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Opinion: Billy Graham's other voice
George Beverly Shea sings "How Great Thou Art" to 54,000 people at a Billy Graham crusade in 2003.
April 21st, 2013
01:53 PM ET

Opinion: Billy Graham's other voice

Editor's note: CNN Contributor Bob Greene is a best-selling author whose 25 books include "Late Edition: A Love Story"; "Duty: A Father, His Son, and the Man Who Won the War"; and "Once Upon a Town: The Miracle of the North Platte Canteen."

By Bob Greene, CNN Contributor

(CNN) - Devoted fans.

Faithful listeners.

Seldom have those words sounded quite so apt.

They describe the people who enjoyed the singing of George Beverly Shea, who died last week at the age of 104. The name may not be instantly recognizable to some Americans, but that was no fault of his. He accomplished something very few vocalists can claim: During his career, he sang in front of an estimated 200 million people in live performance.

How could this be?

FULL COMMENTARY
- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: Billy Graham • Christianity • Leaders • Music • Opinion

soundoff (148 Responses)
  1. Austin

    if I wrote a story about reality I would not have hell as real. i also used to see "in the world but not of the world" bible verse as schitzo, "deny the flesh and live by the spirit" as oppressive and overly moral and repulsive.

    And I said enough is enough. I had no regard for religion at all. I vandalized the church. and then over the next few years I started realizing that evil, was a satanic force. and after that, and over the past four to five years, I experienced a series of spiritual revelations where God revealed His sovereign presence through absolute control over the things around me.

    I hated the cross, and I considered myself an enemy, and I received a call that I will never turn down. And now that I still struggle with the flesh I am really humbled and undeserving. I am no one to argue with THE WORD OF GOD. No one is. they are simply acts of the Spirit being revealed. I am not a prophet. God's voice did not speak to me, He communicated with me through my dreams and the circu.mstances later tied in to the revealing dreams.

    John 15:26-27
    New International Version (NIV)
    The Work of the Holy Spirit

    26 “When the Advocate comes, whom I will send to you from the Father—the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father—he will testify about me. 27 And you also must testify, for you have been with me from the beginning.

    April 23, 2013 at 7:44 am |
    • Science

      Logic overload Austin have a great life ........................grow up !

      Shout-Out: logicked

      [youtube=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ns5pnPab29k&w=640&h=360]

      April 23, 2013 at 7:49 am |
    • Austin

      science , I have given you a pattern that should at least open up your hypothesis to a new patient experiment.

      My evidence is personal and true, and it is also true for you if you do understand, or if you don't understand it is still true.

      Jehovah Shammah Our Lord is There

      April 23, 2013 at 7:57 am |
    • Science

      Was the bible around back then ?

      Human Y Chromosome Much Older Than Previously Thought

      Mar. 4, 2013 — The discovery and analysis of an extremely rare African American Y chromosome pushes back the time of the most recent common ancestor for the Y chromosome lineage tree to 338,000 years ago. This time predates the age of the oldest known anatomically modern human fossils.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/03/130305145821.htm

      No god(s) needed or required to graduate from public schools in the US

      Leanrning is fun do you have one ?

      April 23, 2013 at 8:01 am |
    • Austin

      When Moses was on the mountain, He came back down with aged appearence. Because the light of God is radiant.

      When the flood happened, the poles in rocks have shown to have flipped. The magnetic field was affected. the scientific model is supposed to be a constant deal. But all we have to have to throw off the radioactive decay rates is one thing , that humans have not figured out. And that is it. the speed of light. Pressure, heat, something caused the acceleration of radioactive decay if the dates are recorded as such, they are probably wrong due to a variable in the model that you don't calculate or account for.

      And I am telling you, I have experienced spiritual revelation. I swear on my life. I will not bow to science. If science can't incorporate God, then you have hijacked what is God's in deceit. You are scampering around intimidated and trying to distort God out of desperation.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:26 am |
    • Austin

      the only other alternative, period, is that God was evolving life for the millions of years you speak of, and then He breathed the spirit and soul into a man and woman that was ready.

      I have experienced revelation. and that being said, there is zero percent chance for you to make God un exist. Absolutely, completely, 100%, totally impossible to chance what God is.

      You are supposed to have a relationship with God. God wants you attention every day to be on His team.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:30 am |
    • Science

      .................you got one stuck in your throat ?

      Evolution wins hands down time for god(s) to get the hell out of the way ...............so humanity can evolve !

      .Dinosaur Egg Study Supports Evolutionary Link Between Birds and Dinosaurs: How Troodon Likely Hatched Its Young

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130418104324.htm

      April 23, 2013 at 8:31 am |
    • Austin

      How is the revelation of God surrounding the bible at a regular basis, a delusion? Is that a common hindu experience?

      Because these revelations every one of them, revealed God's word are accurate , living, real, and pertinent to the revelation.

      That is consistent and concise. That is not random, or hindu or muslim, or carma. That is the God of Jacob, the Holy Spirit, revealing the bible as His word.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:02 am |
    • oOo

      The Bible can reveal just about anything anyone wants it to reveal if you look at the right series of words. Nothing special there.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:05 am |
    • Austin

      science, that is an obvious motivation for you. to get God out of the way. Bad idea. insane. rebellious.

      those are only applicable honest words. I mean no rebuke to you other than simple truth. I like you.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:05 am |
    • The real Tom

      Get help, Austin. You are quite clearly mentally ill.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:08 am |
    • Science

      Fish Was On the Menu for Early Flying Dinosaur Bye Bye doogie !

      Apr. 22, 2013 — University of Alberta-led research reveals that Microraptor, a small flying dinosaur was a complete hunter, able to swoop down and pickup fish as well as its previously known prey of birds and tree dwelling mammals.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130422154925.htm

      Chomp Chomp Austin have a great life and grow up !

      All the other kiddies too !

      April 23, 2013 at 9:09 am |
    • Austin

      and when the word is revealed in dreams before you read it, miraculously, and genius quality, AND THEN ON TOP OF THAT, you are dreaming about things and writing them down, and then the people around you are suddenly bringing forth your dream into reality, such as dreaming about the blue print someone shows you two days later, and having a kid come up to you in the morning and telling you they dreamed about your exact thoughts the night before, you have to take the conincodence out of what God is doing to get your attention. The rate and fashion I experienced was the revealing of spiritual power. None other than the living God.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:09 am |
    • Austin

      have a good one. off to work.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:10 am |
    • The real Tom

      Work won't help you, Austin. You'll remain ill until you get some help.

      You haven't posted a thing yet about any "new" dreams you've had, so that when you have some sort of relevant experience in your conscious hours you can show everyone that you're not just making up sh~t. When are you going to do that?

