believes women to be subservient, while another sect in the same denomination promotes equality between the sexes.

      Conflicted right from the very beginning, Christianity continues to splinter and create divisions and more extremism as it goes.

      March 27, 2013 at 5:25 pm |
    • clarity

      One poster earlier asked what kind of evidence would be sufficient for proving the historical Jesus that is reflected as the Christ character in the Bible.

      Reasonable evidence would certainly have to be something beyond what has been demonstrated so far. Anonymously written gospels don't help. When the historical writings ABOUT the anonymously-written gospels appear to have been tampered with, THAT certainly doesn't help solidify anything about the Christian claim. When early Christian apologists themselves charged that the devil had disseminated earlier fake stories before the "real" gospels ('diabolical mimicry'), THAT doesn't help validate the Christian claim either. It just makes things smell very, very fishy.

      March 27, 2013 at 5:27 pm |
    • ME II

      "Maybe because I know the truth of the scriptures and you don't..."

      But the scriptures say "no one knows" (Mt 24), right? Does that make you a false prophet... or perhaps the anti-christ?

      March 27, 2013 at 6:19 pm |
    • sam stone

      OOOOH.....the "truth of the scriptures"......pretty impressive.

      well, at least as much as the person quoting harry potter

      March 27, 2013 at 7:24 pm |
    • sam stone

      "Personally, I think it can't come soon enough..."

      insert the barrel in your mouth.....

      March 27, 2013 at 7:47 pm |
    • NiceTry

      To "Clarity"… Just because you believe all that nonsense you just wrote that doesn't make it true. Some people believe a lot of things but that don't make it true. To be true it must come from God. To come from God, it must come from a source authorized by God. Nothing you said came from an authorized source. It's no wonder you're so confused. Learn some truth. Then you won't be so confused…

      To "Me II"… No, there is no scripture that says that.

      March 27, 2013 at 8:47 pm |
    • clarity


      Well, if you can dredge up some evidence for God, then I might reconsider. Oh, but that's right – you have nothing.

      March 27, 2013 at 9:31 pm |
    • Lola Bunch

      @Nice Try,

      "@ME II, no, nothing in scripture says that"
      Mathew 24:36 “But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son,[f] but only the Father.

      Nive try.

      March 27, 2013 at 11:43 pm |
    • Lenn

      Lola Bunch
      So, Jesus could come back in 10 minutes, 10 years, 10 centuries, 10 million years, or even longer. Honestly, anybody who watches the Discovery Channel knows that the odds of our surviving another 50, 000 years isn't great. Some comet, famine, robot uprising, black hole, gamma burst, ice age, zombie apocalypse, Yellowstone supervolcano, astroid, and maybe a couple dozen other threats are much more likely so why should we be terribly concerned by King Jesus the alien overlord coming to conquer the earth?

      March 28, 2013 at 1:00 am |
    • fintastic

      @nice try.................. " To be true it must come from God. "

      WRONG!.... to be true there must be evidence to support the claim of "truth"... there is ZERO evidence of any god, therefore you are lying.

      March 28, 2013 at 10:12 am |
  4. loveforall

    SAM: My posts aren't coming out either. Guess L4H got mad that I asked if he was gay

    March 27, 2013 at 3:35 pm |
    • ..

      Live4Him is rather absurd. Her whole tax premise is absolutely ridiculous...the number of gay marriages vs. straight marriages would so infinitesimally small that her tax rate would not go up at all, but that never stopped a bigot from frothing at the mouth at the injustice of a person who may be different than her asking for the same rights she enjoys with impunity. Sickening.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:05 pm |
    • HotAirAce

      Not to mention ignoring the shift of taxes onto others because religious houses of stupidity are tax exempt. . .

      March 27, 2013 at 4:09 pm |
    • ..

      HAA, thought of that as well.
      Her tax aspect was so absurd that I thought that pointing THAT out would cause her to go into convulsions.

      March 27, 2013 at 5:51 pm |
    • Saraswati

      L4H has refused to answer any of the tough questions regarding whether elderly or infertile straight couples should get the same tax breaks. S/he is trying to pretend that there's some practical financial reason for her bigotry based opinions, not very well.

