home
RSS
When Christians become a 'hated minority'
Evangelical Christians say they are the new victims of intolerance - they're persecuted for condemning homosexuality.
May 5th, 2013
06:00 AM ET

When Christians become a 'hated minority'

By John Blake, CNN

(CNN) - When Peter Sprigg speaks publicly about his opposition to homosexuality, something odd often happens.

During his speeches, people raise their hands to challenge his assertions that the Bible condemns homosexuality, but no Christians speak out to defend him.

“But after it is over, they will come over to talk to me and whisper in my ear, ‘I agree with everything you said,’" says Sprigg, a spokesman for The Family Research Council, a powerful, conservative Christian lobbying group.

We’ve heard of the “down-low” gay person who keeps his or her sexual identity secret for fear of public scorn. But Sprigg and other evangelicals say changing attitudes toward homosexuality have created a new victim: closeted Christians who believe the Bible condemns homosexuality but will not say so publicly for fear of being labeled a hateful bigot.

As proof, Sprigg points to the backlash that ESPN commentator Chris Broussard sparked recently. Broussard was called a bigot and a purveyor of hate speech when he said an NBA player who had come out as gay was living in “open rebellion to God.” Broussard said the player, Jason Collins, was “living in unrepentant sin” because the Bible condemns homosexuality.

“In the current culture, it takes more courage for someone like Chris Broussard to speak out than for someone like Jason Collins to come out,” says Sprigg, a former pastor. “The media will hail someone who comes out of the closet as gay, but someone who simply expresses their personal religious views about homosexual conduct is attacked.”

When is disagreement hate?

Bryan Litfin, a theology professor at Moody Bible Institute in Illinois, says Christians should be able to publicly say that God designed sex to take place within a marriage between a man and a woman.

“That isn’t so outrageous,” Litfin says. “Nobody is expressing hate toward homosexuals by saying that. Since when is disagreement the same as hate?”

But quoting the Bible doesn't inoculate anyone from becoming a bigot or hater, some scholars say. There's a point at which a Christian's opposition to homosexuality can become bigotry, and even hate speech, they say.

Crossing such a line has happened many times in history.

A literal reading of the Bible was used to justify all sorts of hatred: slavery, the subjugation of women and anti-Semitism, scholars and pastors say.

“Truly damaging speech cannot be excused just because it expresses genuine religious belief,” says Mark D. Jordan, author of “Recruiting Young Love: How Christians Talk about Homosexuality.”

“Some religious beliefs, sincerely held, are detestable. They cannot be spoken without disrupting social peace,” says Jordan, a professor at the John Danforth Center on Religion & Politics at Washington University in St. Louis.

The point where religious speech becomes hate speech is difficult to define, though, scholars and activists say.

The Southern Poverty Law Center in Alabama is a nonprofit civil rights group that combats and monitors hate groups. Three years ago, it designated the Family Research Council, the group that Sprigg represents, as a hate group - a characterization the group stridently rejects.

Mark Potok,  a center spokesman, says there’s no shared definition of what constitutes hate speech.

“There is no legal meaning. It’s just a phrase,” Potok says. “Hate speech is in the ear of the beholder.”

'One of the most hated minorities?'

Intolerance may be difficult to define, but some evangelicals say they have become victims of intolerance because of their reverence for the Bible.

The conservative media culture is filled with stories about evangelicals being labeled as “extremists” for their belief that homosexuality is a sin.

Their sense of persecution goes beyond their stance on homosexuality. There are stories circulating of evangelical students being suspended for opposing homosexuality, a teacher fired for giving a Bible to a curious student, and the rise of anti-Christian bigotry.

A blogger at The American Dream asked in one essay:

“Are evangelical Christians rapidly becoming one of the most hated minorities in America?”

The reluctance of evangelicals to speak out against homosexuality is often cited as proof they are being forced into the closet.

Joe Carter, editor for The Gospel Coalition, an online evangelical magazine, wrote a blog post entitled “Debatable: Is the Christian Church a ‘Hate Group’?" He warned that young people will abandon “orthodox” Christian churches that teach that homosexuality is a sin for fear of being called haters.

“Faux civility, embarrassment, prudishness and a fear of expressing an unpopular opinion has caused many Christians to refrain from explaining how homosexual conduct destroys lives,” Carter wrote.

Some Christians fear that opposing homosexuality could cause them to lose their jobs and “haunt them forever,” Carter says.

“It’s easier to just go along,” says Carter, who is also author of “How to Argue Like Jesus.” “You don’t want to be lumped in with the bigots. That’s a powerful word."

Edward Johnson, a communication professor at Campbell University in North Carolina, says we are now living in a "postmodern" era where everything is relative and there is no universally accepted truth. It's an environment in which anyone who says "this is right" and "that is wrong" is labeled intolerant, he says.

There was a time when a person could publicly say homosexuality was wrong and people could consider the statement without anger, he says. Today, people have reverted to an intellectual tribalism where they are only willing to consider the perspective of their own tribe.

“They are incapable of comprehending that someone may have a view different than theirs,” Johnson says. “For them anyone who dares to question the dogma of the tribe can only be doing so out of hatred.”

Sprigg, from the Family Research Council, says his condemnation of homosexual conduct does not spring from intolerance but a desire to protect gays from harmful conduct, he says.

Sprigg, a senior fellow for policy studies at the council, wrote in a council pamphlet that homosexual men are more likely to engage in child sexual abuse than are straight men. He also wrote that gay men are also afflicted with a higher rate of sexually transmitted diseases and mental illness as well.

Sprigg says he does not believe homosexuality is a choice and that “personal testimonies" and "clinical experience” show that some people “can and do change from gay to straight.”

“Maybe we need to do a better job of showing that we are motivated by Christian love,” Sprigg says. “Love is wanting the best for someone, and acting to bring that about.”

'That's a lie'

Potok, from the Southern Poverty Law Center, has little use for the love Sprigg talks about.

He calls it hatred, and his voice rose in anger when he talked about the claims by Sprigg and other Christian groups that gay men are more predisposed to molest children and that homosexual behavior is inherently harmful.

He says the Southern Poverty Law Center didn’t designate the Family Research Group a hate group because they view homosexuality as a sin or oppose same-sex marriage, Potok says. There are plenty of Christian groups who hold those beliefs but are not hate groups, he says.

A group becomes a hate group when it attacks and maligns an entire class of people for their “immutable characteristics,” Potok says. The Family Research Council spreads known falsehoods about gays and lesbians, he says, such as the contention that gay men are predisposed to abuse children.

