 |
|
|
|
|
September 14th, 2013
08:01 AM ET
Hey atheists, let’s make a deal
(CNN) - Famed atheist Richard Dawkins has been rightfully criticized this week for saying the “mild pedophilia” he and other English children experienced in the 1950s “didn’t cause any lasting harm.” This comes after an August tweet in which Dawkins declared that “all the world’s Muslims have fewer Nobel Prizes than Trinity College, Cambridge. They did great things in the Middle Ages, though.” Dawkins is known for pushing his provocative rhetorical style too far, providing ample ammunition for his critics, and already I’ve seen my fellow Christians seize the opportunity to rail against the evils of atheism. As tempting as it is to classify Dawkins’ views as representative of all atheists, I can’t bring myself to do it. I can’t bring myself to do it because I know just how frustrating and unfair it is when atheists point to the most extreme, vitriolic voices within Christianity and proclaim that they are representative of the whole. So, atheists, I say we make a deal: How about we Christians agree not to throw this latest Richard Dawkins thing in your face and you atheists agree not to throw the next Pat Robertson thing in ours? Now I’m not saying we just let these destructive words and actions go—not at all. It’s important for both believers and atheists to decry irresponsible views and hateful rhetoric, especially from within our own communities. (Believe me. There are plenty of Christians who raise hell every time Robertson says something homophobic or a celebrity pastor somewhere says something misogynistic.) READ MORE: Why millennials are leaving the church But what if we resist the urge to use the latest celebrity gaffe as an excuse to paint one another with broad brushes? What if, instead of engaging the ideas of the most extreme and irrational Christians and atheists, we engaged the ideas of the most reasonable, the most charitable, the most respectful and respected? Only then can we avoid these shallow ad hominem attacks and instead engage in substantive debates that bring our true differences and our true commonalities to light. It’s harder to go this route, and it takes more work and patience, but I’m convinced that both Christians and atheists are interested in the truth and in searching for it with integrity, without taking the easy way out. Pope Francis took a step in that direction this week with a letter in a Rome newspaper responding directly to questions posed by its atheist director and inviting respectful open dialog between nonbelievers and Christians. READ MORE: Why millennials need the church So, yes, Richard Dawkins is an atheist. But so are authors Greg Epstein and Susan Jacoby. So is my friend and fellow blogger Hemant Mehta. So is Sir Ian McKellen. So is ethicist Peter Singer, who may or may not be the best example. And yes, Pat Robertson is a Christian. But so is Nelson Mandela. So is acclaimed geneticist Francis Collins. So is Nobel Peace Prize winner Leymah Gbowee. So is Barack Obama. So is Stephen Colbert. And I'm willing to bet that the same collective groan emitted by millions of Christians each time Pat Robertson says something embarrassing on TV sounds a lot like the collective groan emitted by millions of atheists when Richard Dawkins rants on Twitter. Still, in the end, it’s not about who has the most charismatic or generous personalities in their roster, nor about who has the most “crazies.” It’s about the truth. So let’s talk about the truth, and with the people who most consistently and graciously point us toward it. Rachel Held Evans is the author of "A Year of Biblical Womanhood" and "Evolving in Monkey Town." Evans blogs at rachelheldevans.com, and the views expressed in this column belong to her. soundoff (5,916 Responses)« Previous 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 Next »
Next entry »What makes Jerusalem so sacred?
« Previous entryIt's Yom Kippur, and this goat wants your sins
|
  About this blog
The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.  |
|
|
|
Opinion by Rachel Held Evans, special to CNN
The person who wrote this is an idiot. You can't compare Dawkins and Robertson. Pat Robertson is a doddering old fool who believes gay people give straight people AIDS by using secret razor rings and Dawkins is a respected academic.
Atheism is merely a word used to denote no belief in god or rather gods – as in all of the deities man has made over the eons. As such, I'm interested to hear more on the "evils" you or others prescribe to this lack of belief.
On another point, those criticizing Dawkins seem to lack an understanding of nuance or degrees. Maybe read this to clear things up: http://www.richarddawkins.net/foundation_articles/2013/9/11/child-abuse-a-misunderstanding
Most of us just ignore the trolls.
Trolls that look a lot like Mary Smith.
"and already I’ve seen my fellow Christians seize the opportunity to rail against the evils of atheism."
And just what are the evils of atheism?
mass murder is an evil of atheism
Mass murder is an evil of religion.
