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January 7th, 2014
10:00 AM ET
Satanists unveil design for OK statehouse statueBy Daniel Burke, CNN Belief Blog Co-Editor (CNN) - Satanists have unveiled their design for a proposed statue at the Oklahoma state Capitol, including a place for people to sit on the devil's lap "for inspiration and contemplation." The New York-based Satanic Temple submitted its proposal to Oklahoma officials this month after applying for a spot on Capitol grounds late last year. The Satanists say their statue would "complement and contrast" with a Ten Commandments monument placed at the Capitol in Oklahoma City in 2012. The Satanists' proposed monument depicts Baphomet, a goat-headed pagan idol sitting on a 7-foot-tall throne inscribed with an inverted pentagram. In an artist's rendering provided by the Satanic Temple, smiling children look adoringly at the devilish figure. "The statue will serve as a beacon calling for compassion and empathy among all living creatures," Lucien Greaves, a spokesman for the Satanic Temple, said in a prepared statement. "The statue will also have a functional purpose as a chair where people of all ages may sit on the lap of Satan for inspiration and contemplation.” According to its Indiegogo page, the Satanists have raised more than $16,000 toward their goal of $20,000 for the monument, which Greaves said would "be a historical marker commemorating the scapegoats, the marginalized, the demonized minority and the unjustly outcast.” The Temple of Satan is less a religious body organized around rituals and regular meetings than a roving band of political provocateurs, according to Greaves. They believe Satan is a "literary construct," the spokesman said, not an actual being with horns and hooves. READ MORE: Satanists want statue next to Ten Commandments The proposed statue includes quotations from poets Lord Byron and William Blake. “Prisons are built with stones of Law, Brothels with bricks of Religion” runs the Blake quotation. The 18th-century poet was a Christian, albeit one with a mystical bent and little use for traditional morality. The statue's main figure, Baphomet, has long been associated with Satan, Greaves said. In the 12th century, the Knights Templar, a group of Christian crusaders, were accused of worshiping Baphomet in their secretive rituals. "From the mythology created by these accusations against the Templars, we now have a symbol for Satan pictured as a goat-headed beast," Greaves said. Since the 1960s, a variation of the horned goat head has been the official symbol of the Church of Satan, which is not affiliated with the Temple of Satan. The head of the Church of Satan has told CNN he does not approve of the idea of a Satanist statue on public grounds. Oklahoma state Rep. Paul Wesselhoft told CNN that he doesn't think the Satanists' statue will be approved. “What will disqualify them has really nothing to do with Satan as such; it's that it has no historical significance for the state of Oklahoma,” he said. Trait Thompson, chairman of Oklahoma's Capitol Preservation Committee, said he has not received the Satanists' proposed design yet. He also said that no applications will be considered until a lawsuit over the Ten Commandments monument is settled. The American Civil Liberties Union has sued over Oklahoma's Ten Commandments monument, calling it an unconstitutional government endorsement of religion. After news broke of the Satanists' proposal, the state was flooded with requests from religious groups seeking to erect monuments to their own faith, including Hindus and Pastafarians, a satirical religion that "worships" the Flying Spaghetti Monster. An Oklahoma lawmaker told CNN that the Satanists' message wouldn't fly in the Bible Belt state, where nearly two-thirds of the population is Christian. "Any monument displayed on state property should reflect the values of Oklahoma or memorialize those who built or defended our freedom," Rep. Bob Cleveland said Tuesday. "In my opinion, this Satanist monument does not meet with the values of Oklahomans." soundoff (3,489 Responses)« Previous 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 Next »
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.  |
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Rep. Cleveland needs a refresher course on the Establishment Clause.
Let's ask the Duck Commander if this should be allowed.
I think most of would agree what they would think. And I agree. Hell is real, Satan is real. Read accounts of visions of hell. People who want to go there will go there.
You appear to be missing an "n" in your name.
iroy
"Satan is real"...if he is, he inspired your bible, since the result of having the bible in the world has been death, spread of disease, destrution on an amazing scale. Just the fact that no two interpret it the same way, is evidence of the lord of chaos' hand in it. Certainly no god would get so much wrong, like the bible is.
I mean seriously, who believes that you can test your wife's fidelity by having her drink magic water and dust.
You clearly have been deceived by satans greatest trick...convincing people that god inspired the bible when it was satan himself who inspired it.
All you non-christians out there. You just don't get it. Satan has you just where he wants you.
To you non-mayans – Quetzlcoatl has you right where he wants you.
Loki is laughing at you all....
I smite thee, verily, Beelzepoodle!
Quetzalcóatl is an aztec god, for the mayans it would be Kukulcán
Yeah...wouldn't want to offend any living Mayans or Azt.....oh yeah....nevermind.
no
There are many living Mayans today. They are direct descendants of the Original Mayans and many keep their culture alive.
To all you non-Athenians out there, Zeus has you right where he wants you.
Atheists do not believe in hell anymore than they believe in heaven. Therefore, they do not believe in God, let alone Satan. Well, when they die, one way or another they will be proved wrong and incorrect.
I guess we'll just have to take you word for it since you can't provide poof right.. .
I mean there is 0% chance that you a mere human could possibly be mistaken right?
Or you'll find out that you're gullible and stupid.
Or maybe just...NOTHING.
you know, if blind faith in a mysterious being is a prerequisite to entering heaven, regardless of how honest/good/moral/generous/kind/etc you were in life, then perhaps heaven isn't the place to be
May Thor hit you over the head with his very large hammer!
When Captain Amexican throws his mighty bean, all those who chose to oppose his bean will scream!
I get the horns and Anubis-style sort of Egyptian head, but what's with the blanket on the Evil One's lap? Looks like the throw-rug from Grandma's day room. A shawl perhaps? Makes Satan look like he's been in an assisted living facility playing bingo. We can do better!
Don't want people staring at his goat-dork, it would detract from it's main message.
If there was such a thing.......
Let me try to spell this out. The irony here, is that it hasn't seemed to sink into the Christians who've expressed mortification at the proposal of edifying Satan on public property, that these so-called Satanists do not believe in the existence of Satan and are only seeking to provoke those who believe in both their Christian god as well as Satan to make a political and social statement. Many Christians presume that everyone entertains a belief in something otherworldly, and they just can't wrap their brains around the idea that many aren't given to bizarre belief systems of one kind or another.
If the preachers and Bible thumpers in Oklahoma had their way, I bet they would love to have back the power to HUNT DOWN ALL YOU HERETIC POSTERS and have you whipped down in their dungeons for all your blasphemous comments. Fortunately, the FOUNDING FATHERS of this country understood the danger of giving religious fanatics any secular power and so we have SEPARATION OF CHURCH AND STATE, and thus did not become a CHRISTIAN IRAN with a supreme Christian Ayatollah proclaiming 'death fatwas' against satirical, disrespectful poster like you and me!
Till the time our country was fearing God, it was number ONE country in the world in every area of life but since then we are nowhere. Yes, you have right to believe what you want to and you have right to be stupid too. People who follow Godly principles are much happier and secure.
And apparently only semi-literate.
I completely agree with Atul's first sentance.
You will be destroyed.
Who? Me?
Thanks for the warning I guess.
Time to max out my credit cards!
Oh crap – he found me! (sound of running steps fading into distance)...
Just more proof that it's going downhill, and going faster and faster.
More proof that what is going downhill, faster and faster?
Putting mythical characters on public display probably doesn't bother you when it's *your* delusion.
Really?!? I didn't see any wheels on the thing.... did I miss something?
IT is going downhill? Clarify please.......
The legislature stating that Satanism is not representative of Oklahoma values is an improper endorsement (albeit negative) of religion by government. They allowed a 10 commandments statue; they should not discriminate against other religions. Personally, I want to see what the Pastafarians erect.
You want to see the statue Italian chefs erect?
I partially agree with you. I think the government shouldn't be involved in the decision. However, I don't think that any religion should be automatically be placed on state property. So, I would advocate that any monument that gets at least 5% of the voters should be entitled to being placed on state property. Otherwise, you could have outsiders forcing their views upon others – contrary to our form of government.
I see where you are coming from but popular vote should not be relied on when consitutional issues are at stake. Too much opportunity for the tyranny of the majority.
Much easier (and cheaper!) to just say – no religious monuments on government property.
I'm pretty sure jesus didn't have 5% support when (if) he was crucified.
"Pastafarians", makes me hungry just thinking about it.
I don't believe in Pastafarianism. Too much starch in their diets.
Personally, I would rather have a symbol of Islam.
Oh man! Them christians must be foaming at the mouth right about now...
They are foaming like atheists mouths foam when looking at the 10 Commandments statue.
But for different reasons I'm willing to bet...
Right. They atheists reasons are perfectly scientific and amazingly logical. The Christian's reasons are deluded and retarded.
LOL.. I like you, you're funny.
But seriously, is that what you really think?
I've met many irrational atheists in my time. I've also met many irrational Christians in my time. Sometimes I have a hard time telling atheists and Christians apart.
I can see where you are coming from. In cases like this though, I am neither. I'm an american that knows a secular government is in the best interests of ALL americans regardless of their beliefs.
I think that's the real point trying to be proven here. Thx – GDT
Funny; Satan looks much taller in person.
That's cause it isn't a statue of Satan, it's one of his cousins from the pagan religions.
That's because he's sitting. When standing his thingy touches the ground and gives him another foot of height. Hence the big blanket on his lap!
Whats the point? All state houses in the country already have a devil in them.
Most of them move to the DC area eventually.
They should have suggested a statue of Toby Keith. Then they might just get their statue OK'ed.
I can't see a defensible position denying the statue. The Christians opened Pandora's Box.
At least the Satanists refrained from putting Oral Roberts face on the statue!
No, separation of church and state caused this fiasco. The US is the only country in the world to have such a ridiculous law and you waste time and money trying to enforce it. Personally, I'd spray paint a cross on it. Nothing would happen to me. I've never been arrested before lol.
Are you saying that you find the First Amendment to be pointless? How sad.
"No, separation of church and state caused this fiasco." And when the christians in this nation are a minority, you think you'll feel the same way? I certainly wouldn't...
So you are going to deface property you don't own, by putting up a symbol that you believe stands for morality.
Is defacing property you don't own considered to be moral now?
Dasilva: You don't seem to make any sense in your post. Are you saying that the "law" of separating church and state is ridiculous since you believe there should be a state sponsored church in the US (most likely YOUR church) or that such a law is ridiculous since... something else?
So then you go on to say you would paint a cross on a Satan statue and feel justified. Does that mean non-Christians should paint whatever they want on the 10 Commandments statue? Should it be okay for someone to paint on the 10 Commandments and not be punished? Is that your idea of "free speech"?
Solution is simple. Take them ALL DOWN. Leave the statues for the church.
It's a shame that common sense has become so rare that it's a SUPER-POWER.
LOL.. best post so far. You sir, just won the internet.
except this has been reposted about a gazillion times – disturbing that this is the first place you ever heard it. Get out (or stay in) more!
the statue would be a beacon to compassion and empathy towards all....however, the statues values apparently don't line up with the Christian values of Oklahoma. If they are against the values of compassion and empathy, Oklahoma values must suck.
Shall we erect a monument to the 10th commandment on Wall Street?
"Thou shalt not covet...anything that is thy neighbors"
If you could see how nice my neighbour's donkey is, you'd covet dat ass too.
And don't get me started on his manservant!
Oh! A DONKEY! That makes WAY more sense now...
One of the reasons that I firmly back the exclusion of religious symbols from public places is that when you allow one, you open the door for every crack pot and religious nut on the planet. It a circus that we can do without. It's not about atheism! It is about avoiding the very sort of mess that this article addresses.
That is what equal protection under the law usueally means yes.
If you want to allow one group to build a monument you have to allow all of them to build monuments if they choose. Picking and choosing isn't equality, and separate but equal isn't freedom.
It's funny to me how many Republicans say they are for individual freedom and rights, yet are quick to say that people shouldn't have the right to make choices which an result in outcomes they personally disagreeable. (Abortion)
Actually, you do not have to let them all build one. Discretion is still allowed. They are equally allowed to go through the process to erect a monument. That is what is taking place.
Sure Digression is allowed.
The state will say no, The Satanist will sue on grounds of infringement of first amendment rights, the court will say what grounds do you have to deny this request and then the State will lose because they don't have logical rational grounds on which to deny this request.
What grounds do they have to not allow this?
This is hilarious!
Everybody know Satan is just God's gambling buddy. Read the book of Job.
I've taught the book of Job, and nothing along this line is in the book.
Lie4Him
You disingenuous sack of sh!t, who is on your haughty naughty list today?
What? Literally the entire book is Satan goading God into letting him torture Job, because Satan wagers he can make Job curse God's name. Job doesn't acquiesce so Satan pretty much goes double-or-nothing and God gives him the go ahead to take Job's health as well. Are...are you trolling? Or are you seriously that ignorant?
well joebob is right , but maybe the wording was too harsh for lie4him to understand.God will test us all the devil is winning on his earth, this place is mant for him thats why praying is out of shcools, not allowed at games, ect,m the devil wants god and his people as far off as possible.
You cannot teach that which has it's entire base in falsehood. You made more stuff up, is what you did.
Live4Him, JoeBob's description "Satan is just God's gambling buddy" is the central theme of the book of Job. God bets Satan that Job will remain faithful to him, and Satan bets God that Satan can make Job blaspheme and reject God. You may not like the flippant way that JoeBob describes that book of the Bible, but saying "nothing along this line is in the book" is nonsense. What could you have possibly "taught" from the book of Job that ignores the whole background of the book?
L4H
How did you find students more ignorant than you to teach? And they believed you, you're kidding right?
"Stupid is as stupid does." -Forrest Gump
"Then the Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job? There is no one on earth like him; he is blameless and upright, a man who fears God and shuns evil.”
“Does Job fear God for nothing?” Satan replied. 10 “Have you not put a hedge around him and his household and everything he has? You have blessed the work of his hands, so that his flocks and herds are spread throughout the land. But now stretch out your hand and strike everything he has, and he will surely curse you to your face.”
The Lord said to Satan, “Very well, then, everything he has is in your power, but on the man himself do not lay a finger.”
– Job 1:8-12 (NIV)
Live4Him,
You taught a class on the Book of Job?
I took a class on The Iliad... and one on The Odyssey... and one on The Aeneid. It's really interesting to get caught up in that mythology and the trials and tribulations of the heroes, isn't it?
I've taught the book of Job, too. The wager between Satan and God is the central theme. But you know that.
@Hahahaha : Literally the entire book is Satan goading God
God does the 'goading'. No wonder you've misunderstood the book. And God had a purpose in test Job – to eliminate the 'Health and Wealth' doctrine to which Job had subscribed. In his pride, Job had started down a wrong path.
And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my slave Job
@JDMArkansas : God bets Satan that Job will remain faithful to him
Yes, but you missed the 'WHY'.
@Doc Vestibule : "Then the Lord said to Satan, “Have you considered my servant Job?
Exactly – God wanted Job tested.
<><
Have you ever considered how all of Job's family would feel about dying so god could prove a point?
Most Christians believe that GOD WATCHES everything that happens on Earth. This means that God watched as millions of innocent JEWISH CHILDREN and their parents were gassed and thrown into ovens, and HE DID NOTHING TO STOP IT! Doesn't this make God (if this character actually exists) as bad a Satan (if he exists)?
The Jews haven't been God's chosen people since He became His own father and then sacrificed Himself to Himself only to resurrect Himself so that He could Join Himself in Heaven.
So, you know – once you fall out of favour all bets are off.
Just ask the citizens of Sodom.
Brainwashed much are you? Your man made god doesn't exist.
Please check under your bed for the boogie man every night. We don't want him running off with you, your wife, children, etc.
Oh I think you've mistaken Doc for a christian...never assume anything in this world.
Your hate is blinding.
Sarcasm slips by you!
How does a Jew get to heaven if they dry hump the Wailing Wall like Miley Cyrus?
Jews themselves bantered around the number of blood sacrifices necessary to make atonement to God and bring about the establishment of the state of Israel before WW1. The Nazi's and the rest of the World have been manipulated by the chosen ones to subsidize the occupation and creation of this rogue state. The actual number of Jews killed by the Nazi's has been quite controversial with possible numbers falling quite short of the sacred 6 million.
Yes, maybe not quite 6 million, would you feel better if it was only say 500,000 ? that's a lot less... Nazis weren't that bad, they grew a conscience after jew 499,999 was murdered in cold blood... and they did not try to invade western Europe and Russia that was a bunch of lies to make poor Nazis look bad... Nazis were a peaceful people ... lol.
20,000,000 russians died freeing Europe from the clutches of WWII. TWENTY MILLION. Some of them were Jewish.
They built factories to murder as many people as fast as they could. Your minimizing that in your inference that it was a number way short of 6 million (a number that the Nazis own records substantiate) is repugnant to the extreme. Be an adult. OWN your hate and stop insulting others with your revisionist history BS.
God didn't sin on humans, they have chosen to be sinners. Unfortunately, God gave us free will to choose right or wrong. Example: if you're highly intoxicated; either you will have an accident or get pulled by cops while driving under. You can't blame government for that. Can you? Government made laws for people not to drive under influence. Do innocent people get killed by drunk drivers? Yes, all the time. It is the same way, if you will continue to smoke heavily, you're bound to have lung diseases (including cancer). If you live around non-smokers, they are affected by second hand smoke and they could get sick as well. God has given us choices (common sense) to do right. Even if you didn't believe in God, most of these laws are just common sense approach.
Free will is "unfortunate"? LOOOOOOOOOONEY!
Our God and creator gave us a freedom of will, that we are all perfect made by him to live for him. However some people choose to live for other "gods" and think they can play god by taking lifes and terrorizing such as the government is with the Middle Eastern and even in our Nation. If you read the Bible, the most popular book in the world (if you've heard of it from your underground cave) you will see that we hold our own Fate and make our own decisions... ignorant
Yes...you post certainly was ignorant.
You will never get to a favored view from Mt Olympus with that at!tude.
If satan exists, he inspired the bible...the chaos, death and destruction that has happened as a result of the book existing should be evidence enough for you that you have played right into satan's hands, by believing the story satan himself inspired to be written.
Ummm, have you ever read the Bible? There is freewill and Hitler committed the most heinous crimes one could commit. He will be judged for that. Do you have any clue how well most Jews do in life today? How about how Israel became a nation in one day? Actually prophesied in the Bible. God is coming back and ALL male & female will bow to Him. He IS a God of love and mercy but man is evil and destructive. We see this each day when we open a paper or watch the news or read about an abortion clinic.
I don't think anyone will engage in that discussion with you..
I guess one day however you will find out for yourself.
What references to God are you talking about in particular.
Do you mean the Unofficial Motto of the US voted for by the Congress that created America which didn't include the word "God".
Why not have respect for the Founding Fathers wishes and go back to the motto they approved?
The founding fathers said NO SUCH THING. Why is it that so many people are unaware that "In God We Trust" was drummed up in the last 60 years by religious zealots and has nothing to do with this country's birth?
In God We Trust was approved by Congress on 4/22/1864...so almost 150 years ago...not 60 and not by religious zealots.
"God" was not originally in there it was added in the 60s look it up its a matter of public record, and just another history fact not all the founding fathers were not Chrisitans some were deists here is a quote from the Britanica about the Founding Fathers and thier religions "In recent decades Christian advocacy groups, prompted by motives that have been questioned by some, have felt a powerful urge to enlist the Founding Fathers in their respective congregations. But recovering the spiritual convictions of the Founders, in all their messy integrity, is not an easy task. Once again, diversity is the dominant pattern. Franklin and Jefferson were deists, Washington harbored a pantheistic sense of providential destiny, John Adams began a Congregationalist and ended a Unitarian, Hamilton was a lukewarm Anglican for most of his life but embraced a more actively Christian posture after his son died in a duel." and if you wish to read it yourself https://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2014/01/07/satanists-unveil-design-for-statehouse-statue/comment-page-2/?replytocom=2866428#respond
apo0logies here is the correct URL http://www.britannica.com/blogs/2007/02/the-us-founding-fathers-their-religious-beliefs/