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September 17th, 2013
09:59 PM ET

Rick Warren on guns, God and son's tragic death

By Eric Marrapodi, CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor

Lake Forest, California (CNN) — In his first interview since his son's suicide in April, famed pastor Rick Warren told CNN that he knew his son, Matthew, had bought a gun, dismissed rumors that Matthew was gay and said he doesn't blame God for the tragedy.

"I have cried every single day since Matthew died," Warren said Tuesday in an exclusive interview with CNN.

"But that - that's actually a good thing. Grief is a good thing. It's the way we get through the transitions of life."

Rick Warren and his wife, Kay, founded Saddleback Church in Southern California in 1980, growing it from a small congregation to a multisite megachurch with some 20,000 weekly worshippers.

Warren is also author of the spiritual self-help guide “The Purpose Driven Life,” one of the best-selling books of all time, with more 36 million copies sold.

But even as the Warrens grew in prominence - attending conferences with presidents and prime ministers - their son Matthew struggled with borderline personality disorder and deep depression, they said during an interview with CNN’s Piers Morgan.

The Warrens said they are opening up about their son’s tragic death because they hope to end the stigma of mental illness and save another family from the pain they suffer.

They have slowly returned to the spotlight since grieving in private for five months.

MORE ON CNN: The five things you need to know about Rick Warren

The gun

Matthew Warren visited his parents on the night of April 5, just like so many nights before.

“I had made him dinner,” Kay Warren told CNN. “He laid his head down on the kitchen table and he just said ‘I'm so tired.’ He just said ‘I'm so tired.’”

After a hug from his dad, Matthew left his parents' house and went back to his own. He and his mom began texting, and the conversation veered toward suicide, Kay Warren said.

“I knew it was very desperate. And I also knew he – I knew he had a gun.”

Earlier, Matthew had told his parents he had illegally obtained a gun online - but if they called the police about the gun he would kill himself instantly.

Matthew Warren had tried to legally purchase a gun many times, his family said. Each time he was rebuffed because he had been forcibly admitted to a mental institution, a red flag on a California background check.

“We're grateful that the laws kept Matthew from getting the gun for as long as it did,” Rick Warren said.

When Matthew hit a roadblock buying a gun, he turned to other options.

"He was so desperate to end the pain,” Kay Warren said.

Ten days earlier, Matthew had tried to end his life by overdosing on pills, the Warrens said, one of several suicide attempts in his young life.

Matthew had begged his mother to help him die, Kay Warren said.

“I will do anything to help you live,” she recalls telling him, “but I will not help you take your life.”

The texting between Matthew and Kay Warren went on for hours on the night of April 5.

Then it stopped.

The Warrens headed to Matthew’s house. He did not come to the door. The lights were on, and they decided to leave, worried if they called the police Matthew would make good on his fatal promise.

The next morning they went back to his house. The lights were still on.

This time they called the police.

Rick and Kay Warren stood outside their son’s home sobbing in each others’ arms.

They knew.

A nod from a police officer who inspected Matthew's house confirmed the worst.

“I just hit the ground," Kay Warren said.

God's plan

Matthew had access to mental health care and all the love in the world but not even that could spare him, Rick Warren said.

“If love could have kept my child alive, he'd be alive today, because he was incredibly loved,” the pastor said.

The evangelical Christian said he doesn’t blame God for his son’s death.

“I never questioned my faith in God; I questioned God’s plan,” Rick Warren said. “God isn’t the blame for my son’s death. My son took his life. It was his choice.”

Kay Warren said the family’s faith and community support got them through the past five months. Condolence cards poured in from around the world; 30,000 by Saddleback Church’s count.

In their grief, Rick and Kay Warren said they turned to a familiar source, the Bible.

For Kay Warren, a verse from the New Testament brings comfort, she said. “It says our bodies are buried in brokenness, but they will be raised in glory.”

She recites the verse when visiting her son’s grave.

"Matthew's body was broken. That gun broke his body and he was buried in brokenness. But he's going to be raised in glory.”

GALLERY: Rick Warren over the years

Forgiveness

The Warrens said they struggle with anger that their son died using an illegally obtained firearm.

Before his death, Matthew told his parents he bought the gun online, but wouldn’t tell them from whom.

Investigators said the serial number was filed off when they recovered it from the scene. So far police have not been able to determine who sold Matthew Warren the gun.

“One of the hard things was forgiving the person who sold him the gun,” Rick Warren said. “Because I didn't want to forgive him.”

But the Warrens said their Christian faith, rooted in the belief that their own sins had been forgiven by Jesus, enabled them to forgive the person who sold the gun to their son.

“I don't want to be tied to that person emotionally for the rest of my life,” Kay Warren said.

Slightly more than half of Americans - 53% - think churches should do more to prevent suicide in America, according to a new poll by LifeWay Research, a Christian company based in Nashville.

Nearly half of evangelicals (48%) say people with serious mental illnesses like depression, bipolar disorder and schizophrenia can be cured by Bible study and prayer alone. Sixty percent of Americans overall disagree.

The Warrens said Matthew had access to good health care, but the system sometimes puts obstacles between families and their mentally ill loved ones.

Kay Warren pointed to difficulty families have in getting mentally ill family members help because of laws on patient privacy.

“The right to privacy and that right to autonomy, it's a dance,” she said.
 “I don't have good answers. It's a dance. So we've got to do a better job with that.”

Because the Warrens are conservative Christians who oppose same-sex marriage, rumors circulated about Matthew's sexuality in the days after his death.

The Warrens dismissed those rumors in the CNN interview.

“Well, first, Matthew wasn't gay, " Rick Warren said, "but if he was, we would have loved him unconditionally anyway. It wouldn't have made one difference at all.”

The Warrens said they have tried to stay away from online criticism and the rumors surrounding Matthew’s death so they can focus on his legacy: raising awareness about mental illness.

Hope

Asked why they had not prioritized mental illness earlier, the Warrens said that they did not want to thrust their troubled son into the limelight.

“It was his story to tell,” Rick Warren said.

