May 31st, 2013
04:19 PM ET
Baptists plan exodus from Boy Scouts
By Daniel Burke, CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor
(CNN) - For Southern Baptist pastor Tim Reed, it was Scripture versus the Scouts.
“God’s word explicitly says homosexuality is a choice, a sin,” said Reed, pastor of First Baptist Church of Gravel Ridge in Jacksonville, Arkansas.
So when the Boy Scouts of America voted to lift its ban on openly gay youths on May 24, Reed said the church had no choice but to cut its charter with Troop 542.
“It’s not a hate thing here,” Reed told CNN affiliate Fox 16. “It’s a moral stance we must take as a Southern Baptist church.”
Southern Baptist leaders say Reed is not alone.
Baptist churches sponsor nearly 4,000 Scout units representing more than 100,000 youths, according to the Boy Scouts of America.
That number could drop precipitously.
The Southern Baptist Convention, the country’s largest Protestant denomination, will soon urge its 45,000 congregations and 16 million members to cut ties with the Scouts, according to church leaders.
The denomination will vote on nonbinding but influential resolutions during a convention June 11-12 in Houston.
“There’s a 100% chance that there will be a resolution about disaffiliation at the convention,” said Richard Land, the outgoing head of the Southern Baptists’ Ethics & Religious Liberty Commission, “and a 100% chance that 99% of people will vote for it.”
“Southern Baptists are going to be leaving the Boy Scouts en masse,” Land continued.
Roger “Sing” Oldham, a spokesman for the Southern Baptist Convention, emphasized that local congregations make their own decision on the Scouts.
But he, too, said he expects Baptist delegates, which the church calls “messengers,” to voice their disagreement with the BSA's decision to allow gay youths.
“With this policy change, the Boy Scouts’ values are contradictory to the basic values of our local churches,” Oldham said.
Several religious groups with strong Scouting ties support the new policy.
“We have heard from both those who support the amended policy and those who would have preferred it would not have changed,” said BSA spokesman Deron Smith.
Faith-based organizations charter more than 70% of Scout chapters, providing meeting space and leadership, according to the BSA.
“There have been some organizations that have decided not to renew their charters with Scouting," said Smith, "but we can’t quantify the impact of the amended policy."
The National Jewish Committee on Scouting, the United Church of Christ, the Episcopal Church, the Unitarian Universalist Association and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, which sponsors more Scout units than any other faith, all endorsed the change.
The National Catholic Committee on Scouting, which is run with oversight from a bishop, said Thursday that allowing gay youths in the Scouts does not conflict with church teaching. Each bishop will decide whether or not to allow churches in his diocese to charter Scout units, the committee added.
“We ask that Catholic Scouters and chartered organization heads not rush to judgment,” said Edward Martin, chairman of the National Catholic Committee on Scouting.
But the Rev. Derek Lappe, pastor of the Our Lady Star of the Sea Catholic Church in Bremerton, Washington, has already made up his mind.
“I do not feel that it is possible for us to live out, and to teach, the authentic truth about human sexuality within the confines of the Boy Scout’s new policy,” said Lappe.
The priest told CNN affiliate FOX16 that his parish will part ways with the Scouts and develop its own programs.
There may soon be an alternative to the Scouts for social conservatives like Lappe.
John Stemberger, founder of On My Honor, a group that opposed the Scouts’ change in policy, plans to convene conservatives in Louisville, Kentucky, in June to consider forming a new Scout-like group, which could be up and running by the end of 2013.
“Churches and Scoutmasters are looking for leadership and direction,” said Stemberg, an attorney in Orlando, Florida.
A number of conservative religious denominations already sponsor their own groups.
For instance, the Southern Baptists have the Royal Ambassadors, an explicitly Christian program founded in 1908 for boys in first through sixth grade. (A similar group called Challengers equips older boys in “mission education.”)
The name comes from the New Testament, in which the Apostle Paul tells Christians to be “ambassadors for Christ.”
The estimated 31,000 Royal Ambassadors pledge “ to become a well-informed, responsible follower of Christ; to have a Christlike concern for all people; to learn how to carry the message of Christ around the world; to work with others in sharing Christ; and to keep myself clean and healthy in mind and body."
While not as outdoorsy as the Boy Scouts, Ambassadors do camp and play sports, said Land, who was a member of the group during the 1950s. But instead of merit badges for archery and bird study, young Ambassadors earn patches for memorizing Bible verses and mission work.
