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North Carolina getting a state religion? No.
North Carolina legistators are fighting over a church and state issue.
April 4th, 2013
02:06 PM ET

North Carolina getting a state religion? No.

By Eric Marrapodi and John Blake, CNN

(CNN)– Politicians often declare that the U.S. is a Christian nation, but a group of representatives in North Carolina wants to add a new wrinkle to that argument.

They want North Carolina to be able to make its own laws establishing religion.

Two Republican representatives in North Carolina filed a resolution Monday that would permit the state to declare Christianity its official religion and reject any federal laws or court rulings regarding how the state addresses the establishment of religion.

Critics say the resolution violates the U.S. Constitution’s First Amendment guarantee that government will not prefer one religion over another. But a supporter of the resolution said it is about protecting another freedom.

The resolution reads in part, "The North Carolina General Assembly does not recognize Federal court rulings which prevent the state, its public schools, or any political subdivisions in the state from making laws respecting the establishment of religion."

Rep. Carl Ford, the resolution’s co-sponsor, told the Salisbury Post the resolution's intent is to support county commissioners in Rowan, North Carolina, who routinely end their invocations at public meetings with "In Jesus' name, amen."

A Rowan County resident filed a lawsuit against the county in March saying that she was not a Christian and that evoking Jesus in a public meeting sends the message that county commissioners favor Christians.

“We’re not starting a church. We’re not starting a religion. We’re supporting the county commissioners in their freedom of speech,” Ford told the Post.

Ford did not respond to interview requests.

By Thursday afternoon, the resolution was dead.

Jordan Shaw, a spokesman for North Carolina House Speaker Thom Tillis, said, "the bill that is getting so much attention is not going to move. It's dead."

Shaw said it would probably be referred to committee but would not come before the legislative body for a vote.

When asked why it was not moving forward, Shaw said the legislation did not accomplish what the legislators who had submitted the resolution had hoped for it.

Barry Lynn, executive director of Americans United for Separation of Church and State, a Washington-based organization that aims to protect religious liberty, said Ford's argument is “phony.”

“That’s quite a bizarre argument,” Lynn said. “They’re trying to say that the state of North Carolina has the right to trump the U.S. Constitution, that we have the right to decide what religion gets preferential religion in our state.”

David Graham, an associate editor for The Atlantic Monthly, said the North Carolina resolution signals the revival of the states' rights “nullification” theory: a legal argument invoked as far back as the 19th century that claims states have the right to void, or nullify, federal laws they oppose.

During President Obama’s presidency, conservatives have claimed that states could ignore duly passed federal laws dealing with health care and gun control, Graham wrote in a blog post for The Atlantic.

Courts don’t buy the nullification theory, Graham said.

“Nullification has repeatedly been ruled to be incorrect,” he said. “States don’t have the right to invalidate federal laws.”

The nullification theory won’t die, though, because it serves a purpose, Graham said.

“It’s good politics for the people proposing it,” he said. “If people are upset that the federal government is keeping them from praying at a City Council meeting or changing the way they get health insurance, a politician can say, 'This is wrong and I’m going to take a stand.' ”

- CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor

Filed under: Belief • Christianity • Church and state • Courts

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soundoff (2,110 Responses)
  1. Austin

    @n Tom
    "you're probably using words you don't understand–ones you copied from someone else's writing."

    ill take that as a compliment ......all I was doing was describing what I am witnessing "evasive exploitation" is simply the way you cop out of reality.

    April 7, 2013 at 4:47 pm |
    • sam stone

      what makes you think you are any authority on "reality", austin? did your dreams exhalt you?

      April 7, 2013 at 4:56 pm |
    • Austin

      Good question, fair enough. no they dont exalt me, they exalt God. And they give the reality of God authority.

      Daniel 9:18 ►
      Give ear, our God, and hear; open your eyes and see the desolation of the city that bears your Name. We do not make requests of you because we are righteous, but because of your great mercy.

      April 7, 2013 at 5:00 pm |
    • sam stone

      no, they confirm your opinion that god exists, and you use ancient comic book tales to justify your delusion

      April 7, 2013 at 5:08 pm |
    • Austin

      No I allready had faith, and God confirmed His presence and involved a supernatural vision through dreams to confirm that He controls other people, circ.umstances, He exalts the horn of a sinners adversary, meaning, He punishes those whom He loves. And He confirmed the supernatural quality of the bible through supernaturally conveying in my dreams what i was going to read the next day, or what I would encounter at bible study the next day. He has total knowledge and control of the future, and conveying this fact to me, was just to increase my faith and give me strength to be bold. And to proclaim the truth about the resurrection.

      April 7, 2013 at 5:13 pm |
    • Mrs. Pepperpot

      Austin: for your edification:

      Evasive
      1. tending or seeking to evade characterized by evasion an evasive answer. 2. elusive or evanescent.

      Exploitation
      1. use or utilization, especially for profit: the exploitation of newly discovered oil fields. 2. selfish utilization: He got ahead through the exploitation of his friends. 3. the combined, often varied, use of public-relations and advertising techniques to promote a person, movie, product, etc.

      Now how, exactly, if one of the most forthright people on here doing any of that?
      Malarky.

      April 7, 2013 at 5:52 pm |
    • sam stone

      austin: you evaded my question about free will in the same evasive manner that gopher has. are you a coward, too?

      April 7, 2013 at 6:35 pm |
    • Blessed are the Cheesemakers

      Austin accusing someone of "copping out of reality"....

      THAT is funny....

      April 7, 2013 at 7:56 pm |
    • skytag

      More proof religion makes people stupid. Out of a desperate need to support your beliefs about God you resort to laughable claims and logic that can only be described as silly. You believe what you believe about God because you want to believe it. You see the Bible as proof because you want to see it as proof. You interpret dreams as being confirmation from God because you want to believe that.

      In every case you have simply decided to believe what you believe, with no evidence any of it is true.

      April 8, 2013 at 12:24 am |
    • Donna

      Austin
      Another explanation could be that you're mentally ill and are only suffering from the delusion that you've dreamt the things that happen to you before they happened. Seriously now, how do you know that you're not mentally ill? Have you had yourself evaluated?

      April 8, 2013 at 12:58 am |
    • The real Tom

      Poor Austin. It's sad that no one who cares for you in real life will make sure you get the help you need.

      By the way, I was correct. You don't have a clue what "evasive exploitation" means. You're a lot like a first grader who gallops around the house chanting "fvckety fvck" just because he likes the way the words sound when he's playing.

