Dwindling witnesses of the Holocaust
April 28th, 2014
09:57 AM ET

Dwindling witnesses of the Holocaust

(CNN) - The old man exited a car and immediately ran through the forest to what he remembered was a mass gravesite. “The Germans were here,” he said. "The people were in a row, and they just shot them in the back, one by one.”

Mikhail K, a man well into his 80s, said he was just a boy when he witnessed Nazi German soldiers massacre villagers in southern Russia in the 1940s. In 2012,photographer Markel Redondo accompanied him to a site near the village of Ladozhskaya in the region of Krasnodar to document his memories surrounding the atrocity.

Mikhail stood silently for a moment, “remembering and looking at the place,” Redondo recalled. "You could see there was something going on in his head.”

Redondo met Mikhail and other witnesses as part of an initiative by the Paris-based group Yahad – In Unum. The project aims to locate and document World War II sites where Jews and other victims were executed by Nazis and their allies throughout Eastern Europe. Yahad – In Unum has chosen not to reveal the witnesses’ full names.

Redondo spoke with CNN ahead of Days of Remembrance, when Holocaust victims are honored during the week of April 27-May 4.

- CNN Belief Blog

Filed under: Uncategorized

soundoff (675 Responses)
  1. Reality

    And yet there are still the bigoted among us ! They should be reminded constantly that we come from the same Adam, not the biblical one but the one described below:

    As per National Geographic's Genographic project:

    " DNA studies suggest that all humans today descend from a group of African ancestors who about 60,000 years ago began a remarkable journey. Follow the journey from them to you as written in your genes”.

    "Adam" is the common male ancestor of every living man. He lived in Africa some 60,000 years ago, which means that all humans lived in Africa at least at that time.

    Unlike his Biblical namesake, this Adam was not the only man alive in his era. Rather, he is unique because his descendents are the only ones to survive.

    It is important to note that Adam does not literally represent the first human. He is the coalescence point of all the genetic diversity."

    For your $199 and a DNA swab:

    "Included in the markers we will test for is a subset that scientists have recently determined to be from our hominid cousins, Neanderthals and the newly discovered Denis vans, who split from our lineage around 500,000 years ago. As modern humans were first migrating out of Africa more than 60,000 years ago, Neanderthals and Denisovans were still alive and well in Eurasia. It seems that our ancestors met, leaving a small genetic trace of these ancient relatives in our DNA. With Geno 2.0, you will learn if you have any Neanderthal or Denisovan DNA in your genome."

    April 29, 2014 at 10:28 am |
    • Dyslexic doG

      Brilliant post. Unfortunately christian cognitive dissonance means the few who actually read it have already discounted it and recited themselves a few bible verses to ease that frightened feeling and make themselves feel better.

      April 29, 2014 at 10:49 am |
      • Salero21

        HAHAHA, rabid dog, if you think that's a brilliant post then I have a bridge to sell you in Brooklyn or land in the Everglades at quite a bargain price. Which do you like the best?

        April 30, 2014 at 5:57 pm |
        • In Santa We Trust

          loser, what is the biblical explanation of the DNA? Oh that's right there isn't one as it is the best imaginings of Bronze Age goatherders.

          April 30, 2014 at 6:06 pm |
    • Concert in an Egg

      Christians and other religions with members that discount scientific reality in favor of the bible are complete idiots. I would go so far as to say they cannot be trusted if they are being honest about their beliefs. If they are liars and just want to fit it and/or be admired they are even worse. It is difficult if not impossible to trust the religious because of their ignorance. Be cautious.

      April 29, 2014 at 11:35 am |
  2. Doris

    David Wood destroyed by Bart Ehrman

    Bart Ehrman, from the video [regarding the Gospel of Mark]: "These lots and lots of copies are from many centuries after Mark was written. How could we know that these copies stemmed from a correct copy, instead of an errant copy? Our earliest ones are all highly errant."

    Published 04-14-2014

    NT scholar Bart Ehrman holds a PhD from Princeton Theological Seminary (magna cum laude). He is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill. He currently serves as co-editor of the series New Testament Tools, Studies, and Documents (E. J. Brill), co-editor-in-chief for the journal Vigiliae Christianae, and on several other editorial boards for journals and monographs.

    April 29, 2014 at 10:15 am |
    • colin31714

      Bart publishes a few series of his lectures through The Teaching Company. I have three or four series and they are great. Real eye openers as to how little we really know about Jesus life.

      April 29, 2014 at 11:00 am |
  3. Doris

    Letting go of superst.i.tion


    Speakers in order of appearance:

    1. Lawrence Krauss, World-Renowned Physicist
    2. Robert Coleman Richardson, Nobel Laureate in Physics
    3. Richard Feynman, World-Renowned Physicist, Nobel Laureate in Physics
    4. Simon Blackburn, Cambridge Professor of Philosophy
    5. Colin Blakemore, World-Renowned Oxford Professor of Neuroscience
    6. Steven Pinker, World-Renowned Harvard Professor of Psychology
    7. Alan Guth, World-Renowned MIT Professor of Physics
    8. Noam Chomsky, World-Renowned MIT Professor of Linguistics
    9. Nicolaas Bloembergen, Nobel Laureate in Physics
    10. Peter Atkins, World-Renowned Oxford Professor of Chemistry
    11. Oliver Sacks, World-Renowned Neurologist, Columbia University
    12. Lord Martin Rees, Astronomer Royal
    13. Sir John Gurdon, Pioneering Developmental Biologist, Cambridge
    14. Sir Bertrand Russell, World-Renowned Philosopher, Nobel Laureate
    15. Stephen Hawking, World-Renowned Cambridge Theoretical Physicist
    16. Riccardo Giacconi, Nobel Laureate in Physics
    17. Ned Block, NYU Professor of Philosophy
    18. Gerard 't Hooft, Nobel Laureate in Physics
    19. Marcus du Sautoy, Oxford Professor of Mathematics
    20. James Watson, Co-discoverer of DNA, Nobel Laureate
    21. Colin McGinn, Professor of Philosophy, Miami University
    22. Sir Patrick Bateson, Cambridge Professor of Ethology
    23. Sir David Attenborough, World-Renowned Broadcaster and Naturalist
    24. Martinus Veltman, Nobel Laureate in Physics
    25. Pascal Boyer, Professor of Anthropology
    26. Partha Dasgupta, Cambridge Professor of Economics
    27. AC Grayling, Birkbeck Professor of Philosophy
    28. Ivar Giaever, Nobel Laureate in Physics
    29. John Searle, Berkeley Professor of Philosophy
    30. Brian Cox, Particle Physicist (Large Hadron Collider, CERN)
    31. Herbert Kroemer, Nobel Laureate in Physics
    32. Rebecca Goldstein, Professor of Philosophy
    33. Michael Tooley, Professor of Philosophy, Colorado
    34. Sir Harold Kroto, Nobel Laureate in Chemistry
    35. Leonard Susskind, Stanford Professor of Theoretical Physics
    36. Quentin Skinner, Professor of History (Cambridge)
    37. Theodor W. Hänsch, Nobel Laureate in Physics
    38. Mark Balaguer, CSU Professor of Philosophy
    39. Richard Ernst, Nobel Laureate in Chemistry
    40. Alan Macfarlane, Cambridge Professor of Anthropology
    41. Professor Neil deGrasse Tyson, Princeton Research Scientist
    42. Douglas Osheroff, Nobel Laureate in Physics
    43. Hubert Dreyfus, Berkeley Professor of Philosophy
    44. Lord Colin Renfrew, World-Renowned Archaeologist, Cambridge
    45. Carl Sagan, World-Renowned Astronomer
    46. Peter Singer, World-Renowned Bioethicist, Princeton
    47. Rudolph Marcus, Nobel Laureate in Chemistry
    48. Robert Foley, Cambridge Professor of Human Evolution
    49. Daniel Dennett, Tufts Professor of Philosophy
    50. Steven Weinberg, Nobel Laureate in Physics