Southern Baptists said they are preparing for a surge of interest in the Royal Ambassadors at their upcoming convention in Houston.
“We really have an opportunity here to strengthen our RA programs,” the Rev. Ernest Easley, chairman of the Southern Baptist Convention’s Executive Committee, said in a sermon last Sunday, “and to get the boys in a program where they’re going to be protected, where there’s a high moral standard and where they will have an opportunity to learn about camping, missions, evangelism in the local church.”
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.
If the only reason one can give for discrimination is their disapproval then there should be no argument.
I think this post says it best: "Being left-handed is a sin! It's a choice! It's not natural! Left-handed people need to repent and become right-handed or gawd will get them "
The son of a B. preacher I worked with told me, seriously (I am not kidding), that left-handedness is a sign of evil. I asked him to show me the scripture his daddy had interpreted... then I explained what it meant, knowing the context of the times it was written in. By social custom, the left had was reserved for hygiene (wiping yourself) and it is still widely practiced today in less-developed regions of the world where soap and sinks and toilets are rarely found. This really illustrates how literal translations of the bible are often gross distortions of their intent. But a cult that has self-appointed authorities who disdain religious scholarship and the need to know history cannot be trusted to interpret ancient texts. God made a lot of the worlds most creative geniuses left-handed.
The effect of church doctrine and how they use shame leads to something that astonished me when I noticed it in a co-worker....Gay baptists not only hide it (which you would expect)... but in the presence of other cult members they are the most vociferous gay-bashers you'll find anywhere. The hypocrisy and sneaky behavior this cult produces is astonishing. It is a sick organization... really mental.
Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church. – 1 Corinthians 14
Know your place Christian women. Every word of the Bible must be obeyed right?
What a joke!
You bring this up a lot. I think I would advise you as I would any of my Christian friends who struggles with Scripture. When you prayed about this what did God open for you in your mind?
And they still believe this stuff. Taken right from their website:
"A wife is to submit herself graciously to the servant leadership of her husband even as the church willingly submits to the headship of Christ."
This is why Carter left the convention, long after there was any political advantage. These folks are living in the dark ages.
I thought it was the Mennonites who lived in the dark ages?
Try and remember your comments about the Nun's on a bus story were along the lines of they should STFU or leave the church. Obedience uber allem, gesamt.
"Whole truth," as a man, I have you say that you're a sad, lost "lamb of God" on the way to the slaughterhouse. May your chops be as tender as your brain.
The women of the day were disrupting church services by calling out to the goddess Diana. It was so bad that something had to be done to shut them up.
The Bible also expects men to respect their wives. Men are instructed tom love their wife like Christ loves the church. Christianity expects men to love and respect women, which is why nations that have historical ties to Christianity, have more kindness and manners exhibited to women. I always find it interesting when people who scream for tolerance for one group, have none for others. I mean, why do bashers care what Baptists believe as long as they are not harming you?
RE: "Some of you are ignorant to the true structure of a healthy family as God intended it to be."
Yes, the way Blabtists supported slavery and the Klan was part of gawwwwwds plan for creating healthy families. Sure. Gawwwwds love. Sure. Westboro = Taliban = hatred. Denying your church history is the same as lying.
When I joined the Blabtists, they told me a man can discipline his wife. I use a cane on her weekly now. She's better than a robot now.
I hope the women who replied here got permission from their husbands first.
You know it is unfair to judge normal Christians by the sorts of people who attend the Southern Baptist Convention. How would you like to be judged based on your crazy neighbor?
when the 'law' was written that wives must stay at home in the kitchen, barefoot and pregnant, they were not written for modern trailer-park blabtists... they were written for the people of that long-ago day... you know, back when Fred rode his dinosaur to work with Barney Rubble. It's amazing what a literal translation of ancient text can lead to... except when it breeds Westboro-like zealots who can only believe what they do by living in denial... denying that science searches for the truth, for instance or that literal translations that do not hold up to science cannot be correct.
You can tell a bible-worshipping cult-member easily. They qualify their statements with: "The Bible says..." as opposed to saying what God intends. When they do it, they nearly always are twisting some text taken out of context to 'prove' their dogma. Any act that does not pass the golden rule test is not what God intends. if demonizing quaaars at a funeral is something your gawwwwd wants you to do, you aren't even close to passing that test. Hate is not love.
