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May 11th, 2013
10:00 PM ET

My Take: ‘Gay Christian’ is not an oxymoron

Editor’s note: Justin Lee is the Executive Director of the Gay Christian Network and author of Torn: Rescuing the Gospel from the Gays-vs.-Christians Debate.

By Justin Lee, Special to CNN

(CNN)–In high school, I was a Christian know-it-all.

My nickname was "God boy," and I was known for regularly preaching at my friends about social issues of the day. I dismissed their objections - and accusations of homophobia - as intolerance for my faith.

"I'm just telling you what God's Word says," I'd argue.

Years later I realized my mistake. What my peers most objected to wasn't my beliefs - it was my condescending attitude. I debated and preached when I should have listened. I thought that stating my position loudly and unyieldingly was a sign of strength. In the process, I alienated my friends.

I'm still an evangelical Christian, but one thing is now crystal clear to me. American evangelicals' bad reputation isn't just because of what we believe. It's mostly because of how we behave.

When ESPN commentator Chris Broussard was criticized for saying that openly gay NBA player Jason Collins was “openly rebelling against God,” some evangelicals argued that conservative theological views are no longer tolerated in America.

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But they're missing the point.

Broussard's language didn't just express a religious view about sexual morality; it referred to gay people in ways that were dehumanizing, reducing all gay people's lives to a single sex act. Other outspoken Christians routinely say even worse things, comparing gay people to pedophiles, for example.

No one is immune from criticism in a free country with diverse beliefs. But if Christians feel particularly singled out at times, I'd argue that our perceived lack of empathy for others is largely to blame.

I can often test a Christian's level of empathy by offering a single admission: When I was 18, I realized that I'm gay.

Empathetic Christians are typically intrigued by such a statement, even if they also question how a conservative Southern Baptist could also be openly gay. They want to know about my struggles, how my family and church responded, and whether I ever feel my faith and sexuality are at odds with one another.

I love these questions, because they show that the other person genuinely sees me as a human being.

But far too often, Christians respond not with curiosity and questions but with politics and preaching.

They quote Bible passages at me, make assumptions about my faith, or tell me why they’re opposed to same-sex marriage.

I'm no longer a person to them; I'm a symbol of a culture war. A battlefield. And when I don't want to be treated that way, they assume I'm turning away because I didn't really want to hear the truth.

This kind of behavior is why so many of my LGBT (lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender) friends want nothing to do with the church.

But it's not only them.

In my book, "Torn: Rescuing the Gospel from the Gays-vs.-Christians Debate," I share the story of Cindy, a conservative evangelical mom whose life was thrown into turmoil when her son told her he was gay.

This wasn't a political question for Cindy; it was a personal one. But the dehumanizing rhetoric about gay people she heard from the pulpit made her afraid to talk to anyone at church about her son's sexuality.

Christians are not a monolithic group. I know many empathetic Christians, including many who speak up regularly for their LGBT brothers and sisters.

CNN’s Belief Blog: The faith angles behind the biggest stories

The loudest megaphones do not speak for the rest of us, but they are still loud, and legion. To them I say: Gay people are not an issue. We're people. Some of us are Christians, too. And if it disturbs you that I refer to myself as both gay and Christian, I invite you to take the time to get to know me, and read what I write. You don't have to agree, and you might think I’m a sinner, but at least you’ll see me as a human being.

Baptist minister and author Tony Campolo quips that Jesus entreated Christians not to "love the sinner and hate the sin," but to "love the sinner and hate your own sin."

Jesus saved his harshest words for the self-righteously devout and chose the outcasts and sinners as his closest friends.

Perhaps a lesson in Jesus-style humility might do us all some good.

The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of Justin Lee.

- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: Belief • Christianity • Homosexuality • Opinion

soundoff (3,629 Responses)
  1. A pilgrim on the journey

    Arguing religion with an atheist is like being the defendant in a court case where the judge, the jury and the prosecuting attorney are all the same person.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:54 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      Searching for god is like looking for a black cat in a dark room at night--and the cat isn't there.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:56 pm |
    • Joe

      "and the cat isn't there."

      That's why they have to use their imaginations to come up with excuses as to why it's not there.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:59 pm |
    • Richard Cranium

      Because religion has no logical or reasonable leg to stand on and cannot withstand the scrutiny

      May 13, 2013 at 3:01 pm |
    • A pilgrim on the journey

      Q: How many atheists does it take to turn on the lights?

      A: There is no light.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:01 pm |
    • Richard Cranium

      pilgrim
      You do understand the point of a joke is to be humorous, right?
      Yours are non-funny.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:38 pm |
    • G to the T

      Q: How many pilgrims does it take to turn on a light?
      A: Fool! The lights are arleady on and you will burn for eternity for doubting it!

      May 13, 2013 at 3:38 pm |
  2. Science

    Plain REALLITY Mom and DAD did do it.................but NOT with the red devil or the sky daddy !

    May 13, 2013 at 2:53 pm |
  3. bob

    Claiming to be a gay Christian is like claiming to be a pro-life abortionist.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:50 pm |
    • Jesus is a dead fa.ggot

      Jesus was gay. A big flaming homosexual. He could spot another gay Jew in a crowd just like that!
      He loved to get nekkid and wash their feetsies. He was teh gay.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:52 pm |
    • ReligionIsBS

      Claiming to be a christian is like claiming to be a Thorist. Beleif in an imaginary god.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:53 pm |
    • Akira

      No, but thanks for trying so hard in 'Analogy 101."

      May 13, 2013 at 2:56 pm |
    • Dan

      I am pro-life and have no problem with abortion. I am pro-life of the mother. I am pro-life for society that functions for all and is not overloaded with unwanted children that unready teen parents would likely neglect only to start more cycles of uneducated kid's have unwanted babies.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:01 pm |
  4. Bibleisgood

    Facts we should know about the Bible
    ------------

    The Bible is the oldest book; its main and only theme is God, man, and
    God's salvation for man. The Bible was written over 1600 years in three
    languages (Hebrew, Chaldee – also known as Aramaic, and Greek) by more
    than 40 writers of different ages, and in different eras. Those were
    disciples, kings, ministers, priests, scribes, physicians, wise men,
    shepherds, fishermen, and tent makers. Moses was a minister, then a
    prince, a shepherd and a prophet. Samuel, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Daniel, and
    Jonah were prophets. David and Solomon were kings and wise men. Ezra was
    a scribe. Zechariah was a priest.

    The Bible (66 books) consists of the Old Testament (39 books) and the
    New Testament (27 books), each complementing and clarifying the other.
    Saint Augustine said that the New Testament was hidden in the Old
    Testament, and that the Old Testament was manifested in the New
    Testament. There are also ten other books which are used by all the
    Orthodox and Catholic Churches, but which the Protestant Church has not
    recognized (they question their sources). These books are Tobia,
    Jehodette, the End of the book of Esther, Wisdom, the Wisdom of Joshua
    son of Sirach, the Letter of Jeremiah the Prophet, Baroch, the End of
    the book of Daniel, First Macabees, and Second Macabees. These make the
    total of 76 books in the Bible. These books are full of history, laws,
    teachings, prophecies, poetry, prayers and wisdom.

    Inerrancy proofs
    ------

    1) Conservation of the Bible for 35 centuries: The Bible faced all sorts
    of wars since the beginning of its oldest books. Several kings and
    emperors resisted it and sought to destroy it (Antiochios, Neron,
    Dometian, Tragan, Valerian, Diocletian, Maximian, and several Muslim
    rulers). Recent writers and philosophers maliciously questioned its
    accuracy (Voltaire, Lenin, Bertrand Russell, and others). All those went
    away and remained the Bible as God said "for I will hasten my word to
    perform it." (Jeremiah 1:12).

    2) The Bible's wide and miraculous spread: Being the most widely spread
    book in spite of the resistance and wars against it, the Bible was
    preached in the early Christian centuries with very primitive
    transportation means. The Bible was translated into tens of languages
    before the invention of printing machines, and afterwards to more than
    1500 languages and dialects. Much more than 500,000,000 (five hundred
    million) copies have been distributed since 1804 all over the world as
    Jesus said "And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the
    world for a witness unto all nations" (Matthew 24:14).

    3) The character of its writers: The writers of the Bible were righteous
    people full of virtues like purity, honesty, self-sacrifice, and most of
    them performed miracles. Their strong faith was not shaken by misery nor
    illness (Job). They were persecuted for their preaching and prophecies.
    Several of them became martyrs and proclaimed the word of God until the
    last breath.

    4) The Bible's effect on people's lives: The undeniable strong effect of
    the Bible on the lives of people, and particularly sinners, is a proof
    that it is a Divine word. The Bible convicts the evildoers, changes
    their lives and renews their hearts and minds; it makes saints out of
    sinners, preachers out of the atheists, and happy successful out of
    miserable and sorrowful.

    5) Historical, monumental and scientific proofs: Scriptures found in the
    dumps of Ashur, and a pillar from Babel, dating from centuries before
    Moses' account of the creation in Genesis, are kept in England. They
    describe the creation, the fall of Adam and Eve, the flood, Noah's ark,
    and the Tower of Babel. These are all identical to Genesis' record.
    Other discoveries, like Rosette's Stone and Moab's Stone, support the
    historic account of the Old Testament.

