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October 9th, 2013
02:27 PM ET
Creationists taunt atheists in latest billboard warBy Eric Marrapodi, CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor (CNN)– A new video billboard in New York's Times Square has a message from creationists, "To all of our atheist friends: Thank God you're wrong." The video advertisement at 42nd Street and Eighth Avenue in Manhattan is one of several billboards going up this week in New York, San Francisco and Los Angeles, paid for by Answers in Genesis. Answers in Genesis is best known as the multimillion-dollar Christian ministry behind the Creation Museum outside Cincinnati. The museum presents the case for Young Earth creationism, following what it says is a literal interpretation of the book of Genesis, which says the Earth was created by God in six days less than 10,000 years ago. Ken Ham, president of Answers in Genesis, said the idea for the advertisements came from an atheist billboard in Times Square at Christmas. During the holidays, the American Atheists put up a billboard with images of Santa Claus and Jesus that read: "Keep the Merry, dump the myth." “The Bible says to contend for the faith,” Ham said. “We thought we should come up with something that would make a statement in the culture, a bold statement, and direct them to our website. "We're not against them personally. We're not trying to attack them personally, but we do believe they're wrong," he said. "From an atheist's perspective, they believe when they die, they cease to exist. And we say 'no, you're not going to cease to exist; you're going to spend eternity with God or without God. And if you're an atheist, you're going to be spending it without God.' " Dave Silverman, president of the American Atheists, said he felt sad for creationists when he saw the billboards. "They refuse to look at the real world. They refuse to look at the evidence we have, and they offer none," Silverman said. "They might as well be saying, 'Thank Zeus you're wrong' or 'Thank Thor you're wrong.' " Silverman said he welcomed another competitor to marketplace, noting that after atheists bought a billboard two years ago in Times Square that read "You KNOW it's a myth," the Catholic League purchased competing space at the entrance to the Lincoln Tunnel for a sign that read "You KNOW it's true." "I would suggest, if they're actually trying to attract atheists, they should talk about proof and reason to believe in their god, not just some pithy play on words," Silverman said. Ham says part of the goal of the campaign is to draw people to the website for Answers in Genesis, where he offers a lengthy post on his beliefs for the proof of God. Ham insists that this campaign is in keeping with their overall mission. "We're a biblical authority ministry. We're really on about the Bible and the Gospel. Now, we do have a specialty in the area of the creation account and Genesis because that's where we say God's word has come under attack." Ham said Answers in Genesis made the decision to split its marketing budget for the ministry between a regional campaign for the museum and this billboard campaign, rather than a national campaign. IRS filings for the ministry in recent years have shown a yearly operating budget of more than $25 million. Ham said the marketing budget is about 2% of that, about $500,000 a year. Though they are waiting for all the bills to come due for this campaign, he said he expected it to cost between $150,000 and $200,000. Silverman noted that his billboards were not video and cost approximately $25,000 last year. He said another campaign was in the works for this year. "They're throwing down the gauntlet, and we're picking it up," Silverman said, adding that his group would "slap them in the face" with it. Ham said that despite criticism from other Christians for being negative and the usual criticisms from secularists he received on his social media accounts, the advertisements have been a success. "We wanted people talking about them, and we wanted discussion about this. We wanted people thinking about God," Ham said. The Creation Museum and the theory of Young Earth creationism are widely reviled by the broader science community. In a YouTube video posted last year titled "Creationism Is Not Appropriate For Children," Bill Nye the Science Guy slammed creationism, imploring parents not to teach it to their children. "We need scientifically literate voters and taxpayers for the future," he said. "We need engineers that can build stuff and solve problems." The museum responded with its own video. For the past 30 years, Gallup Inc. has been tracking American opinions about creationism. In June 2012, Gallup's latest findings showed that 46% of Americans believed in creationism, 32% believed in evolution guided by God, and 15% believed in atheistic evolution. For as long as Gallup has conducted the survey, creationism has remained far and away the most popular answer, with 40% to 47% of Americans surveyed saying they believed that God created humans in their present form at one point within the past 10,000 years. The Creation Museum said it recently welcomed its 2 millionth visitor since its opening in 2007. soundoff (8,748 Responses)« Previous 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 Next »
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.  |
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Ok, I've got a question. The atheists are saying that the creationists need to not "play on words" in answer to the atheists billboards. But, there is about as much proof for creation as there is for evolution if one is going to use "theory" to back up their position. Meaning, no one was around a billion years ago, and its all speculative. At least the creation theory is more plausible. Take for instance the bombardier beetle. Between the time the beetle were to evolve to be able to mix two chemicals together and burn the intruder, the beetle would have blown itself to smithereens. Or, if a fish came out of water to live on land, the time between water and land, it would have died of lack of air. Or, by the time humans figured out how to precreate, the human race would have died out. Even with "leaps" between, you couldn't get those changes quick enough to keep a species alive. Evolution is a theory. If we had never seen a car, and all of a sudden a car appeared in front of the cave man, what would have been the theory on that? We observe so called rules, and we say it is thus. If God had made the world the center of the universe, rather then the sun, that would be the rule for the day. In addition, let's say the atheist is right, and when we die, that's it. Then those who believe in God, will be dead, and both won't know who was right or wrong. But, let's say the Christian is correct. Seems someone will be the loser, and I find it ironic that the Bible says "the fool says in his heart, there is no God".