    Mozart – Requiem Mass In D Minor K 626 – 1. Introitus 00:03
    Massive Attack – Two Rocks And A Cup Of Water 02:28, 19:14
    Max Richter – Embers 05:13
    Ludovico Einaudi – Andare 09:27, 24:30, 26:31
    Ludovico Einaudi – Nuvole Bianche 13:13
    Max Richter – Vladimir's Blues 29:21
    Ludovico Einaudi – Eni 30 Percento (The Earth Prelude) 33:16

    April 29, 2014 at 10:13 am |
  4. Salero21

    Atheists in their delusional ways must believe that Stalin, Mao and Pol Pot have a cooler room in Hell or a better seating than Hitler. JAJAJA...oops... pardon me please... I meant to say HAHAHA!!!

    So atheists think that Communism, Socialism is better than Fascism, so they even claim that it is in the Bible. Really, is like from what part of Hell they get the absurd. Or maybe they think that in Hell Communists, Socialists, Evolutionists et al are going to have a better beer hall than the fascists and materialists.

    April 29, 2014 at 1:56 am |
    • Salero21

      From what part of Hell or who from Hell leads them [atheists] to believe and think such? I know the answer, we all know the answer, all men of reason and reasonable men know the answer.

      April 29, 2014 at 2:00 am |
      • ssq41

        Poor Sal...sitting on a bar stool facing the wall just below the dart board next to the juke box....the place emptied out an hour ago.

        And he's there sobbing in his mug and rambling on about all the lovers that left him.

        April 29, 2014 at 2:03 am |
      • realbuckyball

        Are you drunk or on drugs Salero21 ?

        April 29, 2014 at 4:11 am |
    • realbuckyball

      Still lying for Jebus, I see.

      April 29, 2014 at 4:15 am |
      • TruthPrevails1

        Sorry for double posting...I saw salero's comment and failed to look further. Although I doubt salero will be convinced no matter how often the truth is pointed out.

        April 29, 2014 at 5:30 am |
        • gulliblenomore

          TruthP....that's because he is an idiot.

          April 29, 2014 at 8:40 am |
        • TruthPrevails1

          gnm: Idiot is extremely polite considering how sally portrays him/herself.

          April 29, 2014 at 9:09 am |
    • TruthPrevails1

      sally: We understand from your non-stop ramblings of hate that you have no comprehensions skills of any form and are extremely uneducated. For the truth about your fellow Christian, Hitler and his views you can go to this website: http://www.nobeliefs.com/Hitler1.htm where it states very clearly:
      "Hitler wrote: "I believe that I am acting in accordance with the will of the Almighty Creator: by defending myself against the Jew, I am fighting for the work of the Lord.."

      As you can see, you are wrong...he is on your side, not the other way around.

      April 29, 2014 at 5:29 am |
    • SeaVik

      A Loser 21 is back with more drivel!

      Has anyone ever noticed how the believers have psychos that constantly post incoherent bs on this board, whereas I don't recall ever seeing a regular atheist who posted this kind of stuff? Not surprising, but interesting.

      April 29, 2014 at 8:40 am |
      • gulliblenomore

        SeaVik....I have noticed the same thing. Why are these televangelists on this site so incoherently stupid with the responses they give. Some are less ridiculous than others, but for the most part, they remain steadfast in their obscure convictions despite the facts that are presented against them. Something is really wrong with these people. The topper was Theo yesterday claiming the Jews deserved the Holocaust!

        April 29, 2014 at 8:54 am |
        • Akira

          And don't forget the rest of the people died because, well, they. must have sinned somewhere along the course of their life.

          And the robotic repetition of "I can only go by what the Bible says."

          April 29, 2014 at 11:38 am |
    • kudlak

      Communism and socialism are on the extremes of left-wing thinking, where fascism is on the extreme of right-wing thinking. So, isn't the lesson here to aim for the middle?

      April 29, 2014 at 10:29 am |
  5. Salero21

    Staling did the same, but because Stalin is some sort of Folk hero for atheists, we don't see nothing being said against him. So did Mao in China and Pol Pot in Cambodia, but these are Folksy "heroes" for the atheists communal. Yeah right like if Stalin, Mao or Pol Pot have a better room in hell than Hitler a few degrees cooler.

    Really, really atheists you're a disgusting aberrant group. Which proves my point.

    April 29, 2014 at 1:50 am |
    • ssq41


      It's late and you've had too much to drink. Do you need me to call a cab for you?

      April 29, 2014 at 1:57 am |
      • Salero21

        No, not for me call it for you Mom, she is crawling on her own vomit on the floor. The poor soul!!

        April 29, 2014 at 2:02 am |
        • ssq41

          Sal...come on...Mom died years ago. You were at her funeral.

          Now, please, take a last swallow and let me walk you out the door.

          April 29, 2014 at 2:05 am |
        • Salero21

          OMG My condolences. Then it must be either your wife, sister or daughter, she looks old beyond her age that's why I though it was your mother. You may want to call an Ambulance by now, she may be drowning in her own vomit.

          April 29, 2014 at 2:11 am |
        • ssq41

          See? I warned you not to mix your Clozapine and Haloperidol with your malt liquior. It makes you see things and type all kinds of nonsense...and use all-caps way too often.

          Now, come on! The cab is waiting.

          April 29, 2014 at 2:16 am |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      " Stalin is some sort of Folk hero for atheists, we don't see nothing being said against him. ... Mao in China and Pol Pot in Cambodia, but these are Folksy "heroes" for the atheists communal."

      You are apparently a sad person to continually spew such bile. Please find someone who will give you a hug, or failing that go back under your bridge. It misses you.

      April 29, 2014 at 11:46 am |
  6. Salero21

    The article clearly mentions that others suffered besides the jews, that's such a well know FACT that is even unnecessary to mention it more than once. However all we see here is atheists DEMONSstrating their Absolute, Complete and Total Stupidity. Their extreme hypocrisy, compulsive and pathological Lying is something congenital in them.

    April 29, 2014 at 1:42 am |
    • Akira

      This post says nothing at all. It makes not one iota on sense. All it is is Tourette's Keyboard.
      Yes. Other people suffered, as was brought up on a previous page that you refuse to go back and read, probably because you don't know what the word "previous" means. What does that have to do with the rest of your trollpost?

      April 29, 2014 at 11:33 am |
  7. Salero21

    For the last time atheists, Hitler was not a christian. He never said or did anything christian, he only paid lip service to the churches. He was in every deed, sense and words a lost soul, a cultist, a pagan, a child of hell just like all others unbelievers [atheists] idolaters et al. It could be said also that he may have been predestined for such. Not only the Jews suffered under his demonic government, tens of millions of others did also and let's not forget his own people the germans and all others who lost loved ones, families, friends. Like in almost all cases people like him eventually end up making their own people suffer.

    April 29, 2014 at 1:36 am |
    • realbuckyball

      No True Scotsman Fallacy. Nice try. Fail again.
      (We can only hope it was the "last time").