      April 23, 2013 at 9:14 am |
    • sam stone

      Austin: You are delusional. Obviously, the hooch rotted your mind.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:20 am |
    • Ted Jones

      Austin, how is science removing god? Intelligence is removing ramblings of ignorant men. You have visions so therefore you know? People are in padded rooms who have visions and act on them. Austin you are in serious need of mental help. SERIOUS.

      April 23, 2013 at 2:05 pm |
    • hawaiiguest

      I see Austins crazy is still in full view of all. Poor deluded little fool.

      April 23, 2013 at 2:15 pm |
    • Austin

      Im so scared Ted. So people get put in padded rooms for something they didn't do then ? God did something and so someone ends up in jail? Big talker there Theodore.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:54 pm |
    • Saraswati

      Austin,

      I really think what you're trying to accomplish would fit better on a personal blog. You could record not only your past dreams but a whole dream journal and then tie in matching events as they happen. You are more likely to get relevant feedback in that sort of format.

      April 23, 2013 at 10:13 pm |
  2. M.R. Walts

    Before quoting scripture or some self professed expert on the Bible who wrote "a twitter sensationalized" account of the Bible to make it more in line with their own vanity...try actually reading the Bible.Their are enough modern language translations that even an atheist could read.The woman who got the Bible kicked out of schools will be forgotton, but one of her sons is a Evangelical Christian Minister.He embraces the God of Abraham.God/Yahweh/Messiah/Jesus Christ is Truth,Light.Life.and Creator.Amen.

    April 23, 2013 at 6:38 am |
    • Science

      Thai Researchers Discover 100-Million-Year-Old Crocodile Fossile

      [youtube=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwD_hjq_V7U&w=640&h=360]

      April 23, 2013 at 6:42 am |
    • Truth Prevails :-)

      Most Atheists have read the bible. Most of us were raised within the church and grew up. Some of us don't need a god to guide us in this world, we're quite capable of living good lives based on reality. Christians live in fear...sin=fear; death=fear;....the list goes on.
      Maybe you should really read the bible yourself! It is so full of contradictions and horror.

      April 23, 2013 at 7:01 am |
    • Austin

      Truth Prevails, that is a ridiculous assumption. Christians are just as moral as you are without the bible. No one comes to the cross so they can have a moral guide. What a joke that would be.

      And if there were no God, we would be doing what you do. Pretending that its good to still be moral while there was no God. but you are wrong. There is a God who we submit to. and then there are rules that a Holy God instructs for one purpose.

      A Blessed life. The judgments of God and his promises are obtained through living according to His will.

      Psalm 111:10 ►

      The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom; all who follow his precepts have good understanding. To him belongs eternal praise.

      April 23, 2013 at 7:50 am |
    • Saraswati

      If you look at the demographics and do the very simple math you'll see that there are far more atheists around whose parents were Christians than Christians whose parents were atheists. What do all those examples tell you since you seem to think such stories are deeply meaningful?

      April 23, 2013 at 7:56 am |
    • Truth Prevails :-)

      Austin: That is your opinion, nothing more. You base what you believe off of one book that has been refuted and debunked on numerous occasions. You base your morals off of one book. I'm not pretending anything. I live my life and would know that I don't require a god that CAN'T be shown to exist, to live a good life. This is your conception and it doesn't meld with reality. You believe strictly on faith and really don't seem to care that what you believe has any evidence (the bible doesn't count). I happen to care that my belief's are based on evidence, so I drop the religion factor and wait until the day a god is shown to exist, until then there is no valid reason to believe.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:02 am |
    • Austin

      It tells you that on a whole people are depraved. They despise their parents many times, and adding scripture or church into a scenario with a twisted parent/folk causes a backlash against what is truly God's word. If Hitler was your dad and he was sending you to catholic church all the while killing people how would you fare? Sick world.

      Also, in my case, my parents believe and I believe, yet there is a trial at hand for me to be able to honor my parents. I have problems getting spiritually open around them . this could be demonic oppression, or pride. It could be a generation thing where one does not relate to the other.

      It is a serious sin, to dishonor your parents , and to reject the faith they tried to bring you up with because of relationship issues. This is like the woman submitting to Man, Man to God, children to parents. this is an area that us under MAJOR attack by Satan.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:06 am |
    • Austin

      You believe strictly on faith and really don't seem to care that what you believe has any evidence (the bible doesn't count).

      two nights in a row, and a little space between the third dream,

      #1I dreamt about the tile patio , a huge and beautiful rock tile with wide grout and a beautiful pattern and color, ater i had entered a stone arch entrance. There was an arm reaching into a whole, a whole chizzeled out of the ground. and the arm pulled out a leather bag full of gems. wrote these down in the middle or the night half asleep. The next day....I kept reading my bible.......

      Jeremiah 43:8-13
      New American Standard Bible (NASB)
      8 Then the word of the Lord came to Jeremiah in Tahpanhes, saying, 9 “Take some large stones in your [a]hands and hide them in the mortar in the brick terrace which is at the entrance of Pharaoh’s [c]palace in Tahpanhes, in the sight of [d]some of the J.ews; 10 and say to them, ‘Thus says the Lord of hosts, the God of Israel, “Behold, I am going to send and get Nebuchadnezzar the king of Babylon, My servant, and I am going to set his throne right over these stones that I have hidden; and he will spread his canopy over them.

      #2 the next night I dreamed that i was being attacked by a motorcycle gang and that the leader of the gang had a huge animal horn, att.atched to his seat. he could not even sit on his bike. he was trying to run me over. they were a rebel gang.
      the next day, i had finished reading Jeremiah and gotten into Lament.ations

      ◄ Lament.ations 2:3 ►

      New International Version (©2011)
      In fierce anger he has cut off every horn of Israel. He has withdrawn his right hand at the approach of the enemy. He has burned in Jacob like a flaming fire that consumes everything around it.
      ◄ Lament.ations 2:17 ►

      New International Version (©2011)
      The LORD has done what he planned; he has fulfilled his word, which he decreed long ago. He has overthrown you without pity, he has let the enemy gloat over you, he has exalted the horn of your foes.

      I DID NOT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE BOOK OF JEREMIAH AND THE STONES, AND I HAD NO RECOLLECTION OF LAMENTA.TIONS. i COULD NOT HAVE TOLD YOU WHAT ONE MAIN POINT WAS OTHER THAN I KNEW JEREMIAH WAS A PROPHET.

      #3 a few days later I had a dream that there was a huge pile of feathers underneath a bed. that day, I was reading in the book of daniel, ◄ Daniel 4:33 ►

      New International Version (©2011)
      Immediately what had been said about Nebuchadnezzar was fulfilled. He was driven away from people and ate grass like the ox. His body was drenched with the dew of heaven until his hair grew like the feathers of an eagle and his nails like the claws of a bird.

      the kid who i had the dream about, got into trouble that day, which i had suspected the feather was a sign that he would be humiliated. he had his work pass suspended which was a major blow.