“That’s a lie,” Potok says. “These guys are engaging in straight-up defamation of a very large group of people. There are not many things much worse than you can say in America about somebody than they are a child molester.”

Potok scoffed at Spriggs’ claim that the council and other evangelical anti-gay groups are victims of intolerance.

“That’s whining on the part of people who spend their days and nights attacking gay people and then some people criticize them and they don’t like it,” he says. “That’s pathetic. It reminds me of slave owners complaining that people are saying ugly things about them.”

What the Bible says

What about the popular evangelical claim, “We don’t hate the sinner, just the sin” – is that seen as intolerance or hate speech when it comes to homosexuality?

There are those who say you can’t hate the sin and love the sinner because being gay or lesbian is defined by one’s sexual behavior; it’s who someone is.

“Most people who identify as gay and lesbian would say that this is not an action I’m choosing to do; this is who I am,” says Timothy Beal, author of “The Rise and Fall of the Bible: The Unexpected History of an Accidental Book.”

Beal, a religion professor at Case Western University in Ohio, says it should be difficult for any Christian to unequivocally declare that the Bible opposes homosexuality because the Bible doesn’t take a single position on the topic. It's an assertion that many scholars and mainline Protestant pastors would agree with.

Some people cite Old Testament scriptures as condemning homosexuality, such as  Leviticus 18:22 - “If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination.” But other Christians counter by saying they are not bound by the Old Testament.

There are those who also cite New Testament scriptures like Romans 1:26-27 - “… Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men. …”

Beal, however, says Jesus said little about sex. And the Apostle Paul, who wrote Romans, was probably referring to male prostitution and men having sexual relations with boys, a practice in the Greco-Roman world.

“Paul does not understand genetics and sexual orientation the way we understand it now as something much more than a choice,” says Beal.

Some evangelicals say Christians can’t change their view of biblical truth just because times change. But some scholars reply:

Sure you can. Christians do it all the time.

Denying a woman’s ability to preach in church was justified by scriptures like 1 Timothy 2:11-12 - “… I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man; she must be quiet.” But many churches have abandoned that teaching - and some scholars say a woman preached the first Christian sermon, when Mary Magdalene proclaimed that Jesus had risen.

Slaveholders in 19th century America justified slavery through a literal reading of the Bible, quoting Titus 2:9-10 – “Teach slaves to be subject to their masters in everything. …” And anti-Semitism was justified by the claims that Jews killed Jesus, such as Matthew 27: 25-26 - “Let his blood be on us and on our children.”

Litfin, from Moody Bible Institute, acknowledged that the Bible once sanctioned slavery, but he said that practice was a “cultural expression” that changed over time. Evangelicals who oppose same-sex marriage by citing the Bible are on more solid ground, he says.

“Marriage is a universal and timeless institution that God set up for maximum human flourishing. He set it up in the first book of the Bible with the story of Adam and Eve. It is consistent throughout the whole Bible. … Marriage is in a different category than those cultural things.”

Public jousts over the Bible's stance on homosexuality rarely change people’s minds. What changes is when people get to know gay and lesbian people as friends and hear their story, says Beal, author of “The Rise and Fall of the Bible.”

“If you open up to that other person genuinely, you basically come to a point where you have to sacrifice them to your ideology or crack open your ideology to make a hospitable place for them,” Beal says.

One Christian pastor who is gay says the uproar over the ESPN commentator’s comments can actually be good,  because debates help settle moral disputes.

“What appears to us as antiquated and prejudicial now was once a disputed issue that required debate,” says the Rev. Richard McCarty, a minister in the United Church of Christ and a religious studies professor at Mercyhurst University in Pennsylvania.

Until the debate over homosexuality is settled - if it ever is - there may be plenty of evangelical Christians who feel as if they are now being forced to stay in the closet.

Carter, the evangelical blogger, says he foresees a day when any church that preaches against homosexuality will be marginalized. Just as many churches now accept divorce, they will accept sexual practices once considered sinful.

“It’s getting to the point,” he says, “where churches are not going to say that any sexual activity is wrong.”

- CNN Writer

Filed under: Belief • Bible • Christianity • Church • Church and state • Culture wars • Protest • Sex • Sexuality • Sports

soundoff (10,982 Responses)
  1. Joe

    Christ may speak for God, but he wasn't speaking...it was you. Not to mention that Christ had nothing to say on the subject. Christians have a bad habit of speaking for Christ based on a 5th grade level understanding of an English TRANSLATION of the Bible. Most don't even know where the Bible really comes from. It is not God or Christ I challenge, but your understanding of what God's opinions are. So once again stop speaking in absolutes that you know what God wants, because they are just your opinions, not God's.

    May 5, 2013 at 7:03 pm |
  2. charles moffett

    To sum: it's still a crying foul via the scapegoat mentality. Sacrifice; violence; hatred, can all become backwards defining who, what, when, where, why, and how come. How come?

    May 5, 2013 at 7:02 pm |
  3. betty

    Who cares what that book of fables says? God is no more real than Santa.

    May 5, 2013 at 7:01 pm |
    • mark

      How do you know that?

      May 5, 2013 at 7:11 pm |
    • Paul Jaramillo

      What makes it your business to make fun of billions of people who believe in God?
      You are very immature and have no concept, of how this belief in a God goes back in all human history.
      The belief in a deity is almost genetic in all human civilizations.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:16 pm |
    • Lamb of Dog

      But people look back on the roman gods as a fairy tale. Yet I am sure the Romans believed in them.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:19 pm |
    • mark

      Jesus was not a mythical God like the Greek gods. He walked earth he fulfilled prophecy and he is real. And, he actually loves you, even though you deny him. Yo have one chance to accept his love, the rest will take care of itself.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:22 pm |
    • Lamb of Dog

      Jesus was a man and he is dead.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:24 pm |
    • Lamb of Dog

      All gods are mythical beings.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:25 pm |
    • mark

      He rose again and was seen by 500. He changed the world, and you will find out soon enough.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:30 pm |
    • Lamb of Dog

      Dont threaten me with a good time.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:35 pm |
    • mark

      You have an opinion on God, if you are wrong, you will be affected for eternity. I might not take that chance based upon opinion.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:35 pm |
    • Lamb of Dog

      And just so you know. Scare tactics dont work on non believers.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:36 pm |
    • Lamb of Dog

      Thats because you dont have any balls mark.
      And scare tactics are to keep people like you in line.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:37 pm |
    • mark

      Not my place to threaten, He is Lord not me. If I'm right I live for eternity, if I'm wrong no loss. If your're wrong ouch.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:37 pm |
    • mark

      Not a scare tactic, just a given. And I'm not scared of anything, I welcome the blessing of heaven. I fear not. It takes a man to walk the narrow path, a wuss to walk the wide path.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:40 pm |
    • LinCA

      @betty

      You said, "Who cares what that book of fables says? God is no more real than Santa."
      Don't knock Santa. He, just like Loch Ness Monster or Big Foot, is far more likely to be real than any god. The Santa myth is based on a real person. He is most likely dead as a doornail, but he did exist.