      The one who has no grip on reality is you, hon.

      April 8, 2013 at 7:19 am |
    • WASP

      @austin: "meaning, He punishes those whom He loves."

      sick, sick person.

      April 9, 2013 at 1:38 pm |
  2. clarity

    The Establishment clause of the 1st Amendment to the Constitution has been under attack since it was first adopted. Thanks to its brilliant designers, it has stood the test of time and continues to do so. In order to protect every individual the right to believe in whatever they so choose, the key framers of the U.S. government knew they had to keep religion away from government as much as possible. This was not some new idea that just popped into their heads. People were fighting over religious differences in framers' home states – Madison's advocacy for separation of church and state began long before he was charged with drafting the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.

    In another post below, I quoted Thomas Jefferson from one of his letters:

    Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man & his god, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of separation between church and state.

    (from a letter to the Danbury Baptist Association in Connecticut)

    But what was Madison's reflections on his handiwork in the Constitution and 1st Amendment? These quotes are from two Madison letters later in life:

    Every new & successful example therefore of a perfect separation between ecclesiastical and civil matters, is of importance. And I have no doubt that every new example, will succeed, as every past one has done, in shewing that religion & Govt. will both exist in greater purity, the less they are mixed together.

    The Civil Govt, tho' bereft of everything like an associated hierarchy, possesses the requisite stability and performs its functions with complete success, Whilst the number, the industry, and the morality of the Priesthood, & the devotion of the people have been manifestly increased by the total separation of the Church from the State.

    (from letters to Edward Livingston and Robert Walsh)

    Madison as president vetoed two bills that he believed would violate the separation of church and state. He also came to oppose the long-established practice of employing chaplains at public expense in the House of Representatives and Senate on the grounds that it violated the separation of church and state and the principles of religious freedom. (See Library of Congress – James Madison Papers – Detached memorandum, ca. 1823.)


    As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion;

    (from the Treaty of Tripoli signed by President John Adams and with unanimous ratification of the U.S. Senate, 1797)

    April 7, 2013 at 2:56 pm |
  3. Chad

    @redzoa "By definition, "free will" and omniscience are mutually exclusive."

    =>boy, I sure see that nonsense a lot.. Anyone making such a claim simply doesnt understand that:
    A. Time had a beginning (http://www.hawking.org.uk/the-beginning-of-time.html)
    B. Agents external to our universe are not subject to our time.

    Some definitions:
    free will is the ability of agents to make choices unconstrained by certain factors

    omniscience the capacity to know everything that there is to know.

    Refuting the claim is very simple. Suppose i had a time machine and could go to the future. There I could see what the results were of everyone exercising their free will.
    Returning to the present would enable me to watch unfold according to what I had just seen the result of.

    Once you understand that time had a beginning, is relative and that agents outside our time/space are not bound by it, you can understand that it is straightforward to demonstrate omniscience and free will are not in any way shape or form mutually exclusive.

    See also: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theory_of_relativity

    April 7, 2013 at 2:46 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      I remember a math professor who put a question on a test asking about the behaviour of a function inside a closed curve around a singular point, at the boundary and outside the boundary. He forgot to define the function outside the boundary, so he had to admit that the correct answer was "it can't be determined" for that part of the question. So, what do you know about "outside of time", Chad. I recall that for some odd reason involving the word "imaginary" you rejected Hawking's proposals regarding "imaginary time", so what exactly does "outside of time" mean? Is it well-defined? Do you know if events and change are possible there? Do you know if God (or anything) can act there?

      April 7, 2013 at 3:00 pm |
    • clarity

      So Chad, do you think that your God knows at each moment through time all possible outcomes of every decision exercised by each bit of matter in the universe that he has granted free will to?

      April 7, 2013 at 3:03 pm |
    • Science

      Hey Chad ........................splat....................

      Curtains Down for the Black Hole Firewall Paradox: Making Gravity Safe for Einstein

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/news/matter_energy/albert_einstein/

      April 7, 2013 at 3:09 pm |
    • Chad

      @TTTOO "Chad. I recall that for some odd reason involving the word "imaginary" you rejected Hawking's proposals regarding "imaginary time","

      =>actually, that is (yet another) figment of your fertile imagination 🙂
      I never rejected anything that Hawking proposed on a basis of anything resembling "imaginary"

      sorry..

      of course, it's trivial to prove me wrong.. just provide a link to that post 🙂

      April 7, 2013 at 3:11 pm |
    • Chad

      @Science "Hey Chad ........................splat.................... http://www.sciencedaily.com/news/matter_energy/albert_einstein/"

      @Chad "actually, I believe that 🙂

      is this another one of your "post a random science fact then imply I dont believe it in a futile attempt to cast me as somehow anti-science but then it turns out I do and you look like you have no idea what my position is"?

      April 7, 2013 at 3:19 pm |
    • Science

      Dance rachael dance

      April 7, 2013 at 3:21 pm |
    • Honey Hush

      Rachel/Chad
      You are back from church after being cleansed of your sins and start right back into lying your ass off.

      April 7, 2013 at 3:46 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      Actually, you did say that. I don't keep track of your posts, but it was in the context of your rejection of the so-called No Boundary Proposal. I'm sure that will jog your memory.

      April 7, 2013 at 4:19 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      You haven't come up with anything on "outside of time". Do you need some references?

      April 7, 2013 at 4:30 pm |
    • clarity

      I had asked "do you think that your God knows at each moment through time all possible outcomes of every decision exercised by each bit of matter in the universe that he has granted free will to?"

      Regarding the free will issue, of course. I can almost grab onto that possibility, but then I keep thinking of the notion that man was in this God's image and then I really get some strange thoughts. I mean to keep track of all those possible outcomes, this God has got to have a much, much bigger head than say Keith Olbermann.

      April 7, 2013 at 4:38 pm |
    • Chad

      @Tom, Tom, the Other One "Actually, you did say that. I don't keep track of your posts, but it was in the context of your rejection of the so-called No Boundary Proposal"

      =>um.. no 🙂
      never said that 🙂

      your fertile imagination!!

      April 7, 2013 at 5:07 pm |
    • Chad

      "outside of time"

      =>see for example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse
      any candidate for the origin of our universe will stand outside our time, as its existence is not dependent on our universe, and time came into being when our universe was created.

      April 7, 2013 at 5:09 pm |
    • Chad

      @clarity "do you think that your God knows at each moment through time all possible outcomes of every decision exercised by each bit of matter in the universe that he has granted free will to?"