      #4 dreamed I was poisoned by mercury in alcohol. the next dream, didnt have a single dream for two weeks, this next dream I had just let two snakes out of a cage. one was a viper, the other was a rattler. but I had not thought even thought the word viper for a long time. when i woke up, i said to the kid next to me................."something is going to happen today, this one is a sign" i knew the snakes were a sign..

      two hours later i went down to bible study, the leader, on the second passage, said turn to proverbs 23:32

      29 Who has woe? Who has sorrow?
      Who has strife? Who has complaints?
      Who has needless bruises? Who has blo.odshot eyes?
      30 Those who linger over wine,
      who go to sample bowls of mixed wine.
      31 Do not gaze at wine when it is red,
      when it sparkles in the cup,
      when it goes down smoothly!
      32 In the end it bites like a snake
      and poisons like a viper.

      #5 Dreamed i was in a wh.ore house and I flooded it because i turned on a water spitot upstairs and just let it go and left it on. I had been praying about lust. I didnt catch this dream, until a few week later i did a study on water. I had no clue about this dream. i seemed like a random joke. but i got kicked out for letting the water run and flood.

      15 Drink water from your own cistern, running water from your own well. 16 Should your springs overflow in the streets, your streams of water in the public squares? 17 Let them be yours alone, never to be shared with strangers. 18 May your fountain be blessed, and may you rejoice in the wife of your youth. 19 A loving doe, a graceful deer– may her breasts satisfy you always, may you ever be intoxicated with her love. 20 Why, my son, be intoxicated with another man's wife? Why embrace the bosom of a wayward woman? 21 For your ways are in full view of the LORD, and he examines all your paths. 22 The evil deeds of the wicked ensnare them; the cords of their sins hold them fast.

      # 6 dreamed i was touring a house and went out back and there was an ABOVE ground pool with an flush deck and a privacy fence right around the deck.

      two days later the kid sleeping next to me pulled out a piece of paper , sheldon clay was his name, and he showed me his blue print he drew, of a new house, with an above ground swimming pool , with a flush deck around the pool, and a privacy fence on the deck.

      #7 this kid on night threw a roll a tp and racked me. I was furious and said to myself, I wonder if he has the light in his eye. and then i rebuked my judgment of his spiritual condition. THE NEXT MORNING he woke up and came up to me and said, "i had a dream last night that i was going around to see who had a special light in their eye to see if they were possessed or not"
      this kid was not a bible verse type of guy.

      #8 had a dream that the kid who was ripping on me lost his money
      a month later i over heard him talking about how he lost his money, and i said watch this, and pulled out the dream i had that he had lost it.

      #9 the cat dream. I had a cat at my house, that night i dreamed that a demonic voice sang to me which inverted my body and then presented the same cat, covered in blood.

      I woke up and the cat was dead in the highway, 550 feet from my house.

      #10 I had a dream i was inside the st. louis arch and I was in there with my cousin, and she was pointing at a glass case , with a bust of someone. she said "look, its thomas Jefferson" and the place was very nice. very expensive and ritzy.

      I had no idea what the st. louis arch was about. but what i had been doing, was getting heavily into the rumors about masons, and this dream just came to me. and when I googled this and I started trembling . this is called "a word of knowledge" which is a type of spiritual gift.

      There have been numerous other ones that I believe were spiritual words of knowledge that i wont get in to .

      None of this stuff, is me trying to fit things together. everything i dreamed, and then experienced in real life as i have stated. Some of these, are totally obvious. others, I have complete faith that they were also spiritual revelations, because I know %100 that some were, so I can have faith that others probably were too. and 8 of the first ten there, all happened in jail.

      This is organized, and relevant information that is a dream, relating to reality that i was about to live.

      That is spiritual revelation.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:09 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      Austin, if you are a moral person without your Bible why surrender your sense of morality to that book? Your interpretation of it may lead you to say and do things outside of what anyone would consider moral.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:11 am |
    • Austin

      It is more than a book and there is more than physical evidence that you need to understand does exist. I received a powerful series of spiritual breakthroughs , God's transcending power is here right now.

      Don't damn your mind expecting a spiritual God to suddenly give you scientific proof of His presence. His kingdom is spiritual. That is what you are. Spirit. This life is a test.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:13 am |
    • Austin

      Tom, look I cant really surrender my sinful flesh. I struggle with that. but when it comes to morality, the simple truth is that I cant lie to myself about the revelations that were God bieng fully sovereign and revealing the power around His written word.

      I cant challenge what God has done. I sin and that is the insane disobedience. I am not disobedient to myself. My self does not want any morals. I want to fornicate all day. God revealed Himself and I know what He expects, even in areas my flesh disagrees with. like hell, and slavery,and the canaanite slaughter. I cant challenge the Word of God. God has revealed himself through His word. the Word is prophetic, and the Spirit has shown its all powerful ability.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:19 am |
    • Truth Prevails :-)

      Austin: Once again, those dreams are pertinent to you and you only. Without anything further to back them, they mean nothing to anyone else. As for the evidence to back the bible...where? You can deceive yourself all you wish but you are not deceiving us. It becomes pointless trying to talk to you because you are too blinded by religion to see anything else. You still fail to show that your god exists...once again, your dreams and the bible are not evidence of this...give us the evidence backed by the scientific community!

      April 23, 2013 at 8:23 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      What is the test like, Austin? Live in the world, but ignore all of it except the one thing you have become convinced is true, something that is not part of the world. I think it's better to learn to abide and to stop seeking approval from an imaginary Father.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:29 am |
    • Austin

      loy·al·ty [loi-uhl-tee] Show IPA
      noun, plural loy·al·ties.
      1.
      the state or quality of being loyal; faithfulness to commitments or obligations.
      2.
      faithful adherence to a sovereign, government, leader, cause, etc.
      3.
      an example or instance of faithfulness, adherence, or the like: a man with fierce loyalties.

      THE TEST IS LOYALTY. understand that submission is because God is God. Submission and loyalty will not get you into trouble like rejecting God will. so they are good , to be able to submit and be loyal to God, to persevere under trials and temptations through faith , this is what life is about. Come to faith.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:34 am |
    • Austin

      Maybe you will start to recognize satanic power and evil, and pain, before you reach out to God who is invisible. That is the way faith was handed to me.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:36 am |
    • .

      Hey Austin, what is your favorite color?