I believe one of the problem here is that you have the wrong idea on what a theory is and what the theory of evolution is. Relativity is a theory, but no one questions that it is true and that what it describes exists, simply we know it is flawed and will need to be perfected. Science doesn't say evolution is a theory, but its precise mechanism are still debated.
For the theory itself, it is not that fish suddenly walked on earth or that an ape gave birth to a human. It holds in two statements: genes mutates, genes are selected through reproduction success. So in the example of the "ground dwelling fish" let's say that a fish adopt the ability to voluntarily strand on land for a short period of time (all fish can and do breath air! if you don't believe me just go fishing once in a while and learn about their behavior, the only problem is if their gills go dry). The fish has a unique survival tool, which enables him to reproduce more, he become widespread. Since now the stranding fish is common, if a predator adopt the same technique, he can catch a prey that no other can, he will reproduce more than the others and the "standard" stranding fish lose its advantage. Now a mutation affecting one of the stranding fish to breathe a little longer in the air, not that he gained lings suddenly but his gills may simply have changed in shape or size, allowing him to go further away from the water. This mutated fish will out-reproduce the standard version, until a predator catch up and so on, and so on. This is an extremely gradual and lengthy process that doesn't occur on an individual but over the generations simply because children inherit traits from their parents and must compete for reproduction. And if you doubt a fish can adapt to the land, you'll be interested in learning more about the periophtalmus.
That also means that some bombardier beetles probably blew themselves up having defective organs, but then they just never were able to reproduces and pass their defects to any descendant. While their brothers and sisters who had better production organs would outcompete "standard" bombardier beetles by repelling predators more effectively and living longer life to reproduce ... leading to the ones we know today. Same thing for any human that would be too dumb to imitate his parents in order to per create: he would have no child leaving more place for those who were a bit more intelligent.
"If we had never seen a car, and all of a sudden a car appeared in front of the cave man, what would have been the theory on that?" Well, unsurprisingly that never happened, did it ? But my best theory on that is that the car would be a doloreane 😉
"Seems someone will be the loser, and I find it ironic that the Bible says "the fool says in his heart, there is no God"." Humans calling those who don't share the same view of the world idiots isn't ironic, it is simply all too common.
Now since you mention there are some, I must admit I would like to know what are the proofs shown by creationists (no sarcasm or anything else here).
I wouldn't want to appear disrespectful: my sincere apologies for my somehow approximate English it is not my native language and it is late ... I failed to spot quite a few mistakes !
If I recall correctly the scientific method is based on a hypothesis. Then experiments are designed to disprove that hypothesis. In the effort of disproving the hypothesis a theory may develop. It has been over 50 years since I studied anything to do with science. My guess is science was taught far differently back then. Scientific honesty was of paramount importance then. I don't see that today.
I'd say it is more based on experimental verification. No matter the hypothesis, as long as it has not been verified/denied, it is just a mental construct. As for the theory it is like a "general model" for something (gravity, particles, evolution ...), you formulate an hypothesis within a given theory (if the theory is true, then phenomenon X should be observed) then you design an experiment to validate or invalidate the hypothesis, which in turn can validate or invalidate the general model.
For the teaching I can't tell but I would imagine it is taught very differently, and will be taught very differently in 50 years. For the scientific honesty, it is still important ... simply we accept that scientists are humans who have bias and beliefs, they can make mistake and even lie. Even Einstein invented the cosmological constant because the results of his own theory disproved his belief in a static universe ! That's why experimental verification is so important and any wanna-be ground breaking discovery has to be repeated and verified by different teams worldwide.
Creationists and the creation museum the earth is not a what ?
New Light On Dark Energy, Cosmic Speed-Up: Big Bang Afterglow Shows Earth Has No Special Place in Expanding Universe
Nov. 7, 2013 — In a new study, Dartmouth researchers rule out a controversial theory that the accelerating expansion of the universe is an illusion.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/11/131107094622.htm
Per ffrf.org, 9.98% of the prison population- http://ffrf.org/news/news-releases/item/18197-survey-reveals-only-02-of-prisoners-identify-as-atheists .This would be significant if you ignore the ten of thousands of dead found outside our city gates that have died as the result of stoning to death and beheading. Obviously, the truly religious got to them before our justice system. This is obviously evidence of religious organizations not working together with the government to say taxpayer dollars. It is troubling in that many of these were punished for their heretical beliefs, not punishable by normal law, but did "put away" many of the bad guys where over strict rules of evidence would have hamper a governmental prosecution and allowed possibly guilty people set free.
Isn't one of the tenents of Christianity to ENLIGHTEN the ignorant?
THAT, my friend in Christ, is what's happening HERE.
Vaya con DEUS!
If that were the case, Matt, why are you not working on the believers in one of the other of the tens of thousands of other christian denominations?
TAX CHURCHES!!!!
Yeah! bALl those Mega churches in cali and Joel Orensteen, Olsteen....whatever...
Yeah! all those Mega churches in cali and Joel Orensteen, Olsteen....whatever...
Why do we need to tax churches? If one were to calculate the amount of social services provided by the churches, and if it were left to the government to have to do it, how much would taxes have to go up to continue the services? Oh, I forgot, liberal democrats believe that the only one who can do anything right is the government, and that the rest of the country needs to pay up. Churches comprise of tax paying people, so to tax the church, would merely be raising taxes on those who attend, either bankrupting the churches and forcing them to close, or causing those who donate, to have to donate even more.
