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 Former President George W. Bush plans to address a group committed to converting Jews to Christianity.
November 13th, 2013
05:34 PM ET
Bush's plans to address Messianic Jewish group irks former aidesBy Jessica Ravitz, CNN (CNN) - Of course Tevi Troy has heard the hubbub. He knows full well that his onetime boss, former President George W. Bush, plans to speak Thursday at a Dallas fundraiser for the Messianic Jewish Bible Institute – a group dedicated to converting Jews to Christianity. “I have yet to meet a Jewish person who hasn’t heard about this,” says Troy, who served as a Bush administration liaison to the Jewish community and was a former deputy secretary at the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services. The topic of conversion can prompt a visceral reaction for Jews whose darker times have been marred by persecution, expulsion and forced conversions. Millions have died for and because of their faith. “There’s good historical reason for the Jewish discomfort,” Troy says. But before Troy, an Orthodox Jew, will tread into this controversy, he wants to discuss the Jewish value of hakarat hatov, or “recognizing the good.” He says people should remember and appreciate that Bush was “a very good president to the Jewish people.” He was a friend to Israel during the Second Intifada, Troy says. He was an outspoken opponent of anti-Semitism. And in the wake of the murder of American journalist Daniel Pearl by al Qaeda in Pakistan in 2002, when Jews felt like targets, Troy says Bush took on terrorism. That said, when it comes to Bush’s decision to speak at the annual banquet for this messianic group, one that believes Jews like this former aide need to be saved, Troy admits, “I would be lying if I said I wasn’t disappointed.” CNN tried to speak with five other former Bush administration liaisons to the Jewish community, but only two of those responded. Both suggested Troy could speak for them, too. His words, though, are tempered. Others, such as Rabbi David Wolpe, who was dubbed America’s most influential rabbi by Newsweek in 2012, called Bush’s decision “infuriating.” The Messianic Jewish Bible Institute is representative of a longstanding effort to convert Jews, one that dates back to Paul in the New Testament who said, in Romans 1:16, that the Gospel should be taken “to the Jew first.” The institute's website features a menorah in its logo. Its chairman is listed as Rabbi Jonathan Bernis, a man who heads up another organization called Jewish Voice Ministries International, where an “Ask the Rabbi” feature includes an image of him wearing a yarmulke and Jewish prayer shawl. CNN reached out to Bernis at Jewish Voice Ministries but was told by a spokeswoman that he was not allowed to comment on the upcoming fundraiser. Then CNN asked where he had been ordained as a rabbi, and the spokeswoman hung up the phone. We also called the Messianic Jewish Bible Institute, which pulled down from its website any references to Bush’s upcoming appearance soon after Mother Jones broke the story. An institute spokeswoman said there would be no comment. A source close to Bush, who didn't want to be named, confirmed to CNN on Wednesday afternoon that the former president still plans to speak at Thursday’s banquet, where tickets reportedly range in price from $100 to $100,000. The source also said that Bush addresses all sorts of groups, secular and religious of varying stripes. Bush tells stories from the White House and speaks about his love for America, which includes a commitment to religious freedom and tolerance, according to the source. Had Bush’s onetime liaison to the Jewish community still been working with the former president or been asked, Troy said he certainly would have advised against such an appearance. Troy says the problem is most people don’t understand why talk of converting Jews stirs up such strong feelings in the Jewish community. “It dates back to a time when forced conversion was a serious issue, when the church was imbued with the power of state,” he says. Troy points to the Spanish Inquisition as an example, explaining how under duress and torture, Jews had to convert to Christianity or face expulsion from Spain in 1492. Those who stayed and exhibited any shred of Jewish observance were persecuted. The Messianic Jewish Bible Institute, founded in the mid-1990s, includes in its mission the goal to "educate Christians in their role to provoke the Jewish people to jealousy and thus save some of them." The institute's statement of faith also says that those who are born Jewish and "place their faith in Messiah Yeshua," Jesus, "have not disowned or separated themselves from their race and Judaic heritage, but remain sons and daughters of Israel." Missionary outreach to Jews in America isn't new. It dates back to the 19th century. A Hungarian man who called himself a "rabbi" established a ministry in 1894 to target Jewish immigrants in Brooklyn, offering them assistance, education and New Testaments translated into Yiddish. On the opposite coast in San Francisco in 1973, a Baptist minister - who was born Jewish - founded a proselytizing organization called Jews for Jesus. His small army has been knocking on doors and pounding the pavement ever since. A less aggressive approach, preferred by others who might call themselves Messianic Jews or Hebrew Christians, has been the establishment of Messianic “synagogues” and organizations. They’re sponsored by Christians, and they incorporate Jewish symbols and modified Jewish rituals. They’re often led by leaders who call themselves rabbis, use Hebrew phrases and wear traditional Jewish accessories. Critics cry false advertising, subterfuge and bemoan how such outfits, including the Messianic Jewish Bible Institute, which built its base in the former Soviet Union, often target Jews who don’t know better – what Rob Eshman of the Jewish Journal in Los Angeles called, “the low-hanging fruit of Jewish identity.” While Messianic Jews believe it’s possible to be Jewish while believing Jesus is the Messiah, others say this makes as much sense as a vegetarian who believes in scarfing down steak. The historical concern may have been rooted in forced conversions, but Troy knows that's not an issue today. In fact, the group Bush will address - and others like it - don’t really worry him. He’s more concerned about a recent Pew study that showed how a growing number of American Jews don’t identify with any faith, let alone their own. About a third of American Jews born after 2000 answered “none” when asked about their religious affiliation, the survey showed. Of everyone surveyed who was raised Jewish, according to the researchers, 6% now describe themselves as Christian - mostly as Catholics, Protestants or "just Christian." Messianic Jews, Pew said, constitute a very small group. Meantime, though, the Pew survey also showed that 34% of those asked believe a person can be Jewish and believe Jesus was the messiah. But the fundraiser in Dallas, even if it features the likes of a former U.S. president, isn’t what’s hurting American Jews, Troy says. "Judaism," he says, "has other and bigger problems."
