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April 10th, 2013
06:43 AM ET
Social media embraces, attacks Warren familyBy Dorrine Mendoza, CNN (CNN) - In the hours after learning the Rev. Rick Warren's son had killed himself, Beth Moore says she was swept with conflicting waves of emotion. Moore didn't know Warren or his wife, Kay, personally. But as someone who had ministered to women on Warren's Saddleback Church campus several years ago, she felt a strong connection to the couple. In a post on her Living Proof Ministries blog about Matthew Warren's suicide, Moore first explained her anger at the "satanic force" that would prey on weak children. Then she walks her readers through her struggle to understand suicide. But most compelling is her frustration in trying to understand "trash talk" on social media from Christians attacking the Warrens, in addition to hateful posts from non-Christians. For some reason, these people felt compelled to blame Warren for the death of his 27-year-old son or defend their position that suicide is an unforgiveable sin and therefore Matthew Warren would never be received in heaven. Hardly comforting thoughts for grieving parents. Follow the CNN Belief Blog on Twitter Such posts don't seem to be flooding Warren's social media accounts. But Moore, who founded Living Proof Ministries and has written several books and Bible study courses aimed at teaching women about living a Christian life, was not alone in her frustration. "Repulsed and embarrassed the way some professing-Christians are reacting to the tragedy in Rick Warren's family," tweeted @Dhdyer. "A tree is known by its fruit." Even @HuffPostRelig tweeted, "If you are hating on @RickWarren in this horrible time you should be ashamed of yourself." The day after his son's death, Warren tweeted and posted to his Facebook page the following message: "We pray 'Thy WILL be done on earth AS IT IS IN HEAVEN' since in heaven God's Will is done #always. On Earth, it's done rarely." Over the weekend, Warren's Facebook page and Twitter feed were filled with thousands of supportive comments, many from people who shared their own emotional stories of losing someone to suicide. While some people referenced "hateful" comments directed at the family, they were not immediately evident on either site. But negative messages are out there. Despite the success of Saddleback and book sales for "The Purpose Driven Life," Warren is far from a universally loved figure, in particular because of his anti-gay messages. Twitter user Jeffrey Christian (@JeffreyChrist) describes himself as a "partnered, faithful friend" living in New York. On Saturday he posted, "Dear Rick Warren: now U know the 'anguished grief' parents of gay teen suicides feel after listening 2 U and UR ilk's anti-gay hate speech." @LadyLNorth, who describes herself as a tea party supporter from Kansas and conservative mother of three boys, replied, "Can u not show some humanity & contain ur hate 4 even 1 day? A family lost a son. Show some class if compassion is beyond u." @JeffreyChrist responded: "@LadyLNorth No hate here. ... And I hope his son is finally at peace. I'm not reveling in anyone's pain." On the CNN.com story about Matthew Warren's death, more than 3,000 comments were posted. "Christians are without question, the most HATE FILLED BIGOTED HYPOCRITES on the planet! Google it!" wrote urnemisis. "You are right," wrote a user who chose not to register a name. "We are hypocrites. We are human. Christianity has become about us instead of about Christ. Many 'Christians' are filled with hate and are bigots. Have you ever stopped to think that perhaps the 'Christians' who act that way are not really Christians at all? Christian means 'Like Christ' and Jesus is not like that." CNN’s Belief Blog: The faith angles behind the biggest stories Which was exactly the sentiment Moore was wrestling with as she described taking a walk in the woods and crying angry tears. "Life is hard enough without hatefulness rife in the Body of Christ," she wrote. "I'm sick of the bullying. The mud-slinging and the meanness. I'm sick of careless, idle words thrown out there in the public square and professing believers in Christ standing on the necks of their own brothers and sisters to sound smart and superior. As if it's not enough that we are surrounded in this culture by Christian haters, we've got to have our own hater-Christians. It's insane." On Tuesday, Warren posted to his Facebook page, "You're most like Jesus when you pray for those who hurt you, 'Father forgive them, for they don't know what they're doing.' "
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I wouldn't wish his son's or his pain on anyone.
If Waren understood that concept he would be more carefull of what he says.... and the implications of the religion he considers "moral".
It is easy to cast judgement based on babble. It is another to have the babble facign you in your own house. The babble throwers have a decision to make...ignore and justify or hold your babble accountable. This is why you do not see the flock of babble throwers in this story. They hiss and growl and crawl back in the shadow of ignorance.