      April 23, 2013 at 8:40 am |
    • oOo

      It's like ... someone questioned the other day – what if Austin were born in India among the Aghori, and possessed the same delusions and convictions? He very well might now be twirling his penis up on a stick and dragging rotted corpses of various animals and people only to munch on in cannibalistic ritual, and never have heard of the God of Israel. All just because he was born in another place in the world.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:44 am |
    • Austin

      Austin
      How is the revelation of God surrounding the bible at a regular basis, a delusion? Is that a common hindu experience?

      Because these revelations every one of them, revealed God's word are accurate , living, real, and pertinent to the revelation.

      That is consistent and concise. That is not random, or hindu or muslim, or carma. That is the God of Jacob, the Holy Spirit, revealing the bible as His word.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:03 am |
    • Austin

      Austin reposted
      How is the revelation of God surrounding the bible at a regular basis, a delusion? Is that a common hindu experience?

      Because these revelations every one of them, revealed God's word are accurate , living, real, and pertinent to the revelation.

      That is consistent and concise. That is not random, or hindu or muslim, or carma. That is the God of Jacob, the Holy Spirit, revealing the bible as His word.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:03 am |
    • oOo

      The point is, think about that if you were born somewhere else – anywhere, you may not know about the God of Israel at all. The notion may never even arise during your lifetime.

      If he is real, and his words in the OT are genuine, then he is a prick for selling himself as perfect when he is anything but – dooming certain peoples here and there like play toys. As an agnostic, I don't believe he is real, so I don't have any animosity – only animosity to those that attempt to impose their belief in such a god on others. But if he was real, and could prove himself to me as described in the Bible, then I'd tell him what he is – a prick.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:16 am |
  3. M.R. Walts

    When people need to blame someone or make themselves feel mightier than they really are the usually blame someone for their problems, or make up their own idiology.Marx gave the world communism. The ones who imposed this view by violence on the masses tried to destroy the Church and the Jews who clung to the Old Testament.The Church is alive and well in those nations and so are the Hebrews.Communism fell.The Bible is now used as a required text book in Many Russian K-12 public schools

    April 23, 2013 at 6:22 am |
    • Science

      Was the bible around back then ?

      Human Y Chromosome Much Older Than Previously Thought

      Mar. 4, 2013 — The discovery and analysis of an extremely rare African American Y chromosome pushes back the time of the most recent common ancestor for the Y chromosome lineage tree to 338,000 years ago. This time predates the age of the oldest known anatomically modern human fossils.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/03/130305145821.htm

      No god(s) needed or required to graduate from public schools in the US

      April 23, 2013 at 6:29 am |
    • Truth Prevails :-)

      "The Bible is now used as a required text book in Many Russian K-12 public schools"

      Thankfully that can't happen in Secular countries, at least not without facing severe and rightful scrutiny. You'd think if it could be taught in schools in less oppressed countries, it would be considered to be backed by solid evidence but given that it can't be taught in schools, it is safe to say there is not enough to back it.

      April 23, 2013 at 7:05 am |
  4. M.R. Walts

    True faith is not about religion and mindlessly obeying its rules, but accepting the gift of redemption. Steven Hawkings may have a brilliant mind but that is all. Life apart from God/Yahweh/Jesus Christ is empty and useless...why else would empty people filled with twisted half truths attack Christians. That same emptiness made two young men become terrorists and embrace a religious view that is destoying the lives of thousands daily. The God of Abraham left an empty tomb and Light of Salvation. Amen.

    April 23, 2013 at 5:57 am |
    • Science

      Evolution wins hands down time for god(s) to get the hell out of the way ...............so humanity can evolve !

      .Dinosaur Egg Study Supports Evolutionary Link Between Birds and Dinosaurs: How Troodon Likely Hatched Its Young

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130418104324.htm

      Source above is current ...............not out dated like the bible !

      April 23, 2013 at 6:02 am |
    • Truth Prevails :-)

      Life apart from God/Yahweh/Jesus Christ is empty and useless...

      >Empty? Useless? That's your opinion and you're wrong. Actually life without the worry of an afterlife (that can't be shown with evidence to exist) is much more fulfilling and better lived because we know based on the evidence presented thus far that this is the only life we are guaranteed of.

      why else would empty people filled with twisted half truths attack Christians.

      >Why? When Christians learn to keep it out of the public square we will stop but until then we will work to ensure christians never get control

      That same emptiness made two young men become terrorists and embrace a religious view that is destoying the lives of thousands daily.

      >Wow, you're jumping to some conclusion there. They believe their god is the right one...how are you so certain they're wrong? I don't agree with their belief system any more than you do but christianity has its own skeletons. I know good muslims, these men do not represent my friends. Do you want the Crusades and the Inquistions to represent you??

      The God of Abraham left an empty tomb and Light of Salvation.

      >You do understand that it is impossible for anyone to come back from the dead after 3 days, right? It's just a silly little made up story for the gullible.

      April 23, 2013 at 6:46 am |
    • sam stone

      "True faith is not about religion"

      You say that then you indicate that for you, it IS about religion.

      " Life apart from God/Yahweh/Jesus Christ is empty and useless"

      Not for most of the world.

      "why else would empty people filled with twisted half truths attack Christians."

      1. by deifinition, empty people cannot be filled with anythijng

      2. why would pompus people feel the need to legislate their beliefs?

      "That same emptiness made two young men become terrorists and embrace a religious view that is destoying the lives of thousands daily"

      You are delusional if you think that Christianity does not do the same.

      "The God of Abraham left an empty tomb and Light of Salvation. Amen."

      Seek help.

      April 23, 2013 at 9:37 am |
  5. Bob1god

    Hi, kids , talking god stuff again?

    April 22, 2013 at 10:40 pm |
    • Science

      Hey Bob1god.................good stuff fotr the kids !

      The End

      You asked for it kenhbradshaw Have a good read !

      Where do morals come from?

      By Kelly Murray, CNN

      https://religion.blogs.cnn.com/

      Learning is fun with facts.......................... and facts work when teaching children.