Now telling Matthew’s story falls to his parents.

They want the world to remember a young man who was “funny, quirky, ridiculously silly.”

On his headstone the family put “compassionate warrior.”

They have established the Matthew Warren Fund to honor his memory. Rick Warren said they will wait a year and then hope to use the funds to help those struggling with mental illness and their families.

The Warrens want to spread the word that even though their story had a tragic ending, “There’s hope,” Kay Warren said. “It’s so important that people know, no matter how desperate their despair, there is hope, and not to give up.”

- CNN Religion Editor

Filed under: Death • Faith • Guns • Leaders • Violence

soundoff (1,411 Responses)
  1. Amazing Grace

    Psalm 34 – The King of Glory and His Kingdom

    September 19, 2013 at 11:27 am |
    • Bill & Ted

      Be excellent to each other!

      September 19, 2013 at 11:30 am |
  2. Meredith S.

    She is not. I know for a fact that sambo is female and she believes in Horus, so, point being, having said that, agreed

    September 19, 2013 at 11:10 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      Oh, great. The fem-a-nazi group is here.

      What next, the Gays, Lesbian and Transgenders?

      What has happened to this blog?

      It was meant just for Religion bashing.

      Can we get back on point people.

      We have to vomit more on this blog and show up these religious nuts.

      September 19, 2013 at 11:21 am |
    • Up Your Rear Admiral

      Meredith, I'll see you in the Rapture Capsule with the unicorns. Don't forget to wear your nose ring – the big steel one that I padlocked the chain onto when we were practising for the Uplifting.

      This time, though, close your mouth when the swirling starts and your head goes down, so the floaters don't get in like they did in our last practice.

      September 19, 2013 at 2:17 pm |
  3. Doc Vestibule

    APPLE BUSH,

    My friend you are back online.

    How's you stomach today?

    You were vomiting so much yesterday, we were concerned.

    What great awful things will you share with us today?

    Come on... vomit some more.

    September 19, 2013 at 11:04 am |
  4. ASDFAASDFASDF56234523

    MENTAL TORTURES.

    BODY ORGANS HEART IRRADIATION.

    ¿WHY DENOUNCE ALL PRESIDENTS WHEN THEY KNOW USING TECHNOLOGY TO READ THE MIND WITH NANOTECHNOLOGY OR NANO COMPUTERS?.

    SEE THE TECHNOLOGY IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINEUROSKY.COMIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

    BY THE LAW ALL CRIMES ARE RESPONSABILITY TO THIS POLITICS.

    NANO PARTICULES IN DRUGS FOOD AND MEDICINE DENOUNCE.

    NEW ALLEGATIONS PSYCHOLOGICAL STRATEGIES.

    DENOUNCES THA WE HAS SENT TO FBI EUROPOL INERPOL, DO AN INVESTIGATION IN NANO PARTICULES IN MEDICINE.

    DENOUNCE CHILDREN OF PRESIDENTS AND EUROPEAN KINGS BY OFFENDERS OF HUMAN RIGHTS, MURDERERS, THIEVES,

    HANDLERS AND DRUGS TRAFICANTS.

    LEONOR DE BORBÓN, SOFIA OF BOURBON.

    FLORENCIA KIRCHNER, MAX KIRCHNER.

    1.RÍNCIPES WILLIAM AND HARRY OF ENGLAND.

    2. NATASHA OBAMA, MALIA ANN OBAMA.

    3.NICOLAS MADURO.

    4.DILMA RUSEF.

    5.KING OF SPAIN.

    IS EXTREMELY URGENT RESEARCH IN FOOD AND PRODUCTS WITH ATOMIC FORCE MICROSCOPY BE CAUSE VICTIMS ARE

    IRRADIATED AND CAUTERIZED FRON SATELITES, NANO PARTICULES IN LOBES, INCLUDING AREAS TO FORNIX AND

    HYPOTALAMOUS.

    WE HAVE MANY CASES.

    THE OBJETIVE THE INVESTIGATION POLICE LIKE FBI EUROPOL INTERPOL IS DENOUCERS INSULT PRESIDENTS TO HAVE

    REASONS TO DO DENOUNCES IN CASES OF HUMAN RACE STUDIES, EKLECTRONIC HARRASMENTS, IRRADIATIONS

    INSTED TO DO INVESTIGATIONS IN NANOTECHNOLOGY AREAS.

    IN VENEZUELA IS ENTERING AGENCIES PERMITTING STUDY OF THE HUMAN RACE OF U.S. AND OTHER COUNTRIES.

    PRECISELY WHY DO THEY HAVE NO WAY PUBLIC RELATIONS WITH VENEZUELAN.

    IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIpgiorg.blog.comIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

    IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIpgiorg.blog.comIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

    IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIpgiorg.blog.comIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

    IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIpgiorg.blog.comIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

    SOME JOURNALISTS TELL US WHEN THEY ARE ANALYZING THIS TEXTS, FEELINCENTIVES AND VOICES WITH HAVE VOLUMS INPECEPTIBLES, STIMULS TO TOILET, PHONE CALLS, FRIENDS COME TO TALK.

    FOR CHECKED OR NOT ATTEND THE CASES.

    September 19, 2013 at 10:53 am |
    • Doris

      Poor thing hasn't been right in the head since they saw the movie "*batteries not included"

      September 19, 2013 at 10:56 am |
    • Doris

      Poor thing hasn't been right in the head since they saw the movie "*batteries not included".

      September 19, 2013 at 10:57 am |
  5. Live4Him

    @Doc Vestibule : "Gott mit uns" ... It is a fact that the slogan was on the belt of Wehrmacht uniforms. It was also on german army helmets in the 1st World War.

    And "In God We Trust" is on America's money. Does this mean only Christians are in this nation? No. this is why the argument is fallacious.

    September 19, 2013 at 10:48 am |
    • Topher

      And it's fallacious because the claim is that Hitler was Christian ... which wasn't true.

      September 19, 2013 at 10:49 am |
      • Doris

        Of course it's true. Now you can say he was a bad witch if you want.