      =>no.. you still havent gotten your mind around what being independent of this universe's time implies.

      think of the time travel example.

      April 7, 2013 at 5:13 pm |
    • clarity

      Well yes, Chad my imagination took me somewhere else a bit, but regarding your "B. Agents external to our universe ", what do we actually know about that? Answering that would probably answer the ?? from TTOO. And if you think we know anything about anything external to our universe, how do you know it – can you prove it? That would tell us a lot.

      April 7, 2013 at 6:06 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      A Multiverse would be one setting for our Universe, I suppose. But you usually bring up criticism of the idea, by Paul Davies for the most part. It sounds like a comfortable place for your God, though. Well-hidden, at least, in a place that requires a kind of faith even from the people who believe in Multiverse theories (as Paul Davies points out).

      April 7, 2013 at 6:33 pm |
    • clarity

      If you consider multiverse as a way to explain a creator being external and combine that with the some of the ideas of the classical Deistic God, then I think we come closer to that crazy idea I had a while back of a creator god that did his job here, but is no more, and has skedaddled down a black hole to work on another new universe.

      April 7, 2013 at 6:47 pm |
    • Chad

      @Tom, Tom, the Other One "A Multiverse would be one setting for our Universe, I suppose. But you usually bring up criticism of the idea, by Paul Davies for the most part."
      @Chad "The Davies quote is to how how irrational it is for an atheist to embrace the idea of a multiverse, but reject the notion of the God of Israel. Both are equally supernatural.

      ======
      @TTTOO " It sounds like a comfortable place for your God, though. Well-hidden, at least, in a place that requires a kind of faith even from the people who believe in Multiverse theories (as Paul Davies points out)
      @Chad "interesting point. There is actually zero support for a supernatural multi-verse, requiring 100% belief.

      Supporting the supernatural God of Israel there is the Jewish people and the reality of Jesus Christ. All chronicled in the bible.

      As I say, being an atheist requires a great deal more faith than I could ever muster 🙂

      April 7, 2013 at 7:08 pm |
    • justagirl

      C,

      I am glad you hold to your position. Strong men answer with a calmness. You have the quality.

      April 7, 2013 at 7:16 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      I accept the invitation to point out (again) that the God of Israel is known and defined by religious Jews. Most Jews would wish you well, Chad, but I doubt they would support your efforts to promote your God in the name of theirs.

      April 7, 2013 at 7:26 pm |
    • justanothergirl

      @justagirl: do you know that Chad doesn't have a navel?

      April 7, 2013 at 7:28 pm |
    • redzoa

      @Chad – All that matters is that God perfectly knew/knows the one ultimate course of events and every individual step along the progression. Whether God is within time or views time from outside or simultaneously throughout all of time doesn't change the claim that this perfect knowledge exists. Because this knowledge is perfect, this knowledge can't be defied, else it is no longer perfect. Because no mortal act can contradict God's perfect knowledge, mortals are bound (whether aware or not) to follow the course of events perfectly known by God. Further confounding your position is that God is the claimed first cause creator and so possessed perfect foreknowledge of every event which would transpire within the creation. You've provided no real rebuttal here . . .

      April 7, 2013 at 7:32 pm |
    • redzoa

      I would add that your time machine analogy fails because, under your outside of time premise, God is not popping in and out of the timeline. Rather God perfectly knows/knew the entire timeline. In other words, Omniscience is not knowing only points 1 and 2; Omniscience is perfectly knowing the infinite points in between.

      April 7, 2013 at 7:37 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      Perfect foreknowledge by God, or any sort of knowledge, can't compel events. It is inconsistent with the occurrence of events contrary to what is foreknown, but that underlines problems with foreknowledge, not free will.

      April 7, 2013 at 7:45 pm |
    • justagirl

      @justanothergirl

      His navel is probably perfect and right where it should be. I'm 99% sure of that even without ever seeing it. Thank you for your concern for the absence of it though.

      April 7, 2013 at 7:49 pm |
    • Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam

      But if he is the one without a navel, would he be as cute as Kyle XY?
      Will he be ours to control?

      April 7, 2013 at 7:57 pm |
    • justagirl

      Rmghm

      I am unfamiliar with your comparison of KYLE xy. C is probably cuter though. Control would be out due to infringement.

      April 7, 2013 at 8:07 pm |
    • Chad

      @redzoa "Because no mortal act can contradict God's perfect knowledge, mortals are bound (whether aware or not) to follow the course of events perfectly known by God. Further confounding your position is that God is the claimed first cause creator and so possessed perfect foreknowledge of every event which would transpire within the creation."

      @Chad "Christian doctrine is that God is eternal, timeless, creator.
      Any ent ity that exists outside our universe, exists outside our time.
      That is the really important thing to understand. We think that the serial nature of our time applies also to any ent ity outside our universe, but that isnt true. We have a past, present and future, but that simply does not apply to ent ities outside our universe. Right?

      Simply knowing what we will do as a result of exercising our free will doesnt obviate that free will.

      April 7, 2013 at 8:39 pm |
    • redzoa

      @Chad – Again, it doesn't matter what God's position is relative to our time line (mortals, this universe, etc). If there is omniscience, then there exists an infinite and infallible knowledge of ALL events, period. This includes all events transpiring in any universe, any dimension, any supernatural non-"time-based" realms, e.g. from heaven to hell, from Midgard to Asgard, etc, etc. This also includes the timelines of humans and each and every "choice" they "make" during their lives.

      TTTO suggests that perfect foreknowledge doesn't compel. I disagree. The fact that the knowledge of the single true course of events is infallible renders any alternatives impossible. If there is only a single possibility, a single course of events, "choice" is an illusion as the only possible "choice" is that which conforms to the infallible foreknowledge.

      For example, God knew that Adam would eat the fruit, long before Adam or the fruit existed. God knew exactly who, when, what, where, how and why. If God didn't know a single part of this, then God isn't omniscient. But because God knew beforehand, and God's knowledge is infallible, there could be no alternative course of events. Adam was going to eat the fruit and he was always going to eat the fruit. If Adam could have "chosen" not to eat the fruit, then God's knowledge was not infallible. Sure, from Adam's perspective he may have considered alternatives, but in the end, Adam's thought processes are irrelevant. Adam could not manifest any internal deliberation in an outcome contrary to what God already knew would happen. Adam was, in fact, constrained by the only course of events which were actually possible; that single course of events which God already and infallibly knew would transpire, i.e. Adam was going to eat the fruit and could not "chose" otherwise.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:44 pm |
    • Science

      Chad ............................question for you................ are you smater than a 5th grader ?