Hiss and growling.... Are thine speaking of yourself? The problem you will always have is the same as, I guess, those who use such tragedies.
Just like when Christopher Hitchens passed away and there were Christians that offered respectful and sympathetic post. This angered quite a few Atheist because they came into the Blog expecting Christians to be cheering the death of Hitchens. That you and a few other Atheist are cheering this guys loss make you no better than those Christians who cheer the death of Hitchens.
Both of your houses are the drain on society.
"Both of your houses are the drain on society."
The moment I see some clown on TV, begging for money ,threatening damnation, promising to get that money back tenfold, in the name of Atheism ...I ll grant you that.
Most of us dont know the man, don't know his family.... wouldn't wish a tragedy like this on him and certainly not his son,
but we are not going to sit back and watch as he attempts to marginalize people because he doesnt agree with who they spend their time with.... or blame atheists for the gun violence....Both are cheap shots, – fear to bilk money from those he can.
Cheering??? No cheering here. When a man/woman walks around throwing ignorant judgements at people, he should expect judgement being thrown back. His son was a victim of mental illness as well as his father's ignorance. No I am not cheering at the death of his son. It is truly sad that the son reached a point that the pain was so great that death was his only option. There was no Jesus's hand reaching down. His father will have to deal with his own judgements and scriptures he quoted in the past
When things are positive it is God's doing. When things are unexplained, it must be Gods will. When things are negative, it is of Satan. Christians move the ball to satisfy their ignorance. In this case I am guessing Ricky is moving the ball to Satan had a hand in it. Ricky boy will not question God as to all the prayers to heal his son's mental illness. He would not dare blame Jesus or God for failing to heal his son's mind. It must be of the Devil. But hey God/Jesus just helped a retired lady at a casino hit the jackot...thank God her prayer was answered.
"Christians move the ball to satisfy their ignorance."
Not always.
"In this case I am guessing Ricky is moving the ball to Satan had a hand in it."
You are good at guessing. I'd be more impressed if you where good at being correct.
"Ricky boy will not question God as to all the prayers to heal his son's mental illness. He would not dare blame Jesus or God for failing to heal his son's mind."
You have no idea about that.
Do you acknowledge the idea of "odds"?
Knowing the "odds" requires knowing more information. You have to admit, we know very little about the people involved in this situation.
Regardless whether you do or not, they exist. With past patterns and rational of Christians in general, I think the odds are in my favor.
Not really, we are talking about odds in general
In that case you are generally odd. Just joking.
It's a matter of personal preference. I try not to apply the generalizations of a group to that of an individual.
How delightfully these "christians" illustrate their doctrine of love and tolerance!
"How delightfully these "christians" illustrate their doctrine of love and tolerance!"
Heck, I was thinking the same thing about the atheists that have their own self made doctrine of love and tolerance. They have been illustrating it as well as the Christians have.
There is no atheist doctrine....You either do not understand what a doctrine means or atheist means or both.
It is a basic doctrine of those Atheist that come here. Same as some Christians that come here. Both, are of the same doctrine of hate, fear and disgust.
@Richard Cranium- More likely you did not understand what I wrote. Atheists have their own self made doctrine of how they should act. At least that's how the atheists on here would respond. After all, according to them, one does not need religion to be moral. Right?
Segoy
Again..look up doctrine...
Atheists have the same sense of morals as any religious people have as we get our morals from many millenia of evolution, just as all social animals do. Atheists just don't make the irrational leap to think that a god is responsible (or needed) for it.
Richard Cranium- "Again..look up doctrine..."
"Doctrine (from Latin: doctrina) is a codification of beliefs or a body of teachings or instructions, taught principles or position"
Yeah..and?
"Atheists have the same sense of morals as any religious people have as we get our morals from many millenia of evolution"
Oddly enough I think there are some atheists that would disagree with that.
Atheists create there own self made doctrines. Perhaps a personal moral code might appeal to you better? In no way do I mean that atheists as a whole share a moral code. I am speaking about them as individuals.
Salero
Exactly...a doctrine is a set of TAUGHT positions or instructions.
You were born an atheist and had to be taught not to be. There is no atheist doctrine.
Not Salero back there.
"Exactly...a doctrine is a set of TAUGHT positions or instructions."
And where did your positions and instructions in your life come from? Out of thin air? You created your own code of conduct in your life but most of what you believe comes from either your family or environment. You have a doctrine. It might not be a religious one but you do.