        September 19, 2013 at 10:59 am |
        • Meredith S.

          Sam the lover boy stone is a christian

          September 19, 2013 at 11:02 am |
        • Live4Him

          @Doris : Of course it's true [that Hitler was a Christian].

          How do you know this to be a fact? Or do you? Maybe you just WANT it to be true. The evidence points to the contrary.

          Hitler: The Master Race vs. Christianity All are created equal.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:06 am |
        • Topher

          Hitler said …
          “Our epoch will certainly see the end of the disease of Christianity.”
          “Christianity is the worst of the regressions that mankind can ever have undergone.”
          “The heaviest blow that ever struck humanity was the coming of Christianity.”

          Doesn't sound like a Christian to me.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:10 am |
        • AE

          Or look how Hitler admired J.apan, and thought they were great because they were not Chrisitan:

          “The fact that the Ja.panese have retained their political philosophy, which is one of the essential reasons for their successes, is due to their having been saved in time from the views of Christianity.”

          September 19, 2013 at 11:16 am |
        • Topher

          Doris

          See the above quotes. He wasn't interested in doing the Lord's work.

          It's not about "individual faith." It's about what is true.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:25 am |
        • sam stone

          gopher: is your lord that ineffective that he needs flawed humans to do his work?

          it was a rhetorical question.

          without flawed humans believing in a god, it ceases to exist. just like thousands of other gods that people no longer believe in. but, feel free to grovel for your salvation

          you are a COWARD.

          you feel you are due hell, but lacking the integrity to take the punishment you feel you deserve, you latch onto a scapegoat, a spiritual get out of jail free card called jeebus

          you purport to KNOW, rather than believe

          you claim evidence but never provide anything compelling, if at all

          come on, boy.....

          do you have it, or do you not?

          September 20, 2013 at 12:59 am |
      • OKfine

        Topher every time you are proved wrong you run away, quite sad. Hitler was baptized a Roman Catholic and even sang in the choir as a boy and was confirmed. Now some people like Bill Deacon believe that once a catholic is always a catholic, you may lapse but are still part of the group. PS: that is how they keep their dwindling numbers look good.

        September 19, 2013 at 11:10 am |
        • Topher

          OKfine

          "Topher every time you are proved wrong you run away, quite sad."

          What have I run away from? I'm still here talking to people. And I reject the idea that anyone on this board has proven me wrong.

          "Hitler was baptized a Roman Catholic and even sang in the choir as a boy and was confirmed"

          First, Catholics aren't Christians. They're Catholics. Second, singing in the choir and being confirmed do not a believer make. Going to church doesn't save you, either.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:18 am |
        • OKfine

          Topher, you are quite amusing, you were wrong about the diversity of races but will not admit it, pathetic. The fact that you deny that the catholic believers are christian shows off your closed bigoted mind. No wonder those that claim to be Christian just can't seem to get along.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:24 am |
        • Topher

          OKfine

          "Topher, you are quite amusing, you were wrong about the diversity of races but will not admit it, pathetic"

          First, Ad hominem fallacy. Second, no one in that conversation proved me wrong.

          "The fact that you deny that the catholic believers are christian shows off your closed bigoted mind."

          It's called the Protestant Reformation. Look it up. Oh, and more ad hominems.

          "No wonder those that claim to be Christian just can't seem to get along."

          I get along with my Christian brothers and sisters just fine.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:29 am |
        • OKfine

          Topher. The RCC kept the Christian myth rolling for the first 1500 years, if it wasn't for them there would not have been a reformation or Christianity at all. Ad Hominem, saying you have to stick to your delusions is Ad Hominem, how so? Your denial of facts, history and science is really what makes you what you are, I repeat, pathetic. Enjoy.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:46 am |
        • Topher

          OKfine

          "The RCC kept the Christian myth rolling for the first 1500 years, if it wasn't for them there would not have been a reformation or Christianity at all."

          Despite what the Catholics will tell you, they weren't around since the time of Christ. So no, they don't get credit for keeping Christianity around. Second, I reject Christianity is a myth.

          "Your denial of facts, history and science is really what makes you what you are, I repeat, pathetic. Enjoy."

          More ad hominems. I haven't denied anything that is a fact in history or science. So how am I, as you say, "pathetic"?

          September 19, 2013 at 11:51 am |
        • OKfine

          Topher. Anyone that can willfully deny facts, science and history for belief in the bible myths would not even get out of grade school where I live, which in my eyes makes you pathetic. Just remember it is up to you to accept Ad Hominem attacks, turn the other cheek and love thy neighbour and all that jazz; me not so much, I can dish out more than I get. Or do you not follow your Christian teachings and prefer to be a hypocrite? Send me a little of that very narrow Christian love and Pope Francis while you are ay it.

          September 19, 2013 at 12:05 pm |
        • Topher

          OKfine

          "Anyone that can willfully deny facts, science and history for belief in the bible myths would not even get out of grade school where I live, which in my eyes makes you pathetic."

          Again, what have I denied? Second, I reject the Bible is full of myths. Third, as much as I hate to say it, EVERYBODY gets out of grade school these days.

          "Just remember it is up to you to accept Ad Hominem attacks, turn the other cheek and love thy neighbour and all that jazz; me not so much, I can dish out more than I get."

          I have been "turning the other cheek" with you. Despite your name-calling, I've continued to talk to you. I could have easily ignored you and been justified ... in debates, ad hominem attacks equal you lose.

          "Or do you not follow your Christian teachings and prefer to be a hypocrite? Send me a little of that very narrow Christian love and Pope Francis while you are ay it."

          Sure, I'll tell you the about the most loving thing I know of ... Jesus Christ. That despite your continuous shaking of your fist at Him, He died for you anyway. He voluntarily took the punishment you deserve so that you can live forever with Him. He paid your fine in His life's blood so that you can be seen as innocent on the day of judgment. "Come, let us reason together. Though your sins be as crimson, they shall be as white as snow."

          Now, I'm off to work. And I'll leave you with this. None of us are promised another day. Get right with God while you still have time. Have a good day, dude. And God bless.