      March 27, 2013 at 8:39 pm |
    • sam stone

      saraswati: it is because L4H is both a bigot and an imbecile. of course, those two are often related

      March 28, 2013 at 4:43 am |

    In hindu dark ages, a woman was laying in bed, while her husband was away, she was having her lust pleasing dreams in hindu secular ism, filthy self center ism of enjoying company of her husband in bed in a hindu darkened cave, a hindu filthy languor, secular daddy of hindu hanuman, stupid monkey, secular, every hindu believes to be their god saw her moaning and took advantage of her, her husband came back and had relationship , but she had already been pregnant by hindu crook languor, filthy secular. She never told her husband of the indecent, time of child birth her husband took her to a medicine man for deliver, and waited for hours, while he heard wild noises from inside delivery cave. Finally medicine man came out of cave sweating and all bruised, her husband rushed to him, and asked about wellbeing of his wife and child, boy or a girl, medicine man could not answer, while he was trying to figure out way to explain, finally he put himself together and started to explain mystery of his child birth. AS HE STATED , RIGHT AFTER BIRTH, CHILD JUMPED AND CLUNG TO CEILING OF THE CAVE, HIM AND HIS ASSISTANT WERE TRYING HARD TO CATCH CHILD FOR S GENDER IDENTIFICATION, BUT TO NO VIALS, AFTER HOURS THEY GAVE UP.
    Child of hindu crook Languor, secular from a woman was called Bujrungbhali, meaning ruler of his own limit, a hindu secular, stupid self centered, he matted with his own half kind, hindu monkeys and donkeys, stupid secular s, self centered animals and multiplied enormously,
    Living by hindu secular ism, self center ism, kenjer ism, today his progeny claims their linage from Monkeys AND DONKEYS, stupid secular s As their maternal gods. So much so, producers of Gorge of the Jungle movie borrowed concept from inception of hindus, ignorant and made a lot of money.

    Every letter of a word has meanings of its own, seeds to grow crop of words for humanity to communicate. From seeds of letters, blocks are created and than blocks are combined to create words to communicate intentions of a person. Word ATHEIST MEANS, A SELF CENTERED, DENIER OF TRUTH ABSOLUTE, OR A PERSON CLAIMING HIMSELF TO BE TRUTH ABSOLUTE GOD, A HINDU SHAMAN, A CROOK SPEAKING BY HIS SOUL, DESIRE, NOT OF TRUTH ABSOLUTE OF A MATTER. Atheism is not of human, but in line with mind set of a animals. Following words are best example to identify Atheism.
    Letter D, means, THE. vowel O, represents, QUANTIFIED AND Letter G is result of one s intention from his mind and heart. Sounded Ga. meaning a secular, self centered by intention in opposition to truth absolute by intention. or an atheist,
    Letter M means essence or choice of an intention, Vowel O represents Quantified. Letter N means enshrined or established. Letter K identifies function of a noun. Vowel E represents unity of an adjective and a noun in essence. Letter Y means Ye, from heart and mind, base of word Yes. meaning by self choice, with dis regard to truth absolute, a Secular, self centered or an atheist,
    Letter D, means THE, Vowel O means QUANTIFIED, Letter N means established or enshrined. Letter K identifies function of a noun. Vowel E represents unity of an adjective and a noun in essence. Letter Y means Ye, from heart and mind, base of word Yes. meaning by self choice, with dis regard to truth absolute, a Secular, self centered or an atheist,
    As a matter of fact, word ANIMAL means nothing else, but a atheist, self centered or denier of truth absolute.
    Atheism, self center ism is way of animals and hindrance negativity to truth absolute GOD, foundation of consti tution of USA and universe and source for existence of every thing in existence, otherwise known as constant.
    Atheism is way of hindus, deniers of truth absolute, not of human, but animals observed by pot head hindu Swamis, ignorant goons, secular, self centered by their hindu soul, filthy desire and foundation of hinduism racism of hindu dark ages.

    March 27, 2013 at 3:31 pm |
    • Salero21

      Are you friends with Douglas? He was here last night talking about 'butt flu' and 'ass polio' and I was wondering how to avoid catching it.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:32 pm |
    • .

      report abuse on this Pakistani trash

      March 27, 2013 at 3:33 pm |
    • clarity

      Ass polio?? What is that, some new video game?

      March 27, 2013 at 3:42 pm |
    • Salero21

      Douglas was here last night on this article trying to convince us all that you can catch polio and the flu from anal sex. He likes to talk about butts a LOT.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:46 pm |
    • sam

      First....Mohammad, bug off.

      Second, WHAT? Polio?? How many pages back is that mess...

      March 27, 2013 at 3:48 pm |
    • clarity

      "Letter D, means, THE. vowel O, represents, QUANTIFIED AND Letter G is re . . ."