      April 29, 2014 at 4:12 am |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      "Hitler was not a christian. He never said or did anything christian, he only paid lip service to the churches."

      Clearly he was raised a Christian. There's plenty of evidence that Hitler said lots of "Christian" things. He manipulated the Christianity of the 'good' Lutheran and Catholic Germans to his own ends.

      Whether Hitler was ultimately a Christian is entirely moot. What is factual is that vast numbers of the 'good' Lutheran and Catholics of the Third Reich readily did his bidding.

      April 29, 2014 at 11:32 am |
  8. Salero21

    OMG Is almost 16 hrs. since this article was posted and atheists are still around in circles with the same old fallacy about Hitler being a christian. That's been refuted time and again but this rabid atheists in their desperation are still holding to it. If that's not Evidence of the Total NONSENSE of atheism, then what else?

    April 29, 2014 at 1:20 am |
    • realbuckyball

      One thing wrong. You have failed to provide even ONE refutation, and there are hundreds of quotes from him demonstrating he was a believer. Saying "the moon is made of green cheese" does not make it so.

      April 29, 2014 at 4:14 am |
      • fintronics

        What do you expect from a moron?

        April 29, 2014 at 3:31 pm |
  9. Doris

    Theo Phileo on the Holocaust (comments earlier today):

    They suffered because they violated their covenant with God formed in Deuteronomy 28:15-68.

    [Akira:] "Explain how the Jews violated this covenant, and explain how you know that every single Jewish family violated it."

    Idolatry, apostasy, and unbelief. [..] The fact that Judaism still exists today in denial of the Messiah is evidence to their apostasy.

    [Akira:] "And now you are claiming that Hitler to be an instrument of God? That's what you seen to be implying."

    Yup. In the same sense that Judas, who betrayed Jesus was an instrument of God. In the same sense that the Jews who had Jesus crucified were the instruments of God. The Bible tells us that God will use even an unrighteous and a sinful people to judge those whom God deems worthy of judgment, even if those to be judged are beloved of God.

    I can only relate what the Bible has to say, and it tells us that the Jews' hearts are hardened due to their apostasy, and because of their apostasy, God will punish them, until such a time that they repent of their unbelief.


    Wow – just wow. Now let's see – unbelief of what? Well, there are the Gospels of unknown authorship. There is hearsay from Paul. And let's see there is Peter saying that Paul's word is divinely inspired in Peter 2, except that – oh yes, most NT scholars agree that Peter did not author Peter 2. A belief that instilled fear in people early on by telling them that Satan was able to perform plagiarism backward in time....

    And from THAT "foundation" Theo feels justified that HIS god has exercised his "righteousness" will on Jews. And from THAT "foundation", we have evangelists who traveled to Africa recently to incite violence and the killing of people there. Just wow.


    “The problem with religion, because it's been sheltered from criticism, is that it allows people to believe en masse what only idiots or lunatics could believe in isolation.”
    ― Sam Harris

    "These lots and lots of copies are from many centuries after Mark was written. How could we know that these copies stemmed from a correct copy, instead of an errant copy? Our earliest ones are all highly errant."
    - Bart Ehrman

    "I almost shudder at the thought of alluding to the most fatal example of the abuses of grief which the history of mankind has preserved – the Cross. Consider what calamities that engine of grief has produced! With the rational respect that is due to it, knavish priests have added prostitutions of it, that fill or might fill the blackest and bloodiest pages of human history. "
    –John Adams, in a letter to Thomas Jefferson, 09/03/1816

    April 28, 2014 at 8:21 pm |
    • sam stone

      corn pone once again shows that having the bible shoved so far up his rectum inhibits his reasoning abillty

      that's fine....apparently, his god likes unthinking slaves

      corn pone, jeebus is waiting on you

      April 28, 2014 at 8:59 pm |
    • Akira

      I particularly like how Theo uses the Hebrew Bible, that IMHO the Christians co-opted for their new religion, against the Jews for not goosestepping with the Christian view that Jesus is the Jewish Messiah.

      And that Theo feels the Jews of the Holocaust deserved their fate because the Jews don't feel that the prophecies of their own Bible has been fulfilled, and still await their Messiah.

      And that the other 6 million who perished deserved to, because hey, they must have 'sinned' somewhere along the way.

      I shouldn't be surprised by anything Theo says, but this was beyond the pale...and I have to think that Theo is Live4Him's doppelgänger. They sound so very similar.

      The whole conversation was appalling.

      April 28, 2014 at 9:28 pm |
      • gulliblenomore

        I've heard this incredibly stupid and pathetic statement made by other so-called Christians before....that somehow the Jews deserved their demises at the hands of the Nazis. Most of these Jews suffered a hundred times more than Jesus supposedly did. I would rather not believe that god existed than to believe in and worship such a horrible, horrible revengeful monster of a god that these complete and utter morons choose to follow. You can't claim that your god is a loving and forgiving god while at the same time making the ridiculous proposal that the Jews deserved what they got.

        April 28, 2014 at 9:38 pm |
        • sam stone

          apparently, jeebus has a better PR firm than the victims of the holocaust

          April 28, 2014 at 10:45 pm |
        • gulliblenomore

          Probably...but having such mindless sheep followers doesn't hurt gods chances either.

          April 28, 2014 at 10:47 pm |
        • Akira

          It's wholly ridiculous, and a cruel, unfeeling way to think.

          They call Hitler the monster? When they tacitly applaud what he did?
          Ludicrous. At least they can claim him as one of their own since they have no problem with what he did, and it squares with their interpretation of the Bible.
          Wish Theo would admit THAT, at least.

          April 28, 2014 at 11:06 pm |
      • sam stone

        i thought Theo Phileo was a repackaged Larry of Arabia

        April 28, 2014 at 10:42 pm |
        • Akira

          Perhaps. LoA didn't come off quite as empathy deficient as both Theo and L4H. Some of Theo's posts on science remind me of L4H, also.

          April 28, 2014 at 11:02 pm |
        • sam stone

          both Larry of Arabia and Theo Phil(at)eo trumpeted on and on how they have studied the comic book for over 30 years, and, as a consequence, they know who the TRUE christians (TM) are

          April 29, 2014 at 5:16 am |
      • sam stone

        theo is every bit as arrogant as gopher or rainy fuhrersucker

        April 28, 2014 at 10:43 pm |
    • Akira

      And I fail to see how the New Testament should have any bearing on the Jewish at all, being that the New Testament is a Christian construct. So naturally Jews do not follow it...but it seems perfect to justify bigotry against then now, doesn't it?

      April 28, 2014 at 9:34 pm |
      • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

        Well, we all know "who" killed Jesus, right?

        At least according to Paul.

        1 Thessalonians 2:14-15

        April 28, 2014 at 9:57 pm |
      • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

        It's not the real heart of anti-Semitism, but it is the convenient excuse used by Christians to condone it.

        April 28, 2014 at 9:59 pm |
        • ssq41

          The primary argument I heard from the various Evangelical pulpits over the first 3 decades of my life was that the Jews killed Jesus.

          There is a primary hatred of the Pharisees and Sadducees fostered by Matthew and John. And the likes of Topher and Devin and others love to hate the "religious leaders" of 1 century Palestine as well as their labelling the Catholic church in this fashion.

          Plus, there is a general racism toward Jews and a strong jealousy toward their individual financial success.

          All comes down to the psychological need to make yourself feel better by de-humanizing/demonizing another group.

          And when your God hates the humans you hate...then...

          April 28, 2014 at 10:13 pm |
        • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV


          The tricky indefinite article. Not "some Jews", or even "Jews" but "the Jews".