          September 19, 2013 at 12:18 pm |
        • sam stone

          if jesus died for you, how is still alive?

          did jesus have a bad weekend for your sins?

          if you don't want to take to me, gopher, i can deal with it

          you don't want to have a discussion, you want to preach

          reject whatever the fvck you want

          you are a fine example of the insanity of religious beliefs

          go home, boy, and get your shinebox

          September 20, 2013 at 1:04 am |
      • Doris

        Who can say they read Hitler's mind and that he hadn't convinced himself that he was doing the Lord's work? After all, how is it not all about individual faith and interpretation for all things in the "spooky"-physics realm?

        September 19, 2013 at 11:12 am |
      • Doris

        Like many Christians, maybe Hitler didn't think of other Christians around him as true Christians, yet still believed he was doing His work.

        September 19, 2013 at 11:16 am |
      • sam stone

        you are a coward, gopher

        you run like a scared little girl when you cannot answer a question

        you claim you have evidence, but never provide it

        you believe you are due hell, but won't take your punishment

        you blather on about a just and righteous god, but to my view, it is neither a just nor a righteous being

        September 19, 2013 at 6:24 pm |
    • Doc Vestibule

      Regardless of his personal beliefs, Christianity was parts of Hitler's tools of statecraft.
      Instead of purging faith like the Communist regimes, he purged atheism:
      "We were convinced that the people need and require this faith. We have therefore undertaken the fight against the atheistic movement, and that not merely with a few theoretical declarations: we have stamped it out".
      The Speeches of Adolf Hitler, April 1922-August 1939, Vol. 1 of 2, Oxford University Press, 1942

      "By its decision to carry out the political and moral cleansing of our public life, the Government is creating and securing the conditions for a really deep and inner religious life. The advantages for the individual which may be derived from compromises with atheistic organizations do not compare in any way with the consequences which are visible in the destruction of our common religious and ethical values. The national Government sees in both Christian denominations the most important factor for the maintenance of our society. ..."
      – Adolf Hitler, speech before the Reichstag, March 23, 1933, just before the Enabling Act is passed.

      He even tried to convince the world that the Vatican was on his side.
      "The fact that the Curia is now making its peace with Fascism shows that the Vatican trusts the new political realities far more than did the former liberal democracy with which it could not come to terms. ...The fact that the Catholic Church has come to an agreement with Fascist Italy ...proves beyond doubt that the Fascist world of ideas is closer to Christianity than those of Jewish liberalism or even atheistic Marxism..."
      – Adolf Hitler in an article in the Völkischer Beobachter, February 29, 1929, on the new Lateran Treaty between Mussolini's fascist government and the Vatican

      September 19, 2013 at 11:31 am |
      • Joey

        All that really matters is that Hitler was able to convince millions of German Christians that it would be a good idea to kill all of the Jews.

        September 20, 2013 at 2:16 pm |
        • NID_FTL@yahoo.com

          Bravo!

          >________________________________ > From: CNN Belief Blog >To: nid_ftl@yahoo.com >Sent: Friday, September 20, 2013 2:16 PM >Subject: [New comment] Rick Warren on guns, God and son's tragic death > > > > WordPress.com >Joey commented: "All that really matters is that Hitler was able to convince millions of German Christians that it would be a good idea to kill all of the Jews." >

          September 20, 2013 at 2:41 pm |
  6. sdfgsdfgasdfsASDFASDFdfg3456234523

    MENTAL TORTURES.

    BODY ORGANS HEART IRRADIATION.

    ¿WHY DENOUNCE ALL PRESIDENTS WHEN THEY KNOW USING TECHNOLOGY TO READ THE MIND WITH NANOTECHNOLOGY OR NANO COMPUTERS?.

    SEE THE TECHNOLOGY IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIINEUROSKY.COMIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

    BY THE LAW ALL CRIMES ARE RESPONSABILITY TO THIS POLITICS.

    NANO PARTICULES IN DRUGS FOOD AND MEDICINE DENOUNCE.

    NEW ALLEGATIONS PSYCHOLOGICAL STRATEGIES.

    DENOUNCES THA WE HAS SENT TO FBI EUROPOL INERPOL, DO AN INVESTIGATION IN NANO PARTICULES IN MEDICINE.

    DENOUNCE CHILDREN OF PRESIDENTS AND EUROPEAN KINGS BY OFFENDERS OF HUMAN RIGHTS, MURDERERS, THIEVES,

    HANDLERS AND DRUGS TRAFICANTS.

    LEONOR DE BORBÓN, SOFIA OF BOURBON.

    FLORENCIA KIRCHNER, MAX KIRCHNER.

    1.RÍNCIPES WILLIAM AND HARRY OF ENGLAND.

    2. NATASHA OBAMA, MALIA ANN OBAMA.

    3.NICOLAS MADURO.

    4.DILMA RUSEF.

    5.KING OF SPAIN.

    IS EXTREMELY URGENT RESEARCH IN FOOD AND PRODUCTS WITH ATOMIC FORCE MICROSCOPY BE CAUSE VICTIMS ARE

    IRRADIATED AND CAUTERIZED FRON SATELITES, NANO PARTICULES IN LOBES, INCLUDING AREAS TO FORNIX AND

    HYPOTALAMOUS.

    WE HAVE MANY CASES.

    THE OBJETIVE THE INVESTIGATION POLICE LIKE FBI EUROPOL INTERPOL IS DENOUCERS INSULT PRESIDENTS TO HAVE

    REASONS TO DO DENOUNCES IN CASES OF HUMAN RACE STUDIES, EKLECTRONIC HARRASMENTS, IRRADIATIONS

    INSTED TO DO INVESTIGATIONS IN NANOTECHNOLOGY AREAS.

    IN VENEZUELA IS ENTERING AGENCIES PERMITTING STUDY OF THE HUMAN RACE OF U.S. AND OTHER COUNTRIES.

    PRECISELY WHY DO THEY HAVE NO WAY PUBLIC RELATIONS WITH VENEZUELAN.

    IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIpgiorg.blog.comIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

    IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIpgiorg.blog.comIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

    IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIpgiorg.blog.comIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

    IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIpgiorg.blog.comIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

    September 19, 2013 at 10:45 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      All we can say, this is one sick puppy.

      Wow!

      He needs serious help.

      Daddy is vomiting out this guys head. Daddy Satan that is.

      See the head spinning?

      Where are the boys in white coats when you need them?

      Help is on its way....

      Hand on fellow. ...

      September 19, 2013 at 10:50 am |
  7. Doc Vestibule

    My name is not that German dictator and monster. We are related though.

    We serve the same master.

    September 19, 2013 at 10:32 am |
  8. AE

    Place your trust and confidence in God and He will not let you down. God with us.

    September 19, 2013 at 9:52 am |
    • Doc Vestibule

      "Gott mit uns" -- where have I heard that before?

      September 19, 2013 at 9:55 am |
      • Reality # 1

        DV, your friend Reality # 3 posted an offer you should consider.

        Your daddy wants an answer, and he wants it NOW!

        September 19, 2013 at 10:07 am |
      • Topher

        Ah, here we go with the fallacious Hitler argument.

        September 19, 2013 at 10:12 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          Fallacious?
          It is a fact that the slogan was on the belt of Wehrmacht uniforms.
          It was also on german army helmets in the 1st World War.

          September 19, 2013 at 10:39 am |
        • OKfine

          Topher. No reply on page 13 re diversity of race, try searching the topic on google; they even have pictures to help you comprehend. Since you love responding with questions from time to time here's one for you. What fallacious Hitler argument are you referring to?

          September 19, 2013 at 10:45 am |
        • Topher

          Doc Vestibule

          Fine. You're right. But the insinuation is that Hitler was a Christian, which he clearly was not.

          September 19, 2013 at 10:51 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          The insinuation is actually that Nazis were Christians.
          Whether Hitler believed he was or not is moot – he encouraged Christianity in the 3rd Reich.
          If anything, he was an enemy to atheists.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:22 am |
        • Topher

          Doc Vestibule

          "Whether Hitler believed he was or not is moot – he encouraged Christianity in the 3rd Reich."

          It isn't moot. If you're not a believer then you're not a Christian. Just because you call yourself one doesn't make you one. Second, whatever he was pushing wasn't Christianity. See above quotes.

          "If anything, he was an enemy to atheists."

          He may have been, but this also doesn't make him a Christian. Christians don't believe in atheists.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:35 am |
        • sam stone

          speaking for christians, are you gopher?

          why not, since you purport to speak for god

          delusional little boy

          September 20, 2013 at 7:45 am |
        • Cristeros for Satan

          Topher

          Just because you call yourself one doesn't make you one.
          >
          Thats nice, who decides such? You? lol
          You have no authority or position to dictate or state who is or isnt a christian.

          September 25, 2013 at 2:33 pm |
      • AE

        I have a beautiful Native American blanket in my possession. It has a symbol for peace pattern running through it. The same symbol you would probably point at and say "swastika".

        God with us, as in Immanuel which predates the Nazi's by thousands of years.

        September 19, 2013 at 10:17 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          Christians don't have a very good history with blankets and Native Americans.

          September 19, 2013 at 10:33 am |
        • AE

          That was a plan of the English Government, not the Christianity.

          And was it ever actually carried out? Or is that a myth?

          September 19, 2013 at 10:39 am |
        • Billy

          I suppose AE wants to blame the plight of the children of the Catholic-run Canadian residential school system.

          http://popecrimes.blogspot.com/2011/06/canadian-holocaust-50000-children-died.html

          September 19, 2013 at 10:51 am |
        • Billy

          (that is blame it on someone else)

          September 19, 2013 at 10:53 am |
        • AE

          Uh, not sure if that blog is legit, but I would blame the Catholic-run Canadian residential school system. I wouldn't blame all Catholics, Christians, Canadians or school administrators though.

          September 19, 2013 at 10:59 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          @AE
          That was the plan of the Commander of Fort Pitt, Captain Simeon Ecuyer, who was a Christian.
          During the siege of For Pitt, he wrote a letter to his superior office, Colonel Bouquet that read, in part:
          " God and the Soldier we both adore
          In times of danger and not before."
          And yes, the blankets did go the natives during a parley at Fort Pitt on June 24, 1763. Two blankets and a hakerchief from the smallpox ward, to be precise. There exists an invoice that makes is clear that they were to be used as a means to infect the Delaware Indians.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:03 am |
        • AE

          Doc

          Can you post your source?

          Also, the Native Americans had sided with the French (who were Christians). So it was not like all Christians were for killing Native Americans.

          Definitely the English Army wanted to defeat the Native Americans. Not sure it it logical to say that was the goal of all the Christians.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:09 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          I have to apologize for my ill will towards Christians.

          See, my mom and dad didn't love me or care enough to show me the way.

          I'm lost and confused, so like Apple Bush and others, I like to vomit all over this Belief Blog the CNN folks put on line.

          Don't pity me. I am happy, and miserable person.

          Just unload on my post. I won't be offended.

          Be wise. ... it may be Apple Bush's turn next.

          Hate you people with all my evil heart.

          Satan's son, Doc Vestibule

          Bye for now....

          Got to take my medicine.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:12 am |
        • OKfine

          AE. There were Indian wars long after the independence of the USA, see Custer's career. By the way some Indians fought for the British and some for the Americans, whatever suited their own interests, so history tells us.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:18 am |
        • AE

          @ fake Doc
          Come on, that is childish. You can use your own name and make your point. Let him speak for himself.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:18 am |
        • Live4Him

          @Doc

          Here's the facts.

          www_history_org/foundation/journal/spring04/warfare.cfm

          Trent wrote: "Out of our regard for them, we gave them two Blankets and an Handkerchief out of the Small Pox Hospital. I hope it will have the desired effect."