      Atheist Prof. Peter Higgs: Stop calling Higgs boson the ‘God particle’

      Professor Peter Higgs said recently that there is no God and so people should stop referring to the theoretical partial that
      bears his name as the “God particle.”

      http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/04/08/atheist-prof-peter-higgs-stop-calling-higgs-bosen-the-god-particle/

      Pope praises science, but insists God created world updated Thur October 28, 2010
      Stephen Hawking is wrong, Pope Benedict XVI said Thursday – God did create the universe. The pope didn't actually mention the world-famous scientist, who argues in a book published last month that the laws of physics show there is no need for a supreme... \

      https://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2010/10/28/pope-praises-science-but-insists-god-created-world/

      Science

      Heaven is 'a fairy story,' scientist Stephen Hawking says updated Tue May 17, 2011
      By Dan Gilgoff, CNN.com Religion Editor The concept of heaven or any kind of afterlife is a "fairy story," famed British scientist Stephen Hawking said in a newspaper interview this week. "I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when...

      https://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/17/heaven-is-a-fairy-story-scientist-stephen-hawking-says/

      April 7th, 2012

      08:32 PM ET

      The Jesus debate: Man vs. myth

      https://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2012/04/07/the-jesus-debate-man-vs-myth/comment-page-137/#comment-2281915

      Make sure to read comments

      April 18, 2013 at 3:10 pm | Report abuse |

      Breaking News

      NASA: Three planets found are some of best candidates so far for habitable worlds outside our solar system.

      http://www.cnn.com/2013/04/18/us/planet-discovery/index.html

      April 23, 2013 at 5:32 am |
  6. #gospel

    Every soul needs to hear the good news! Thank you Rev.Graham and team for an awesome job!

    April 22, 2013 at 10:01 pm |
  7. Austin

    @ Saraswati
    "We're talking about a situation where you would not be helping anyone by your decision and just suffering eternally misery for your own temporary peace of mind. Again, I'm not a Christian and I don't think the belief system holds together, but those of you who claim you would suffer eternal misery, not to help anyone, but just on principle are either fools or liars."

    Very intelligent and real to be able to be open to rational expectations, Mam.

    April 22, 2013 at 5:25 pm |
  8. OH MEIN GOTT

    Never heard of this guy. Don't know if I'd want to live that long. Especially as a believer.

    April 22, 2013 at 3:09 pm |
  9. Live4Him

    Saraswati : The entrapment claim is valid, and it invalidates the very claim of a Christian god.

    Entrapment presumes an enforcement officer coerces a person, who otherwise would not have committed the crime, to commit said crime. It is not applicable to a member of the legislative body who passes a law prohiting a given act. Since God gives us the laws, then He is like the legislative body in our form of government. So, the entrapment claim has been falsified.

    April 22, 2013 at 1:40 pm |
    • oOo

      Gullible4Him: "Since God gives us the laws, then He is like the legislative body in our form of government. "

      LOL. (Over 40,000 denominations' opinions of 'what the legislative body' is for the 'form of government'. Thankfully, in the U.S., there is separation of church and state.)

      April 22, 2013 at 1:48 pm |
    • ME II

      @Live4Him,
      "He is like the legislative body in our form of government. So, the entrapment claim has been falsified."

      Isn't He also supposedly the judge and executioner (or executive)? He makes the laws, interprets then, and enforces them, supposedly. That makes Him a dictator, not a legislature.

      April 22, 2013 at 1:55 pm |
    • sam stone

      Lie4Him: Nonsense. If god is omniscient, he knows from the beginning man would violate his laws. The entrapment analogy is correct

      April 22, 2013 at 2:28 pm |
    • OH MEIN GOTT

      If a being in the sky created cavemen, then we do in fact have a severe problem with entrapment. There must have been a massive language barrier between the sky fairy and the first caveman.

      Think about it like this. You give birth to a puppy, and then you put food in a dish in front of it. Then you tell it not to eat the food. What does the puppy do? It eats the food. Would you open-hand slap that puppy across its furry little jowls with the force of the Hulk for insolently disobeying your omnipotent awesomesauce? Obviously the puppy did not understand your completely unreasonable command. It hasn't been taught Hebrew. Would you then threaten to burn its offspring for eternity just because it ate the food you told it not to eat, even though it doesn't understand Hebrew? What a really nice sky fairy, ya know? REAL NICE. I sure wish I knew which one to sacrific goats to.

      April 22, 2013 at 3:28 pm |
    • ME II

      I don't know the specifics of @Saraswati's position, but it does seem extremely unfair to tell your own creation to not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil and then expect them to be good and obey you.

      April 22, 2013 at 3:47 pm |
    • Akira

      For context, Sarawati's post:

      I agree with nclaw that if one believes in a god who is all powerful one would do what he said no matter how nasty because really at that point there is no choice. If someone holds eternity in your hands the only reason to risk that eternity is to save someone else’s eternity. I always think it dishonest when an atheist says “I wouldn’t go along with your god anyway because he’s such a jerk”. Well, yes, if you really believed that jerk existed and with that power, I’m willing to bet you would.

      The problem from the Christian side is not that god is a jerk, but that his being this particular jerk makes the whole story self-contradictory and implausible. So why live believing in a jerk of a god who doesn’t exist? The entrapment claim is valid, and it invalidates the very claim of a Christian god.

      April 22, 2013 at 5:55 pm |
    • Mickey1313

      @akira, you are wrong about many atheists. would not worship yhvh even if proven real, because evil does not deserve worship, and if the god if the jews is real, than it is truly a monster.

      April 22, 2013 at 6:54 pm |
    • Akira

      Mickey, that entire post was made by Saraswati. This is why I wrote, "for context, Sarawati's post."

      April 22, 2013 at 10:43 pm |
    • Austin

      Or, having heard the truth you are truly rebellious, wicked, obstinated, and you also reject atonement and heaven. You speak out against God, you misrepresent loyalty and throw God's person back in His face. You believe you can side step a Holy God. You act like Holiness is a quality of God you don't have to grasp. You are totally spiritually irresponsible, deviant, and spritually closed off. Hell is the absence of God. You are half way there allready.

      April 22, 2013 at 10:54 pm |
    • sam stone

      you know nothing about us, austin. isn't it time for yet another drink? maybe that will give you more cat hallucinations

      April 23, 2013 at 4:40 am |
    • HotAirAce

      sam stone could have, should have, stopped after "you know nothing" . . .

      April 23, 2013 at 5:07 am |
    • Austin

      Its all right. People scramble around in their intimidation before God and come up with all kinds of delusions of who and what God is and should be. I understand that it even seems absurd. Why would anyone agree with a story that has an eternal hell?

      obviously if I wrote a story I myself would not have that as real. i also used to see "in the world but not of the world" verse as schitzo, deny the flesh and live by the spirit as oppressive and overly moral and repulsive.

      And I said enough is enough. I had no regard for religion at all. I vandalized the church. and then over the next few years I started realizing that evil, was a satanic force. and after that, and over the past four to five years, I experienced a series of spiritual revelations where God revealed His sovereign presence through absolute control over the things around me.

      I hated the cross, and I considered myself an enemy, and I received a call that I will never turn down. And now that I still struggle with the flesh I am really humbled and undeserving. I am no one to argue with THE WORD OF GOD. No one is.

      John 15:26-27
      New International Version (NIV)
      The Work of the Holy Spirit

      26 “When the Advocate comes, whom I will send to you from the Father—the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father—he will testify about me. 27 And you also must testify, for you have been with me from the beginning.