Common sense, church custom, and good principles of biblical interpretation all say that we should not take these verses literally—and almost no one does. Paul is not making a blanket prohibition that says that women can never speak in church. Rather, he was addressing his comments to a certain situation, and his comments are limited in some way. The question is, What are the limits of Paul’s prohibition? In the following paper (see link below and copy to browser), the doctrinal review team examines the context and looks at the details of these verses. -Joseph Tkach
The Bible is not a "joke" as many would like to believe, however, it does contain many inconvenient truths. These truths become more clear as one takes time to seriously study the Bible in its full context.
RE: "the way Blabtists supported slavery and the Klan was part of gawwwwwds plan for creating healthy families..."
And the blabtist racists who broke up black families are the first ones to ridicule them anytime a black man shows up in the news for some crime... truly this is what gawwwwwd wants us all to be like. Hate is love.
Gee...NO WONDER Republicans gravitate toward Christianity!
Jayzus and his band of merry men wuz the original boyz in da scouts. Hatin' on scouts iz hatin' on jayzus. Yew blabtists will burn on the eternal barbecue pit of doom fer that.
Society was much better off that way was the drawback.
Less gangs, crimes, drugs, unwed mothers, dropouts etc, abortions.
Nothing has gotten BETTER for society because of it.
WOW! you guys believe this crap?
Whole Truth – why?! I would never expect my wife and daughters to live this way.
BTW, Whole Truth – aren't you speaking out now?
Once again, like millions of others, you take a verse out of context and run with it. If you did your homework, you'd know that Paul was writing to a particular church in Corinth, that was being disrupted, during service, by women. It was a localized situation and was addressed as such at the time. The Bible is made plain to those who believe, but is made foolish to the wise and prideful.
Soon, technology will allow us to create perfect little robot helpers (anatomically correct too). Then your cult's wimmin will have to marry outside the church. I worry about the implications... for normal society having to fit you in.
I stay out of Blabtist 'churches' (a simple cult allergy) so was not aware they misconstrued the instruction to the Corinthian church on how to deal with a few obnoxious women. Surely blabtists have misused their self-appointed 'authority' to demean the role of women in the church? Wow. Sucks for them I guess. Who would want a robot instead of a wife?
re: "I have you say that you're a sad, lost "lamb of God" on the way to the slaughterhouse..."
Why worship a vindictive gawwwwwd when a loving one is waiting with open arms? Why feel glee at the thought of someone suffering eternal torment? Why worship a gawwwwd that threatens you to do so? Your cult has it bass ackwards. An innocent child could see that.
If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods …do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him.
– Deut 13:7-12
Get to work Christians. Every word of the Bible must be obeyed right?
What a joke!
I would suggest reading the entire chapter. It refers to your own prophets. As in the prophets of the tribe of Israel. This verse does not refer to everyone, but a very specific case.
Dyslexic doG – You must be a very funny person since you point out so many "jokes", however, I did not know that being dyslexic also included taking Bible verses out of context.
GEE..I never KNEW that early Christians were "Jihadists". I wonder if they lived today, would they be able to get through screening at an airport?
Wow, it is sad to see these people quoting verses, when they don't even understand how to associate context. To clarify, these random verses only show your ignorance Dyslexic. For the people that understand context, they are interesting verses which have or had some significance to someone or some group.
If I wanted to, I could pull out random sentences from any book showing that we are to kill. You are simply doing something comparable to what a 10 year old could think up.
SL – that would be fine if any 2 groups of christians could decide which ones are to be taken literally, which are to be taken figuratively, some ONLY applies to the jews in a certain time/place. Fact is, there is no consensis so how can there every be a "true" interpretation of the texts?
I'm LOVING this. Their own hate is destroying scouting. Yeah, 12 year old kids want to earn badges for memorizing bible verses. Way cool, Baptists, enjoy the hate, 2016's gonna make 2012 look like a cakewalk.
yep, I'm sure all those Baptists are non-sinners and perfect.
Should straights hide their orientation, too? Why not? It's no different. It's not a perversion. It's a natural behavior found in over a thousand other species. Why does it bother you so much that you have to pretend it's wrong?
RE: "No, but at least Baptists can admit their wrongdoings are sins. .."
I think what you're trying to say here is that blabtists gleefully tattle on the sins of others (apparently their gawwwwd gives extra points for being sanctimonious and a tattle-tale) and that they admit their wrongs if the get caught. Is that what you meant?