      Listening to the Big Bang - In High Fidelity

      Apr. 4, 2013 — A decade ago, spurred by a question for a fifth-grade science project, University of Washington physicist John Cramer devised an audio recreation of the Big Bang that started our universe nearly 14 billion years ago.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130404170154.htm

      April 8, 2013 at 11:38 am |
    • Rick

      Chad
      "any candidate for the origin of our universe will stand outside our time, as its existence is not dependent on our universe, and time came into being when our universe was created."
      Which is a very good argument for why there cannot be a creator. How can an intelligent being with thoughts and the ability to do other actions exist, or act without the time to perform these things? You might be able to argue that God must have existed in a separate time line and then created ours, but that would negate the claim that he is truly eternal and would really open up the question of where he came from, right?

      April 8, 2013 at 11:46 am |
    • fintastic

      Hey Chad.............. what does your post have to do with a state religion in North Carolina?.....

      April 8, 2013 at 11:53 am |
  4. Reality

    Ending all of this religious stupidity, putting this blog to rest and giving the blog editors/moderators pink slips:

    Only for the new members of this blog:

    • As far as one knows or can tell, there was no Abraham i.e. the foundations of Judaism, Christianity and Islam are non-existent.

    • As far as one knows or can tell, there was no Moses i.e the pillars of Judaism, Christianity and Islam have no strength of purpose.

    • There was no Gabriel i.e. Islam fails as a religion. Christianity partially fails.

    • There was no Easter i.e. Christianity completely fails as a religion.

    • There was no Moroni i.e. Mormonism is nothing more than a business cult.

    • Sacred/revered cows, monkey gods, castes, reincarnations and therefore Hinduism fails as a religion.

    • Fat Buddhas here, skinny Buddhas there, reincarnated/reborn Buddhas everywhere makes for a no on Buddhism.

    Added details available upon written request.

    A quick search will put the kibosh on any other groups calling themselves a religion.

    e.g. Taoism

    "The origins of Taoism are unclear. Traditionally, Lao-tzu who lived in the sixth century is regarded as its founder. Its early philosophic foundations and its later beliefs and rituals are two completely different ways of life. Today (1982) Taoism claims 31,286,000 followers.

    Legend says that Lao-tzu was immaculately conceived by a shooting star; carried in his mother's womb for eighty-two years; and born a full grown wise old man. "

    April 7, 2013 at 2:41 pm |
    • Roth

      The bible is the truth. Moses, Abraham, Gabriel, Jesus, the apostles, and other prophets, scribes, kings and priests in the bible, they are part of recorded history. If you deny those, you have to deny all other historical accounts for much the same reasons.

      April 9, 2013 at 9:00 pm |
    • hawaiiguest

      @Roth

      Asserting it is one thing, actually presenting the historical evidence is a whole other thing entirely, and one which the religious have been failing at for years.

      April 9, 2013 at 9:02 pm |
    • Roth

      I never expected someone to present me with a Bible. I just went and picked one up, started reading it. Maybe I'll do that right now.

      April 9, 2013 at 9:12 pm |
    • hawaiiguest

      @Roth

      So your answer is the bible. I guess you're unaware that a book saying something doesn't mean it's true. If that's your standard why do you not believe in Zeus based on the Illiad.

      April 9, 2013 at 9:14 pm |
    • Roth

      What God says in the bible gives away that it's the truth. A made up story doesn't convey that.

      April 9, 2013 at 9:20 pm |
    • hawaiiguest

      @Roth

      So you have to assume that a god exists for the bible to be true, instead of actually presenting specifics you continue with the same failed rhetoric. Good job, you have nothing.

      April 9, 2013 at 9:23 pm |
    • Roth

      Then why are you on a news site reading if you have to believe they are telling you the truth before you can know what today's news is? Life must be hell for you. Instead, believe God and read the bible.

      April 9, 2013 at 9:37 pm |
    • the real Tom

      Do you really take the word of any one media outlet, Roth? I don't. When I read something on CNN that I have doubts about, I don't just say, "Oh, well, if CNN says it's so, then it must be."

      April 9, 2013 at 9:41 pm |
    • Roth

      Well Tom, if everything you encounter in life must be doubted each time you encounter it, that would be a living hell. Do you have alzheimers?

      April 9, 2013 at 9:50 pm |
    • clarity

      Well just what have you "encountered" from the Bible that you feel you don't need to doubt, Roth?

      April 9, 2013 at 9:55 pm |
    • hawaiiguest

      @Roth

      So instead of actually presenting specifics and evidence, you divert the conversation to utter irrelevancies and stupidity. Congratulations, you're showing that you have nothing to back up your assertions once again.

      April 9, 2013 at 9:56 pm |
    • the real Tom

      "Well Tom, if everything you encounter in life must be doubted each time you encounter it, that would be a living hell. Do you have alzheimers?"

      I believe the Alzheimer's shoe is on your foot, dearie. Where did I say I had to "double everything"? Go back and read my post again slowly. Move your lips if it helps. Your mommy might be able to help you with the big words.

      April 9, 2013 at 10:01 pm |
    • the real Tom

      Edit: "doubted everything", not "doubled everything."

      April 9, 2013 at 10:02 pm |
    • Roth

      No, Tom was saying to doubt everything, news, the bible, other things. I can't live like that, that's a horrible way to live. Maybe try some medications, I don't know. Talk to your doctor.

      April 9, 2013 at 10:07 pm |
    • hawaiiguest

      LOL It seems Roth is taking the standard tactic of "if you can't divert them, ignore them". Truly pathetic.

      April 9, 2013 at 10:10 pm |

    • Roth: "I have to be gullible otherwise it's too hard! It makes me want to go poopy!"

      April 9, 2013 at 10:17 pm |
    • Roth

      Clarity, the first reply said:

      "The bible is the truth. Moses, Abraham, Gabriel, Jesus, the apostles, and other prophets, scribes, kings and priests in the bible, they are part of recorded history. If you deny those, you have to deny all other historical accounts for much the same reasons."

      April 10, 2013 at 4:14 am |
  5. Flung

    Time to arrest all the North Carolina legislators and charge them with treason. Federal prison would open their eyes.

    April 7, 2013 at 2:12 pm |
    • save the world and slap some sense into a Christard today!

      Agreed. Especially since their Const-i-tution is not valid under U.S. law.

      April 7, 2013 at 2:19 pm |
    • Reality

      Should we put the voters of Colorado and Washington State in federal prison as they approved the non-medical use of marijuana which violates the Commerce Clause of the US Const-itution?