"You were born an atheist and had to be taught not to be. There is no atheist doctrine."
Wrong. You are born not anything. Atheism is taught. You might reject religions but until you come across them to reject, you are not an atheist. Atheism is a choice. Otherwise the only alternative is that pure atheism isn't based on logic or reasoning but based on ignorance.
He made this bed.....what? he gets to make stupid, insensitive comments in the wake of mass shootings, but he s now untouchable because his son's problems....that HE threw out there for the world know....He wont let up on his bs for an instant.....
what is the old cliché? people who live in glass houses shouldn't throw rocks
"People say... where was God in all of this? We've threatened high school graduation participations, if they use God's name, they're going to be jailed... I mean that kind of stuff. Where was God? What have we done with God? We don't want him around. I kind of like his protective hand being present.”
.
““When students are taught they are no different from animals, they act like it.” Rick Warren regarding school shootings
.
.
And now he must turn to himself and ask this same question. Where was god when all those prayers for his son's mental illness?
What animal was his son acting like when he turned a gun on himself?
What gets me is MOST of the atheists comments are leveled at Warren directly – over his previous statements. We did know who his family were... he's the one that made his family issues public....he lives in the spotlight ...makes his living peddling a bunch of garbage to the gullible....and he expects us to give him a pass now? he expects the trolls to stay away?
We did NOT know who his family were.... sorry
I posted one of the Christian "attacks" on Warren on a previous CNN Belief Blog entry, arguing that Warren's teachings were obviously no cure for his son's depression, and that Warren should consider this experience as a lesson that his views are shallow and dangerous, and that the size and wealth of his church is not a sign of God's blessing. And making his son out to be a saved Christian damages the credibility and attraction of true Christianity. Ms Moore, this is not bullying or hate. It is hard Biblical truth for everyone who is living.
No one knows what was going on in Warren's son's mind (and maybe it was an accident), but suicide is a selfish and unforgiveable act, and an ultimate display of a lack of faith in God and absence of an in-dwelling Holy Spirit. Scripture tells us that God disciplines the ones He saves, often through trials, suffering, and pain, but never beyond what we can bear, and all for the purpose of bringing us closer to Him. Papa Warren may be feeling that discipline right now, but whether or not this causes him to re-prioritize his teachings is up to him.
Obviously you have never felt the crushing pain of serious depression. The moment when you can't breathe through it, when the weight is crippling you, when the pain is so far beyond your capacity to overcome. You say suicide is selfish. Is taking pain meds selfish? Is ending your pain selfish?
Putting that extra weight on someone already struggling is cruel and selfish and disgusting. Sure, suicide causes pain to those you leave behind, but they can't feel your pain, they don't know how bad it is/was. Obviously "god" gave this poor young man more than he was capable of dealing with...so obviously you're wrong about how that doesn't happen.
Belief in god doesn't cure mental illness. Sometimes there just is no cure.
"(and maybe it was an accident), but suicide is a selfish and unforgiveable act, and an ultimate display of a lack of faith in God and absence of an in-dwelling Holy Spirit."
.
Yep, blame the person for their mental illness because mental illness does not exist. Mentally handicapped (aka retarded)people choose to be that way. These conditions simply cannot exist because God is perfect and to accept these conditions would mean God is mnot perfect. All will be JUDGED even the ones and their thoughts while in a coma!
MrHighMightyStupid: You aren an ignorant ass. You obviously know NOTHING about suicide or depression and you sure as hell don't know anything about Warren's son.
Why don't you just shut your trap?
.
“God sometimes removes a person from your life for your protection. Don't run after them.”
― Rick Warren
...............
Warren
Got any other out of context quotes?
I mean..you are being so honest and everything.
Confused, are you disputing his quote? You can easily verify.
Hey, if you want to quote from twitter and apply your own spin on it, that's your cross to bear. Heck, he didn't even originated that quote. But I am so sure you knew that already right?
There are many crosses....which one are you talking about. Telephone pole? Those are pretty heavy not sure I could.
"There are many crosses....which one are you talking about. Telephone pole? Those are pretty heavy not sure I could."
I am now certain that mental deficiency is one of those crosses you carry.
But no one ever claimed you were intelligent on here.
Segoy
But no one ever claimed you were intelligent on here.
.--
And I never claimed to be as well.
At least you are honest with your ignorance.
