April 11th, 2014
09:27 AM ET

Pope asks for forgiveness for 'evil' of sex abuse

By Daniel Burke, Belief Blog Co-editor

(CNN) - Pope Francis made his strongest condemnation of sexual abuse by Catholic clergy on Friday, asking for forgiveness and pledging to impose penalties on "men of the church" who harm children.

“I feel compelled to personally take on all the evil which some priests, quite a few in number, obviously not compared to the number of all the priests, to personally ask for forgiveness for the damage they have done for having sexually abused children," the Pope said in remarks quoted by Vatican Radio.

"The Church is aware of this damage, it is personal, moral damage carried out by men of the Church, and we will not take one step backward with regards to how we will deal with this problem, and the sanctions that must be imposed," Francis continued. "On the contrary, we have to be even stronger. Because you cannot interfere with children."

The Pope's new comments, made to a Catholic NGO on Friday, represent a shift from his previous statements on sexual abuse.

- CNN Religion Editor

Filed under: Catholic Church • Pope Francis

soundoff (192 Responses)
  1. Blessed are the Cheesemakers

    Once again no responsibility taken by the RCC....this asshat isn't any better than the others.

    April 12, 2014 at 12:42 am |
  2. Concert in an Egg

    How do we know the pope is not guilty? And even if he has not personally committed these atrocities, he is even more guilty for doing nothing to punish those that have...with prison time.

    April 11, 2014 at 5:37 pm |
    • realbuckyball

      The Vatican has a prison ?

      April 11, 2014 at 11:55 pm |
      • Concert in an Egg

        The Vatican has a dungeon.

        April 12, 2014 at 11:17 am |
  3. thefinisher1

    Atheism should be kept away from children. Atheist parents will force their atheism onto their children. Atheist parents who do that should be found guilty of child abuse. I wonder if an atheist partner would hate their own child if he/she decided to leave the cult of atheism.

    April 11, 2014 at 4:29 pm |
    • Madtown

      Trolling comes naturally to some. For others, it's a work in progress.

      April 11, 2014 at 8:07 pm |
    • tallulah131

      What exactly are you finishing? You only seem to make silly comments that have no bearing on the topic.

      Oh, I get it. You are just another troll.

      April 11, 2014 at 8:34 pm |
    • realbuckyball

      When Christians indoctrinate their young into the cult of the ancient angry seity who NEEDED his son to die, so he could feel better, it's called "evangelization", and "spreading the good news". When atheists do the SAME THING, they're called "militants". Which is better ? Indoctrinating your children in a sky fairy, or telling them the truth ?

      April 11, 2014 at 11:58 pm |
    • realbuckyball

      So ... atheism is a cult now. Interesting. Now all you have to do is establish that crap statement to make any sense, and explain how the absence of belief is belief in absence. (Or perhaps English isn't your first language ? That would explain your nonsense.)

      April 12, 2014 at 12:00 am |
    • Blessed are the Cheesemakers

      Even though I am an atheist I agree with you....I think it is important to raise my children in a faith, so I pledged them to the Church of Satan...and it has the added benefit of less child r@pe!

      April 12, 2014 at 1:21 am |
  4. thefinisher1

    The atheist fundies will be all over this article. Their atheism is so weak, they need to be here. Nothing supports atheism. Nothing.

    April 11, 2014 at 4:24 pm |
    • MidwestKen

      Technically, that's true, which puts it on equal footing with religion which has nothing to support the supernatural.

      April 11, 2014 at 4:29 pm |
      • thefinisher1

        We know that atheism is weak, yes.

        April 11, 2014 at 4:35 pm |
    • tallulah131

      Obvious troll is obvious. And doesn't actually finish anything.

      April 11, 2014 at 8:34 pm |
    • realbuckyball

      Nothing needs to "support atheism". YOU are making the extraordinary claims, and YOU have to provide the evidence.
      You have none. By your logic, we have to provide evidence that there is no 1957 Chevy orbiting Pluto.

      April 12, 2014 at 12:02 am |
      • thefinisher1

        If you want people to stop believing, YOU REQUIRE EVIDENCE for YOUR CLAIMS. If you really think there is no God, you must have proof that we exist without a creator. Grow up you overgrown child.

        April 12, 2014 at 11:02 am |
        • doobzz

          Nope. Just like you don't require evidence that the Easter Bunny doesn't exist.

          But you aren't here for a discussion. You just like to troll. You're not even good at it.

          April 12, 2014 at 11:10 am |
      • realbuckyball

        Sorry. No one has to provide proof of irrational claims. You have none for your deity. The default position is not belief. No one believes anyway unless "the Father draw him". It has nothing whatever to do with anyone's belief. Your Jebus said as much.

        April 12, 2014 at 4:06 pm |
  5. Bootyfunk

    "But that is all it is: talk," said Barbara Dorris, SNAP's outreach director."
    "We beg the world's Catholics: Be impressed by deeds, not words. Until the Pope takes decisive action that protects kids, be skeptical and vigilant."

    +++ the pope has done NOTHING. he's said a few flowery words, but he's taken ZERO action. a good start would be to supply every bit of information they have about past abuses so the victims can get some resolution. they know about past and present priests and still do nothing. the pope gets no credit until he takes action.

    April 11, 2014 at 2:57 pm |
  6. unsername1

    People say the pope speak for God, ummm in other words, God wants to forgive child molesters, sinners!!

    April 11, 2014 at 2:52 pm |
  7. Concert in an Egg

    There is something about this that is on some levels, even more disturbing than the child sexual abuse itself and that is the disregard the priests have in their life’s calling. In other words, wouldn’t a man of God punish himself for his transgressions by resigning or confessing to these unforgiveable crimes? What kind of people become “men of God” in the first place? The bold face lies, the hypocrisy. How can any of it be tolerated unless it is institutionalized? Church is not a safe place for children and religion is just not safe period.

    April 11, 2014 at 2:19 pm |
  8. hotairace

    Did Pope-A-Dope order his minions to release all information about pedophile priests and their criminal protectors? Nope! Fuck 'im just like his fellow priests fucked innocent children.

    April 11, 2014 at 2:04 pm |
  9. SeaVik

    Anyone who indoctrinates their children is guilty of mental child absuse. Catholics won't be forgiven until they stop abusing childrent. Currently, it is a core part of the religion.

    April 11, 2014 at 1:24 pm |
    • Concert in an Egg

      Agree. Actions speak louder than words. Child abuse is a core value for all Christians.

      April 11, 2014 at 2:01 pm |
    • thefinisher1

      So that means you atheist parents should be guilty of child abuse as you force your atheism onto them. Seriously, get over yourself.