      April 7, 2013 at 2:45 pm |
  6. Bootyfunk

    they already have state religions in the southern states: ignorance

    April 7, 2013 at 1:54 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      The practices of Ignorance are important things to know if you ever go there. Someone will ask you "What's your chew?" If he offers you Redman, tell him you chew Days Work. I he offers you Days Work tell him you chew Redman.

      April 7, 2013 at 2:01 pm |
  7. Montoya

    @Chad: most of your points are spot on, but where you go wrong this time is when you say that a person's boots have anything to do with what he/she allows to go on in his/her rectum. How do you know any of that?

    April 7, 2013 at 1:40 pm |
  8. save the world and slap some sense into a Christard today!

    I'm baaaaaaaaackkk!!! lol.

    April 7, 2013 at 1:37 pm |
    • dustball

      I understand you want someone to slap around. But really, it's pointless. You should be thinking about the incredible effort that went into forming an entire universe, from God, his effort, and we're living here for some short period of time. Your slapping people around and making a mess of things, what good does it do? We've all be here some number of years, each, he's been around since before the universe. Instead of destroying or wanting to do something like that, I will take a minute to thank the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, for all he's done, and giving me the gift of life here and for his sending Jesus to die for the sins of those that believe him. Thank you God, have a good day...

      April 7, 2013 at 1:57 pm |
  9. Jill

    Rainer Braendlein, don't obfuscate the primary prenuptials with rasberries. Often, the pertinent cat presents fabled necessities in the parking chamfer. Realize your net precedent. Triangulate! Save the best for the alligators. Ever the bastille notches the orchestra but Wendy is not green and horses will capitulate. Filter out the log from the turnstile and cry prevalently.

    So there brown stare. Feed your inner walnut and resolve. Subject your lemon to the ingenious door in the presence of snow and animals. Aisle 7 is for the monetary cheese whiz. Faced with the kitchen, you may wish to prolong the sailboat in the cliff. Otherwise, rabbits may descend on your left nostril. Think about how you can stripe the sea.

    Regale the storm to those who (6) would thump the parrot with the armband. Corner the market on vestiges of the apparent closure but seek not the evidential circumstance. Therein you can find indignant mountains of pigs and apples. Descend eloquently as you debate the ceiling of your warning fulcrum. Vacate the corncob profusely and and don’t dote on the pancreas.

    Next up, control your wood. Have at the cat with your watch on the fore. Aft! Smarties (12)! Rome wasn’t kevetched in an autumn nightie. (42) See yourself for the turntable on the escalator. Really peruse the garage spider definitely again again with brown. Now we have an apparent congestion, so be it here. Just a moment is not a pod of beef for the ink well nor can it be (4) said that Karen was there in the millpond.

    Garbage out just like the candle in the kitty so. Go, go, go until the vacuum meets the upward vacation. Sell the yellow. Then trim the bus before the ten cheese please Louise. Segregate from the koan and stew the ship vigorously.

    And remember, never pass up an opportunity to watch an elephant paint Mozart.

    April 7, 2013 at 1:28 pm |
    • hal 9001

      Your assertions, Jill, are entirely correct. Congratulations, Jill.

      April 7, 2013 at 1:31 pm |
    • Akira

      I am such a fan of Jill's work.

      April 7, 2013 at 2:25 pm |
    • sam stone

      jill is awesome

      April 7, 2013 at 3:30 pm |
  10. Rainer Braendlein

    Although I favour genuine Christianity as the most preferable faith I would say that the state should be neutral.

    From the Christian stance true life begins with the rebirth which is the sacramental baptism received trough faith.

    Yet, every human being has to make a way until he can grasp the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and the holy baptism.

    Before St. Paul became a Christian he was a Jewish Taliban, and was ready to kill Christians. However, God's patience let him live even when he was still a sinner in God's eyes because he persecuted the Christian Church, Christ's body.

    Also King Nebuchadnezzar of the Old Testament who was a very cruel ruler experienced God's patience until he became a believer.

    A few of us will ever have committed sins like Paul or Nebuchadnezzar but also we "enjoy" God's patience who gives us opportunity to become faithful. The godness of God waits whether we become faithful.

    The state is nothing more than an emergency-facility for the people which have not yet become faithful. Anyhow they must be enabled or helped to live together on this plantet even if they are still filled with hatred, selfishness, avaricy, fornication, anger, etc.. I guess without authority every nation would collapse within days because people would start to slay eachother.

    Of course, the Church has to accept the states authority, and regretably even a Christian can commit crimes which must be punished. It is also the case that always wolves in sheep's clothing infiltrate the Church, and they also have to get punished for their crimes.

    (Probably according to Augustine)

    April 7, 2013 at 1:16 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      I gather that you believe that states, and perhaps all of civilization, exist to provide order and security for God's people.

      April 7, 2013 at 1:21 pm |
    • Giggles

      Who gives a crap what some German fundiot's view is on a U.S. matter? Go rain on your own people.

      April 7, 2013 at 1:22 pm |
    • Jill

      Rainer Braendlein, don't obfuscate the primary prenuptials with rasberries. Often, the pertinent cat presents fabled necessities in the parking chamfer. Realize your net precedent. Triangulate! Save the best for the alligators. Ever the bastille notches the orchestra but Wendy is not green and horses will capitulate. Filter out the log from the turnstile and cry prevalently.

      So there brown stare. Feed your inner walnut and resolve. Subject your lemon to the ingenious door in the presence of snow and animals. Aisle 7 is for the monetary cheese whiz. Faced with the kitchen, you may wish to prolong the sailboat in the cliff. Otherwise, rabbits may descend on your left nostril. Think about how you can stripe the sea.

      Regale the storm to those who (6) would thump the parrot with the armband. Corner the market on vestiges of the apparent closure but seek not the evidential circumstance. Therein you can find indignant mountains of pigs and apples. Descend eloquently as you debate the ceiling of your warning fulcrum. Vacate the corncob profusely and and don’t dote on the pancreas.

      Next up, control your wood. Have at the cat with your watch on the fore. Aft! Smarties (12)! Rome wasn’t kevetched in an autumn nightie. (42) See yourself for the turntable on the escalator. Really peruse the garage spider definitely again again with brown. Now we have an apparent congestion, so be it here. Just a moment is not a pod of beef for the ink well nor can it be (4) said that Karen was there in the millpond.