But dogs, which have no ability to sin nor moral conscience, do not have an ability to reject Jesus.
Rick Warren
Jesus, Moral,Conscience
---------------–
What?????????????
Sounds like something taken out of context or just made up.
"I can t imagine God not allowing my dog in heaven."
Rick Warren
.
---------
Not out of context....just delsuional ramblings. I wonder if he believes goldfishes will be in heaven???
Nah, out of context, unless you have more of the transcript available. I doubt you are just copy/pasting one little blurb that someone else had put up somewhere. That would be dumb.
I'm certain Ciafosmi was going to get to it but for those interested in more than just the one quote...here ya go: http://network.crcna.org/content/disability-concerns/warren-argues-dogs-and-people-intellectual-disabilities-will-go-heaven
So he never said those words? Confused????
I believe I implied "out of context" over made up.
Are you a bit slow today? Take a few minutes and catch up.
rick warren. imagine having him as a father. it's hard not to believe his son took his own life because of what a religious nutjob rick is. can you even imagine if he was g.ay? or didn't want to be a christian? hopefully the real story comes out.
Booty
I bet the boy was a closet queeen
Listening to Pop's bash gays for a quarter of a century left him with the impression God hated him.
He probably couldn't stand living here in a world with people like you.
Same amount of evidence and just as likely yes?
Segoy sounds a little defensive.
I don't think she does.
I am not a person of faith, and I have little patience for Rick Warren, his beliefs, or his church. That being said, it would never occur to me to post anything other than an expression of sympathy regarding the death of his son (if I were moved to post anything at all regarding the tragic death of a young man whom I never knew but must have been in incredible pain).
People can be horribly cruel.
That's because atheists are a brutish, rash, animal like group of people. They're are worst than baboons and ravenous wolves. They often get attacks of the rabies. They're among the worst of people.
@Salero...do you claim to be a Christian? If so, then my brother, STFU. (Sorry for my Wyoming.) There is nothing Christ-like about your post. You cannot, in one breath, so callously reject another person, and in the next breath say that you have the love of Christ in you.
you wanna make out?
You show your true colors
Well fear not, your days in power are dwindiling
And we who have lived under the boot of your imaginary sky fairy want a little payback.
Just as you and yours tried to exterminate the Jews when you came to power, so shall the next cult try to do to yours.
Already the world over your people are being hunted like dogs by the cults who are rising up.
You see it is a dog eat dog in domination of the idiot masses, and it looks like your time has come.
@Salero21
!!!THE GOLDEN RULE!!!
Luke 6:31
"31 Treat others the same way you want them to treat you."
@A Convesation,
Do you claim to be a Christian? If you do then I can also! If you're not, then you're in an abject complete and total ignorance of what is it like. Therefore you're incapable of judging me or any other Christian. Your argument accusations and finger pointing is just arguing from Ignorance ARGUMENTUN AD IGNORATIUM. Which is very typical of atheists idolaters et al (pardon my Latin).
@ Vic,
I'm just Informing them of their condition and situation! Nothing else. They need to know that their behavior, conduct, manners are way below even below that of wild animals. I don't treat neither entreat them.
@Salero
Still trying to get rid of that self-loathing? How sad it must be to hate yourself as much as you do.
No Salero...they need to know Christ loves them, and since we are his hands and feet, that love also has to come from us. You have, in no way, accomplished this with your rant. (BTW, there is no judgment in my argument, just admonition.)
As far as claims to be a Christian as "A Conversation" have stated. I'll say this very, very clear.
If some Politicians can claim it, if some people in show business can claim it, if Sarah Palin can claim it, if Romney can claim it, if Obama can claim it, if John McCain can claim it, if the Pope can claim it and if many others like them can claim it! Then I, can and will also claim it. And there's nothing absolutely nothing you can do about it! So get a life, get over yourselves, because neither you, the atheists, the Pope, Obama, Palin, Romney can do anything about it!
Do you understand? Do you Comprende?
Wow, now we know how to make Salero go even more batshit crazy and moronic.
Thanks "A Conversation".
@ Hawaiian uninvited guest intruder,
Speaking about yourself again?
I can also claim to be muslim.
Atheists are brutish fools who will all soon die of the polio the ho.mos are giving them.
So, Salero21, you were going to tell me about the authorship of the gospels when you got sidetracked here and by your queasy feeling about "ho-mos" above. So it seems there are a lot of things that are more important to you than defending your belief system – that's very interesting. But if you ever do get the time – you really need to settle down and take a look at what we really know about the authorship of the gospels.