Bless you for being honest enough to not say that they actually do admit their wrongs..
Pointing out the failings of others is what jeeezus commands us to dew. Gawwwd also wants us to feel glee at the thought of others being eternally tormented. I just love my gawwwwwd.
This is a good thing. Yes, a good thing indeed.
Absolutely a good thing indeed.....young children should not be corrupted by immoral, religious dogma.
I agree with you both. I don't want my children to be associating with Southern Baptist children.
Why, because it'll make your Scoutmaster job just SO much more enjoyable? No more having to filter through all the kids to find just the right ones.
We are becoming a divided country. Whatever happened to Morals and decency.
Gays have none. That much is for sure.
People decided to set their own morals. Unfortunately, they can set the bar anywhere. For some groups it means a very low bar. For others it means sticking to Gods teachings. Personally, I only see this country descending into a pit of chaos and ruination, similar to old Rome. Our government is corrupt (both sides), morality is being redefined as something twisted, and people are now re-writing our own history books to eliminate any reference to God. Read Revelations, are we close?
billfitt, you really are a stupid person, aren't you? What is "immoral" about homosexuality? It's not "immoral" anymore than is being straight. It simply isn't. You choose to believe it is because you find it "icky" so you use your bible as an excuse. You don't seem to have any problem accepting divorce and remarriage, do you? No, because that would mean you'd have to disown your own relatives, wouldn't it?
You're going the way of the dinosaurs, bub.
Can you find even ONE negative consequence of gay marriage in ANY place where it's now legal? Go ahead and post it with your sources, you azz.
RE: "Galactus93...We are becoming a divided country. Whatever happened to Morals and decency."
Baptists don't believe in evolving.
But seriously, dividing relatives, neighbors, congregations is how they get the attention of like-minded haters. The church always does it when it desperately needs to recruit new members. They have quotas to fill. Seriously... QUOTAS. It's all about the money and body-counts. Sick organization. If you think they don't use media to drum up business and spread hate, I have one word: Westboro.
Finally are we getting the religions out of the Boy Scouts? When I was in Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts 50+ years ago OUR (not all) scout troops had nothing to do with religions. It wasn't about that. Of course in recent times religions of all flavors have tried to cleave their way into the scouts.
You didn't say "I promise, on my honor, to do my duty to God and country"?
The Scouts was an organization founded on Religion and love of country. Christianity to be precise. If God wasn't the cornerstone of your troop, then you weren't a true Scout.
What makes you think god doesn't want gays in this world? If you're a christian, don't you believe he made everything, knows everything? If that's the case, why did he create gays? Just to give you something to hate? You are idiots.
So why did he also create murderers, rapists, and thieves? Figure that out and you'll have your answer.
Unconditional love is not something you'll find in a business disguised as a church. In this cults dealings there are always strings attached, people are things like game-pieces, and you aren't lying or cheating if you don't get caught. Love and ethics don't exist there... just appearances for advertising purposes.
RE: "CurmudgeonTx...The Scouts was an organization founded on Religion and love of country. Christianity to be precise. If God wasn't the cornerstone of your troop, then you weren't a true Scout..."
Well that's yer Texas-sized view of the world (where Christianity is the "official American religion" too)... but there is a great big ole country outside the narrow limits of Texas-approved thinking. Take that white hood off yer eyes and see for yerself.
bullho nkey says:So why did he also create murderers, rap ists, and thieves? Figure that out and you'll have your answer.
So you agree he created such criminals? Good to know that you don't believe in "free will," bull d!ck.
Bu-bye. Don't let the door hit you in the azz on you way out. Nice kind of "christians". Jesus would love the way they are mangling that "love your neighbor" thing.
Your "love thy neighbor" thing has an entirely different meaning.
"Love one another as I have loved you" is not a statement that has much room for interpretation. Nor does it need to.
Hypatia, you completely do not understand the point behind "love thy neighbor." Look at examples in the Bible of how sinners and sin was dealt with. While Jesus had mercy on sinners, there was no acceptance of the sin. Crazy luke-warm "Christians" these days want to accept the sin, so the sinner will tag along.
RE: "SimpleLogic Hypatia, you completely do not understand the point behind "love thy neighbor." Look at examples in the Bible of how sinners and sin was dealt with. "
She's talking about a variation of the golden rule. If your cult didn't worship revenge, and focus on that and excluding love, you would recognize that. Save your 'wisdom' for your cult and shut your pie hole.