      Gods, any gods, are far more like the Tooth Fairy and the Easter Bunny. There is equal evidence for each of these imaginary creatures. That makes them about equally likely to exist.

      May 5, 2013 at 8:00 pm |
    • LinCA

      @mark

      You said, "Not my place to threaten, He is Lord not me. If I'm right I live for eternity, if I'm wrong no loss. If your're wrong ouch."
      That sounds an awful lot like Pascal's Wager.

      Pascal's Wager:
      In effect, Pascal's wager states that while we can't know with absolute certainty whether the christian god exists, a rational evaluation should lead to a belief. If having to choose between believing (in the christian god), or not believing, the reward for being correct, and the price for being wrong, tips the balance in favor of believing.

      It says, if you believe and are correct, you will gain heaven, while the price for being wrong is nothing. On the other hand, if you don't believe, it says you will gain nothing for being right, yet lose everything if you are wrong. So, belief results in a win/neutral, and non-belief in a neutral/lose position, tipping the balance clearly in favor of the "belief" position.

      Why Pascal's Wager is a fallacy:
      a) Pascal's Wager assumes that there are only two options.
      b) Pascal's Wager assumes the christian god doesn't care whether someone actually believes, or simply goes through the motions.
      c) Pascal's Wager discounts the price paid for belief before death.
      d) Pascal's Wager vastly overestimates the odds for the reward and the risk of punishment.

      Positing only two options is ridiculous. There are, of course, thousands of possibilities when it comes to gods. Based on the evidence available for these gods, it is not reasonable to assume one is more likely than any of the others. To increase the odds of a positive outcome of this wager, the believer would have to believe in, and worship, every possible god. Including the ones that haven't been invented yet. Aside from the drain on the available time, it presents the problem that quite a few of these gods are pretty selfish. They frown upon believers believing in other gods. In some religions that is enough to not be eligible for the reward (making the belief position a lose/neutral one).

      Also, just going through the motions and pretending to believe may fool your community, but it can't fool an all-knowing god. It is very unlikely that anyone would gain the ultimate reward for simply faking belief (making the belief position a lose/neutral one).

      The price paid for the belief position isn't nothing. It involves going through the rituals, day after day, week after week. It may have severe side effects on physical and mental health. Sex life suffers, too.

      In estimating whether the cost of any given action is worth it, an evaluation of risk versus reward is in order.

      Risk is (simplistically) the chance that a negative event occurs, multiplied by the cost of that event. As an example, being hit by a meteorite carries a very high cost (probably death), but since the odds are extremely low, the risk associated with it is low. Similarly, the chance of getting rained on is pretty high, but the cost is very low, representing also a low risk. On the other hand the cost and chances of, and therefore the risk associated with, a traffic accident are high.

      The choice whether to mitigate a risk depends on, among other things, the severity of the risk, the cost of the mitigation and the tolerance of that risk. In the above examples, the cost to mitigate each risk are; exorbitant, low and high, respectively. Methods to reduce or eliminate the risk of meteorite impacts are cost prohibitive and far exceed the risk. An umbrella and a check of the weather forecast effectively mitigate the risk of getting rained on, and is easily worth the cost. Car crashes, and their after-effects are mitigated to various degrees by expensive technology (from street surface technology to driver training, airbags and traction control). People bear those costs to their financial ability and tolerance for the risk.

      A similar reasoning applies to reward. The choice whether to pursue a reward is guided by the perception value of the reward, the perception of the odds of gaining the reward and the cost to pursue it.

      In the belief versus non-belief question, believers tend to irrationally overestimate both the reward for belief, and the risk associated with non-belief.

      May 5, 2013 at 8:02 pm |
    • mark

      I understand the wager. I believe by faith and the way he works physically and emotionally in my life. It was 500 Christians who showed up to little Evan's party yesterday and made dieng boy the happiest he has ever been on his 4th birthday. That is love.

      May 5, 2013 at 8:10 pm |
    • LinCA

      @mark

      You said, "I understand the wager. I believe by faith and the way he works physically and emotionally in my life."
      What makes you so sure it's your imaginary friend? What sets your "experiences" apart from random chance?

      You said, "It was 500 Christians who showed up to little Evan's party yesterday and made dieng boy the happiest he has ever been on his 4th birthday. That is love."
      Just because 90% of the world population still believes in fairy tales doesn't mean they are true.

      May 5, 2013 at 8:44 pm |
  4. faith

    Am I coming or going? Shit.

    May 5, 2013 at 7:01 pm |
    • ..

      If you were coming you'd be a lot less uptight.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:28 pm |
    • Science

      faith....................thinks the sky is falling !.....................or the se-x education deal on Christians Be Nice.

      Pound SAND faith.with your partner the red horn-y devil.

      May 15, 2013 at 6:55 pm |
  5. Selfservliberal

    I am a baby boomer gay man. I have watched this battle going on my whole life. I have this to say to right wing Christians; It is not persecution to insist you stop imposing your beliefs on me. You are persecuted when you are fired, because you belong belong to a church, or get evicted from an apartment, or are disowned by family– parents, children, sibling because you belong to a church. You are persecuted when you can be arrested for going to church. All of these things have been done to gay people for all of my life because they are gay, and most of them have been done because of the influence of these very same Evangelicals people who now claim they are persecuted. Paranoia yes. Persecution No !

    May 5, 2013 at 7:01 pm |
    • lol??

      The usual is, "I am a gay baby boomer". Get that right with your community and you'll go further. That won't work in the body of Christ.

      "Gal 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

      May 5, 2013 at 7:10 pm |
  6. tomunbound

    Thank you sir, for an insightful and well rounded article. The "bible" in an anthology by hundreds of different writers, from different millennia, with different viewpoints and opinions, and with altering cosmological understandings. Stating that such a collection is, or could be "infallible" shows not the wisdom of the person, but their complete lack of understanding and critical study of said tome. Thus, any meaningful debate is pointless, as said believer has a fundamental 🙂 lack of understanding and, more importantly KNOWLEDGE of said subject matter. So there...