    Scientific observations were occasionally able to explain parts of the
    Bible. For instance, during the sixteenth century Galileo observed what
    Isaiah the prophet has written in 750 B.C., "It is he that sitteth upon
    the circle of the earth" (Isaiah 40:22). Similarly, Isaac Newton
    observed the laws of gravity about which Job has written around 3500
    B.C. saying "He stretcheth out the north over the empty place, and
    hangeth the earth upon nothing." (Job 26:7).

    6) Fulfilment of the Scriptures: Thousands of years after they were
    written, all the prophecies about Christ were fulfilled. They described
    His miraculous Birth from a virgin (Isaiah 7:14), Him being the Mighty
    God (Isaiah 9:6), His miracles in healing the blind, the deaf, the dumb
    and the lame (Isaiah 35), His Passion, His suffering, His trial, His
    silence, His crucifiction between two thieves and His burial in a new
    tomb (Isaiah 35), Him being filled with the Holy Spirit, wisdom and
    justice (Isaiah 11:3-5), and Him being the only Savior of the whole
    world (Isaiah 63:1-5).

    King David's Psalms are also full of prophecies about Christ being the
    Eternal Son of God (Psalm 2), the Crucified (Psalm 22), the Good
    Shepherd (Psalm 23), the Risen from the dead (Psalms 16, 24, 47, 68),
    the King God, the Righteous, the Just (Psalms 45, 72), the Eternal
    Priest and God (Psalm 110), and also about Judas' betrayal (Psalm 41:9,
    55:12-14, 109:6-20).

    Others prophesied about the massacre of the children of Bethlehem in His
    childhood (Jeremiah 31:15-17), His new covenant (Jeremiah 31:31-34), His
    triumphant entry to Jerusalem (Zachariah 9:9-12), the spear that pierced
    His side (Zachariah 11:12), His birth in Bethlehem (Micah 5:2), and His
    first coming (Daniel 9:24-27).

    A huge number of detailed prophecies from tens of prophets and saints
    with hundreds and thousands of years separating them, which come to
    fulfilment all together in Jesus Christ. This is the ultimate
    irrefutable proof of the accuracy and inerrancy of the Holy Bible and
    that its Divine author is the Holy Spirit (II Peter 1:20-21, II Timothy
    3:16). Jesus Himself pointed out the fulfilment of those prophecies in
    His person (Luke 4:21, Mark 12:35-37, Luke 24:44-47).

    7) The testimony of Jesus Christ Himself: Jesus Christ, the Incarnate
    Word of God, Himself, Who is infallible and faultless, witnessed to the
    truth of the Bible, the accuracy of its accounts, and its verses, the
    words of God, by referring to the Old Testament and using some of its
    verses. The contemporary claims that some of these truths and stories
    (such as the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah, the flood, and the story
    of Jonah) are only myth can only be false claims since Jesus Christ used
    them and referred to them.

    Among the references Jesus made to parts of the Old Testament are
    references to the fall of the devil (Luke 10:18), the creation of Adam
    and Eve (Matthew 19:4), Abel's death (Matthew 23:35), the flood (Matthew
    24:37), the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah (Luke 17:18), Lot's wife
    (Luke 17:32), Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and Moses (Luke 20:37), the Law
    (John 7:19), divorce in the Old Testament (Matthew 19:8), Elijah and the
    widow when he stopped the rain by his prayer (Luke 4:25), Elisha healing
    Na'aman the Syrian the leper (Luke 4:27), Jonah (Matthew 12:40), and
    numerous other references from the prophecies of Isaiah, Jeremiah,
    Daniel, Zachariah, Malachi, and the Psalms.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:39 pm |
    • Hrothgar

      The Bible is not even close to being the oldest book.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:41 pm |
    • Smithsonian

      "Historical, monumental and scientific proofs:"

      Wrong. The Bible is primarily a book of religion, a guide to faith. it was not a book of history, poetry, economics, or science. It contains all sorts of literary genre, which are used to teach about the relationship between God and mankind. Even biblical history is edited history: events were chosen to illustrate the central theme of the Bible. The Biblical writers did not pretend they were giving a complete history; instead they constantly refer us to other sources for full historical details, sources such as "The Annals of the Kings of Judah" (or Israel).

      It is therefore not possible to try to "prove" the Bible by means of checking its historical or scientific accuracy. The only "proof" to which it can be subjected is this: Does it correctly portray the God-human relationship? In the best analysis, the Bible is a religious book, not an historical document.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:43 pm |
    • LOL!

      This knuckle head is quoting this site http://www.coptic.net/lessons/BibleInerrancy.txt

      May 13, 2013 at 2:45 pm |
    • Viewers choice award

      That post about the bible got a 🌟 🌟 🌟 🌟 🌟 rating!

      May 13, 2013 at 2:48 pm |
    • meifumado

      It’s too bad that stupidity isn’t painful.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:50 pm |
    • lol??

      You will NOT abort the Bible. Sorry, Death! You gonna burn.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:50 pm |
    • LOL!

      "That post about the bible got a 🌟 🌟 🌟 🌟 🌟 rating!"

      You realize you are endorsing the Christian Coptic Orthodox Church Of Egypt. LOL!

      May 13, 2013 at 2:51 pm |
    • liz

      you've missed it. totally.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:53 pm |
    • Lucifer's Evil Twin

      I didn't read past the very first lie... "The bible is the oldest book"

      "The oldest well-known "book" (a narrative story) is probably the Epic of Gilgamesh, first composed circa 2150-2000 BCE..." That took me about 5 seconds to find...

      May 13, 2013 at 3:23 pm |
    • Richard Cranium

      The term book is also subjective as most things were not written in books.
      The first known written language dates back to around 10,000-12,000 years ago, and was a written numbering system
      Odd haw elaborate the lies can get, and how quickly they are found.
      Delusion at its finest.

      May 13, 2013 at 4:01 pm |
  5. Carrie

    I am a Christian and it's true many Christians give us all a bad rap by the condescending way they act. But Gods word remains true and the word gay and christian don't go together and the author knows it. We're all human and all sin and all need God who loves us all dearly. Can't change God's word though just to make some happy. Truth is truth.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:39 pm |
    • Hrothgar

      And what about divorced Christians? Jesus came out strongly against that. And rich Christians? Jesus said no heaven for them. Christians who practice their faith where others can see them? No more reward, said Jesus.

      Looks like heaven is empty.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:41 pm |
    • RJW

      @Carrie:

      You CAN be gay and Christian. It's not a difficult concept. I know gay people who are very devout. They attend churches who welcome them with open arms. They are ministered to like anyone else and they use their talents to minister to others about God. I'm sorry that you think you have a right to define who and who cannot be a Christian. Talk about giving Christians a bad name. I wish Christians would stop putting down their fellow believers. I'm a Christian but I don't attend church any longer. I find that I get just as much benefit out of taking care of my relationship personally. I don't need to sit with a bunch of hypocrites and judges in a building. I can talk to God just fine on my own.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:41 pm |
    • sam stone

      Another one who thinks she knows the "truth"

      May 13, 2013 at 2:44 pm |
    • Dana MacGregor

      You somehow managed to completely miss the point.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:46 pm |
    • lol??

      The gubmint corrupted marriage. Hi, what's new??

      May 13, 2013 at 2:46 pm |
    • DQ

      To paraphrase the film Ivanhoe, "For every gay person who is not a Christian, I'll show you a Christian who is not a Christian..."

      May 13, 2013 at 2:58 pm |
    • Dan

      How amazingly loving for your God to afflict some people with constant desires for persons of the same gender and punishing them if they ever give in to those desires, but chooses not to afflict others who he let's be attracted to the opposite gender where they have desires that can be eventually fullfilled through marriage. So loving of him to create two classes of humans, one that get's what they want because God instilled in them the right desires, and the others who will forever be denied what they want, because God intilled the wrong kind of desire in them when they were born so they will have to suffer through life constantly guarding against their inate nature which God has deemed "un-natural".

      May 13, 2013 at 3:08 pm |
    • Madtown

      Gods word remains true
      ---
      Carrie, do you think God is maybe a little disappointed that the humans he created have suggested he is responsible for creating the bible, when in fact they are? God didn't write the bible. I can't help but think he'd be a little offended at this. Wouldn't this be "taking the lord's name in vain", by using it in a way that suggests that God did something that he actually did not do?

      May 13, 2013 at 3:13 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      "Can't change God's word though just to make some happy. Truth is truth."

      Ignorance is bliss I guess considering that book has been changed many times throughout history....I love people who believe something they really have no knowledge about.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:27 pm |
  6. sybaris

    When did YOU choose to be straight?

    May 13, 2013 at 2:38 pm |
    • lol??

      Straight is the fool for the comic in Brooklyn theatre. FFFFffffooooooolssssssss.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:45 pm |
    • Mike from CT

      Ok, so if I was born straight, does that make it correct.

      Good, because I was also born adulterous, covetousness (I took candy bars off the shelf that were not mine at the age of 2 and angry (at the age of 4 or so, I would bite my brother if he didn't put on my cartoon. I did not learn that from my parents or my environment. At no time in my life did I watch someone else do that and say Eureka that is the way to get the channel changed. It was pure anger)

      So since I was born this way, you will accept my behavior when I punch you in the face, steal your wallet and sleep with your spouse. Come on you have to now be consistent.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:00 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      "So since I was born this way, you will accept my behavior when I punch you in the face, steal your wallet and sleep with your spouse. Come on you have to now be consistent."