      April 11, 2014 at 4:27 pm |
      • Doris

        Oh poor baby. Butthurtedness was never so obvious...

        April 11, 2014 at 10:53 pm |
      • realbuckyball

        *As if* YOU didn't indoctrinate your young. Hypocrite.

        April 12, 2014 at 12:03 am |
  10. snuffleupagus

    No "forgiveness"f anything until the perps are prosecuted and put behind bars. As 'captian of the ship," you bear the responsiblity for running a 'moral and sin free, organization. People will make mistakes, but pedophilia is not a mistake but a sickness in the head.. These priests knew what they were doing was wrong, yet did it anyway. Seems to me these priests were more afaid of being cought by real-life authorities, than being punished by the god they profess to believe in. Hmmm, I think they are fakers, they don't believe what they tell others to believe.

    April 11, 2014 at 12:27 pm |
  11. Doc Vestibule

    1. In 1962, The Vatican relased the 'Crimen Sollicitationis', which outlined how the church is to handle accusations of se.xual impropriety against clergy.
    The stickiest point for most people is that not only was the doc.ument itself Top Secret for decades, it explictly stated that anybody involved in this type of investigation, including the accuser and potential witnesses, are sworn to secrecy regarding any and all details, upon penalty of excommunication (a fate worse than death for the devout).
    This preoccupation with secrecy significantly slowed the investigative process – the backlog of referrals to the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith for action against se.xually abusive priests is so large that it takes 18 months to get a reply.
    According to the John Jay report, 918 of 1872 (49%) substantiated allegations of abuse against Catholic clergy were addressed by sending the priest off for psychiatric counseling and then moving him to another parish, with nary a whisper to law enforcement. This number does not include priests relocated for reasons other than charges of se.xual impropriety.
    The Catholic Church's pre-occupations in dealing with cases of child se/xual abuse have been the maintenance of secrecy, the avoidance of scandal, the protection of the reputation of the Church, and the preservation of its as.sets. All other considerations, including the welfare of children and justice for victims, have been subordinated to these priorities.

    Until the Pope publically and unequivocally states that all allegations of abuse will immediately be referred to local law enforcement, the RCC will be viewed as an evil, predatory inst.itution by a large portion of the world.

    April 11, 2014 at 11:45 am |
    • Akira

      That's all he needs to do. One Papal proclamation.
      "Pedophiles will be turned over to law enforcement for prosecution."

      April 11, 2014 at 12:02 pm |
      • ausphor

        Oh Lord, Oh Lord, How can we get bums back in the pews?

        April 11, 2014 at 12:15 pm |
  12. Dyslexic doG

    we are all born as atheists

    the abuse comes when parents and priests brainwash children with bronze age fairy stories and the threat of eternal fire and torment if they don't believe.

    let's set up a commission to investigate THAT abuse!

    April 11, 2014 at 11:40 am |
    • workingcopy12

      Dog...where does all the hyperbole come from? I have two children 17 and 12. They have attended church their entire lives. In all that time, I don't recall anyone in my family, or anyone at our church ever threatening our children with eternal damnation if they don't believe. Our focus, just as I believe the focus is in most Christian homes, is to (a) love god and (b) love our neighbor. Your continued brainwashing argument is absurd.

      April 11, 2014 at 1:07 pm |
      • TruthPrevails1

        Do they believe in Evolution? Do they believe in the Big Bang?

        >>If no, then you have brainwashed them and lied to them.

        Do they believe that abortion is a sin? Do they think that LGBT is a sin?

        >>If yes, then you have brainwashed them.

        April 11, 2014 at 1:12 pm |
      • SeaVik

        The point is, without brain-washing them from birth, it is extremely unlikely that your children would come to believe in your god fairy tale as an adult. Teaching children that it's ok to ignore evidence and believe things purely based on "faith" is a seriously harmful message and one at the core of religion.

        April 11, 2014 at 1:28 pm |
      • MidwestKen

        Isn't it implicit in the belief system? Ask them what happens to non-believers when they die?

        April 11, 2014 at 4:36 pm |
      • realbuckyball

        There are 33,000 Christian sects. Each of you people think your sect is the real most authentic one. 1/33,000.
        Good odds or bad odds that yours is right. I was taught I would go to hell if I dies in mortal sin. I bought it as a child, Catholics teach that to millions of children. Good for you if you don't. There are STILL millions if not billions of fundies that do precisely THAT in the name of their deity. You can put your head in the sand if you want. It doesn't change the facts.

        April 12, 2014 at 12:47 am |
    • thefinisher1

      You heard it folks! Doggie addmitted atheism is the source of all the problems in this world! Ban atheism now!

      April 11, 2014 at 4:45 pm |
      • realbuckyball

        And just exactly how would you go about that, and how would you enforce that Mr. Thought Police.
        I see you cannot be a patriotic American. That is a very un-American thing to say.
        Your friend is Mr Putin ?

        April 12, 2014 at 12:49 am |
        • thefinisher1

          Wrong. I was acting like you atheists..so much for "logic" and "reason"! Heheheh

          April 12, 2014 at 11:03 am |
        • realbuckyball

          Nice try. Fail. You were caught in the act being a troll, and you can't even own up tot it.

          April 12, 2014 at 4:08 pm |
      • doobzz

        Could you point out where he said anything of the kind?

        April 12, 2014 at 11:07 am |
  13. bostontola

    This pope says the right things, and that alone is a step in the right direction. But it is only a step.

    The RCC must follow through with action that truly fixes their problems, punishes the criminals in their ranks, and compensates victims.

    April 11, 2014 at 11:34 am |
  14. doobzz

    "The church is aware of this damage, it is personal, moral damage carried out by men of the church, and we will not take one step backward with regards to how we will deal with this problem, and the sanctions that must be imposed," Francis continued.

    The church is aware? No shit, Francis, the whole world is aware.

    "But that is all it is: talk," said Barbara Dorris, SNAP's outreach director. "We beg the world's Catholics: Be impressed by deeds, not words. Until the Pope takes decisive action that protects kids, be skeptical and vigilant."

    Turning them over for prosecution would be a good start. Until that happens, the pope is just another lying huckster scrambling to cover the crimes of his minions.

    April 11, 2014 at 11:22 am |
    • Akira

      Agreed; but until he states emphatically that criminals will be turned over for prosecution, it's just talk.

      April 11, 2014 at 1:59 pm |
      • doobzz

        Precisely. It's all just been "we're going to deal with it, really. Honest, this time we mean it" so far.