Actually, I believe a group of nuns did a study. They figured that each congregation would have to raise in the area of an additional $10,000-$50,000 per year to make up for services that are provided by tax dollars. So no, the answer is not that churches relieve some of the taxpayer's burden.
Ooohh big words from the science community demanding proof of God. Who was it that said absence of evidence is not evidence of absence?
Few Facts: All matter and energy (interchangeable) slowly decay into heat (random motion of molecules) over time. Where did the original energy and mass come from?
Fact: Evolution of species presupposes factors leading to increased survival will lead to members that possess them to reproduce at a greater rate and thus overcome natural predators to "change" to a new species where all members have the same characteristics. Why did religion evolve? If it is a benefit to humans–from an evolution standpoint (considering the numbers of kids religious vs non-religious people produce: not adopt) it would seem religion is a positive trait–so all you people who believe in evolution, better think again–your species is at risk.
Fact: carbon dating is NOT exact–who cares if the world is 10,000 or 10 billion years old. Same problems, different calendar.
Fact: God DOES exist. If you have ever seen the complexity of the human eye, the beauty of a nerve cell, or even watched a baby being born you would realize that 10 billion years is probably not long enough to have created any of them from decaying matter that will eventually turn into darkness.
Proof is just what enough people who read/write books and sit talking accept as being the facts–based on other facts they claim as being infallible. Science is wrong so often–so is religion made by man. There is no proof of anything–we accept stimulus through our senses into our brain which tries to interpret the input and makes sense of it. Don't try to prove religion, live it and know it is true by the outcomes. Frankly the pascal argument makes me smile–no matter who is right, I never have to see another Atheist again after I die–and that comforts me.
How can you argue against evolution when you don't even grasp the concept? The dark ages called, they want you to bring their time machine back. You're behind on your witch burning.
I dunno. The CNN word filters on here must be too strict because my post is not getting through and it has no derogatory words in it at all. I'm going to post it in sections so it goes through.
Bad letter combinations / words to avoid if you want to get past the CNN Belief Blog/WordPress automatic filter:
Many, if not most, are buried within other words, so use your imagination.
You can use dashes, spaces, or other characters or some html tricks to modify the "offending" letter combinations.
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ar-se.....as in ar-senic.
co-ck.....as in co-ckatiel, co-ckatrice, co-ckleshell, co-ckles, etc.
co-on.....as in racc-oon, coc-oon, etc.
crac-ker…
cu-m......as in doc-ument, accu-mulate, circu-mnavigate, circu-mstances, cu-mbersome, cuc-umber, etc.
ef-fing...as in ef-fing filter
ft-w......as in soft-ware, delft-ware, swift-water, drift-wood, etc.
ho-mo.....as in ho-mo sapiens or ho-mose-xual, ho-mogenous, sopho-more, etc.
ho-oters…as in sho-oters
ho-rny....as in tho-rny, etc.
inf-orms us…
hu-mp… as in th-ump, th-umper, th-umping
jacka-ss...yet "ass" is allowed by itself.....
ja-p......as in j-apanese, ja-pan, j-ape, etc.
koo-ch....as in koo-chie koo..!
ni-gra…as in deni-grate
nip-ple
o-rgy….as in po-rgy, zo-rgy, etc.
pi-s......as in pi-stol, lapi-s, pi-ssed, therapi-st, etc.
p-oon… as in sp-oon, lamp-oon, harp-oon
p-orn… as in p-ornography
pr-ick....as in pri-ckling, pri-ckles, etc.
que-er
ra-pe.....as in scra-pe, tra-peze, gr-ape, thera-peutic, sara-pe, etc.
se-x......as in Ess-ex, s-exual, etc.
sl-ut
sm-ut…..as in transm-utation
sn-atch
sp-ank
sp-ic.....as in desp-icable, hosp-ice, consp-icuous, susp-icious, sp-icule, sp-ice, etc.
sp-ook… as in sp-ooky, sp-ooked
strip-per
ti-t......as in const-itution, att-itude, t-itle, ent-ity, alt-itude, beat-itude, etc.
tw-at.....as in wristw-atch, nightw-atchman, salt-water, etc.
va-g......as in extrava-gant, va-gina, va-grant, va-gue, sava-ge, etc.
who-re....as in who're you kidding / don't forget to put in that apostrophe!
wt-f....also!!!!!!!
x-xx…
There's another phrase that someone found, "wo-nderful us" (have no idea what sets that one off).
–
There are more, some of them considered "racist", so do not assume that this list is complete.
Piccolo,
Great comments! I hope that I didn't disrupt them by putting up a copy of the hints list - just thought you might need it.
I really appreciate you posting that. That will definitely help me. I'm thinking it was "cu-m" because i was saying "circu-mstantial evidence". That had to be it. Thanks!
Surprise surprise. Another guy who knows nothing about science thinks he knows more than a scientist that has worked in the field and studied it his entire life. The arrogance of some of these people is amazing.
If you want to claim existence of ANYTHING, you need to present evidence or it will not be accepted in the scientific community. It really is that simple. Science DOES NOT say god doesn't exist. It says, "there isn't objective evidence to suggest either way". Therefor the concept of god gets ignored by science.
"Where did the original energy and mass come from?"
Good question. I don't know, and science doesn't know yet either. I take it you are privy to evidence that we are not? Not knowing the answer, doesn't mean god exists. 😆
"Why did religion evolve?"