Exactly! Way to help the kids by creating bigotry because you're "uncomfortable" with others. 2016's a-comin', tick-tock, tick-tock, Southern Baptists.....:)
Please help a very confused person (me) with answers to these questions:
How do Christians know which passages of the Bible need to be obeyed and which can be ignored?
What is the % of the Bible that must be obeyed and what % can be ignored?
Who decides which parts that once were true and the word of God, are now no longer true and no longer the word of God?
It has to be all or nothing doesn't it? Either obey every line of the bible as God's word, or else admit that some lines can be ignored, and then the entire book is of dubious value. If some lines, in fact MANY LINES can be ignored, then how can people be so sure about the anti-gay references? Seems like many people are just using the bible to justify your own bigotry.
Didn't you post this yesterday? Di you try any of the suggestions?
I did, and I still don't have any answers that make sense.
People said not to concentrate on any lines in particular but just go with the general feel of the Bible. This makes no sense to me because in the next breath they cherry pick the one or two lines that say gay is bad ... the irony is palpable!
That's are great questions... that's part of the reason I fell apart from my church. Don't get me wrong, I still believe in God. But I believe God will judge me and others for the impact we've left on this earth. The bottom line is He wants us all to get along and be civil with each other, help each other, love one another. These people are using the Book for the opposite. I left my church because I was tired of being surrounded by hypocrites. I saw adulterers giving advice on marriage. I knew people cheating on their taxes, yet were against stealing. And most disgustingly, I saw racists spreading the word of God. I'm done with religion. I will however teach my kids to follow the true message, and that's to be the best person you can be. Help others and respect others, no matter what differences you may have. And most importantly, I will teach them to love life because life is precious.
Well, I wouldn't worry about what other people represent. There could be a communication issue between you and them. I think it's more important that it speak to you personally.
Well, if you actually read it, and you've gone to school in America, you would understand that one line is not context. The first half of the Bible is historical, the second is the religious part, for the most part.
Dyslexic doG – Jesus said in John 8:32: "Then you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.” He is the Truth and can set you free – IF you really want to be. You say you are confused, but do you REALLY want understanding and peace? Do you even own a Bible? You obviously need help, but there are many avenues to receive that help if you really want it. Just ask him for it. If you do so sincerely, you will be surprised.
Hopefully they plot an exodus from the entire country....that would be the next logical step right?
The problem is realistically, who would want them?
Agree....Jesus died for gays, just like he did everyone else. The baptist church is in no way Christian nor teaching the love the Jesus did. If your church says other humans aren't as good as another, you need a new church.
Ha-Ha! AMEN 🙂
Jesus died for sinners that they may REPENT. Which means apologize to Jesus and whomever else was harmed by your actions if anyone, and do your best not to repeat the sin. Being OPENLY gay means you are proud (one of the deadly sins) of your sins and will continue to sin without remorse. If you have that mindset, you cannot be a Baptist in heart.
Baptists do not preach that they are better or sinless. Where do you people get this stuff? What they preach is that certain things are wrong according to God. The message is love the sinner and hate the sin. There is a difference between the two.
Ah yes – " love the sinner, hate the sin. "
A concept that contemporary Christians stole only to ignore it on a daily basis.
Since when does "loving" someone mean casting them out? Really, did you get a degree in "Rationalizing"?
With Baptists teaching women are second class citizens subordinate to their men folk.. its a good thing this hate and backward religion is separating itself from BSA.. Once the Baptists were taken over by fundamentalist crazies.. i quit being a Baptist.
It is a good thing you dropped from the Southern Baptist church as lying is intolerable. They will still allow you to be in the church, but you will have to repent from the lies you spew.
I'm not a baptist, but you must REALLY be old and stew pid if you believe those lies. Pathetic.
Bubba-tists have such a high turnover rate because of their ultra-conservative-dark-ages view of women that they had to attack something that would really appeal to the knuckle-dragging public: quaaaars!
My neighborhood blabtist church claims that husbands can discipline their wives. I cane my wifey every few days. She's better than any robot could ever be. Who needs robots when thar's wimmins.
yeppers. Hate. It's not fer ever-body. Just the chosen ones.
RE: "It is a good thing you dropped from the Southern Baptist church as lying is intolerable.."