There. I fixed it for you.
Nope just hid the Truth like I always do.
You're a fucktard name stealing git who is too dishonest to use his own alias to refute a point and instead justifies their theivery by saying "how can I steal an alias?"
Typical dicieving behavior by a typical lying religie. Asshole.
Just pointing out the errors of my ways, now you have the rest of the story.
Is your god proud of you and the tactics you use? You really don't think you're pulling one over on him, do you? Real Jeeves is right; you're a lying azzhole.
Nonsense.
Mass murder is always evil, and I know of nobody who committed mass murder in the name of atheism.
not in the name of but because they were atheists there was no moral restraint.
God believers who claim to be killing and causing pain for their god are simply labeling their own murderous way "god's will." Just because a religitard claims his evil is moral doesn't mean that it is.
Question: Is it moral for god to allow a place of eternal torture when he could destroy it? God has no morals.
agreed, with the unusual exception of the ussr, perhaps, which didn't actually commit murder in the name of atheism but in the name of power to control....
otherwise, most mass murders– as in by nations or leaders– have indeed been in the name of 1 religion over another. very horrid truth. and the mass murder was wither for 1 religious group or against one. examples, crusades, muslim reaction to, hitler, and lots of others...
For the moment, I am going to ignore the fact that you are using my name as a moniker.
It makes no difference whether a mass murderer is an atheist or not. Religious tyrants have used their religion as justification for their evil. The devout Catholic Adolf Hitler comes to mind, who stated that he was doing a 'Christian deed' by eradicating Jewish people.
of course quoting hitler for truth is like getting a ham sandwich off a side of beef. hitler to those who truly knew him or those that accurately study history was an atheist.
Well, name stealer,
it just so happened that there is nobody left who personally knew him, and who could confirm your assertion. Thus we only have historical records to guide us, and those records speak for themselves. Hitler was Catholic.
By the way, I get why a coward would steal somebody's moniker. But mine is my real name.
Mass murder...LOL...who?go ahead and say Stalin or Mao...you're clueless if that's what you think
As if all the atheists throughout history have caused even a miniscule fraction of needless death & suffering of the Roman Catholic Church, alone!
Atheists appear in many disguises often claiming to be Christian to hide their true intent.
Not aware that a mass murder has ever been committed out of atheism. Please, state an example.
"Mass murder is an evil of atheism" – oh really? Christianity has murdered more people in the name of religion, as has Islam, than atheists ever have or could do in the future. I'm not an "atheist" by the way. The root of all evil is when human beings think they have a monopoly on "truth". Only when all human beings realize that they are not enlightened enough to "know truth", and accept the potential that any spiritual path that makes one a better human being is valid will that root disappear. Frankly I don't see that happening in my lifetime or that of my grandchild either. Truly sad; makes one wonder if there is really any hope for humanity (and don't tell me that all I need is Jesus because 98% of Christians don't get Jesus' teachings anyway).
Countries with a higher percentage of atheists have much fewer murders and ra pes.
Countries that have had atheist dictators have all been subjected to mass murder often in the millions of victims. Historical fact.
Someone finally used my name. HeavenSent is that you? Prayer bot?
Be aware that if/when you all report abuse on the troll, your replies will also disappear. You might not want to spend too much time, thought or typing on them. Blast him quick and severe, if you like, though.
personally I'm rooting for Anubis...
put all of these Christians/Muslims/Jews/Hindus etc where they belong!
where?
huh?
my turn to triumph!
Why do some many people knock religion? Its required for the less fortunate. Also, its one of the best scams in all of history, just wish it would allow a reach around once in a while.
How about, No.
"but I’m convinced that both Christians and atheists are interested in the truth" hahahahaha I laughed for a good 2 minutes at that statement. Christians are not interested in the 'truth'. Isn't religion based on the fact that the 'truth' has already been revealed and you should live according to those truths? What a joke
LOL, right on!
Mary jane? Hmmmmmm
"So, atheists, I say we make a deal: How about we Christians agree not to throw this latest Richard Dawkins thing in your face and you atheists agree not to throw the next Pat Robertson thing in ours?"
Christianity teaches that you should treat others as you would have them treat you, not that you'll do the right thing if they'll agree to do it too. Therefore as a Christian you should need no deal to do this. I have a different deal for Christians to consider: Start living your beliefs and I'll stop thinking you're a bunch of frauds.