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.  |
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Nobody should be surprised by this. If Sun Yung Moon's church offered him enough Bush would talk the them too. Easy money is just too hard for George to resist. And about those "messianic Jews," their very name is a contradiction in the minds of thinking Jews. Go meet with some of these folks and check them out. They are the saddest bunch of people trying to look happy. There are half as many Jews in the entire world as there are people in California. There are more people in Syria than there are Jews in the world. We are an easy target. For centuries, mllenia, the people of the world have tried to enslave us or kill us off, or convert us. We are like a ball, the tighter you press us the stronger we get. And when we bounce back, as we always have, just look out. Jews are not proselytizers. We're not looking for new members, except for the ones we've already got. Proselytizers are very un-Jewish. These Jews for Jesus are a fringe group. They are to the Jews what snake handlers down south are to Christians. I don't think we really pay them much mind. Like the man says, we have bigger fish to fry.
George W. Bush Net Worth | Celebrity Net Worth
http://www.celebritynetworth.com/.../presidents...
Former Texas governor and U.S.A. president George W. Bush has a net worth of $26 million
He may not be doing it for the money.
I disagree your comment about the sad state of messianic Jews, actually I find them to be kind and really accomplished. Unlike most Jews I know who are mostly interested in helping their own people, they are reaching out to fulfill their belief. What is wrong with George Bush speaking at their event? Isn't this country suppose to have religious freedom? Any Christian shares the view of the messianic Jews if they actually read the Bible.
Jacob does have his troubles. Shoulda, coulda, woulda been better to keep up with Israel.
The flesh is weak 98.8% dustball dirtball chumpy chimps. Need any more examples??
I would love to hear Doubleya speak the truth about 9/11.
The Shrub is a evolutionary back step so should make a great presenter to a bunch of mentally ill believer delusionals.
I can't believe I am about to defend a man who I consider not only our worst president ever, but one of the most damaging, dangerous world leaders in history...
There is no controversy here. Christians also proselytize, yet no one raises an eyebrow when Presidents or former presidents address such groups.
This is no surprise at all. Bush didn't understand half of what was going on around him when he was President. How would he understand that this is insulting to Jews? Of course his right wing religiosity could well be blinding him to others' viewpoints. Heck, on the eve of his immoral invasion of Iraq he still didn't know the difference between a Sunni and a Shi'ite.
Just a small detail you overlooked:
The cycle,
Bush I..........white horse
Clinton.........red horse
Bush II.........black horse
Obama.........pale horse
The free wurld???????
BBbbwaaaaahahahaha
Don't see a cycle.
.
... and the jews don't try to convert christians?
.
Gimme a break!
.
Actually they don't.
I never had a Jew (or a Muslim for that matter) come to my door to bother me about why I should be "saved".
No they don't. I know a guy who did convert. As a rule Rabbi's will turn away converts and actively discourage then a number of times before actually beginning the process. Get educated before you make such statements.
You do realize what males have to do when converting to Judaism?
We do not proselytize. If folks want to join up we put them through the mill. We do not make it easy. Those who come in to the temple most often stay with it. But we don't want you. We are the less than 1%ers and we like it that way. In the whole world all we want is a little piece of the desert in the Mediterranean. And the whole world begrudges us that. Including you. Shame
How come you never looked at Australia?? OOops, I forgot, Dispensationalists and the witch girl.
Jews don't want you anyway. Your a schmuck.
I have never had any person of any religion other than christianity try to bring me into their 'fold.'
I wouldn't pay to hear George W. Bush if he was the last person on earth. Of course, if he really was the last person on earth, I wouldn't be here.