That's what blabtist SAY. What they LEARN is: You ain't lyin' or cheatin' if you don't get caught. Brazen lying is an artform they cherish... for example: We don't hate gays... we are just followin' our marchn' orders. Well, that's a big fruckin' lie. Gawwwwd never said to persecute gays just to have a successful membership recruiting drive. Blabtists are so well known for their hypocrisy that they have been ridiculed throughout southern literature. I suspect it stems from believing in a vengeful gawwwwwd that punishes people for not being blindly obedient. Fundamentalist cult-followers are hard to cure.
Good old SB exclusionary mentality. Let them separate- the Scout's will be better off without their dogmatic nonsense and bigotry.
Funny the comments here blasting Baptists are from the very same people that defend nearly every action of the Muslim world....
Uh...except not. If you're going to whine, try to at least be partly accurate about it.
That is a really judgmental and bigoted statement.
Really? Please identify one person here who is criticizing the SBs and previously defended any of the intolerances in the Muslim world. Just one example will be adequate.
all religion is laughably foolish.
Really??? because I don't see any difference between Baptists and Muslims.
Really? Name two of them. I'll look them up and see if you're telling the truth, or I, and everybody else who reads your post will get a big laugh out of an obvious supporter of the Southern Baptists decision is defending their actions to maintain what they consider a high moral code by lying.
It would be kind of like an animal rights supporter at a SPCA march with a sign made out of Panda skin.
What kind of up bringing did you have, didn't your mother tell you to not make things up.
Look at the faces of Westboro blabtsits and tell us what you see in their faces. Is it gawwwwwds love? They are openly showing what most of you are denying exists. At least they aren't hypocrites. They are just evil morons. Your cult is going down fast.
You are using a Strawman argument. It is dishonest. I know your cult justifies obfuscating the truth (for you blabtists that means lying), but the point the comment was making is valid: you are a member of a zealous cult that, like the Taliban, does not serve god though loudly proclaiming to. Do you understand that?
That don't make no sense. You should join our blabtist prayer group. We don't do no thinking stuff.
It seems the same to you, because they both have zero tolerance for anyone with another viewpoint, and are irrationally close-minded. But to them, they are very different, since they know the absolute truth and the other guys dont. What could be more different than that?
Well at least you didn't say people oppose the dogma of Baptist self-taught, self-appointed 'authorities' are all just America-hatin' commies. Maybe you are... wait for it....evolving. Golly.
I suggest that they all wear Brown Shirts, dye their hair blond, and wear blue contacts.
That was precisely my first thought.
So let me get this straight... The Bible tells us to go out into the world to preach the Good News but to not be of the world. So how is this obeying God's Word?
how is it not?
The southun Baptists have written their own version of those particular passages. For them, it says "Go out into the world and conduct interviews of people who look a certain way, dress a certain way, live in particular neighborhoods, and appear to be financially secure to see if they are a good fit for our club. If they pass the preliminary tests, invite them to church where we will continue to conduct internal character examinations in order to determine if they are acceptable for the fold. If any test is failed at any time, treat said person as if you've never seen them before in your life. Amen"
I am guessing you folks don't know there are Black Southern Baptist churches, Hispanic Baptist Churches, and people of all colors and nationalities are welcome within the walls of ANY Southern Baptist church...even my family and I are welcome (Cherokee married to a Korean). You people speak of that which you know not.
The most important mission for a blabtist is to target senile old people who have lots of money... then persuade them that their kids don't deserve any inheritance. Dividing families for church financial gain is what a money-grubbing cult needs to focus on. The second most important mission for a blabtist is to bring in as many bodies as you can. A cult that has nothing spiritually to offer is naturally going to have the highest turnover rate. Appealing to the dumbest people helps some, but not enough to offset the need for high body counts.
Wow...almost an exact recreation of the split that formed the Southern Baptist church to support these folks support of slavery. If their pattern stays consistent I guess we can expect them to recant and apologize in about 150 years.
Maybe they'll just split even further?
IDK, Sara. This would be an iota less hypocritical if they also refused to ally themselves with *any* entity that is guilty of any 'sin'. Which I guess would mean...uh, no one ever again. That sounds like a pretty good idea.
Well said... well said!
Could not have been more poignantly and accurately said!
Nice red-herring you have there.
I wonder what their split was with interracial marriage and Jim Crow laws and the civil rights movement?