      LOL comparing something that does not hurt anyone to things that obviously do....ignorant.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:09 pm |
    • Mike from CT

      The argument is I WAS BORN THAT WAY. I have no responsibility for my actions.... why should sodomy be any different.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:50 pm |
    • Richard Cranium

      Mike
      Apples and oranges.
      I can choose to go for a walk. I cannot override my body and go for a flight.
      People are born the way they are, and has nothing to do with choice, you are comparing choices to things we have no choice over.
      Logic fail. Try again.

      May 13, 2013 at 4:05 pm |
    • Mike from CT

      "comparing choices to things we have no choice over."

      So are you asserting that we have no choice over what we do with our attractions?
      I love icecream, but I also choose not to eat it for every meal.

      May 13, 2013 at 4:30 pm |
    • Mike from CT

      " I cannot override my body and go for a flight."

      Really, why can you not use airplanes or hot air balloons, to assist you in flight? Please explain

      May 13, 2013 at 4:32 pm |
  7. fred

    Justin Lee
    There are Christians that murder, rape, commit adultery and a host of sins yet I do not see them boasting about being a Christian murderer or a Christian adulterer etc. If it is sin then you cannot boast in your sin and expect anyone to believe that the presence of God is with you. Regardless of denomination the mark of a Christian is the presence of the Holy Spirit that transforms the individual so that he or she no longer rapes, murders etc. and fully repents for prior sin accepting the blood of Christ as full atonement.

    Orientation is not a sin and I doubt anyone would argue with that. What one does with their orientation either is or is not sinful according to the Bible (assuming we are limiting this conversation to Christians since you claim to be a gay Christian). At issue is lustful physical carnal desire which is sinful regardless of orientation. At issue are lustful carnal thoughts which are sinful regardless of orientation. At issue is the understanding we are more than animal having been uniquely created in the image of God for the purpose of reflecting the glory of God regardless of orientation. The promotion of a personal agenda that tears down the Word of God is contrary to the image of God.

    This is the root of your problem which has nothing to do with your orientation. It is simply your excuse and justification to continue in your sin.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:36 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      There is no such thing as "sin" or "soul." Invisible and undetectable body parts are irrelevant.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:39 pm |
    • Doc Vestibule

      As the Apostle Paul said, it is better to be celibate, but if you can't control your loins then get married.
      Not allowing gays to get married is unfairly stacking the deck against them, don't you think?

      May 13, 2013 at 2:39 pm |
    • Joe

      "At issue is lustful physical carnal desire which is sinful regardless of orientation"

      So when Christian gays are married before their God in their churches, this does not apply to them.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:41 pm |
    • sam stone

      fred: anyone who would equate murder with being gay is an imbecile. go home, boy, and get your shinebox

      May 13, 2013 at 2:45 pm |
    • fred

      Doc
      There is marriage as an institution generally approved under state law and the states typically do as they please if it gets votes or collects revenue. Governments are typically unfair and unjust so I agree our laws are not fair to all concerned.

      Now, there is the union between a man and women before God that is not only blessed by God but perhaps brought about by God. This marriage is symbolic of the relationship between the Christ and the Church with many verses addressing the wedding feast. Traditions flow from that such as man is head over the wife as Christ is head of the Church. A husband is commanded to love his wife as Christ loved the church. This is not unfair on the basis of orientation as God by definition cannot be unfair while having the attribute of perfect goodness, perfect love etc.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:51 pm |
    • Wrong

      This should read.

      Now, there is the union between a man and man before God that is not only blessed by God but perhaps brought about by God. This marriage is symbolic of the relationship between the Christ and the Church with many verses addressing the wedding feast. Traditions flow from that such each partner is equal in their love and respect for each other. A husband is commanded to love his partner as Christ loved the church. This is not unfair on the basis of orientation as God by definition cannot be unfair while having the attribute of perfect goodness, perfect love etc

      May 13, 2013 at 2:55 pm |
    • fred

      Sam Stone
      Get a grip. I made an example of sin and sin is sin period. I equated nothing with your being gay or anyone being gay to murder. I put Justin lee in perspective with the correct issue which was not being gay but sinful behavior and actions.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:56 pm |
    • fred

      Joe
      Lustful physical carnal desire is sinful regardless of orientation. Being married or single does not put a lock on thought or desire. Godly thoughts and desires are a choice from the heart not a piece of paper.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:59 pm |
    • Doc Vestibule

      @Fred
      What of Anglican churches that perform gay marriage?
      Are those couple not in holy matrimony?

      And you may want to be careful when referencing the traditional Christian view of women.
      As the theologan Calvin said, woman is "more guilty than the man, because she was seduced by Satan, and so diverted her husband from obedience to God that she was an instrument of death leading all to perdition. It is necessary that woman recognize this, and that she learn to what she is subjected; and not only against her husband. This is reason enough why today she is placed below and that she bears within her ignominy and shame."

      Just as the zeitgeist has shifted away from misogyny, so will it move beyond ho?mophobia.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:06 pm |
    • fred

      Wrong
      Thanks, I would add that the union is complete in that they are one.
      There still remains order within the union as God is orderly. Just as the Father is over the Christ yet they are one and they are equal before God and in God. The husband is head of the wife yet both are equal before God and one before God. This issue goes back to the Garden of Eden and after the fall when sin entered. God told Eve he (Adam) will be your master.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:10 pm |
    • UhOh

      " This issue goes back to the Garden of Eden and after the fall when sin entered. God told Eve he (Adam) will be your master."

      Another illiterate Christians, what's new.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:12 pm |
    • fred

      Doc
      I look at the issue of subservient Eve a little different that Calvin. Before sin both were fully dependent and in the presence of God. When man rejects God man is living in sin in a broken world that does not enjoy the protection life in a perfect world offers. Order is necessary and man is master over women as part of the curse of life outside of Gods perfect will. In the absence of sin there is unity and equality where mutual love and submission do not require order.

      What ministers and priests do is an issue separate from a union put together before God and with Gods blessing. God has capacity and authority to bring about holy matrimony that brings glory not only to God but to those that are part of the blessing. Orientation is not an obstacle for God but an obstacle for man and in your question and obstacle before the church and the people.

      Christian marriage is between a man and a women period if the Bible is followed. If a denomination elects not to follow the Bible then they have declared the Bible false and if it is false then the entire Bible cannot be the word of God and becomes simply the words of man. But, this is what we all do as each has a slightly different take on God and on the meaning of the Word of God verses the words written in the Bible. One thing is clear Christian churches and priests that marry other than a man and a women are using their own personalized bible

      May 13, 2013 at 3:43 pm |
    • kim

      Fred, are you suggesting you are the only one who understands the bible?

      May 13, 2013 at 5:40 pm |
    • Jacob

      "Christian marriage is between a man and a women period if the Bible is followed. "

      Heterosexuals wrote the bible without the understanding of homosexuality, you are assuming they have the correct interpretation of God creations. The fact that homosexuality is found throughout natures only proves God did create them as well, then gave us science and psychology to understand. The bible also clearly states that we are not to stop learning, that means God has revealed to us through the Holy Spirit that homosexuals are his creation and he loves them.

      May 13, 2013 at 5:45 pm |
    • fred

      Kim
      No, the Bible is very clear about homosexuality being a sin and marriage is only discussed in terms of husband and wife / man and women. If you throw that out why stop there?

      May 13, 2013 at 5:47 pm |
    • UhOh

      "No, the Bible is very clear about homosexuality being a sin "

      Well, then you better go tell the Pope he got it wrong. Oh and all those thousands of churches that now web gays and lesbians and have declared it's not a sin.

      May 13, 2013 at 5:50 pm |
    • .

      "This is the root of your problem which has nothing to do with your orientation. It is simply your excuse and justification to continue in your sin."

      263 Ministers Proclamation

      As Christian clergy we proclaim: the Good News concerning Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender (LGBT) persons and publicly apologize where we have been silent. As disciples of Jesus, who assures us that the truth sets us free, we recognize that the debate is over. The verdict is in. Homosexuality is not a sickness, not a choice, and not a sin. We find no rational biblical or theological basis to condemn or deny the rights of any person based on sexual orientation. Silence by many has allowed political and religious rhetoric to monopolize public perception, creating the impression that there is only one Christian perspective on this issue. Yet we recognize and celebrate that we are far from alone, as Christians, in affirming that LGBT persons are distinctive, holy, and precious gifts to all who struggle to become the family of God.

      In repentance and obedience to the Holy Spirit, we stand in solidarity as those who are committed to work and pray for full acceptance and inclusion of LGBT persons in our churches and in our world. We lament that LGBT persons are condemned and excluded by individuals and institutions, political and religious, who claim to be speaking the truth of Christian teaching. This leads directly and indirectly to intolerance, discrimination, suffering, and even death. The Holy Spirit compels us:

      -to affirm- that the essence of Christian life is not focused on sexual orientation, but how one lives by grace in relationship with God, with compassion toward humanity;

      –to embrace- the full inclusion of our LGBT brothers and sisters in all areas of church life, including leadership;

      –to declare- that the violence must stop. Christ’s love moves us to work for the healing of wounded souls who are victims of abuse often propagated in the name of Christ;

      –to celebrate- the prophetic witness of all people who have refused to let the voice of intolerance and violence speak for Christianity, especially LGBT persons, who have met hatred with love;

      Therefore we call for an end to all religious and civil discrimination against any person based on sexual orientation and gender identity and expression. All laws must include and protect the freedoms, rights, and equal legal standing of all persons, in and outside the church.