You are using a different meaning of the word evolve! Religion was created by man. That's like asking why the automobile evolved. Religion is not an evolutionary survival mechanism (although you could say that it was in the dark ages when non believers were tortured and executed for not believing). It's a belief system.
"Fact: carbon dating is NOT exact–who cares if the world is 10,000 or 10 billion years old. Same problems, different calendar."
That's why we have several methods of dating. Carbon dating is only accurate within the last 10,000 years or so. To go back further we use radiometric isotope dating. Of course none are EXACT, but the error margin is something like 1%. Scientists care how old the earth is because the more we learn about it, the more that knowledge can be applied to help lead to new discoveries and technology.
"Fact: God DOES exist"
You are seriously calling that a fact? Present your objective tangible evidence of god, please.
"If you have ever seen the complexity of the human eye, the beauty of a nerve cell, or even watched a baby being born you would realize that 10 billion years is probably not long enough to have created any of them from decaying matter that will eventually turn into darkness."
So you formulated this opinion with what data? Yes, all you have to do is watch a baby being born, and observe the genome to prove evolution.
"Proof is just what enough people who read/write books and sit talking accept as being the facts–based on other facts they claim as being infallible."
Wrong again. Wow you are on a role today. Proof is what scientists determine via repeated experiments and observation of data. Nothing is infallible in science. It changes when new evidence arises. Science attempts to paint a most likely scenario based on the evidence and right now that scenario DOES NOT require a god or creator. Evolution is observed via genome mapping from parent to offspring.
"I never have to see another Atheist again after I die–and that comforts me."
Don't stick around on our account
You really know dick about science. You evidence of god also sucks...other than stating god is real you have no evidence...none...zippo...the probability there is no god is much much higher than the existence of god. Probability is the only real way it can be estimated as this arguement can go on forever using the present parameters we use to say yea or nay. But to err on the side of probability you would have to say there is no god...just sayin'
Engaging in these debates isn't constructive for the atheists or the believers. As a believer, I want to know what the believers here are trying to accomplish. Conversion of the atheists? This strategy isn't working. If you want to convert the unfaithful, look to Pope Francis as an example.
Well said and thank you.
i think many believers like playing the victim and also issuing empty proxy threats
atheists and believers think they are the only parties in this debate. smart people don't automatically doubt or discount the possibilities, nor do they accept anything without verifiable proof.
What is the difference when atheists say "you know it's a myth" vs. creationist saying "you know it's true". The fact is, both sides are going on faith with their statements. Yes, it's correct that there is no empirical evidence of God. Or more succintlly, the God defined in numerous types of spiritual guide books. But did blackholes exist before science discovered evidence of their existence? Of course they did. So the point being, just because there is no evidence, that does not mean there is no God. Having said that, i personally have a problem with the word "God" and the connotations it invokes, I personally prefer the term universal intelligence. Switching gears, it is accepted by science that the universe came into being via the "big bang" ... that's nice, and comforting to know isn't it? Little bit of a problem though, what caused it to go "bang" in the first place? You can say whatever you want about that, but the FACT is, there is no evidence pointing to any cause. So ... could it be God? The truth is, this is where faith comes in again on both sides.Meanwhile, science JUST discovered another ligament in the human knee (ALL/anterolateral ligament) ... isn't that nice and comforting?
Scientists discovered a new ligament, verified it, advertised it, and will use it to benefit the world at large. Before you flame that for "just happening", tell me what you have "just" discovered with your bible? Anything useful? Thanks.
ASDF,
I know what you mean, but FishMuskie doesn't claim any Bible belief. Maybe you were addressing the crowd of Bible believers in general?
FishMuskie- "The fact is, both sides are going on faith with their statements."
You make that statement as though the same level of faith is involved for both sides of the argument. In reality, the level of faith involved in making any assertion is inversely proportional to the amount of evidence supporting the assertion. The religious have extremely little evidence for their position, so their level of faith must necessarily be very much higher than the faith of the non-religious.
@George – no disrespect, but your argument is kinda weak. All you are saying is, what you believe (based on faith) takes a little less faith than someone else's belief (based on faith). That's like comparing two pregnant woman, and saying one woman is less pregnant than the other. One may indeed be further along in her pregnancy, but both are pregnant none the less.
No, I was saying it takes a LOT more faith to be a believer in any sort of deity than to not believe in any deity, considering the lack of evidence for any deities.
It depends on what we are talking about. If it is about saying "god exist" "no he doesn't", yes that is just faith on both side and an empty discussion. Religion is about an intentional cause (God decided that), science is about mechanistic cause (this phenomenon is the result of this or these causes), they don't necessarily conflict, but for some reason some people like to mix the two, and creationists fall exactly in that category.
Creationism, is a myth. It was proven false and the best argument I've heard for its case was "you weren't there" and that's still a pretty stupid argument: can anyone imagine a judge in a murder trial being given evidences like DNA, fingerprints, blood stained clothes and simply saying "you weren't there, case closed" ?
We are truly in the Last Days. Look at how these atheists mock and scoff the Lord Jesus Christ on billboards.
Jesus did say that in the end time mockers and scoffers would come..and LQQK... here they are.
The mockers and scoffers have been here from the beginning. Everybody likes to think the end times will come in their time (and that Jesus will then reappear right where they happen to be).