        April 11, 2014 at 2:28 pm |
  15. Akira

    One sentence. Seven words. That's all I would like to see.

    "I will turn pedophiles over for prosecution."

    April 11, 2014 at 11:08 am |
    • Concert in an Egg

      I also have a sentence, but I would get in trouble.

      April 11, 2014 at 12:05 pm |
      • Akira

        I'll just bet....

        April 11, 2014 at 12:18 pm |
  16. joey3467

    No one can forgive them until we know all of their names.

    April 11, 2014 at 11:06 am |
  17. Rainer Helmut Braendlein

    The se-xual abuse of children by Catholic clergy is not by far the greatest damage which the RCC brings about. The number of cases may be limited (at least relatively).

    The worst spiritual crime of the RCC of today is "levelling down". The pope blesses believers of all religions, even anti-Christian religions like Islam. The pope even claims that Christians and Muslims would share the faith of Abraham. Obviously the pope has absolutely no notion of Abraham's faith. The pope is an extreme spiritual dabbler, and that is expressed well-meaning. In fact, the pope is any enemy of Jesus Christ, the Son of God. Also Muhammad was an outrageous enemy of the incarnated God, Jesus. The pope is responsible for the soul's death of billions of Catholics and believers of other religions. He doesn't preach the pure gospel of Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ alone can save us or anybody.

    Though the RCC keeps sacramental baptism (sacr. baptism is good in itself), the Holy Spirit has forsaken her (since the beginning of 7th century). The Holy Spirit forsook the RCC, when the bishop of Rome started to presume to be bishop of all bishops, the highest bishop of the world. Through that he deprived Christ from his office as invisible head of the whole Church, and the invisible head of all bishops and priests. It is clear that God cannot stand that a human being tries to rule his body which is divine in the strictest sense of the word. The real Christian Church is indeed the body of Christ, nearly Christ himself. Impossible that one lousy human dwarf, called pope, could rule that glorious body. Therefore the Holy Spirit has forsaken the RCC, she is no more Christian Church, but the wh-ore of the Revelation which has forsaken her groom Jesus, and joined Satan.

    Only by the releasing power of the Holy Spirit we can overcome the lust of our body, including se-xual lust. Now it has become clear why Catholic clergy abuse children. They are still slaves of their lust, because their church is no real church, but a pseudo-church.

    April 11, 2014 at 10:39 am |
    • Doris

      Sacramental Baptism. Well yes, and don't forget to rub down the door frames with garlic in a clockwise motion. You won't receive His protection unless you get things right.... (eyeroll emoticon goes here)

      April 11, 2014 at 10:44 am |
      • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

        Sacramental Baptism is nothing magical though it is supernatural. The triune God bestows upon us eternal blessing.Jesus sacrifice is made present during baptism. We become partakers of Jesus death and resurrection through baptism which bridges all barriers of time and space. After baptims we can really say that we have died and resurrected together with Jesus. That is much more than accepting the gospel as true. Through baptism our faith gets sealed and strengthened. The faith which refers to baptism is the faith which makes us able to present our body as a living sacrifice.

        April 11, 2014 at 10:51 am |
        • G to the T

          " is nothing magical though it is supernatural"

          I find it fascinating that you would consider these 2 different concepts. What is your criteria if I may ask?

          April 11, 2014 at 11:57 am |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          I am not understanding your question. Could you express your question using other terms? What do you mean?

          April 11, 2014 at 12:00 pm |
        • sam stone

          how is supernatural different than magical, rainy?

          April 11, 2014 at 12:30 pm |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          I see light at the end of the tunnel (concerning you).

          One could assume that everything supernatural would be bad, But that is not right. According to the Bible there is certain range of supernatural occurences which are thorougly legitimate: Simply the miracles done by God himself.

          "Magical" means all supernatural occurences done by demons or the devil That is the difference.

          Sacramental baptism is done by God himself. God is the invisible baptist. He connects us with the releasing power of Jesus death and resurrection.

          A divine cure must always be connected with repentance and confession of sins. God doesn't cure without reference to deliverance from sin. The cure is the visible sign for the deliverance and forgiveness.

          We should be on the alert, if somebody just cures without reference to deliverance from sin.

          April 11, 2014 at 12:52 pm |
        • Akira

          So magic is now demonic, but demons aren't supernatural.

          Need some salt for that pretzel logic, Rainier?

          April 11, 2014 at 1:03 pm |
        • G to the T

          In my mind you might be able to separate the "magical" from the "miraculous" by that criteria (though it wouldn't be a usage of "magic" that I've ever heard used before), but both would still be supernatural as it (in my mind) describes the broadest category in the lexicon. Both are supernatural events, distinguished by their source. See what I mean?

          April 11, 2014 at 1:08 pm |
        • realbuckyball

          "We become partakers of Jesus death and resurrection through baptism which bridges all barriers of time and space. After baptims we can really say that we have died and resurrected together with Jesus. That is much more than accepting the gospel as true. Through baptism our faith gets sealed and strengthened. "

          --Do you copy-paste that crap, or do you just make it all up ?
          --Prove that one word of it is true.

          April 12, 2014 at 12:57 am |
    • new-man

      you can bless anyone you want, believer or non-believer. Jesus even told us to bless those who curse us, so there's nothing wrong in blessing someone who you might consider "having a different belief."

      Also, believe it or not Jews, Christians, Muslims do share Abraham as their father and practice Abraham's belief in one God. "Even if we cannot agree with many of the tenets of the Muslim faith or the Jewish faith, we can at least build upon the foundations of Abraham that we can agree upon and provide a bridge to the fullness of Christ to both from there."

      If we have all knowledge, understand all mysteries, and have all faith, and have not love, we are nothing.

      DayspringfromonHigh: By My Spirt

      April 11, 2014 at 11:01 am |
      • Akira

        He knows that. He has an irrational hatred of all things Catholic.

        April 11, 2014 at 11:22 am |
      • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

        Abraham was actually a Christian though the Jews call him their Father.

        Abraham had received a divine call (God had encountered him). Abraham was obedient in the power of the divine call. Abaraham's faith had been implanted by God himself, it was much more than "accepting something as true". This powerful faith enabled Abraham to live a life of love and righteousness.

        Today a similar divine call takes places when somebody gets sacramentally baptized. Only conditions for baptism are repentance, and accepting the gospel as true.

        April 11, 2014 at 11:23 am |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          Abraham and Sarah had become an adged man and a adged woman, but nevertheless they put their faith in the Lord that he would give them a son (Isaac). Biologically seen there was no more hope that Abraham and Sarah would ever get a son, but they were convinced that God was able to fulfill what he had promised.