      None of that makes sense.

      Are you that dude SamB from America's Got Talent??

      Cause he was somehow able to take an "i" out of his first name "Sam" (see at ~:25 into video)


      March 27, 2013 at 3:51 pm |
    • sam

      LOL wow.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:54 pm |
    • End Relgon

      In honor of SamB I will remove the 'i's from my moniker today.

      March 27, 2013 at 6:06 pm |
  6. sam stone

    My posts are not showing. I wonder if that closet queen L4H had a hissy fit and complained

    March 27, 2013 at 3:24 pm |
  7. sam stone

    L4H: Do you consider people marrying those to whom they are not attracted to be a "responsible" thing to do for families and for society?

    March 27, 2013 at 3:23 pm |
    • Gave Them Up

      Bart Simpson says, "I don't know anything about girls. They all look alike to me."

      March 27, 2013 at 3:41 pm |
  8. Nancy

    Why is my point of view and belief system called an agenda? Is your point of view and belief system called an agenda too?

    March 27, 2013 at 2:48 pm |
    • Timothy Hay

      Yes, both sides have agendas. Some realize it, some deny it.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:50 pm |
    • Stan

      Nancy, these days, your belief system is mostly just regarded as a combination of ignorant and stupid.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:53 pm |
    • sam

      Creepy lurking poe.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:17 pm |
    • HotAirAce

      I don't believe I accused you, or anyone else, of having an agenda. Please provide a reference to where I allegdedly made this horrendous accusation.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:20 pm |
    • Nancy

      Why can't I stop asking questions that basically mean nothing?

      March 27, 2013 at 3:34 pm |
  9. Jane

    I have been married to a man for 25 years now, and we never had any intention of having children. Should I not have been allowed to get married?

    March 27, 2013 at 2:42 pm |

      If we allows peoples like you to mary, then the next thing you know we will have gay Satanist mimes marrying ill-tempered mutant sea bass with fricking lasers on their heads!!!!!!!!!!

      March 27, 2013 at 2:48 pm |
    • clarity


      March 27, 2013 at 2:50 pm |
    • Akira

      According to the bigots, no. According to sane people, you're fine.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:02 pm |
    • Bill Deacon

      When people talk about marriage as a vehicle for procreation, they are not speaking specifically about each marriage. They are talking about the societal construct of marriage as structural to the foundation of society. Marriage, as a formation into which life is first experienced, nurtures us and creates our first community, in family and our first experiences in society. This is why the family is called the foundation of civilization. Same seex marriage creates a disorder in that foundational structure. Pro gay marriage advocates would argue that their arrangement is not a detriment and possibly even an improvement to the structure of society. Traditionalist espouse that it is both symptomatic of our current decline in morals and would further would degrade society. This, I believe is why Justice Alito made the comment that they Justices feel they are being asked to rule on a condition of which there is limited information on which to make a judgment.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:25 pm |
    • Salero21

      Bill counts on many orifices to pull his pretzel ideas from.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:35 pm |
    • The Demon Deacon

      Bill Deacon
      Is irrelevant. Billy is an obsequious papal apologists troll. Billy are you not concerned that a small number of cardinals, bishops, priests, nuns and even deacons might want to get ho0ked up to their significant other of the same s8x?

      March 27, 2013 at 3:41 pm |
    • Tinky Winky

      Decline in morals? You are unaware that crime rates have been declining steadily in America? Lynching is virtually gone from our land, whereas in the 1930s there were three a week.

      What is really happening is that morality is evolving such that the "sins" of old that really had no victim nor any social negative are ending up on the ash heap of history. Where they belong. It is just the Borg reactionaries who are angry about it.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:46 pm |
    • sam

      Bill's worried about butt crimes.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:54 pm |
  10. Reality

    Only for the new members of this blog:

    See the Philadelphia Inquirer review “Gay Gene, Deconstructed”, 12/12/2011. Said review addresses the following “How do genes associated with ho-mose-xuality avoid being weeded out by Darwinian evolution?”

    To make it easy to access the review, simply copy and paste the following website in your browser address window.


    The opening paragraph:

    "Most scientists who study human s-exuality agree that gay people are born that way. But that consensus raises an evolutionary puzzle: How do genes associated with h-omose-xuality avoid being weeded out by Darwinian evolution?"

    March 27, 2013 at 2:38 pm |
  11. The Bottom Line

    We so often hear that we must obey or we will be tortured horribly forever, but that's blackmail, duress, terrorism. What kind of evil god would do that.