      April 23, 2013 at 7:40 am |
    • Science

      L4H and austin and the list............................interesting

      April 23, 2013 at 7:46 am |
    • Saraswati

      @Mickey,

      "you are wrong about many atheists. would not worship yhvh even if proven real, because evil does not deserve worship, and if the god if the jews is real, than it is truly a monster"

      Does this statement go for just the "forever separated from God" version of Christian hell or are you saying you would suffer the eternal flames and torment version just on principle? If you mean the latter do you mean that you would make that decision now or that you think if someone came back and asked you to re-evaluate after six months of torment that you believe you would still say "I'm good; leave me here!"

      Reminder – I'm not a Christian and think this whole vision of god is nuts. I just think that some Non-Christians really haven't thought through their position on what they would do if they really believed this god existed and that has implications for understanding Christians and others with similar beliefs.

      April 23, 2013 at 8:08 am |
    • sam stone

      "People scramble around in their intimidation before God and come up with all kinds of delusions of who and what God is and should be."

      sounds like you, austin

      April 23, 2013 at 9:41 am |
  10. Which God?

    Oh, I thought that BG's other voice was when he talks out of his a$$.

    April 22, 2013 at 1:30 pm |
  11. Honey Badger Don't Care!

    nclaw441,

    "If I believed that God required me to eat dog poop in order to satisfy Him, I'd do it (not saying I'd like it, though.)"

    So if you were convinced that your god was telling you to put a knife through the heart of your son you would do it?

    April 22, 2013 at 10:01 am |
  12. clarity

    God is real. Jesus is the answer. Atheism is a delusional form of stupidity and stubbornness.

    April 22, 2013 at 9:16 am |
    • sam stone

      Jesus was a loudmouth who got whacked by the Romans. Hardly the first, nor the last. Jesus just happened to have mythology attached to his rotting corpse

      April 22, 2013 at 9:38 am |
    • oOo

      Ah, the name thief again. Why is it that Christians must lie for their God?

      April 22, 2013 at 1:50 pm |
    • ME II

      People are real. Let's find our own solutions.

      April 22, 2013 at 1:57 pm |
    • Hans

      "Atheism is a delusional form of stupidity and stubbornness"

      You are not a Christian and you bring shame to Christ.

      James 4:11-12
      Do not speak evil against one another, brothers. The one who speaks against a brother or judges his brother, speaks evil against the law and judges the law. But if you judge the law, you are not a doer of the law but a judge. There is only one lawgiver and judge, he who is able to save and to destroy. But who are you to judge your neighbor?

      James 1:26
      If anyone thinks he is religious and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his heart, this person's religion is worthless.

      Ephesians 4:31-32
      Let all bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander be put away from you, along with all malice. Be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as God in Christ forgave you.

      April 22, 2013 at 3:18 pm |
  13. Big Trouble

    A wonderful thank you to the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, you are absolutely the best, none better. And of course, thank you for sending Jesus to die for the sins of others, incredible, thank you so much.

    April 22, 2013 at 1:04 am |
    • sam stone

      yes. thank you for setting up that entrapment to begin with. thank you for being such a vindictive pr1ck

      April 22, 2013 at 5:43 am |
    • nclaw441

      sam– entrapment? pr1ck? Looking at this logically, I don't get you. There is either a God or there is not. If not, then there is no one to insult. If there is a God (as I believe), who holds your eternity in His hands, why would you insult Him?

      Let's say you are right about entrapment ( I don't believe that, but let's suppose.) or other "bad" things about God. If you believe in God, wouldn't you do whatever it is He says to do, as best you can understand? If I believed that God required me to eat dog poop in order to satisfy Him, I'd do it (not saying I'd like it, though.) There have been some religions that have called for human sacrifice– I happen to believe they are wrong, just as I believe any aspect of Islam that calls for killing other human beings based upon their faith is wrong (not to mention counterproductive).

      If you believe there is a God, as I do, does it not make logical sense to search out what God wants from us, and to do it? I'm going out on a limb and assume that He doesn't want us to call Him names and otherwise insult Him. We must each search within ourselves and seek to discern who God is and what He wants from us.

      I happen to be a Christian, and the Bible (Old and New Testament) guides my faith, although I continue to have questions. I acknowledge that I believe by faith, and cannot prove it. I am just doing the best I can, and hope that I am following what God wants from me.

      April 22, 2013 at 8:08 am |
    • sam stone

      nclaw: i don't think that god is there. the story people paint is of a vindictive pr1ck who, being omniscient, knew man would "sin", but set them up anyway.

      April 22, 2013 at 8:14 am |
    • sam stone

      "There have been some religions that have called for human sacrifice– I happen to believe they are wron"

      Really? What was Jesus's "sacrifice" about?

      April 22, 2013 at 8:16 am |
    • sam stone

      "There is either a God or there is not."

      True.

      "If not, then there is no one to insult. If there is a God (as I believe), who holds your eternity in His hands, why would you insult Him?"

      I am not insulting god. I cannot insult something in which I do not believe.

      I am saying that the story told is of a nasty, vindictive being

      April 22, 2013 at 8:21 am |
    • Saraswati

      I agree with nclaw that if one believes in a god who is all powerful one would do what he said no matter how nasty because really at that point there is no choice. If someone holds eternity in your hands the only reason to risk that eternity is to save someone else's eternity. I always think it dishonest when an atheist says "I wouldn't go along with your god anyway because he's such a jerk". Well, yes, if you really believed that jerk existed and with that power, I'm willing to bet you would.

      The problem from the Christian side is not that god is a jerk, but that his being this particular jerk makes the whole story self-contradictory and implausible. So why live believing in a jerk of a god who doesn't exist? The entrapment claim is valid, and it invalidates the very claim of a Christian god.

      April 22, 2013 at 8:22 am |
    • Austin

      Saraswati, When Anvil says, "intolerance of religious idiousy must end" , he/she is summing up a personality quality.

      Slavery meant assimilation and salvation.
      Death of Cannanites meant preventing disease.
      And hell is not God's choice for people. Hell is a persons rejection of God and following of Satan.

      Your personality is not God's.

      April 22, 2013 at 8:44 am |
    • Saraswati

      Austin, could you expand on that comment about slavery?

      April 22, 2013 at 8:46 am |
    • ?

      "And hell is not God's choice for people. Hell is a persons rejection of God and following of Satan."

      What's so stupid about this typical Christian response is that the god in the bible states, “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you." So the god of the bible doesn't even follow this very simple saying when condemning people to hell for eternity for sins as menial as theft or blasphemy. Most courts of law would take custody of your child from you just for an excessive spanking. People enacted laws, because we thought it to be logical. Is god above logic, or what we deem as compassionate behavior? After all most of the people in this world actually end up in this hell. How many of us would want a parent such as that? Anyone of us would immediately sever our ties with such an abusive person. Yet Christians knowingly continue the insanity of giving worship to a god so cruel.