      May 13, 2013 at 5:51 pm |
    • fred

      Jacob
      ok, so if you are going with some version of moral relativism to establish a belief you are not following the Bible. Churches cannot marry a man and women that are living in sin before God. When they marry homosexuals they must claim their beliefs are that the Bible is wrong when it says marriage is between a man and women and the Bible is wrong as to what is and is not sin. These churches do not believe the Bible is infallible by their own actions. These churches agree with you.

      What you propose is similar to the LDS where they have a group that updates the bible with the Book of Mormon and special insights. At some point us traditionalists may be outnumbered by relative Christianity.

      May 13, 2013 at 6:06 pm |
    • .

      "At some point us traditionalists may be outnumbered by relative Christianity."

      Brent

      Religion-based bigotry is the foundation of anti-gay attitudes in our society and in the minds of a majority of Americans, particularly persons of faith. The term religion-based bigotry was coined because it best fits the description of the problem. The term religion-based bigotry encompasses the attitudes of prejudice, hostility or discrimination that are falsely justified by religious teachings or belief. We will never see full and equal rights unless we address the root of people’s anti-gay attitude.

      Religion-based bigotry is not synonymous with bigotry. It is a uniquely vile form of bigotry as the prejudice, hostility and discrimination behind the words are given a moral stamp of approval.

      Faith in America’s core message is that religious-based condemnation and rejection of LGBT people cause great harm to LGBT individuals and our society.

      We have learned that when we focus on the harms caused by religious hostility toward gay people – its destructive role in the lives of gay and lesbian Americans and explaining that being gay is not a lifestyle choice but is how you are born– persons of faith can understand why religion must no longer be misused to justify hostile attitudes and actions toward LGBT people

      May 13, 2013 at 6:10 pm |
    • fred

      UhOh
      I would love for someone to show me how they arrive at that conclusion. This would bring a great deal of peace to me and many troubled people I see on a regular basis. People love a church that sweeps sin under the carpet. We can have our carnal desires and our cake too.

      May 13, 2013 at 6:22 pm |
    • fred

      .

      There are 350,000 congregations in the U.S. 263 is not a significant number.

      May 13, 2013 at 6:30 pm |
    • You're an asswhole

      " People love a church that sweeps sin under the carpet. We can have our carnal desires and our cake too.'

      Why do you steal other peoples handles to make your stupid comments?

      May 13, 2013 at 6:33 pm |
    • fred

      .

      God allows bigots to reveal themselves so that they can turn from their wicked ways. The problem is not the Bible or calling sin sin. The problem is human nature with its ugly tribal side that picks on them vs us. This is also exploited by politics and misguided Christian leaders. That does not mean the Bible is wrong.

      May 13, 2013 at 6:34 pm |
    • mama k

      fred – considering that gays haven't even had accessibility to gay marriage in churches for very long the membership of churches that are outwardly gay-friendly is pretty high, don't you think? When you add ELCA and United Church of Christ, you are already somewhere between three and four million members, and there are a lot of independent churches that are very gay-friendly – even quite a few Baptist churches. And there there are some Unitarians. I would suspect that the numbers might grow rapidly reflecting the rapid growth in short time of states adopting gay marriage.

      May 13, 2013 at 6:39 pm |
    • .

      "There are 350,000 congregations in the U.S. 263 is not a significant number."

      That's not the complete number if you actually did research funny how you're ok with being deceitful and lie. There are numerous congregations that have now stated publicly they support gay marriage. That statement explained why they support.

      May 13, 2013 at 6:40 pm |
    • UhOh

      " The problem is not the Bible or calling sin sin."

      Another illiterate Christian, there are many scriptures that point out you should not call out the sins of others.

      May 13, 2013 at 6:42 pm |
    • fred

      .
      I did not bother tor research the number as you said 263 and I simply pointed out that is a small number.

      May 13, 2013 at 6:44 pm |
    • .

      "I did not bother tor research the number as you said 263 and I simply pointed out that is a small number."

      Are you really that stupid you would apply 263 to all other congregations, especially when other churches have been pointed out to you over and over again that support gay marriage. That makes you a liar.

      May 13, 2013 at 6:49 pm |
    • fred

      .
      I know the number is much larger than 263 but I did not make that claim you did. I did not care to argue the number but it is very small. If you want to research and claim there are thousands that you forgot to mention that is up to you. If the number is wrong it makes you the liar not me because it is your number.

      May 13, 2013 at 6:59 pm |
    • .

      "I know the number is much larger than 263 but I did not make that claim you did. I did not care to argue the number but it is very small. If you want to research and claim there are thousands that you forgot to mention that is up to you. If the number is wrong it makes you the liar not me because it is your number."

      See how Christians twist the truth to try and justify their lies and stupidity this is a great example of it. Your post about the 350,000 congregations was deceitful and a lie. You have been proven to be deceitful and a liar when you use numbers on this blog. You have to confess your sins or rot in hell.

      May 13, 2013 at 7:03 pm |
    • fred

      mamma k
      I belong to a gay friendly church but we still make it clear the Bible says carnal desire is sin, homosexuality (not orientation) is sin and marriage is between a man and a women.
      Some gay members have relocated to a different church that offers gay marriage as soon as it becomes legal.

      May 13, 2013 at 7:07 pm |
    • .

      "the Bible says carnal desire is sin, homosexuality (not orientation) is sin and marriage is between a man and a women."

      John

      Some argue that since homosexual behavior is "unnatural" it is contrary to the order of creation. Behind this pronouncement are stereotypical definitions of masculinity and femininity that reflect rigid gender categories of patriarchal society. There is nothing unnatural about any shared love, even between two of the same gender, if that experience calls both partners to a fuller state of being. Contemporary research is uncovering new facts that are producing a rising conviction that homosexuality, far from being a sickness, sin, perversion or unnatural act, is a healthy, natural and affirming form of human sexuality for some people. Findings indicate that homosexuality is a given fact in the nature of a significant portion of people, and that it is unchangeable.

      Our prejudice rejects people or things outside our understanding. But the God of creation speaks and declares, "I have looked out on everything I have made and `behold it (is) very good'." . The word (Genesis 1:31) of God in Christ says that we are loved, valued, redeemed, and counted as precious no matter how we might be valued by a prejudiced world.

      There are few biblical references to homosexuality. The first, the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, is often quoted to prove that the Bible condemns homosexuality. But the real sin of Sodom was the unwillingness of the city's men to observe the laws of hospitality. The intention was to insult the stranger by forcing him to take the female role in the sex act. The biblical narrative approves Lot's offer of his virgin daughters to satisfy the sexual demands of the mob. How many would say, "This is the word of the Lord"? When the Bible is quoted literally, it might be well for the one quoting to read the text in its entirety.

      Leviticus, in the Hebrew Scriptures, condemns homosexual behaviour, at least for males. Yet, "abomination", the word Leviticus uses to describe homosexuality, is the same word used to describe a menstruating woman. Paul is the most quoted source in the battle to condemn homosexuality ( 1 Corinthians 6: 9-11 and Romans 1: 26-27). But homosexual activity was regarded by Paul as a punishment visited upon idolaters by God because of their unfaithfulness. Homosexuality was not the sin but the punishment.

      1 Corinthians 6:9-11, Paul gave a list of those who would not inherit the Kingdom of God. That list included the immoral, idolaters, adulterers, sexual perverts, thieves, the greedy, drunkards, revilers, and robbers. Sexual perverts is a translation of two words; it is possible that the juxtaposition of malakos, the soft, effeminate word, with arsenokoitus, or male prostitute, was meant to refer to the passive and active males in a homosexual liaison.

      Thus, it appears that Paul would not approve of homosexual behavior. But was Paul's opinion about homosexuality accurate, or was it limited by the lack of scientific knowledge in his day and infected by prejudice born of ignorance? An examination of some of Paul's other assumptions and conclusions will help answer this question. Who today would share Paul's anti-Semitic attitude, his belief that the authority of the state was not to be challenged, or that all women ought to be veiled? In these attitudes Paul's thinking has been challenged and transcended even by the church! Is Paul's commentary on homosexuality more absolute than some of his other antiquated, culturally conditioned ideas?

      Three other references in the New Testament (in Timothy, Jude and 2 Peter) appear to be limited to condemnation of male sex slaves in the first instance, and to showing examples (Sodom and Gomorrah) of God's destruction of unbelievers and heretics (in Jude and 2 Peter respectively).

      That is all that Scripture has to say about homosexuality. Even if one is a biblical literalist, these references do not build an ironclad case for condemnation. If one is not a biblical literalist there is no case at all, nothing but prejudice born of ignorance, that attacks people whose only crime is to be born with an unchangeable sexual predisposition toward those of their own sex.

      May 13, 2013 at 7:11 pm |
    • fred

      .
      How about a simple verse John missed:
      Jude 1:6-8
      New International Version (NIV)
      6 And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their proper dwelling—these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day. 7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.