          Today a Christian could become hopeless regarding his outrageous, intrinsic sinfulness. Actually, there is no hope to improve – thinks the Christian. But God says that he has delivered his Son for our sins, and has raised him from the dead for the sake of our justification. Jesus can set free even the worst sinner on earth. The releasing power of Jesus is boundless. The same power set free Abraham and Sarah, and through the same power they got a son despite their very high age.

          April 11, 2014 at 11:35 am |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          Romans 4: 16-25

          Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all, 17 (As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were. 18 Who against hope believed in hope, that he might become the father of many nations; according to that which was spoken, So shall thy seed be. 19 And being not weak in faith, he considered not his own body now dead, when he was about an hundred years old, neither yet the deadness of Sarah's womb: 20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God; 21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform. 22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness. 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone, that it was imputed to him; 24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead; 25 Who was delivered for our offences, and was raised again for our justification.

          April 11, 2014 at 11:40 am |
        • Doc Vestibule

          Thousands of years before the sequel to the Torah had even been thought of, somehow one of the protagonists from the Original book was already aware of what was to come in the second one?

          This is akin to saying "The T-800 from "The Terminator" was actually a T-1000.

          April 11, 2014 at 11:42 am |
        • Akira

          Now you are going to claim Abraham as purely Christian.

          You're going to re-write thousands of years of Biblical history because you hate Catholics so much and you want to smear the Pope so much?

          You need to get a grip, Rainier.
          You ideas get more and more absurd as you go along.

          April 11, 2014 at 11:57 am |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          You impute base motives. I don't hate Catholics. I myself have been a Catholic before I became a Christian (Protestant?).

          There is a difference between an ordinary believer (Catholic) and a heresiarch (the pope). St. John says that we shall show extreme restraint against heretics or heresiarchs.

          I regard Catholics as poor people, and feel for them. They are entrapped and seduced by a lousy "church" and a lousy pope.

          Every Catholic who wants to become a serious Christian should leave the RCC immediately.

          April 11, 2014 at 12:07 pm |
        • Akira

          You claimed that the Pope said that Islam and Christianity were the same thing.

          That was a lie.

          When told that both Islam and Christianity are Abrahamic religions, you immediately said that Abraham was actually a Christian, and Jews couldn't really lay claim to him either.

          Even though the Torah was written thousands of years before the birth of Christ and Christianity.

          So, that's another lie.

          Why do you do this? The answer is quite clear: to slam the Pope and Catholicism, which you do every time there is an article about Catholicism.

          April 11, 2014 at 12:27 pm |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          It is a great crime that the pope recognizes Islam as legitimate religion. The Koran clearly denies that Jesus was the incarnated Son of God (according to the Koran Jesus was only a human Prophet, lower than Muhammad). Moreover the Koran claims that Jesus had not died at the cross, but a person who resembled him (some Muslims assume it had been Judas Iscariot). Furthermore the Koran denies the Trinity. The Koran commands Jihad against the infidels. Etc., etc.

          A Muslim will never inherit the Kingdom of God save he or she converts to Christianity.

          A true Christian has to tell the Muslims that their faith is worthless, and that they need to repent, to believe in Jesus, God's incarnated Son, and to get sacramentally baptized.

          I forgot: The most important leader of Islam, Muhammad, was a murderer. What an idiocy to believe that a murderer could be a divine prophet. Is God a beast?

          April 11, 2014 at 12:39 pm |
        • Akira

          No, it's not a great crime to recognize Islam as a religion, just because you hate Islam, too.
          It IS a legitimate religion.

          Just like Judaism, which I an sure you will promptly denounce next.

          Really, just go ahead and state that everyone is wrong, and the only True Religion™ is the one currently residing in your head.

          April 11, 2014 at 12:57 pm |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          Indeed, the Faith in Jesus (TM) is the only legitimate religion. All other religions are nonsense.

          Jews and Muslims will get lost, if they don't convert to Christianity.

          Jesus is the incarnated Son of God. He has borne our sinful flesh. Only through Him we can become loving and righteous people. No other religion provides such a great deliverance as Christians have it in Jesus Christ.

          All religions, save Christianity, are stuck in the sinful flesh of man (the degenerated human nature, the selfish human nature).

          All religions, save Christianity, try to make the pictures straight on the sinking ship.

          April 11, 2014 at 1:13 pm |
        • Akira

          Are you even trying to imply that no OT Prophets murdered?

          But then again, the OT was really Christian too, right?

          April 11, 2014 at 1:01 pm |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          It is very, very ill to claim that OT prophets had been murderers.

          Are US-executioners murderers?

          The OT prophets really had a divine office like some people of today have a US office. They really were instructed to kill some criminals (Elia killed some priests of the Baal, Samuel killed an evil king, etc.).

          Bonhoeffer was ready to kill Hitler personally. So what?

          If a new Caliph would emerge, I would be ready to kill him.

          April 11, 2014 at 1:18 pm |
        • Akira

          "The most important leader of Islam, Muhammad, was a murderer."

          Condemnation. And yet:

          "The OT prophets... were instructed to kill some criminals (Elia killed some priests of the Baal, Samuel killed an evil king, etc.)."

          That's fine?

          It's the same thing, Rainier.

          Don't bring up the US. You are woefully ignorant of everything American; just like I would never dream of commenting on Germany's way of life.

          It is very, very sick to believe that yours is the only legitimate religion...

          April 11, 2014 at 1:51 pm |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          Muhammad simply was no legitimate prophet of God. God had not instructed him to kill anybody. The elders said that Muhammad was an impostor or deceiver – I think they were right.

          Just read the Koran, what an apocalyptic nonsense. The product of an ill brain.

          Muhammad was a false prophet. He used religion as a smokescreen for his malice – similar to the pope.

          April 11, 2014 at 1:59 pm |
        • Akira

          Says you. So what?
          To Muslims, he is as legitimate to them as the OT Prophets (who were NOT Christians, BTW) are to you.


          April 11, 2014 at 2:14 pm |
        • The Answer Is 42

          Muhammad was a false prophet. He used religion as a smokescreen for his malice – similar to the pope.

          Similar to you, Rainier Helmut Braendlin. You malevolence is clear in every post you make. You use your religion as a weapon.

          April 11, 2014 at 4:10 pm |
        • The Answer Is 42

          If a new Caliph would emerge, I would be ready to kill him.

          Are you seriously trying to say you are some sort of divine Prophet now, Rainer Helmut Braendlein?