          It is not known who conceived the plan, but there's no doubt it met with the approval of the British military in America and may have been common practice.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:19 am |
        • AE

          Some Native Americans were Christians.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:20 am |
        • Billy

          Uh – someone stealing Doc's handle?

          September 19, 2013 at 11:23 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          Though the term most often used in conjunction with the frontier settlers is "pilgrim", the proper term is "puritan". Those ships that landed at Plymouth Rock carried a tribe of people disillusioned with what they saw as the moral degeneration of their homeland. Convinced of their righteousness and confident in their role as God's messengers, they sought to impose their will on a new land and it's peoples under the guise of bringing elightenment. The mentality was hardly new, being the same Augustinian conceit of “Cognite Intrare” that helped fuel the crusades, inquisition and myriad other brutalities. Holding an entire race of people at musket point and condeming their cultures from a fiery pulpit, the arrogant, confrontational and technologically superior invaders saw no hypocrisy in killing those who refused conversion.

          September 19, 2013 at 11:25 am |
        • AE

          I didn't know the English Army was led by the Puritans.

          September 19, 2013 at 12:47 pm |
      • mirror

        "Christianity is a rebellion against natural law, a protest against nature. Taken to its logical extreme, Christianity would mean the systematic cultivation of the human failure.”

        Where have I heard that before?

        September 19, 2013 at 10:47 am |
    • Apple Bush

      If there is a god, he is the WORST one ever. Can't do anything right. Nothing but problems and suffering.

      September 19, 2013 at 10:34 am |
      • AE

        Sorry there is nothing but problems and suffering in your life. My life has had difficulties, but there is also a lot of good in my life. I'm blessed to be able to know that today. Seek God and He can help you overcome your problems and suffering.

        September 19, 2013 at 10:42 am |
        • Lionly Lamb

          Sired AE...

          It seems to my perceptions that you might be having a personal identity conundrum... Speaking from experience; many folks seem unable to cope with individualized rationalizing complexities... Giving up attempting, toward understanding social austerities which encompass individualism, gives people their identification of oneness... Individualisms are set upon the relativities of quaint somberness issues in daily moderations... Religious identities are as emotionalized labels giving people an ability to pause and reflect upon judgmental reasoning... Whether or not, religious agendas are servicing and served with ever those willing to serve...

          [youtube=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmVAWKfJ4Go&w=640&h=360]

          September 19, 2013 at 11:22 am |
      • Topher

        Apple Bush

        "If there is a god, he is the WORST one ever. Can't do anything right. Nothing but problems and suffering."

        Hey, dude! Long time no-chat. Hope you are doing well.

        God has done everything right. "Problems and suffering" are results of the fallen world. It's a result of sin.

        September 19, 2013 at 11:02 am |
        • Austin

          Topher, is that me?

          September 19, 2013 at 2:19 pm |
        • sam stone

          Sin is a man made construct, designed to trap the gullible. Looks like they got you good

          September 19, 2013 at 6:32 pm |
    • Theadore Realist

      *************************************************************

      ... {{{{{ AHEM .. clears throat }}}}}

      .............. your http://www.GODisIMAGINARY.com ...

      ... and thank goodness because he emanates from ...

      ...............................the http://www.EVILbible.com

      *************************************************************

      September 20, 2013 at 7:39 am |
  9. Reality # 1

    MWR. You have a point. What it is, only you know it. Small world you live in.

    Lonely and pathetic ad it is, it's your life. People should respect you, as miserable as you may be.

    Be bold, stand up and be the weird person you are. You show such class.

    We like you here.

    Make us proud

    You deserve the "Slamming Award".

    Congratulations.

    It comes with a prize, want it?

    September 19, 2013 at 9:42 am |
  10. Reality # 3

    Godless people unite. Hell isn't full yet. Get your ticket now.

    Your daddy Satan is waiting for you.

    Come home to pappa girls and boys.

    He has the big toys for you to play with.

    Greed, Selfishness, Lying, Cheating, Stealing, Hatred, Fornication, Adultery, Lawlessness, Se..xual Immortality, Anger, Malice, and your very favorite – eternal darkness, hell fire and unquenchable thirst.

    The welcome mat is out.

    All you need is take his offer.

    September 19, 2013 at 9:30 am |
  11. Hell and destruction are never full

    The servants' right to bear arms is an extension of the Masters' rights, in his name so to speak. Tightening up the Masters' rights automatically tightens up the servants. Never get outgunned by the servants. They might not be able to bear the temptation honorably.

    September 19, 2013 at 9:29 am |
  12. USMC 1371

    If the conversation went towards suicide and they knew he had a illegally bought a gun then both of his parents should be charged with conspiracy. They knowingly and willingly allowed his death.

    September 19, 2013 at 9:14 am |
  13. Henry

    This believer is in favor of massive gun control

    September 19, 2013 at 8:47 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      I'll join you in that, though I am a competitive shooter. We can do without all the things people who like to play soldier like to play with.

      September 19, 2013 at 9:05 am |
    • Hell and destruction are never full

      You've got it, control by guns that is. SWAT team activity has EXPLODED over the last few decades. It's all part of the mingling.
      The military is the powice of the wurld, and the powice is the military lording over the Masters.

      September 19, 2013 at 9:12 am |
      • My Dog is a jealous Dog

        Lolly – you've changed your name, but you just can't loose that lisp. I was wondering who the new nut-job was on the board, but it's just you again.

        Why is it that only the believers find the need to continuously change handles?

        September 19, 2013 at 10:20 am |
  14. Amazing Grace

    I just love unbelievers, atheist, and alike.

    You crack me up.

    You sing from the same hymnal.

    You puff yourself up, and try to make yourself a God (little g)

    Have fun

    Enjoy your deception. This season will soon pass.

    We are neither afraid or concerned by your post. Just love seeing the outpouring of your love for your fellow mankind.

    September 19, 2013 at 8:44 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      Everyone is a "little-g" god – the only kind there is. From moment to moment we construct our world, at least each for himself, from a wild array of sensory input and our knowledge of what seems to work. We foresee the future, in a way, and plan for it on the fly so that we can interact with this world we piece together. That's as close as we come to reality and we create it, almost without ever thinking about it.