      8 In the very same way, on the strength of their dreams these ungodly people pollute their own bodies, reject authority and heap abuse on celestial beings.

      May 13, 2013 at 7:33 pm |
    • kim

      Fred, I have read your bible and just want to remind you that it is 2,000 year old culture that it addresses.

      May 13, 2013 at 7:42 pm |
    • Saraswati

      @fred,

      "I belong to a gay friendly church but we still make it clear the Bible says carnal desire is sin, hom.ose.xuality (not orientation) is sin and marriage is between a man and a women."

      No one but your other very sheltered buddies considers that "gay friendly". It's like saying your town is Christian-friendly as long as no one actually prays or that your business is minority-friendly as all as all non-whites agree not to bear children. If you go around using a term like "gay friendly" with your own made up definition you just sound like your trying to be an ass.

      May 13, 2013 at 7:44 pm |
    • fred

      kim
      The truth does not change if it is truth. I am not picking on you and the Bible is not picking on you over any particular sin. Jesus made it clear to hate or think negative thoughts towards another is sin and all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. We are all in the same boat where the plan is one of redemption for all. You cannot redeemed if there is nothing to be redeemed from. The Bible just points out how far from God we have drifted and sin in our lives is a good warning signal. A persons need for God is only apparent when you are ready i.e. heart open to what God wants for you.

      May 13, 2013 at 7:52 pm |
    • fred

      Saraswati
      I was replying to mamma k who used the term gay-friendly and wanted to stay in context.
      Yes, I never use that term. We are frank about the Bible's position but promote the theme of love your neighbor. We believe that one must come to God first and unless that happens there is no need to beat someone over the head regarding sin.

      May 13, 2013 at 8:01 pm |
    • Science

      See..............MOM AND DAD DID IT !!!.................fred .............not the red horn-y devil

      Scientists Identify Why Some Fathers Are Left Holding the Baby

      Mar. 12, 2013 — A century old mystery as to why, for some animals, it's the father rather than the mother that takes care of their young has been cracked by researchers at the University of Sheffield.

      http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/03/130312121842.htm

      May 13, 2013 at 5:57 pm | Report abuse | Reply

      Science

      From another thread............

      But Sara..................the POLITICIANS...............military and police forces should know the information and understand IT !

      http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/05/11/my-take-gay-christian-is-not-an-oxymoron/#comments

      May 13, 2013 at 8:05 pm |
  8. soni

    Great post. Sad to see so many unintelligent comments here... for Christianity, against it or for/against the LBGT community.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:36 pm |
    • Basically

      People who write so poorly should not accuse others of being unintelligent.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:38 pm |
    • lol??

      Communes and demobocracy
      Go together like a ______________________
      You can't have one without the other.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:42 pm |
  9. Knights Who Say

    NI! NI! NI!

    May 13, 2013 at 2:32 pm |
    • Doc Vestibule

      Ekke Ekke Ekke Ekke Ptangya Ziiinnggggggg Ni

      May 13, 2013 at 2:37 pm |
    • the Knights who say "Ekky-ekky-ekky-ekky-z'Bang,zoom-Boing, z'nourrrwringmm"

      We are now no longer the Knights Who Say "Ni"!

      May 13, 2013 at 2:37 pm |
    • Akira

      Bring me a shrubbery.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:43 pm |
  10. Doc Vestibule

    Regarding The King James New Testament

    The King James NT was completed in 1611 by 8 members of the Church of England.
    There were no original texts to translate. They oldest manuscripts in existence were written down hundreds of years after the last apostles died. There are over 8000 of them, with no 2 alike.
    The KJV translators didn't use them, anyways. They instead edited previous translations to create a version the King would approve.

    So the Word of God is a book edited in the 17th century from 16th century translations of 8000 contradictory copies of 4th century scrols that claim to be copies of lost letters written in the 2st century.

    Ref: http://bit.ly/MbXj7Z, http://bit.ly/Mymb9

    May 13, 2013 at 2:32 pm |
    • lol??

      One of the main themes is YOU are a dirtbag dustball that continually practices dustballism. Get it Doc??

      May 13, 2013 at 2:38 pm |
    • G to the T

      And having nothing substansive to say... lol?? reverts to gibberish...

      May 13, 2013 at 3:44 pm |
    • Mike from CT

      Please explain, " 8000 contradictory copies of 4th Century scrolls that claim to be copies of lost letters written in the 1st Century"

      because your source doesn't he just as.serts it, pointing to the same two references.

      Also, in your opinion, if we were to loose the original Const.itution in the National Archives, would we start from scratch or would we be able to recreate the doc,ument from all the different manuscripts? How much more with over 5000 manuscripts.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:58 pm |
  11. faith

    i c sambo is wurkin hard 2day

    May 13, 2013 at 2:29 pm |
  12. joep222

    1 John 3:8-9 Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil. (9) No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God.

    2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come.

    You cannot, cannot actively, willfully, habitually live in a lifestyle of sin and condone sin and say you know Christ Jesus. If you do so you are a walking contradiction.

    By the way, Tony Campolo is a false teacher and should be disregarded.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:26 pm |
    • Me

      Not true at all. People are born again when they are addicted to something, it doesn't necessarily go away the same day. Do you ever go over the speed limit? Do it more than once during a week? If so then by your definition, you are breaking God's law habitually..

      May 13, 2013 at 2:33 pm |
    • RJW

      @joep222:

      Somebody die and make you God? If not then your opinion on who and who cannot have a relationship with Him is irrelevant. And I like how you throw that little caveat in that the person is a false teacher. Don't agree with it so he is not worthy. I would question your Christianity as much as you would question the Christianity of a gay person. You are a hypocrite and a disgrace to the religion.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:34 pm |
    • Zippy

      Ah, but Jesus said you sin everyday, so by his words and your standards, you are every bit as doomed as gays, maybe worse: Jesus no doubt would take a dim view of people who sin, repent, then do the same sin again and again and again.

      It's all part of that illogic that is religion.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:34 pm |
    • WASP

      @joe: "for the devil has been sinning from the beginning"
      wanna hear a funny joke? ...................god made the devil that way. XD
      jokes on your god for failing to make a perfect creature; he failed with the angels and failed with us.

      " is a false teacher and should be disregarded"
      and whom are you to say who should and shouldn't be listenned to? are you god's voice on earth? do you have god's magic underwear on your head to grant you knowledge of things we mere mortals don't?
      if not then get back in line! lmfao

      May 13, 2013 at 2:35 pm |
    • Joe

      "You cannot, cannot actively, willfully, habitually live in a lifestyle of sin and condone sin and say you know Christ Jesus. If you do so you are a walking contradiction."

      All Christians are sinners and live in sin every day and you are no different. Think about these abominations and how many in your church do them including you. When you buy those cheap clothes made in Bangladeshi you are supporting "Oppression of others, particularly the poor or vulnerable" .

      Unclean things (Lev. 7:21) ; Cheating (Mic. 6:10) ; A proud look (Pro. 6:16-17) ; A lying tongue (Pro. 6:17; 12:22) ; Hands that shed innocent blood ((Pro. 6:17) ; A wicked scheming heart (Pro. 6:18) ; A false witness that speaks lies (Pro. 6:19) ; A sower of discord (Pro. 6:19) ; A false balance or scale (Pro. 11:1) ; The proud of heart (Pro. 16:5) ; Justifying the wicked (Pro. 17:15) ; Condemning the just (Pro. 17:15) ; Refusing to hear the law (Pro. 28:9) ; Wearing clothes of the opposite sex (Dt. 22:5) Re-marriage of former companions (Dt. 24:1-4) ; Cheating others (Dt. 25:13-16) ; Making images/idols (Dt. 27:15) ; Eating unclean things (Isa. 66:17) ; Robbery (Ezek. 18: 6-13) ; Murder (Ezek. 18: 6-13) ; Adultery (Ezek. 18: 6-13) ; Oppression of others, particularly the poor or vulnerable (Ezek. 18: 6-13) ; Violence (Ezek. 18: 6-13) ; Breaking vows (Ezek. 18: 6-13) ; Lending with interest to a brother (Ezek. 18: 6-13) ; Lying with a menstruous woman (Ezek. 18: 6-13)

      May 13, 2013 at 2:38 pm |
    • What IF

      joep222,

      So, the guy(s) who wrote under the name of "John" and Paul of Tarsus could be "false teachers" too, you know... not a single 'supernatural' thing that they said has been verified.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:39 pm |
  13. Cluckles the Boneless Chicken has a Bad Day Playing Football

    "Gay Christian" an oxymoron?

    Gay is the "oxy" part, and Christian is the "moron" part.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:24 pm |
    • LMAO!

      LOL!

      May 13, 2013 at 2:25 pm |
    • lol??

      The wurld is Boolean and yer thinkin' dialectic. You were taught to the test.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:28 pm |
    • lol??

      I have so much trouble making sense that I qualified for handicap license plates.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:30 pm |
    • Me

      "Oxy" meaning they act like an animal?

      May 13, 2013 at 2:35 pm |
    • Hrothgar

      "Oxy" meaning they allow oxygen to go to their brains, unlike Christians.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:43 pm |
  14. Darryl

    Gay and Christian, how do you reconcile the two? For all the atheists out there, Christians really don't care to hear your opinion on the topic, but we will continue to pray for you to find faith in the one true God that loves you.