Prayer changes things .
Here's how God treated children and NEVER named ONE SIN that the babies and fetuses had done.
(Gen. 7:21) “And all flesh died that moved on the earth, birds, domestic animals, wild animals, all swarming creatures that swarm on the earth, and ALL HUMAN BEINGS”
The one sin common to everyone was continual and only evil minds. Sin had become a genetic deformity that would have destroyed all creation. It was a wise healer who compassionately spared the righteous and cut off the cancer to save the future of mankind.
fake Observer,
You keep coming on here and LYING about your name.
Is that level of honesty the same as most Christians?
Observer is a fake?????????
Since when is an alias a name?????????
Sounds like typical Christian behavior to me, real observer. They take their cue from their god who will kill babies and torture people forever and such.
fake Observer,
Claiming to be me is a LIE.
Is your level of HONESTY the same as that of most Chrisitians?
You understand the point, well enough, fake observer, now, be a good little Christian idiot troll and go lie for your brain virus some more.
Since Observer is without Truth there cannot be a lie and an alias cannot be owned by a person.
fake Observer,
That was a riot. Here's the question you keep avoiding because you are AFRAID to say the truth:
You keep coming on here and LYING about your name.
Is that level of honesty the same as most Christians?
Fake observer, try lying to real observer about how you chose your alias. It's okay, it's just one more lie, and only you and jesus will know.
It's obviously not changing you.
When in Gods grace why would someone want to change?
Why do you steal someone else's name, alias or not? Too dim to think up your own?
LOL
LOL.
putz.
(you probably watch a video screen for 4+ hours a day, eat junk, and ARE FAT! 🙂
The fake Observer here is saying that there is no such thing as "free will for everyone". Those thoughful fetuses had no chance to change their "minds" before they were horribly killed by God.
OOOOOPS!
I guess I'd miss the cancerous mass.
Waiting for your answer.
STUMPED?
Please I'm trying hard to recreate the evil of those days, I want to be sick and demented, I want my mind to be warped beyond repair for ever. I want to destroy all that is true and decent, I want to continue to corrupt even the unborn.
At this point we cannot even be certain that any children were even being conceived. After all Noah's children did not have offspring until after the ark landed.
fake Observer,
Still STUMPED?
Never was.
fake Observer,
Is your LYING typical of most Christians?
Try not to get COMPLETELY STUMPED again. A simple "yes" or "no" will do. No need for more than one word: "yes" or "no".
No, there is no excuse for Pat Roberts and Dawkins doesn't speak for me as an atheist. He deserves any and every criticism he gets. What Dawkins said doesn't relate to any atheist dogma, because there IS NONE. On the other hand, Roberts tends to relate all of his crap to the bible and Christianity, which is why he rightfully so is made fun of by atheists. Dawkins is not a representative of atheists, he is merely AN atheist. He gets what he gets.
Rachel Held Evans is way too naive here, assuming both atheists and Christians seek the TRUTH. No way! Science seeks the truth, religion has faith that it ALREADY has the REVEALED truth. Fundamental Christian believe in a LIE as the foundation of their faith, and irresponsible MAGICAL thinking proceeds from there.
I wonder if we are going to find out something about Mr. Dawkin's personal life in the near future.
Godless Vagabond
Why would we care? If we found out about his personal life, it would no longer be personal, would it?
You mean like when he shared that he and his friends were touched by a teacher, and they didn't think it did major long lasting harm to them? Then he compared that to when his parents emotionally traumatized him by telling him he was going to heII when he was little and he feels like that had more of a traumatic impact on him?
Yeah, he did share something personal and look at what people did with that.
"So, atheists, I say we make a deal: How about we Christians agree not to throw this latest Richard Dawkins thing in your face and you atheists agree not to throw the next Pat Robertson thing in ours?"
A real Christian wouldn't do that even without a deal.
a REAL christian is an oxymoron, no pun intended. Worthless nonsense, you have no soul, death is death. Study the Universe not your iron age textbook for sadism
Asking people to be rational, huh? Well, it's going to be an uphill battle, but I'm willing to try if other people are.
Why do you wait for others to act a certain way to exhibit good behavior?
Dawkins is guilty of the same thing the Harvard President was when he pointed out that biological differences might impact the male-female ratios in engineering and the sciences.
Sometimes scientists are more interested in being realistic than obeying cultural taboos.