          April 11, 2014 at 4:18 pm |
        • realbuckyball

          Abraham as no Christian. As you can see Rainer is a liar, and thinks you will buy into that nonsense. Was Abraham waiting for a messiah ? Nope. Did Abraham ever exist ? Nope. Did Jesus or Mohammed ever exist ? Probably not.

          April 12, 2014 at 1:03 am |
      • realbuckyball

        Actually that is completely false. Islam is not an Abrahamic faith, which you would know if you had ever actually studied comparative religions. The Trinity is not Yahweh either, so the chief gods are all very very different. Christians are polytheists, who don't admit it. The Jews did not and DO not buy into the doctrine that was cooked up during the Council of Nicea of the Trinity. To claim you are all "Abrahamics" is simply a lie.

        April 12, 2014 at 1:01 am |
    • Akira

      The Pope never said that Islam and Christianity were the same faith. They ARE both Abrahamic faiths.
      Good gracious. In your attempt to slander all things Catholic, you're going to flat out lie?

      April 11, 2014 at 11:21 am |
      • The Answer Is 42

        So it would seem.

        April 11, 2014 at 4:13 pm |
    • TruthPrevails1

      "The se-xual abuse of children by Catholic clergy is not by far the greatest damage which the RCC brings about"

      Oh my...I can't believe you would say that!!! I don't give a damn what else this cult does, the child abuse will always be the worse thing!! How pathetic of you not to see that!!

      April 11, 2014 at 1:18 pm |
      • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

        The death of a soul is worse than the harming of a body. Ain't I right?

        April 11, 2014 at 1:21 pm |
        • TruthPrevails1

          The soul can't be proven to exist, these innocent children can be and they are the ones we all should be focused on!! For you to think otherwise proves exactly how damaging Christianity can be!

          April 11, 2014 at 1:34 pm |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          I really feel for the children. Don't get me wrong.

          It is only that I would stress more the responsibility of the Roman purple for the crimes than the responsibility of the single Catholic priest. Certainly the higher Roman clergy are the real evildoers.

          April 11, 2014 at 1:44 pm |
        • TruthPrevails1

          I would disagree. These individual priests don't have someone pointing a gun at their heads while they are harming the children, they sadly do it of their own volition. The RCC in general is responsible for knowingly harboring these priests and protecting them from prosecution and for that alone should be held criminally responsible.

          April 11, 2014 at 2:00 pm |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          We always look at the tip of the iceberg (of the Roman crimes), but we should also consider the multi-tude of all (spiritual) crimes of the RCC.

          The whole bunch of the Catholic clergy is bad, not only some individuals. The whole Catholic Church is an evil organisation bringing about damage. The RCC is evil all through.

          I am sick of the following: Finally the RCC gets always re-legitimated again. That shows that the whole world is under the rule of the fiend.

          This current society (worldwide) is not able to abolish an evil organisation. Ain't that a scandal?

          April 11, 2014 at 2:11 pm |
        • SeaVik

          No, you're not remotely right. Glad you asked though.

          April 11, 2014 at 1:35 pm |
        • Akira

          I truly hope you don't have children, Rainier. You lack of empathy for their pain is staggering.

          You are probably the least Christ-like Christian I have ever come across.

          April 11, 2014 at 1:55 pm |
        • Rainer Helmut Braendlein

          You exeggerate.

          April 11, 2014 at 2:01 pm |
        • The Answer Is 42

          Rainier Helmut Braendlein, you are lying for God again. No one can exaggerate the depth of your falsehoods.

          April 11, 2014 at 4:12 pm |
    • realbuckyball

      Yes indeed. Rainer pontificating from his soap box yet again. Of course HE's too ugly to ever have been molested, and knows NOTHING about the sujbect, yet feels he can tell us all what we need to know about it. What a pompous jerk.

      April 12, 2014 at 12:52 am |
  18. new-man

    [Now having received the Holy Spirit, and being led and directed by Him] if you forgive the sins of anyone, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of anyone, they are retained.

    Forgiveness is more beneficial to you than it is to the offending party. Reclaim your power, in Jesus' Name. Amen.

    April 11, 2014 at 10:35 am |
    • G to the T

      True – attachment can only ever lead to suffering.

      April 11, 2014 at 10:38 am |
  19. jhg45

    to learn what the Bible really teaches go to jw.org and at no charge have all your scriptural questions answered.

    April 11, 2014 at 10:01 am |
    • Russ

      @ JW:
      "All things were made through him, and without him was not any thing made that was made." (Jn.1:3)

      April 11, 2014 at 10:17 am |
      • Russ

        @ jhg45:
        you said: "Russ, sorry I missed your reply but if you look back here you may want to know that JWs are true Christians and like Jesus they worship his father and like Jesus make his father's name and kingdom known.(John 17:26; Matt.24:14; Matt.28:19,20) also Jesus never taught that He was God but the Son of God."

        1) if Jesus is a creation (i.e., not God), how did he make himself (Jn.1:3)?

        2) Jesus forgave sins. the Pharisees knew that only God could do that.

        3) your appeal to Jn.17:26 requires ignoring the rest of John – in which Jesus repeatedly & clearly claims divinity:

        a) 7 "I Am" statements (the Greek equivalent to YHWH, as found in the LXX).
        note well: Jn.8:24 says literally: "unless you believe that I AM, you shall die in your sins."
        for you as JW, that means: unless you believe He is YHWH – the One true God.
        He's purposefully invoking the name of God from Ex.3:14, which you say as Jehovah.

        b) people repeatedly try to kill him for blasphemy (Jn.8:58f;10:31f). there's no biblical warrant for stoning someone to death for saying they're just really, really old – as JWs claim Jesus is only saying.

        4) people worship him & he doesn't say "stop that!" (Mt.2:2,11;4:10;14:13;28:9; Jn.9:38; Heb.1:6; etc.)
        Thomas even says "My Lord and my God!" (Jn.20:28)
        note well: the word for Lord (kurios) is the same Greek word used in the LXX (Greek translation of the OT) for YHWH.

        5) along those same lines, throughout the NT, he is called "Lord Jesus Christ." it's a repeated statement of his divinity. remember, we hear that as one term, but ancient Hel.lenized Jews heard: "YHWH Jesus Messiah."

        6) Php.2:6-10 – what do you do with this hymn, especially "he did not consider equality with God something to be grasped..."? it's obvious he COULD consider equality with God the Father here.

        moreover, how do you interpret v.9 (God gave Jesus the "name that is above every name")? obviously, for you the only name that is above every name is Jehovah. How could Jehovah give the name Jehovah to Jesus unless he's also God?

        7) Col.2:9: in Jesus, the fullness of deity lives in him?

        8) Heb.1:8 – where Jesus is directly referred to as God on the throne?