    My opinion on Gay and Christian is that there is no different than beig an adulterer, a thief, a murderer or a liar and Christian. All go against the Bible, but the one's I listed are axctually a part of Gods own words ... the 10 Commandments.

    The most important thing to remember is that we have all come up short in the eyes of God, but he loves us anyway. It is duty to try our best to live the life God expects of us and do our best to follow his laws. Most of all, above all else, we must have faith in God!

    May 13, 2013 at 2:12 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      sorry.....not gods words but the words of mere mortals over long periods of time, then edited by more men over more years....learn the history of the bible please.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:15 pm |
    • IrishinToronto

      Fine, pray all you want, just please stop telling us about it. We don't really care to hear your opion either, so if you promise to stop telling you yours, we'll stop telling you ours? Deal?

      May 13, 2013 at 2:17 pm |
    • Science

      And the red devil that is part of the deal !

      Not for me though.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:17 pm |
    • sam stone

      "For all the atheists out there, Christians really don't care to hear your opinion on the topic"

      Then don't come to public forums

      "but we will continue to pray for you"

      we will continue to think for you

      "to find faith in the one true God that loves you."

      the one who set up the entrapment to begin with?

      May 13, 2013 at 2:18 pm |
    • ReligionIsBS

      Nobody cares what your hate group thinks. God is dead. He has been for some time now. Funny how he used to show up all the time, now we just get bible thumpers like you rambling on about the nonsense in a 2000 year old book written by goat herders.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:19 pm |
    • tallulah13

      The whole christianity thing is moot, because there is no evidence that your god, or any god, actually exists. I have no problem with people who believe this nonsense arguing what their god thinks, but it has no bearing on reality, and it certainly should have no bearing on the laws of this nation.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:19 pm |
    • ..

      Doesn't quite matter if you approve of atheist opinions OR gay people. Notice that being gay isn't one on the 'big 10.' Shove your prayers up your ass – they're not effective OR needed, you condescending twit.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:20 pm |
    • Tom in ATL

      @"religion:... " What is your proof?

      When exactly was the Bible introduced with all these lies? Would the people of that time have believed it if it was all stories and lies? Was Jesus a real person? Did the thousands of people who saw him after his resurrection really see him? Or did they all lie? Read some of the Bible and you'll see it's pretty amazing. And GOD may just change your opinion.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:22 pm |
    • Perfect evidence of Christian closed-mindedness

      "Christians really don't care to hear your opinion on the topic"

      May 13, 2013 at 2:22 pm |
    • lol??

      The A&A's made the gubmint a god. It has variable winds and doctrines.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:22 pm |
    • Ken

      The 10 Commandments are part of the Old Covenant, are they not?

      May 13, 2013 at 2:23 pm |
    • Lucifer's Evil Twin

      "I ain't lookin' for help from on-high. That's a long wait for a train don't come." – Malcolm Reynolds, “Serenity"

      May 13, 2013 at 2:25 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      "What is your proof?

      When exactly was the Bible introduced with all these lies? Would the people of that time have believed it if it was all stories and lies? Was Jesus a real person? Did the thousands of people who saw him after his resurrection really see him? Or did they all lie? Read some of the Bible and you'll see it's pretty amazing. And GOD may just change your opinion."

      LOL tom, I am not the one claiming a god with zero proof. The burden of proof lies with you as you are making the outrageous claim of a god. If you read my post you will see that MANY (over 30) people wrote the book. And afterward, MANY people edited to fit their agendas. Research, its out there. Thousands of people saw him after his resurrection? accroding to who? the person who wrote the passage? hahahaha can you say GULLIBLE? There are millions of people who claim they see god and talk to god in today's world. do you believe them? Why not? And I have read and studied the bible and went to a christian college. I think I have some knowledge of what is in the book. Again PEOPLE wrote the book....not a god. But I am still waiting for your proof that god authored the book. waiting........................

      May 13, 2013 at 2:27 pm |
    • Smithsonian

      " Read some of the Bible and you'll see it's pretty amazing. And GOD may just change your opinion."

      The Bible is primarily a book of religion, a guide to faith. it was not a book of history, poetry, economics, or science. It contains all sorts of literary genre, which are used to teach about the relationship between God and mankind. Even biblical history is edited history: events were chosen to illustrate the central theme of the Bible. The Biblical writers did not pretend they were giving a complete history; instead they constantly refer us to other sources for full historical details, sources such as "The Annals of the Kings of Judah" (or Israel).

      It is therefore not possible to try to "prove" the Bible by means of checking its historical or scientific accuracy. The only "proof" to which it can be subjected is this: Does it correctly portray the God-human relationship? In the best analysis, the Bible is a religious book, not an historical document.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:29 pm |
    • Me

      I agree. Romans 3:23 "For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God"..

      May 13, 2013 at 2:31 pm |
    • RJW

      @Darryl:

      Why is it so hard to reconcile being gay and Christian? I get so irritated when other Christians try to define who can and cannot be a Christian. That is between the person and God. I don't pretend to know what God thinks or doesn't think. What I do know, however, are that Christians who want to define who can and cannot be a Christian give the religion a bad name. It's not your job.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:31 pm |
    • Darryl

      Ever notice that when someone is about to be rich they may ask a few to come with them, but they don't go al nuts when they won't. Then there's the person that's about to be arrested and they try and take as many down with them as possible?

      Why would an atheist even look at this article if they don't believe in God or Christians? Are they looking to try and find an eternal roommate on judgement day?

      Try somone else.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:32 pm |
    • ReligionIsBS

      "When exactly was the Bible introduced with all these lies? Would the people of that time have believed it if it was all stories and lies?"

      Noitce how you could say the exact same thing about the quran or the Bhagavad Gita.

      "Was Jesus a real person? Did the thousands of people who saw him after his resurrection really see him? Or did they all lie?" Were the thousands of people who saw Mithra do the same exact thing lying, or are they both made up stories, or is Mithra really god because his story is almost identical and he came first. Funny how the jews dont beleive the bible, and they live in the area during that time.

      "Read some of the Bible and you'll see it's pretty amazing." I have read the entire bible, and it is by far the biggest piece of filth i have ever read. Not sure you have ever read it, since your view on god seems pretty skewed. It only takes about a half hour of bible reading to see that the god of Isreal is a sadistic monster.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:34 pm |
    • ReligionIsBS

      "Why would an atheist even look at this article if they don't believe in God or Christians? Are they looking to try and find an eternal roommate on judgement day?"

      Because you loonies try to introduce your insanity into our legislature. Do you reall not understand that?

      Judgement day? Is that when your all loving (unconditionally, I may add) father sends people to eternal torture? LOL. How is that unconditional love....with conditions? LOL. You beleive in nonsense.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:36 pm |
    • Tom in ATL

      @Religion... there is no proof. It's called faith.

      Think through my question. Exactly when was the Bible introduced where all these lies would have been accepted? Just makes more sense to me that the 40 authors writing over a 1500 year span in 3 languages rolled out over centuries with no contradictions makes it a pretty amazing book. In fact, who really 'wrote' the Bible? I'm sure you're familiar with 2 Tim 3:16 which gives us a clue. "All Scripture is GOD breathed."

      May 13, 2013 at 2:39 pm |
    • ReligionIsBS

      " Exactly when was the Bible introduced where all these lies would have been accepted? Just makes more sense to me that the 40 authors writing over a 1500 year span in 3 languages rolled out over centuries with no contradictions makes it a pretty amazing book."

      No contradictions? LOLOLOLOLOLOL. Google bible congtradictions and you will see that there are not dozens of contradictions, but HUNDREDS of contradictions in it. So, since there are these contradictions, I suppose you dont beleive anymore.

      "All Scripture is GOD breathed." Then god is in favor of slavery? Exodus 21:20-21, direct instructions on how to beat your slaves.

      And since your too lazy or stupid to google, ill provide you with the first contradiction, found on the very first page of the book. God created light before he created the light source, the sun. BS at its finest.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:48 pm |
    • ReligionIsBS

      Tom,

      please explain why your monster of a god condones slavery.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:49 pm |
    • ReligionIsBS

      Tom,
      Think through my question. Exactly when was the Quaran introduced where all these lies would have been accepted?

      May 13, 2013 at 2:51 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      lol no contradictions? What book are you reading?

      May 13, 2013 at 2:52 pm |
    • Dan

      "Ever notice that when someone is about to be rich they may ask a few to come with them, but they don't go al nuts when they won't. Then there's the person that's about to be arrested and they try and take as many down with them as possible?"

      Thanks for the moronic generalities. Too bad they are total BS and based on made for TV movies i'm sure you love to watch.

      If I am not mistaken this blog is about belief, and what is belief without disbelief? Did you want to come here and find a whole bunch of like minded Christians just patting each other on the back? I doubt it. You came here to express your opinion just like everyone else here. And besides, some of the most vile things said on these boards are said by Christians bashing other Christians for their beliefs. Ever read the posts from evangelical Christians in regards to Mormon Christians?

      "My opinion on Gay and Christian is that there is no different than beig an adulterer, a thief, a murderer or a liar and Christian. All go against the Bible, but the one's I listed are axctually a part of Gods own words ... the 10 Commandments."