    May 5, 2013 at 6:59 pm |
    • TG

      The Bible was written by about 40 different "secretaries" over a period of about 1600 years (1513 B.C.E – about 98 C.E.), from humble shepherds to fishermen, to kings, to scribe, but it has only one author, Jehovah God.(2 Tim 3:16) It has show itself to have wisdom far above than that of mankind (Prov 2:1-6), providing sound counsel on having a happy family life (Eph 5:25-33; 6:4), how to be guided around and through calamities (Matt 10:16; Ps 73, Prov 14:15), to be honest (Heb 13:18), what the future holds (Ps 37:9-11, 29; Rev 16:16; Dan 2:44), how to show love.(1 Pet 2:21-23; John 13:1)

      It has proven time and again to be accurate in history (Joshua 6), persons of the past (such as David [1 Sam 17:12], Pontius Pilate [John 19:1], Jucal [Jer 38:1], Assyrian king Sargon [Isa 20:1] ), scientific details (Job 26:7, Isa 40:22).

      The Bible is unique, for it alone provides a hope of living forever on a paradise earth, whereby sickness, sorrow and death will be vanquished.(Rev 21:3-5) It alone shows the reason why we die (Gen 3:6; Rom 5:12) and what the future will be for those who love their Creator and those who do not.(John 3:36)

      May 8, 2013 at 8:56 am |
    • Richard Cranium

      Tg
      SHow me where god put any words in the bible...all were put there by men.
      You will say they were inspired by god...you have no evidence of that (the bible is not evidence)

      The brainwashing really took on this guy.

      Think for yourself...join us in reality.

      May 8, 2013 at 8:58 am |
  7. faith

    no way

    BACKFILL on E =mc2.....

    Einstein letter, set for auction, shows scientist challenging idea of God, being 'chosen'

    By Jessica Ravitz, CNN

    Decades before atheist scientist and author Richard Dawkins called God a "delusion," one world-renowned physicist – Albert Einstein – was weighing in on faith matters with his own strong words.

    “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends,” Einstein wrote in German in a 1954 letter that will be auctioned on eBay later this month. "No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this.”

    http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/category/culture-science/

    May 4, 2013 at 6:47 am | Report abuse |

    Cheech & Chong's History of 420

    http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/3b1508d1f0/cheech-chong-s-history-of-420?rel=player&playlist=341944

    All cults...........creationists, ID believers and devil cults.................

    The fact...............the earth is to old ...........time to EVOLVE !.

    Ancient Earth Crust Stored in Deep Mantle

    Apr. 24, 2013 — Scientists have long believed that lava erupted from certain oceanic volcanoes contains materials from the early Earth's crust. But decisive evidence for this phenomenon has proven elusive. New research from a team including Carnegie's Erik Hauri demonstrates that oceanic volcanic rocks contain samples of recycled crust dating back to the Archean era 2.5 billion years ago. Their work is published in Nature.

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130424132705.htm

    Dover Trial Transcripts............................................. FACTS.

    Below are the complete transcripts from the Dover Trial. Thanks to our friends at the National Center for Science Education for helping us fill in the missing transcripts.

    http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/intelligentdesigncase/dovertrialtranscripts.htm

    Education works for children

    Earth From Space

    Detailed satellite images reveal the web of connections that sustain life on Earth. Aired February 13, 2013 on PBS

    Program Description

    "Earth From Space" is a groundbreaking two-hour special that reveals a spectacular new space-based vision of our planet. Produced in extensive consultation with NASA scientists, NOVA takes data from earth-observing satellites and transforms it into dazzling visual sequences, each one exposing the intricate and surprising web of forces that sustains life on earth. Viewers witness how dust blown from the Sahara fertilizes the Amazon; how a vast submarine "waterfall" off Antarctica helps drive ocean currents around the world; and how the sun's heating up of the southern Atlantic gives birth to a colossally powerful hurricane. From the microscopic world of water molecules vaporizing over the ocean to the magnetic field that is bigger than Earth itself, the show reveals the astonishing beauty and complexity of our dynamic planet.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/space/earth-from-space.html

    February 16, 2013 at 7:18 am | Report abuse |

    Peace

    May 5, 2013 at 5:59 pm | Report abuse |

    May 5, 2013 at 6:45 pm | Report abuse | Reply

    no way

    BACKFILL on E =mc2.....

    Einstein letter, set for auction, shows scientist challenging idea of God, being 'chosen'

    By Jessica Ravitz, CNN

    Decades before atheist scientist and author Richard Dawkins called God a "delusion," one world-renowned physicist – Albert Einstein – was weighing in on faith matters with his own strong words.

    “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends,” Einstein wrote in German in a 1954 letter that will be auctioned on eBay later this month. "No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this.”

    http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/category/culture-science/

    May 4, 2013 at 6:47 am | Report abuse |

    Cheech & Chong's History of 420

    http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/3b1508d1f0/cheech-chong-s-history-of-420?rel=player&playlist=341944

    All cults...........creationists, ID believers and devil cults.................

    The fact...............the earth is to old ...........time to EVOLVE !.

    Ancient Earth Crust Stored in Deep Mantle

    Apr. 24, 2013 — Scientists have long believed that lava erupted from certain oceanic volcanoes contains materials from the early Earth's crust. But decisive evidence for this phenomenon has proven elusive. New research from a team including Carnegie's Erik Hauri demonstrates that oceanic volcanic rocks contain samples of recycled crust dating back to the Archean era 2.5 billion years ago. Their work is published in Nature.

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130424132705.htm

    Dover Trial Transcripts............................................. FACTS.

    Below are the complete transcripts from the Dover Trial. Thanks to our friends at the National Center for Science Education for helping us fill in the missing transcripts.

    http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/intelligentdesigncase/dovertrialtranscripts.htm

    Education works for children

    Earth From Space

    Detailed satellite images reveal the web of connections that sustain life on Earth. Aired February 13, 2013 on PBS

    Program Description

    "Earth From Space" is a groundbreaking two-hour special that reveals a spectacular new space-based vision of our planet. Produced in extensive consultation with NASA scientists, NOVA takes data from earth-observing satellites and transforms it into dazzling visual sequences, each one exposing the intricate and surprising web of forces that sustains life on earth. Viewers witness how dust blown from the Sahara fertilizes the Amazon; how a vast submarine "waterfall" off Antarctica helps drive ocean currents around the world; and how the sun's heating up of the southern Atlantic gives birth to a colossally powerful hurricane. From the microscopic world of water molecules vaporizing over the ocean to the magnetic field that is bigger than Earth itself, the show reveals the astonishing beauty and complexity of our dynamic planet.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/space/earth-from-space.html

    February 16, 2013 at 7:18 am | Report abuse |

    Peace

    big deal

    i love dodo
    May 5, 2013 at 5:59 pm | Report abuse |

    May 5, 2013 at 6:45 pm | Report abuse | Reply

    May 5, 2013 at 6:55 pm |
    • GAW

      Can you say Spam everyone?