There are far more Biblical signs that are coming together as never before starting with the re-birth of Israel. Now we see Russia and iran forming an alliance (Gog and Magog in the Bible). Today we are witnessing the largest and most powerful storm on history.
To be sure no one but God knows when the hour will come. But we are told to watch for signs and to stay alert.
People have been saying this for years. For every big storm we discover, there will be a bigger one at some point. That's just the reality of the constantly changing planet we live on. We've only been monitoring weather for the past 50 years or so. We've been on the planet 200,000 years. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that during the ice age transitions there were way bigger storms. Basically you are forcing something to fit to the prophecy, because it's emotionally appealing to you, but your putting a square peg in a round hole.
lalDan Huch law' rur laH luj Hol qaStaHvIS mughmeH
Atheists can be wrong about many things just as religionists are very often. But on the point of what makes us Atheists, we are right. So far religionsists have not been able to come up with any evidence to support that their God actually exists (or Allah, or Jehova). There are wooden idols but then, they are such and then it all depends on how you define your personal god or gods. So when they say we are wrong they should show us some evidence to support that conclusion. Are they desperate becasue they know they are not right? It takes two true facts to support a logical conclusion, or are they disregarding logic and science in order to feel comfortable believing things for which there is still no valid evidence. Good luck. I suppose they are defending their franchise, but why attack us, and with such false and dark messages? Heed the old adage that the nature of the means determines the nature of the end. Most Atheists I know do mostly good things. Statistics show religious people commit far more crimes and are much more violent and prone to drugs, alcohol, and illegitimate births and so on than those who are not. It seems they haev no intention of getting their act together, at least not yet.
Without religion the world would be full of good people doing good things, and bad people doing bad things. But, for a good person to do bad things, that takes religion.
– Stephen Weinburg
#1. You can't prove that God doesn't exist.
#2. Where are these statistics you speak of? Also, how do you know statistics are true? Can you really believe the words that someone else wrote down? (Sarcasm)
In support of your two truth idea here's a couple. A creation requires a creator. Seriously, until you walk out in the front yard and see a rock explode and form a mercedes benz, don't talk to me about rocks exploding in space and creating life.
Truth two, morality is ingrained in every living human. Whether it is used or not, or what degree of right vs wrong, they use, every human has a sliding scale of morality. This is something we received from giant exploding rock? I don't think so.
Atheists amaze me simply by the fact that they expect me to believe there is no God simply on my faith in what they tell me. If I have to choose between faith in God versus faith in joe bob the atheist. I'm going to go with God.
You don't really understand this logic thing, do you? You can't prove a negative. YOU folks are the ones saying God exists, without any proof. So the burden isn't on others to prove he DOES NOT exist. It's on the religious to prove he DOES, assuming you want people to act on, or worse yet legislate on, his opinion.
BTW, you have fallen very foolishly into the classic "flying spaghetti monster" fallacy. I say there's a flying spaghetti monster, and you say there isn't. I tell you to PROVE there isn't, attempting to put the burden on you. They have even used this in South Park, it's that common a logic dodge.
lol cute black and white world view you got there
"Atheists amaze me simply by the fact that they expect me to believe there is no God simply on my faith in what they tell me. If I have to choose between faith in God versus faith in joe bob the atheist. I'm going to go with God."
Why would any believe anything for which their to no evidence? Should I believe just because others do?
Yes, obviously a creation requires a creator. However, looking at the earth, sun, moon and stars there is no evidence whatsoever to suggest that it is a creation. Cars are human technology and we know this. To assume the world or universe is the technology or creation of some other being is a HUGE leap of logic. Its the watchmaker's fallacy. If you can't prove the earth is a creation, there's no reason to call it a creation or suggest it means there must be a creator. That is you making as-sumptions.
Precisely. Creationist are weak minded, gullible in every sense of the word. The only possible way they can bother an atheist is if they can actually come up with evidence of a creator. Until then"........we win
Ooohh big words from the science community demanding proof of God. Who was it that said absence of evidence is not evidence of absence?
Few Facts: All matter and energy (interchangeable) slowly decay into heat (random motion of molecules) over time. Where did the original energy and mass come from?
Fact: Evolution of species presupposes factors leading to increased survival will lead to members that possess them to reproduce at a greater rate and thus overcome natural predators to "change" to a new species where all members have the same characteristics. Why did religion evolve? If it is a benefit to humans–from an evolution standpoint (considering the numbers of kids religious vs non-religious people produce: not adopt) it would seem religion is a positive trait–so all you people who believe in evolution, better think again–your species is at risk.
Fact: carbon dating is NOT exact–who cares if the world is 10,000 or 10 billion years old. Same problems, different calendar.
Fact: God DOES exist. If you have ever seen the complexity of the human eye, the beauty of a nerve cell, or even watched a baby being born you would realize that 10 billion years is probably not long enough to have created any of them from decaying matter that will eventually turn into darkness.
Proof is just what enough people who read/write books and sit talking accept as being the facts–based on other facts they claim as being infallible. Science is wrong so often–so is religion made by man. There is no proof of anything–we accept stimulus through our senses into our brain which tries to interpret the input and makes sense of it. Don't try to prove religion, live it and know it is true by the outcomes. Frankly the pascal argument makes me smile–no matter who is right, I never have to see another Atheist again after I die–and that comforts me.
ok, so all of your intellect in this is intriguing to me...I know there is a God because I feel Him and see Him moving in my life because I am connected to His word (the bible). When one studies it, one gets many, many different messages sent from Him.