      Besides your spelling and logic mistakes, there is a major difference between being gay and all the other sins you mention, that of consent. With adultery you do not have consent of the spouse you promised to be fathful to. With a thief you do not have the consent of the party being robbed. With a murderer you obviously do not have consent of the murdered, and with a liar you do not have the consent of the person being lied to. Now with being gay, you have two adult humans who love each other and want to care for eachother and both consent to the relationship. Also, the concept of consent throws out the slippery slope reasoning saying if we allow gay marriage we will have people marrying dog's or children, of which by law neither can "consent" and enter into a contract therefore it has nothing to do with gay marriage.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:53 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      Ill let "religionisBS" pwn you....i gotta get back to work.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:54 pm |
    • lol??

      ReligionIsBS,

      Please explain when you quit beatin' your wife.

      BBBBBBBBBBBBBbbbbbbwwwwwwwwaaaaaaahahahahahaha

      May 13, 2013 at 2:57 pm |
    • ReligionIsBS

      Im not married, but if I wanted to beat my wife, I would find plenty of justification for it in the bible. Especially in leviticus. Whoever that dude was, he sure hated women. "Women are to be silent in the church and submit fully to their husbands."

      Wait, if i do get married, do I have to beat my wife. Christians, please chime in!

      May 13, 2013 at 2:59 pm |
  15. Jesus was a space alien

    Justin is a member of the Gay biker nazi's for christ.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:11 pm |
  16. Russ

    "Adulterous spouse" isn't an oxymoron, either... but it certainly draws out a problem.

    The problem for the so-called 'gay Christian' lobby is claiming 'gay' is equally a part of one's identi.ty.
    When ANYTHING becomes equally (if not MORE of) your identi.ty than Christ, that's what the Bible calls idolatry.
    If the God you believe in can't call out your sins (ANY of them), then who's the real God?

    May 13, 2013 at 2:05 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      God doesn't call anyone out on anything. Invisible and undetectable beings are invisible and undetectable--even for "calling people out."

      May 13, 2013 at 2:07 pm |
    • Doom Upon You

      "When ANYTHING becomes equally (if not MORE of) your identi.ty than Christ, that's what the Bible calls idolatry."
      Bullcrap. There is nothing in the bible saying anything of the sort. You are a liar and you're going to HELL!

      May 13, 2013 at 2:07 pm |
    • Ken

      Russ
      But are you willing to give up all relationships as well? That's the problem with your argument: Christians who are opposed to gay relationships aren't losing anything for themselves just like the men who opposed women being pastors, or voting weren't giving up anything of themselves either.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:18 pm |
    • tallulah13

      The entirety of christianity is based on letting someone else make the sacrifice. Why in the world would this be different for someone like Russ?

      May 13, 2013 at 2:22 pm |
    • anothermuse

      Well, then and I think he told you this, you should let God call them out. It's not your place or job to do so.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:26 pm |
    • ..

      Russ, no. If there were true equality among all, the question of gender preference wouldn't even come up. Since idiots insist on denying gay people their equal rights to marry, that identifier is put in...and it is a part of their intrinsic being, same as being hetero is part of yours.
      And I think you're assuming that the order of the words in a sentenmce is the same as order of importance. I disagree. When people say they are a conservative Christian, does that mean they worship the GOP over Christ? Nonsense.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:39 pm |
    • Russ

      @ Doom: it's one of the primary themes of the Bible. just google bible verses idolatry.
      Commandment #1: no other 'gods' before me
      Isa.44: idols are dead & can't save you
      Jesus: (Mt.6) no one can serve two masters. you'll hate one & love the other.

      that's the problem: for Christians, Christ is first & foremost our identi.ty.
      As Soren Kierkegaard said: sin is building your identi.ty on anything other than Christ.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:43 pm |
    • Russ

      @ Ken: what is your conception of sin? EVERY Christian is called to leave behind things that we used to think were giving us life but were really killing us. to fail to see that is to minimize Jesus call to everyone else to take up their cross & follow him.

      as the Psalmist says: he turns our dancing into mourning and our mourning into dancing.
      your se.xuality cannot give you life. it's the very thing Jesus is telling the woman at the well (who had been divorced five times and now was with yet a different man). He is the life.

      As he said, "I came that you would have life and life to the fullest" (Jn.10:10). don't miss the strong implicit statement about our prior condition: something less than life to the fullest... if not outright spiritual death (Eph.2:1-3; Rom.3:10-20; etc.).

      May 13, 2013 at 3:49 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      I've been intrigued by the places where sin, in particular the origin of sin, lies in a desire to be "like the most high God" in certain respects reserved by (that) God for itself. So, it mightn't be healthy to build ones life too closely on God's model.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:53 pm |
    • Russ

      @ tallulah: there is no high ground for sacrificial life here. Jesus alone took the ultimate sacrifice. the rest of us are called to follow – not to earn his favor, but to experience the kind of love he showed us.

      On top of what I said to Ken above, "those who cling to worthless idols forfeit the grace that would be theirs" (Jnh.2:8). the idea that we somehow *missing out* by following Jesus' call is to fail to understand that he is offering FREEDOM from the slavery of sin (Jn.8:34). The fact that we all seem to prefer to constantly run back to our chains is only a more awe-inspiring statement at how messed up we are and yet his willingness to pursue us in our spiritual insanity.

      Or as Bonhoeffer put it: "when Jesus calls a man, he bids him come & die." Yes, Jesus died to save us. And the more we get that what we used to call "life" is actually killing us, the more we die to it & live a new life. "For I have been crucified with Christ, and i no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I live in the body I live by faith in the Son of God who loved me and gave himself up for me" (Gal.2:20)

      May 13, 2013 at 3:53 pm |
    • Bob

      Among the other typical themes of the bible, that Russ the coward conveniently chooses to ignore, are guidances to do murder and other violence. (and hows that evidence search coming Russ? Still nothing. Thought so. ) Fine stuff like this can be found throughout Russ's book of nasty AKA the bible:

      Numbers 31:17-18
      17 Now kiII all the boys. And kiII every woman who has slept with a man,
      18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

      Deuteronomy 13:6 – “If your brother, your mother’s son or your son or daughter, or the wife you cherish, or your friend who is as your own soul entice you secretly, saying, let us go and serve other gods … you shall surely kill him; your hand shall be first against him to put him to death”

      Revelations 2:23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

      Leviticus 25
      44 “‘Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves.
      45 You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property.
      46 You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.

      Note that the bible is also very clear that you should sacrifice and burn an animal today because the smell makes sicko Christian sky fairy happy. No, you don't get to use the parts for food. You burn them, a complete waste of the poor animal.

      Yes, the bible really says that, everyone. Yes, it's in Leviticus, look it up. Yes, Jesus purportedly said that the OT commands still apply. No exceptions. But even if you think the OT was god's mistaken first go around, you have to ask why a perfect, loving enti-ty would ever put such horrid instructions in there. If you think rationally at all, that is.

      And then, if you disagree with my interpretation, ask yourself how it is that your "god" couldn't come up with a better way to communicate than a book that is so readily subject to so many interpretations and to being taken "out of context", and has so many mistakes in it. Pretty pathetic god that you've made for yourself.

      So get out your sacrificial knife or your nasty sky creature will torture you eternally. Or just take a closer look at your foolish supersti-tions, understand that they are just silly, and toss them into the dustbin with all the rest of the gods that man has created.

      Ask the questions. Break the chains. Join the movement.
      Be free of Christianity and other superstitions.
      http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/

      May 13, 2013 at 3:57 pm |
    • Russ

      @ anothermuse: it is a common, especially Western individualistic mindset which fails to understand the communal nature of Christianity.

      As Paul said: "what business is it of mine to judge those OUTSIDE the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside." (1 Cor.5:12-13). That's the problem here: this man is claiming to be a Christian. We are called to love one another enough to speak the truth with love (eph.4:15), call out the speck in one another's eyes (even as we admit we have one in our own) (Mt.7:2-5), and to spur one another on toward love & good deeds (Heb.10:24).

      To be blunt: the God to which you are appealing has commanded Christians to call other Christians out in love.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:58 pm |
    • Russ

      @ ..
      read what I've already written above. The author is claiming to be a Christian – someone who believes the Gospel. That's the same Gospel that calls us to love one another enough to call each other out of bondage.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:59 pm |
    • Russ

      @ TTTOO: if you really want to deeper into that, look up the communicable & incommunicable attributes of God.

      May 13, 2013 at 4:00 pm |
    • Russ

      @ Bob: again you conveniently choose not to read the entirety of the Bible. the NT has a lot to say about HOW those OT practices pointed to Christ... and how he fulfilled all of the ceremonial/cleansing laws.

      for example...
      "For he himself is our peace, who has made the two groups one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, by setting aside in his flesh the law with its commands and regulations." (Eph.2:14-15)

      NOTE: setting aside the law... by his flesh (cross)... the law with its commands & regulations.
      Following the Bible INCLUDES when it tells you the OT was fulfilled in the NT and now it's ALL about Christ.

      May 13, 2013 at 4:04 pm |
    • Russ

      @ TTTOO: you are right to note that God is the only appropriately egocentric being in existence – but wouldn't he be flawed to center himself around something lesser?

      two thoughts in light of that:
      1) the Trinity explodes that notion. whereas every other monotheistic being CANNOT speak of Love as an eternal attribute of God (b/c if there's only ONE, there's no love for another). Instead, as mind-boggling as the 3-in-1 and 1-in-3 of the Trinity is, we are presented with 'perichoretic' love – a love that ETERNALLY the three persons of the Trinity are giving to one another.

      and that's a love that we can emulate.