      May 5, 2013 at 6:58 pm |
  8. GAW

    But in reality Evangelicals are their own worst enemy. They will probably divide themselves into oblivion.

    May 5, 2013 at 6:52 pm |
    • Bostontola

      Let's hope, but don't take it for granted, do whatever you can to ensure it.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:53 pm |
    • mama k

      "divide themselves into oblivion" LOL – yes, well that might actually prove some theory in the process – when do tickets go on sale?

      May 5, 2013 at 6:56 pm |
    • faith

      u wish

      o, your momma

      no way

      BACKFILL on E =mc2.....

      Einstein letter, set for auction, shows scientist challenging idea of God, being 'chosen'

      By Jessica Ravitz, CNN

      Decades before atheist scientist and author Richard Dawkins called God a "delusion," one world-renowned physicist – Albert Einstein – was weighing in on faith matters with his own strong words.

      “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends,” Einstein wrote in German in a 1954 letter that will be auctioned on eBay later this month. "No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this.”

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/category/culture-science/

      May 4, 2013 at 6:47 am | Report abuse |

      Cheech & Chong's History of 420

      http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/3b1508d1f0/cheech-chong-s-history-of-420?rel=player&playlist=341944

      All cults...........creationists, ID believers and devil cults.................

      The fact...............the earth is to old ...........time to EVOLVE !.

      Ancient Earth Crust Stored in Deep Mantle

      Apr. 24, 2013 — Scientists have long believed that lava erupted from certain oceanic volcanoes contains materials from the early Earth's crust. But decisive evidence for this phenomenon has proven elusive. New research from a team including Carnegie's Erik Hauri demonstrates that oceanic volcanic rocks contain samples of recycled crust dating back to the Archean era 2.5 billion years ago. Their work is published in Nature.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130424132705.htm

      Dover Trial Transcripts............................................. FACTS.

      Below are the complete transcripts from the Dover Trial. Thanks to our friends at the National Center for Science Education for helping us fill in the missing transcripts.

      http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/intelligentdesigncase/dovertrialtranscripts.htm

      Education works for children

      Earth From Space

      Detailed satellite images reveal the web of connections that sustain life on Earth. Aired February 13, 2013 on PBS

      Program Description

      "Earth From Space" is a groundbreaking two-hour special that reveals a spectacular new space-based vision of our planet. Produced in extensive consultation with NASA scientists, NOVA takes data from earth-observing satellites and transforms it into dazzling visual sequences, each one exposing the intricate and surprising web of forces that sustains life on earth. Viewers witness how dust blown from the Sahara fertilizes the Amazon; how a vast submarine "waterfall" off Antarctica helps drive ocean currents around the world; and how the sun's heating up of the southern Atlantic gives birth to a colossally powerful hurricane. From the microscopic world of water molecules vaporizing over the ocean to the magnetic field that is bigger than Earth itself, the show reveals the astonishing beauty and complexity of our dynamic planet.

      http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/space/earth-from-space.html

      February 16, 2013 at 7:18 am | Report abuse |

      Peace

      May 5, 2013 at 5:59 pm | Report abuse |

      May 5, 2013 at 6:45 pm | Report abuse | Reply

      May 5, 2013 at 6:56 pm |
    • lol??

      No, they're not playin' the mob against mob, spy vs spy, mad magazine game.

      "Luk 12:53 The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law."

      May 5, 2013 at 7:05 pm |
  9. Bostontola

    You've seen this many times because it hits the nail on the head so often:

    I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
    Mahatma Gandhi

    May 5, 2013 at 6:50 pm |
    • faith

      u 2 agree that he lived and was wonderful.

      about time

      I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
      Mahatma Gandhi

      u 2 agree that he lived and was wonderful.

      about time

      I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.
      Mahatma Gandhi

      May 5, 2013 at 6:58 pm |
    • Snow

      Unfortunately, the only people who do not get that quote are the christians.. that's the sad part

      May 5, 2013 at 6:58 pm |
    • lol??

      Gandhi had to register as a s*ex offender. Did him in for life. Couldn't find work.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:02 pm |
  10. Eric

    One is not decriminated against by NOT letting them control the action of another. Christians are not told they cannot believe somethng, nor are they told they cannot be Christians. They, on the other hand,, believe it is their right to control others, and that they are being somehow persecuted when someone tells them to keep their views to themselves. When Christians are pulled behind a car and left for dead hanging on a fence they can claim persecution. When they are told they cannot visit a dying partner, or that they cannot be employed, then they can claim descimination. Methinks many people do not understand the meaning of the words.

    May 5, 2013 at 6:49 pm |
  11. faith

    no way

    BACKFILL on E =mc2.....

    Einstein letter, set for auction, shows scientist challenging idea of God, being 'chosen'

    By Jessica Ravitz, CNN

    Decades before atheist scientist and author Richard Dawkins called God a "delusion," one world-renowned physicist – Albert Einstein – was weighing in on faith matters with his own strong words.

    “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends,” Einstein wrote in German in a 1954 letter that will be auctioned on eBay later this month. "No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this.”

    http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/category/culture-science/

    May 4, 2013 at 6:47 am | Report abuse |

    Cheech & Chong's History of 420

    http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/3b1508d1f0/cheech-chong-s-history-of-420?rel=player&playlist=341944

    All cults...........creationists, ID believers and devil cults.................

    The fact...............the earth is to old ...........time to EVOLVE !.

    Ancient Earth Crust Stored in Deep Mantle

    Apr. 24, 2013 — Scientists have long believed that lava erupted from certain oceanic volcanoes contains materials from the early Earth's crust. But decisive evidence for this phenomenon has proven elusive. New research from a team including Carnegie's Erik Hauri demonstrates that oceanic volcanic rocks contain samples of recycled crust dating back to the Archean era 2.5 billion years ago. Their work is published in Nature.

    http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130424132705.htm

    Dover Trial Transcripts............................................. FACTS.