Always reflecting something that is happening either internally or externally. YOU have put it in science terms, which I have never had the education of. Please keep sharing your message for/to all the peeps that think they know better in their own human flesh, so they will question – and perhaps do more research – and in searching you know they will find The Truth in Jesus. That is our mission for the Lord. XO
messages??? You need help.
The scientific community is not demanding any proof of god. They are simply acknowledging the fact that evidence has not yet been found. If you have evidence and would care to present it, people might take creationists more seriously, but they have been caught countless times lying and stretching facts to fit into their worldview that has no evidence behind it. If you plan to tell people that god is real and all this other mumbo jumbo about HIS word, then you are the one that is required to provide proof. If you simply say, "that's what I believe" then leave it at that, because that's the ONLY bit of verified truth in the entire ordeal. You have strong faith. Nothing wrong with that, but without proof of god or creation, you can't expect laws to be made based on it or to tell other people they are wrong about verified science.
Per ffrf.org, 9.98% of the prison population- http://ffrf.org/news/news-releases/item/18197-survey-reveals-only-02-of-prisoners-identify-as-atheists .This would be significant if you ignore the ten of thousands of dead found outside our city gates that have died as the result of stoning to death and beheading. Obviously, the truly religious got to them before our justice system. This is obviously evidence of religious organizations not working together with the government to say taxpayer dollars. It is troubling in that many of these were punished for their heretical beliefs, not punishable by normal law, but did "put away" many of the bad guys where over strict rules of evidence would have hamper a governmental prosecution and allowed possibly guilty people set free.
The smartest thing I have read...
It is 2013...that is how old the earth is...don't you get that people!!!
Have you heard of the term B.C.?
"I would suggest, if they're actually trying to attract atheists, they should talk about proof and reason to believe in their god, not just some pithy play on words," Silverman said.
Here is what you are asking for, Mr. Silverman!
http://www.holy-19-harvest.com
__UNIVERSAL MAGNIFICENT MIRACLES__
inane drivel
GOOD NEWS,
Why are you unable to supply ANY PROOF using your own words? Anyone can find a biased, unproven website to support them. Cut and paste is not a good answer.
Dude, stop spamming this same copy & paste job over and over.
I cannot believe this is STILL an issue in the 21st Century...
I guess the 'information age' and modern civilization has taught people nothing.
I can expect this from monkeys living in bamboo huts in Africa, but people with internet access???
People are idiots.
I'm sorry, I'm an atheist and this whole thing seems just plain silly. I'm talking about both sides. What we're discussing here is a person's fundamental view on the nature of reality, and we've reduced it to dueling snark on billboards. If you ever meet someone who was convinced one way or the other by one of these billboards; I recommend you run away from that person. Go far, go fast, just go. You'll thank me later.
Thank you Jim. Well said.
Some atheists are normal Jim and you're one of them. Some of them are Jehova's witnesses with bulimia of the mind.
"I really didn't eat those four gallons of Ben and Jerry's...I puked them all up later. They were terrible!"
"Creationism blah blah blah...read this page right here it's nonsense."
No really?
I picture some of them up at night, sweating, three am in the bathroom with a flashlight, praying to Richard Dawkins that their wife doesn't catch em with a page of the old testament.
Get some help kiddies, get some help
The problem is that everyone thinks they aren't affect by billboards, advertising and propaganda, but one way or another everyone is affected by many of these things...we have plenty of well done psychological studies as evidence. In this case a few people who think this cute will go to the website. A few who don't will also go there. What they see will be integrated into their other information and have an effect way down the line that is impossible to source.
Evolution is one of the biggest lies going. I mean seriously, you believe your ancient ancestors were monkey? If so, then why are monkeys still around? You honestly believe your grandpa was a rock? I mean like cell structure is like so complex and stuff, there's no way it just happens to exist. Reserve that concept for God. Evolution! LOL! Humans are not animals, they are created in god's image.
Your comment proves you have no idea what you are talking about and thus it explains why you think evolution is a crock.
"I mean seriously, you believe your ancient ancestors were monkey? If so, then why are monkeys still around?" Evolution happens very slowly over millions of years. One mutation at a time. Not all members of a species get those mutations however. And you then have a branch in the tree. Very simplistic explanation obviously.
"You honestly believe your grandpa was a rock?" No, nobody believes that.
"I mean like cell structure is like so complex and stuff, there's no way it just happens to exist." Actually over billions of years the chances of it not happening are remote. Deep time is a hard concept for most to wrap their brains around. But Chemical reactions would form things like lipids. Lipids have hydrophobic tails so they will find ways to form where the tails are "hidden" from water until eventually you have cell walls. Etc. It is all just chemistry, given a long enough time the reactions WILL occur.
"Reserve that concept for God." So god can just be, but the universe can't just be? (And I am not saying the Universe just IS either.
"Humans are not animals, they are created in god's image." Humans are animals. That is a fact sorry.
You have a book, The Bible, which tells you that God exists. I am curious, why do you believe that magical beings in that book are real, yet you don't believe Harry Potter is real. Or Frodo Baggins, or Merlin etc.....or do you actually believe in those things?