      September 19, 2013 at 8:54 am |
    • BU2B

      Atheists aren't the ones quoting from 2,000 year old books.

      We don't believe in gods, so why would we try to be one?

      "Enjoy your deception". Now that is a funny one!

      "Just love seeing the outpouring of your love for your fellow mankind." And we love watching you worship a god who condemns 5 billion out of the 7 billion of us to eternal hellfire. I guess that's your definition of love?

      September 19, 2013 at 8:55 am |
      • Topher

        BU2B

        "Atheists aren't the ones quoting from 2,000 year old books."

        That's a logical fallacy. The age of the book doesn't make it wrong.

        "And we love watching you worship a god who condemns 5 billion out of the 7 billion of us to eternal hellfire. I guess that's your definition of love?"

        It absolutely is love. And it's just.

        September 19, 2013 at 9:00 am |
        • BU2B

          Then your "god" is no different than a dictator.

          September 19, 2013 at 9:04 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          A relationship predicated on violent jealousy and threats of torture is not healthy.

          September 19, 2013 at 9:05 am |
        • Topher

          He's nothing at all like a dictator. He loves you and has done everything for you. So in this situation it's more like you're the traitor.

          I think we can agree that love is something that is freely given. You could not force someone to love you back, no matter what you do. If you're really into a girl and she rejects you, you can't say, "I love you so much I'm going to make you love me." It doesn't work that way. If you truly love that person, you're going to have to let them go. That's what happens with God. He has loved you. You've rejected it. So all He can do is let you go. If you don't want Him in this life, you won't want Him in the afterlife. He's not going to force you into His presence.

          September 19, 2013 at 9:11 am |
        • Honey Badger Don't Care

          Topher,

          You have no evidence that your god even exists let alone does the things that you claim. Please provide reliable evidence of your premise before you make these wild claims.

          September 19, 2013 at 10:37 am |
        • Topher

          Honey Badger Don't Care

          "You have no evidence that your god even exists let alone does the things that you claim. Please provide reliable evidence of your premise before you make these wild claims."

          There's TONS of evidence for God. What type would you like?

          September 19, 2013 at 10:56 am |
        • sam stone

          you always speak about evidence, gopher, but you never provide it

          come on, boy, provide it

          sit or get off the pot

          September 19, 2013 at 6:35 pm |
      • Amazing Grace

        This will be over your head , but I'll simply it for you.

        Free will is a choice, like everything in life, choices have consequences.

        You are confused if you think or misunderstand what GOD'S plans are. He doesn't condemn people to hell, you choose whether to believe and follow His ways. He choose life for you, did you decide not to accept it?

        Don't try to rewrite history or the facts about someone you don't know.

        And if you father or a judge gives you what you deserve as punishment for you bad choices, lies, crimes or misbehavior – that doesn't make them a person who doesn't love. Just means the gave you justice and there are penalties for when we are wrong or wrong someone. Disobedience has consequences. In this world and the next. Agree or not – this is truth.

        September 19, 2013 at 9:08 am |
        • Tom, Tom, the Other One

          You think in the most legalistic terms about your God. But this is common. The books must balance. Everyone must be rewarded or punished in exact measure for what they have done or failed to do. Life is made fair by what happens in the afterlife. These are among the more important reasons people want to believe in God. In an interesting twist, Christians hope to escape judgment themselves, though they certainly believe in it for others.

          September 19, 2013 at 9:10 am |
        • Topher

          Tom, Tom, the Other One

          "In an interesting twist, Christians hope to escape judgment themselves, though they certainly believe in it for others."

          EVERYONE will be judged and that includes Christians. But I know what you mean. And I truly hope you "escape" the judgment you're talking about. But there's only one who can make that happen for you. Why would you reject that?

          September 19, 2013 at 9:22 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          @Topher
          "Why would you reject that?"
          For the same reason that you're not worried about dying on the field of battle, bathed in the blood of your vanquished foes so that you can get into Valhalla.

          September 19, 2013 at 9:54 am |
        • Topher

          Doc Vestibule

          "For the same reason that you're not worried about dying on the field of battle, bathed in the blood of your vanquished foes so that you can get into Valhalla."

          What's that from, dude?

          September 19, 2013 at 9:55 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          @Topher
          Norse mythology – the religion of the Vikings.
          It is the Asgardian mead hall, full of the souls of warriors who died in battle.

          September 19, 2013 at 10:00 am |
        • Topher

          And what is the source for that belief?

          September 19, 2013 at 10:21 am |
    • OKfine

      The outpouring of love by the religious groups is what exactly? If you are not part of and acceptable to the group you are excluded and persecuted, is that not right? Gays, divorced women, abortion supporters, in some cases minorities are some examples and that is just christian cults that do not accept the beliefs of the many other religions of the world. Warren is a very successful scam artist living the high life off of suckers like you and Warren may even be a major cause of his sons suicide. East of Eden.

      September 19, 2013 at 8:59 am |
  15. Reality # 2

    Rick,

    Please return all the money you have conned from your church members all these years !!!

    If you do not, said members will be suing you for false advertising.

    September 19, 2013 at 8:36 am |
    • Reality # 3

      Reality # 2 or # 1 or who ever you want to be...

      Have you paid everyone back, including the IRS, for all the decelivers you have lived?

      You owe plenty dude. With interest.

      Pay up, NOW! Send your bank cashier check to:

      PO BOX 1234
      Going straight to Hell, Nevada 89146

      September 19, 2013 at 9:20 am |
  16. Roddy2112

    Uhg, this religion crap is just that. But I guess if you can't understand even the basics of science it's all you have.

    September 19, 2013 at 8:34 am |
    • Topher

      Who doesn't understand the basics of science?

      September 19, 2013 at 8:51 am |
      • OKfine

        That would be you Topher. Anyone that believes that 8 people from Noah's ark populated the entire earth in such diversity of races in such a short period of time does not only not have a clue about science but also of basic arithmetic.