        9) people pray to Jesus (Acts 7:55-60) and call upon his name (Rom.10:13-14; 1 Cor.1:1-2) as they did to YHWH in the OT (1 Kgs.18:24; Zech.13:9; Joel 2:32; etc.)

        10) Jesus says he is the first & the last (Rev.1:17-18), which is *exactly* what YHWH says (Isa.44:6) when he claims "there is no God but me"

        April 12, 2014 at 10:14 pm |
        • jhg45

          russ, I will try one more time and keep it simple since it really is. Father – Almighty God- Jehovah, YHWH, etc.; Son- Jesus, Son of God, firstborn of all creation,(Col1:13-16,Rev.3:14 etc.)by his Father, all other creation through Him. John chapter 17 is Jesus praying to his Father and concluding with point of making His Fathers name known, then and now. This is so simple but I fear you have been so misled by those who twist the scriptures, like the pharisees. Jesus is the first and last but JHVH has no beginning or end,(PS.90:2 from time indefinite to time indefinite, etc) there are so many scriptures to show these things but you need an accurate translation, not a paraphrased Bible that reduces the Almighty Creator to a nameless God when Jesus clearly made His Fathers name known and is making it known again. Please do not be misled God is not to be mocked.

          April 14, 2014 at 10:02 am |
        • Russ

          @ jhg45:
          it really is simple, which is why JWs are such a minority here among those who claim to submit to the Word. the NT clearly teaches Jesus is God.

          i prefer word-for-word translations, but this has nothing to do with that debate (paraphrastic/dynamic equivalence translations). to be clear: i have a postgraduate degree in this field. i can read Hebrew & Greek. i would encourage you to do some research yourself. i willingly read people with whom i disagree. ask yourself: why do your JW leaders so greatly fear you reading the Bible on your own? is it God's Word or not? why do they insist on THEIR translation – which has been heavily criticized for *adding* to the text?

          again, look at the MANY examples i gave you above. you basically side-stepped all of them in your responses. why not engage them? why not go deeper? bottom line here – who do you trust more: your JW leaders or God's Word? what do you have to fear from studying the Bible directly? doesn't God promise in Isaiah 55 that his Word never comes back empty?

          April 14, 2014 at 10:53 am |
        • jhg45

          I do not know where you get your information but we are encouraged to study the Bible and use all translations I.and have for as long as I have been studying it. as for your claimed education I am reminded of Paul's first letter to the Corinthians. like Paul I am not impressed but would also ask if you would read the preface to the Divine Name King James Bible and get back but I really do not think we are going anywhere here so I will just wish you peace and hope you will look into the jw.org website. again I can not believe you think some "leaders" tell us what you said. again you have been seriously misled. We have one leader, Jesus! (Matt.23:10)

          April 14, 2014 at 11:51 am |
        • Russ

          @ jhg45: i only brought up my educational background because you rather explicitly assumed i was a novice here.

          again, i invite you actually engage the CONTENT of the Bible on this topic – especially as it pertains to the 10 biblical points I made above. as i said below, the reason this conversation is not progressing is because you seem more interested in referencing your website (or the preface to your translation) than discussing the actual content of Scripture.

          April 14, 2014 at 11:52 pm |
        • jhg45

          I have tried to share some truths with you starting with God and Son of God but you can not get by this basic point and take so many scriptures out of context. your 10 points were covered.and i only encourage you to check out the website to learn more than we can share here.

          April 15, 2014 at 8:51 am |
        • jhg45

          since i have a couple minutes I thought I would correct a couple things, the translation I referred to is not mine or JWs I was referring to a new King James Bible also your points contain so many errors or vs..out of context they it do not make sense but as far as our beliefs on most of them, I will try to cover with the point that we DO believe Jesus is a God just not Almighty God (His Father). when Jesus was replying to satan and told him to worship God who was he referring to? (Matt.4) when he turns the Kingdom back over to His God and Father, who is it that he is talking about?(1 Cor.15:20-28) and who was sacrificed as a ransom? Why? Who was the ransom paid to? Why? only And if Jesus is King of God's Kingdom, Who is God? why would you use the pharisees as a reference when Jesus called them liars, hypocrites etc.Jesus was sent to forgive sins based on his sacrifice and shed blood. he also raised people from the dead but what does that matter if like he said "he can do nothing of his own initiative...but what his father .tells him, shows him.etc.(John 5:19, 30,36; 8:28, 12:49 and 14:28 where he says The Father is Greater than He is.There are so many scriptures showing Jesus in subjection to his Father and as far as some one worshipping Jesus or doing obeisance to him there are too many reasons for this but why is this a problem? He is our Lord and Savior and King of God's Kingdom but He still wants us to give the praise, worship and Glory to his Father in Heaven. Rev.4:11

          April 15, 2014 at 11:24 am |
        • Russ

          @ jhg45:
          you said: "your 10 points were covered."
          i don't see where you've answered them – even in the post *after* the quote i'm referencing here.

          you said that I "take so many scriptures out of context."
          show me. that's a throw away line unless you'll demonstrate it. why not go point by point & address it?

          you said: "i only encourage you to check out the website to learn more than we can share here."
          what is stopping you from having the conversation here? i could post a link to a Christian website debunking JW claims – does that substi.tute for our conversation here?

          you said: "I was referring to a new King James Bible."
          so you don't use the New World Translation (NWT)? isn't that the sanctioned version of the JWs?

          you said: "we DO believe Jesus is a God just not Almighty God (His Father)."
          so are you monotheistic or polytheistic? or would you qualify yourself as henotheistic like mormons?

          you said; "when Jesus was replying to satan and told him to worship God who was he referring to? (Matt.4) when he turns the Kingdom back over to His God and Father, who is it that he is talking about?(1 Cor.15:20-28)... And if Jesus is King of God's Kingdom, Who is God?"
          this is not a problem for Christians since we are Trinitarian monotheists. Jesus – though equal with his Father – willingly subjects himself to the Father (Php.2:6-10).

          you said: "and who was sacrificed as a ransom? Why? Who was the ransom paid to? Why?"
          We were reconciled to the Father by the death of his Son (Rom.5:8-10; 2 Cor.5:17-21). The cross makes it clear: a) we deserve that sort of death; b) he loves us so much he takes what we deserve in our place.