          It can vastly color the meaning and particularly so with the literalist crowd.

          April 28, 2014 at 10:18 pm |
        • Akira

          It's a sick point of view...period.

          April 28, 2014 at 11:09 pm |
      • Doris

        It certainly does seem that way, Akira. Can you imagine the state of affairs today if we didn't have a secular government? I bet Cotton Mather – I mean Theo would be slap happy with joy over the pain that he could inflict against the "unrighteous".

        April 28, 2014 at 10:06 pm |
        • ssq41

          Funny how Theo, Topher, devin, truthfollower01, and Cotton Mather don't realize that their longing for such a government would merely look like those Arab nations today that are fundamentalist.

          Remember, it wasn't too long ago that one of the Evangelical pastors said that the LGBT community should be "fenced in" in camps. Much like the Re-education camps and concentration camps used by those governments that these folks claim to despise.

          April 28, 2014 at 10:16 pm |
        • sam stone

          corn pone and topher are punks

          they run like little cowards when confronted with logical arguments

          gopher is certain that he deserves hell, but is too much a bedwetting little punk to stand up and take his punishment, and corn pone is no better, touting how much time he as studied that iron age comic book

          if they had any guts, they would rush off to meet their slavior immmediate, but they won't, because they are gutless little punks.

          they blather on empty proxy threats of hell

          they are as impotent to carry out those threats as their vindictive pr1ck god

          April 28, 2014 at 10:51 pm |
        • sam stone

          ssq: that view is not much different than the one advocated by rainy fuhrersucker

          April 28, 2014 at 10:53 pm |
        • ssq41


          Spiritual as well as physical racism runs rampant...no matter how soft Topher's tone was about Catholics and Theo's comments about Jews...

          And..as with everything...they have scripture to support their positions.

          April 28, 2014 at 11:08 pm |
        • Akira

          Sam, one if the funnier things I read by Helmut was when he told Theo that he'd pray for Theo to find his way because he was lost.

          ssq, that's the beauty of interpretation, which Theo denies to this day as being what s/he's doing.

          April 28, 2014 at 11:14 pm |
        • ssq41

          Rainer (sp?) is in a class all his own...he is the kind of a believer that would make Dostoyevsky's grand inquisitor look like Mr. Rogers of PBS fame...

          April 28, 2014 at 11:15 pm |
        • ssq41

          Absolutely, Akira...as I believed when an Evangelical, all other's interpret while my reading of scripture was correct because I had an intimate relationship with Jesus and was filled with the Holy Spirit...

          I was deeply offended when my conservative Catholic dad kept telling me: "It's just your interpretation."

          Oh, and for Topher's claim that the Catholics are outside orthodoxy, my dad was correct, the Catholics were followers of Jesus long before Luther came along. Had there been no Catholic church, there would have been no Protestantism.

          April 28, 2014 at 11:20 pm |
        • Akira

          Remember, it wasn’t too long ago that one of the Evangelical pastors said that the LGBT community should be “fenced in” in camps. Much like the Re-education camps and concentration camps used by those governments that these folks claim to despise.

          Pastor Charles Worley
          And Helmut agrees with this.
          Jesus wept.

          April 28, 2014 at 11:21 pm |
        • sam stone

          ssq: what a co-nky-dink, god hates the same people they do

          they will claim they don't hate gays or jews, but we know they are just delusional

          April 29, 2014 at 5:19 am |
        • sam stone

          akira: no, no, no, you got it wrong......they are not interpreting the bible, they are just reading it correctly. even when their views differ, they are claiming they are reading it correctly

          they are entertaining pompous fvcks

          April 29, 2014 at 5:23 am |
    • SeaVik

      Theo beliefs are exactly like those of Muslim terrorists.

      April 28, 2014 at 10:07 pm |
      • Akira

        The repeated protestations of "I can only relate what the Bible has to say" is eerily similar.
        The robotic response was chilling.

        April 28, 2014 at 10:58 pm |
      • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

        It is written.

        April 28, 2014 at 11:08 pm |
        • fintronics

          ".... on whatever it is they write it on up there..."

          April 29, 2014 at 3:33 pm |
    • realbuckyball

      The Jews were not, in general waiting for a "messiah" until very late in their history , and then only a small sub-set of them were doing that. Jesus accomplished not one of the tasks a messiah was supposed to get done, even IF you were part of the small sub-sect waiting for one. "Messiah" means "the anointed one". The anointed one was the King of Israel. The few who were expecting the kingdom to be re-established were waiting for a messianic king figure to drive out the Romans, and re-establish the old Kingdom of David. Did Jesus do THAT ? Nope.

      People like this Theo person have a deep seated psychological NEED to explain what they see as "evil" in religious terms, as they have no other paradigm by which to explain it. They are intellectual infants. In this case, he is seriously offensive. IF there were a deity, and that deity allowed hundreds of thousand of innocent Jewish children to die, that deity can go you-know-what-itself.

      April 28, 2014 at 10:28 pm |
      • sam stone

        If theo, gopher, rainy fuhrersucker, vic, kermy, et al did not have the boogieman of "sin" to flaggelate themselves over, they would have to develop their own morality, which is obviously sadly lacking

        they are cowards

        April 29, 2014 at 5:31 am |
    • Sungrazer

      I once pointed out to truthfollower01 that if god had commanded the Holocaust, he would have to consider it morally good, despite his current objections that it was objectively morally evil. He avoided the point by responding that my hypothetical scenario presented "a false god who is not the Christian God. I don't see any reason on commenting on the actions of a false god."

      Theo and truthfollower01 have some talking to do.

      April 29, 2014 at 9:37 am |
  10. Salero21

    The Extreme hypocrisy and the compulsive and pathological Lying of atheists is a recurring abhorrence in their behavior, especially when this subject matter is the Main topic of discussion.

    April 28, 2014 at 7:42 pm |
    • Akira

      Which you have constantly avoided when asked about the topic.

      Are you an atheist yourself?

      April 28, 2014 at 7:45 pm |
    • MidwestKen

      Please don't feed the Trolls.

      April 28, 2014 at 7:55 pm |
      • Akira

        I keep hoping for a lucid conversation. Oh, well.

        April 28, 2014 at 8:04 pm |
        • gulliblenomore

          An intelligent comment....from A Loser21? He writes the exact same garbage on every one of his posts, mostly in broken English, so I'm assuming he is probably a graduate of the 5th grade....but, I could be wrong.

          April 28, 2014 at 8:10 pm |
    • snowr14

      Anybody can make stu-pid mo-ro-nic statements out of their a– with ZERO evidence. Doesn't take more than two cells in brain to do that!.. as evidenced by Salero

      April 28, 2014 at 8:45 pm |
    • realbuckyball

      Really. Who's "lying" Seems it precisely YOU. Here is the proof.
      Caught in the act of lying for Jebus again, with your pants down, Salero21.

      April 28, 2014 at 11:14 pm |
  11. Salero21

    Atheists and their old ragged and worn out Fallacious argument about Hitler being a Christian is just another DEMONstration of the Absolute, Complete and Total NONSENSE of atheism/evolutionism/paganism/cultism and idolatry.

    April 28, 2014 at 7:32 pm |
    • fintronics

      See the moron, see the moron run, run run run....

      April 29, 2014 at 3:35 pm |
  12. Salero21

    Atheists and their old worn out argument about Hitler being a Christian is just another DEMONstration of the Absolute, Complete and Total NONSENSE of atheism/evolutionism/paganism/cultism and idolatry.