    Below are the complete transcripts from the Dover Trial. Thanks to our friends at the National Center for Science Education for helping us fill in the missing transcripts.

    http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/intelligentdesigncase/dovertrialtranscripts.htm

    Education works for children

    Earth From Space

    Detailed satellite images reveal the web of connections that sustain life on Earth. Aired February 13, 2013 on PBS

    Program Description

    "Earth From Space" is a groundbreaking two-hour special that reveals a spectacular new space-based vision of our planet. Produced in extensive consultation with NASA scientists, NOVA takes data from earth-observing satellites and transforms it into dazzling visual sequences, each one exposing the intricate and surprising web of forces that sustains life on earth. Viewers witness how dust blown from the Sahara fertilizes the Amazon; how a vast submarine "waterfall" off Antarctica helps drive ocean currents around the world; and how the sun's heating up of the southern Atlantic gives birth to a colossally powerful hurricane. From the microscopic world of water molecules vaporizing over the ocean to the magnetic field that is bigger than Earth itself, the show reveals the astonishing beauty and complexity of our dynamic planet.

    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/space/earth-from-space.html

    February 16, 2013 at 7:18 am | Report abuse |

    Peace

    May 5, 2013 at 5:59 pm | Report abuse |

    May 5, 2013 at 6:45 pm |
    • Science

      Thanks faith..............have you lost it ?

      Where do morals come from?..............not from the bible .

      By Kelly Murray, CNN

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/04/12/where-do-morals-come-from/#comments

      Gravity is not up for debate ! ............E = mc2..........(U–Pb).................two math formulas..........that do not lie or sin !!!...

      Peace.......

      May 5, 2013 at 6:52 pm |
  12. NoDoubt

    Funny how the attackers are now the victims. Well, good for them to get a little of their medicine, but I don't believe anyone should be persecuted for their beliefs if it doesn't hurt others. People DO have a right to have an opinion, to believe what they want to believe. However, know what you believe, and don't just say "the bible tells me so", because that is SUCH a weak argument.
    When humanity lived in wide open spaces, and were at the mercy of nature and its elements, they had to create shamanism that morphed into religion in order to cope. Our lives are no longer that desolate. If you continue to utilize the logic of a book written eons ago as your moral barometer, you better be willing to accept the whole thing, not just parts of it you prefer.

    May 5, 2013 at 6:45 pm |
    • lol??

      Don't need no stinkin' argument. Rights are God given that can only be infringed upon and violated. Don't matter what a mob thinks, if there is such a thing as mob thinkin'.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:47 pm |
    • NoDoubt

      True. In mob thinking, there usually isn't any reason, so arguing is pointless there. But for people attempting a debate, hopefully it would be different.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:22 pm |
  13. Troglodytes Entertaining All

    The Family Research Council is a domestic terrorist organization.

    May 5, 2013 at 6:37 pm |
    • faith

      they r a front for ms 13

      May 5, 2013 at 6:40 pm |
    • Lamb of Dog

      Gay bashing research council.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:40 pm |
    • lol??

      Ever heard of in-laws??

      May 5, 2013 at 6:45 pm |
  14. nick2313

    And btw there has been more killed in the name of freedom and communism in these last 50 or so years then islam-catholics -christains combined.

    May 5, 2013 at 6:36 pm |
    • Bostontola

      You're right, religion isn't the only bad thing out there.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:40 pm |
    • jp

      809 million people have died in religious wars. That’s nearly a billion people.

      Oftentimes, a retort is that secular ideals and Godless Communism have killed many more. It is true that Stalin, among others, slaughtered his own people by the millions during the industrialization of Soviet Russia. By comparison, 209 million have died in the name of Communism. Some 62 million died during World War II, civilian and military, on all sides. Conclusively, more people have died in the name of religion than in the name of Communism or Hitler, or the two combined times two."

      May 5, 2013 at 6:43 pm |
    • GAW

      Yes I agree.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:47 pm |
    • tallulah13

      Of course, the world population has grown radically in the last hundred years, so it's like comparing apples to oranges. I wonder what the proportional comparison would be. I suspect that the number of deaths attributed communist dictators is a drop in the bucket compared to the estimated 90% death rate of indigenous Americans when Christian explorers arrived in the New World.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:50 pm |
  15. faith

    personally, i am grateful for my relationship with atheist. i know each and every one of my brethren believes not only that gays should be allowed to marry, legally, but that all xtards should pay dearly for all the dastardly things done to them. amen? amen! sieg heil!

    May 5, 2013 at 6:35 pm |
    • Jesus freaker

      Good thing they have us to protect them from you.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:44 pm |
    • ..

      Faith Translation: I'm a lunatic.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:46 pm |
  16. Lamb of Dog

    God is love. Sounds beautiful. Until you do something wrong. And then blam he smites you. Feel the burn er I mean love.

    May 5, 2013 at 6:35 pm |
    • faith

      so true. list 5 examples

      May 5, 2013 at 6:36 pm |
    • Lamb of Dog

      Not for you. Read the old testament. He burns people to a crisp for just about anything.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:37 pm |
    • mark

      Jesus brought forgiveness, you are wrong.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:44 pm |
    • faith

      lis
      r
      5
      ex
      a
      m
      ple

      s

      BACKFILL on E =mc2.....

      Einstein letter, set for auction, shows scientist challenging idea of God, being 'chosen'

      By Jessica Ravitz, CNN

      Decades before atheist scientist and author Richard Dawkins called God a "delusion," one world-renowned physicist – Albert Einstein – was weighing in on faith matters with his own strong words.

      “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends,” Einstein wrote in German in a 1954 letter that will be auctioned on eBay later this month. "No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this.”

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/category/culture-science/

      May 4, 2013 at 6:47 am | Report abuse |

      Cheech & Chong's History of 420

      http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/3b1508d1f0/cheech-chong-s-history-of-420?rel=player&playlist=341944

      All cults...........creationists, ID believers and devil cults.................

      The fact...............the earth is to old ...........time to EVOLVE !.

      Ancient Earth Crust Stored in Deep Mantle

      Apr. 24, 2013 — Scientists have long believed that lava erupted from certain oceanic volcanoes contains materials from the early Earth's crust. But decisive evidence for this phenomenon has proven elusive. New research from a team including Carnegie's Erik Hauri demonstrates that oceanic volcanic rocks contain samples of recycled crust dating back to the Archean era 2.5 billion years ago. Their work is published in Nature.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130424132705.htm

      Dover Trial Transcripts............................................. FACTS.