      Garbage out just like the candle in the kitty so. Go, go, go until the vacuum meets the upward vacation. Sell the yellow. Then trim the bus before the ten cheese please Louise. Segregate from the koan and stew the ship vigorously.

      And remember, never pass up an opportunity to watch an elephant paint Mozart.

      April 7, 2013 at 1:27 pm |
    • sam stone

      an emergency facillity to those who have not found faith?

      you are a delusionsal litte fvck, aren't you?

      April 7, 2013 at 3:34 pm |
    • sam stone

      rainy: you are a fool

      April 7, 2013 at 4:13 pm |
  11. Tom, Tom, the Other One

    Too many of us see the effort at reducing the influence of unfounded beliefs in supernatural beings, events and forces – which currently dominate the natural world in the minds of so many believers – as something that must result in the end of such beliefs. But I can see a day when belief in such things is encouraged, just as attempts are being made to preserve languages that are nearing extinction. Why should we do it? Even ideas that are ultimately failed and wrong may have components that may have unforeseen uses down the road. Imagine brave volunteers taking on the most virulent beliefs, even religions, for the greater good of humanity – necessary because these things seem only to run on human wetware. We must do all we can for these brave people. We must give them North Carolina.

    April 7, 2013 at 12:42 pm |
    • Your comment is awaiting moderation.lol?? Your comment is awaiting moderation.

      You could give freedoms back that ya stole from the people.

      April 7, 2013 at 12:52 pm |
    • Really-O?

      The 15th century – brought to you by North Carolina.

      Clever post, TTtOO.

      Cheers

      April 7, 2013 at 12:52 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      Hi Really-O? Seen anything interesting?

      April 7, 2013 at 12:57 pm |
    • Your comment is awaiting moderation.lol?? Your comment is awaiting moderation.

      See what the Patriot Act has done to bank lock boxes with warrantless seizures. The censor won't let me post the info.

      April 7, 2013 at 1:10 pm |
    • JMEF

      How dismal it is to see present day America (NC) yearning for the very orthodoxy that their country was founded to escape. C. Hitchens

      April 7, 2013 at 1:12 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      Now that's interesting. Is the Censor supernatural? What's in the box? Is it full of pox?

      April 7, 2013 at 1:12 pm |
    • midwest rail

      " The censor won't let me post the info. " Funniest post of the day.

      April 7, 2013 at 1:15 pm |
    • JMEF

      I would be willing to turn over both N & S Carolina as a religious ghetto (except for the golf courses, no proselytizing, beer allowed) in exchange for Italy turning Vatican City into a Disney type theme park, fair is fair.

      April 7, 2013 at 1:24 pm |
    • Science

      Hey JMEF

      Plastic heaven can't give that up ! LOL

      April 7, 2013 at 1:28 pm |
    • Your comment is awaiting moderation.lol?? Your comment is awaiting moderation.

      Ho ho ho, what are property rights worth? Nuthin', hahahaha All the dead soldiers killed fighting for yer gubmint died in vain if they weren't Christians.

      April 7, 2013 at 1:32 pm |
    • JMEF

      Science
      Yep.
      I don't care if it rains or freezes
      Long as I got my plastic Jesus
      Sitting on the dashboard of my car...

      Buy yourself a sweet Madonna
      Dressed in rhinestone
      Sitting on a pedestal of abalone shell....

      Best played with dueling banjos.

      April 7, 2013 at 1:34 pm |
    • Science

      JMEF

      And they used be a dime at the hardware store !

      April 7, 2013 at 1:41 pm |
    • Akira

      Better get back to building your bunker, lol??. Spam is on sale at the Food Lion. Stock up.

      April 7, 2013 at 2:34 pm |
  12. neastsider

    Since NC backed out of creating thier own teabagger repug right wingnuut approved state religion that probably means that they won't offer the pope's job to Gohmert?

    April 7, 2013 at 12:37 pm |
  13. Your comment is awaiting moderation.lol?? Your comment is awaiting moderation.

    Moby Schtick sayz,
    So let's look at another passage from the same chapter in Romans. Here, Paul admits to three things Chad is currently disagreeing with:

    1. Believers will question why god holds people accountable when it is god's will that is ultimately occurring by god's formation of his "clay."
    2. No one can resist god's will; therefore, man has no freewill, since it is inconsequential to god's will for the person.
    3. There's no point talking back to god, because his will and not the human's is inviolate.

    19 One of you will say to me: “Then why does God still blame us? For who is able to resist his will?” 20 But who are you, a human being, to talk back to God? “Shall what is formed say to the one who formed it, ‘Why did you make me like this?’”[h]

    And you see a Believer where, moby? More like a false brother or baby Christian to me. Isn't that a leap you're doing with the parable??

    "Eze 18:32 For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn [yourselves], and live ye."

    Just don't tick God off. When He does the judgment thing it will look like wrath to you. I see your pals don't mind your interpretation and are clueless as to inheritance, too.

    April 7, 2013 at 12:36 pm |
    • Your comment is awaiting moderation.lol?? Your comment is awaiting moderation.

      Moby HATES leapers,

      "Moby Schtick
      Chad, just because you and other Christians make stupid and erroneous leaps in logic that you have no business making doesn't mean that atheists follow your poor example and make stupid and erroneous leaps in logic. Just because animals are part of a natural process doesn't mean that they don't make decisions. How stupid do you have to be to make such a nonsequitur mistake as that?

      April 6, 2013 at 8:54 pm"

      April 7, 2013 at 12:39 pm |
  14. clarity

    Still some a little rumbling out there today. No earthquake. – It's still old James Madison from beneath the ground, farting in displeasure in the direction of these fundie nutcases south of Virginia who quite stupidly attempted to wrestle with the U.S. Constitution's 1st Amendment.

    April 7, 2013 at 12:01 pm |
    • Bostontola

      There is an article on CNN about Bangladesh citizens protesting for blasphemy laws. That is what you get with state religions. It is so sad that we have a portion of our US citizenry as out there as Bangladesh.

      April 7, 2013 at 12:16 pm |
  15. Bostontola

    I have an issue with religion's value proposition:

    Give me some of your money in this world and we'll give you everlasting love in the next.

    If religion wasn't protected from the Govt, wouldn't this be investigated by the bunko squad?

    April 7, 2013 at 11:56 am |
    • Blessed are the Cheesemakers

      If it wasn't specifically protected, it would be considered fraud.

      April 7, 2013 at 12:03 pm |
    • Reality

      Good point ! Time for some action by the SCOTUS !!!