    April 28, 2014 at 6:14 pm |
    • MidwestKen

      Please don't feed the trolls!

      April 28, 2014 at 6:31 pm |
      • Salero21

        Takes one to know another huh!

        April 28, 2014 at 6:33 pm |
    • Akira

      Salero, do you agree with Theo's assessment that Jew's deserved the Holocaust?

      April 28, 2014 at 6:34 pm |
      • Salero21

        Do you?

        April 28, 2014 at 6:36 pm |
        • Akira

          You didn't read the previous page.
          Answer the question.

          April 28, 2014 at 6:38 pm |
        • Salero21

          What's the word?

          April 28, 2014 at 6:40 pm |
        • Akira

          And you accuse others of being childish?

          Stop dodging and please answer: do you agree with Theo's assessment that the Jews deserved the Holocaust?

          April 28, 2014 at 6:49 pm |
        • Salero21

          Please is the Word!!! I don't know who is Theo, I don't know what assessment you're talking about. No I don't read everything in the page. Copy and Paste whatever it is and maybe I'll answer.

          April 28, 2014 at 6:57 pm |
        • Akira

          OP with Theo Philio's reply.
          One page back. Very slothful of you not to care enough to look.

          If I was powerful enough to create the universe and design the way everything works, I wouldn’t have let all those poor men, women and children suffer the horrors of the holocaust. I am pleased to say that’s the difference between me and your god.

          Theo Phileo says:
          April 28, 2014 at 1:45 pm
          They suffered because they violated their covenant with God formed in Deuteronomy 28:15-68.

          Rebuttal Salero? And to Theo Philio's reply, not the OP, please.

          April 28, 2014 at 7:08 pm |
        • Akira

          Yeah, I didn't think you'd answer. Just wanted another self-professed Christian to weigh in.

          April 28, 2014 at 7:22 pm |
        • Salero21

          @ Akira,

          Are you calling that an assessment? Are you really that dumb? Are you some sort of Simpleton? You want to play the interrogator with me? An opinion is an opinion. That's what we all do here, posting opinions for or against whatever. If you disagree with whoever wrote that then you do the rebuttal, don't assume that I have to, just because in your melodramatic pomposity you chose to call it an assessment.

          April 28, 2014 at 7:24 pm |
        • Akira

          Okay, so what's your opinion on it?

          April 28, 2014 at 7:35 pm |
        • gulliblenomore

          A loser....I can't believe what a coward you are! Answer the question! Do you believe that the Jews deserve what they got during the Holocaust? A simple yes or no answer will suffice.

          April 28, 2014 at 7:45 pm |
        • Akira

          Apparently, Salero doesn't know the meaning of assessment.
          noun: assessment; plural noun: assessments
          the evaluation or estimation of the nature, quality, or ability of someone or something.

          Synonyms include judgement.

          April 28, 2014 at 8:03 pm |
        • ssq41

          Clearly, Akira, you touched a nerve with Salero...that last response of his was the most coherent thing he has ever posted here.

          You confused/angered him into an articulate response.

          Ahhhh, the power of the feminine mystique.

          April 29, 2014 at 12:00 am |
        • fintronics

          @selero-o-hole " Are you some sort of Simpleton?"

          Wow ...... the irony!

          April 29, 2014 at 3:18 pm |
      • Salero21

        Akira the Drama Queen/King!!

        April 28, 2014 at 7:28 pm |
        • Akira

          Nope. But you are a coward.
          Go to page one and read it all. I am not going to c/p 3/4 of the page because you are too lazy to look back a page that you even commented on.

          April 28, 2014 at 7:40 pm |
        • Salero21

          As extreme as your your hypocrisy is, so is extremely easy to call me a coward.

          April 28, 2014 at 7:44 pm |
        • Akira

          Example of my hypocrisy, please.

          You haven't answered the question, which is cowardly behavior.
          I answered it on the previous page. Go look.

          April 28, 2014 at 7:47 pm |
        • fintronics

          Salero-o-hole, you are at best, an extremely ignorant troll.

          April 29, 2014 at 3:19 pm |
    • In Santa We Trust

      Don't you have homework to do?

      April 28, 2014 at 6:57 pm |
  13. Salero21

    The mountain of Evidence for the Total Stu... no.. I'll be nice again. The mountains of Evidence for the Absolute, Complete and Total NONSENSE of atheism/evolutionism/paganism/cultism and idolatry is overwhelming. Or is it NON-SENSE?

    April 28, 2014 at 6:08 pm |
    • In Santa We Trust

      So post some.

      April 28, 2014 at 6:15 pm |
      • Salero21

        When Satan runs you thru the grinder, it will be too late for you to realize you trusted the wrong being.

        April 28, 2014 at 6:18 pm |
        • In Santa We Trust

          So no evidence then just the usual nonsense.

          April 28, 2014 at 6:52 pm |
        • fintronics

          Salero-o-hole with more boogie man threats..... yawn.

          April 29, 2014 at 3:20 pm |
    • Salero21

      Where is the GRAMMAR GESTAPO OF THE INTERNET when you need them?

      April 28, 2014 at 6:16 pm |
      • Salero21

        If and every time I made a grammar mistake or misspell a word. THE GRAMMAR GESTAPO OF THE INTERNET, the Legal Enforcement Branch of atheism, will pick, pierce and poke me with their toothpicks till I die. All the while YELLING DIE, DIE, DIE. They'll do that till I die and be no more.

        April 28, 2014 at 6:23 pm |
        • bostontola

          "When Satan runs you thru the grinder, it will be too late for you to realize you trusted the wrong being."

          April 28, 2014 at 6:28 pm |
        • Salero21

          "When Satan runs you thru the grinder, it will be too late for you to realize you trusted the wrong being."

          So you and Santa are one and the same troll huh!!

          April 28, 2014 at 6:32 pm |
        • bostontola

          Psychological projection is the act or technique of defending yourself against unpleasant impulses by denying their existence in yourself, while attributing them to others. For example, a person who is rude may constantly accuse other people of being rude.

          April 28, 2014 at 6:39 pm |
        • Salero21

          @ Bostonian the pseudo-psychologist. Somewhere I read that that psychology is part quackery. However the following may or may not apply to you

          Psychological projection is the act or technique of defending yourself against unpleasant impulses by denying their existence in yourself, while attributing them to others. For example, a person like you who is very rude may constantly accuse other people of being rude.

          April 28, 2014 at 6:54 pm |
        • Akira

          Between the two of you, it does not apply to bostontola.

          April 28, 2014 at 7:16 pm |
        • fintronics

          "satan"? the devil? the guy with the pointy horns, pitchfork and red suit?..... just saw him on a paint can.

          Mythology is funny!

          April 29, 2014 at 3:22 pm |
      • Akira

        Salero, do you agree with Theo’s assessment that Jews deserved the Holocaust?

        April 28, 2014 at 6:36 pm |
  14. bostontola

    Holocaust denial is hard to fathom, however it is but 1 example of historical revisionism, or even broader, reality revisionism.

    People quickly accept revisionist ideas if they support their belief system, especially their prophesy. Things like; the US is a Christian nation, evolution is a lie, Hitler was an atheist, etc., are but a few of the rampant revisionist ideas defended with passion instead of objective evidence.

    April 28, 2014 at 4:38 pm |
    • Akira

      All the evidence in the world doesn't erase the puerile thought that the Jews somehow deserved this, and use the Bible as justification. It's mind-boggling.