I don't know where you're from, but it is clearly a place with no educational opportunities. The support of slavery encompassed THE ENTIRE United States for most of its existence. There were even slaves in Washington D.C. DURING the Civil War, so stop your "only the South encouraged slavery" crock if you don't want to look like a fool.
great insight into a cult that was founded and has thrived on race-baiting hatred. There are so many healthy social outlets for uneducated, unintelligent, people these days... really I don't see any justification at all for this cult to even exist today. People only go "because mah diddy did" I suppose.
RE: "Nice red-herring you have there."
She wrote an excellent analogy, that reveals an important point: this latest gay-bashing is not surprising... your cult has a long history of spreading hatred in the guise of "doin' gawwwwwwds work" . A red herring is used in literature to throw you off the trail. Her comment is the complete opposite of that.
Here's to hoping that the SB churches begin to lose their influence sooner, rather than later. Southern-fried bigotry makes me ill.
They are already losing their influence. Their membership has been declining for quite some time. Unfortunately I grew up in the SB church. Took me many many years to recover.
Yankee bigotry is even worse, since it is so hypocritical when it does not recognize its HUGE part in the slave trade. Most slave traders were actually Yankees btw, and they sure loved those profits and abuse of the slaves whether they owned slaves or not.
RE: "Yankee bigotry is even worse, since..."
Dude, the Civil War ended... some time ago. Try reading a history book that isn't on your pastor's approved reading list. Sheeesh.
Golly you're ignorant!
Sure, sure. It's never a hate thing if you can conveniently slap a 'morality' label on it. Right?
The Scouts will ultimately be better off. The churches doing this don't see how much they're shooting themselves in the foot with anyone who doesn't share their view. Taking a stand like this is not heroic or moral. It's embarrassing.
Being left-handed is a sin! It's a choice! It's not natural! Left-handed people need to repent and become right-handed or gawd will get them and send them to a lake of fire to burn baby burn for all eternity! Because he loves them! The Latin word for "left" is "sinister"! That proves that the debbil is making them do it! Repent you unnatural left-handers before it's too late! Or not....those of us Chosen To Sit At The RIGHT Hand Of Gawd will get an eternal thrill from watching you all writhe in torment, so hey, if you don't Repent, that's ok by us!
Baptists leaving the Boy Scouts making it safe for sane people to join again.
This can't be a surprise to anyone. Maybe the scouts can finally be separated from religion's dominance over them. Right now they've got so many ties to the church that even this small step was a huge battle.
It'd be nice to let my boy join Boy Scouts someday without worrying that I'm setting him up for failure when he doesn't follow the church.
Maybe you could direct your son to one of the thousands of atheist supported scout troops. D'oh!
buckle – I'd planned to try – but it's all about where you live – you don't always have a choice of a few dozen troops and organizations to pick from. So let's not pretend like I can just shop from an Amazon full of options.
The Boy Scouts was formed as a religious organization. They should have stayed that way. Now their numbers will drop as will the money coming in to support them.
I would think a lot of people would be embarrassed by ties to Southern Baptists (not to pick on them in particular, any organized bigotry).
Left the SB Church years ago because of their discrimination against women. If Jesus were on earth today, it would be the evangelicals executing Him for not fitting their mold.
I knew a white couple who already had some kids of their own and wanted to adopt a little black girl. They had already met and thought it would go through and were understandably very upset when it didn't. But what shocked me was how oblivious they were to the fact that their religion might have had anything to do with it. When I pointed out to the father that the social workers might hesitate to put a black chiild with a family who had chosen (not just been born into) a religion founded to protect slavery and with a history of promoting segregation, he was genuinely surprised as it had never occurred to him this might be an issue or might be disturbing to the child as she grew up.
After thinking about it he actually said that he could see that that might have been a factor. Historical guilt may not be fair but it still has lasting repurcussions. And now, as a social worker, would you, knowing a child could turn out to be gay, feel comfortable placing them with parents would would not tolerate their own child as he or she grew up? These are real issues that people struggle with every day.
What about hinduism that supports Casteism as part of it's religion. Where people born to a lower caste are treated worse than animals?
Like your gay liberation army? Talk about bigots!!
"What about hinduism that supports Casteism as part of it's religion. Where people born to a lower caste are treated worse than animals..."
And religions that endorse human sacrifice... Blabtists aren't as bad as them either... therefore, we should all be grateful for Blabtists... is that how your bogus argument goes?