    Many choose religion to get the wonderful rewards, but that is greed and selfishness. What kind of evil god accepts the greedy and the terrorized?

    The whole heaven/hell Pascal's Wager thing is based on the assumption that God is a terrorist.

    March 27, 2013 at 2:33 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      "The whole heaven/hell Pascal's Wager thing is based on the assumption that God is a terrorist."

      ... as amply illustrated by the God of Israel protrayed in the Bible.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:46 pm |
    • Curious

      Where does a god go for anger management therapy?

      March 27, 2013 at 2:49 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      He indulges in a round of old-fashioned smiting.

      Storms, plagues, drought, flood, the usual things.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:55 pm |
    • Akira

      Didn't somebody claim yesterday that insurance companies were the cause of all of those things?

      March 27, 2013 at 3:12 pm |
    • NiceTry

      To "Bottom Line"… You've got it backwards. You were born in sin and slated for the lake from the beginning. From the day you born you were slated for the lake. Jesus came that you might have life and that you might live forever. You can either accept his help or reject it. If you reject it, you'll simply continue on to the lake, which is where you were headed in the first place. If you go to the lake it's your fault not his. He offered you a way out but you turned it down…

      March 27, 2013 at 4:00 pm |
    • The Bottom Line

      I cannot be born guilty of anything. Guilt cannot be inherited. Those are profoundly unjust concepts that are rejected by all civilized cultures.

      Why would a god give you guilt before you are born?

      The greatest trick the devil ever pulled was making people believe he wasn't God.

      March 27, 2013 at 4:09 pm |
  12. BRC

    Agree, it's all a matter of what a person is willing to trust, or take on faith. as long as we let one another believe our own things, I've got no issues .

    An interesting take on what you like to say, that Jesus paid the ultimate price for our sins. Even if I did believe the Bible was true, he really didn't pay the ultimate price, because he didn't pay the price that we pay. He returned to Heaven (and being "God"). So, if before Jesus came along, a human committed a sin, they went to hel (unless they appeased "God" with a sacrifice). Jesus came and went, and now, if a human commits a sin, they go to hel (unless they repent and thank Jesus for dying). No big difference there. As for Jesus, he came to earth as a human, supposedly died for our sins, then returns to rule in eternal paradise. How exactly is sacrificing anything for humans? He didn't even have to live out a full human life, he just had to spend 30 years walking around having divine powers and a mass of followers. Then he dies, un-dies, and goes to heaven? How exactly is that something that we should be grateful for? If it was truly intended to be a sacrifice to take on all mans sin, then in theory Jesus, that portion of "God" that he sent to Earth to be a representative of himself, would be in Hel.

    March 27, 2013 at 2:16 pm |
    • BRC

      Sorry, posted to teh wrong place, kept getting kicked stimied by the word mult-itude. I hate the word filter.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:17 pm |
    • sam stone

      They tried the slogan "Jesus had a bad weekend for your sins", but it did not have the same punch

      March 27, 2013 at 2:19 pm |
    • BRC

      72 hours is a long time for an all powerful being to just aly around "being dead". Maybe the plan was originally for Jesus to be and stay dead, but after 3 days "God" was all like, "You know what, no. This is boring, the rock is cold, those bugs are eyeballing me, and I'm the supreme ruler of the universe, forge this, I'm going home. I'll just tell everyone that if they continue to follow my rules they can follow me one day. It'll look all miraculous and help get the point across. Yeah, that works, this is a great plan."

      March 27, 2013 at 2:35 pm |
    • Jesus

      Actually, knowing you are immortal and only going to be out for a few hours is definitely easier than what humans go through when facing death. And I make thousands die worse deaths everyday just for giggles.

      It was a bad few hours on Friday, but then I had a nice sleep-in, so it wasn't even a bad weekend.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:38 pm |
    • NiceTry

      BRC… There is no pain or suffering we go through individually that Jesus did not feel. He felt all of that and more, yet without sin. And I suppose you think dying on the cross for something you didn't do is fun? (he wasn't guilty of a single crime or sin, yet they killed him). When have you ever suffered and died for anyone? Even worse, when have you died for your enemies and for people who hate you and despise you? Jesus fasted for 40 days in the wilderness. When have you done that? Jesus slept up in the mountains and slept outdoors (foxes have holes, birds of the air have nests, but the son of Man has no where to lay his head) he never even have a house to live in or a nice soft bed to sleep in. When have you done that? Lastly, the burden and the pain that Jesus felt while dying on the cross was much more than just a simply man dying of his own wounds. Instead he felt the weight and the burden of all the sins of everyone in the whole world upon his shoulders. And Jesus had to carry that weight and to bear it or they'd have no chance of being saved. So please tell us when have you ever suffered and died for anybody? When you have done so and done what Jesus did, only then can you tell us how it feels. Until then, you should only talk what you know and not what you don't. And it's clear you don't anything about God…