      April 22, 2013 at 8:57 am |
    • sam stone

      "Your personality is not God's"

      Nor is yours

      April 22, 2013 at 9:12 am |
    • sam stone

      "Christians knowingly continue the insanity of giving worship to a god so cruel."

      Stockholm Syndrome

      April 22, 2013 at 9:22 am |
    • Austin

      Yes I will, when God tells women to submit to her husband, it is because God has a heirarchy of authority. Covenant with marriage, church and government. There are rules.

      And for people who would face hell with no intervention, slavery was a blessing. Submission and slavery were dealt to Israel as well. This earth is not a pretty thing when it comes to humanity.

      God used experiences like Daniel, who had his nuts chopped off, as a slave, servant to the king, and the high prophet of God.

      Joseph, sold into slavery, Moses, thrown into a river and taken from his mother into the Pharoh's house.

      Life, the breath of live, and the quality of eternal life, is not hindered by slavery, or overcoming evil at any cost. Pain and suffering are part of life. Terminal disease, leprosy. Being sawed in half, crucified upside down. Slavery. Submission....................will not stop the will of God. We are not provided a cake walk. No one was, God did not show favoritism.

      Did you ever wonder if because Satan had defiled the flesh so deeply with the cannanites that they could not mentally come to faith, that God might have been preventing further disease through the merciful act of providing death?

      Do people put their pets to sleep?

      April 22, 2013 at 9:23 am |
    • midwest rail

      "....slavery was a blessing." Pure apologist nonsense.

      April 22, 2013 at 9:26 am |
    • sam stone

      "Did you ever wonder if because Satan had defiled the flesh so deeply with the cannanites that they could not mentally come to faith, that God might have been preventing further disease through the merciful act of providing death?"

      No, but I do wonder how anyone can believe that drivel.

      How does one "come to faith" BUT mentally?

      April 22, 2013 at 9:36 am |
    • Honey Badger Don't Care!

      Austin,

      You're talking like all of those stories are real. The bible is a work of fiction. There is very little, if any, basis in reality for any of those stories. The sun has never stopped in the sky, the sea of reeds was never parted to let people through, and no one has EVER risen from the dead.

      April 22, 2013 at 9:56 am |
    • The real Tom

      "Do people put their pets to sleep?" The depth of your idiocy never ceases to amaze me.

      What an ass.

      April 22, 2013 at 10:00 am |
    • The real Tom

      How is it that such a student of the Bible can't spell "Canaanites"?

      April 22, 2013 at 10:02 am |
    • Saraswati

      OK, Austin, just to be clear you argument is that slavery is not only itolerated by the Christian god but is a valid method for spreading the faith. You're really going to go with that one?

      April 22, 2013 at 10:03 am |
    • oOo

      Austin is a deluded fool. As dangerous as any other kind of zealot. There is no sense in trying to reason with such an individual.

      April 22, 2013 at 10:13 am |
    • oOo

      If Austin had been born in India, he would most likely be an Aghora who twirls his penis up on a stick and drags rotting bodies out of the river to eat in cannibalistic ritual.

      April 22, 2013 at 10:58 am |
    • sam stone

      Austin cannot be a deluded fool. Jeebus personally has spoken to him through squashed felines

      April 22, 2013 at 12:09 pm |
    • BRC

      NClaw and Saraswati,
      I can honestly say that if right now, the Christian God appeared in teh sky for all the world to see, and said "The BIble is true in hole, Christianity is the path I choose for you to follow", I would continue to call him a petulant d-bag, and ignore the religion as a bunch of power hungry manipulators. I would admit, freely that "God" was real and that I've been wrong my whole life, but I would never bow to the will of a diety that did what was chronicled in that book. those are the acts of a psycopath, not a benevolent creator. Does that mean I would be going to hell? yes, but I would be going knowing that I stood on better ground than the beligerent being that sent me. Having unlimitated powere and weilding it to see your whims carried out does not make you righteous, it makes you a tyrant. The "God" of the Bible is jsut that, a jealous, childish, insecure tyrant; and knowing it was real wouldn't change my opinion, so why lie about it and follow the ceremonies? Can "God" be fooled? I would think not, so I would be honest and true to my beliefs and morals.

      April 22, 2013 at 12:37 pm |
    • meifumado

      And what a boring god and religion.
      If I did believe in a supernatural power I would want something fun, not something that's so repressive and controlling and chauvinistic.

      April 22, 2013 at 12:49 pm |
    • Saraswati

      @BRC, If that's you're choice then I would just think you an idiot. We're talking about a situation where you would not be helping anyone by your decision and just suffering eternally misery for your own temporary peace of mind. Again, I'm not a Christian and I don't think the belief system holds together, but those of you who claim you would suffer eternal misery, not to help anyone, but just on principle are either fools or liars.

      April 22, 2013 at 12:54 pm |
    • BRC

      @Saraswati,
      I can' t dodge or disagree with teh fool accusation, but I'm a fool who likes to be right. I can't agree with a large part of what the Bible says, so I won't. The part that is interesting to think about, if you didn't really agree with it, but you said you did, would "God" be fooled? Defenders of Christianity always like to say you can't just say I'm sorry, you have to be truly repentent, would the same rule apply here? If it does, I could follow all the little ceremonies in the world, I'm still going to hell.

      April 22, 2013 at 2:25 pm |
    • Big Trouble

      meifumado, God is the most creative, fun, imaginative, intelligent, witty, and ahead of the game, being I've ever had the chance to encounter. I will never find another being anywhere like him, and that's fine with me. You don't know what you're missing.

      April 23, 2013 at 11:12 am |
    • Saraswati

      @BRC,

      I'm just curious to see how far you'd take this. You've. found out there's an ass of a god out there and that by bowing down to him you'd hurt no one but your own principle and by refusing him/her/whatever you'd get eternal misery. You say you wouldn't do it and would take eternal misery (I'm guessing you'd change your mind quickly, but we'll put that aside for now).

      OK, now this God tells you if you don't bow down your whole family will suffer the same fate (remember, he's a jerk). What do you do?

      April 23, 2013 at 11:21 am |
    • Big Trouble

      Obedience and fear is part of it, but it is impossible to ignore the indescribably wonderful qualities of God.

      April 23, 2013 at 11:47 am |
    • BRC

      Saraswati,
      If "God" is willing to accep false defference and mock obedience to spare my family, then I would do what I had to do to keep them safe from him being a maniac; to a point (say thank you before every meal, yeah sure fine; child sacrifice, nope). I'm pigheaded enough to let myself suffer for what I believe is right, but unlike the "God" of the Bible, I have no intention of making other's suffer unnecessarily for it.