"That's because atheists are a brutish, rash, animal like group of people. They're are worst than baboons and ravenous wolves. They often get attacks of the rabies. They're among the worst of people."
I would have to disagree with you on that.
@Salero
"They're among the worst of people"
Says the person who comes here nearly every day to cut and paste the same hateful, divisive, rhetoric all day. Congrats, you have shown the level of projection you're using, and you have also shown, once again, the damage religion does to someone's mind.
Keep going, you're doing wonders for rationality with your stupidity.
@Hawaii...I do what I can!
@Sal...I'm going to go out on a limb here...if you are a Christian, explain which fruits of the spirit your posts are most in conformity with. If you are not a Christian, please quite aligning yourself with us...you're giving the atheists a hard on.
Matthew 7:1,2
"7 Do not judge so that you will not be judged. 2 For in the way you judge, you will be judged; and by your standard of measure, it will be measured to you."
Luke 6:37
"37 Do not judge, and you will not be judged; and do not condemn, and you will not be condemned; pardon, and you will be pardoned."
John 3:16,17
"16 For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him."
http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/03/23/the-money-man-behind-atheisms-activism/comment-page-57/#comment-2242221
[All above Scripture is from the New American Standard Bible (NASB)]
http://www.biblegateway.com
you know i was taught as a southern baptist that suicide is a mortal sin because "god gave you life, who are you to throw it away." (preacher's words not mine.)
you know i went looking for a passage about just that thing and found only these.
2 Samuel 17:23 – And when Ahithophel saw that his counsel was not followed, he saddled [his] ass, and arose, and gat him home to his house, to his city, and put his household in order, and hanged himself, and died, and was buried in the sepulchre of his father.
1 Samuel 31:5 – And when his armourbearer saw that Saul was dead, he fell likewise upon his sword, and died with him.
1 Samuel 31:4 – Then said Saul unto his armourbearer, Draw thy sword, and thrust me through therewith; lest these uncircu-mcised come and thrust me through, and abuse me. But his armourbearer would not; for he was sore afraid. Therefore Saul took a sword, and fell upon it.
appearently
1) it has nothing against taking your own life.
2) saul was a coward that couldn't accept defeat.
BLASPHEMY is the ONLY UNFORGIVABLE sin!
Matthew 12:31
"Therefore I say to you, any sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven."
It is very sad and terrible when someone commits suicide, but is not the unpardonable sin. Problem is that if the person who does that is not a believer he/she will go to the other place that is not Heaven sooner. That's all there is to it! But of course atheists et al are like ravenous wolves and worst than a troop of wild baboons.
" Moore first explained her anger at the "satanic force" that would prey on weak children"
.
Insane in the membrane.
"I'm sick of the bullying. The mud-slinging and the meanness. I'm sick of careless, idle words thrown out there in the public square and professing believers in Christ standing on the necks of their own brothers and sisters to sound smart and superior. As if it's not enough that we are surrounded in this culture by Christian haters, we've got to have our own hater-Christians. It's insane."
Sounds like every day here on the Belief Blog.
""I'm sick of the bullying. The mud-slinging and the meanness. I'm sick of careless, idle words thrown out there in the public square"
Funny how the christards are ok with bullying , meanness, mud slinging, careless and idle words when it comes to g a y rights, but it is somehow offensive when one of their own pops a hole in his noggin.
They can go fvck themselves. What goes around, comes around.
Derps, there are Christians who are Gay. Do these Christians also bash and remain silent?
"Derps, there are Christians who are Gay. Do these Christians also bash and remain silent?"
No the three g a y christians are too confused to hurl insults.
John 13:134
"34 A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another, even as I have loved you, that you also love one another."
Sometimes people help the wrong way and/or may forget that "ACCEPTANCE" is all what matters when someone is in a dire situation/condition!
But it's hard to accept christians with all their crazy talk.
If people would just accept instead of telling others they are going to hell for some perceived "sin", things would be a lot more kopacetic. Unfortunately, that isn't the way it is.
Some Christians truly think mental illness is demonic possession. Is this helpful at all?
All legitimate concerns! There must be a better way! I couldn't agree more!!!
Moore first explained her anger at the "satanic force" that would prey on weak children.