          you said: "why would you use the pharisees as a reference when Jesus called them liars, hypocrites etc.?"
          he did call them liars & hypocrites – because they knew God's Word but refused to come to Him for eternal life.
          a) consider that carefully: Jesus repeatedly says the entire OT is about HIM (Lk.24:27,44; Jn.5:39-40; Lk.16:31; etc.). that makes perfect sense for Christians, but that's a major problem for JWs.
          b) the Pharisees killed Jesus for claiming to be YHWH. if he WASN'T making that claim, it wouldn't have been a problem. he could have just said: "hey fellas, i'm not claiming to be God..." but he NEVER did. on the contrary, he said the exact opposite.
          c) to press you further, note well the messianic secret in Mark. virtually on the demons know who he is. would you discount their testimony ("we know who you are, Son of God!") because they are demons? (Mk.1:24; 5:7)

          you said: "Jesus was sent to forgive sins based on his sacrifice and shed blood. he also raised people from the dead but what does that matter if like he said "he can do nothing of his own initiative...but what his father .tells him, shows him.etc.(John 5:19, 30,36; 8:28, 12:49 and 14:28 where he says The Father is Greater than He is.There are so many scriptures showing Jesus in subjection to his Father"
          again, Jesus' willing subjection to his Father is a classic statement of Christianity. your critique here fails to understand Trinitarian monotheism.

          you said: "as far as some one worshipping Jesus or doing obeisance to him there are too many reasons for this but why is this a problem?"
          this goes back to my earlier question: are you monotheistic or not? if you are, and you believe YHWH is the only God, that's a problem. if you are not... well, that's an entirely different set of problems (henotheism, polytheism, etc. are directly refuted in the Bible).

          you said: "He is our Lord and Savior and King of God's Kingdom but He still wants us to give the praise, worship and Glory to his Father in Heaven. Rev.4:11"
          again, that's not a problem for Trinitarian monotheism. but "Lord" Jesus, should be a problem for someone who does a word study on (Hebrew) YHWH, (Hebrew) adonai, (Greek) curios, & their uses in the LXX & NT. again, LORD Jesus Christ is directly contrary to the JW position here.

          April 15, 2014 at 5:56 pm |
        • jhg45

          we are going nowhere here since you base your beliefs on the trinity which is not a Bible teaching and was never included in the Hebrew or Greek scriptures. when you start to spread lies about us I will not get into this discussion. I just hope you are being misled and not doing this on your own. that is one reason I encourage you to examine our website or talk to one of us face to face which is why we follow Jesus and his Apostles example and preach and teach from door to door and in the congregation or anywhere we find someone willing to reason on the Bible. it is so simple, Father, Son, no mystery here.

          April 16, 2014 at 8:25 am |
        • Russ

          @ jhg45: lies? name one place i've misrepresented you above. let's discuss it.
          i want to hear what you actually think – especially since we so clearly disagree here on something essential.

          everything i've stated above is basic exegesis (what does the Bible say/mean here?).
          i have offered for you to clarify ANY of your beliefs, claims, etc., but you keep refusing to go beyond the generic.
          i have repeatedly asked you to engage the points I made above (which were all derived from the text). your only response has been to claim that i took passages out of context – but you REFUSE to discuss the context, or even the meaning.

          case in point, you say "it's not in the Hebrew or Greek" despite the fact that i've repeatedly shown you that 'Lord' (YHWH, adonai, kurios, etc.) ARE the original languages. it's right there to be read. you've yet to address that, and you are now making claims directly to the contrary.

          you are dodging.
          if you really believe that is what the Bible says, then let's talk about it.
          yes, i agree: it is that important – so why not actually engage the points I've made above?
          if every time we disagree you are simply going to say "you're lying about me" then how can you ever have a conversation with anyone outside your JW faith? isn't that why you go door to door?

          April 16, 2014 at 10:56 am |
    • G to the T

      "to learn what the Bible really teaches..."

      Well thank goodness someone know's what it REALLY teaches... funny that most christians don't consider JW's one of their own...

      April 11, 2014 at 11:59 am |
      • Russ

        @ G to the T:
        JWs don't believe Jesus is God. Christians do.
        It shouldn't be insulting to point out that most fundamental difference.
        we BOTH think we are NOT worshipping the same God.

        April 11, 2014 at 1:07 pm |
        • G to the T

          While I may not agree, please know that I was responding to the OP itself, not your response to that OP.

          Either way, it doesn't change there is a lot of variation in what may be considered "christian" (by the outside observer) and most of that appears to be in the eye of the beholder.

          April 11, 2014 at 1:11 pm |
        • Russ

          @ G to the T: i can respect your sense that there is a lot of variance among Christian denominations, but i hope you can see the difference between forms, modes & even limited theological divides and this topic.

          this isn't just a particular part of theology – this is the whole of it (who is God?).

          April 11, 2014 at 1:28 pm |
        • jhg45

          Russ, sorry I missed your reply but if you look back here you may want to know that JWs are true Christians and like Jesus they worship his father and like Jesus make his father's name and kingdom known.(John 17:26; Matt.24:14; Matt.28:19,20) also Jesus never taught that He was God but the Son of God.

          April 12, 2014 at 6:22 pm |
        • G to the T


          Thanks for proving my point to Russ.

          April 12, 2014 at 6:32 pm |
        • Russ

          @ G to the T:
          1) the Apostles' Creed as evidence of unity

          The oft-cited fact on this blog that there are 40,000+ Christian denominations works both ways.

          Of the 2 billion Christians with a variety of beliefs, ALL of them (according to their denominational leadership) assent to the content of the Apostles' Creed as an ancient (c.AD 180), brief summation of what Scripture teaches Christians believe. Read over it. It's not merely stating Trinitarian monotheism, but *many other* complex doctrines as core tenets of the faith from the outset.

          Note well: 2 billion, often disagreeing, splintering subsets ALL agree on these core tenets.
          JWs notably DO NOT share that belief – not just on one count, but the virtual whole of that creed.

          I'm not saying the *creed* is what is authoritative. I'm pointing out how expansive the unity is – and how consistently that places JWs *outside* of Christianity.

          SUM: the very variance you cite here actually demonstrates unity on this point. doesn't that give you prove the opposite point?

          2) theology in its most basic meaning

          theology has many facets – but the topic itself is literally "the study of God."
          definitionally speaking – there is no greater theological divide than to disagree fundamentally about the identi.ty of God.

          case in point, JWs believe Jesus was less than God and worships God alongside humanity.
          while Muslims heartily agree here, Christians do not.
          so, considering Muslims hold those same tenets, are you prepared to argue that Muslims are equally a Christian sect?

          if you draw the line for Muslims (who believe they TOO are following Jesus), why not for JWs?