      March 27, 2013 at 4:23 pm |
    • BRC

      @Nice Try,
      I'm sorry to hear that the embodiment of a diety had to go camping. How do you rationalize that as a punishment? He's "God", not just the son of "God", according to the book he actually is "God", he has divine powers, so why on earth would he care about a little discomfort? Even then, how do you know he felt any discomfort? Are you the Earthly-embodiment of an omnipotent being, capable of crafting a universe at will? If you are, I'd love to hear your thoughts on temporary death, otherwise you have no idea what Jesus "went through". For all we know, he didn't even feel it.

      But I'll go one more, I'll grant you that he was a physical embodiment, and felt human pain. So what, again, he did some camping, and he got tortured. Yeah that sucks, but it happens to humans all the time, some of them for much much much longer than a month (there are prisoners of war who can in full rights call Jesus a pansy). So he has to go camping, he gets tortured, he dies (knowing that he's not going to stay dead, because again HE IS "GOD", none of this is a surprise to him), and then is whisked away off to heaven. How about the human soldiers who go out, risk their lives, live for months in the conditions you described, risked being captured, adn tortured and are often killed, for the soldiers of the US they do all of this to protect the rights of the people sitting safe at home who may or may not agree with them, and who may call them baby killing monsters. And when they die, they stay dead. ANd even if they were great people, who never took a life, but worked to protect life at home and where they were (let's say combat medics for instance)... if they didn't profess an undying thanks and love for Jesus, who had it pretty easy by comparison, then they are going to burn in hell forever.

      Sorry, taken in that light, Jesus did nothing special. "God" walked around for a while in a man suite then decided to go home. Not a real big deal. Now, obviously I've never died, but I do serve in the military, and if I'm in a situation where my life is going to be put at risk to protect yours (provided you're in the US or one of our allies), I'll do it without hesitation, despite the fact that you would call me as a sinner and a heathen (we atheists aren't well thought of in the religious circles), because that's who I am.

      Now, what EXACTLY is so very impressive about a "god" spending a blink of an eye on Earth and returning to heaven?

      March 27, 2013 at 4:42 pm |
  13. I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

    O'Reilly blasts same-se'x marriage critics


    "The compelling argument is on the side of h0mosëxuals," O'Reilly said Tuesday on Fox. "That's where the compelling argument is. 'We're Americans. We just want to be treated like everybody else.' That's a compelling argument, and to deny that, you have got to have a very strong argument on the other side. The argument on the other side hasn't been able to do anything but thump the Bible."

    It's interesting to watch what is going on at Fox right now.

    In the aftermath of the November election, the pragmatic real-politik people at Fox (like O'Reilly and Rove) are blasting those who are disintegrating the GOP: the tea party and the religious right. They know that middle America has moved on and will not elect a hard-right candidate.

    If O'Reilly and Rove have figured that out, it's time that the tea party and the religious right figured it out too!

    March 27, 2013 at 2:11 pm |
    • clarity

      Wow – that is something.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:21 pm |
    • hawaiiguest

      Wow. Just wow. I need to try and find a clip of that. I don't think I'll believe it until I actually hear those words myself.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:46 pm |
    • clarity

      Next thing you know, Pat Robertson will be agreeing with O'Reilly; lol.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:48 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      Fox News:

      2012-2013, 54% of Republicans under 30 support same-sëx marriage.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:51 pm |
    • hawaiiguest

      Now, if the Phelps clan ever get to that point, I might believe the world is ending.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:54 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      Stephen's take on O'Reilly and the beauty of man-goat love.

      "If Bill O'Reilly is now pro-gay marriage, then back when he said gay marriage was like marrying a goat, he was really saying that he's pro-goat marriage. "



      March 29, 2013 at 11:38 am |
    • Saraswati

      What I find amazing is how people can be wrong, and learn to recognize the fact, this many times and yet still speak with the same level of arrogance. I'm all for admitting when you're wrong – we all are sometimes – but to go on with the same air of superiority year after year, error after error is amazing?