.
Tom, you are not as dumb as you souns.
.
.
sound.
.
You are correct. And funny.
The three Abrahamic religions are desert blood cults.
Yer kids are hooked on blood cheese.
Life is in the blood.
No. It's poetic, but untrue. Life arises from a complex combination of chemicals working together. if we might say that "life" is "somewhere," then it is in the electromagnetic force.
Have you had a PET scan?? Not all psychos are killers, just wanna be winners. Look at James Fallon on youtube.
The mark of the Beast just happens to reside in the forehead. How coincidental!!
HowStuffWorks "How Blood Works"
science.howstuffworks.com/life/.../blood....
Blood is the most commonly tested part of the body, and it is truly the river of life. Learn about red and white blood cells, ...
You obviously know nothing about chemical processes and the electromagnetic force, Robert. Life is more about the brain and the neurons than the blood. Catch phrases are tough to let go of, huh?
Jehovah Witnesses say "the life is in the blood." I know it must be biblical, but I can't place it. At any rate, it's a sort of right of passage for biology students to have to explain what life is. Really, it is too complicated for a single word.
Leviticus 17:11 – For the life of a creature is in the blood, and I have given it to you to make atonement for yourselves on the altar; it is the blood that makes atonement for one’s life.
So I guess you must presuppose that blood is uniquely important, Robert. Also, since they don't have blood, arthropods must be right out as sacrificial animals.
Capt.
Yes, you are correct. I don't know much about the electromagnetic force.
Hey Tom,
You catch on quick. The shed blood of Jesus is our life.
Those creeping things do have a different kind of blood than we do.
Said a member of one of those blood cults. Yeah, you have a lot of credibility around here, Robert, after all the disgusting things you've done here. Why anyone like you should ever be allowed the same level of free speech as the rest of us......
That which does not kill us makes us stronger.
Not if it makes you weaker. You really are stupid. I put your IQ at somewhat below 100. What you don't know can kill you.
Sorry Crom, I thought you might recognize a Conan quote. Oh well.
RB
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger."
Not actually true for everyone. In fact I believe that star
RB
"That which does not kill us makes us stronger."
Not actually true for everyone. In fact I believe that saying started as a statement of intent.
What doesn't kill us makes us stronger was written by philosopher Friedrich Nietzsche in the Twilight of the Idols (1888). This quote is used to give people encouragement after they have gone through trying times and have survived such. The saying can also be used to give others comfort after a period of suffering and pain.
All religion is evil.
No religion is evil, just stupid.
Barry?
No religion is evil, just stupid with even stupider adherents.
What does the big religion call the small religion? A cult.
Some are evil, Howie.
All of them are evil, robert. All of them. They all refuse honest truth at the slightest hint of a threat to their brainwashing program.
The Truth will set you free.
Actual truth will not necessarily set you free of anything at all.
Robert, you spout inane nonsense so often I hereby dub thee Robert the Inane and grant you the lands under whatever rock you choose to live beneath. So say I.
Thanks
George Bush was a good president to nobody.
Except to comedy fans. That's Obama's problem. He's just a bad president. Not terrible, just bad and he did inherit a terrible situation. Bush however was an absolutely terrible president but he sure was funny. It's his redeeming characteristic. Does Obama have a redeeming characteristic? I guess he sang Sweet Home Chicago quite well.
He was good to GM and Chrysler and the banks and we still have an economy. He was good to the seniors. He fought al qaeda unlke his predecessor. There was some good in G Bush, as much good as any other recent president.
bill,
"good to the economy"? He left the stock market PLUMMETING and the Dow was down over 20% from his first to last day. We are setting records often now.
bush created the housing bubble and the banking abuses? Hardly. Those were 20 years in the making. Clinton did NOTHING
He bailed out the economy after the big banks screwed it all up. Bush did not run the federal reserve. He did not cause the stock market to crash
bill,
Bush "bailed out the economy"? And how was that? Clinton left a surplus. Bush left the stock market DOWN 22% for his terms. The economy was PLUMMETING when Bush left. The biggest concern for everyone then was whether any day it would totally collapse.
Bush did, however, start a $2,000,000,000,000 war for false reasons.
Oh, he was good to some folks. Just not us.
What do you consider "good" when every single person who ever lived has used nothing but moral relativism?
Perhaps you mean in one or more ways that do not treat you as you would like, legal or not, amirite?
I was speaking of his generosity to those like himself. He was good to the energy industry and real good to the military industrial complex. The rest of us get to fight for what is left.
So Jews don't like people who preach the Gospel to them, because of the Spanish Inquisition in 1492. That was over 500 years ago. No one is talking about forcing Jews to convert today. So what's the crying about?
do you want someone in your face to covert you from probably christianity to Islam? Those wars were fought 600 years ago. What is your problem? Why the crying? Why wouldn't you convert?