          April 12, 2014 at 9:42 pm |
        • Russ

          @ jhg45: (sorry, i assumed you were the artist formerly known as 'JW' on this blog before)

          note my response to you in the other thread. (keeping it there for better tracking of the conversation)

          April 12, 2014 at 9:45 pm |
        • jhg45

          Russ, you may still want to go to jw.org while there is time to learn "what the bible really teaches" and that is not the pagan trinity doctrine. the 'apostles creed' also is not a Bible teaching and as far as the many who believe something, it causes me to think of Jesus' words that the gate is narrow and the road is cramped that leads to eternal life but the road to destruction is broad and spacious.(Matt.7:13,14) also one may want to meditate on vs. (15-21) to see the rest of the point that he was making and please just know that I am just trying to encourage you to look into the jw website and not listen to those who think they know what Jehovah's Witnesses believe and teach. also you may want to have a serious discussion with them when they come to your door, something also taught by and done by Jesus. This is so important in view of the way this world is going. again, please check it out and know there is no charge, unlike many other religions.

          April 13, 2014 at 2:10 pm |
        • jhg45

          Russ and G–t and also for any who look here you may want to seek out a Kingdom Hall of Jehovah"s Witnesses on Monday P.M. @7:30. you are invited to attend the memorial observance of Jesus' death to learn why and how Jesus gave his life for YOU and why his death is so important. again this is completely free as are all meetings of JWs Learn the accurate knowledge that leads to eternal life that the Bible teaches and that Jesus and his father Jehovah want you to have.

          April 13, 2014 at 2:33 pm |
        • Russ

          @ jhg45:
          as I said before, i have answered you at length in the thread above.
          note well the 10 different biblical proofs that Jesus is YHWH.

          it is tragic to me that a group would claim to adhere to the Bible & spend so much time dodging its main point.

          April 13, 2014 at 6:27 pm |
        • jhg45

          I would love to discuss this further since I have not seen what you claim to have shared but I will check back tomorrow because I have a few questions about your points and hope you are serious and sincere about this subject.

          April 13, 2014 at 10:52 pm |
        • jhg45

          I have gone back above to share a couple points but feel it does not matter where we do this you will not look into what I am trying to share.

          April 14, 2014 at 10:04 am |
        • Russ

          @ jhg45: i have responded above.
          and quite to the contrary, i'm willing to have this conversation.
          ask yourself: why do your leaders so greatly fear you studying the Bible *on your own*?

          April 14, 2014 at 10:56 am |
        • jhg45

          russ, you need to stop going to the ford dealer to ask about the chevy because someone has been telling you some untruths. you should still look up your local Kingdom Hall and attend the Memorial of Jesus death tonight. it is free and you will be amazed at what you will learn. it also may mean your eternal life. please check it out. I promise it will not hurt.

          April 14, 2014 at 12:40 pm |
        • Russ

          @ jhg45:
          so, are you denying that you do not believe Jesus is God?
          i'm not claiming something way out of bounds here. that's JW 101, right?

          i have given MULTIPLE biblical warrants to the contrary above, and you have yet to engage ANY of them.
          the reason our discussion is not going anywhere is because you are refusing to actually talk about the CONTENT of the Bible.

          April 14, 2014 at 11:49 pm |
        • jhg45

          as said above and before Jesus is the Son of God (bible 101) and all the vs. you have taken out of context and taken from Bibles that have removed Jehovah's name do not change that fact. you have been so misled about us that I thought if you want to learn the truth about us go to the website,(it will not hurt) and you may learn much more than we can share here. sorry you have not understood my responses to your claims but I have seen and heard those claims many times before and they do not alter the whole theme of God's Word.

          April 15, 2014 at 9:16 am |
        • Russ

          @ jhg45: if you have seen those claims many times, then why not respond to them?
          i have responded to you above – point by point.
          something i would like you to do w/ my 10 points.

          April 15, 2014 at 5:57 pm |
  20. lookatuniverse

    Quran says (Islamic Scripture)

    “The example of Jesus, as far as GOD is concerned, is the same as that of Adam; He created him from dust, then said to him, "Be," and he was.” Quran [3:59]

    “It does not befit God that He begets a son, be He glorified. To have anything done, He simply says to it, ‘Be,’ and it is.” [19:35]

    “No soul can carry the sins of another soul. If a soul that is loaded with sins implores another to bear part of its load, no other soul can carry any part of it, even if they were related. ... [35:18]

    “They even attribute to Him sons and daughters, without any knowledge. Be He glorified. He is the Most High, far above their claims.” Quran [6:100]

    “Recall that your Lord said to the angels, "I am placing a representative on Earth." They said, "Will You place therein one who will spread evil therein and shed blood, while we sing Your praises, glorify You, and uphold Your absolute authority?" He said, "I know what you do not know." [2:30]

    “They say , "We live only this life; we will not be resurrected. If you could only see them when they stand before their Lord! He would say, "Is this not the truth?" They would say, "Yes, by our Lord." He would say, "You have incurred the retribution by your disbelief." [6:30]

    “We have honored the children of Adam, and provided them with rides on land and in the sea. We provided for them good provisions, and we gave them greater advantages than many of our creatures.” Quran [17:70]

    “O children of Adam, when messengers come to you from among you, and recite My revelations to you, those who take heed and lead a righteous life, will have nothing to fear, nor will they grieve.” Quran [7:35]

    “O children of Adam, do not let the devil dupe you as he did when he caused the eviction of your parents from Paradise, and the removal of their garments to expose their bodies. He and his tribe see you, while you do not see them. We appoint the devils as companions of those who do not believe.” Quran [7:27]

    “Losers indeed are those who disbelieve in meeting God, until the Hour comes to them suddenly, then say, "We deeply regret wasting our lives in this world." They will carry loads of their sins on their backs; what a miserable load! [6:31]

    Thanks for taking time to read my post. Please take a moment to visit whyIslam org website.

    April 11, 2014 at 9:42 am |
    • Span.k Your Imam

      lookie, do not be spamming us thusly with your website and the Coo-ran-ran so verbosely and pastedly. Here it is now said. Hearken:

      For such overt and voluminous spamming, you must nakedly assume the to-be-spanked position, and so receive. Lean forward now, with hands grasped tightly on ankles.

      Do not be embarrassed as such with red post-spank posteriority. We have experienced vestal goats close quartered in Tehran if you need to be resanctified.

      Of this year, shall no imams be spanked without above goats, unless such imam has closely humped another imam on the same day. No more. The Coo-ran-ran. The Coo-ran-ran.

      Here it is written and must be so.
      Here it is written and must be so.
      Here it is written and must be so.
      Said thricely. Hear well. You have been spanken.

      April 11, 2014 at 11:33 am |
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About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.