You think the Bible is a "magical book" depicting "magical beings?" You need a HISTORY LESSON!!!!! Type this into your search engine: "Dead Sea Scrolls." Roman historic texts confirm the Bible. Countless personal accounts confirm the Bible. And not just the Bible, but the "magical beings" in it as well. More than 90% of Americans believe in God. More than 80% of the world believes in God. Do you truly think that six billion people's beliefs came from a spontaneous, unanimous delusion? Do not deceive yourself. That's even stupider than the notion that we evolved under astronomical odds and are also animals. REALITY CHECK!
Even the best scientists cannot understand what a soul is. They cannot even understand the conscious mind, let alone the unconscious! Consciousness, soul, and the paranormal DID NOT EVOLVE. The universe, in question, is still unexplored. But to make it short, the universe DID NOT EVOLVE either.
As for your little comment about "chemical reactions," the entire theory of evolution is STILL A THEORY. How can scientists truly prove their theory? Fossils? Rocks? Genetics? It doesn't matter. Just because it may look and smell like something doesn't mean it is. The current methods of determining fossil age or genetic mutation ARE FLAWED AND CANNOT BE TRUSTED. How can they prove their methods for absolute certainty? Easy. They would have to travel time. And I would love to see if you could prove that time itself evolved as well.
Come on! Here is what has been proven to exist: spirits, the psychic mind, the whole paranormal spectrum, and space/time dimensions on Earth (like the Bermuda Triangle). These things DID NOT EVOLVE. And, after years of study and contemplation, I have come to realize some of the most simple, fundamental truths of the human race. The Bible is very real. The people portrayed in it are very real, as our their stories. The Bible doesn't just say that God is real. It has taught us love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control.
Those who have a problem with these things are definitely more animal than I thought.
The Founding Fathers founded America upon these Christian Biblical principles. What is the first thing God gives us besides life? Free will. If we have laws and commandments, it is because we CHOOSE to live by them. HE gives us that choice. WE determine our destiny and our fate. What is the first amendment in the Bill of Rights? FREE SPEECH and FREE EXERCISE OF RELIGION.
If you have a problem with these things, you might as well study Nazi ideology.
If you have a problem with us Christians or Jews, you should have a problem with gays and atheists too. Like gays, Jews and atheists alike, we have FREE SPEECH and FREE EXERCISE OF RELIGION. We are equal.
Said Thomas Jefferson, "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."
You believe God cannot exist? Well, neither can the universe. You believe that the Bible has no truth? Well, neither does The Origin of Species. EVOLUTION IS FLAWED. The Bible, however, is not.
Are humans animals, or are animals humans? Do we have to go outside, or do we find a bathroom? Do we bark and purr, or do we type and reply? That question must be settled by one's self, depending on how animal-minded one is.
We believe in God. We believe in the Bible. We believe in loving our neighbors as we would ourselves. We believe in hoping for the better angels of our nature. We believe in faith, the faith in God Almighty, maker of Heaven and Earth, of all things visible and invisible.
We do not persecute you because our opinions are different. We donate more to causes than politicians ever will. We believe in doing what is right, not what is easy. We will not forget the Founding Fathers, America, God or the Bible. We will not forget or betray you either. WE ARE CHRISTIANS.
George Washington and Abraham Lincoln were Christians. They did not descend from monkeys and they most certainly did not evolve. Neither did I. And frankly, neither did you.
You and I have something in common. We were created by God, the Creator. Whether or not we believe this, we strive for that symbol of love, forgiveness and perfection. We are all human.
I say this not as a rallying cry against those who do not agree with us. That is tyranny and oppression. But you atheists fight to destroy our very nature, though we pose no threat to you. You fight to destroy our human rights and our religion, though we pose no threat to you. You attack constantly without solid reason, though we pose no threat to you, and we barely even fight back. You, who oppress others for their religion and beliefs, commit tyranny and oppression. In both our worlds, those are crimes against humanity.
My best friend is Catholic. I've met atheists who were good, loving people. I've meet Christians who were complete jerks. Why? Because no matter how we evolved or were created, WE ARE ALL HUMAN.
Said John F. Kennedy, "Our most basic common link is that we all inhabit this planet. We all breathe the same air. We all cherish our children's future. And we are all mortal."
God "is." The Bible "is." The universe also "is," seeing as how God created everything. Humans are not animals. Quite basically, humans are humans. Evolution is flawed and illogical in billions of ways. And if I can't prove it with philosophical evidence, neither can you.
We are Christians. We are not cowards. We do not surrender to oppressive ideology, as the Nazis realized. But we can love each other and we can be friends. One of our fundamental beliefs should coincide with yours: COEXIST. Ring a bell?
May life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness prevail for you and all people.
Excellent choice in choosing Thomas Jefferson to quote.
Thomas Jefferson was not only NOT a Christian, he thought the Bible contains so much nonsense that he edited his version down to 50 pages. Well done.
True he famously cut and pasted pages out of it of his own design. I don't think he believed in God either.
Bravo Simon Peter, Bravo.
Matthew Jude.
Vaya con Deus friend in Christ
Jefferson did believe in God, even attending Unitarian services and spoke highly of them, and there is this quote: "I am a real Christian, that is to say, a disciple of the doctrines of Jesus." Jefferson has been mis-quoted and taken out of context for when he attacks the church because he was a fundamentalist and believes it should be purified of the corruption and hypocracy (much of which still goes on today). Those attacks do not mean he is un-Christian – if anything, they solidify his stance. How about reading this: http://www.truthcontrol.com/articles/was-thomas-jefferson-christian-did-he-believe-jesus-christ
"And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerve in the brain of Jupiter. But may we hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away with this artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine doctrines of this most venerated reformer of human errors."