        September 19, 2013 at 9:19 am |
        • Topher

          OKfine

          "That would be you Topher. Anyone that believes that 8 people from Noah's ark populated the entire earth in such diversity of races in such a short period of time does not only not have a clue about science but also of basic arithmetic."

          There is only ONE race — human. If you mean ethnicities ... that came about after Babel. It's what's commonly called adaptation. And I'm the one who doesn't know about science?

          September 19, 2013 at 9:28 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          @Topher
          3 breeding pairs of humans with all the males being first order relatives would lead to extinction within a few generations.
          Inbreeding is not healthy.

          September 19, 2013 at 9:36 am |
        • OKfine

          Topher. Race is a classification system used to categorize humans into large and distinct populations or groups..... I could go on but why bother. If you would read some books besides your bible maybe you would not be so willfully ignorant.

          September 19, 2013 at 9:39 am |
        • Topher

          Doc Vestibule

          "3 breeding pairs of humans with all the males being first order relatives would lead to extinction within a few generations.
          Inbreeding is not healthy."

          4 breeding pairs. And I'd agree with you if we were talking about today. Relatives that close would be a problem because there's too much corruption in the genetics. But back then you wouldn't have that problem yet.

          September 19, 2013 at 9:41 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          @Topher
          3 pairs. Noah and his wife didnt' have any more children.
          I imagine that most 600 year old men have erectile problems.

          And what do you mean "corruption"? Diversity is necessary for a healthy population. This is basic Mendelian genetics – the rules are effectively the same for every living creature and they haven't changed.

          September 19, 2013 at 9:51 am |
        • Topher

          Doc Vestibule

          "3 pairs. Noah and his wife didnt' have any more children."

          Does it explicitly say they didn't? I don't remember.

          "And what do you mean "corruption"? Diversity is necessary for a healthy population. This is basic Mendelian genetics – the rules are effectively the same for every living creature and they haven't changed."

          The generations numbers at this point in history was very small. Because Noah's daughters-in-law were not from the same family, you would have the diversity.

          September 19, 2013 at 10:11 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          @Topher
          I'm afraid genetic drift is not so forgiving.
          For a population to survive more than handful of generations, there needs to be at LEAST a dozen genetically distinct breeding pairs.

          September 19, 2013 at 10:31 am |
        • Topher

          Doc Vestibule

          "For a population to survive more than handful of generations, there needs to be at LEAST a dozen genetically distinct breeding pairs."

          I wish you would have told that to the pet mice my cousin and I had as children.

          September 19, 2013 at 10:59 am |
  17. Amazing Grace

    If you think you have hope without GOD, you deceive yourself.

    If you think you are okay apart from GOD, better hope you are right.

    Otherwise, GOD help you when you will be wrong.

    Puzzle me this,

    If you steal, and think you will get away with the crime – do you deceive yourself?

    If you lie, commit perjury, and think you will not be held accountable – do you deceive yourself?

    If you beg for mercy, do you think the judge will ignore your crimes?

    Then you are deceiving yourself and you have no hope.

    So, who is delusional?

    September 19, 2013 at 8:07 am |
    • midwest rail

      "...you have no hope. "
      Arrogant presumption.

      September 19, 2013 at 8:11 am |
      • Amazing Grace

        MWR,

        Such wisdom... so profound, you must be very proud of yourself? Keep telling yourself those lies, one might consider looking in the mirror.

        You have hope in what? Enlightened the masses, convince us, convert us, win us over with where you hope comes from.

        We are waiting to see how arrogant you really are.

        Please indulge us. May be you friends want to join your game?

        Please, play to win, puff yourselves up, big up your ego.

        Remember, the bigger they are...

        Pride comes before....

        If you say in your heart there is no GOD, you make yourself a. ...

        Waiting.....

        September 19, 2013 at 8:23 am |
        • midwest rail

          The arrogance is all yours. You presume that you have all the answers, and that people can only have hope if they follow your dictates. That is arrogant nonsense. And by the way, please show anywhere in my post that I claimed to have all the answers or displayed what you call pride. Your arrogance is surpassed only by the vast number of as$umptions you make.

          September 19, 2013 at 8:27 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          [youtube=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqwvU8QhlYQ&w=640&h=360]

          September 19, 2013 at 8:42 am |
    • HotAirAce

      Why do you believe what you wrote above? If it is because you believe in an alleged supernatural being for which there is no independent, objective, factual or verifiable evidence, then clearly it is you who is mentally ill, delusional and/or a liar.

      September 19, 2013 at 8:25 am |
      • Atheist Hunter

        Keep blowing the same hot air ace!

        September 19, 2013 at 9:00 am |
    • OKfine

      Grace, just another god isd going to roast your butt if you do not believe in the myth, comment. Why would any rational person believe in that nonsense?

      September 19, 2013 at 8:28 am |
    • OKfine

      Grace, just another your loving god is going to roast everyone's butt that does not believe the myth, comment. Why would any rational person believe such nonsense?

      September 19, 2013 at 8:34 am |
    • Tom, Tom, the Other One

      You think in the most legalistic terms about your God. But this is common. The books must balance. Everyone must be rewarded or punished in exact measure for what they have done or failed to do. Life is made fair by what happens in the afterlife. These are among the more important reasons people want to believe in God. In an interesting twist, Christians hope to escape judgment themselves, though they certainly believe in it for others.

      September 19, 2013 at 8:42 am |
  18. Hell and destruction are never full

    It was a dark and stormy night and all across the land young men were being touched by God. Their friends heard about it ,said "you must have a calling", so they enrolled in seminary. What their friends didn't know was the seminaries were designed after abortion mills sponsored by the Beast and Planned Parenthood. Strip that faith!! The following verses are dedicated to those inst*itutions.

    Luk 11:24 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest; and finding none, he saith, I will return unto my house whence I came out.
    Luk 11:25 And when he cometh, he findeth it swept and garnished.
    Luk 11:26 Then goeth he, and taketh to him seven other spirits more wicked than himself; and they enter in, and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first.

    September 19, 2013 at 8:00 am |
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About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.