      April 7, 2013 at 12:08 pm |
    • Bostontola

      What's worse is that in some religions they impress the full Pascal wager, if you don't conform you spend eternity without love or even torture of fire.

      To me that kind of threat goes beyond a confidence game and is an extreme form of immorality.

      April 7, 2013 at 12:13 pm |
    • Dr. Slick's Traveling Patent Medicine Show!

      As long as there is snake oil, there will be people gullible enough to buy it.

      April 7, 2013 at 12:59 pm |
  16. the AnViL™

    it's so hard to take xians seriously.

    knowing more about their imaginary man in the sky than they do – it's comical to watch them screwing up something so simple as the worship of that imaginary man in the sky.

    "And they say: "None shall enter Paradise unless he be a Jew or a Christian." Those are their (vain) desires. Say: "Produce your proof if ye are truthful." Nay,-whoever submits His whole self to God and is a doer of good,- He will get his reward with his Lord; on such shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.
    Quran Surah 2 Verses 111 – 112

    the funniest part: when the most devout wake up – and realize how wrong they've been... they submit.
    they understand they've been muslim the whole time and didn't even know it.

    April 7, 2013 at 11:15 am |
    • whatever

      The false prophet of Islam denied that Jesus died on the cross and rose again, obviously not a Christian concept.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:23 am |
  17. biggles

    I am sure the atheist's god will forgive Christians for hating them.

    April 7, 2013 at 11:01 am |
    • The real Tom

      Which "atheist"? Is there just one? Which one do you mean?

      How are you "sure" when you can't even show any evidence a god exists, lolly?

      April 7, 2013 at 11:03 am |
    • The real Tom

      Come on, biggies, move your ass. What "god" of which "atheist"? Why would Christians be 'forgiven' for hating atheists by one atheist's god?

      Tripping over your fingers again, biggies? I know it's hard when you're a knuckle-dragging dolt to write anything sensible, but do make an effort. The post you typed is just plain sad.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:18 am |
    • whatever

      The atheists have to ask their nothing god to give them evidence.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:19 am |
    • End Religion

      Will your god forgive Rick Warren's son for suicide? I'm going to guess Christians will find a way to give the kid a free pass so his daddy's not too shaken up over the loss, since with religion, the loss isn't the suicide itself but only which imaginary place you think he ended up spending eternity.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:19 am |
    • Blessed are the Cheesemakers

      If your god claims "unconditional love"....there should not be any conditions right?

      April 7, 2013 at 11:20 am |
    • Damocles

      @whatever

      Next time someone wants to sell you something, just take it on faith that they are telling the truth. Spend your whole damn life not asking for evidence of the claims people make.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:24 am |
    • The real Tom

      whatever, between you and biggies, you might have half a thought.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:27 am |
    • whatever

      Mat 13:37 He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;

      April 7, 2013 at 11:30 am |
    • The real Tom

      Why do you clowns think that typing a Bible quote gets you off the hook? It's like some sort of incantation for you, isn't it? "Uh-oh. I can't answer this so I'll just chant these magic words. No one will notice that I haven't said anything meaningful."

      April 7, 2013 at 11:33 am |
    • Damocles

      Annnd the half a thought just died a horrible, paonful death. Well done.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:33 am |
    • Damocles

      painful*

      April 7, 2013 at 11:34 am |
    • whatever

      In contrast to the bad seed that doesn't even bother to ask their nothing god for evidence, because they admit it does... nothing.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:37 am |
    • whatever

      Admit it, you don't ask your nothing god for anything do you. Just admit it. Your nothing god doesn't know anything, do anything, plan anything, understand anything, tell you anything... it's not there... how could it? You'll have to hype up that nothing god a bit more if you want it to save you... from God.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:42 am |
    • The real Tom

      What's a "nothing god"? I have no idea what you're babbling about now, and I don't think you do, either.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:48 am |
    • OTOH

      Wouldn't you think that a real smart "Holy Spirit" would give its ambassadors better material and guidance. It's almost like this "Holy Spirit" isn't there... (*wink*)

      April 7, 2013 at 11:55 am |
    • Blessed are the Cheesemakers

      And what do you ask from your god? That he witholds his imposing his "moral judgement" on you. You beg you god to be "saved from" your god.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:58 am |
    • whatever

      The material is of the finest quality, which is probably why you didn't get any.

      April 7, 2013 at 12:01 pm |
    • The real Tom

      By whose measure is the material of the finest quality? If it were, you'd be able to convince a lot more people, whatever. That you can't even explain what you mean puts you on the same sorry footing as Austin.

      You're just posting dreck.

      April 7, 2013 at 12:04 pm |
    • Blessed are the Cheesemakers

      "The material is of the finest quality,"

      Isn't that a quote from "The Emperor's New Clothes"?

      April 7, 2013 at 12:07 pm |
    • Reality

      Now for some Sunday afternoon nitty-gritty:

      The Apostles'/Agnostics’ Creed 2013: (updated by yours truly and based on the studies of historians and theologians of the past 200 years)

      Should I believe in a god whose existence cannot be proven
      and said god if he/she/it exists resides in an unproven,
      human-created, spirit state of bliss called heaven??

      I believe there was a 1st century CE, Jewish, simple,
      preacher-man who was conceived by a Jewish carpenter
      named Joseph living in Nazareth and born of a young Jewish
      girl named Mary. (Some say he was a mamzer.)

      Jesus was summarily crucified for being a temple rabble-rouser by
      the Roman troops in Jerusalem serving under Pontius Pilate,

      He was buried in an unmarked grave and still lies
      a-mouldering in the ground somewhere outside of
      Jerusalem.

      Said Jesus' story was embellished and "mythicized" by
      many semi-fiction writers. A descent into Hell, a bodily resurrection
      and ascension stories were promulgated to compete with the
      Caesar myths. Said stories were so popular that they
      grew into a religion known today as Catholicism/Christianity
      and featuring dark-age, daily wine to blood and bread to body rituals
      called the eucharistic sacrifice of the non-atoning Jesus.

      Amen
      (references used are available upon request)

      April 7, 2013 at 12:11 pm |
    • The real Tom

      Great. Now we can be bored to tears by Reality, the master of copy-and-paste.

      Never got out of Kindergarten, did you?

      April 7, 2013 at 12:13 pm |
    • whatever

      It's a bible verse, about Jesus Christ of Nazareth... of the finest quality... the most High.

      April 7, 2013 at 12:14 pm |
    • Blessed are the Cheesemakers

      "It's a bible verse, about Jesus Christ of Nazareth... of the finest quality... the most High."

      Read "The Emperor's New Clothes", it is a short story, you MIGHT then get the joke, and you MIGHT get why just because it is a bible verse is not a reason to accept the statement as being true....but I doubt it.

      April 7, 2013 at 12:20 pm |
    • whatever

      You can learn more about the truth, Jesus Christ of Nazareth, in the New Testament portion of the Bible.

      April 7, 2013 at 12:27 pm |
    • Blessed are the Cheesemakers

      12 years of christian education taught me that the New Testament is a lot of things....."true" is not one of them

      April 7, 2013 at 12:35 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      It might be fun to have a god. Perhaps it could do tricks, like creating evil and forgiving it, creating life and tormenting it with its flaws. Perhaps it could be trained to be perfect. But then again, it might go around impregnating virgins, and have special needs like sacrifice.

      April 7, 2013 at 1:07 pm |
    • tallulah13

      biggles: I'm sure that eventually everyone will grow tired of your trolling and start to ignore you, so you will change your screen name and start again. It must suck to be so irrelevant.

      April 7, 2013 at 4:37 pm |
  18. Austin

    Jeremiah 1:16 ►

    New International Version (©2011)
    I will pronounce my judgments on my people because of their wickedness in forsaking me, in burning incense to other gods and in worshiping what their hands have made.

    Revelation 9:20 ►

    New International Version (©2011)
    The rest of mankind who were not killed by these plagues still did not repent of the work of their hands; they did not stop worshiping demons, and idols of gold, silver, bronze, stone and wood–idols that cannot see or hear or walk.

    April 7, 2013 at 10:41 am |
    • clarity

      If I were a substance abuser, I probably would love to have whatever John of Patmos was on when he wrote that mess called Revelation.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:09 am |
    • whatever

      John was high on the Holy Spirit.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:13 am |
    • fintastic

      Harry Potter;

      "If Snape gets hold of the stone, Voldemort's coming back! Haven't you heard what it was like when he was trying to take over? There won't be any Hogwarts to get expelled from! He'll flatten it, or turn it into a school for the Dark Arts! Losing points doesn't matter anymore, can't you see? D'you think he'll leave you and your families alone if Gryffindor wins the house cup? If I get caught before I can get to the stone, well, I'll have to go back to the Dursleys and wait for Voldemort to find me there, it's only dying a bit later than I would have, because I'm never going over to the Dark Side! I'm going through that trapdoor tonight and nothing you two say is going to stop me! Voldemort killed my parents, remember?"

      April 8, 2013 at 12:07 pm |
    • John

      F, your Potter fantasy is based on nothing and imaginative use of nothing to wake people up so they can go on with daily life. God is absolutely beyond anything you can comprehend, or I could guess, ever comprehend given that you're rejecting him. You are missing out big time on the best there is: God. I wouldn't trade knowing God for anything. Anything.

      April 8, 2013 at 4:13 pm |
  19. Austin

    Barry Metcalf
    Baloney, Austin. Or is your evil religion still burning witches at the stake, and sacrificing animals to your bloodthirsty "god"?

    People use ways of ignorance as an evasive exploitation of who God is. And if you are missing out on the freedom and forgiveness, the grace and mercy of Christ, and you because you pick out some stuff from the old testament that is uncomfortable , this is not going to change the truth and necessity for atonement.

    You are bearing your sin and carrying it straight to judgment. Hatred for Christ, is the result of letting the devil control your flesh without using your spiritual tools to battle this evil.

    April 7, 2013 at 10:35 am |
    • The real Tom

      Explain "evasive exploitation of who God is."

      You are so delusional that you think people must believe in your god to live an ethical, honest, fruitful, happy, and worthwhile life. That means you assume, wrongly, that I and others are sleeping around, murdering, stealing, cheating, and wreaking havoc. You have no idea how many people don't believe, Austin, because they are JUST LIKE YOU. Except sane.

      April 7, 2013 at 10:42 am |
    • Austin

      testing.......

      tom, the reason that you are evasive is seen in your exploit.ation of me , or God, in your words "except they are sane". you form judgments that error in reality. The are due to one who is philoshphically controlled by satanic control that sounds harsh, but it is exactly true. that you can be as nice and sweet as you want, if you are not claimed by the holy spirit, your father is the devil.

      and we all should fight to be on God's side and in His will . You should battle with all your might to be right with God, and as moral as you think you are, you speak for the devil. You have a spiritual father, either way. and denial is evasive .

      Aboslu.te truth of God, and the resurrection, is not altered in denial and following the god of this world.

      April 7, 2013 at 10:56 am |
    • The real Tom

      "tom, the reason that you are evasive is seen in your exploit.ation of me , or God, in your words "except they are sane". you form judgments that error in reality."

      So, the fact is that you either don't have a clue what the words "evasive" or "exploitation" mean. Got it.

      Try harder next time you write. You're posting gibberish again.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:02 am |
    • End Religion

      Austin seems to be battling his own penis when instead he should let it rule his life. Let it lead you around like a divining rod. Stick it wherever it wants to go, as long as it isn't illegal and doesn't contain blades.

      An example might be, if you have central vacuum system in your house, open the door and stick it in. You can even make it a game. Pretend there are demons inside and you want to shoot them using a weapon your god gave you.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:23 am |
    • Damocles

      @ER

      If I see a story in the news about a guy found starved to death in his house with his junk stuck in an outlet.... I'm going to laugh... so very, very much.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:28 am |
    • clarity

      "spiritual tools"

      I guess those dreams are part of Austin's spiritual ARSEnal. I wonder if he's just eating too much food too close to bedtime . . .

      April 7, 2013 at 11:36 am |
    • Damocles

      @clarity

      I don't think it's too much food so much as too much acid.

      April 7, 2013 at 11:38 am |
    • Barry Metcalf

      Coward Austin, do learn to use the reply button. You and your god myth are pathetic.

      April 7, 2013 at 1:29 pm |
    • tallulah13

      As far as I can tell, the only spiritual tool in Austin's world is Austin himself.

      April 7, 2013 at 4:39 pm |
  20. Bostontola

    The pilgrims and puritans came to America to get religious freedom. The pilgrims wanted a full break with the Anglican Church. I can't think of a more Un-American intent than a state religion.

    April 7, 2013 at 10:28 am |
    • OTOH

      Many of the communities that the Pilgrims & Puritans set up were quite religiously restrictive and exclusive in their own ways. Thank goodness that the Massachusetts Bay Colony and the Plymouth Colony did not prevail!

      April 7, 2013 at 11:53 am |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.