-Thomas Jefferson, Letter to John Adams, April 11, 1823
I believe in hobbits.
We all evolved from monkeys...it is just that SOME of us have evolved far more than others...others have a long way to go...
Wow, so you guys really DO believe your grandpa was a rock! Ha! And they say Christianity is silly!! God really is a nice guy. He just happened to get really angry one day and drown virtually every species on earth.
When did they let you out of jail, Kent?
WE AS HUMAN BEINGS ARE MORE FLAWED AND SINFUL THEN WE EVER COULD DARE IMAGINE BUT THROUGH GODS GRACE(WHICH MEANS HE DID IT NOT THROUGH WORKS OR ANYTHING THAT ANY PERSON COULD EVER DO,SAY, OR ACT GAVE US MERCY) WE ARE FORGIVEN AND LOVE MORE THAN WE COULD EVER IMAGINE. I'm very sorry to you who are empty and missing GOD for his real character, He is a loving GOD but also is Just, GOD HATES EVIL therefore EVIL must be punished. It's not that GOD doesn't want to love you its that you reject the attempts that he throws your way to see the TRUTH. GOD doesn't kill people for fun he punishes the sinful actions that we do. I pray that GOD touches a few hearts and I challenge the atheist's that really think they know what the bible says to really open and read it instead of just assuming that you know what it says. GODS WORD is powerful and I doubt that you will not be intrigued by how powerful it is. GOD BLESS
The answer is not in genesis it is below. no god(s) needed.
Scientists Solve Major Piece in the Origin of Biological Complexity
Nov. 6, 2013 — Scientists have puzzled for centuries over how and why multicellular organisms evolved the almost universal trait of using single cells, such as eggs and sperm, to reproduce. Now researchers led by University of Minnesota College of Biological Sciences postdoctoral fellow William Ratcliff and associate professor Michael Travisano have set a big piece of that puzzle into place by applying experimental evolution to transform a single-celled algae into a multicellular one that reproduces by dispersing single cells.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2013/11/131106073859.htm
wow.....man is flawed and in need of redemption because a book said so. how insightful
@The Lord is my Shepard[sic],
Why a shepherd (correct spelling, btw) takes such good care of his sheep:
- For profit from their wool
- For profit from their flesh and skins at slaughter
- For a tasty meal
Is your "shepherd" all dressed in shearling and snacking on rack of lamb?
The guy who thought up that analogy was quite silly.
"To all of our Atheist friends, thank god you're wrong"....really? That's less than helpful in presenting your message and pushes most real atheists further from the doors of religion, let alone the doors of a church. Why not come up with some proof of the existence of a deity, present your case and "pray" that your message makes even the slightest bit of sense? Why not cease arguing over the assumptions with tumultuous idiocy of your very narrow perspective and provide people with ONE piece of proof of the existence of the deity that you champion? As a point of order, "look around you" is not, nor will it ever be proof of your claim. Looking around is clearly proof to the opposite of your point as chaos theory is CLEARLY at work all around us. You present proof, I'll stipulate that you're not bat-cheese crazy and life will finally have the profoundness that you're peddling.
Have you gone to the website Answersingenesis? Have you ever looked into why people have issues with evolution? If not, then any message to "real Athiests" would be disregarded and attacked.
This message may let people review other evidence. There are some biologists that really question Evolution as the answer and admit there are holes in the theory, which need to be addressed.
So go do some mind opening digging, broaden your horizons. Go look up how rocks from Volcanic activity were submitted for dating and the crazy results. Or you could stay inside your garden walls.
Nobody with a half a brain believes anything on AIG. Real biologists that have worked in the field do not doubt evolution. It is the cornerstone for all of biology. It is universally accepted in the scientific community as valid science. AIG promotes lies about science and it doesn't take a nuclear physicist to figure it out. The reason people are denouncing this stuff is because they HAVE been to that lying website. There's nothing wrong with faith, but promoting lies and attacking science without proposing an alternate theory backed by evidence is nonsensical. People should promote their faith based on the positive influence on their life and the morality it teaches, rather than preach against a solid field of science in evolutionary biology. AIG is a joke, just like the creationist museum. There is no evidence at all to support that viewpoint, or the viewpoint that evolution is wrong.
When lava flows over the ground, it melts some of the rock, sedimentary rock, that can be millions of years old, incorporating it into the lava's flow. You'd expect that aging lave would have highly different results for that reason. This doesn't invalidate the methods used by scientist to determine the age of stones.
Scrutiny? What's that? Smart people blindly believe in things like god just because their parents said so. I just don't understand how you could condemn scientific theories founded on objective evidence while at the same time blindly believing in a guess such as religoin. Show some scrutiny with your own beliefs and then you can start mentioning proven facts. That's pure hypocrisy.
Try a little philosophy. You may come up atheist, you may come up theist, you may come up solipsist but at least you'll loose a little arrogance along the way.
Arrogance? Believing in scientific data that has been experimented with and tested over and over and over again is not arrogant, it's logical. Arrogance is denouncing science when you haven't ever stepped in a lab or worked in the field and claiming to know more than them when you don't even understand the basic fundamentals of evolution. This is AIG in a nutshell.