      March 29, 2013 at 11:40 am |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      Yes, that level of arrogance is stupefying.

      March 29, 2013 at 2:03 pm |
  14. Doc Vestibule

    I was a straight guy living in Toronto's Gay Village when gay marriage was legalized here in Canada.
    One of my friends happend to move next door to me with her girlfriend and we three were constantly visiting each other.
    Life was simpler when my girlfriends were lesbians..... but then one day I fell in love with a woman who was visiting their place. Lo and behold, she turned out to be straight! 10 years later and we're still together, raising a family.
    The lesbian couple are also still together and raising a family (their son is less than a year old).
    In fact, the gay couple's relationship could be considered more "normal" than mine since they're married and we're not!

    The longevity and stability of a marriage has nothing to do with whether the couple is of the same gender. It has everything to do with that couple honouring their commitment to each other.

    Ease up America – the world won't end when gays are allowed to get married.
    Your neighbour's ho/mo marriage won't lessen or invalidate your straight marriage.
    Legalzing same se/x marriage has nothing to do with legalizing incest, polygamy, beastiality or whatever other slippery slope nonsense you can think of.
    No church will be forced to perform ceremonies that go against their religious creed.
    The fact is that in every country where gay marriage has been legalized, after the initial celebration by the rainbow triangle community, nobody gives any more of a flying fig for ho/mo relationships than they do hetero ones.

    March 27, 2013 at 2:04 pm |
    • clarity


      March 27, 2013 at 2:10 pm |
    • sam

      Gosh, can you imagine?? Canada is even still there! There was no destruction, nothing was ruined, the sun rose the next day. Crazy.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:38 pm |

  15. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-iKqr230U9M

    March 27, 2013 at 1:47 pm |
    • Wally

      Even W's daughter dumped his narrow-minded religious feculence.

      You know, a decade after gay marriage is legalized, even the Christians are going to look back and not know what the fuss was about. Even they are going to realize it has absolutely zero impact on their lives and hurt nothing to allow.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:44 pm |
  16. loveforall


    March 27, 2013 at 1:43 pm |
  17. Live4Him

    @WASP : we have early copies of the texts, we know that what we have no is what they had then. Now, were there some changes? Yes.

    We have about 24,000 early manuscripts (between 125 AD and 500 AD). When comparing like passages, these 24,000 manuscripts were found to be 99.9% identical, after accounting for the different languages. So, yes, there have been some changes. Of this 0.1%, the following were found to be the primary causes:

    1) Word order (the apostle Paul vs. Paul the apostle)
    2) Tense (he said vs. he was saying)
    3) Spelling (honor vs. honour)

    None of the changes impact basic doctrine, and we know the meaning of the phrases. But, yes, we do see some minor differences.

    March 27, 2013 at 1:41 pm |
    • History Channel's "The Bible" Parts 3 & 4 - In Under 11 Minutes!

      For creationists funny stuff .


      March 27, 2013 at 1:44 pm |
    • WASP

      @HIM: check out BANNED FROM THE BIBLE 1 & 2. it's history channel docu.mentary about how the bible was EDITED.
      thus the bible you possess isn't the COMPLETE bible.

      March 27, 2013 at 1:56 pm |
    • Live4Him

      @WASP : it's history channel docu.mentary about how the bible was EDITED. thus the bible you possess isn't the COMPLETE bible.

      I also know WHY certain manuscripts were excluded – they were written more than 100 years after Christ and yet claimed to be written by one of the apostles.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:48 pm |
    • Tinky Winky

      All of the gospels were written well after the apostles died.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:52 pm |
  18. Over 40,000 denominations of insanity

    One sect calls homosexuality an abomination while the next one in the same denomination is already performing gay marriage.

    One sect, the Westboro Baptist Church believes Americans are being killed at war because America is too kind to "fags".

    One sect believes that Jesus and Satan were brothers and that Christ will return to Jerusalem AND Jackson County, Missouri.

    In the U.S. recently we learned of the head of Lutheran CMS chastising a minister of that church for participating in a joint service for the victims of the Newtown school shooting.

    One sect believes women to be subservient, while another sect in the same denomination promotes equality between the sexes.

    Some believe that celibacy is appropriate for certain people, or for certain positions. It's ridiculous. Celibacy is unnatural and will continue to cause problems for the religious institutions that employ it.