      Below are the complete transcripts from the Dover Trial. Thanks to our friends at the National Center for Science Education for helping us fill in the missing transcripts.

      http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/intelligentdesigncase/dovertrialtranscripts.htm

      Education works for children

      Earth From Space

      Detailed satellite images reveal the web of connections that sustain life on Earth. Aired February 13, 2013 on PBS

      Program Description

      "Earth From Space" is a groundbreaking two-hour special that reveals a spectacular new space-based vision of our planet. Produced in extensive consultation with NASA scientists, NOVA takes data from earth-observing satellites and transforms it into dazzling visual sequences, each one exposing the intricate and surprising web of forces that sustains life on earth. Viewers witness how dust blown from the Sahara fertilizes the Amazon; how a vast submarine "waterfall" off Antarctica helps drive ocean currents around the world; and how the sun's heating up of the southern Atlantic gives birth to a colossally powerful hurricane. From the microscopic world of water molecules vaporizing over the ocean to the magnetic field that is bigger than Earth itself, the show reveals the astonishing beauty and complexity of our dynamic planet.

      http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/space/earth-from-space.html

      February 16, 2013 at 7:18 am | Report abuse |

      Peace

      May 5, 2013 at 5:59 pm | Report abuse |

      May 5, 2013 at 6:47 pm |
    • Lamb of Dog

      If thats what you need to believe. I dont see how an omnipotent being changes. And why would he need to create a son for this. Couldnt god have just stopped being a jerk without jesus?

      May 5, 2013 at 6:49 pm |
    • faith

      see what i mean?

      BACKFILL on E =mc2.....

      Einstein letter, set for auction, shows scientist challenging idea of God, being 'chosen'

      By Jessica Ravitz, CNN

      Decades before atheist scientist and author Richard Dawkins called God a "delusion," one world-renowned physicist – Albert Einstein – was weighing in on faith matters with his own strong words.

      “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends,” Einstein wrote in German in a 1954 letter that will be auctioned on eBay later this month. "No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this.”

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/category/culture-science/

      May 4, 2013 at 6:47 am | Report abuse |

      Cheech & Chong's History of 420

      http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/3b1508d1f0/cheech-chong-s-history-of-420?rel=player&playlist=341944

      All cults...........creationists, ID believers and devil cults.................

      The fact...............the earth is to old ...........time to EVOLVE !.

      Ancient Earth Crust Stored in Deep Mantle

      Apr. 24, 2013 — Scientists have long believed that lava erupted from certain oceanic volcanoes contains materials from the early Earth's crust. But decisive evidence for this phenomenon has proven elusive. New research from a team including Carnegie's Erik Hauri demonstrates that oceanic volcanic rocks contain samples of recycled crust dating back to the Archean era 2.5 billion years ago. Their work is published in Nature.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130424132705.htm

      Dover Trial Transcripts............................................. FACTS.

      Below are the complete transcripts from the Dover Trial. Thanks to our friends at the National Center for Science Education for helping us fill in the missing transcripts.

      http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/intelligentdesigncase/dovertrialtranscripts.htm

      Education works for children

      Earth From Space

      Detailed satellite images reveal the web of connections that sustain life on Earth. Aired February 13, 2013 on PBS

      Program Description

      "Earth From Space" is a groundbreaking two-hour special that reveals a spectacular new space-based vision of our planet. Produced in extensive consultation with NASA scientists, NOVA takes data from earth-observing satellites and transforms it into dazzling visual sequences, each one exposing the intricate and surprising web of forces that sustains life on earth. Viewers witness how dust blown from the Sahara fertilizes the Amazon; how a vast submarine "waterfall" off Antarctica helps drive ocean currents around the world; and how the sun's heating up of the southern Atlantic gives birth to a colossally powerful hurricane. From the microscopic world of water molecules vaporizing over the ocean to the magnetic field that is bigger than Earth itself, the show reveals the astonishing beauty and complexity of our dynamic planet.

      http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/space/earth-from-space.html

      February 16, 2013 at 7:18 am | Report abuse |

      Peace

      May 5, 2013 at 5:59 pm | Report abuse |

      May 5, 2013 at 6:47 pm | Report abuse |

      May 5, 2013 at 6:52 pm |
    • Jesus freaker

      Read the old testament. He burns people to a crisp for just about anything.

      Sometimes he punished multiple generations. Imagine being locked up for something your great great great grandfather did. He's worse than a mob boss.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:55 pm |
    • Paul Jaramillo

      If someone beats you up, are you going to love that person?

      May 5, 2013 at 6:59 pm |
  17. nick2313

    It is not that religion is flawed in so much as man is flawed one can make the argument capitalism/communism-islam /christainity and any other thing a flock of humans put to together has been good and evil.Or I can say a police officer is supposed to obey the law and enforce but time and time again we see some that do not uphold law don't mean all officers are evil people.

    May 5, 2013 at 6:34 pm |
    • Bostontola

      The problem is religion makes good people do bad things, and bad people take advantage of good ones.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:37 pm |
    • lol??

      And the public servants want a Vegas cut, AKA skimming.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:43 pm |
    • faith

      boy. sieg heil to that.

      list 5 examples

      Bostontola
      The problem is religion makes good people do bad things, and bad people take advantage of good ones.

      no way

      BACKFILL on E =mc2.....

      Einstein letter, set for auction, shows scientist challenging idea of God, being 'chosen'

      By Jessica Ravitz, CNN

      Decades before atheist scientist and author Richard Dawkins called God a "delusion," one world-renowned physicist – Albert Einstein – was weighing in on faith matters with his own strong words.

      “The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends,” Einstein wrote in German in a 1954 letter that will be auctioned on eBay later this month. "No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this.”

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/category/culture-science/

      May 4, 2013 at 6:47 am | Report abuse |

      Cheech & Chong's History of 420

      http://www.funnyordie.com/videos/3b1508d1f0/cheech-chong-s-history-of-420?rel=player&playlist=341944

      All cults...........creationists, ID believers and devil cults.................

      The fact...............the earth is to old ...........time to EVOLVE !.

      Ancient Earth Crust Stored in Deep Mantle

      Apr. 24, 2013 — Scientists have long believed that lava erupted from certain oceanic volcanoes contains materials from the early Earth's crust. But decisive evidence for this phenomenon has proven elusive. New research from a team including Carnegie's Erik Hauri demonstrates that oceanic volcanic rocks contain samples of recycled crust dating back to the Archean era 2.5 billion years ago. Their work is published in Nature.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/04/130424132705.htm

      Dover Trial Transcripts............................................. FACTS.