Like any other atheist it's who's payin'?? They make great progress during war time with blank checks.
Why do you lie so much?
I'm honestly amused that you think the Harvard president's words were rooted in science. And that Dawkin's words are. You're adorable. Go have your momma give you a cookie.
I know they were, I heard Steven Pinker talk about the meeting where Summers got that information from. Pinker studies biological gender differences. He told Summers, and Summers told the conference, and Summers got ignorant people like you screaming that male and female brains are identical.
The evils of Atheism? What might those be again?
Well, mass murders have been done in the name of eradicating religion. Mexico in the 1930's is a good example.
That's not unique to atheism.
Oh, good question. Probably referring to the godless, conscienceless, lack of regard for accountability of life and life impacting decisions that atheism breeds. People call themselves atheists yet replace the God figure with incredibly fallible, prideful, self promoting scientists who steal money from the general public under the guise of pushing humanity into the next technological phase of evolution. Atheists refuse to believe in having to account to a higher power so as to allow them to feel free to operate without morals, integrity to humanity, and regard for the moral well being of society.
That's probably what she was referring to but I'm just guessing.
Oh look, another Christian bearing false witness about atheists. What a load of BS.
This was the single dumbest, most unintelligent, idiotic comment I've read in weeks (and I read that Trayvon Martin nonsense)
THANKS
Poolwrecker ironically, the very same could be said of religious folk.
"Evil" must be referring to the lack of regard for accountability of life and life impacting decisions that religion breeds. People call themselves 'religious' yet replace the God figure with incredibly fallible, prideful, self promoting prophets who steal money from the general public under the guise of pushing humanity into the nextl phase of consciousness. Religious folk refuse to believe in having to account to their fellow man so as to allow them to feel free to operate without morals, integrity to humanity, and regard for the moral well being of society.
That's probably what she was referring to but I'm just guessing.
Poolwrecker, why do you feel you have to lie to back up your belief in God? And as for stealing money from people, nobody, and I mean nobody, does it better than those who represent God.
"who steal money from the general public under the guise of pushing humanity "
And what happens every Sunday at the end of the sermon in every church world wide.....they stick their fingers in yoyur pocket of course.....your god is supposed to have created the earth ....but he cannot create his own money.
The evils of atheism? Lets' start with 'subjective morality' and its' slippery slope, then make our way towards the progressive liberalism of Christian persecution...
Let's, not lets', its, not its'. You write like a Yeti, alright.
Grammatical corrections are all you have to offer? My Freshman high school can do that.
Christian Yeti,
"Progressive liberalism" usually has "subjective morality" that doesn't support much of the Bible like slavery and discrimination against women, gays, and the handicapped. You are welcome to claim those.
Get a clue. Christians excel at subjective morality. That's part of the reason there are so many forms of Christianity.
The fact that Christians so often tell these kinds of lies about atheists is just more evidence they're frauds.
"That's part of the reason there are so many forms of Christianity."
Ah yes the Christian bible supposedly written by an all seeing all knowing infallible sky daddy ....who writes so poorly that his religion can be interpreted in hundreds of different ways....some book....some sky daddy.
If your morality is based on the Christian Bible your morality is subjective.
God's morality is ALWAYS subjective. "Don't kill"... (three verses later)... "kill every person in that town over there, I want you to have their land that they have worked and lived on for several hundred years." Why? Because god is a "might makes right" kinda guy. Always was and always will be.
On one condition. both of us can make fun of Miley Cyrus. deal?
Whoa. Lots of wisdom in this, and a lot of material to work with there!
You want to call it a wash because Dawkins said something stupid? No deal.
If Richard Dawkins were to say "It appears to me that the sun rises in the east", you can bet full well that within the week some Bible-thumper will be accusing him of being arrogant, hostile, and condescending.
You see how this works, don't you? If they can't find anything wrong with WHAT he says, they jump right straight to b¡tching about the way he says it.
Calm down. When your spirit is separated from your body you will understand. Your life is short. Why not party instead of hating??
This, coming from you, is patently absurd. You are the biggest hater on this blog.
Oh, ooooohh. Socie peer reviewed pressure is never very far beneath the surface.
Idiot. I'm about as conservative as it gets. You just don't disguise your hatred very well.
If he's patting someone one the head and saying it in a arrogant, condescending manner, yes, he will be told that. Tone is everything.