Marx's dad converted and the rest is history. Talk about getting bit in the butt by yer ancestors!! The Vikings are still payin' for their thieving ancestors of pagan beliefs.
70 years ago they were burning Jews in ovens in Germany. The great war that ensued was certainly not to save the Jews, but to save our own butts. And how about the middle east? Ongoing for over 60 years. Just because a few million people of the desert by the Med, their neighbors, over a billion muslims, want them dead and gone. I guess you have been out of town.
So Bush shouldn't speak at this event because of the Spanish inquisition in 1492? What, are you kidding me? Kind of a stretch, don't ya think? You're actually comparing talking to an evangelical group with supporting the torture, murder, and forced conversion of Jews and Muslims 500 years ago? Get a life, dude. Seriously.
Now if he had been speaking to a bunch of Catholic pedo-lovers, the analogy would be more analogous as they are the ones who did the Inquisitions, crusades, pogroms, genocides, massacres, tortures, oh wait the list is too long nevermind
Evangelical Christians are all alike, hellbent on converting Jews. Why? Because after 2,013 years, the rational world is realizing that the Jews are and have always been right: Y'shua Ben Nazareth, if he ever existed at all, is not the Jewish Moshiach and the Christian church is nothing but a church of the golden calf.
The Jews are just as wrong as the Christians.
That's right, only the JEWISH flying spaghetti monster is real! You're all so pathetic.
You mean the Great Flying Lokshen Monster?
Some Jews believe in G_d, I'm told. Some don't. Which of them is and always has been right?
I see you ridin dirtay
you are wrong. I believe in sharing to the TRUTH, to those who seek the TRUTH. Only those the FATHER draws to Yeshua, will come to Yeshua. You cannot persuade a person against their will, SO DON'T WASTE YOUR TIME. Whether JEW are Gentile, I like to let people believe what they choose to believe. THE FACTS HAVE BEEN LAID OUT. WE WILL SEE WHO IS RIGHT. We will see if Jews who reject Yeshua are right, or if Muslims are right, or if Buddhist are right, are if all the other beliefs are right, or if JESUS BELIEVING PEOPLE ARE RIGHT. I know I was healed of heart disease in the name of JESUS, SO LETS JUST WAIT AND SEE.
....I do not believe that a man called JESUS CHRIST existed!
Napoleon Bonaparte (as quoted by General Charles Dupuis) upon the discovery of the Rosetta in Egypt
Oh boy. Let the histrionics begin...
Science has rolled over the psychologists. Psychopathy is a spectrum disorder. The fraudian Freudians with the bad data from observations of s*exual attraction overlooked the rich and the wet nurses. PET scans and simple reflexive observations will be like fingerprints.
".............."Judaism," he says, "has other and bigger problems."......"
As a former supporter of Jews For Jesus a long, long time ago, I recognize the cultural bias that doesn't seem "fair" to the lost. But the not-a-Jews are gonna have to face the fact of their divorce. It won't hurt. and it might just even slow down the religions claiming the first covenant that's OVER. Like Mormons, Dispensationalists, Rapturists, and even Arab Muslims. OOOps, almost forgot the RCC.
And, of course, you are perfectly free of any such bias. Right. I'll put that over here with the rest of the BS. Thanks.
Are you scientific??
Did somebody need a good scientific ass-whoopin'?
I understand Joe Six-Pack .But if you want us to have a beer with the Big O, I ain't going unless the Scotch is at least 75 years old.
The only religion/faith that is NOT lost is Judaism. All others who came after Judaism and borrowed from it (Christianity and Islam) are the lost ones which should be saved!
Any Jew who works for evangelical/right wing Christians or neo-con Jews should NOT be surprised!!
Holy crap, people actually pay good money to listen to G.W. "Bubblehead" Bush flap his gums? Man, I am definitely in the wrong business.
I would. The guy is a comic genius.
Ollie North is still on the paid speech circuit. He swings by our town every year or so.
No matter how depraved, there is a market for it somewhere.
All the ex-presidents get big bucks for speechifying BS to anyone with a few thousand to rub together who want the "inside" BS to make them feel important and "smart".
Protip: You rarely get what you pay for.
Hrmph.
Nope. Not me. I am not surprised nor freaked out to hear of little 'w' catering to anyone like the ho he always has been.
People like that are predictably ridiculous and depraved. This is not really news, just a small update on a different day.
Just imagine the Christian uproar there was a Jewish organization out to convert christians...we try hard to talk would-be converts out of doing so....maybe we need to change that
There wouldn't be such an organization as it would go against Jewish theology. There are Islamic groups who try to peacefully convert people in the US (and given the situation in the world, you'd think that would be far more contentious).
Ever heard of the problem of legalism for Christians?? Oh, well americult is a nation of laws and PROUD of it.
BBbbwwwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahaha