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March 15th, 2014
11:23 AM ET

Five things you didn't know about Jesus

Opinion by the Rev. James Martin, special to CNN

(CNN) - With Easter approaching, and the movie “Son of God” playing in wide release, you’re going to hear a lot about Jesus these days.

You may hear revelations from new books that purport to tell the “real story” about Jesus, opinions from friends who have discovered a “secret” on the Web about the son of God, and airtight arguments from co-workers who can prove he never existed.

Beware of most of these revelations; many are based on pure speculation and wishful thinking. Much of what we know about Jesus has been known for the last 2,000 years.

Still, even for devout Christian there are surprises to be found hidden within the Gospels, and thanks to advances in historical research and archaeological discoveries, more is known about his life and times.

With that in mind, here are five things you probably didn't know about Jesus.

1.) Jesus came from a nowhere little town.

Nearly all modern-day archaeologists agree the town of Nazareth had only 200 to 400 people. Jesus’ hometown is mentioned nowhere in either the Old Testament or the Talmud, which notes dozens of other towns in the area.

In fact, in the New Testament it is literally a joke.

In the Gospel of John, when a man named Nathanael hears the messiah is “Jesus of Nazareth,” he asks, “Can anything good come from Nazareth?” He’s dissing Jesus’ crummy backwater town.

2.) Jesus probably didn’t know everything.

This is a thorny theological question. If Jesus is divine, wouldn’t he know all things? (Indeed, on several occasions Jesus predicts his death and resurrection.)

On the other hand, if he had a human consciousness, he needed to be taught something before he could know it. The Gospel of Luke says that when Jesus was a young man he “progressed” in wisdom. That means he learned things. (Otherwise how would he “progress”?)

In the Gospel of Mark, Jesus initially refuses to heal the daughter of a non-Jewish woman, saying rather sharply, “It is not fair to take the children’s food and throw it to the dogs.”

But when she replies that even the dogs get the crumbs from the table, Jesus softens, and he heals her daughter. He seems to be learning that his ministry extends beyond the Jewish people.

3.) Jesus was tough.

From age 12 to 30, Jesus worked in Nazareth as a carpenter. “Is not this the carpenter?” say the astonished crowds when he begins to preach.

The word used for Jesus’ profession in the original Greek is tekton. The traditional translation is “carpenter.” But most contemporary scholars say it’s more likely a general craftsman; some even translate it as “day laborer.”

A tekton would have made doors, tables, lamp stands and plows. But he probably also built stone walls and helped with house construction.

It was tough work that meant lugging tools, wood and stones all over Galilee. Jesus doesn’t simply stride onto the world stage after having dreamily examined a piece of wood when the mood suited him. For 18 years, he worked—and worked hard.

4.) Jesus needed “me time.”

The Gospels frequently speak of Jesus’ need to “withdraw” from the crowds, and even his disciples.

Today by the Sea of Galilee, where Jesus carried out much of his ministry, you can see how close the towns were, and how natural it would have been for the enthusiastic crowds to “press” in on him, as the Gospels describe.

There’s even a cave on the shoreline, not far from Capernaum, his base of operations, where he may have prayed.

It’s called the “Eremos Cave,” from the word for “desolate” or “solitary,” from which we get the word “hermit.” Even though Jesus was the son of God, he needed time alone in prayer with the father.

5.) Jesus didn’t want to die.

As he approaches his death, and prays hard in the garden of Gethsemane, Jesus says, “Remove this cup.” It’s a blunt prayer addressed to the father, whom he affectionately calls Abba. He doesn’t want to die.

Unlike the way some Christians portray Jesus as courting death, and even desiring it, like any human being, the idea of death is terrifying. “My soul is sorrowful even unto death,” he says.

In other words, “I’m so sad that it feels like I’m going to die.” But once Jesus realizes that this is somehow the will of the father, he assents to death, even on a cross.

It’s natural to want to know as much as we can about Jesus; that’s one reason I wrote my new book. But beware of the more outlandish claims about the son of God (he fathered children, he was married to Mary Magdalene, he spent time in India and so on.)

Many of these claims tend to project our own desires on a man who will always remain somewhat elusive, hard to fully understand and impossible to pin down.

In the end, as theologians like to say, Jesus is not so much a problem to be solved as a mystery to be pondered.

The Rev. James Martin is a Jesuit priest, editor of America magazine and author of the new book "Jesus: A Pilgrimage" (HarperOne). The views expressed in this column belong to Martin. 

- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: Bible • Christianity • Easter • Jesus • Opinion

soundoff (3,128 Responses)
  1. Bob

    The whole Jesus-sacrifice-salvation story, the foundation of the Christian superstitions, is nonsense out of the gate. How is it that an omnipotent being couldn't do his saving bit without the whole silly Jesus hoopla? And how was Jesus' death a "sacrifice", when an omnipotent being could just pop up a replacement son any time with less than a snap of his fingers?

    Pretty pathetic "god" that you've made for yourselves there, Christians.

    Ask the questions. Break the chains. Join the movement.
    Be free of Christianity and other superstitions.
    http://whywontgodhealamputees.com/

    March 15, 2014 at 2:08 pm |
    • kabelme

      funny that you even read the article. Not sure why. But it is not about what the omnipotent can do, it is about what we are willing to do.

      March 16, 2014 at 12:06 pm |
    • southerncelt

      So loving your neighbor is "nonsense" ? What code do you live by, or are you just a meaningless and random collection of atoms? That would be nonsense. There is a Natural Law in this world and you should examine it and wonder where it came from.

      March 16, 2014 at 3:52 pm |
      • ihavetopushthepramalot

        My neighbor listens to Garth Brooks. He deserves scorn and derision, regardless of the writings of the Italian followers of a desert preacher.

        March 16, 2014 at 3:57 pm |
      • readerpan

        It is called math. No other natural law.

        March 16, 2014 at 9:52 pm |
      • jaxx7883

        Actually scientists say we are made up of protons neutrons and electrons but I think in this case they may have left out one bucause this A-hat has got to be made up of morons.

        March 17, 2014 at 12:05 pm |
    • wilburw7

      Galatians 6:7 "Do not be deceived: God cannot be mocked. A man reaps what he sows."

      Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

      March 16, 2014 at 9:44 pm |
    • wilburw7

      Your logic is faulty. A just God requires every sin be punished. We could not pay the price of the sin we created for ourselves so out of love, Jesus took up the cross in a selfless act of mercy.

      "No one takes it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. " - Jesus Christ

      March 16, 2014 at 9:50 pm |
      • observer

        wilburw7

        "A just God requires every sin be punished."

        Should you be punished when you know God's "sin's" are wrong like his support of slavery and various discriminations and you don't support them?

        March 16, 2014 at 9:56 pm |
        • wilburw7

          God did not support Slavery. He regulated it and reduced it as much as he could without destroy us as the only way to stop it. Every unrepentant Slave owner will end up in hell.

          March 16, 2014 at 10:06 pm |
        • observer

          2014 at 9:56 pm | Reply

          wilburw7

          "God did not support Slavery"

          Have you ever read a Bible? God not only supported it, he said that men could sell their daughters and even said where you could buy slaves and how badly you could hurt them without punishment.

          Please read a Bible and then come back.

          March 16, 2014 at 10:54 pm |
        • wilburw7

          I already read the Bible many times and understand it very well. I am trying to teach you the Bible. You are the one that is ignorant. It was not God's ideal. He allowed it because of the hardest of man's heart. He regulated it as much as He could falling short of destroying mankind.

          March 16, 2014 at 11:38 pm |
        • otoh2

          wilbur,
          " He regulated it as much as He could..."

          Are you serious?

          "He" was pretty dang handy with a bunch of other edicts (some of them very, very silly).

          How about: "Thou shalt not OWN or ENSLAVE people"!

          March 16, 2014 at 11:48 pm |
        • observer

          wilburw7,

          Speaking of being ignorant, here's what the Bible ACTUALLY SAYS:

          "Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. You can bequeath them to your children as inherited property and can make them SLAVES FOR LIFE"

          "If a man SELLS HIS DAUGHTER as a female slave, she is not to go free as the male slaves do”

          God even gives instructions on how you can BEAT your FEMALE slave with a ROD without punishment.

          If you actually have read a Bible, you sure MISSED a lot.

          March 16, 2014 at 11:50 pm |
        • otoh2

          Yet this "LORD" character took the time and effort for this:

          (Numbers 15:32-36) – "Now while the sons of Israel were in the wilderness, they found a man gathering wood on the sabbath day. 33 And those who found him gathering wood brought him to Moses and Aaron, and to all the congregation; 34 and they put him in custody because it had not been declared what should be done to him. 35 Then the LORD SAID to Moses, "The man shall surely be put to death; all the congregation shall stone him with stones outside the camp." 36 So all the congregation brought him outside the camp, and stoned him to death with stones, just as the LORD had commanded Moses."

          March 16, 2014 at 11:54 pm |
    • kermit4jc

      whats pathetic is your knowledge of what the Bible says about the God..to YOu it makes no sense cause you don't know the whole story..God is a JUST God..and therefore sins are to be paid for....God had a purpose for Jesus..to be a sacrifice..Jesus was sinless and thus was capable of payin gin FULL for the sins...we could pay for sins..but then wed go to hell and no one would get to heaven. You only got part of the information sadly...

      March 17, 2014 at 3:41 am |
      • ssq41

        And, kermy, that you believe with all of your heart what you just wrote here clearly supports the atheist claim that Christians like you are delusional...

        March 17, 2014 at 3:50 am |
        • kermit4jc

          were you NOT for arguments sake assuming if God exists..then this...? again the pOINT is yOU are arguing out of ignorance of the beliefs..and of God

          March 17, 2014 at 3:52 am |
        • kermit4jc

          BTW,,I pretty much got it that you are NOT a psychologist and have no business calling us delusional..seeing as how youdont even know how to "diagnose" one as delusional..i work in psychology field..got a psychology degree..and ONLY ones who call us delusional are arm chair wannabes like you

          March 17, 2014 at 3:54 am |
        • ssq41

          kerMY, wHo are yoU talKING tOO?

          March 17, 2014 at 3:54 am |
        • ssq41

          kermy, you may then want to make an appointment with yourself and discuss why you have such intense anger issues.

          Apparently the Blood of Jesus isn't working well to resolve those issues.

          Don't overbill yourself, either. That would be unethical.

          March 17, 2014 at 3:57 am |
        • kermit4jc

          what anger issues? I have no anger issues

          March 17, 2014 at 3:57 am |
        • ssq41

          ...okay, kermit.

          I'll stop.

          March 17, 2014 at 4:02 am |
  2. joey3467

    It is more likely that Bigfoot exits than it is that Allah exists, or any gid for that matter.

    March 15, 2014 at 2:03 pm |
    • bostontola

      Yeah, but Allah is more likely than Pegasus.

      March 15, 2014 at 2:09 pm |
      • TruthPrevails1

        Yet not as likely as unicorns...

        March 15, 2014 at 2:21 pm |
        • bostontola

          I'm kind of partial to the Centaur, those dudes could run.

          March 15, 2014 at 2:27 pm |
      • theemptyone1

        No, I've seen horses fly, they just didn't have wings. In fact, I've been on a horse when it has flown.

        March 15, 2014 at 3:02 pm |
        • bostontola

          Duly noted, Pegasus before Allah, check!

          March 15, 2014 at 3:47 pm |
  3. nelliesees

    you must really ask yourself one thing. What DO you really believe? Is it not so hard fetched to believe there is a force of good AND bad in this world we live in? We see this everyday in our own lives. We wish for things to be better and for those that do not see what we see to be good and right in this world to stop and rethink how they approach their own life. But who is to know what is good or bad? I can tell the difference because I choose to listen to that part of me that tells what is right and good. Live this way and the frustration, doubt and indifference will go away. And then you will wake to feel a new day that is worth remembering.

    March 15, 2014 at 2:03 pm |
    • the0g0to0the0t

      "Your enemy is never a villain in his own eyes." – Robert Heinlein

      Everyone almost always believes they are justified, some are just better at rationalizing their behavior than others.

      March 15, 2014 at 5:24 pm |
  4. naturechaplain

    As naturalist/philosopher John Burroughs wrote a century ago (The Gospel of Nature), "It is the gospel of contentment, of appreciation, of heeding simple near-by things–a gospel the burden of which still is love, but love that goes hand in hand with understanding." As a former Minister and then Chaplain and Teacher for many years I continue to wonder how it is that Religion and it's Gospels (Torahs, Vedas, Qur'ans, etc) so easily distract and divert from the simple message of love.

    March 15, 2014 at 2:02 pm |
    • theemptyone1

      Simply switch on all the lobes, religion was created by man to control other men. That has been historically established. When people seek to control others, even through the use of "love" the door is opened to all sorts of distortions and games in it's name.

      March 15, 2014 at 4:08 pm |
  5. islamistheanswer

    All, I am not trying to be judgmental or make a conclusive remarks regarding Jesus (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him and His Virgin Mother Mary). It is clear from historical evidences and common sense that he didn't know everything (item 2 in this article). It is also not expected of a human to know everything. Our Lord is above and beyond our imagination and our limited universe and hence is not confined within the realities and limitations of our intellect. Any revelation from the divine who created us and give us this special part of our body and being "The brain" can only corroborate the logic and common sense that we use to rational and decipher the information that we receive and grasp daily. It is therefore not surprising that the fastest growing *religion* today in the world is Atheisim. People naturally are tired of the conflicting accounts about Jesus, trinity and the purpose of our existence. I hereby would like to invite you to an account that is consistent with our logic, common sense and evidences around us. God the Almighty is ONE and has no partners or associations whatsoever in this earth. He has sent the messengers and prophets to guide humanity to that which is beneficial to them – to success. Through His messengers and prophets, a clear and manifest record has been revealed with one message that didn't change all along. This life is temporary and the hereafter is the eternal life. There is one God to worship and none but him. All the prophets shared this messaged and delivered it – a message called Islam – to surrender to the creator, worship none but him and to believe in all his messengers and prophets (obviously, this is simplified but meant to give you a quick summary). Islam corroborates a lot of the Christian accounts about Jesus (his miracles that he was sent with similar to miracles other messengers were given before him). However, Islam asserts that He was nor crucified nor killed but was rather taking to heaven. Muslims believe that Jesus will return to this earth as Christians do – but they believe that when he comes back he will break the cross and slaughter the Pig in signs that he did neither of those things (he never claimed to be son of God, nor did he eat Pork). Among other things, the Quran (holy book) sorts accounts and miracles that are not mentioned in the new testament about Jesus in a beautiful chapter about Mary (chapter 19 verse 29) in which he responded after birth to the allegations that people had for Mary on how she bore a child. Islam reaffirms the one message that Adam, Ishaq, Jacob, Joseph, John, Solomon, David, Moses, Jesus and Mohammed (Peace and Blessings be Upon Them All) – one God, one Creator. God describes himself in the Quran as "the One that nothing is similar to him" actually the verse in Arabic means there is nothing LIKE the LIKE of Him to give us a perspective that anything that we imagine about ALLAH (God) is actually not true. Therefore, our rational and explanation of how God is all Hearing and All knowing and Merciful – all of those are nothing but language realities and in a universe that we understand but He is nothing like that and beyond those descriptions (our minds can't help but to imagine nonetheless).. My fellow Christians, don't be like the Jews – when Jesus was given the message, they denied him and they were arrogant. They knew that a prophet was coming but since he was not from the highest ranks among them, they denied his message. Since they had the old testament (revealed book from God), they looked no further even though Jesus was truth from God and corroborated the accounts they had in the old testament. Same happened to many of you (Christians). After you got the message, you looked no further. Prophet Mohammed (peace and blessings upon him, his family and his companions and those who follow him to the day of judgement) and the Quran are the truth from God and they corroborate all the messengers who were sent to humanity. Message that has been universal and not specific to certain people – to the entire humanity but you looked no further. I invite you all to read and learn about Islam and the Quran. I understand the skepticism that all have regarding Islam especially after all the barbaric acts of the few who painted Islam as a violent religion. However, I don't want you to judge Islam based on the actions of the few but rather through its teachings and core message. Go the source and don't listen to the media and what people tell you about Islam. As those who are Muslims and knowledgeable about their faith. If I were to judge Christianity through the actions of the Crusaders (If I lived during those times), you could imagine what my opinion would be. Christianity however doesn't call to violence and is a loving and peaceful religion so is Islam. Read and Learn the treasures that were revealed from God through Prophet Mohammed (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him). As for our Atheist friends, the order this universe possess didn't just come out of nothing. There is a supreme being called ALLAH who created all and bestowed His bounties and favors upon us. We should explore his signs and learn about him through His books and signs. I invite all to visit a website that has a beautiful video about the purpose of life and other nice videos about Islam (islamtalk dot com dot au).

    March 15, 2014 at 1:46 pm |
    • realbuckyball

      Mohammad never existed, and Islam developed for the Arabic moon-god cult. Get over it.
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUC5Su5P8D4

      March 15, 2014 at 1:57 pm |
      • islamistheanswer

        Go to the source. The only way and befitting methodology to learn about something is by going to the source. The source is the holy book and Muslims (knowledgeable ones). Why is it you hear from those who are either not familiar or non-Muslims to form your conclusion about an entire faith (with followers as much as third the population of this earth). Visit the website I shared and see for your self. Don't rely on books and writers who talk about Islam and they have nothing to do with it.

        March 15, 2014 at 2:02 pm |
        • joey3467

          Or maybe yoy need to seek the truth from the source. Namely the followers of Zeus.

          March 15, 2014 at 2:06 pm |
        • TruthPrevails1

          First off, I don't put you all in one group myself. I've met some terrific Muslims who only wish for the better for mankind. With every religion there are those who are extremist.
          Second, with that said, I must disagree with your stats.
          This breaks down worldwide religious population:
          "the following list of the major world religions.

          Christians: 2,100,000,000 – tending to decline in terms of global percentage
          Muslims: 1,500,000,000 – tending to increase in terms of global percentage
          Of no religion: 1,100,000,000 – tending to decline in terms of global percentage
          Hindus: 900,000,000 – stable in terms of global percentage
          Chinese folk religionists: 400,000,000
          Primal religionists: 400,000,000
          Buddhists: 375,000,000- stable in terms of global percentage
          Sikhs: 24,000,000
          Jews: 14,500,000
          Baha'is: 7,400,000
          Jains: 4,300,000
          Shintoists: 4,000,000
          Taoism: 2,700,000"

          http://www.age-of-the-sage.org/mysticism/world_religions_populations.htm

          March 15, 2014 at 2:28 pm |
        • realbuckyball

          "Going to the source" of Grimm's Fairy Tales does not make them true. The Qur'an is NOT the source. Humans cooked it up, many parts of it preexisted in Arabic culture. Grow a brain someday. BTW, you have refuted NOT ONE of the origins questions Spencer speaks of.

          March 15, 2014 at 2:33 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          I haven't seen the video and I do intend to tackle those points that he presents which I have knowledge of. In cases of things that I don't have adequate knowledge, i will learn about them and report on what I know.

          I have posed this question to others but I feel compelled to ask you the same, what is your standard in believing that something is the truth? What would you like to see in a religion that would be the one thing that convinces you that there is truth to that. I am not here to convert you or to change your way of life (no one has that right anyway), but I am here to share with you something that you might not be aware exists. Something that is unequivocal and I say that because I live it daily and with my humble educational background doesn't undermine my logic and intellect but rather supports it and give me the drive to even excel further – something meaningful!

          March 15, 2014 at 2:50 pm |
        • realbuckyball

          Keep your religion in your pants. I am VERY well aware that all your claims are built on historical nonsense, and no evidence. You chose to buy into fairy tales. I do not. There is nothing "special" about Islam.
          How about starting with the Satanic Verses. You can refute NOTHING. You cliam you know about these things. You don't.

          March 15, 2014 at 3:17 pm |
        • wilburw7

          Allah = Satan

          And Jesus answered and said to them: “Take heed that no one deceives you."

          March 16, 2014 at 9:58 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          wilburw7: you don't have to answer but I beg you to think about this with your self. what do you know about Islam to suggest that Allah = Satan (exalted is He from the accusations of the ignorant)? Truly, What is it that you know about this faith that you learned first hand either from the Quran or Islamic texts (aside from what you might hear through a third person, media, opinions)? Please my dear, take the time to educate your self about this religion as it does nothing but corroborate the accounts you have about Jesus and rectifies the issues the you along with fellow Christians have struggled with for centuries (trinity, truth about Jesus, authenticity of the gospel, etc...). It calls you to worship the God of Jesus and Moses and all the Prophets before them.. Read.

          March 16, 2014 at 10:24 pm |
        • observer

          wilburw7

          "Allah = Satan"

          So God created Allah. Interesting.

          March 16, 2014 at 10:06 pm |
        • wilburw7

          I know things by divine revelation and study.

          "The last hour will not come before Muslims fight the Jews and the Muslims kill them." Muhammad
          "Take not the Jews and Christians as friends... Slay the idolateres [non- Muslims] whereever ye find them...besiedge them, and prepare them each ambush." Surah 5:51; 9:5

          The Qur'an also allows lying.

          The Almighty does not allow lying; Satan is the liar. Jesus is God and he says:"Treat others as you want to be treated." Look at that statement and compare it to the Qur'an.

          I do not speak from ignorance as you would like so that I am easily argued against. In the Qur'an it speaks of the Mahdi in the end times. It is the same as the story of the Bible except the Mahdi is in the place of the Anti-Christ, who is Satan incarnate. When I say that Allah is Satan I am saying God opposes your Mahdi who is to come. I support Jesus Christ and my fate is in his hands. Jesus Is God the Almighty, who already defeated Allah-Satan on the cross but who will allow him to reign for 7 years as a trial for the earth of those that have not excepted Jesus Christ yet. Jesus is the answer, not Islam.

          March 16, 2014 at 11:09 pm |
      • islamistheanswer

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7d16CpWp-ok&feature=share&list=UUxBR44IXdJY0gsfHcIDMQuQ&index=5

        March 15, 2014 at 2:22 pm |
      • islamistheanswer

        Ready for the response to those claims?

        March 16, 2014 at 12:18 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          Any idea why my posts are not being displayed?

          March 16, 2014 at 12:22 pm |
      • islamistheanswer

        realbuckyball, my response for some reason is being blocked. I am not able to publish it. I did however post it in your blog and it is awaiting moderation. Also, I posted it in my blog for reference for those who are interested to the response to the video you posted. You have challenged me in a different post to refute ONE of the claims made by Robert Spencer, I actually was excited and decided to refute all of them since they were trivial for someone who is not even a scholar in the Islamic faith/religion. My blog is (http://islamistheanswer.wordpress.com/) I am not advertisement for my blog. I only have two posts there and they are related to this topic.

        March 16, 2014 at 9:52 pm |
      • islamistheanswer

        This is in response to a video posted by buckyball in which he contended that I couldn’t refute ONE of the claims made by Robert Spencer in a video that he posted in the first page of the comments of this article (you can watch the video by going to the first comment page). I took the time to refute ALL of the claims..
        So I finally got around hearing the video that you posted by Robert Spencer and his claims that Mohammed didn’t exist. Let me start by saying that from your writing I had wrongly assumed that you were logical, rational, and methodical in what is const-ituted as a proof or evidence upon which one could firmly believe in the conclusions presented. Throughout your comments and responses, you had referred (and perhaps others) to the Gospel, and the Quran alike as fairy-tales and I can’t resist but to mention that all what Robert Spencer presented in this video was nothing but a fairy-tale that has no basis whatsoever. The difference is that I will go through all the items here and share with you why I believe that they are fairy tales unlike YOU who opted to use this video to support your claim that the Quran is a fairy-tale (a mere opinion of a single person who chose to think that his analysis is the basis of an entire religion – I urge you to read the criticism section of his biography page in Wikipedia) :).. This article is also meant to be educational in nature to every reader on some of the theological aspects of Islam.
        Did Mohammed Exist? It is sad that the question is even posed. Yes he did exist and he is the prophet of the second largest religion in the world (universal religion) with 1.8 billion followers in the world today. Mr. Spencer demonstrated time after another in this video that he doesn’t know much about Islam or the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him). His Video could be summarized as follows:
        • Mohammed didn’t exist and was created (no historical basis that he existed)
        • Islam was created to support a political agenda to expand the empire at the time
        • Islam doesn’t teach universal brotherhood, love and peace like other religions do (cited 98:6)
        • Quran was not collected until 60 years after the death of the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him)
        • The Prophet’s tradition was not collected until 125 years later (first biography of the prophet). Huge material was made up and it was a lie that spread
        • Tradition doesn’t talk about what Prophet did with the leap month up until 627 when abolished (Arabs used to add that month to correct for a lunar calendar)
        • There are no instances in which non-Muslims enjoyed equal rights under Islamic rule (No Equality)
        • Islam contradict const-itutional freedom rights
        Let me start addressing those points one by one. Please note that I don’t claim to be a scholar or a person of substantial knowledge in the faith so with my modest knowledge, I was shocked to see the preposterous claims laid out in this video.
        • Mohammed didn’t exist and was created (no historical basis that he existed)
        He did exist. Mr. Spencer talks about history and historical evidence and fails to address a crucial and elemental point of what he makes of the Quran – the one big miracle of Prophet Mohammed (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him). Suffice it to say that this book is a challenge to the entire humanity to find a single contradiction in it throughout its 600 pages. The book that has both scientific evidences and prophecies that no other book had – I am talking about tens of those. If Mohammed (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him) didn’t exist, where did this book come from? Please don’t just foolishly and naively say that books can be written because this is not a book (any book); this is a book that humanity is challenged to find a single contradiction in it for the past 1400 years ago but hasn’t been able to!
        Now to add to the above, aside from the Quran and “historical records” that a lot of people doubt are accurate (and by the way Mr. Spencer apparently relies on those handpicked, carefully selected records in making his points), what else could be presented to confirm that Mohammed (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him) did exist? For one, I and many other in the Muslim world come from the lineage of the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him). It is an honor beyond imagination! However, this lineage is kept throughout time in a clear and manifest record. Each descendent of the prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him) has the tree that traces his or her lineage to the prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him). This offspring of the prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him) is all over the world today as one could image but all can be validated to the source. In every generation these records and updated and are well kept. It is one thing to argue that history is “written by the powerful” but it is another thing to tell a man that his father “is not” or didn’t exist! Ironic isn’t it?
        • Islam was created to support a political agenda to expand the empire at the time
        Mere theory and has not basis. Mr. Spencer just illustrated why he thought so which none of it made sense by the way. I’d rather focus on something worthwhile commenting on.
        • Islam doesn’t teach universal brotherhood, love and peace like other religions do (cited 98:6)
        This is the only time that Mr. Spencer quoted from the Quran (thanks God!). Not sure how he came up with this conclusion. The verse he cited is shown here for reference (verse 6 but I am pasting the whole chapter for you to judge – obviously Mr. Spencer wouldn’t share with you the context the verse was revealed nor the intent of it). As shown below, this is addressing the disbelievers who disbelieved after they ahve received the scripture and the truth from God to worship him alone and after all this clear evidence they were given, they disbelieved. Those Allah says are the worst creature (in comparison to the best creatures in the sight of Allah and those by the way include Muslims, Christians and Jews who are on the monotheistic belief of God). I can go and write pages on Islam and brotherhood, love and peace but I want to address the claims that Mr. Spencer had in his video that folks like you yourself USE to come to the conclusion that Mohammed (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him) didn’t exist!
        Those who disbelieved among the People of the Scripture and the polytheists were not to be parted [from misbelief] until there came to them clear evidence – (1) A Messenger from Allah, reciting purified scriptures (2) Within which are correct writings. (3) Nor did those who were given the Scripture become divided until after there had come to them clear evidence. (4) And they were not commanded except to worship Allah, [being] sincere to Him in religion, inclining to truth, and to establish prayer and to give zakah. And that is the correct religion. (5) Indeed, they who disbelieved among the People of the Scripture and the polytheists will be in the fire of Hell, abiding eternally therein. Those are the worst of creatures. (6)Indeed, they who have believed and done righteous deeds – those are the best of creatures. (7)
        • Quran was not collected until 60 years after the death of the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him)
        Mr. Spencer mentioned that the Quran is mentioned in the Islamic books that it was collected during the third Caliph, Othman may Allah be pleased with him some 28 years after the passing of the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him). This is another incorrect and I would have said misconstrued, but the truth is it was deliberately said to create confusion and doubt in the hearts of many. The simple truth is that the Quran was COLLECTED during the Prophet’s time (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him). It was also RECORDED and REVIEWED by the Prophet HIMSELF (You could imagine the importance of preserving the word of God!). It would be naive of an ordinary person to think that what is in his mind and heart would be preserved after his demise, let alone the prophet of God (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him). So the fact is that the Quran was Collected and Recorded during the time of the prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him). Then, what is this story that it was collected during the time of Othman (the third Caliph). As Mr. Spencer mention, the Islamic empire expanded greatly during that time so what happened was naturally newly entrants to Islam learned the Quran and doctrine from people of knowledge and memorizers of the Quran who happened to be there to teach people the affairs of their faith. An effort had not be done by then to accompany every mission with a recorded book (Large number of Muslims at the time memorized the Quran in its entirety). The locals however were learning the Quran but started to record it in their own dialects which alerted the Caliph that this could be an issue in the way of preserving the holy book. Therefore, he ordered all the written texts in the different dialects be collected and burned and instead furnished a single copy that was to be the only one that is distributed throughout the empire. Is it possible that this copy could have been different from the one that the prophet collected? NO. After the death of the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him), the first Caliph, Abu Baker, Collected all the different records in which the Quran was recorded (written on leather and others on bones). He passed it to Omar (2nd Caliph) who in turn passed it to his daughter Hafsa (My ALLAH be pleased with all of them). Othman (3rd Caliph) got this particular copy that was the same memorized by the masses at the time to be recorded and sent out to 4 cities of the Muslim world at the time.. This is the story of the preservation of the Quran. Also, bear in mind that people memorized this book and some memorizers exist until today that have approval traced back to the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him) himself (i.e. approved by a teacher who was approved by his teacher traced back to the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him)). I personally know man (not to mention that are 10s of millions today that have it memorized but not authenticated by a teacher who learned it traced to the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him))… Moving on to the next item!
        • The Prophet’s tradition was not collected until 125 years later (first biography of the prophet). Huge material was made up and it was a lie that spread
        Again and again, incorrect information. Based on those claims, the naive and the ignorant would truly think that this is the truth about Islam and Prophet Mohammed (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him). The prophet’s tradition (Hadith) was memorized also by the companions of the prophet and those who followed them. The first generation had the tradition memorized not through active memorization but also through practice as they did EVERYTHING that the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him) instructed – no wonder they were victorious in their affairs not just through the expansion of the Islamic state but through the purification of their souls and how they transformed to a civilized society at a time where Arabs were truly tribal and barbaric. This tradition began to pass from the first generation to the next and while Mr. Spencer claims that the tradition wasn’t collected until 125 years later, the truth is that it was recorded since the time of the prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him). What was gathered as collections thereafter qualified the tradition or Hadith based on their authenticity. The traditions are narrated through a chain of narrations. This chain of narrations (people who narrated from the prophet) are classified in terms of their trustworthiness and credibility. If in the chain of narration there was a person who had questionable character, then that particular narration is discounted. If there exists a person who is not known to have exhibited any questionable character but rather was not known enough through people who could firmly attest to his worthiness, then that tradition became an OK (good) tradition but is not considered AUTHENTIC. The third category which is the Authentic is the one with a KNOWN chain of narration of trustworthy people who were never known to have lied, joked about the matter of the faith, etc… Mr. Spencer is not aware of these details. The material that he refers to as a lie was nothing but the exercise of collecting the authentic tradition not to differentiate it from “fake” traditions but rather from traditions that came through people who were not FULLY vetted (not through knowing that those were lies – that generation was a different scale of integrity and personal conduct)..
        • Tradition doesn’t talk about what Prophet did with the leap month up until 627 when abolished (Arabs used to add that month to correct for a lunar calendar)
        Incorrect and Deceiving again! The Hijri calendar that Muslims use actually come from the word Hijrah which means migration and it marked the migration of the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him) from Mecca to Madina. There were no leap calendar additions to the lunar calendar thereafter. Prior to that the call to Islam in Mecca was limited and was mostly done in secret. The Islamic State started thereafter. Mr. Spencer says that leap months were added until 627 but there is no record of what the Prophet (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him) did during that month since the acts of worship like fasting the month of Ramadan is tied to the calendar and moves with the calendar. Answer to that is, Calendar started in 622 rather and hence whatever compensation you mention was nullified thereafter not 5 years later.
        • There are no instances in which non-Muslims enjoyed equal rights under Islamic rule (No Equality)
        I really won’t bother to try to convince you in this regard because the renaissance that the world had seen through the ruling of the Muslims is only apparent to those versed with “History”. Suffice it to say that Jews for one had this to say about their time under the Islamic ruling (check out the Golden Age for Jews in the Middle Ages http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_age_of_Jewish_culture_in_Spain)
        • Islam contradict const-itutional freedom rights
        What does Mr. Spencer and you for that matter rely on to say that Islam contradicts freedom rights? Saudi Arabia? I told you in a prior post, the government there is the biggest scam in the History of Islam so I would not use it as a reference when generalizing about Islam. Could you quote anything from the Quran that validates this claim?
        In conclusion, you have contended that I haven’t not addressed the claims of Mr. Spencer and that I CAN’T. I didn’t have to do much here but listen to the video and write this response to show the ignorance of Mr. Spencer and his lack of knowledge about Islam and those who use him as an authority and reference to conclude that Islam is a violent religion and that Mohammed didn’t exist (a joke for those who read my response with an open mind).. I hope you re-read this post with an open mind and heart and learn not to rely on journalists and historians on forming your own opinions. Always validate and dig for the resources and SOURCE used to form an informed opinion. May God guide us all to the straight path and I apologize for the lengthy post!

        March 18, 2014 at 11:35 pm |
      • islamistheanswer

        After refuting all the claims that Mr. Spencer made and not hearing from you, I thought I would share this challenge with you. It relates to one of the claims that Mr. Spencer and others make about the Quran. So take the challenge!

        The Quran Challenge Please listen to it since it is an amazing challenge and since the crowd here is typically of a higher IQ than the average population, I urge you to take this challenge!
        http://youtu.be/4hbDVwweUsk

        March 20, 2014 at 11:26 pm |
    • Doris

      Mmmm.. no.

      March 15, 2014 at 1:58 pm |
    • otoh2

      "After you got the message, you looked no further."

      It seems as if you stopped looking too. Joseph Smith (Mormon) had further "revelations" (directly from a similar "angel" as your guy). Ooooh, updated and collecting members worldwide (claim 14 million) in only 150 years! And current "revelations" come along to the elders (prophets) quite often, I hear. Must be the real deal, huh?

      I don't recall who allegedly "revealed" stuff to L. Ron Hubbard, but that "update" has amassed quite a number of adherents in only 50 years.

      We have these guys' original writings too, so don't go with your "not a word has been changed" tack as 'proof' of anything about your beliefs.

      March 15, 2014 at 2:01 pm |
      • islamistheanswer

        otoh2, May God guide us all to the truth and the straight path. Why do you assume that I for one and others have looked no further. Quran was not just a book that has been preserved over the years and memorized by millions of people but also has miracles that have been revealed over the years. The scientific evidence in Quran is staggering and mind blowing – all of those discoveries were made within the last 100 years. The fact that Mormonism is growing is great but in my humble opinion it is an attempt to rectify the ailments in the christian faith – a faith that has been daunted by a lot of doubt and illogical stories that undermine the intelligence of human beings. This in no way speaks to the authenticity of Jesus (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him and His Mother Mary) – he was a true messenger of God. However, the lack of a preserved scripture from Jesus himself attributes to the fact that most (a huge percentage) of people that convert to Islam and Mormonism are Christians. Do you have any figures of how many Jews today convert to your faith? How about Muslims converting to your faith? Exactly. The distorted christian theology is a huge factor to the popularity and traction that Mormonism gained recently.. Again, I invite you to visit the website that I mentioned and learn about the religion that is universal to all.

        March 15, 2014 at 2:12 pm |
        • otoh2

          And a web page for you (from ex-Muslims):

          http://www.islam-watch.org/amarkhan/Miracles-of-Quran-Exposed.htm

          March 15, 2014 at 2:20 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          Do you know why you can't find the Quran in English or any other language other than Arabic? You can find the translation of the MEANING of the Quran in other languages but Quran is only available in Arabic. The main page you shared was authored by Imran Shah (A Pakistani born Muslim) who most likely didn't speak Arabic or learn Arabic formally. With all due respect to non-Arab Muslims, the fact that someone who was not affluent not only in Arabic but in the Quranic Arabic (a more eloquent Arabic that baffled the Arab linguistics at the time of its revelation) to speak about the dangers of the quran is questionable. Please share his qualifications. For your own sake, if his conclusions were derived from a translation of the meaning of the Quran, I would opt to look somewhere else. Converts spend years studying Arabic and Quranic Arabic to grasp and gain better understanding of the versus of God. I am not singling the author on the first page but this is applicable to anyone else who doesn't know Arabic to derive their own interpretations based on a translation of the meaning of the Quran. Does this mean that people of Arab origin have never left Islam? of course not, there are people who left Islam for one reason or another and I am not here to claim that all Muslims are infallible. What I am trying to say is don't judge a religion based on the actions of the few. The fact that you have few people who decided to leave Islam for their own conviction shouldn't be the yard stick through which you judge the authenticity of Islam. Read and Explore and believe me, at the end of the day, you won't regret your time. Worst case scenario, you would have educated your self about the faith of the second largest religion (and the fastest growing true religion) in the universe!

          March 15, 2014 at 3:10 pm |
        • otoh2

          The science in the Quran is:

          - Not new or unknown even in the 7th century
          - Not true
          - Manipulation of figurative language to seem to relate to actual science

          March 15, 2014 at 3:18 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          You are assertive! Can you quote one evidence and decipher it (based on your conclusion). I would at least expect you to have gone through ONE your self and learned that words are manipulated, science was known in the 7th century, etc.

          March 15, 2014 at 3:22 pm |
        • wilburw7

          Islam is the wrong way.

          Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

          March 16, 2014 at 10:42 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          This is exactly why Christianity today is out of touch with the masses (especially those who are born Christian). The fact that religion in anyway undermines one's intellect and logical way of thinking is a showstopper to many and hence what I call the exodus from the faith. Why do I need an intermediary to get to God? Why not go directly to God as HE is the ONE who created me? Why does it take BRAINS to understand the concept of God? Why are the majority of Christians today still confused and don't fully grasped Trinity?

          This is precisely why Islam is the answer! The faith demystified: creator is ONE who guided humanity through the messengers and the Prophets he sent throughout history, Mohammed Peace and Blessings be Upon him being the last messenger/Prophet with a message that is universal to the whole of humanity. Why does God send us messengers and not come directly to us? Exalted is He! He is nothing like his creatures (logical to think so). The creator of anything is nothing like His/Her creature (Isn't this the same with anything around us: an inventor is nothing like his/her invention but rather at a level higher both in traits and attributes).God presides in a dimension that is befitting of HIS Majesty; a dimension that is beyond our 4 dimensional physical realization (3 dimensions with time as the fourth dimension). God is the same way (In the quran he says in describing himself "There is nothing LIKE the LIKE of HIM").

          I will leave you with this. Muslims believe in the God that created this humanity and the heavens and earth. The God that sent all the messengers and Prophets you believe in (with the exception of Mohammed Peace and Blessings upon him). You called HIM the father, I call HIM ALLAH. If my life is devoted to the worship of ALLAH and following HIS Commandments (similar to yours by the way), what happens to me in the day of judgement (we both believe in the hereafter!)? Would the son (ALLAH is exalted of this analogy and of having a son) be angry for not being the intermediary between me and God who created me?

          Think about this, in Islam and the Quran, ALLAH says that he forgives all of man's shortcomings except the act of associating partners with HIM (only logical to think if there is a supreme being (ALLAH) that he needs no son nor an intermediary between HIM and HIS creation). If we both take a big GAMBLE (Muslims don't gamble by the way, but I mention it here for the sake of argument). If I continue on my path and meet God (ALLAH) in the day of judgement abiding by HIS commandments, performing the obligatory 5 daily prayers, giving in charity, abstaining from that which is indecent and evil and enjoining that which is good and noble – would he be pleased with me? On the other hand, you go down the path of getting to God through HIS claimed son and barely have had any relationship/worship with the claimed father. Would he be pleased with you? Depending on which religion you believe in, you would think that your path is the right way of course. However, the gamble comes in if Islam happens to be the right path and you are in the wrong path, WHAT WOULD BE your situation in the hereafter having associated partners with the Almighty and having attributed Divine qualities and characteristics to a creature of his (noble creature, Jesus Peace and Blessings be Upon him and his virgin mother Mary)? You would have missed the sweetness of this world by living away from God (ALLAH)! On the flip side, if you were on the right path and I were wrong (it is obvious that each one of us believes he/she to be on the right path), then what would be the worst that happen to me? Would the father argue/fight with the son about me and the 1.8 million Muslims around the world who worship the claimed Father?

          While the gamble presented is simplistic in nature, it is worth contemplating upon and weighing options? If I were in your shoes, I would chose to be a Muslim 🙂

          My ALLAH (God) guide us all to the right straight path and enable us to spread His message to the entire humanity that is unknowingly starving for His guidance!

          Virgin Mary in Islam
          http://youtu.be/fPstjtUTsHE

          Jesus in Islam
          http://youtu.be/om-a-qoI5qU

          March 17, 2014 at 8:06 pm |
      • theemptyone1

        What I really "love" about LDS is that Smith claimed this vision of an angel with a very funny name "Moroni" and received some golden tablets that were never revealed or seen by anyone but him. If any claim of miracle could be proven, this one ought to have been, since it occurred in the early 19th century in a country were the fruits reason (as in the 18th century Age of Reason) was part of the governmental apparatus.

        March 15, 2014 at 4:13 pm |
      • wilburw7

        There is no proof. There is divine revelation that Jesus is the only way. Islam is the WRONG way; atheism is illogical and agnostics are unforgiven like the atheists.

        Hebrews 9:27
        "And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment."

        March 16, 2014 at 10:40 pm |
        • otoh2

          wilbur,
          "There is divine revelation that Jesus is the only way."

          Nope. Your stories of fantasy 'revelation' are just as unproven as Islam's.

          March 16, 2014 at 10:48 pm |
    • bostontola

      I love your post and your logic. It is exactly the same as Christian logic. Read my sacred text, it has the Truth. How do I know? The sacred text says so.

      Christians,
      This is exactly how you sound to non-Christians.

      March 15, 2014 at 2:08 pm |
      • islamistheanswer

        bostontola, how else would you ever learn about anything in this world if you don't go back to the source? I have Christian friends who asked that I accept Jesus so that I learn about Christianity but that is not what I am asking you to do. I asking you to READ about it, the only condition is that you read about it from the source and those who are the experts on the subject matter, not from haters or philosophers whose jobs are just to write. When you go to school, you take it as a given to listen from the experts in the subject matter, why is it that we are reluctant to do the same when it comes down to religion which in my humble opinion should be the highest priority to all human beings since it is the one and only source that explains logically the purpose of this life and our existence!

        March 15, 2014 at 2:18 pm |
        • bostontola

          Many groups throughout history have claimed to have the "Source" of Truth. Your claim has the same validity as theirs. I don't accept any of them as truth, just great literature and great (for the time) philosophy, mixed in with some stale morality that by today's standards are immoral.

          March 15, 2014 at 2:23 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          What is your standard in believing that one of those claims is the truth? The challenge in the Quran had been illustrated in the first few verses in the Quran shown below. A book that has no contradiction whatsoever. roughly 600 pages and the challenge is on for over 1400 years. Willing to join this challenge.. In today's standards, any book that validates all scientific discoveries and which was revealed 1400 years ago is TRUTH, do you disagree?

          This is the Book about which there is no doubt, a guidance for those conscious of Allah – (2) Who believe in the unseen, establish prayer, and spend out of what We have provided for them, (3) And who believe in what has been revealed to you, [O Muhammad], and what was revealed before you, and of the Hereafter they are certain [in faith]. (4) Those are upon [right] guidance from their Lord, and it is those who are the successful. (5)

          March 15, 2014 at 2:30 pm |
        • bostontola

          Islam,
          I do disagree. There wasn't 1 factual item in the Quran that wasn't known at the time. Why didn't they lay out the fundamental particles of nature, the periodic table, evolution, genetics, etc. Not one thing that could have proven it's divine truth.

          March 15, 2014 at 2:34 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          bostontola, it is clear from your response that you are not familiar with the scientific evidence in the Quran and hence I encourage you to check them out. You will be pleasantly surprised – notions that didn't exist 1400 years ago like hyber-space, shape of the earth, lowest point in earth, space time is CURVED, function of mountains, big bang theory and many others. All of that was revealed in the Quran and was just discovered recently. Is this not enough?

          Visit this site for a description of some of those accounts (factual): http://www.islamreligion.com/category/122/

          March 15, 2014 at 2:42 pm |
        • otoh2

          "notions that didn't exist 1400 years ago like hyber-space, shape of the earth, lowest point in earth, space time is CURVED, function of mountains, big bang theory and many others. All of that was revealed in the Quran and was just discovered recently. Is this not enough?"

          The claims are not true, so no, it is not enough.

          You have obviously not researched the thorough debunking of those claims.

          March 15, 2014 at 3:05 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          Please suggest a link to where those claims are debunked. It would be interesting to see how those claims are refuted and please be specific as to what claims can be refuted from those that I mentioned in my earlier post.

          March 15, 2014 at 3:13 pm |
        • bostontola

          Islam,
          I checked it out. There are no substantiated revelations of fact.

          March 15, 2014 at 3:12 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          An Example:
          http://youtu.be/sYajKl-Xr6c

          March 15, 2014 at 3:28 pm |
        • otoh2

          @islamistheanswer,

          Here is just ONE (of many) debunkings of Quran embryology: http://www.wikiislam.net/wiki/Embryology_in_the_Quran

          It's quite long, but briefly, the conclusion is:

          Qur'anic Embryology can be seen to be false due to the following points:

          1. The Qur'an itself omits mention of the ovum in human reproduction, with doctrinal evidence that it regards the progeny to be the resulting union between the seed from the male parent and the female parent as tilth. As tilth do not provide genetic material to the seed, it is clear that the Qur'an regards the nutfah (semen) as the diploid seed. Moreover, the choice of the words nutfah (small amount of liquid) and maa' maheenin (water/liquid disdained) in key passages indicate a belief that the embryo is formed out of semen, with no knowledge of the sperm cell.

          2. The Qur'an includes an initial dust stage that cannot be reconciled with modern embryology.

          3. The missing stages of verse 40:67 contradict the other embryology verses.

          4. The stages of bone formation then clothing with flesh is in error, even assuming that izhaam means both bone and cartilage.

          5. The Qur'anic view of cell differentiation at the Mudgha stage is incorrect, as modern embryology has discovered cell differentiation occurring before and after the putative ‘Mudgha’ stage.

          6. The claim that the Qur'an correctly predicted the beginning of the fetal stage is shown to be in error because the transition between the embryo and the fetus is arbitrary.

          7. The claim that the Qur'an correctly states the least period of conception at 24 weeks is in error, as according to modern medical knowledge this period is closer to 21-22 weeks or even less with advanced medical science, and at least 30 weeks without modern medical assistance.

          March 15, 2014 at 3:33 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          I had asked humbly for you to cite ONE example that you KNOW of and that you yourself researched not read in a wiki page without a reference to who the author are. HAVE you validated the claims in this response to be accurate? You mention for example that verses omitted in verses 40:67 contradict other embryology verses. This in and by itself shows your ignorance about the science of Comprehension and Meaning of the verses of the Quran. For verses to exist in different chapters within the Quran with the same subject doesn't necessitate that they are as elaborate of all the details. In fact, they exist elsewhere to remind of that sign but the emphasis is on another sign or lesson (here for example the reminder of how we humans were created in the different stages followed by the creation of life and death and the punishment of those who deny those signs of God). The verses are pasted below but I would urge you to learn and explore those signs and any "debunking" need to be followed by a research on your part. For some, the moment they hear the evidence, their main concern and focus on how to refute it rather than taking a step back and contemplating on those versus and signs. Rather than contemplating on whether a human could have come up with this in that detail, whether this level of complexity in detail could be an innovation of a man who lived in the desert in a society that was plagued by ignorance. READ!

          It is He who created you from dust, then from a sperm-drop, then from a clinging clot; then He brings you out as a child; then [He develops you] that you reach your [time of] maturity, then [further] that you become elders. And among you is he who is taken in death before [that], so that you reach a specified term; and perhaps you will use reason. (67) He it is who gives life and causes death; and when He decrees a matter, He but says to it, "Be," and it is. (68) Do you not consider those who dispute concerning the signs of Allah – how are they averted? (69) Those who deny the Book and that with which We sent Our messengers – they are going to know, (70) When the shackles are around their necks and the chains; they will be dragged (71) In boiling water; then in the Fire they will be filled [with flame]. (72) Then it will be said to them, "Where is that which you used to associate [with Him in worship] (73) Other than Allah?" They will say, "They have departed from us; rather, we did not used to invoke previously anything." Thus does Allah put astray the disbelievers. (74) [The angels will say], "That was because you used to exult upon the earth without right and you used to behave insolently. (75) Enter the gates of Hell to abide eternally therein, and wretched is the residence of the arrogant." (76) So be patient, [O Muhammad]; indeed, the promise of Allah is truth. And whether We show you some of what We have promised them or We take you in death, it is to Us they will be returned. (77)

          March 15, 2014 at 3:51 pm |
        • otoh2

          @islamistheanswer,

          Muhammad was not some hayseed yokel in the desert. He was a prominent political and military leader. As such, he would have had access to consulting and education from all sorts of people in the Middle East - religious, scientific and philosophic. Some of that embryology info was as old (if not older) than the ancient Greek scientists, hundreds and hundreds (perhaps a thousand) years earlier.

          March 15, 2014 at 4:12 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          There is no disagreement that embryology was attempted by the Greek way before the 7th century but please contemplate the level of detail in the revelation in the Quran. can you share with folks here the knowledge that existed before the Quran to validate the claim that that knowledge already existed. The issue here is that it is easy to say that it did exist but show proof that it did.. On the same token, if I claim that scientific discoveries today have been revealed before 1400 years ago in the Quran, the burden of proof lies on me to furnish such evidence – which was done. Embryology might be a cloudy example of scientific evidence but can you say the same on the others that I mentioned? My dear brother, have an open heart as you go through this exercise and let not your ego overtake you. If you come across something that is truly impressive..

          By the way, people in the middle east at the time of prophet Mohammed (Peace and Blessings be Upon Him) were not astute in politics, finance,governance, etc. They were rather tribal in nature, barbaric in that they buried their newly born girls (believed that woman were a shame to the family), the killed one another and had their loyalty only to the tribe. Not sure why you implied that that region was "civilized" at the time? That was not the case.

          March 15, 2014 at 4:30 pm |
        • otoh2

          @islamistheanswer,

          Look up the early history of Mecca and Medina. Sure they were tribal; but in the 600s, when Muhammad lived there, these cities were fairly important trade centers on the Spi.ce Route of the Middle East. Muhammad was a successful merchant and trader and would certainly have had exposure to the beliefs and learning of other cultures from the Middle East and beyond. When he went on to be a "chieftain" and then to a religion starter, he was well-established enough to have access to advisors from many disciplines – one, for example, Abu Bakr was a widely traveled and knowledgeable man. I can't find the names of some of the others right now, but I think a brother-in-law or uncle taught him about the Hebrew Bible, and it's not at all a far stretch to conclude that he learned things from other travellers to the area.

          March 15, 2014 at 5:05 pm |
        • readerpan

          The quran, like the bible, is full of baseless assertions. Period, end of story.
          “Believe nothing, no matter where you read it or who has said it, not even if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own common sense.” -Buddha

          Now there's a statement fit for building a life.

          March 16, 2014 at 10:03 pm |
    • Keith

      All three of the Desert Cults are dangerous and evil.

      March 15, 2014 at 2:23 pm |
    • southerncelt

      Islam may be the path for Ishmael's descendants but not for the rest of us. Many paths, one destination. One path is not better than another as long as the destination is the same.

      March 16, 2014 at 3:57 pm |
      • islamistheanswer

        Southerncelt: the idea is that all those paths preach the same message and DID preach the same message. The message that didn't change since the revelation to our father Abraham and Lut, Jacob, Joseph ...... Jesus and finally Mohammed. Message to worship the creator and not associate any deity with Him. The deviations that took place throughout history were always rectified with the messages sent down through the messengers and Prophets (Peace and Blessings be Upon all of them). Islam is nothing new and shouldn't be viewed as something new. It is a rejuvenation of the original message sent down by God the Almighty. Worship one God. As was the case with Christianity, Islam came to further elaborate on the way of life for the entire humanity. Aside from what you hear in the Media, have you attempted to read about Islam and the Quran from the Muslims?

        March 16, 2014 at 9:45 pm |
    • unsername1

      see the attached gruesome video before you file your claim

      http://youtu.be/xTSYdo3j9qg

      March 16, 2014 at 7:40 pm |
    • wilburw7

      Jesus is God and opposes the writings of Mohammed that were inspired by Satan also called Allah.

      March 16, 2014 at 9:53 pm |
      • readerpan

        Baseless assertion. Fit only for children.

        March 16, 2014 at 10:06 pm |
        • wilburw7

          "Truly I tell you, unless you change and become like little children, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven." - Jesus Chirist

          March 16, 2014 at 10:17 pm |
      • observer

        wilburw7,

        The problem seems to be that radical Muslims are following most of the commands from God when he told the world how he wanted things run.

        March 16, 2014 at 10:24 pm |
  6. Akira

    "The word used for Jesus’ profession in the original Greek is tekton. The traditional translation is “carpenter.” But most contemporary scholars say it’s more likely a general craftsman; some even translate it as “day laborer.”"

    I would venture a guess that many words in the Bible were mistranslated, and they need to be revisited.

    March 15, 2014 at 1:41 pm |
    • Doris

      Maybe that's where the water into wine story came from. Maybe he just went and got water for the real laborers and was popular among them for adding something to make it a bit more palatable...

      March 15, 2014 at 1:43 pm |
      • theemptyone1

        I was married in the Balkans in 1999 where traditions older than the Bible are discernible in and around marriage ceremonies and practices. A marriage party, what we call a reception, can last up to three days. Mine was a day and a half. One thing that stood out to me was that as the groom, I was regarded as the master of the event and my Best Man came to me with questions and information and problems to be solved during the event. Our parents were not present, as we are both Americans, but one of our female friends mother took the place of that position. When we ran low on wine (food was never a question), I was consulted and my wishes followed. From this and other evidence in the NT, I think we can remove the notion that ordering wine was a miracle because I "changed" water into wine at my wedding by ordering more and it was my surrogate mother who told the waiters to bring it. Was it a conscious re-enactment of the Wedding at Canna? I don't think so, because although there were religious people present, ours was not a religious, but civil ceremony. The woman who acted as our surrogate mother was very religious (as Serbian Orthodox) but did not make any mention of the comparison, something the devout in that region never fail to do if there is a chance. It would have been unwise to do so because it tends to say that Jesus was the groom, something that many people in the past have pointed to as evidence that the Wedding at Canna was his own (with Mary Magdalene the likely bride). Ooops, another "mystery."

        March 15, 2014 at 2:09 pm |
    • bostontola

      Scholars can't even be sure of the meaning of old English, imagine the task to interpret the meaning of ancient Hebrew and Greek.

      March 15, 2014 at 1:45 pm |
      • ausphor

        Translation is in the eye of the beholder, that is whatever he desires it to be. That is why there are hundreds of different of bibles and thousands of apologists to argue why their version is the goodest. LOL

        March 15, 2014 at 1:50 pm |
        • ausphor

          Ooops ..different versions...

          March 15, 2014 at 1:51 pm |
      • Akira

        Exactly. Which is why I think many words were lost in translation.

        March 15, 2014 at 1:51 pm |
      • djangoboy

        Add to that the fact that Jesus would have spoken Aramaic but his words are supposedly captured in the Gospels IN GREEK. Think we might already have a bit of a translation problem right there?

        March 15, 2014 at 5:07 pm |
    • southerncelt

      Ahh, yes. Valid translation, as in St. Jerome translating the Greek, Aramaic, Hebrew, and other texts into Latin thereby creating the Latin Vulgate (a.k.a. The Bible). Latin was the prevalent language of commerce at the time. Only when the Protestant Reformation started did the process of deleting books and changing texts start. The original texts still exist if you have the desire to read them.

      March 16, 2014 at 4:03 pm |
  7. Rainer Helmut Braendlein

    "Jesus probably didn’t know everything."

    Unquote.

    I claim that he knew everything.

    Why?

    The mystery of Jesus Christ was that he had got a divine nature and a human nature perfectly united but not mingled. Jesus Christ even had got two wills, a divine one and a human one. The human will always submitted to the divine will: The man Jesus remained always in God through submitting his will to the will of Christ. Jesus was a man who was, is and will be always in God. He was yet in God before his birth. He was yet in God when he was born into the womb of his mother Mary. He was yet in God when he was born into the world leaving the womb of his mother. He remained in God even in Gethsemane when he knew that he had to face crucifixion next day. Though Jesus was a human being like we are, he was distinct from us: He did not wish to act against God's will or his divine nature (Christ). He accepted the rule of his divine nature (Christ), he even welcomed this rule all the time. We, in contrast, always forsake God even without any pressure (Adam forsook God though he had everything in the Paradise). We are a godless race by nature. Jesus indeed was a new Adam.

    When the divine nature of Jesus Christ, that means Christ or God, did not wish to reveal something, Jesus simply said that he would not know it but the Father. But actually, strictly speaking, he only did not wish to reveal something. It was less a matter of not-knowing than a matter of his will.

    That Jesus Christ was man and God at the same time proves the following:

    Matthew 17: 1-7

    The transfiguration of Jesus (Christ)

    And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart, 2 And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light. 3 And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him. 4 Then answered Peter, and said unto Jesus, Lord, it is good for us to be here: if thou wilt, let us make here three tabernacles; one for thee, and one for Moses, and one for Elias. 5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him. 6 And when the disciples heard it, they fell on their face, and were sore afraid. 7 And Jesus came and touched them, and said, Arise, and be not afraid.

    This passage is a clear proof that Jesus Christ could have behaved as God even on earth when it had been his will. But it was not his will. Jesus Christ wanted to be crucified as a man for the sake of our salvation: He has borne our sinful flesh or nature when he died for us on the cross. We have resurrected together with him, if we believe, and if we are sacramentally baptized.

    Jesus Christ said he would not know the hour of his second coming but actually he did not want to reveal it.

    As all churches worldwide turn apostate today, I believe that the hour of his second coming is very near.

    March 15, 2014 at 1:40 pm |
    • bostontola

      "I claim that he knew everything."

      Then there was no sacrifice on his part. How could that represent a reckoning of man's debt to God for all sin?

      March 15, 2014 at 1:42 pm |
    • Akira

      "Many of these claims tend to project our own desires on a man who will always remain somewhat elusive, hard to fully understand and impossible to pin down."

      Sounds like he was talking to you, thief.

      March 15, 2014 at 1:46 pm |
    • realbuckyball

      The proposition that there were two "natures" is self-refuting, (and Special Pleading).
      A "fully human" is not, and cannot be anything else. It's meaningless. (Jesus also never claimed divinity). It might be a "hybrid" of some sort, but using those words in that way is linguistic dishonesty. No OTHER human has any other "nature", thus if the word "human" actually means what you say it does, it does NOT mean "also something else". You're talking nonsense as usual Rainer Hemut. You think adding a middle name makes your nonsense any less nonsensical.

      March 15, 2014 at 1:56 pm |
      • islamistheanswer

        realbuckyball, I agree. Please check my post above.. There is no need to have doubts. A verse in the Quran talks about this doubt you mention and the confusion that was created after Jesus was taking to heaven. It also talks about the arguements of who Jesus was but then ALLAH (God) addresses all this confusion and doubt with the definitive answer )The Jews say "The Christians have nothing [true] to stand on," and the Christians say, "The Jews have nothing to stand on," although they [both] recite the Scripture. Thus the polytheists speak the same as their words. But Allah will judge between them on the Day of Resurrection concerning that over which they used to differ. (2:113))...

        That is Jesus, the son of Mary – the word of truth about which they are in dispute. (34) It is not [befitting] for Allah to take a son; exalted is He! When He decrees an affair, He only says to it, "Be," and it is. (35) [Jesus said], "And indeed, Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship Him. That is a straight path." (36) Then the factions differed [concerning Jesus] from among them, so woe to those who disbelieved – from the scene of a tremendous Day. (37) How [clearly] they will hear and see the Day they come to Us, but the wrongdoers today are in clear error. (38). Chapter 19 Mary

        March 15, 2014 at 1:58 pm |
    • Keith

      I think that waiting over 2000 years is about the dumbest thing I have ever heard of.

      March 15, 2014 at 2:26 pm |
  8. bostontola

    "Beware of most of these revelations; many are based on pure speculation and wishful thinking." Rev. Martin.

    Doesn't that apply to the bible as a whole?

    March 15, 2014 at 1:27 pm |
    • Woody

      "pure speculation and wishful thinking."

      That about sums up any and all religions, not just the Christian version.

      March 15, 2014 at 7:35 pm |
  9. collecemall

    Here's something you probably don't know. He most likely didn't exist. If there was a man named Jesus (and that's not a given) it's much more likely that the gospels are myth based on him after the fact. Stuff they don't teach you in church. Look up some info about how the bible was compiled. Who wrote it (here's a hint they don't know for most of it)? Who decided what got put in? Why did they decide that? Were there any eyewitnesses that wrote the gospels? Did they talk to an eyewitness? Was it edited by anyone? Are there any forgeries? Just be careful. If you believe and start asking tough questions you probably will end up on the road to doubt.

    March 15, 2014 at 1:17 pm |
    • harrisdm

      there is more evidence for the historicity of Jesus than there is for Julius Caesar. The majority of liberal scholars never doubt his existence only his divine attributes–(miracles and the resurrection)–because that would obviously validate everything He said. Keep asking questions. Keep seeking.

      March 15, 2014 at 1:34 pm |
      • bostontola

        There is historic evidence for a man named Jesus that had messianic claims, but your assertion that there is more than for Caesar is not founded.

        March 15, 2014 at 1:40 pm |
        • joey3467

          If Jesus was not the son of god then for all intents and purposes Jesus didn't exist.

          March 15, 2014 at 2:10 pm |
      • collecemall

        There's basically no credible evidence for him outside of the gospels and they are shaky at best. I'm assuming you are regurgitating what you heard in Sunday school. There are zero contemporary sources that speak of Jesus outside of the Bible. I'm assuming you didn't ask or answer any of the questions I posed as well.

        March 15, 2014 at 4:53 pm |
      • southerncelt

        OK, if you (or the liberal types) don't belivein resurrection, then where is His Body? Where is His Mother's body? We know where the Apostles ar buried so why not their Lord and His Mother? Hundreds saw Jesus wakling around and talking to people after dying on the Cross (and being stabbed). The fact that eyewitness testimony is so readily dismissed is the real problem,.

        March 16, 2014 at 4:10 pm |
      • readerpan

        Did you receive a major blow to the head?

        March 16, 2014 at 10:09 pm |
    • Vic

      If anyone tells that they have no doubt, most likely they would be lying.

      We all have doubts and unanswered questions, it is a big mystery; however, from what we have and given the stark evidence of this wondrous creation, Christians believe that God is the Almighty Father, Son (Lord Jesus Christ) and Holy Spirit.

      March 15, 2014 at 1:49 pm |
      • islamistheanswer

        Please check my post above.. There is no need to have doubts. A verse in the Quran talks about this doubt you mention and the confusion that was created after Jesus was taking to heaven. It also talks about the arguements of who Jesus was but then ALLAH (God) addresses all this confusion and doubt with the definitive answer )The Jews say "The Christians have nothing [true] to stand on," and the Christians say, "The Jews have nothing to stand on," although they [both] recite the Scripture. Thus the polytheists speak the same as their words. But Allah will judge between them on the Day of Resurrection concerning that over which they used to differ. (2:113))...

        That is Jesus, the son of Mary – the word of truth about which they are in dispute. (34) It is not [befitting] for Allah to take a son; exalted is He! When He decrees an affair, He only says to it, "Be," and it is. (35) [Jesus said], "And indeed, Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship Him. That is a straight path." (36) Then the factions differed [concerning Jesus] from among them, so woe to those who disbelieved – from the scene of a tremendous Day. (37) How [clearly] they will hear and see the Day they come to Us, but the wrongdoers today are in clear error. (38). Chapter 19 Mary

        March 15, 2014 at 1:55 pm |
        • realbuckyball

          So a verse in the fairy take says the fairy tale is true.
          How compelling.

          March 15, 2014 at 4:24 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          If I were in your shoes, I would actually elaborate on why I call a book "a fairy tale" rather than throw baseless accusations without proof. You seem to be an intelligent individual so it behooves you to spend the time to learn about those fairy tales to be able to call out exact cases/instances.. Willing to take that challenge?

          March 15, 2014 at 4:37 pm |
      • bostontola

        Honest statement Vic, kudos. I'm not certain of what I had for lunch yesterday.

        March 15, 2014 at 1:58 pm |
      • Keith

        So, Christians do not believe in one god they believe in Three

        March 15, 2014 at 2:28 pm |
        • Vic

          The Holy Trinity, One Godhead Three Persons—Father, Son (Lord Jesus Christ) and Holy Spirit—has three distinct "Persons" of One Shared Existence, hence "Hypostases." The use of the word "Person" is but a translation for the lack of a better term.

          March 15, 2014 at 2:47 pm |
        • Keith

          Abigail Adams wrote to her husband "no matter how those Congregationalists try to explain it the three for one "god" doesn't make sense. I believe in the "god of Abraham" that the Jews, Christians and Muslims abandoned.

          March 20, 2014 at 10:14 am |
        • Keith

          Vic, I have seen all the explanations, none of them make sense. You either worship one god, or you are not really monotheistic.

          March 16, 2014 at 1:49 am |
  10. steelontarget

    “It is not fair to take the children’s food and throw it to the dogs.”

    Good to see we can all agree that the mythological character known as Jesus was really just an @ s s h o l e after all. Much like the religious cult that is based on his mythology.

    March 15, 2014 at 1:12 pm |
    • Vic

      I don't have a problem with that. I always wondered, since Jesus Christ confined Himself to the human realm, sin comes with the territory.

      March 15, 2014 at 1:16 pm |
      • Akira

        But, Vic, most Christians INSIST that Jesus was without sin. Ever. Perfect.

        I've never understood that either.

        March 15, 2014 at 1:30 pm |
      • doobzz

        Then he's not qualified to be the perfect human sacrifice necessary to atone for original sin.

        March 15, 2014 at 1:53 pm |
    • championsleaguer

      Those are harsh words. But even an iron heart can melt! May the LORD accept your apology and your future efforts to right any wrongs. I support you in this endeavor.

      March 16, 2014 at 3:37 am |
      • doobzz

        It must be hard for you to have the bigotry of your "messiah" written right there in black and white in your precious book for the world to see.

        March 16, 2014 at 11:02 am |
  11. bostontola

    Why does Jesus need to threaten eternal infinite pain if you don't love him?

    March 15, 2014 at 12:55 pm |
    • championsleaguer

      He does not.

      March 16, 2014 at 3:45 am |
      • doobzz

        Of course he does. That's the deal. Either you love Jesus or burn. He's like an abusive boyfriend.

        March 16, 2014 at 11:04 am |
        • championsleaguer

          Jesus is quite forgiving. God, not so much, unless you repent. 🙂 The only reason all of us are speaking is because a.) the LORD has given us breath, and b.) Jesus died so that God didn't destroy us! It's a pretty good deal. You, and the rest of the Antichrists in the comment board, are allowed to speak so viciously about God and his son, Jesus! How does that make him abusive? All of you have been abusing the LORD with your words since this article was published! Change your ways, or answer for it later!

          March 16, 2014 at 11:13 am |
        • doobzz

          Jesus is part of the trinity, and he supposedly said, "I and the father are one". Jesus is just as abusive as his daddy, since they are one god, along with that annoying bird part of them that is supposed to make people talk funny.

          Your last sentence proves it. Love god or he'll hurt you in horrible ways forever.

          March 16, 2014 at 11:23 am |
        • championsleaguer

          Why do you hate the LORD so much? He has given you breath, given you life! He has enabled you to speak so hatefully against him, yet you despise him further!

          March 16, 2014 at 11:46 am |
        • doobzz

          Oh, good grief. Pointing out that your deity destroyed every living thing in a fit of pique is not hatred.

          March 16, 2014 at 12:11 pm |
        • championsleaguer

          and the Holy Trinity is a construct of the church. Nowhere in the bible (unless perhaps literally once or twice in the New Testament) does it specifically mention "The Holy Trinity". The Holy Spirit is absolutely true, however, but please, for my sake and your very well-being don't insult it! It is sacred. Jesus even mentioned that you could insult him, and he would forgive you, but the LORD will not forgive someone who insults the Holy Spirit.

          March 16, 2014 at 11:49 am |
        • doobzz

          I know that blasphemy of the "holy spirit" is a very, very bad thing. It's like saying "Mary Worth" three times in a dark closet.

          March 16, 2014 at 12:13 pm |
        • igaftr

          champion

          you'll never get into Valhalla with an at!tude like that.
          You will never acheive enlightenment.
          You won't get a favored spot on Mt. Olympus.
          You will be re-incarnated as a lesser animal.
          You need to sacrifice one of the villages virgins to the volcano so we can have good crops...

          All based on ridiculous myths, just liek yours.

          How will you react when Ra is looking at you in the afterlife, and you worshipped your false god?

          March 16, 2014 at 11:20 am |
        • igaftr

          champ
          "The Holy Spirit is absolutely true, however, but please, for my sake and your very well-being don't insult it! It is sacred. Jesus even mentioned that you could insult him, and he would forgive you, but the LORD will not forgive someone who insults the Holy Spirit."

          First, do you need a lesson in the difference between belief and truth? you have no idea if "the holy spirit is true, escpescially absolutely.
          Second, I though all things could be forgiven. So your god gets insulted when other gods are put before Him?
          You'd better not mention any of the planets, the days of the week, Drive a Saturn, own a pair of Nike's...all of those are gods who are being mentioned before yours.
          Most of them were gods before yours was invented too.

          March 16, 2014 at 11:54 am |
        • myweightinwords

          Champion, "and the Holy Trinity is a construct of the church. Nowhere in the bible (unless perhaps literally once or twice in the New Testament) does it specifically mention "The Holy Trinity".

          Actually, the trinity is a concept borrowed from previous religions. It is not a concept that the Jewish religion, from which Christianity was born, held to. You will not find the "trinity" anywhere in the bible. It is a misunderstood model of Pagan triple gods (in which no one actually believes that the 3 are all 1, unless it is as 3 stages of life...as in Maiden, Mother and Crone, in which case, all three can actually be the same person, just at different stages of life). And, it should be noted, none of these religions claimed to be monotheistic.

          And because it was misunderstood, it was not mimicked very well, ending up with the convoluted idea that is the Christian trinity.

          The more you know...

          March 16, 2014 at 12:26 pm |
    • wilburw7

      You decided to sin; therefore, you have earned for yourself eternal damnation. Jesus has generously offered to pay for your sin. Instead of accepting His gift, you mock Him. Woe is you.

      March 16, 2014 at 10:13 pm |
      • observer

        wilburw7,

        Why are Christians so unwilling to accept blame for their actions and instead let Jesus take their punishment?

        March 16, 2014 at 10:16 pm |
        • wilburw7

          Christians acknowledge their sin and ask for mercy and receive it through Jesus Christ that wants you to receive salvation. Why do non-Christians choose to go to hell when you do not have to?

          March 16, 2014 at 10:37 pm |
        • observer

          wilburw7,

          Christians "acknowledge" their sins and then let Jesus take the punishment. Good system. It especially works well for all the Christian hypocrites who divorce and remarry while continuing to live in adultery and let Jesus take the punishment. This gives them time to protest gay marriage.

          March 16, 2014 at 10:42 pm |
  12. Vic

    ♰ ♰ ♰ Jesus Christ Is Lord ♰ ♰ ♰

    Why Jesus Christ became flesh:

    Jesus Christ, when on earth, was fully God and fully man. That was not at random. The death in the flesh that is without a blemish was the requirement for atonement (for the remission of sins;) the once and for all sacrificial "Lamb of God;" the "Penal Substitution;" All sacrifices before where temporal.

    John 1:14
    "14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth."

    Colossians 2:9-14
    "9 For in Him all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form, 10 and in Him you have been made complete, and He is the head over all rule and authority; 11 and in Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ; 12 having been buried with Him in baptism, in which you were also raised up with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead. 13 When you were dead in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions, 14 having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross."

    Scripture Is From:

    New American Standard Bible (NASB)
    Copyright © 1960, 1962, 1963, 1968, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1975, 1977, 1995 by The Lockman Foundation

    http://www.biblegateway.com/

    March 15, 2014 at 12:37 pm |
    • doobzz

      So Jesus was fully god and fully man. Did he have original sin, then?

      March 15, 2014 at 12:42 pm |
      • Vic

        No.

        That's the point. Jesus Christ as Deity was without sin—without a blemish—Who became sin for us for the purpose of atonement. Sin came through Adam, and with sin came death and separation from God the Father. Jesus Christ took away the sin of the world, and brought us eternal life and reconciliation with Gos the Father.

        March 15, 2014 at 12:47 pm |
        • doobzz

          If he didn't have original sin, he wasn't fully human.

          March 15, 2014 at 12:51 pm |
        • ausphor

          Vic
          Oh you poor fellow Osteen and Schuller are two of your favorite, all of your Sundays in front of the TV.

          March 15, 2014 at 12:53 pm |
        • Vic

          He became sin for us.

          2 Corinthians 5:21
          "21 He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf, so that we might become the righteousness of God in Him." (NASB)

          March 15, 2014 at 12:58 pm |
        • Doris

          Motor-mouth Saul of Tarsus' opinion is duly noted.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:06 pm |
        • realbuckyball

          Jesus never claimed to be a "deity". The very idea that a Jew would claim equality with Yahweh is preposterous. The entire business of his nature was cooked up over the centuries by the early Christians, who argued and VOTED about in the councils. In Hebrew culture there were many "divine beings". That in NO WAY meant they held an equivalent position to Yahweh. All scholars knows that the "divinity" of Jesus is presented significantly differently, in each gospel. Martin thinks he can support his assertions with statement from the gospels. How strange he doen't even know what "circular" means. There is not a shred of evidence that Yeshua ben Josef ever existed, or that he can be distinguished from Jesus of Gemala, Simon of Perea, or Philo's Jesus.

          How weird that Martin would actually think he has something to say of interest on a topic he clearly knows nothing about.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:14 pm |
        • Vic

          As Christians, we believe the accounts of Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior.

          Jesus Christ was prophesied in the Old Testament and attested to in the New Testament. He spoke of Himself as being from above and to be the Son of God the Father. He clearly spoke of and promised us the Holy Spirit.

          Using the Holy Bible for reference is but NORMAL.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:28 pm |
        • realbuckyball

          BTW, if it's a legitimate enterprise to cherry-pick "details" in the gospels, for believers, then it's equally legitimate for critics to question the details, and actually it's a slippery slope for believers to even bring up. The DETAILS refute the historicity. They CONTRADICT each other in important ways. The gospels can't even agree at what time, or day esus died, or whether he gave a speech or was silent at his (imaginary) "trial". No Jewish peasant was EVER ONCE brought in front of Roman aristocrats for "trouble making". There was a standing order in the Pax Romana to summarily execute them. There was no trial. The Sanhedrin was NEVER ONCE in ewish history called into session on Passover weekend. The temple curtain was never spontaneously torn, (or it would have been reported). In Matthew many others also rose from the dead and walked around in the zombie invasion. Really ? Yet NOT ONE was reported as having been seen, or ONE of their empty graves reported.
          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=twX5HlBDZEI

          March 15, 2014 at 1:29 pm |
        • Vic

          "As Christians, we believe the accounts of Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior in the Holy Bible."

          March 15, 2014 at 1:30 pm |
        • realbuckyball

          Doesn't make a bit of difference, what is "normal". (the ad populum fallacy).
          Other religions believe just as vehemently as you do that they are correct.
          In fact since the beginnings of religions EVERY believer thinks THEY ALONE have the truth.
          You INTERPRET the text to suit YOUR preconceived notions. In fact you have NO expertise in ancient Near Eastern culture, history and languages, and neither does Martin.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:32 pm |
        • Doris

          "Jesus Christ was prophesied in the Old Testament "

          You didn't think NT writers would be fool enough to write a sequel to Gullible's Travels, Part 1 that didn't make tie well with it, did you?

          March 15, 2014 at 1:35 pm |
        • martylk

          Glad to see other people in the world know the *real* truth of the Christian faith. I pray the Lord's blessings on you. May he keep you in his grace and love and protect you from all harm and danger. May he preserve your faith and keep you humble before him as you walk and live in his unimaginable love. I pray the Lord guard you from Satan, the world and the sinful human nature.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:35 pm |
        • Doris

          correction: "You didn't think NT writers would be fool enough to write a sequel to Gullible's Travels, Part 1 that didn't tie well with it, did you?"

          March 15, 2014 at 1:36 pm |
        • Doris

          "May he keep you in his grace and love and protect you from all harm and danger."

          Don't forget to spread some garlic above the door frame. I'm sure there are vampires about... 🙄

          March 15, 2014 at 1:37 pm |
        • Vic

          Hold your horses.

          Faith is by hearing. We hear about the Lord Jesus Christ and His Good News—passed down through generations—and we believe them, regardless of whatever errors there might have been in the process regarding details. The general narrative of God in the Holy Bible is clear enough and matches our sentience. We don't need to be scholars to know and believe there is [a] God.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:37 pm |
        • Doris

          Lol. Let's be glad that our missile defense system isn't managed by a series of people telling each other the proper instructions via "the oral tradition"....

          March 15, 2014 at 1:40 pm |
        • realbuckyball

          Jesus of Nazareth fulfilled NONE of the requirements the messiah was supposed to accomplish. Is the KINGDOM of David re-established ? No.

          The very notion of "prophesy as fortune-telling" is non-biblical, (as any Freshman Bible 101 student knows).
          Divination and sooth-saying were forbidden in ancient Isreal. It was not until apocalypticism became popular LATE (around the turn of the millennium), that "secret meanings" – "peshers" became popular. The role of a prophetvwas NEVER to tell the future. Just more proof you know nothing about that actual culture, Vic.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:43 pm |
        • realbuckyball

          Faith is "not by hearing". Saul/Paul says he got his gospel "from no man". He had an hallucination. That's how he got his gospel.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:44 pm |
        • doobzz

          Well, Vic, there's a problem. If Jesus didn't have original sin, then he wasn't fully human, so he can't be the representative man for the necessary human sacrifice. If he did have original sin, then he's not the perfect sacrifice without blemish or spot.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:47 pm |
        • Vic

          John 1:10,11
          "10 He was in the world, and the world was made through Him, and the world did not know Him. 11 He came to His own, and those who were His own did not receive Him." (NASB)

          References On Prophecies Of Jesus Christ:

          http://www.accordingtothescriptures.org/prophecy/353prophecies.html

          http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Miscellaneous/messianic_prophecies.htm

          http://www.bibleprobe.com/300great.htm

          http://www.jesusiscoming.com/Scripture.htm

          March 15, 2014 at 2:00 pm |
        • Doris

          "He had an hallucination."

          Some of the less gullible people he was trying to sell hysteria to probably got sick of listening to him and fed him some bad food causing fever and .....

          March 15, 2014 at 2:00 pm |
        • Vic

          The following is a hyperlink to an examination of the prophecies of Jesus Christ and their fulfillment, I only recommend it if you can read it closely and thoroughly:

          http://www.provethebible.net/T2-Divin/D-0301.htm

          March 15, 2014 at 2:03 pm |
        • Doris

          http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Failed_biblical_prophecies

          March 15, 2014 at 2:04 pm |
      • Vic

        "Jesus Christ took away the sin of the world, and brought us eternal life and reconciliation with God the Father."

        March 15, 2014 at 12:49 pm |
        • doobzz

          Your opinion is duly noted.

          March 15, 2014 at 12:51 pm |
        • Vic

          Read Romans 5:12-21

          March 15, 2014 at 1:03 pm |
        • Doris

          Motor-mouth Saul of Tarsus' opinion is duly noted.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:05 pm |
        • djangoboy

          Yes, Saul of Tarsus, who became Paul. A man who never met Jesus face to face but then somehow through a divine experience of him on the road to Damascus became the world's greatest expert on Jesus. Who hijacked the Jesus movement and made it his own.

          March 15, 2014 at 5:11 pm |
        • islamistheanswer

          Our Lord, we have believed in what You revealed and have followed the messenger Jesus, so register us among the witnesses [to truth]." (53) And the disbelievers planned, but Allah planned. And Allah is the best of planners. (54) [Mention] when Allah said, "O Jesus, indeed I will take you and raise you to Myself and purify you from those who disbelieve and make those who follow you [in submission to Allah alone] superior to those who disbelieve until the Day of Resurrection. Then to Me is your return, and I will judge between you concerning that in which you used to differ. (55) And as for those who disbelieved, I will punish them with a severe punishment in this world and the Hereafter, and they will have no helpers." (56) But as for those who believed and did righteous deeds, He will give them in full their rewards, and Allah does not like the wrongdoers. (57) This is what We recite to you, [O Muhammad], of [Our] verses and the precise [and wise] message. (58) Indeed, the example of Jesus to Allah is like that of Adam. He created Him from dust; then He said to him, "Be," and he was. (59) The truth is from your Lord, so do not be among the doubters. (60) Then whoever argues with you about it after [this] knowledge has come to you – say, "Come, let us call our sons and your sons, our women and your women, ourselves and yourselves, then supplicate earnestly [together] and invoke the curse of Allah upon the liars [among us]." (61)

          Quran Chapter 3

          March 15, 2014 at 5:15 pm |
    • bostontola

      A partial list of Gods that were born from human mothers (from Wiki):
      Abhimanyu incarnation of Varchas, son of moon god Chandra
      Achilles born of mortal man and a nymph
      Aeacus
      Aeneas
      Agenor
      Alpheus
      Amphion
      Arcas
      Arjuna son of king of all gods, the thunder-god Indra & incarnation of Nara
      Ashwathama contained spark of the great god Rudra god of cosmic destruction and universal dissolution
      Asklepios (also known Asclepius) son of the sun god Apollo
      Arquette (also known Arkie) daughter of both Roman and Greek sky gods Jupiter and Zeus
      Athis
      Babruvāhana
      Bali
      Belus
      Bhima son of god of air and wind Vayu
      Bhishma incarnation of celestial god and king of Vasus
      Cu Chulainn
      Chrysaor son of sea god and Medusa and the brother to Pegasus
      Clymene
      Cycnus
      Daedalus
      Dardanus
      Dhristadyumna materialised out of a ritual fire-altar, quasi incarnation of fire-god Agni
      Dionysus son of Zeus
      Drona contained spark of Brihaspati
      Epaphus
      Faith
      Florencia[disambiguation needed]
      Ghatotkacha born of a demigod and a demoness
      Gilgamesh
      Hanuman
      Helen of Troy
      Heracles (also known by the Roman spelling, Hercules)
      Jason son of Roman sky god Jupiter
      Iasion
      Iravan
      Karna son of sun-god Surya
      Kritavarma
      Lakshmana incarnation of great dragon god Ananta
      Māui (Maori) (New Zealand)
      Memnon
      Minos
      Nakula son of one of the god Ashvini
      Otrera daughter of the war god
      Orion possible son of poseidon
      Orpheus
      Peirithous
      Perseus
      Polydeuces of the Dioscuri
      Pradyumna incarnation of Sanatkumara
      Rhadamanthus
      Rhesus of Thrace
      Sahadeva son of one of the god Ashvini Kumaras
      Sarpedon
      Satyaki
      Shantanu
      Shikhandi
      Sugreeva
      Thalia daughter of Greek sky god Zeus
      Theseus
      Turns
      Vali
      Viviana
      Yudhisthira son of god of death and justice Yama
      Zetes
      Zethus

      March 15, 2014 at 12:47 pm |
      • Keith

        thanks

        March 15, 2014 at 2:31 pm |
    • realbuckyball

      A deity which is "subject" to the "requirements of atonement" is not, (and cannot be) the "creator" of the very Reality to which is subject. If it was, it could have easily changed them. You have never examined the crazy assumptions all that nonsense is based upon. The very notion of "salvation" is non-biblical, as Martin Buber (Jewish philosopher-Talmud scholar) pointed out in "Good and Evil". I'd be willing to bet that Martin makes his students read "I and Thou", by the same author. More cherry-picking.

      March 15, 2014 at 1:38 pm |
  13. edlf2014

    A sixth thing I don't know about Jesus: When a child did He tell His playmates He was the Son of God, not His father?

    March 15, 2014 at 12:09 pm |
  14. bostontola

    Why is Jesus' love conditional?

    March 15, 2014 at 12:00 pm |
    • doobzz

      It makes it easier to fleece the sheep that way.

      March 15, 2014 at 12:10 pm |
    • championsleaguer

      Why attempt to understand the LORD? Just be a good man. It is very easy to be loud, very difficult to be quiet.

      March 16, 2014 at 3:49 am |
      • TruthPrevails1

        You're right, it is hard to wrap ones mind around something that is portrayed as such an ass and that is used to justify hate and bigotry. (No my heart isn't darkened...I don't hate based on a fictional book, hate is something christians do)

        March 16, 2014 at 4:42 am |
  15. Vic

    Jesus Christ Is Lord

    March 15, 2014 at 12:00 pm |
    • doobzz

      of the flies.

      March 15, 2014 at 12:08 pm |
    • ausphor

      Vic
      Please, read the damn bible, you have to believe in him, there is the catch. He really doesn't give a sh!t about the non believers like me. I do yearn for Valhalla though.

      March 15, 2014 at 12:09 pm |
      • tallulah131

        Valhalla sounds like a fun place. Much better than heaven.

        March 15, 2014 at 1:08 pm |
        • ausphor

          tallu..
          It is a toss up between Valhalla and the FSM heaven, str!ppers and a beer volcano, tough choice.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:19 pm |
        • theemptyone1

          Not that Vahalla is what some nerds might imagine it to be, but all we know about the Jewish/Christian heaven is that they spend eternity praising and glorifying "God." All I can think is what an insecure god he must be to need all that.

          March 15, 2014 at 3:06 pm |
    • otoh2

      Jesus Christ is lore.

      March 15, 2014 at 12:10 pm |
      • djangoboy

        You misspelled "bore."

        March 15, 2014 at 5:12 pm |
  16. ausphor

    HAHAHA. More of the same trying to make jesus look cool especially to the young who are leaving the church. It reminds me of the RCC ad in New York with a picture of jesus in his gown wearing a pair of Nike sneakers. How desperate are the going to get in making a 2000 year old myth look hip!!

    March 15, 2014 at 11:50 am |
  17. doobzz

    "It’s natural to want to know as much as we can about Jesus; that’s one reason I wrote my new book."

    A crummy commercial!

    March 15, 2014 at 11:45 am |
    • bostontola

      At least with Ovaltine you got chocolate milk.

      March 15, 2014 at 11:50 am |
      • doobzz

        And a decoder ring.

        March 15, 2014 at 11:52 am |
        • bostontola

          "You'll shoot your eye out." Santa

          March 15, 2014 at 11:55 am |
    • bostontola

      "But beware of the more outlandish claims about the son of God"
      Translation:
      Buy my book, not the others.

      March 15, 2014 at 11:54 am |
      • doobzz

        Exactly. It's all about money, money, money.

        March 15, 2014 at 12:04 pm |
        • bostontola

          I'm all right Jack keep your hands off my stack.

          March 15, 2014 at 12:09 pm |
  18. bostontola

    " when Jesus was a young man he “progressed” in wisdom. That means he learned things"

    Duh. Yahweh didn't know everything either. If he did, why did he have to decimate mankind in a flood. He was always lashing out in anger, that comes from surprise, i.e. He didn't know.

    March 15, 2014 at 11:43 am |
    • djangoboy

      Nah, He just loves killing people.

      March 15, 2014 at 5:13 pm |
  19. bostontola

    "Beware of most of these revelations; many are based on pure speculation and wishful thinking."

    Freudian slip by Rev. Martin?

    March 15, 2014 at 11:36 am |
  20. Colton

    #1 He loves all mankind.

    March 15, 2014 at 11:30 am |
    • Mount Olivet

      Yes, Jesus loves all mankind, and men may come up with their own thoughts about who He is.

      The most important point is this: Jesus is God incarnate.

      March 15, 2014 at 11:35 am |
      • bostontola

        I thought it was the Hindu Gods that took human form in Avatars. Did Yahweh take that trick from them?

        March 15, 2014 at 11:38 am |
        • Rick

          Hindu gods are gods made in the image of man.

          Maybe you can explain Hinduism?

          March 15, 2014 at 11:42 am |
        • Rick

          Don't Hindus worship all forms of creatures that are not even human in form? That probably also lends to the belief that that you will reincarnate in a lesser form in the next life?

          March 15, 2014 at 11:45 am |
        • bostontola

          Rick, the Hindus have a god that looks like an elephant, a monkey etc. when Vishnu comes to earth, it takes form in many ways, human, fish, etc. I don't get your question.

          My point is that the Jesus story parallels the Hindu avatars.

          Jesus is an Avatar of Yahweh. Cool.

          March 15, 2014 at 11:48 am |
        • Rick

          What is an avatar as it relates to religion? Also, don't you believe that the truth is one and that there are many paths to the truth? That is a contradictory statement, applying the law of non-contradiction this will not even hold true. Because Muslims don't believe in the gods of Hindus and that itself is contradictory to your original claim that there are many paths to the truth, because Muslims of JW's will not accept that claim of yours.

          March 15, 2014 at 11:56 am |
        • bostontola

          Rick,
          Absolutely not, I don't believe in one truth. Even for trivial things there isn't one truth, I like chocolate ice cream, my wife likes strawberry. The same is true for ethical and moral priorities. Different cultures have a similar list, but different priorities. Christianity is clear for some things (you must love Jesus and accept him as your savior), but most of the rest has conflicting guidance.

          March 15, 2014 at 12:05 pm |
        • Rick

          If you don't believe that truth is one, how do you reconcile the many paths that Hinduism offers to you. Some Hindus even claim to be atheists and there are hindu philosophies that support atheism?

          March 15, 2014 at 12:10 pm |
        • bostontola

          Rick,
          I don't believe in Hinduism. I don't think there are multiple paths to a unique truth. I think we decide what is truth for us, how we want to live as a society, etc. We make our own purpose, our own laws, rules, governance, etc. religions were a huge leap forward in taming ourselves sociologically. We have better ways now.

          March 15, 2014 at 12:16 pm |
        • Rick

          That is understandable. It is very difficult for Hindus to prove their statements or claims.

          March 15, 2014 at 12:21 pm |
        • bostontola

          Rick,
          No religion can prove their claims, especially Christianity. The story is a complex mish mash of myth and legend borrowed from other ancient religions.

          March 15, 2014 at 12:24 pm |
        • Rick

          You changed the goal post now? This was an argument for Hinduism that you originally claimed, now you have shifted the focus when confronted with your claims?

          March 15, 2014 at 12:30 pm |
        • bostontola

          Rick,
          I recommend you go back and read the posts again. I want supporting any religion. I was making a simple point, Jesus incarnate is a concept borrowed from Hinduism. It is also borrowed from Greek religion, the Greek Gods came to earth and had se.x with women and children were born. These ideas predated Jesus by centuries.

          March 15, 2014 at 12:35 pm |
        • bostontola

          want -> wasn't

          March 15, 2014 at 12:37 pm |
        • doobzz

          " It is very difficult for Hindus to prove their statements or claims."

          As it is for Jews, Christians, Muslims, Scientologists and any other group that claims to have imaginary friends.

          March 15, 2014 at 12:39 pm |
        • Rick

          When you make the claim "Hindu Gods that took human form in Avatars", you should be willing to support that claim. Looks like you conveniently danced around the topic when confronted and then finally claimed you were not Hindu, which is deceitful.If you are making a claim like that make sure you are able to standby and support your claim and not skirt around the issue dishonestly. People appreciate when you honestly argue your position, there is no need to hide behind a façade. Be honest with yourself.

          March 15, 2014 at 12:48 pm |
        • bostontola

          Rick,
          Repeated for your convenience:
          "I thought it was the Hindu Gods that took human form in Avatars. Did Yahweh take that trick from them?"

          1. There is no claim in the statement at all. Do you know what "I thought..." means?
          2. That was followed by a question.

          The only deceit in this thread, is you deceiving yourself (best case).

          March 15, 2014 at 1:12 pm |
        • Rick

          As stated earlier, when you argue honestly it makes for a good discussion, discussion with someone who hides behind a facade is useless. You've made it very clear that you are Hindu posing off as an atheist, just like many other handles here. The only person you are deceiving is yourself.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:27 pm |
        • bostontola

          Rick,
          Please get help.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:30 pm |
        • Rick

          Keep pondering about what was stated earlier, someday you may(faint chance) come to the realization that being truthful is a virtue, after all!

          March 15, 2014 at 1:33 pm |
        • bostontola

          "My point is that the Jesus story parallels the Hindu avatars."

          This was from my second comment. I couldn't have been more straight forward and clear.

          You may have a reading comprehension problem. You may want to enroll in a class at your local community college.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:37 pm |
        • Rick

          Not sure why you keep deflecting from the truth. You don't need to be ashamed of your faith; stand up for it, man up and argue like a grown person would.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:46 pm |
        • Akira

          "Rick,
          I don’t believe in Hinduism."-bostontola

          Not sure why you are misrepresenting Boston, but acting disingenuous doesn't contribute to the conversation either.

          March 15, 2014 at 1:59 pm |
        • bostontola

          Rick,
          I think I was wrong about you. I thought you were a religious person that just got embarrassed by misinterpreting my post. Now I see you are likely an arrogant believer that thinks he knows what is in another person's mind, knows their motivations, etc.

          March 15, 2014 at 2:03 pm |
        • Rick

          The only reason you keep deflecting from the truth is that you are unable to defend your faith in Hinduism. It is understandable that you are unable to defend your faith when it is contradictory. The case is already made , you can have other Hindu posters to defend you, but it is very clear that you are a Hindu that poses like an atheist. There is just no point in talking to deceivers like you who pretend to be something that you are not.

          This is a good eye opener to be wise that not all posters here who pretend to be atheists are actually atheists and the said can be made for those on the end of the spectrum.

          There is no point in discussing with dishonest posters who claim to be something they are not. It is a fruitless exercise, nothing good can come out these fruitless discussions.

          March 15, 2014 at 2:13 pm |
        • bostontola

          Rick,
          I remember when my kids were around 10 years old, they used to argue like you: yes you are, no I'm not, yes you are...

          How old are you?

          March 15, 2014 at 2:18 pm |
        • doobzz

          Wow, bostonola, you had us all fooled. 🙄

          March 15, 2014 at 2:45 pm |
        • bostontola

          doobz,
          I was out washing my feet in the Ganges just this morning.

          March 15, 2014 at 2:49 pm |
        • Akira

          "The only reason you keep deflecting from the truth is that you are unable to defend your faith in Hinduism."

          Probably because he told you straight up that he wasn't Hindu, but you continue to lie about that and insist he's doing something wrong by not defending a faith HE DOESN'T EVEN FOLLOW.

          And you called boston dishonest? You either lack complete reading comprehension or you're here trying to inflate your ego by scoring some nonexistent internet point by lying through your teeth.

          Which is it?

          Anyone else think the the finisher got another name? These posts and the intentional lying sound just like him.

          March 15, 2014 at 7:43 pm |
      • Mount Olivet

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=sWSKtoURGAg

        March 15, 2014 at 11:38 am |
        • theemptyone1

          How great is a god that allows you to be tormented and persecuted throughout written history? It seems that victimhood is a religion. Any authority figure that has to punish his children so severely would be arrested in the real world and their right to be even near children removed. When will mankind get over this stuff and learn true wisdom?

          March 15, 2014 at 4:16 pm |
      • Colton

        Agree!

        March 16, 2014 at 2:56 am |
      • Mount Olivet

        @Rick-"What is an avatar as it relates to religion?..."

        The manifestation of a deity in bodily form is often referred to as an "avatar" , this bodily manisfestation of a being can take any number of forms.
        It embodies the concept of pantheism and ploytheism that "god is all" and that there are "many gods", which is Hinduism.

        The concept of "god is all" and that there are "many gods" which are incarnate beings of a deity contrasts the central tenets of Christianity.
        There is no "avatar" in Christianity where a bodily manifestation of a being can take any number of forms.

        Jesus clearly said, "I am THE WAY, THE TRUTH, THE LIFE, no man comes to the father except by me". That is an exclusive claim made by Jesus as to THE TRUTH.
        This statement made by Jesus falsifies any claims by hindus or sikhs that Jesus was an "avatar".

        March 17, 2014 at 12:40 pm |
    • ausphor

      Colton
      You missed the catch 22, he loves you if you believe in him, otherwise, not so much. Re: John 3:16

      March 15, 2014 at 11:54 am |
    • Jonathan Edwards

      Who is Jesus?
      A rabbi? A teacher? A prophet? A great person who lived on planet earth?

      What did Jesus say of Himself?

      Jesus is God.

      John 14:6

      John 1:14

      John 10:30

      John 8:58

      John 14:11

      Isaiah 7:14

      Revelation 1:8

      What did the disciples think of Jesus?

      John 20:28

      What did Paul say of Jesus?

      Colossians 2:9

      Philippians 2:5-8

      1 Corinthians 1: 1-2

      Romans 10:13-14

      What did the wise men think of Jesus?

      Matthew 2:11

      Matthew 2:2

      He is the GREAT I AM

      Exodus 3:14, Revelation 1:17-18

      🙂

      March 15, 2014 at 4:14 pm |
      • realbuckyball

        Nice. Now provide one external piece of proof that anything in the Bible is true.
        Then look up "circular logic".

        March 15, 2014 at 4:23 pm |
        • Jonathan Edwards

          What evidence do you have for the first amendment clause that,

          "prohibits the making of any law respecting an establishment of religion, impeding the free exercise of religion, abridging the freedom of speech, infringing on the freedom of the press, interfering with the right to peaceably assemble or prohibiting the petitioning for a governmental redress of grievances."

          Don't quote the US Constitution as evidence for the clause, that would be circular reasoning. Like saying you are bound by the US Constitution because the US Constitution says so.

          March 15, 2014 at 4:30 pm |
        • Akira

          Huh? How does this address realbuckyball's post?

          It doesn't.

          Try again.

          March 15, 2014 at 7:46 pm |
      • Colton

        Fabulous post!

        Kudos!

        March 16, 2014 at 2:54 am |
        • doobzz

          Yes, his bible verse copying skills are FABULOUS! 🙄

          March 16, 2014 at 11:09 am |
      • Jonathan Edwards

        Quid est veritas?

        March 16, 2014 at 4:16 pm |
        • Jonathan Edwards

          John 14:6

          March 16, 2014 at 4:18 pm |
        • Jonathan Edwards

          John 1

          March 16, 2014 at 4:24 pm |
        • Jonathan Edwards

          John 8

          March 16, 2014 at 4:24 pm |
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The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.