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 North Carolina legistators are fighting over a church and state issue.
April 4th, 2013
02:06 PM ET
North Carolina getting a state religion? No.By Eric Marrapodi and John Blake, CNN (CNN)– Politicians often declare that the U.S. is a Christian nation, but a group of representatives in North Carolina wants to add a new wrinkle to that argument. They want North Carolina to be able to make its own laws establishing religion. Two Republican representatives in North Carolina filed a resolution Monday that would permit the state to declare Christianity its official religion and reject any federal laws or court rulings regarding how the state addresses the establishment of religion. Critics say the resolution violates the U.S. Constitution’s First Amendment guarantee that government will not prefer one religion over another. But a supporter of the resolution said it is about protecting another freedom. The resolution reads in part, "The North Carolina General Assembly does not recognize Federal court rulings which prevent the state, its public schools, or any political subdivisions in the state from making laws respecting the establishment of religion." Rep. Carl Ford, the resolution’s co-sponsor, told the Salisbury Post the resolution's intent is to support county commissioners in Rowan, North Carolina, who routinely end their invocations at public meetings with "In Jesus' name, amen." A Rowan County resident filed a lawsuit against the county in March saying that she was not a Christian and that evoking Jesus in a public meeting sends the message that county commissioners favor Christians. “We’re not starting a church. We’re not starting a religion. We’re supporting the county commissioners in their freedom of speech,” Ford told the Post. Ford did not respond to interview requests. By Thursday afternoon, the resolution was dead. Jordan Shaw, a spokesman for North Carolina House Speaker Thom Tillis, said, "the bill that is getting so much attention is not going to move. It's dead." Shaw said it would probably be referred to committee but would not come before the legislative body for a vote. When asked why it was not moving forward, Shaw said the legislation did not accomplish what the legislators who had submitted the resolution had hoped for it. Barry Lynn, executive director of Americans United for Separation of Church and State, a Washington-based organization that aims to protect religious liberty, said Ford's argument is “phony.” “That’s quite a bizarre argument,” Lynn said. “They’re trying to say that the state of North Carolina has the right to trump the U.S. Constitution, that we have the right to decide what religion gets preferential religion in our state.” David Graham, an associate editor for The Atlantic Monthly, said the North Carolina resolution signals the revival of the states' rights “nullification” theory: a legal argument invoked as far back as the 19th century that claims states have the right to void, or nullify, federal laws they oppose. During President Obama’s presidency, conservatives have claimed that states could ignore duly passed federal laws dealing with health care and gun control, Graham wrote in a blog post for The Atlantic. Courts don’t buy the nullification theory, Graham said. “Nullification has repeatedly been ruled to be incorrect,” he said. “States don’t have the right to invalidate federal laws.” The nullification theory won’t die, though, because it serves a purpose, Graham said. “It’s good politics for the people proposing it,” he said. “If people are upset that the federal government is keeping them from praying at a City Council meeting or changing the way they get health insurance, a politician can say, 'This is wrong and I’m going to take a stand.' ” |
  About this blog
The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.  |
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Midwest Rail, Christianity is banned in schools.
Shut up, and clamp your foil hat on a little tighter, dumbass poe.
I love how people talk about things like Christianity being illegal in school...when they don't know what they're talking about...its outlawed it just can't be part of the curriculum or taught to the students. The students have always had the right and ability to pray for anything at any point in school!
religion founded on moses.. though shalt not kill,,, then goes of to conquer and murder. Religions,, thanks to secular society, they are less dangerous in the free world.
Too easy to refute this.
Just have one of the other council members close a public meeting with "Allah Akbar!", and you'll see the whole proposal circling the nearest toilet drain.
Just when you think the right wing just couldn't get any crazier . . .
If the states and the country adopt a religion, I'd like to suggest it be Kopimism.
he Missionary Church of Kopimism (in Swedish Missionerande Kopimistsamfundet), founded by 19-year-old philosophy student Isak Gerson, is a congregation of file sharers who believe that copying information is a sacred virtue. The Church, based in Sweden, has been officially recognized by the Swedish Legal, Financial and Administrative Services Agency ("kammarkollegiet") as a religious community, after three application attempts.
So when do the witch burnings start?
we're hearing the last squeals from the voodoo religious,, before they fade away into the dark ages, where they belong.
Too many more of those comments and reasonable people might be forced to conclude that "educated" people in the Dark Ages were smarter than "educated" people now.
Once you establish a state religion then the faith tests begin. Plenty of Christians will be left out right away because they're too liberal but, as time passes, the only direction this could take is pushing to ever more fascist extremes of Conservatism. It's already a bit like this now all through the Bible Belt, but I can't imagine that it would be pretty for anyone not in that elite in NC.
lol??
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When the Vikings were havin' a blast???
the religious are losing to science. As they look more foolish than ever,, they resort to this crap
boo,, jesus is coming to get you
Why not use those confirmed and proven prayers to wish those wastes away instead?