      2) God is not self-cerntered in the flawed sense that we are (a broken sense of self as the center of existence). it would be better to think of him as God-centered (something we also need to be). the difference here – as i said at the outset – is that he is the only APPROPRIATELY self-centered being in the universe (though w/in the Trinity, we see a constant 'dance' of love & deference).

      NOTE: of all the major religions in the world, Christianity ALONE speaks of God as inherently Love (1 Jn.4) – something taken as a 'given' in all religion by Western society.

      May 13, 2013 at 4:18 pm |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      Russ, knowing good and evil is incommunicable?

      May 13, 2013 at 4:24 pm |
    • Millie

      I love how Russ, who is a hater and a liar, thinks that his god is love, trusting to the lies in his bible to tell him that this is so.

      May 13, 2013 at 4:34 pm |
  17. Hardy

    Here's the oxymorons: "Conservative" Christian. "Republican" Christian.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:04 pm |
    • Darryl

      Interesting view from a Dem or Lib. My father and I are both Conservative and Christians. We both belive with all our hearts in God and follow his laws as best we can as humans. We just happen to belive that the large sums our money and time that we put into our communities and other charitable contributions should be dictated by us .... the people that made the money; not the government waste machine that will fund any charity based on it status as a charity .... even if it was a charity 100% against all things Christian.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:18 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      "We both belive with all our hearts in God and follow his laws as best we can as humans"

      again, not gods laws.....those are words of men nothing more.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:20 pm |
    • Darryl

      Wow, I need a delete key for my post. I must have typed it with my knuckles while reading another article there are so many mis-spelled words!

      May 13, 2013 at 2:21 pm |
    • Darryl

      You can post all you want "religion; a way to control the weak minded", but the 10 Commandments are Gods laws. The Bible is written by many, but the 10 Commandments were written by the one!

      The only weak minded are those that have not found the strength of mind to have faith and want to take other down with them. I'll pray for you to find strength.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:25 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      "The Bible is written by many, but the 10 Commandments were written by the one!"

      Still waiting for your proof of this....otherwise your statement is nothing but speculation....

      May 13, 2013 at 2:28 pm |
    • Darryl

      Yes "religion; a way to control the weak minded" and you will continue to wait for proof because like the man that won't see that his wife is running around on him, you don't want to know the truth. What is your truth? That the Big Bang is how it all began from absolute nothingness? Want to provide me with some proof on that one? I know you can't.

      God is in the hearts of men to those that let him in and none are so lost as those that refuse to see him.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:49 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      God is invisible and undetectable and therefore irrelevant.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:51 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      LOL Darryl......simpleton.

      My truth is that as humans, we will never KNOW what happens when we die. We wont KNOW if there is a god or many gods or no god. When did I ever say that the Big Bang Theory was completely true? Notice that scientific theory can be rehashed in light of new evidence, unlike religion.

      But thank you for your ignorance and putting words in my mouth. Now, still waiting for you to prove your speculative statement. No need to be defensive, just provide the proof and I will be done. But since you cannot, anything you say is speculation. Sorry but it is.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:58 pm |
    • Darryl

      There are none so blind as those that will not see. God is all around you in everything that lives and is and yet you can not see God? We all came from nothingness? That's is your explanation?

      Quiet your mind and heart and listen so that you may hear God. He speaks to each of us ... if we are willing to listen.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:05 pm |
    • Darryl

      "religion; a way to control the weak minded", yes it is proof that you want, but not really. There is no proof that you would accept, but there is proof that you will have ... one day.

      Perhaps I am not the perfect Christian either because I know that the Bible was written by many and it is beyond flawed because it was written by men, but God is all around us and I find that very easy to see. I'm sorry that you can not.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:11 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      "There are none so blind as those that will not see. God is all around you in everything that lives and is and yet you can not see God? We all came from nothingness? That's is your explanation?"

      Please show me where I ever said anything you claim I believe. More ignorance from Christians....Everything is not black and white you know.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:11 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      " yes it is proof that you want, but not really. There is no proof that you would accept, but there is proof that you will have ... one day"

      Oh noooooooooo.....not pascals wager.....quit scaring me.....*shaking*

      May 13, 2013 at 3:12 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      " but God is all around us and I find that very easy to see. I'm sorry that you can not."

      and I am sorry that you are blinded by the words of MEN into thinking that your god is the one true god.....

      May 13, 2013 at 3:13 pm |
    • Darryl

      I don't find anything about God black or white. God is so complicated that God is beyond mans comprehension. The only thing more complicated than God to me is his plan.

      So, if you are looking for proof in some simple terms that we can understand then your arrogance is a true reflection of the arrogance of man.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:19 pm |
    • Darryl

      If you knew me at all you would know that I am never blinded by the words of men. I am one of the biggest skeptic I have ever known. I hated God from the time I was 14 until I was in my late 30's. But, while I don't listen to men, I do now listen to God and he does speak to men, undeserving as I may be. I believe that he speaks to you too and yet you rail against him because you are unwilling to believe that he would find you worth his time. But God does just the same.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:27 pm |
    • Cpt. Obvious

      Evidence need not be simple but must be reasonable. There is no reasonable evidence that implies god belief is a sensible belief.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:29 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      you may not think of your man made god as "black and white" but you obviously think anyone who doesn't believe that your god is the one true god MUST think everything came from no where, or that I believe that the big bang theory is entirely true. Thus you paint me with your black and white brush, a consistency among christians. Try thinking outside the box, that we dont have the answers. we created ones to alleviate the fear of the unknown. If you fear something that every human has had to endure at the end of their lives and need to make up some god and everlasting life to make yourself feel better about dying, I pity you.

      LOL god speaks to you? I think you may be in need of a mental health evaluation. Or in drug rehab. Or both.

      Again, men wrote the book, men edited the book. No god involved.

      I will quit asking you for some proof of your statements because obviously there isn't any.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:39 pm |
    • Darryl

      If there were a mind in the darkness of the nothingness that was, it would be completely unreasonable to think that man would be here along with the rest of the universe when there was nothing to begin with, or any reason for it being. Yet, here you are and the stars in the ski!

      May 13, 2013 at 3:47 pm |
    • Darryl

      No "religion; a way to control the weak minded", I have nevered feared death, though there were times in the past when I would have welcomed it. Glad to see you like to think outside the box ... it's where the answers are found. As you say, the Bible is written and rewritten by man, how can it be true. So are the books of science ... how can they be true?

      Try sitting in the quiet of the woods and looking into your heart and mind and you will find the answers that you seek.

      May 13, 2013 at 3:54 pm |
    • the truth is that most christians are just greedy

      Darryl
      They love to proclaim that the government has no right to show charity to the poor. That generosity must not be legislated; but, must be freely given and is the duty of the religious. “God will provide” and Christians generously support all kinds of charities. The truth is that most Christian charity is just leavings from the table after the righteous have stuffed themselves full. In reality if just ½ the Christians only gave ½ as much as they like to proclaim they do, there wouldn’t be a single poor, hungry or homeless person left in America.

      May 13, 2013 at 4:15 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      " So are the books of science ... how can they be true?"

      I never claimed them to be entirely true...please point out where I said that. Stop putting words in my mouth.

      But at least science can rehash theory when presented with evidence proving otherwise. Cant say the same for religion.

      May 13, 2013 at 4:28 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      I would also invite you to research and learn the definitions of the terms "scientific law" and "scientific theory"......

      May 13, 2013 at 4:30 pm |
  18. Gregory Adamson

    Religion is a game. Some play and some don't.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:02 pm |
    • Tom in ATL

      No. When you've breathed your last breath, you'll be face to face with GOD and He decides the rules.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:10 pm |
    • religion; a way to control the weak minded

      "No. When you've breathed your last breath, you'll be face to face with GOD and He decides the rules."

      Please prove your speculative statement using sources other than the man made bible.

      Thanks.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:17 pm |
    • sam stone

      Tom in ATL.....fvck you and your empty proxy threats, d-bag

      May 13, 2013 at 2:20 pm |
    • tallulah13

      The hollow promises and empty threats of christianity are nothing I want or need.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:24 pm |
    • blakek

      Tom in ATL – I've already been face-to-face with God on several occasions. Oddly enough, She didn't, and doesn't, see things in quite the same terms that you imagine She does.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:41 pm |
  19. JMEF

    Poor Chad the fear and loathing he must have had to put up while visiting his old Mom for her special day.

    May 13, 2013 at 2:02 pm |
    • Science

      That s-ex word funny stuff JMEF !

      May 13, 2013 at 2:15 pm |
  20. hogarth

    Christian ANYTHING is an oxymoron – especially the moron part.

    May 13, 2013 at 1:59 pm |
    • Giant Iron

      You don't have to be a gun. You can be a crazy person with a gun instead, or Superman!

      May 13, 2013 at 2:05 pm |
    • Del

      Great article Justin!

      Hogarth – So anyone who disagrees with you is a moron? Talk about being an intolerant bigot. The LBGT community has been fight against intolerance for so long that they have become what they hate most. I think Justin, the author, would disagree with you.

      May 13, 2013 at 2:10 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.