      April 28, 2014 at 5:03 pm |
      • bostontola

        puerile... great word, very applicable to much of the Christian apologetics.

        April 28, 2014 at 5:08 pm |
        • Salero21

          How puerile of you to learn such a word in one day!

          April 28, 2014 at 6:06 pm |
      • Salero21

        Your little mind is boondoggle.

        April 28, 2014 at 6:35 pm |
        • Akira

          Salero, do you agree with Theo’s assessment that Jews deserved the Holocaust?

          April 28, 2014 at 6:37 pm |
        • Salero21

          Who's Theo? What assessment?

          April 28, 2014 at 6:46 pm |
        • Akira

          I see. You are incapable of answering a direct question. The mountain of Evidence for the Total Stu… no.. I’ll be nice again. The mountains of Evidence for the Absolute, Complete and Total NONSENSE of your version of Christianity. Or is it NON-SENSE?

          April 28, 2014 at 6:55 pm |
        • In Santa We Trust

          saltshaker has never shown any ability to comprehend posts, follow topics, and respond. not likely to start now.

          April 28, 2014 at 6:55 pm |
        • Salero21


          Are you and joey3467 one and the same troll? He/she is asking the same thing, asking the same thing is either stupid or mean you're the same. Forgot to change misnomer?

          April 28, 2014 at 7:12 pm |
        • Akira

          I know it's inconceivable to you that two separate people might have similar questions.
          But, no( I'm neither a troll nor Joey.and you still didn't answer the question.
          Are you a coward?

          April 28, 2014 at 7:29 pm |
    • ddeevviinn

      We get it. You have nothing but disdain for Christians and others who embrace faith, but is it really necessary to view every issue through the prism of " faith debunking?" The Holocaust no less?

      April 28, 2014 at 5:10 pm |
      • joey3467

        Have you read Theo's posts where his thesis is basically "the Jews had it coming" He would seem to be a perfect example of why the Holocaust happened.

        April 28, 2014 at 5:21 pm |
      • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

        "... the US is a Christian nation, evolution is a lie, Hitler was an atheist, etc

        Criticizing propaganda like the above does not express disdain for people of faith.

        April 28, 2014 at 5:22 pm |
      • bostontola

        This is the belief blog, so yes, I view it through that lens.

        April 28, 2014 at 5:30 pm |
        • ddeevviinn

          You seem like a fairly bright bulb, I have no doubt you fully understood my point, deflection aside.

          April 28, 2014 at 5:41 pm |
        • bostontola

          No deflection. Quite the opposite, I did view this issue as an opportunity to debunk faith. The Holocaust is an excellent basis to do so as I described in the OP.

          April 28, 2014 at 6:00 pm |
        • bostontola

          I would add, the OP didn't apply solely to Christianity, or religion in general. It applies to any belief (including the belief that there is no God).

          April 28, 2014 at 6:04 pm |
        • ddeevviinn

          Well then, my original contention stands. I find it unfortunate that you deem it " necessary'" in this context.

          April 28, 2014 at 6:28 pm |
        • bostontola

          OK, I wouldn't say necessary, but it was an opportunity.

          April 28, 2014 at 6:30 pm |
        • ddeevviinn

          " Opportunity "

          No less unfortunate, but I will defer to the First Amendment.

          April 28, 2014 at 8:01 pm |
    • Alias

      If only that were the message they were trying to send.

      April 28, 2014 at 5:21 pm |
    • Salero21

      "People quickly accept revisionist ideas if they support their belief system..." — bostontola

      Speaking about yourself again huh?

      April 28, 2014 at 6:04 pm |
  15. Dyslexic doG

    there are a lot of things that the christian god really doesn't care about (saving people from tornadoes, preventing natural disasters, feeding the hungry, healing the sick, stopping the holocaust) but the one thing he sure seems obsessed with is what people do while na.ked and who is having se.x with who.

    April 28, 2014 at 3:23 pm |
  16. Dyslexic doG

    if I was powerful enough to have created the world, I would not have used tornadoes to terrorize and maim and kill those poor people in AR and OK. I am pleased to say that is the difference between me and your god.

    April 28, 2014 at 3:22 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

      Perhaps the Belief Blog should dust off the "Where was God in Joplin?" essay by Prof Prothero?

      April 28, 2014 at 3:52 pm |
    • samsstones

      It kills me to see the survivors of some terrible tragedy praise the lord for saving them as if knowing their time on earth is all they have, desperately clinging to their life on earth. The victims, however, have gone to a better place even though their time on earth has been cut short. If they really believed their nonsense shouldn't they have rather gone to the better place. What a strong nonsensical belief system these people have.

      April 28, 2014 at 3:56 pm |
      • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

        There's always this:


        April 28, 2014 at 4:04 pm |
        • Akira

          That was such a hilarious moment. Wolf didn't know what to say.

          April 28, 2014 at 4:23 pm |
  17. Doc Vestibule

    As the number of survivors from the so called "great wars" dwindles, their sacrifices are rendered abstract to those who have seen war only through media representations.
    In North America, it is our blessing and our curse.
    We do not walk through endless killing fields of nameless white crosses that teach humility.
    We do not see human abattoirs that remind us of how easily the hearts of men are turned against their brothers.
    We do not hear the echoes of the atom bomb that deafen hubris.

    What war buys us as a race is a simple lesson, often repeated and frequently forgotten:
    Violence and aggression are a part of human nature and only through vigilance can they be kept from coming to the fore.
    Violence begets violence and it takes only a single act to ignite the flames of hatred.

    Never forget.

    April 28, 2014 at 3:13 pm |
    • Lucifer's Evil Twin

      I was one of those people with my finger on the nuclear trigger
      I have walked through the killing field
      I have witnessed the mangled results of combat
      I have friends laid to rest in the fields of white crosses
      I have witnessed first-hand the mass graves of attempted genocide

      I do not recommend these experiences... but I do not regret having them

      April 28, 2014 at 3:36 pm |
      • Doc Vestibule

        Know that what you've done, though unrecognized by most, is still appreciated.
        No soldier supports war after they have been exposed.

        "It is the soldier, not the reporter who has given us the freedom of the press
        It is the soldier, not the poet who has given us freedom of speech
        It is the soldier, not the campus organizer, who has given us the freedom to demonstrate.
        It is the soldier, not the lawyer who has given us the right to a fair trial
        It is the soldier who salutes the flag, who serves under the flag and whose coffin is dra.ped by the flag, who allows the protestor to burn the flag."

        April 28, 2014 at 3:49 pm |
        • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV


          sadly it is equally the soldier who dies fighting for the 'other side'.

          While those who perpetrated the holocaust were contemptible, there were countless thousands of equally 'good' soldiers who died for the Third Reich including not only the Germans who fell in the face of Stalin's big red meat grinder. but conscripts like Romanians who were cannon fodder for Rommel's sea wall.

          April 28, 2014 at 4:00 pm |
      • Akira

        Thank you for your service; the toll must have weighed heavily on your heart.

        April 28, 2014 at 3:51 pm |
        • Lucifer's Evil Twin

          Thank you... there are times when it weighs heavy, but I was/am a soldier and that is the life that I chose. Some of us continue to suffer physically/mentally long after returning from combat. I thankfully have not had an long-lasting impacts so far.

          if anyone is so inclined please support woundedwarriorproject.org

          April 28, 2014 at 4:12 pm |
    • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV


      in the US "Memorial Day" started as a day to comemorate the Civil War* dead. Now it's the unofficial first day of summer and instead of visiting cemeteries, people barbeque.