    Many of the people from these same institutions advocate against abortion, but don't understand the realistic benefit of the morning after pill or even basic contraception; their unrealistic wishful thinking is causing the death of many at the hands of disease.

    Some believe the Pope is the Anti-Christ. Some believe Obama is the Anti-Christ.

    Conflicted right from the very beginning, Christianity continues to splinter and create divisions and more extremism as it goes.

    Has anything improved with Christianity since 200+ years ago?

    Thomas Jefferson, POTUS #3 (from Notes on the State of Virginia):

    Millions of innocent men, women, and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined, imprisoned; yet we have not advanced one inch towards uniformity. What has been the effect of coercion? To make one half the world fools, and the other half hypocrites. To support roguery and error all over the earth.

    James Madison, POTUS #4, chief architect of the U.S. Constitution & the Bill of Rights (from A Memorial and Remonstrance delivered to the Virginia General Assembly in 1785):

    During almost fifteen centuries has the legal establishment of Christianity been on trial. What has been its fruits? More or less in all places, pride and indolence in the clergy; ignorance and servility in the laity; in both, superstition, bigotry, and persecution.

    John Adams, POTUS #2 (in a letter to Thomas Jefferson, 09/03/1816):

    I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved – the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced! With the rational respect that is due to it, knavish priests have added prostitutions of it, that fill or might fill the blackest and bloodiest pages of human history.

    Ben Franklin (from a letter to The London Packet, 3 June 1772):

    If we look back into history for the character of present sects in Christianity, we shall find few that have not in their turns been persecutors, and complainers of persecution. The primitive Christians thought persecution extremely wrong in the Pagans, but practised it on one another. The first Protestants of the Church of England, blamed persecution in the Roman church, but practised it against the Puritans: these found it wrong in the Bishops, but fell into the same practice themselves both here and in New England.

    Thomas Paine (from The Age of Reason):

    All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit.

    March 27, 2013 at 1:30 pm |
    • Salero21

      So "UNIFORMITY" was TJ's idea! Wow, really of all people! A slave holder and an adulterer/fornicator came up with that idea?

      So "UNIFORMITY" is a Human idea a man's idea Not God's idea. That’s why He [God] Created them Male and Female and called them Man. Which means that in most cases with few exceptions in matters of the Law or matters concerning authority and leadership, the Scriptures speaks about man or mankind but the woman and women are included. He [God] Created them Male and Female. That’s God's Idea and there's no "UNIFORMITY" at all in that!

      March 27, 2013 at 2:05 pm |
    • clarity

      Everyone has their faults. Most of the presidents of that age were just like any other well-to-do land owner. Just like any other president, each of them had their strengths and weaknesses. Madison, for instance did not deal well at all with the war of 1812. But what he and Jefferson were able to do for the Constitution was brilliant. Especially with regard to the separation of church and state. Their drive to keep people from killing each other over religious differences grew out of immediate necessity having observed conflicts in their home state as well as others.

      March 27, 2013 at 2:17 pm |
    • Salero21

      I need to find me a good fornicator. Where is Douglas?

      March 27, 2013 at 3:22 pm |
    • Salero21

      So tired of these trailer park reject fornicators – I'm going to call my internets lawyer and report all of you

      March 27, 2013 at 3:40 pm |
  19. Tea Party Thomas

    The gay life style is SIN. Read your bible.

    Repent gays or you will surely burn in hell.

    Try to remember people this country was founded by CHRISTIAN not sodomites.

    March 27, 2013 at 1:27 pm |
    • loveforall

      But not everyone is Christian. And tons of stuff is a sin, that doesn't make it illegal. Cheating on your wife is a sin, people don't go to jail for it.

      March 27, 2013 at 1:30 pm |
    • clarity

      Hello, 2-bit Thomas. Get a life before squawking about how others should live theirs.

      March 27, 2013 at 1:35 pm |
    • clarity

      As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion;

      John Adams & the U.S. Senate on behalf of the United States of America

      March 27, 2013 at 1:38 pm |
    • loveforall

      So, what would happen if there was undenial proof that Jesus was gay. Would that change things?

      March 27, 2013 at 1:43 pm |
    • loveforall

      Oh that's right! In this country we have separation of church and state!! Huh, then I'm confused, how could this be a question of religion if we are talking about a law? 😛

      March 27, 2013 at 1:49 pm |
    • sam stone

      TPT: Your empty proxy threats are absurd

      The country was founded by deists as well as christians

      You are a bigot and a fool

      Go know yourself biblically

      March 27, 2013 at 2:25 pm |
    • sam

      Boring troll, looking for attention.