Those almighty prayers.. use them.
doctors cured more people that prayer.. Oh wait! Prayer never changed a single thing.
Yeah, those eugenicists look *great,* don't they?
This is a touchy position conceptually. If you say that about prayer, don't you have to say that about meditation too?
lol??
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Why doesn't science do anything with the nuclear waste? Instead of just playin' the role of antichrist???
MBAGuy12, you just got schooled so bas!
NYUK NYUK HERP DERP
Religious nutbags feeling threatened - oh those poor babies. Good.
You're dying and we're loving it.
With the hangman noose. Tighten around their necks.
The image is just unflattering. XD
Answer
"You're dying and we're loving it."
=>ah, more positive encouragement out of darkness
lol??
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And the mob forms...
see dr owour prophet among us.
I take it the Republican representatives in North Carolina who sponsored this goofy bill never took a high school civic's class.
Aaaaaaggggghhhhh!
Nullification is not a north south thing. Check out the states that have essentially refused (read nullify) the Real ID act, led by Maine (real red neck state). And if at the time of the civil war, there were northern states refusing (read nullifying) the fugitive slave act, which sent the southern slave owning states into a tizzy about the support for federal law. Most people support federal and states rights based on what outcome they want, but considering "nullification" merely a north/south, redneck/enlightened debate is quite naive and actually doesn't recognize the fact that nullification has worked as a type of civil disobedience (or state disobedience). And there is more...
https://maps.google.com/maps/msie=UTF8&oe=UTF8&msa=0&msid=115929865190189608620.0004768d8e67d23e11025
http://beforeitsnews.com/tea-party/2013/01/real-id-obamacare-one-we-can-nullify-one-we-cannot-will-not-2475848.html
MBAGuy 12- No he, like you, is ignorant. I do know the difference between illiterate (him) and ignorant (he and you). You have shown your trur colors. Now go away, off to support your liberal and misguided agenda. Wow you have an MBA! How impressive and how typical it is that you have to let everyone know! It's actually relatively easy, some of us didn't stop there!
I'm intrigued, why is Separation of Church and State "liberal and misguided?"
By forbidding the practice of Christianity, Islam, Hindi, Shinto, whatever - we are officially endorsing/establishing the religion of Athiesm.
Who has forbidden the practice of any of these religions? Could you name one single example?
"Religion of atheism"? Idiot!
@ Saraswati: The atheist who sued this time - and the one before that - and the other one before that -
Shut the hell up.
Calling atheism a religion is like calling not collecting stamps a hobby.
@Oldguy
Please tell us, when did an atheist sue a person of faith, any faith, for being that faith and win? Just one instance will be enough
PS how exactly is atheism a religion again?
Oldguy - near death. It's a good thing. Bye bye.
North Carolina, if you freak-a-voids want a civil war, go ahead, my tax dollars will happily fund the United States military to knock you zealots down a few notches. Keep it up, because I think the answer to your neo-KKKhristiaNaziism is going to be aggressive laws stripping your phony religions of their tax exempt status, and that just for starters. I sincerely hope that the next generation of young people that you alienate with your vile rhetoric no only take a stand against this kind of junk, but also cripple religion which has gotten out of control and drunk on arrogance and unchecked power. There needs to be some demolition and leveling in order, and I think North Carolina needs to be the pilot test case to show the rest of the right wing bible thumpers who is boss in the country – it is not them. The Confederency is dead, get over it!
Wow!! 2, count em, 2 very rural state senators make some kinda weird stance and the whole damned state has to pay the price. Not sure where you're from but in my wide travels I have noticed that ignorance is universal. I'm willing to bet that even the great state of West Utopia that you live in has a couple of idiots living there. I may even be responding to one now.
You might be able to make that case, Jackbear, if it weren't for the fact that the majority of people in North Carolina think this way. In fact, were such an act put to a public vote, I'm certain that it would overwhelmingly pass. People in the South are an embarrassment not just to the United States, but to humanity as a whole.
lol??
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"...............neo-KKKhristiaNaziism............." OOoooeeewww, you must be a communist hating a different denomination of socialism...
As a Catholic I say "WRONG". The whole point of separation of Church and State is to not allow a State religion. Read the Danbury Baptist letters to Thomas Jefferson. The founding Fathers did not want a Presbyterian Connecticut, Quaker Penn or a Catholic Maryland. They did not want to be like Europe.
This is a blatant violation of the 1st Amendment and also challenges the 14th Amendment.
Let's just stick with the 1st-whacking out about the 14th all of a sudden isn't helping people appreciate government.
First of all, who says the government has any right to establish religion or have anything to do with religion?
Who says it has the right to ban religion?
Cite one instance where religion has been banned.
Who knows what "freedom" means?
"Freedom's just another word for nothin' left to lose?"
I believe we had a war about state's rights and whether or not state laws could supersede federal laws. Federal won over state, because the North won against the South.
Is it time for another Civil War to remind the southerners that they live in a nation, not a confederacy?
Don't encourage them-it's already Crazy White Supremacist Week.