Beth,
Satan didn't do it. It's called mental illness. Science is working to correct it. Praying won't help. Your diet, exercise, and genetics clog your arteries, not Satan.
Why the vitriol?
Haters are gonna hate ,
Christians are gonna show love ,
In spite of personal tragedies,
a Christian will turn to God ,
in whom they will find comfort.
God's love surpasses and trumps an atheist hatred.
To pastor Rick and Kay- We love you! thank you for everything you do to uplift the lives of the many that are unfortunate. Above all else, God loves you!
Just out of curiosity, do you believe that someone who commits suicide goes to hell or heaven?
It's written, thou shalt not kill. I would think that includes killing yourself. You can't repent after killing yourself so how can God forgive you? God forgives you only after you repent and turn to Him...
I have tried to get some clarification on this issue. I am an atheist, so I don't really know. I was raised catholic, and told that suicided was a sin.
I am really curious to hear from the faithful on this one, but it seems that this is a topic they are afraid to touch.
Derp this has been posted several times in the last few days. You can reference the catechism to learn the doctrine. Just google it.
Derp...I'm generally aware of the Catholic position on this (I'm not Catholic), but I disagree with it. I don't think God judges on the timing or manner of one's death, but whether, per Christian doctrine 101, one has accepted Christ as their savior. It seems that we would have a rather unloving God if he chose to disregard someone who accepted his Son as savior, lived a life generally consistent with that decision, and then chose, in a moment of whatever, to take one's own life. Would it really be any different than dying with slander on your lips, or an unpure thought in your head? Jesus said in John 10:28: "I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will sn.atch them out of my hand." I think the interpretation of this means suicide is not, in and of itself, a direct path to hell.
@why: "Christians are gonna show love ,
In spite of personal tragedies,"
"or defend their position that suicide is an unforgiveable sin and therefore Matthew Warren would never be received in heaven."
Now that's good old christian love right there. lmfao
"Jesus said in John 10:28: "I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will sn.atch them out of my hand." I think the interpretation of this means suicide is not, in and of itself, a direct path to hell"
One other thing I am curious about. If Jesus said all this stuff, why does it say "John 10:28"?
Wouldn't it say Jesus 10:28.
Or did people many many years after the death of Jesus start writing down the things that John thought he remembered Jesus had said many years earlier but never actually bothered to write down?
How does that work?
Derp...fair question...you answer the question yourself (mostly): "Or did people many many years after the death of Jesus start writing down the things that John thought he remembered Jesus had said many years earlier but never actually bothered to write down?" I would disagree with the idea that the gospel was based on a what John "thought" he remembered–to the extent that that suggests a failed memory, but the chronology and source is accurate.
I would also suggest, however, that John's gospel is confirmed in many instances by Paul, whose various letters are generally deemed to have been written by Paul within 15-20 years of the resurrection–and identifies in many instances the witnesses to the resurrection, many of whom were alive a well at the time so one could go ask if they were so inclined.
Drep- God nowhere instructs mankind to make decisions on his behalf as to who goes to heaven and who goes to hell. Mortals are instructed to accept His plan of salvation and be saved.
Just an observation: most people do not like being lied to, so Rick Warren draws a bit of criticism. Even so, criticism can become cruelty. Uncalled for – Rick Warren probably doesn't believe he lies.
Another observation – one need not be an evangelical Christian to empathize with his family. I cannot imagine losing a child – so it never occurred to me to use the occasion to attack him for his politics at this time.
Perhaps, if we were more accepting of each other and less condemning and seeking to change each other, we'd be in better places with each other, instead of the my way or the highway.
This should draw the comments .........................will be interesting.......................... as the ark sinks !
Glad he knows what he is doing ?
It is about education and the children just maybe ?
Dover Trial Transcripts............................................. FACTS.
Below are the complete transcripts from the Dover Trial. Thanks to our friends at the National Center for Science Education for helping us fill in the missing transcripts.
http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/intelligentdesigncase/dovertrialtranscripts.htm
remember to take – out of se-x in the url
http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/04/08/detroit-archdiocese-dials-back-no-communion-for-same-se-x-marriage-supporters/comment-page-9/#comments
No, I don't think this topic will attract a lot of comments.
It holds up the mirror squarely to the hypocrisy of the so-called Christians who don't follow what their faith teaches them.
Those who have any real self-awareness at all with run from this topic as fast as they can.
http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/04/07/my-take-how-churches-can-respond-to-mental-illness/#comments