      It is always the case with war remembrances. Wars are horrific for everyone who can remember them. Once that generation passes away the horrors fade.


      * Or War of Northern Aggression, according to one's perceptions.

      April 28, 2014 at 3:44 pm |
      • Lucifer's Evil Twin

        Cemeteries are full of dead people... I would rather be remembered and honored along with my brothers in arms with a beer raised high.

        April 28, 2014 at 3:59 pm |
        • Akira

          I'd hoist a tankard to you, LET.

          April 28, 2014 at 4:02 pm |
        • I'm not a GOPer, nor do I play one on TV

          I'd be happy to raise a toast to you and your brothers in arms.

          April 28, 2014 at 4:06 pm |
        • Lucifer's Evil Twin


          April 28, 2014 at 4:13 pm |
    • Akira

      Nicely written, Doc. Beautiful.

      April 28, 2014 at 3:49 pm |
  18. Vic

    I knew it was only a matter of time before the focus is shifted from the victims to cynicism and the perpetrators. This article is meant to remember and honor the Victims of the Holocaust through the Days of Remembrance during the week of April 27-May 4.

    I elect to pay tribute to the Victims of the Holocaust and sidestep cynicism.

    Early on:

    April 28, 2014 at 2:40 pm |
    • Concert in an Egg

      When will we set aside remembrance week for the victims of all of the other holocausts of the last 200 years? When do Native Americans get their day of remembrance for example?

      April 28, 2014 at 2:52 pm |
    • neverbeenhappieratheist

      When you have Nazi sypmathizers posting things like:

      "They suffered because they violated their covenant with God formed in Deuteronomy 28:15-68."

      How else should we repsond but to condemn these types of comments?

      April 28, 2014 at 2:52 pm |
      • Akira

        Gotta love when sick people blame the victim to salve their conscience.

        April 28, 2014 at 3:47 pm |
    • SeaVik

      Vic, unfortunately there are sick Christians like Theo who has essentially said that Jews desevered the Holocaust. What a horrible example of a human he is.

      April 28, 2014 at 2:58 pm |
      • Theo Phileo

        The curse of the Jewish people was in response of their apostasy. It will not always be so. Zechariah 12-13 speaks of a time when Israel will repent, and will recognize their Messiah whom they had killed. Until then, their curse stands by decree of God.

        April 28, 2014 at 3:10 pm |
        • Dyslexic doG

          what a sad fairy tale world you inhabit ...

          April 28, 2014 at 3:18 pm |
        • Doc Vestibule

          Apostasy means to abandon one's religious beliefs.
          The Jews have remained remarkably consistent in their for thousands of years.
          The Christian concept of the Holy Trinity is apostasy.
          The most basic tenet of Judaism is that God is One.
          Jews have declared their belief in a single unified God twice daily ever since the giving of the Torah at Sinai – almost two thousand years before Christians started flogging their sequel.

          By your reasoning, Christians are all apostates because they reject the revelations given to Muhammad, God's last prophet.

          April 28, 2014 at 3:18 pm |
        • Theo Phileo

          So you didn't read Zechariah... Got it.

          April 28, 2014 at 3:32 pm |
        • neverbeenhappieratheist

          To be able to blame your racism and bigotry on "what God wants" one must first be able to prove their God exists. Otherwise you are just exposing yourself as a racist bigot.

          April 28, 2014 at 3:39 pm |
        • samsstones

          You would have made a wonderful concentration camp guard and executioner, just following orders and look it says so in Zechariah. I would put a curse on you but unlike you I know it is ridiculous.

          April 28, 2014 at 3:46 pm |
        • SeaVik

          Theo, your immoral position is inexcusable. Stop trying to justify your sick views by using an ancient book of fiction. You are a terrible person and the bible won’t save you.

          April 28, 2014 at 3:47 pm |
        • sam stone

          Theo Corn Pone provides yet another data point supporting the hypothesis that petty, vindictive people find comfort in a petty, vindictive god

          The Jews deserved it?

          April 28, 2014 at 5:54 pm |
    • Vic


      Our hearts and prayers go out to the victims of the tornado outbreak in the southeast since last night.

      April 28, 2014 at 3:07 pm |
      • samsstones

        I saw a survivor thanking your pr-ck of a god for saving her rather than berating the a$$-hole for sending the tornado down on her home in the first instance. If she wasn't taken to heaven, I would think she would be unhappy about missing the chance of being in heaven? What an utt-erly stupid belief system.

        April 28, 2014 at 3:16 pm |
        • guidedans


          What does your belief system say about the tragedy? That it was all just random and that whether the lady lived or died made no real difference in the grand scheme of things?

          How are you even judging our belief system if you are positing that nothing really matters at all?

          April 28, 2014 at 7:51 pm |
        • gulliblenomore

          Dans....the problem for me, and every other atheist out there is.....people like this woman thanking god for saving her while 19 other people lost their lives. Is she any better than them that she should be saved and they should be dead, or was she just in the right place at the right time. That is what we believe, by the way....everything is random. We don't believe that god was controlling the path of that tornado and purposely crashed it down on all those poor people that died. That would make him a monster, which is what you believe. That is absolutely crazy, crazy thinking.

          April 28, 2014 at 8:00 pm |
        • guidedans


          You are correct. That is crazy, crazy thinking. But you are incorrect when you say that we believe God controls all of the natural disasters and directs them at certain people.

          The Christian narrative explains that when man fell from grace, nature was cursed as well. Thus you see some of the evil in the world emerging in the form of natural disasters. The world was not meant to be like this and God did not build it to be like this. Man's sin brought about the current state of things and it will only be through Jesus that we are redeemed along with the world.

          That lady is thanking God for saving her life and if He had let her life be taken, I am sure she would be thanking Him for His grace in allowing her into Heaven. As Christians, we are called to lean on God's strength in times of need and thank Him both for the blessings in our life and the pains because, in that pain, we grow closer to God.

          April 28, 2014 at 8:09 pm |
        • observer


          Hitler had the support of many Christians in Germany. He constantly proclaimed his belief in God.

          Are we supposed to be impressed that God saved her life while he watched 6,000,000 other people die terrible deaths?

          April 28, 2014 at 8:18 pm |
        • MidwestKen

          "Man's sin brought about the current state of things ..."

          Well, technically it wasn't man's sin, per se...

          "Genesis 3 (New International Version)

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          Genesis 3
          New International Version (NIV)
          The Fall

          3 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God really say, ‘You must not eat from any tree in the garden’?”

          2 The woman said to the serpent, “We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, ‘You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.’”

          4 “You will not certainly die,” the serpent said to the woman. 5 “For God knows that when you eat from it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”

          6 When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it. 7 Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they realized they were naked; so they sewed fig leaves together and made coverings for themselves.

          8 Then the man and his wife heard the sound of the Lord God as he was walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and they hid from the Lord God among the trees of the garden. 9 But the Lord God called to the man, “Where are you?”

          10 He answered, “I heard you in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked; so I hid.”

          11 And he said, “Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree that I commanded you not to eat from?”

          12 The man said, “The woman you put here with me—she gave me some fruit from the tree, and I ate it.”

          13 Then the Lord God said to the woman, “What is this you have done?”

          The woman said, “The serpent deceived me, and I ate.”

          14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, “Because you have done this,

          “Cursed are you above all livestock...
          15 And I will put enmity
          between you and the woman

          ""16 To the woman he said,
          I will make your pains in childbearing very severe;"

          "17 To Adam he said, “Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, ‘You must not eat from it,’
          Cursed is the ground because of you;"
          (Gen 3)

          Seems like the supposed God is doing all the cursing. Did He really have to do that, I wonder?