      March 27, 2013 at 3:23 pm |
  20. WASP

    @CHRIS-topher: thanks for permission to call you christopher............would have done it anyhow. 🙂
    RESPONSE)Dude, you can call me Christopher if you want to.
    "1) the bible can be trusted to have been unedited for the 2000years it was in circulation."
    RESPONSE)Depends on what you consider "unedited." Because we have early copies of the texts, we know that what we have no is what they had then. Now, were there some changes? Yes. But it's stuff like breaking some books into two, adding chapter and verse numbers. And of course there's misspellings and other copy errors. But again, since we have those early copies, we know what they are.
    "2) please which version of the "single god book" is the correct one; torah, bible, quran, etc etc etc"
    RESPONSE)The Bible.
    "3) where can i find "proof" outside the bible that these "authurs" were truly doing as "god" said and not what their leaders wanted them to say?"
    RESPONSE)Because if they knew it was a lie, they wouldn't have went to their deaths over it.
    "4) please explain why he bible was written nearly 300 years after "jesus" was dead."
    RESPONSE)It wasn't. It was compiled into one volume that long after, but we know all of the books were written and being circulated within 60 years of Jesus' death.
    "5) please explain how you "seem" to know more than people that spent years studying biblical history while you were pooping your diaper?"
    RESPONSE) I don't believe I've ever said that.
    "6) please prove how adam and eve had cain and able, then cain killed able; thus three humans, now prove how three humans could make a population that would be genetically viable?"
    RESPONSE)"The days of Adam after he fathered Seth were 800 years; and he had other sons and daughters." Genesis 5:4
    When you live that long, it's safe to say Adam had LOTS of children beside the three named in the Bible.

    1A) if major edits weren't made then why did the history channel make two docu.mentaries about "banned from the bible one and two"?
    2A) that is your opinion; a follower of islam would say the quran and a jewish person would say the torah.
    3A) millions have died for their faith in something; pagans died for their faith in their gods, etc etc etc so their giods are real also because they died for their gods, correct?
    4A) Jesus, as described in the New Testament, was most likely crucified on Friday April 3, 33 A.D.
    ■All four gospels and Tacitus in Annals (XV,44) agree that the crucifixion occurred when Pontius Pilate was procurator of Judea from 26-36 AD.
    ■All four gospels say the crucifixion occurred on a Friday.
    ■All four gospels agree that Jesus died a few hours before the beginning of the Jewish Sabbath (nightfall on a Friday).
    ■The synoptic gospels (Matthew, Mark, and Luke) indicate that Jesus died before nightfall on the 15th day of Nisan; right before the start of the Passover meal.
    ■John’s gospel differs from the synoptics; apparently indicating that Jesus died before nightfall on the 14th day of Nisan.
    -•125 A.D. The New Testament manuscript which dates most closely to the original autograph was copied around 125 A.D, within 35 years of the original. It is designated "p 52" and contains a small portion of John 18. (The "p" stands for papyrus.)
    •200 A.D. Bodmer p 66 a papyrus manuscript which contains a large part of the Gospel of John.
    •200 A.D. Chester Beatty Biblical papyrus p 46 contains the Pauline Epistles and Hebrews.
    •225 A.D. Bodmer Papyrus p 75 contains the Gospels of Luke and John.
    •250-300 A.D. Chester Beatty Biblical papyrus p 45 contains portions of the four Gospels and Acts.
    •350 A.D. Codex Sinaiticus contains the entire New Testament and almost the entire Old Testament in Greek. It was discovered by a German scholar Tisendorf in 1856 at an Orthodox monastery at Mt. Sinai.
    •350 A.D. Codex Vaticanus: {B} is an almost complete New Testament. It was cataloged as being in the Vatican Library since 1475.
    YOU'LL NOTICE NO SINGLE COMBINED TEXT OF THE BIBLE EXSISTS UNTIL AROUND 350 A.D. if jesus died in 33 A.D. THEN DO THE MATH. 317 years, long time i would say.
    5A) you accerting to know more than scholars that study and research the bible, stating when the bible was written or when adam died, is accerting that you know more.
    6A) please show me anywhere that a human can live 800 years, we are lucky to live 100 even with the help of modern medical practices. so that would be an opinion based off of your bible, not factual seeing no human has ever lived that long.

    March 27, 2013 at 1:25 pm |
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About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.