      Below are the complete transcripts from the Dover Trial. Thanks to our friends at the National Center for Science Education for helping us fill in the missing transcripts.

      http://www.aclupa.org/legal/legaldocket/intelligentdesigncase/dovertrialtranscripts.htm

      Education works for children

      Earth From Space

      Detailed satellite images reveal the web of connections that sustain life on Earth. Aired February 13, 2013 on PBS

      Program Description

      "Earth From Space" is a groundbreaking two-hour special that reveals a spectacular new space-based vision of our planet. Produced in extensive consultation with NASA scientists, NOVA takes data from earth-observing satellites and transforms it into dazzling visual sequences, each one exposing the intricate and surprising web of forces that sustains life on earth. Viewers witness how dust blown from the Sahara fertilizes the Amazon; how a vast submarine "waterfall" off Antarctica helps drive ocean currents around the world; and how the sun's heating up of the southern Atlantic gives birth to a colossally powerful hurricane. From the microscopic world of water molecules vaporizing over the ocean to the magnetic field that is bigger than Earth itself, the show reveals the astonishing beauty and complexity of our dynamic planet.

      http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/space/earth-from-space.html

      February 16, 2013 at 7:18 am | Report abuse |

      Peace

      May 5, 2013 at 5:59 pm | Report abuse |

      May 5, 2013 at 6:45 pm | Report abuse | Reply

      May 5, 2013 at 6:54 pm |
  18. Paul Jaramillo

    I think that the real problem is that, some seem to think that God hates gay people more than any other sin.
    Sin is all the same, but God shows compassion to all people. These forums attract people who are very crude and vulgar and refuse to dialog in a respectful and intelegent manner.

    May 5, 2013 at 6:34 pm |
    • Lamb of Dog

      I can be repectful. Can you be inteligent?

      May 5, 2013 at 6:36 pm |
    • Truth Will Out

      Paul, the reason they think that is because of certain medieval commentators. Most of them stated directly that so.domy was a worse sin than murder. That was passed down through the Protestant tradition.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:58 pm |
    • LG

      Thank God there seems to be one comment on here that merits being read. I WAS BEGINNING TO THINK THE ENTIRE WORLD HAD GONE BONKERS.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:54 pm |
  19. 1word

    It's a choice, if you chose not to allow Jesus to Save you; you choose to remain confused.

    May 5, 2013 at 6:31 pm |
    • I know you are but what am I?

      If you choose to believe in talking snakes, you choose to remain confused.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:34 pm |
    • just a guy

      Your Jesus chose to cast billions of people he loves into fire just because he gave them the free will to love him and they chose not to. What a dick! Why would someone cling to such a monster?
      God: the greatest lie ever told.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:36 pm |
    • faith

      as a former anti-god nazi atheist punk, i used to agree with u.

      truth is, they chose hell

      May 5, 2013 at 6:38 pm |
    • Jesus freaker

      As a former God loving brainwashed misinformed Baptist, I used to agree with you. They chose to educate themselves.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:04 pm |
  20. clinky

    Why is it so important to liberals to say being gay is not a choice? Why is choice philosophically relevant? I mean, are gays supposed to carry around genetic reports that lend them an excuse for conducting their private lives? Are they on a hook in the first place? Kind of sounds like putting little yellow stars on Jews. Isn't the whole point of personal liberty to say you are FREE to partner with whoever you CHOOSE? But, liberals can get livid on this matter of having no choice. It makes me wonder what they would do if it turned out gayness actually were a choice, after all? In that case, would liberals join the Christian right and legislate against marriage equality, since in this hypothetical, now gays COULD "help themselves"? That seems to be the liberal idea: their ideology is gays are to be tolerated because they cannot do what they WOULD do otherwise. You know, I don't think gays need liberal pity.

    May 5, 2013 at 6:28 pm |
    • Thomas

      Its no difference than the race issue. I *thought* black americans just wanted to be part of the American social fabric. . . . until you listen to their community leadership. Can't stop playing the race card or trying to standout for any number of reasons, just want to be seen and heard, not to just fit in and be accepted.

      May 5, 2013 at 6:32 pm |
    • GodFreeNow

      @ clinky, Why is it so important for conservatives to insist being gay is a choice?

      Out of curiosity, are you gay? If not, was being heterose.xual a choice you made? If so, have you considered the choice of being gay?

      May 5, 2013 at 6:32 pm |
    • clinky

      GFN, I'm not going to answer your interrogation whether I'm gay or straight because it's none of your business. What does it matter? If I told you, are you going to construct an ad hominem argument?

      You still haven't answered my question–why does genetics matter to the argument for legal rights?

      May 5, 2013 at 6:37 pm |
    • Captain Kirk

      Do you have some examples, clinky? That is, where people are arguing to be recognized as "not gay by choice" specifically for the reason of claiming legal rights? I wouldn't be surprised, but has it ever crossed your mind that gay people feel that they were born that way, and would love to know if science would soon confirm that feeling, regardless of the legal and political whirlwind that they find themselves in?

      May 5, 2013 at 6:43 pm |
    • GodFreeNow

      @clinky,
      "why does genetics matter to the argument for legal rights?"
      If not genetics, which until now are largely unchangeable, what should be the standard of legal rights? Is it not genes which make us human? So then, which humans do you intend to withhold rights from?

      May 5, 2013 at 6:48 pm |
    • clinky

      Captain K and GFN, The idea of liberty is that you are free to do what you want with your life–period. You need not add anything more. Bringing in genetics sounds like introducing exculpatory evidence–like gays need some special out to justify their lives. Why even talk about it, unless you think gays need a special clause excusing them for what you believe they would otherwise do, act like "normal" straights?

      May 5, 2013 at 6:57 pm |
    • Captain Kirk

      clinky – you shouldn't have tried to reply to both because you completely missed my point. There are other concerns besides liberty – that's only a piece of the picture. People always want to understand more about why they are like they are, and if science can confirm answers for them about their gut feelings and liberties are mingled in with that process, then so what?

      May 5, 2013 at 7:07 pm |
    • clinky

      Captain K, I believe I answered both of you fine. This is a question of legal right. I'm not against genetic investigation. Of course, there is a whole school of sociologists who believe genetic study is itself ideologically "constructed." I believe there is a nature/nurture mix for practically all people, without one or the other becoming absolute, but I don't have a stake in which is predominant. Could go as high as 80/20 in either direction.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:20 pm |
    • tallulah13

      clinky:

      I guess some of us think that the truth is important and that equal rights are the legacy of all Americans. I guess some of us just want to do the right thing. But if you wish to be a lying moral coward, clinky, that is certainly your choice.

      May 5, 2013 at 7:57 pm |
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120
Advertisement
About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.