          April 28, 2014 at 8:29 pm |
        • MidwestKen

          @guidedans, (repost, sorry for bad copy pasta)
          "Man's sin brought about the current state of things ..."

          Well, technically it wasn't man's sin, per se...

          "14 So the Lord God said to the serpent, “Because you have done this,

          “Cursed are you above all livestock...
          15 And I will put enmity
          between you and the woman

          ""16 To the woman he said,
          I will make your pains in childbearing very severe;"

          "17 To Adam he said, “Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, ‘You must not eat from it,’
          Cursed is the ground because of you;"
          (Gen 3)

          Seems like the supposed God is doing all the cursing. Did He really have to do that, I wonder?

          April 28, 2014 at 8:31 pm |
        • guidedans


          This is not a "No True Scotsman" fallacy, but Hitler was definitely no true Christian.

          "I really big part of Christianity is not wanting to destroy Christianity entirely. In his "Table Talks" between 1941 and 1944, we is quoted as saying:

          The dogma of Christianity gets worn away before the advances of science. Religion will have to make more and more concessions. Gradually the myths crumble. All that's left is to prove that in nature there is no frontier between the organic and the inorganic. When understanding of the universe has become widespread, when the majority of men know that the stars are not sources of light but worlds, perhaps inhabited worlds like ours, then the Christian doctrine will be convicted of absurdity"

          Now, that does not sound very Christian to me. I can understand that Hitler "claimed" to be Christian in order to gain popularity with the largely Christian populace, but his personal ideas and motivations were not those of a Christian.

          And I am not adding in random requirements to be a Christian. In my view, you have to do four things to be a Christian: Admit you are a sinner, admit that Jesus is both God and the son of God who died on the Cross and rose on the third day,, admit that you need Jesus's sacrifice to cover your sins, and commit to following Jesus's teachings as told in the Bible.

          From the way Hitler acted, he surely did not demonstrate Christianity. That would like me claiming I was a Muslim, but then believing Jesus is God. I can say it all I want, but it does not make it true.

          Anyway, back to your point about God sitting back and letting people die. Just so you know, everyone who has ever lived to date, God has let die. Sometimes, this occurs in very terrible ways. You know what God told Adam and Eve in the Garden? If you eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, you will die.

          He was right, and now, because we ate from that tree, everyone will die. You will die. I will die. That lady that got saved from the tornado will die too. God has a master plan and He is using all the evil in the world to work for the good of those who love Him, but that does not mean there will not be pain and tribulation. It is going to suck here and it will keep on sucking until Jesus returns.

          April 28, 2014 at 8:35 pm |
        • guidedans


          I am glad you are reading and thinking about the Bible.

          I don't know why God cursed them. It might have been the natural consequence of knowing about Good and Evil. Now that they are moral creatures who are aware that pain sucks and pleasure is fun, they feel pain and they have to toil to work. Maybe God was protecting them from a curse that naturally comes from eating the fruit. Maybe their separation from God meant that they severed a tie that was preventing all the bad things from occurring.

          The Bible does not give God's motivations most of the time, but it does tell us that His ways are not our ways. If you really think of what God is, you would understand that trying to rationalize Him in our tiny brains would be like a jelly fish trying to understand how an LED screen works. Probably even hard than that.

          April 28, 2014 at 8:44 pm |
        • observer


          "It is going to suck here and it will keep on sucking until Jesus returns."

          Great endorsement for the world that you claim God created for you. Sound pretty UNGRATEFUL to me.

          April 28, 2014 at 9:06 pm |
        • MidwestKen

          Well, if we are participating in maybes then maybe there is no god(s) and pain, pleasure, suffering, and joy are all part of the natural world.

          April 28, 2014 at 9:07 pm |
        • joey3467

          I don't think it sucks here, I happen to think my life is pretty awesome. I am glad I am not a member of a religion that teaches me that this whole world sucks because in my experience that is not the case.

          April 29, 2014 at 1:06 pm |
      • TruthPrevails1

        Two hands working do more than a thousand clasped in prayer. If you truly feel bad, make a donation to the Red Cross or any of the other charities that will be in there helping with the recovery efforts.

        April 28, 2014 at 4:05 pm |
        • guidedans

          Yo Truth,

          How much do you donate to charities every month?

          Is it a 10th of your paycheck? If not, then don't talk to us about giving to charity. You know that you can both pray AND donate your time and money, right?

          April 28, 2014 at 7:49 pm |
        • tallulah131

          You can both pray and give money. And one of those things will actually help those in need. The praying is something you do to make yourself feel better.

          April 28, 2014 at 8:42 pm |
        • guidedans

          Then it looks like we both win. I feel better for praying and they feel better for having received money. And if you are wrong about God, then there is an added bonus of getting God's love shining down on both the prayer and the prayee.

          I am really not seeing the downside of prayer here.

          April 28, 2014 at 8:46 pm |
        • gulliblenomore

          Dans....while I admire the sincerity of your convictions, I can tell you two really severe problems with prayer. It gives people a false sense of hope and security. Ever hear of prayer resulting in the regrowth of a limb? Prayer has absolutely no effect on anything that couldn't happen normally. So yes, it is quite detrimental to pray at all.

          April 28, 2014 at 9:04 pm |
        • TruthPrevails1

          I think you missed the point guidedans. Prayer is the lazy mans way of doing something when in fact it helps no-one.
          As for how much I give, how much do you give? (Don't ask such personal questions if you're not willing to give figures yourself-it's simply hypocrisy on your behalf)

          April 29, 2014 at 4:12 am |
    • alonsoquixote

      Today, April 28, 2014, is Yom HaShoah, "Holocaust Remembrance Day"

      “I tell my story so that it won’t become your future.”

      ~ Leslie Meisels, Holocaust Survivor, (Hungary, Toronto); source: teachinghistorymatters.com/

      April 28, 2014 at 9:11 pm |
  19. Concert in an Egg

    As god(s) watched from his lofty perch in his celestial paradise, Hitler killed six million Jews during World War II. Thanks god. Proactive as always.

    April 28, 2014 at 2:30 pm |
  20. observer

    It's probably just a coincidence:

    "SALERO" is an anagram of "A LOSER"

    April 28, 2014 at 2:29 pm |
    • Concert in an Egg

      well done.

      April 28, 2014 at 2:31 pm |
    • Lucifer's Evil Twin

      It would be funny... if we just keep referring and answering him/her as LOSER from now on

      April 28, 2014 at 3:02 pm |
    • gulliblenomore


      April 28, 2014 at 3:06 pm |
    • Dyslexic doG

      very observant of you ...

      April 28, 2014 at 3:19 pm |
      • observer

        Dyslexic doG,

        With your name, you more than anyone else, could call him "A LOSER".

        April 28, 2014 at 6:48 pm |
    • TruthPrevails1


      April 28, 2014 at 4:04 pm |
    • Salero21

      Pooh-pooh blinded observer wants to be a Pooh-Bah!! JAJAJA... oops... pardon me please... I meant to say HAHAHA.

      April 28, 2014 at 6:29 pm |
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About this blog

The CNN Belief Blog covers the faith angles of the day's biggest stories, from breaking news to politics to entertainment, fostering a global conversation about the role of religion and belief in readers' lives. It's edited by CNN's Daniel Burke with contributions from Eric Marrapodi and CNN's worldwide news gathering team.