      April 23, 2013 at 11:57 am |
    • Saraswati

      @BRC, Thanks, I was just curious.

      April 23, 2013 at 12:00 pm |
    • fred

      BRC
      "unlike the "God" of the Bible, I have no intention of making other's suffer unnecessarily for it."
      =>Since you address the God of the Bible you should accept the character and attributes of God and given in that Bible. God does not bring about unnecessary suffering. You have set up your version of God and now discredit your version not the God of Abraham.

      April 23, 2013 at 12:09 pm |
    • BRC

      fred,
      You and I have differing opiniosn on "God's" behavior. You can read the Bible see that he brings punishment and suffering, and believe that it is not unnecessary, because it is of "God". I do not believe that ability is equal to right, so just because "God" can cause suffering doesn't mean that whn he does it's necessary. In fact, I would say that teh capabilities of "God" make all suffering he has caused completely unnecessesary. As humans we have determined that to live well with one another violence must be the absolute last option exercised, hamring another person should be an action taken only when NO other options are available; and because we have limited capabilities those times do exist (diplomacy can only go so far). But "God" has no such limitation, there is no problem or scenario that "god" can't solve without volience and pain simply by changing the fundamental basis of the scenario. Does he have to, no, he's "God" he can do what he wants, but when he has the ability to change and prevent it, and either chooses not to or directly causes it, then "God" is allowing suffering that is by definition unnecessary.

      TL;DR- Yes "God" does,every time a child dies of tay sachs, "God" allows unnecessary suffering.

      April 23, 2013 at 12:27 pm |
    • fred

      BRC
      Suffering in case of tay sachs or say any pain to the innocent is what the writers of the Old Testament attempted to account for given a loving God. Jesus cleared one misunderstanding up when he told the Jews it was not because of sin or the sin of the parents that such suffering occurs. Then he turned (in the case of the blind man) to say it was to reveal the glory of God. The glory of God was in the healing that strengthens faith, proves or refines faith. There is absolutely no way to bring about such faith without going through the pain. God could have used other methods and in the vast majority of time that is what we see.
      In my case I suspect such a "test" would reveal my lack of faith or lack of complete trust in God. Now how would I respond to the awareness that I really don't trust God if He would allow such a thing. My true character is revealed in my response.
      The Bible says the truth behind such suffering will be made known and in Gods power will be turned for the good. In that way you are correct in that God has the capacity and will not allow unnecessary suffering. That is the way of God which is not our way (i.e. there should be no suffering period)

      April 23, 2013 at 1:08 pm |
    • BRC

      fred,
      I want to be very clear here. You're saying teh "God" purposely allows and even causes innocent children to die of a horrible degenerative incurable disease that destroys their bodies and can devistate their families (no matter how well they keep with teh tenants of "God's laws"), because he wants to teach us a lesson? And there was no way to teach us this lesson that didn't involve slowly and painfully killing children? And you don't find that unnecessary. I don't mean in the biblical "God said it so it's right sense", I mean you as a human being, do you agree that makes sense?

      April 23, 2013 at 1:31 pm |
    • fred

      BRC
      “ "God" purposely allows” ….”
      =>bad things happen to good people and good things happen to bad people. God allows what appears to be nature running its course which includes genetic abnormalities. This is not the will of God but it is our existence outside of the will of God. In short God purposely allows existence to continue outside His perfect will.

      “because he wants to teach us a lesson?”
      =>God allowed the tay sachs to devastate the family and the child not because he wanted to teach but because it is a natural part of our existence. You are now impacted by that occurrence and will respond in many possible ways. You could draw closer to God or push away.

      “And you don't find that unnecessary”
      =>How could we possibly answer that question? 1 in every 3,500 newborn Ashkenazi Jews will face this fact of life. We cannot understand why but we can understand that God allowed it. That takes us before God in search of comfort and understanding.
      => pain and disease in children makes no sense before a loving God but I am thankful I could hang onto God during those times. I do not know what people do during those times when they do not hold onto Gods promises.

      April 23, 2013 at 5:25 pm |
    • Science

      Hey fred................. when is the hair of the sun going to come out ?

      April 23, 2013 at 5:35 pm |
    • In Santa we trust

      fred, "what appears to be nature running its course" is nature running its course. No god required.

      April 23, 2013 at 5:39 pm |
  14. Brampt

    If billy graham were a true Christian he would give the religious services for free and would've work like any other else, just like the first century Christians did. Who ever says what he did was the work of Holy Spirit has to be blind, or share the same income as he did just by exploiting people... Good charlatan he was!

    April 21, 2013 at 11:21 pm |
    • CasualObserver

      Billy Graham was a true Christian who parlayed his influence and earnings into a media empire. The Holy Spirit is not controlled by anyone and comes and goes according to His own purpose.

      April 22, 2013 at 12:24 pm |
    • sam stone

      casual: did you ever hear billy boy with tricky d-i-c-k nixon? he sounded like a bigot hiding behind a pulpit

      April 22, 2013 at 1:14 pm |
  15. Citizen South Elgin

    RIP GBS, you rocked HGTA like it was nobody's business, and I'm a devout atheist

    April 21, 2013 at 7:05 pm |
    • sam stone

      a devout athiest?

      April 22, 2013 at 5:40 am |
  16. Todd

    The Billy Graham crusade was truly used by the Lord. While He was preaching he had a team of prayer partners in prayer over the message. Each time he preached hundreds and thousands of people would respond. This was not the work of any man, but rather the work of the Holy Spirit. God, using the gift of evengelism that He put in Billy Graham, and God working through his humble team to bring forth a great harvest. Praise the Lord "As many as received Him (Jesus Christ) to them He gave the power to become children of God". ....John 1 Receive Him as Lord and Savior and you will have eternal life. God bless.

    April 21, 2013 at 6:05 pm |
  17. nancy

    What happen to the man on the roof????????? Who was he?????

    April 21, 2013 at 5:57 pm |
  18. Gecul

    Just part of Billy's dog and pony show! "Snake Oil" is a good description!

    April 21, 2013 at 5:22 pm |
  19. Bootyfunk

    Billy Graham who once said "All h.omos.exuals should be castrated?" or the Billy Graham caught on tape with Nixon saying something has to be done about the Jews? Billy Graham was a snake oil salesman.

    April 21, 2013 at 3:59 pm |
  20. lionlylamb

    Death comes sometimes early in Life and sometimes quite late. Where's the beef?

    April 21, 2013 at 3:36 pm |
    • Akira

      Wendy's.

      April 21, 2013 at 4:22 pm |
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About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.